Re: [CTRL] Lest We Become Oppressed ?
Joshua2 writes: I hope you're right Bob but I am forced to believe otherwise. The government and the Military have been eroding the Posse Comitadas (?) protections over a period of years now, and all it takes is for the Presidents signature to use the military against its own citizens. Bob writes: Much of what you say is true. The government has been growing steadily and taking powers not afforded by the Constitution. Government needs to be put in it's place - small and no danger to the population from which it derives it's powers. Presidential Decision Directives and Executive Orders have no place in government the President is not part of the legislative branch and has no power to make law. The military is controlled by civilians, the government, most notably the President. Joshua2 writes: And then there's shit like this... ***KILL U.S. CITIZENS, BLAME CUBA Now comes documentation on other plans the Pentagon was pursuing in those days. Articles by Tim Weiner in the New York Times Nov. 19 and Nov. 23 tell of some of them. The military plans approved for development by the Joint Chiefs of Staff on March 13, 1962, as part of the CIA's Operation Mongoose included: u Operation Bingo, a plan to fake an attack on the U.S. base at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, providing cover for a devastating U.S. military assault on Havana. u Operation Dirty Trick, a plot to blame Fidel Castro if the 1962 Mercury space flight carrying John Glenn crashed. u A "Remember the Maine" incident, in which "we could blow up a U.S. warship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba," said a Pentagon memorandum. "We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area," it went on, "in other Florida cities and even in Washington. The terror campaign could be pointed at Cuban refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated), or create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner." The Times reports said no there is no evidence that these plans were ever carried out. Perhaps. Perhaps others that did become operational are still classified "top secret." Cuba has provided very convincing evidence, for example, of bacteriological and biological warfare aimed at its crops and livestock. Nevertheless, these few scenarios reveal enough about the mentality of the military to demolish the benign image of U.S. foreign policy so carefully cultivated by the rulers of this country. In truth, Washington hasn't changed since the days when U.S. Marine Corps Gen. Smedley Butler said he had been nothing but a gangster working for U.S. banks and corporations in Latin America in the 1920s. Bob writes: The military has been involved in many unsavory exploits, but has always been controlled by the Government. Smedley Butler was right about the US butting in where it doesn't belong and exploiting other countries for big business. If our Government wasn't corrupt and didn't take bribes, this unauthorized use of the military would not occur. The military should only be used to protect the people of the US from invasion. ALL Government employees from the city street sweeper to the President should be held accountable for accepting bribes. Corporations that offer bribes should be disbanded and the officers prosecuted and jailed. Corporations are a legal way of passing the buck and not taking responsibility for actions taken. Joshua2 writes: Department Of Defense: Les Aspin, Secretary of Defense -- CFR Frank G. Wisnerll, Under Secretary for Policy -- CFR Henry S. Rowen, Asst. Sec., International Security Affairs -- CFR Judy Ann Miller, Dep. Asst. Sec. Nuclear Forces & Arms Control -- CFR W. Bruce Weinrod, Dep. Asst. Sec., Europe & NATO -- CFR Adm. Seymour Weiss, Chairman, Defense Policy Board -- CFR Charles M. Herzfeld, Dir. Defense Research & Engineering -- CFR Andrew W. Marshall, Dir., Net Assessment -- CFR Michael P. W. Stone, Secretary of the Army -- CFR Donald B. Rice, Secretary of the Air Force -- CFR Franklin C. Miller, Dep. Asst. Sec. Nuclear Forces & Arms Control -- CFR Allied Supreme Commanders: 1949-52 Eisenhower -- CFR 1952-53 Ridgeway -- CFR 1953-56 Gruenther -- CFR 1956-63 Norstad -- CFR 1963-69 Lemnitzer -- CFR 1969-74 Goodpaster -- CFR 1974-79 Haig -- CFR 1979-87 Rogers -- CFR, TC Superintendents of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point: 1960-63 Westmoreland -- CFR 1963-66 Lampert -- CFR 1966-68 Bennett -- CFR 1970-74 Knowlton -- CFR 1974-77 Berry -- CFR 1977-81 Goodpaster -- CFR CFR Military Fellows, 1991: Col. William M. Drennan, Jr., USAF -- CFR Col. Wallace C. Gregson, USMC -- CFR Col. Jack B. Wood, USA -- CFR CFR Military Fellows, 1992: Col. David M. Mize, USMC -- CFR Col. John P. Rose, USA -- CFR Joint Chiefs of Staff: Adm Wm. Crowe, Chairman -- CFR Gen. Colin L. Powell, Chairman -- CFR Gen. Carl E. Vuono, Army -- CFR Gen.
Re: [CTRL] Lest We Become Oppressed ?
Bob Stokes wrote: > > In a message dated 00-06-18 17:24:33 EDT, Joshua2 writes: > > << They > are our very own occupying troops, and would shoot you and me down like rabid > dogs in the street if ordered to even though we pay their wages and are the > citizens of the country they suposedly work for. >> > > This is not true. You don't know, you haven't been there, I was for > twenty years. You are misinformed, it is the controllers of the Soldiers, > Sailors, Airmen and Marines who misuse our military. We need a strong > military to preserve our freedom (such as it is) but we shouldn't be > policeman for Corporate thieves. We have no need to be in a foreign country > without a declared war. Control of the "Elites" is what we need, not control > of the man behind the gun. Perhaps control of the high ranking officers in > charge would be the way to do this, but as Congress is corrupt, so are the > Generals and Admirals ... most of the high-ranking officers aren't in it for > the money, just the power. > The elites won't order the military to fight civilians on a large scale > because they know they would lose. Members of the military are no longer in > the dark. They have access to the internet as provided by the military > itself. They can see the different threads. I hope you're right Bob but I am forced to believe otherwise. The government and the Military have been eroding the Posse Comitadas (?) protections over a period of years now, and all it takes is for the Presidents signature to use the military against its own citizens. And then there's shit like this... ***KILL U.S. CITIZENS, BLAME CUBA Now comes documentation on other plans the Pentagon was pursuing in those days. Articles by Tim Weiner in the New York Times Nov. 19 and Nov. 23 tell of some of them. The military plans approved for development by the Joint Chiefs of Staff on March 13, 1962, as part of the CIA's Operation Mongoose included: u Operation Bingo, a plan to fake an attack on the U.S. base at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, providing cover for a devastating U.S. military assault on Havana. u Operation Dirty Trick, a plot to blame Fidel Castro if the 1962 Mercury space flight carrying John Glenn crashed. u A "Remember the Maine" incident, in which "we could blow up a U.S. warship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba," said a Pentagon memorandum. "We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area," it went on, "in other Florida cities and even in Washington. The terror campaign could be pointed at Cuban refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated), or create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner." The Times reports said no there is no evidence that these plans were ever carried out. Perhaps. Perhaps others that did become operational are still classified "top secret." Cuba has provided very convincing evidence, for example, of bacteriological and biological warfare aimed at its crops and livestock. Nevertheless, these few scenarios reveal enough about the mentality of the military to demolish the benign image of U.S. foreign policy so carefully cultivated by the rulers of this country. In truth, Washington hasn't changed since the days when U.S. Marine Corps Gen. Smedley Butler said he had been nothing but a gangster working for U.S. banks and corporations in Latin America in the 1920s. === Department Of Defense: Les Aspin, Secretary of Defense -- CFR Frank G. Wisnerll, Under Secretary for Policy -- CFR Henry S. Rowen, Asst. Sec., International Security Affairs -- CFR Judy Ann Miller, Dep. Asst. Sec. Nuclear Forces & Arms Control -- CFR W. Bruce Weinrod, Dep. Asst. Sec., Europe & NATO -- CFR Adm. Seymour Weiss, Chairman, Defense Policy Board -- CFR Charles M. Herzfeld, Dir. Defense Research & Engineering -- CFR Andrew W. Marshall, Dir., Net Assessment -- CFR Michael P. W. Stone, Secretary of the Army -- CFR Donald B. Rice, Secretary of the Air Force -- CFR Franklin C. Miller, Dep. Asst. Sec. Nuclear Forces & Arms Control -- CFR Allied Supreme Commanders: 1949-52 Eisenhower -- CFR 1952-53 Ridgeway -- CFR 1953-56 Gruenther -- CFR 1956-63 Norstad -- CFR 1963-69 Lemnitzer -- CFR 1969-74 Goodpaster -- CFR 1974-79 Haig -- CFR 1979-87 Rogers -- CFR, TC Superintendents of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point: 1960-63 Westmoreland -- CFR 1963-66 Lampert -- CFR 1966-68 Bennett -- CFR 1970-74 Knowlton -- CFR 1974-77 Berry -- CFR 1977-81 Goodpaster -- CFR CFR Military Fellows, 1991: Col. William M. Drennan, Jr., USAF -- CFR Col. Wallace C. Gregson, USMC -- CFR Col. Jack B. Wood, USA -- CFR CFR Military Fellows, 1992: Col. David M. Mize, USMC -- CFR Col. John P. Rose, USA -- CFR Joint Chiefs of Staff: Adm Wm. Crowe, Chairman -- CFR Gen. Colin L. Powell, Chairman -- CFR Gen.
Re: [CTRL] Lest We Become Oppressed ?
In a message dated 00-06-18 17:24:33 EDT, Joshua2 writes: << They are our very own occupying troops, and would shoot you and me down like rabid dogs in the street if ordered to even though we pay their wages and are the citizens of the country they suposedly work for. >> This is not true. You don't know, you haven't been there, I was for twenty years. You are misinformed, it is the controllers of the Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Marines who misuse our military. We need a strong military to preserve our freedom (such as it is) but we shouldn't be policeman for Corporate thieves. We have no need to be in a foreign country without a declared war. Control of the "Elites" is what we need, not control of the man behind the gun. Perhaps control of the high ranking officers in charge would be the way to do this, but as Congress is corrupt, so are the Generals and Admirals ... most of the high-ranking officers aren't in it for the money, just the power. The elites won't order the military to fight civilians on a large scale because they know they would lose. Members of the military are no longer in the dark. They have access to the internet as provided by the military itself. They can see the different threads. Those of us who were in the military see that things are not as they should be and are prepared (unlike many others) to go that extra mile if we can see the path is straight. I've seen no one on this or any other list who can see the clear way to end the rule by the elites. I see that we need to control the corporations setup by the government, at least till true "free trade" can be established with government neither aiding or discouraging free trade. Corporations as a whole are given a charter by government and are aided by the Federal Reserve and by laws that give Corps a break. The present government does not speak for us, but for the rich, the filthy rich and they preserve the corporations by stealing money from us via taxes and fees and by devaluating the currency. It's all about money for the rich and as soon as we can abolish income taxes, the Fed and hold government to only Constitutional authority, the sooner things will get back to normal ... the way they were more than a quarter of a millenium ago ... small, weak government. What say you? Regards, Bob Stokes http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Lest We Become Oppressed ?
Yardbird wrote: > > > Today, thousands of soldiers serve around the globe to maintain our freedom and > > to provide the promise of a better life to others for whom liberty is but a > > dream. > > And that liberty will always be a dream under an occupation by US soldiers > as they aren't there to secure liberty but to advance American hegemony. You got that right. > > > They are unknown to most of us, but they sacrifice daily in places like Kosovo, > > Saudi Arabia, Bosnia, East Timor, Kuwait, Korea and Macedonia in order to > > promote democracy and to preserve peace and stability. I guess there are still people out there dumb enough to believe this shit. > > Actually they promote oppression and preserve the drug trade. > > > These men and women are our patriots. They are prepared to defend our country, These men and women are not patriots at all. They are mercenaries. They joined for any number of reasons including obtaining an education, getting away from home, three hots and a cot, and proving their manhood. Since the country is not under attack, or even threat, they are not really defending this country but serving as policemen and enforcers for the New World Order. The same Elites who are in the process of degrading US national sovereignty. They are our very own occupying troops, and would shoot you and me down like rabid dogs in the street if ordered to even though we pay their wages and are the citizens of the country they suposedly work for. > > and they are also the best ambassadors for democracy we could have NOT A CLUE! Foreign occupying soldiers... the best ambassadors of democracy. > > As Johnson noted "Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" but, > perhaps, the image of the US military being the "best ambassadors for > democracy" is an even greater condemnation of US foreign policy. > > Jamieson Good replies Jamieson. I'm glad some people are capable of thinking. Joshua2 http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Lest We Become Oppressed ?
> Today, thousands of soldiers serve around the globe to maintain our freedom and > to provide the promise of a better life to others for whom liberty is but a > dream. And that liberty will always be a dream under an occupation by US soldiers as they aren't there to secure liberty but to advance American hegemony. > They are unknown to most of us, but they sacrifice daily in places like Kosovo, > Saudi Arabia, Bosnia, East Timor, Kuwait, Korea and Macedonia in order to > promote democracy and to preserve peace and stability. Actually they promote oppression and preserve the drug trade. > These men and women are our patriots. They are prepared to defend our country, > and they are also the best ambassadors for democracy we could have As Johnson noted "Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" but, perhaps, the image of the US military being the "best ambassadors for democracy" is an even greater condemnation of US foreign policy. Jamieson http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] Lest We Become Oppressed ?
From
http://www.sunspot.net/content/opinion/story?section=opinion&pagename=story&stor
yid=1150340229802
}}>Begin
The Army at 225: a new patriotism
By Eric K. Shinseki
WASHINGTON -- In two weeks, Mel Gibson's latest movie, "The Patriot," opens
nationwide. Set during the American Revolution, it is the story of a colonist
who becomes a militia leader when the sweep of war and the advance of the
British endanger his farm and family.
Whether by design or mere coincidence, the release of "The Patriot" comes at a
particularly fitting time in our nation's history because this month marks the
225th anniversary of the birth of our Army.
The birth of our nation and the birth of our Army are inseparably linked.
A year before we formally declared our independence, we had already begun
fighting for it at Lexington and Concord and the Battle of Bunker Hill, the
bloodiest single engagement of the Revolution. On that small piece of ground,
over the course of one day, the British lost a staggering 1,054 regulars. The
colonists lost about 440.
After Bunker Hill, the British would never again underestimate the tenacity and
fighting spirit of the American soldier. These early engagements surprised the
British, who saw themselves as professionally trained soldiers and the
militiamen as little more than a disorganized rabble.
But let us not forget that we surprised ourselves as well. Despite our dogged
determination to confront the foe, we were unproven and uncertain of our
abilities. Who could have imagined that our ill-equipped and untrained colonial
militia would fare as well as it did? Our success in those early battles was
significant.
The victories strengthened national pride, engendered new confidence and
bolstered the will to fight. When word spread down the coast that New England
farmers had successfully stood up to the well-equipped and well-trained British
regulars, colonists everywhere were filled with newfound courage and patriotic
fervor. Frustration turned to motivation, and from that point on, the cry for
independence simply would not be quelled.
On June 14, 1775, Congress took the first formal step in the march toward
independence by voting to establish what was then the Continental Army.
In those days, the term patriot more closely equated to insurgent. A patriot
was a revolutionary who promoted the independence of his people from the
country or union of countries that controlled them.
>From the British perspective, patriots were criminals; to them, the term was an
epithet carrying the negative connotation of disloyalty. Thus, in 1775, when
George Washington dubbed the original rag-tag band of fighters "the patriot
army," he was making a profoundly political and deliberately inflammatory
statement; this newborn army would win independence for America.
Over time, the word "patriot" evolved to a more heroic meaning -- a person who
loves his country and who defends and promotes its interests. It is especially
applied to soldiers who fight for love of country. Thanks to the success of the
American Revolution, the connotation of that simple term changed from one of
disloyalty to one of allegiance.
Since the end of the Revolution, American soldiers, imbued with the spirit of
the original patriots, have pledged their allegiance to this nation through
their sacrifices in uniform. In doing so, hundreds of thousands of them have
given their last full measure of devotion in ultimate demonstration of love for
country.
Today, thousands of soldiers serve around the globe to maintain our freedom and
to provide the promise of a better life to others for whom liberty is but a
dream. They are the finest men and women the nation has to offer -- active,
guard and reserve soldiers doing the heavy lifting so we can enjoy the comforts
and freedoms of our way of life.
They are unknown to most of us, but they sacrifice daily in places like Kosovo,
Saudi Arabia, Bosnia, East Timor, Kuwait, Korea and Macedonia in order to
promote democracy and to preserve peace and stability.
These men and women are our patriots. They are prepared to defend our country,
and they are also the best ambassadors for democracy we could have, carrying
the same torch of liberty that was lit 225 years ago. In the remotest corners
of the globe, American soldiers command respect because they symbolize the
traits of our forefathers: a passion for liberty and a willingness to fight to
protect freedom.
As we reflect on the Army's 225th birthday, let us remember that with our Army
was born a nation; with that nation was born democracy; and with democracy was
born the hope that peace and liberty could someday be attained by all oppressed
peoples of the world.
Gen. Eric K. Shinseki is chief of staff of the Army.
Originally published on Jun 15 2000
End<{{
A<>E<>R
~~~
Integrity has no need of rules. -Albert Camus (1913-1960)
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
The only real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking
new
