Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Tom Livingston]

> Or, we can do it with just one image and a little bit of CSS3 magic:
> http://tjameswhite.com/demos/fisheye/
>
> My demo uses Gabriele's original code, minus all the extra background
> images and heights. Instead, I've added CSS transition and transform
> to replicate the fisheye.
>
> Yes, this requires vendor prefixes. It should work in the latest
> versions of Mozilla, Webkit and Opera browsers. Sorry, no IE, and I
> didn't bother making a fall back for IE, which could be done easy
> enough.
>


My only thought here would be if it is possible to use the larger
(hovered) image size and reduce it for the "off" state. This would
possibly crisp up the hovered images a bit - of course, as long as the
reduced size looks good too.

Just a thought for anyone considering this...

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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Thierry Koblentz]

Hi Tim,

> >May I ask, why not simply use foreground icon
> > images and change their height or width on hover? That would be
> > cross-browser-compatible for anything that can parse CSS.
> 
> This is cross-browser compatible. For browsers that do not support the
> transform, nothing happens but they still get the text and image. Of
> course, there could be other changes, such as color and image
> swapping, going on in addition to the transform that those browsers
> would implement.

This is progressive enhancement, but I'd not say it is cross browser
compatible as it is not.
Paul's solution *is* cross browser compatible as would deliver the same
"look and feel" across most browsers out there.
 
> > I don't see
> > that having the icon in the foreground is any more of an issue than,
> > say, having a foreground thumbnail image in a gallery be the link to
> > its larger counterpart. Isn't this a case where one could argue both
> > sides of the question, "Is it content or is it presentation"?
> 
> Yes, this would fall into a semantic debate (see Thierry's reply). But
> for the CSS I used it doesn't matter if the image is foreground,
> background or not there. The transform effects the  element.

The question I asked Paul is related to his use of the alt attribute, it was
not meant to discuss semantics.
The value used for alt text shows if the author considers the image as
decorative or not.
If Paul says he would use alt="", then it means he considers the image being
decorative, if he says he would use some value (for example alt="home") then
it means he considers that image being content. 

Imho, the  itself is not content, it is the alt text that makes it
content.
 

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Thierry
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Tim White]

> I like this.  Hut shouldn't the expansion also work when the menu item is
> selected by keyboard?  I tried adding
> #navigation li a:active {
>        -webkit-transform: scale(1.5);
>        -moz-transform: scale(1.5);
>        -o-transform: scale(1.5);
>        }
>
> But it did not have the effect I expected.  Why not?


I've updated my example with :focus and :active. I also tossed in an
Easter Egg...

For browsers that don't support the transform, I added some good old
color to the link text. Ideally I'd change the icon color as well, but
I'm not a graphics person.

Tim
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Tim White]

> On 16/06/2010, at 5:44 AM, tedd wrote:
>
> While it's neat, but it's a misnomer. That's not a fisheye, it's just
> a magnification.
>
> Hmmm, you're right but you can't blame him

Yes, I realize that, but as Chris points out, I didn't name it,
Gabrielle (original post) did. And I suspect she got the name from
somewhere else.

> I messed with this style for ages a long time ago and never got the results
> I wanted unless I used flash so I gave up. I like this technique but can you
> get it to magnify from the centre point of the image outwards?

Yes, at least a bit. Look for the line 'tranform-origin' and alter the
values (horz vert). My version has the zoom focused at the top center.
You could easily change that to 50% 50% to zoom from the center of the
box (it won't be the center of the image in this case).


> However what i really wanted was that
> they all stayed in the width of their containing div, expanded from the
> centre point outwards, and depending on how close you were to the centre,
> how much the image expanded.

Hmm, I don't know about changing the amount of expansion based on
proximity to center. I'm sure someone wiser than me could do something
with JavaScript.

Tim
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Tim White]

On Tue, Jun 15, 2010 at 5:49 PM, Paul Novitski  wrote:
> All this stuff is good to know and I'm glad for the discussion.
>
> However, for the case at hand, it seems like an awful lot of
> complicated, proprietary fuss merely in order to use background
> images in the menu.

The CSS isn't proprietary, merely vendor prefixes. It is, as someone
else pointed out, avant-garde. The effect comes from the CSS3 and
isn't finalized, hence the vendor prefixes. Once the spec is
finalized, the prefixes can be removed. For example, we have been able
to use -moz-border-radius and -webkit-border-radius for a couple of
years now; my understanding is that the spec is 'complete' and the
next version of browsers (including Opera and IE9) will all support
the simpler border-radius.


>May I ask, why not simply use foreground icon
> images and change their height or width on hover? That would be
> cross-browser-compatible for anything that can parse CSS.

This is cross-browser compatible. For browsers that do not support the
transform, nothing happens but they still get the text and image. Of
course, there could be other changes, such as color and image
swapping, going on in addition to the transform that those browsers
would implement.


> I don't see
> that having the icon in the foreground is any more of an issue than,
> say, having a foreground thumbnail image in a gallery be the link to
> its larger counterpart. Isn't this a case where one could argue both
> sides of the question, "Is it content or is it presentation"?

Yes, this would fall into a semantic debate (see Thierry's reply). But
for the CSS I used it doesn't matter if the image is foreground,
background or not there. The transform effects the  element.

Tim
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Thierry Koblentz]

> >#navigation li a:hover,
> >#navigation li a:active,
> >#navigation li a:focus {
> >color: red;
> >-webkit-transform: scale(1.5);
> >-moz-transform: scale(1.5);
> >-o-transform: scale(1.5);
> >}
> etc.
> 
> All this stuff is good to know and I'm glad for the discussion.
> 
> However, for the case at hand, it seems like an awful lot of
> complicated, proprietary fuss merely in order to use background
> images in the menu. May I ask, why not simply use foreground icon
> images and change their height or width on hover? That would be
> cross-browser-compatible for anything that can parse CSS. I don't see
> that having the icon in the foreground is any more of an issue than,
> say, having a foreground thumbnail image in a gallery be the link to
> its larger counterpart. Isn't this a case where one could argue both
> sides of the question, "Is it content or is it presentation"?

Hi Paul,

I'd like to answer this question with another question:
If you were using  elements rather than background images, what would
you be using as alt text?


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Thierry
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[David Laakso]

Paul Novitski wrote:
>> #navigation li a:hover,
>> #navigation li a:active,
>> #navigation li a:focus {
>> color: red;
>> -webkit-transform: scale(1.5);
>> -moz-transform: scale(1.5);
>> -o-transform: scale(1.5);
>> }
>> 
> etc.
>
>  Isn't this a case where one could argue both 
> sides of the question, "Is it content or is it presentation"?
>
> Curiously,
>
> Paul
>   






I think it is known as the "avant garde":  also, known as, "let's 
lighten up and have some fun." 


Best,
Lady Gaga




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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Chris Blake]

On 16/06/2010, at 5:44 AM, tedd wrote:

> While it's neat, but it's a misnomer. That's not a fisheye, it's just
> a magnification.
>
> A fisheye is like looking through a fisheye lens.
>
> Here's a fisheye picture for example:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fisheye_lens_room.jpg
>
> The perspective is distorted (i.e., no straight lines)
>
> Cheers,
>
> tedd


Hmmm, you're right but you can't blame him when the creators of the  
javascript versions are using the same terminology : 
http://safalra.com/web-design/javascript/mac-style-dock/
I messed with this style for ages a long time ago and never got the  
results I wanted unless I used flash so I gave up. I like this  
technique but can you get it to magnify from the centre point of the  
image outwards?
Oh no I did use it on something - http://www.redrunner.co.uk/ After  
the first rollover the menu uses the effect i wanted on rollover (it  
warps of to the side slightly the first time). However what i really  
wanted was that they all stayed in the width of their containing div,  
expanded from the centre point outwards, and depending on how close  
you were to the centre, how much the image expanded.
i saw it done by some real wizards, I asked how but they were too busy  
to tell me. Bar stewards.

cb
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Paul Novitski]

>#navigation li a:hover,
>#navigation li a:active,
>#navigation li a:focus {
>color: red;
>-webkit-transform: scale(1.5);
>-moz-transform: scale(1.5);
>-o-transform: scale(1.5);
>}
etc.

All this stuff is good to know and I'm glad for the discussion.

However, for the case at hand, it seems like an awful lot of 
complicated, proprietary fuss merely in order to use background 
images in the menu. May I ask, why not simply use foreground icon 
images and change their height or width on hover? That would be 
cross-browser-compatible for anything that can parse CSS. I don't see 
that having the icon in the foreground is any more of an issue than, 
say, having a foreground thumbnail image in a gallery be the link to 
its larger counterpart. Isn't this a case where one could argue both 
sides of the question, "Is it content or is it presentation"?

Curiously,

Paul
__

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Juniper Webcraft Ltd.
http://juniperwebcraft.com 

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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[tedd]

At 10:24 AM -0400 6/14/10, Tim White wrote:
>  > Hi all!
>>  I'm pretty inspired this time:
>>
>>  http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/2010/06/pure-css-fisheye-menu-with-icons.html
>>  Gabriele
>
>Or, we can do it with just one image and a little bit of CSS3 magic:
>http://tjameswhite.com/demos/fisheye/
>
>My demo uses Gabriele's original code, minus all the extra background
>images and heights. Instead, I've added CSS transition and transform
>to replicate the fisheye.
>
>Yes, this requires vendor prefixes. It should work in the latest
>versions of Mozilla, Webkit and Opera browsers. Sorry, no IE, and I
>didn't bother making a fall back for IE, which could be done easy
>enough.
>
>Enjoy,
>Tim
>tjameswhite.com


While it's neat, but it's a misnomer. That's not a fisheye, it's just 
a magnification.

A fisheye is like looking through a fisheye lens.

Here's a fisheye picture for example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fisheye_lens_room.jpg

The perspective is distorted (i.e., no straight lines)

Cheers,

tedd


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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[David Laakso]

Peter Coates wrote:
> I like this.  Hut shouldn't the expansion also work when the menu item is
> selected by keyboard?  I tried adding
> #navigation li a:active {
>   -webkit-transform: scale(1.5); 
>   -moz-transform: scale(1.5);
>   -o-transform: scale(1.5);
>   }
>
> But it did not have the effect I expected.  Why not?
>
> Peter
>   






?


#navigation li a:hover,
#navigation li a:active,
#navigation li a:focus {
color: red;
-webkit-transform: scale(1.5);
-moz-transform: scale(1.5);
-o-transform: scale(1.5);
}

Best,
~d




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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Thierry Koblentz]

> I like this.  Hut shouldn't the expansion also work when the menu item
> is
> selected by keyboard?  I tried adding
> #navigation li a:active {
>   -webkit-transform: scale(1.5);
>   -moz-transform: scale(1.5);
>   -o-transform: scale(1.5);
>   }
> 
> But it did not have the effect I expected.  Why not?

Try :focus

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Thierry
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Peter Coates]

I like this.  Hut shouldn't the expansion also work when the menu item is
selected by keyboard?  I tried adding
#navigation li a:active {
-webkit-transform: scale(1.5); 
-moz-transform: scale(1.5);
-o-transform: scale(1.5);
}

But it did not have the effect I expected.  Why not?

Peter

-Original Message-
From: css-d-boun...@lists.css-discuss.org
[mailto:css-d-boun...@lists.css-discuss.org] On Behalf Of Tim White
Sent: June-14-10 7:24 AM
To: Gabriele Romanato
Cc: css-discuss
Subject: Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

> Hi all!
> I'm pretty inspired this time:
>
> http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/2010/06/pure-css-fisheye-menu-with-icons.html
> Gabriele

Or, we can do it with just one image and a little bit of CSS3 magic:
http://tjameswhite.com/demos/fisheye/

My demo uses Gabriele's original code, minus all the extra background
images and heights. Instead, I've added CSS transition and transform
to replicate the fisheye.

Yes, this requires vendor prefixes. It should work in the latest
versions of Mozilla, Webkit and Opera browsers. Sorry, no IE, and I
didn't bother making a fall back for IE, which could be done easy
enough.

Enjoy,
Tim
tjameswhite.com
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Gabriele Romanato]

Cool! Very smooth. I like it. Could you please post a comment to my  
post with the link of your nice demo?
thanks!

ps. your demo is really much more future-friendly! fantastic! :-)

Gabriele

http://www.css-zibaldone.com
http://www.css-zibaldone.com/test/  (English)
http://www.css-zibaldone.com/articles/  (English)
http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/  (English)








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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Tim White]

> Hi all!
> I'm pretty inspired this time:
>
> http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/2010/06/pure-css-fisheye-menu-with-icons.html
> Gabriele

Or, we can do it with just one image and a little bit of CSS3 magic:
http://tjameswhite.com/demos/fisheye/

My demo uses Gabriele's original code, minus all the extra background
images and heights. Instead, I've added CSS transition and transform
to replicate the fisheye.

Yes, this requires vendor prefixes. It should work in the latest
versions of Mozilla, Webkit and Opera browsers. Sorry, no IE, and I
didn't bother making a fall back for IE, which could be done easy
enough.

Enjoy,
Tim
tjameswhite.com
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Thierry Koblentz]

Hi Gabriele,

> I'm pretty inspired this time:
> 
> http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/2010/06/pure-css-fisheye-menu-with-
> icons.html
> 
> I didn't test it in IE before publishing it, though. Well, IE has its
> height: 100%, but I'm not sure that
> a#id:hover will work... thanks for your attention! bye :-)

I'm not sure height:100% does anything, nor the 100% width on #navigation,
nor display:block on the floats.
Also, since you are already using padding on the anchors, why not using
padding-top to make room for the larger image instead of line-height? The
former would set a fixed value, but the latter may vary depending on font
values. 

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Thierry
www.tjkdesign.com | www.ez-css.org | @thierrykoblentz

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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Claude Needham]

> Claude, there is a link Gabriele's live "demo" page.
> I think you just didn't see it...
> 
> Best,
> ~d


Right you are. Sitting there in plain sight for all to see. Thanks for
pointing the way to it. It is a nice effect. Reminds me of the first
time I saw a Mac user interface.

Claude
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[David Laakso]

Claude Needham wrote:
>
> It is most helpful having a live demo of the effect.
> That is something I missed with the first post in this thread. It is
> so convenient having a live page.
>
> Claude
>   


Claude, there is a link Gabriele's live "demo" page.
I think you just didn't see it...

Best,
~d

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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[Claude Needham]

> Why not use image replacement? Granted they would be larger images,
> but that way you load and deal with only one image per menu item.
>
> Here's an example:
>
> http://webbytedd.com/bb/replace-image2/
>
> Cheers,
>
> tedd

It is most helpful having a live demo of the effect.
That is something I missed with the first post in this thread. It is
so convenient having a live page.

Claude
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[tedd]

At 12:00 PM +0200 6/13/10, Gabriele Romanato wrote:
>Hi all!
>I'm pretty inspired this time:
>
>http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/2010/06/pure-css-fisheye-menu-with-icons.html
>
>I didn't test it in IE before publishing it, though. Well, IE has its 
>height: 100%, but I'm not sure that
>a#id:hover will work... thanks for your attention! bye :-)
>
>Gabriele


Gabriele:

Why not use image replacement? Granted they would be larger images, 
but that way you load and deal with only one image per menu item.

Here's an example:

http://webbytedd.com/bb/replace-image2/

Cheers,

tedd
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Re: [css-d] Pure CSS fisheye menu with icons: a demo

[David Laakso]

Gabriele Romanato wrote:
> Hi all!
> I'm pretty inspired this time:
>
> http://onwebdev.blogspot.com/2010/06/pure-css-fisheye-menu-with-icons.html
>
> I didn't test it in IE before publishing it, though. Well, IE has its  
> height: 100%, but I'm not sure that
> a#id:hover will work... thanks for your attention! bye :-)
>
> Gabriele
>
>   






Neat!
IE/6.0 standalone on Mac 10.4 gets it.
Best,
~d

Why the elliptical method to set type?






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