Re: comments about hardware
On Mon, Jul 18, 2005 at 01:36:55AM -0400, Faheem Mitha wrote: 1) Dual core Opterons first came on the market in April. The sales rep said that AMD Dual Core Opterons did not work with Fedora Core. Since they only install Fedora and SuSE, they had no info about Debian. Any idea what the status is here? How well are they supported, and how stably do they run under Linux? Also, I was told that a dual core Opteron, which is somewhat more than twice the cost two regular Opterons of similar speed, is not equivalent to two regular Opterons in functionality. Can anyone point me to information about this, or offer a comment? One dual core opteron compared to two single core opterons: Each opteron has a memory controller built in that does dual channel memory support. A dual core opteron still only has one memory controller and hypertransport to the chipset. The two cores share it, so two single cores have theoretically twice the memory bandwidth of a single dual core. Of course they also require a dual socket board rather than a single socket board, and you could put two dual core opterons in a dual board and get to use 4 cores total without having to pay for a much more expensive 4 socket board. Two cores in one package may on the other hand have faster access to each other's caches which may be an advantage in some situations, while in others sharing the memory bandwidth could hurt. At the same time the dual core would always have it's memory local, while two single cores half the ram is likely connected to the other cpu so access would have a 1 cycle penalty for access. A decent OS would try to make sure applications are running on the cpu whos ram they are currently in whenever possible. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: comments about hardware
On Thu, 2005-07-21 at 12:01 -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Mon, Jul 18, 2005 at 01:36:55AM -0400, Faheem Mitha wrote: [snip] single dual core. Of course they also require a dual socket board rather than a single socket board, and you could put two dual core Unless I am misunderstanding you, I think that is wrong. Since they use Socket 940, they are a drop-in replacement for regular chips. All that might be necessary is a BIOS upgrade (and kernel 2.6.12). http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=672pid=2568 One of the most-talked-about features of AMD’s dual core product line has been its drop-in compatibility with existing Socket 939 / 940 motherboards. Now that products are actually launch- ing, AMD has reiterated that motherboards based on Socket 939 and 940 should be able to handle a dual core replacement once the BIOS is flashed to recognize the new processor. [snip] -- - Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson, LA USA PGP Key ID 8834C06B I prefer encrypted mail. Vegemite: Yeast extract (comes from the grunge that is left over after the beer brewing process), sea salt, potassium chloride, malt extract, caramel color, natural flavor, niacin, thiamine hydorchloride, riboflavin. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: comments about hardware
On Thu, Jul 21, 2005 at 11:23:08AM -0500, Ron Johnson wrote: On Thu, 2005-07-21 at 12:01 -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Mon, Jul 18, 2005 at 01:36:55AM -0400, Faheem Mitha wrote: [snip] single dual core. Of course they also require a dual socket board rather than a single socket board, and you could put two dual core Unless I am misunderstanding you, I think that is wrong. Since they use Socket 940, they are a drop-in replacement for regular chips. All that might be necessary is a BIOS upgrade (and kernel 2.6.12). You require a dual socket motherboard to run 2 single core opterons, and you do not require one to run a single dualcore opteron. That is I believe what I said, although maybe I messed it up somehow. With the dualcore chip you can use a cheaper board to get 2 cores running, but you only get half the memory bandwidth of a two chip single core system. http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=672pid=2568 One of the most-talked-about features of AMD?s dual core product line has been its drop-in compatibility with existing Socket 939 / 940 motherboards. Now that products are actually launch- ing, AMD has reiterated that motherboards based on Socket 939 and 940 should be able to handle a dual core replacement once the BIOS is flashed to recognize the new processor. Exactly. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: comments about hardware
On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: One dual core opteron compared to two single core opterons: Each opteron has a memory controller built in that does dual channel memory support. A dual core opteron still only has one memory controller and hypertransport to the chipset. The two cores share it, so two single cores have theoretically twice the memory bandwidth of a single dual core. Of course they also require a dual socket board rather than a single socket board, and you could put two dual core opterons in a dual board and get to use 4 cores total without having to pay for a much more expensive 4 socket board. Two cores in one package may on the other hand have faster access to each other's caches which may be an advantage in some situations, while in others sharing the memory bandwidth could hurt. At the same time the dual core would always have it's memory local, while two single cores half the ram is likely connected to the other cpu so access would have a 1 cycle penalty for access. A decent OS would try to make sure applications are running on the cpu whos ram they are currently in whenever possible. Hi, Thanks for the information. If you have experience of using dual core processors with Debian, I'd be glad to hear of the details. Best regards, Faheem. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
comments about hardware
Dear People, My bioinformatics research group at Duke is buying a server, which will mostly be used as a server, particularly for web based services. The idea here is that a user will submit a request for some bioinformatics calculation via a web interface (often using Python or R or similar), the server does the calculation, and returns it as a web page. None of us are experts about recent hardware, so would appreciate any feedback about hardware specs. The following quote is from Monarch Computers. We plan to run Linux on this. It has not yet been decided yet what, but it seems most likely that it will be either some Red Hat variant (Fedora Core, CentOS), or Debian (possibly Ubuntu). Ok, so here are some specific questions. 1) Dual core Opterons first came on the market in April. The sales rep said that AMD Dual Core Opterons did not work with Fedora Core. Since they only install Fedora and SuSE, they had no info about Debian. Any idea what the status is here? How well are they supported, and how stably do they run under Linux? Also, I was told that a dual core Opteron, which is somewhat more than twice the cost two regular Opterons of similar speed, is not equivalent to two regular Opterons in functionality. Can anyone point me to information about this, or offer a comment? 2) I'm wondering if the listed motherboard is the best choice. I see it listed in http://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/27/mainboards.html We are looking for the motherboard that has the least known issues. Preferably something that will work right out of the box. Google found me http://lists.debian.org/debian-amd64/2004/09/msg00443.html but would be interested in other reports. The specs are here http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk8spro_spec.html It looks like both the graphics card and the ethernet cards are onboard. Looks like the graphics card is ATI RAGE XL PCI, which supposedly works with the 'ati' driver. Is this under XFree 4.3? The ethernet cards are an Intel Ethernet Pro 100, which supposedly works with the e100 driver and a Gigabit Broadcom which works with the tg3 driver. There seem to be two cards here. Is that correct? I'm kinda allergic to onboard cards. They are often trouble. Has anyone had experience with Debian Sarge installation with this? Does anyone have a board to suggest that they prefer to this? 3) I'm also wondering if peple have thoughts about the RAID setup. The rep said he would be using RAID 1, but I see RAID 10 is listed. I'll have to check on this. Anyway, assuming this corresponds to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redundant_array_of_independent_disks#RAID_10 with each RAID 1 set as two drives, and 4 RAID 1 sets striped together, does this seem reasonable? Thanks.Faheem. *** ITEM NUM PRICE PER ITEM TOT Monarch Empro Custom 2U Rack S 1.0075.00 75.00 RMC2K2-9I-XPSS,2U,8 Bays,SATA, 1.00 725.00 725.00 AIC 2U Riser Card/Rear Window1.00 112.00 112.00 Tyan S2882G3NR-D Dual Socket94 1.00 394.00 394.00 Amd OSA265FAA6CB Dual Core Opt 2.00 851.00 1,702.00 Thermal Grease, Shin-Etsu G675 2.0014.0028.00 THERMALTAKE A1838 AMD Opteron2.0025.0050.00 WESTERN DIGITAL 250 GB 2500JD1.00 115.00 115.00 3WARE Escalade 9500S-8 - 8-por 1.00 485.00 485.00 RAID 10 Setup1.0025.0025.00 WESTERN DIGITAL 250 GB 2500JD8.00115.00 920.00 SONY DWD-56A 8X4X2.4 DVD RW+/- 1.00129.00 129.00 SUSE Linux 9.3 Professional Ed 1.00 92.00 92.00 24/7 TECH SUPPORT+ONSITE 3 YR. 1.00199.00 199.00 Net Order: 5,051.00 Freight: 75.00 5,126.00 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: comments about hardware
Hi, Dual core support is not distro specific. It depends on the kernel used. I believe that debian, with a recent (2.6.12.3+) kernel should be fine. Ed Tomlinson On Monday 18 July 2005 01:36, Faheem Mitha wrote: Dear People, My bioinformatics research group at Duke is buying a server, which will mostly be used as a server, particularly for web based services. The idea here is that a user will submit a request for some bioinformatics calculation via a web interface (often using Python or R or similar), the server does the calculation, and returns it as a web page. None of us are experts about recent hardware, so would appreciate any feedback about hardware specs. The following quote is from Monarch Computers. We plan to run Linux on this. It has not yet been decided yet what, but it seems most likely that it will be either some Red Hat variant (Fedora Core, CentOS), or Debian (possibly Ubuntu). Ok, so here are some specific questions. 1) Dual core Opterons first came on the market in April. The sales rep said that AMD Dual Core Opterons did not work with Fedora Core. Since they only install Fedora and SuSE, they had no info about Debian. Any idea what the status is here? How well are they supported, and how stably do they run under Linux? Also, I was told that a dual core Opteron, which is somewhat more than twice the cost two regular Opterons of similar speed, is not equivalent to two regular Opterons in functionality. Can anyone point me to information about this, or offer a comment? 2) I'm wondering if the listed motherboard is the best choice. I see it listed in http://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/27/mainboards.html We are looking for the motherboard that has the least known issues. Preferably something that will work right out of the box. Google found me http://lists.debian.org/debian-amd64/2004/09/msg00443.html but would be interested in other reports. The specs are here http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk8spro_spec.html It looks like both the graphics card and the ethernet cards are onboard. Looks like the graphics card is ATI RAGE XL PCI, which supposedly works with the 'ati' driver. Is this under XFree 4.3? The ethernet cards are an Intel Ethernet Pro 100, which supposedly works with the e100 driver and a Gigabit Broadcom which works with the tg3 driver. There seem to be two cards here. Is that correct? I'm kinda allergic to onboard cards. They are often trouble. Has anyone had experience with Debian Sarge installation with this? Does anyone have a board to suggest that they prefer to this? 3) I'm also wondering if peple have thoughts about the RAID setup. The rep said he would be using RAID 1, but I see RAID 10 is listed. I'll have to check on this. Anyway, assuming this corresponds to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redundant_array_of_independent_disks#RAID_10 with each RAID 1 set as two drives, and 4 RAID 1 sets striped together, does this seem reasonable? Thanks.Faheem. *** ITEM NUM PRICE PER ITEM TOT Monarch Empro Custom 2U Rack S 1.0075.00 75.00 RMC2K2-9I-XPSS,2U,8 Bays,SATA, 1.00 725.00 725.00 AIC 2U Riser Card/Rear Window1.00 112.00 112.00 Tyan S2882G3NR-D Dual Socket94 1.00 394.00 394.00 Amd OSA265FAA6CB Dual Core Opt 2.00 851.00 1,702.00 Thermal Grease, Shin-Etsu G675 2.0014.0028.00 THERMALTAKE A1838 AMD Opteron2.0025.0050.00 WESTERN DIGITAL 250 GB 2500JD1.00 115.00 115.00 3WARE Escalade 9500S-8 - 8-por 1.00 485.00 485.00 RAID 10 Setup1.0025.0025.00 WESTERN DIGITAL 250 GB 2500JD8.00115.00 920.00 SONY DWD-56A 8X4X2.4 DVD RW+/- 1.00129.00 129.00 SUSE Linux 9.3 Professional Ed 1.00 92.00 92.00 24/7 TECH SUPPORT+ONSITE 3 YR. 1.00199.00 199.00 Net Order: 5,051.00 Freight: 75.00 5,126.00 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: comments about hardware
Faheem, On Monday 18 July 2005 12:36 am, Faheem Mitha wrote: Dear People, My bioinformatics research group at Duke is buying a server, which will mostly be used as a server, particularly for web based services. The idea here is that a user will submit a request for some bioinformatics calculation via a web interface (often using Python or R or similar), the server does the calculation, and returns it as a web page. None of us are experts about recent hardware, so would appreciate any feedback about hardware specs. The following quote is from Monarch Computers. I'm currently running three dual-Opteron servers purchased last year from Monarch. Delivery was a little slow, but all three worked right out of the box. I've had no hardware problems, so I can't say anything about their technical support, but their sales support was good. We plan to run Linux on this. It has not yet been decided yet what, but it seems most likely that it will be either some Red Hat variant (Fedora Core, CentOS), or Debian (possibly Ubuntu). I ordered my servers with Fedora Core in order to ensure that everything worked with Linux, then immediately reformated the HD's installed Debian-AMD64. ;-) Ok, so here are some specific questions. 1) Dual core Opterons first came on the market in April. The sales rep said that AMD Dual Core Opterons did not work with Fedora Core. Since they only install Fedora and SuSE, they had no info about Debian. Any idea what the status is here? How well are they supported, and how stably do they run under Linux? I have no experience with dual-core Opterons. Also, I was told that a dual core Opteron, which is somewhat more than twice the cost two regular Opterons of similar speed, is not equivalent to two regular Opterons in functionality. Can anyone point me to information about this, or offer a comment? According to an article in LinuxHardware.org dual-core support is included in kernel 2.6.12-rc3 http://www.linuxhardware.org/article.pl?sid=05/04/21/1747217mode=thread 2) I'm wondering if the listed motherboard is the best choice. I see it listed in http://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/27/mainboards.html I don't recall ever hearing any negative comments regarding Tyan MB's and have had no problems at all with mine. (S2882UG3NR). We are looking for the motherboard that has the least known issues. Preferably something that will work right out of the box. Google found me http://lists.debian.org/debian-amd64/2004/09/msg00443.html but would be interested in other reports. The specs are here http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk8spro_spec.html It looks like both the graphics card and the ethernet cards are onboard. Looks like the graphics card is ATI RAGE XL PCI, which supposedly works with the 'ati' driver. Is this under XFree 4.3? I have no experience with the ati driver, as I do not run X Windows on my servers. The ethernet cards are an Intel Ethernet Pro 100, which supposedly works with the e100 driver and a Gigabit Broadcom which works with the tg3 driver. There seem to be two cards here. Is that correct? There are two gigabit ethernet ports which require the tg3 driver and one 100 megabit port which requires the e100 driver. The only problem is in regard to Debian's refusal to ship the Broadcom proprietary firmware with their tg3 driver and I confess to not having studied the situation at all. I just know that it works. I'm kinda allergic to onboard cards. They are often trouble. Has anyone had experience with Debian Sarge installation with this? Does anyone have a board to suggest that they prefer to this? I'm running three AMD64 Debian Sarge servers and they work, but I'm not running anything fancy, just basic server software, as well as an accounting system written in Acucobol. Most of the problems seem to crop up in the desktop/gui software. 3) I'm also wondering if peple have thoughts about the RAID setup. The rep said he would be using RAID 1, but I see RAID 10 is listed. I'll have to check on this. Anyway, assuming this corresponds to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redundant_array_of_independent_disks#RAID_10 with each RAID 1 set as two drives, and 4 RAID 1 sets striped together, does this seem reasonable? The main thing is not to even think about using the onboard SATA RAID controller. I can't explain it in detail, but it's crap. The approach your taking looks fine. I like RAID 10, as well. Disk drives are inexpensive enough now that the little bit of money you save by using RAID 5 just isn't worth it. Thanks.Faheem. *** ITEM NUM PRICE PER ITEM TOT Monarch Empro Custom 2U Rack S 1.0075.00 75.00 RMC2K2-9I-XPSS,2U,8 Bays,SATA, 1.00 725.00 725.00
Re: comments about hardware
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005, Ed Tomlinson wrote: Hi, Dual core support is not distro specific. It depends on the kernel used. I believe that debian, with a recent (2.6.12.3+) kernel should be fine. Do you have any personal experience in using this? I'm concerned about stability issues. Also, would there not be some practical difficulty in getting this installed, seeing as with an earlier kernel it probably won't boot, and the official Debian installers all use 2.6.8? Faheem. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
