Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 21:44 +0100, Pascal Obry wrote: > > Anyway, are you going to work on this? If so, you'll see this while > implementing it I suppose. And will discuss this :) > Did not expect to become dt developer when I started using it :) darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 23:24 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin a écrit : > > Next step is to implement it in export settings, which you said can be > "not easy". Giving users system-wide option doesn't require a lot of > work. I understand this part. But my point is that this global setting will be at some point not needed anymore and this is not something really good. You have a pref, people use it and then it is not anymore there. And note that the "not easy part" is to disable exporting tags only. But whether it is a global setting or local in export module there is not much difference in term of complexity. Anyway, are you going to work on this? If so, you'll see this while implementing it I suppose. And will discuss this :) Thanks, -- Pascal Obry / Magny Les Hameaux (78) The best way to travel is by means of imagination http://www.obry.net gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 20:31 +, Timothy Spear wrote: > > Initial release could just be a blank box. Later releases could offer > predefined commands, such as remove all exit data via the exiftool. > Make dt functionality depend on exiftool. Interesting idea... OK, I understand that many default desktop Linux installations already have it, but would Mac/Win users do? Don't forget that error handling with external tools is a headache. Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
[darktable-user] Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Consider an event model. Allow the user to define export post process hooks. When export done call the desired post process hook with the file as a parameter. Initial release could just be a blank box. Later releases could offer predefined commands, such as remove all exit data via the exiftool. Further in a future release this could be extended to allow for automatic exporting when any attribute or condition on the image has changed. Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36> From: Pascal Obry Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2019 11:57:19 AM To: Timur Irikovich Davletshin; darktable-user@lists.darktable.org Subject: Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 22:23 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin a écrit : > System-wide settings will do fine too :) Just few lines to add new > checkbox in settings and additional check in common/exif.cc lines 2472- > 2473 (is it the one which constructs XMP structure?)... Don't like the system wide setting here. There is case where you want to export with tags and case where you don't want depending for who you export (yourself, client for the Web...). -- Pascal Obry / Magny Les Hameaux (78) The best way to travel is by means of imagination http://www.obry.net gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.or
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 21:16 +0100, Pascal Obry wrote: > Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 23:03 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin a > écrit : > > I don't like it either but it will do for the beginning. > > But then what would be the next step? Disable this setting which has > been used by many people. That's not a good option, better directly > target an export option. > Next step is to implement it in export settings, which you said can be "not easy". Giving users system-wide option doesn't require a lot of work. As I understood, image export modules do not provide this kind of information (future checkbox status) to exif processing stuff in common/exif.cc. Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 23:03 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin a écrit : > I don't like it either but it will do for the beginning. But then what would be the next step? Disable this setting which has been used by many people. That's not a good option, better directly target an export option. -- Pascal Obry / Magny Les Hameaux (78) The best way to travel is by means of imagination http://www.obry.net gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 20:57 +0100, Pascal Obry wrote: > Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 22:23 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin a > écrit : > > System-wide settings will do fine too :) Just few lines to add new > > checkbox in settings and additional check in common/exif.cc lines > > 2472- > > 2473 (is it the one which constructs XMP structure?)... > > Don't like the system wide setting here. > I don't like it either but it will do for the beginning. > There is case where you want > to export with tags and case where you don't want depending for who > you export (yourself, client for the Web...). This is exactly what nearly happened to me. It would be strange (or even embarrassing) to send some people I've just met on New Year party pictures tagged "Crappy party photos" ))) Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 22:23 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin a écrit : > System-wide settings will do fine too :) Just few lines to add new > checkbox in settings and additional check in common/exif.cc lines 2472- > 2473 (is it the one which constructs XMP structure?)... Don't like the system wide setting here. There is case where you want to export with tags and case where you don't want depending for who you export (yourself, client for the Web...). -- Pascal Obry / Magny Les Hameaux (78) The best way to travel is by means of imagination http://www.obry.net gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 13:59 -0500, Anton Aylward a écrit : > On 2019-01-01 12:51 p.m., Timur Irikovich Davletshin wrote: > > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose during > > export. > > Not to my logic. > To my logic this merely adds to the complexity of the export, which is > complicated enough as it is! Don't know why you say that. But some export storage like Google+, Facebook and Piwigo do provide a way to export tags or not. -- Pascal Obry / Magny Les Hameaux (78) The best way to travel is by means of imagination http://www.obry.net gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 13:59 -0500, Anton Aylward wrote: > On 2019-01-01 12:51 p.m., Timur Irikovich Davletshin wrote: > > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose > > during > > export. > > Not to my logic. > To my logic this merely adds to the complexity of the export, which > is > complicated enough as it is! > Feature request simplified UI. TIFF settings are especially complicated for Instagram users. OMG, deflate predictor & compression level... — I just wanted to apply some cool filter, didn't expect that University degree is required ))) darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 14:02 -0500, Anton Aylward wrote: > > I think that Patrick is asking the very pertinent questions. > They amount to :what is your workflow"? > That should be systematized because of the very nature of DT - it is > algorithmic; so far you've made it sound very ad-hoc, > I'm happy to provide more details, but I doubt that help or useful advice will come from Patrick ))) In order to find fix for bug #12160 which was marked as invalid I dropped old settings file (kept from dt 1.4 I suppose). And this indeed helped. Bug was gone, I was happy but suddenly I've discovered that my tags are exported to JPEGs that I was about to send some people. Like I said before, none of my previous exports have been tagged. I don't remember that I used any additional tools to manipulate XMP data in those JPEGs... Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 20:02 +0100, Pascal Obry wrote: > Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 20:51 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin > aécrit : > > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose > > during > > export. > > Probably the best solution indeed. But probably not easy. It is not > only the tags that are exported but the whole exif data (comprising > the > XMP development steps). That is, a feature not well known, from a > jpeg > it is possible to load the XMP to get the back the history used to > develop the RAW. > > Best, > System-wide settings will do fine too :) Just few lines to add new checkbox in settings and additional check in common/exif.cc lines 2472- 2473 (is it the one which constructs XMP structure?)... Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On 2019-01-01 12:51 p.m., Timur Irikovich Davletshin wrote: > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose during > export. Not to my logic. To my logic this merely adds to the complexity of the export, which is complicated enough as it is! -- Perilous to all of us are the devices of an art deeper than we ourselves possess. -- Gandalf the Grey [J.R.R. Tolkien, "Lord of the Rings"] darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On 2019-01-01 1:46 p.m., Timur Irikovich Davletshin wrote: > On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 13:25 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: >> >> more complexity ??? >> >> the images I export *only* have the tags I intended. >> >> maybe better answers will come if you explain what you want to have >> happen. really, you don't assign any tags and still get them when >> you >> export? > >> maybe you need to use the one of the multitude tag editors in >> lighttable mode >> and assign or remove the tags as you desire. will that fit your >> purpose? >> > > Patrick, I doubt if you can assist in relation to this matter. I think that Patrick is asking the very pertinent questions. They amount to :what is your workflow"? That should be systematized because of the very nature of DT - it is algorithmic; so far you've made it sound very ad-hoc, -- When one find's oneself in a hole of one's own making, it is a good time to examine the quality of the workmanship. --John Renmerde darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Le mardi 01 janvier 2019 à 20:51 +0300, Timur Irikovich Davletshin aécrit : > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose during > export. Probably the best solution indeed. But probably not easy. It is not only the tags that are exported but the whole exif data (comprising the XMP development steps). That is, a feature not well known, from a jpeg it is possible to load the XMP to get the back the history used to develop the RAW. Best, -- Pascal Obry / Magny Les Hameaux (78) The best way to travel is by means of imagination http://www.obry.net gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 13:25 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: > > more complexity ??? > > the images I export *only* have the tags I intended. > > maybe better answers will come if you explain what you want to have > happen. really, you don't assign any tags and still get them when > you > export? > maybe you need to use the one of the multitude tag editors in > lighttable mode > and assign or remove the tags as you desire. will that fit your > purpose? > Patrick, I doubt if you can assist in relation to this matter. Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
* Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 12:53]: > On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 12:28 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: > > * Bernhard [01-01-19 12:20]: > > > > but that is an "expected" action where you do have control, not > > something dt does automagically w/o your intention. you (one) did > > create the tags and assign them to particular images. > > > > so, perhaps the best answer is to not tag images with tags you don't > > want exported. > > > > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose during > export. more complexity ??? the images I export *only* have the tags I intended. maybe better answers will come if you explain what you want to have happen. really, you don't assign any tags and still get them when you export? maybe you need to use the one of the multitude tag editors in lighttable mode and assign or remove the tags as you desire. will that fit your purpose? -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.orgopenSUSE Community Memberfacebook/ptilopteri Registered Linux User #207535@ http://linuxcounter.net Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo paka @ IRCnet freenode darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 12:28 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: > * Bernhard [01-01-19 12:20]: > > but that is an "expected" action where you do have control, not > something > dt does automagically w/o your intention. you (one) did create the > tags > and assign them to particular images. > > so, perhaps the best answer is to not tag images with tags you don't > want > exported. > Perhaps it is more logical to give user opportunity to choose during export. Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 18:12 +0100, Bernhard wrote: > > But that has been the case since I know darktable (V1.4.x) > That is strange, none of my previously exported JPEGs are tagged. I tried to reset dt settings and now all of them are tagged... no matter which version I use. Do we have some 'secret' key to control this behavior? Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
* Bernhard [01-01-19 12:20]: > > > Patrick Shanahan schrieb am 01.01.19 um 15:34: > > * Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 08:45]: > > > On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 08:30 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: > > > > * Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 > > > > 05:51]: > > > > > Hi! > > > > > > > > > > I believe it's something new in dt 2.6 (never noticed that in 2.4). > > > > > How do I prevent darktable tags being exported to JPEG keywords? > > > > don't use tags, but I would guess that is not what you want. you will > > > > probably need to use an apt such as shotwell or ... or script to > > > > remove the tags *after* export. or maybe craft an lua script to > > > > export images w/o tags but I do not know that is possible. > > > > > > > > fwiw, shotwell can handily add/remove tags and operate on groups of > > > > images at once. > > > > > > > Thanks for your advice regarding tags, but some of them get applied > > > automatically ))) BTW, exiftool does better job in managing tags. > > yes, I consider exiftool/exiv2 as scripting. > > > > what tags do you find dt applying automatically? I hadn't noticed that. > anything you add in the tagging and metadata modules of lighttable is also > exported to the jpeg - so also all (hierachical or not) keywords. > But that has been the case since I know darktable (V1.4.x) but that is an "expected" action where you do have control, not something dt does automagically w/o your intention. you (one) did create the tags and assign them to particular images. so, perhaps the best answer is to not tag images with tags you don't want exported. -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.orgopenSUSE Community Memberfacebook/ptilopteri Registered Linux User #207535@ http://linuxcounter.net Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo paka @ IRCnet freenode darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
Patrick Shanahan schrieb am 01.01.19 um 15:34: * Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 08:45]: On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 08:30 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: * Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 05:51]: Hi! I believe it's something new in dt 2.6 (never noticed that in 2.4). How do I prevent darktable tags being exported to JPEG keywords? don't use tags, but I would guess that is not what you want. you will probably need to use an apt such as shotwell or ... or script to remove the tags *after* export. or maybe craft an lua script to export images w/o tags but I do not know that is possible. fwiw, shotwell can handily add/remove tags and operate on groups of images at once. Thanks for your advice regarding tags, but some of them get applied automatically ))) BTW, exiftool does better job in managing tags. yes, I consider exiftool/exiv2 as scripting. what tags do you find dt applying automatically? I hadn't noticed that. anything you add in the tagging and metadata modules of lighttable is also exported to the jpeg - so also all (hierachical or not) keywords. But that has been the case since I know darktable (V1.4.x) -- regards Bernhard https://www.bilddateien.de darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
* Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 08:45]: > On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 08:30 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: > > * Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 > > 05:51]: > > > Hi! > > > > > > I believe it's something new in dt 2.6 (never noticed that in 2.4). > > > How do I prevent darktable tags being exported to JPEG keywords? > > > > don't use tags, but I would guess that is not what you want. you will > > probably need to use an apt such as shotwell or ... or script to > > remove the tags *after* export. or maybe craft an lua script to > > export images w/o tags but I do not know that is possible. > > > > fwiw, shotwell can handily add/remove tags and operate on groups of > > images at once. > > > > Thanks for your advice regarding tags, but some of them get applied > automatically ))) BTW, exiftool does better job in managing tags. yes, I consider exiftool/exiv2 as scripting. what tags do you find dt applying automatically? I hadn't noticed that. -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.orgopenSUSE Community Memberfacebook/ptilopteri Registered Linux User #207535@ http://linuxcounter.net Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo paka @ IRCnet freenode darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
On Tue, 2019-01-01 at 08:30 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote: > * Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 > 05:51]: > > Hi! > > > > I believe it's something new in dt 2.6 (never noticed that in 2.4). > > How > > do I prevent darktable tags being exported to JPEG keywords? > > don't use tags, but I would guess that is not what you want. you > will > probably need to use an apt such as shotwell or ... or script to > remove > the tags *after* export. or maybe craft an lua script to export > images > w/o tags but I do not know that is possible. > > fwiw, shotwell can handily add/remove tags and operate on groups of > images > at once. > Thanks for your advice regarding tags, but some of them get applied automatically ))) BTW, exiftool does better job in managing tags. Timur. darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
Re: [darktable-user] Exporting tags → JPEG keywords
* Timur Irikovich Davletshin [01-01-19 05:51]: > Hi! > > I believe it's something new in dt 2.6 (never noticed that in 2.4). How > do I prevent darktable tags being exported to JPEG keywords? don't use tags, but I would guess that is not what you want. you will probably need to use an apt such as shotwell or ... or script to remove the tags *after* export. or maybe craft an lua script to export images w/o tags but I do not know that is possible. fwiw, shotwell can handily add/remove tags and operate on groups of images at once. -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.orgopenSUSE Community Memberfacebook/ptilopteri Registered Linux User #207535@ http://linuxcounter.net Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo paka @ IRCnet freenode darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
