Re: apt-proxy

[Eduard Bloch]

#include 
* Eric Cooper [Mon, Nov 07 2005, 09:18:15AM]:

> > Is there a good alternative?
> 
> I wrote approx for exactly this purpose. It's now in testing.

Update your package description please. Current apt-cacher does not
require Apache.

Eduard.
-- 
Elric: We are dreamers, shapers, singers, and makers. We study the mysteries of
laser and circuit, crystal and scanner, holographic demons and invocations of
equations.  These are the tools we employ, and we know many things.
 -- Quotes from Babylon 5 --


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Re: CDBS and other build systems

[W. Borgert]

Quoting "Ivan S. Dubrov" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> The problem is I can't find thorough documentation or some kind of "How To"
> there I can find how to write these extensions. Although they just simply
> pieces of make-files, I find it difficult to start understanding them. For
> example, the diffirence between "rule" and "class" are not very clear for me.

I like CDBS a lot and all my packages use it. Unfortunately, the
documentation is not very extensive. OTOH, the variables are well
documented in the makefiles, i.e. just read through
/usr/share/cdbs/1/{class,rules/*

Furthermore, there is
https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml
in English and
http://www.ngolde.de/cdbs.html
in German.

Other things, I did: I looked for packages build-depending on
CDBS and stole from the debian/rules, and I asked "stupid"
questions on the CDBS hackers spam exploder:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/build-common-hackers
With some luck, questions get answered.

Cheers, WB


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Bug#339002: ITP: cvsconnect -- CVS connection minimizer

[Piotr Roszatycki]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Piotr Roszatycki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

* Package name: cvsconnect
  Version : 0.1
* URL : http://cvs.m17n.org/~akr/cvssuck/
* License : BSD
  Description : CVS connection minimizer

CVSconnect enables you to do multiple CVS operations on single
connection. CVSconnect sets up special environment using $CVS_RSH and
$CVSROOT for the command line CVS client. In the environment, the
command line CVS client reuses a connection.

CVSconnect is especially designed to use with CVSsuck.


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Anthony Towns]

On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 04:56:37PM +0100, Francesco Poli wrote:
> On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 11:28:41 +1000 Anthony Towns wrote:
> > On Sat, Nov 12, 2005 at 07:26:55PM +0100, Francesco Poli wrote:
> > > I disagree with your calling "licensing in a DFSG-free manner" as
> > > "giving up rights": this seems to imply that releasing DFSG-free
> > > works is something wrong or inappropriate.
> > Uh, licensing in a DFSG-free manner *is* giving up rights.
> Of course it is.
> Maybe I didn't explain myself clearly enough, my apologies.
> What I meant is that using that description is suitable if you want to
> depict licening in a DFSG-free manner as something wrong that people
> should *avoid*.

If the description is accurate, it's suitable at any time.

> It resembles describing charity as "investment with no return".

Perhaps; though there are differences. Charity does have returns: both
emotionally/psychologically, and in helping people get up on their feet
so they can trade with you / work for you / employ you in future.
Charitable donations might have different tax considerations too.

By contrast, BSD-like licenses do nothing but give up your rights.
Copyleft licenses do something in between -- giving up your rights in
the hope that others will give up there's in return.

> Well, it's not an inaccurate description (I think), but you would use
> such a definition only if you think that charity is a stupid thing to
> do...

So, if I'm parsing you right, you're saying that a person (such as myself)
would only describe free software as giving up rights (such as I did) only
if that person (me) thought that free software was a stupid thing to do?

If that's not what you're trying to say, would you kindly look back over
your argument, and retract the error?

Cheers,
aj



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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Anthony Towns]

On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 06:59:41AM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Marco d'Itri) writes:
> > On Nov 13, Thomas Bushnell BSG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> I think the best reason to ask or require contributors to licenses
> >> their papers in a DFSG form is so that Debian can distribute the
> >> papers as part of Debian.  
> > I think this is an awful reason, considering that Debian already
> > contains too many non-software packages.
> I'm sorry, I was under the impression that every package in Debian was
> software.  Are you confusing software and computer programs?

In case you hadn't noticed, for the Debian project's purposes software
is a synonym for computer programs; if it weren't the reversion of the
social contract would have had no effect on the "non-free documentation
in main" question. Indeed, the secretary refused to allow a GR proposal
to revert that policy without limiting the social contract to talking
about free "software".

HTH, HAND!

Cheers,
aj



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Re: [Help] How to fix a buggy prerm script in sarge?

[Frank Küster]

Hi all,

it seems that just reading the policy again sometimes solves a problem...

Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Daniel Burrows <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 12:25:01PM +0100, Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
>> was heard to say:
>>> we just received a bug report that is caused by a buggy prerm script
>>> in the package in sarge (it fails because it doesn't handle read-only
>>> /usr/local properly).  Is there any way to fix this, except documenting
>>> it in the release notes?
>>
>>   If your old prerm fails, the new prerm should be called with
>> "failed-upgrade" as its first argument (see Policy 6.4 and 6.5),
>> so you can do any necessary workarounds there.  Errors in postrm
>> are handled similarly.
>
> But what would be the "necessary workarounds"?  The offending lines are:
>
>   LOCALTEXMF=/usr/local/share/texmf
>   rm -f $LOCALTEXMF/ls-R
>   rmdir $LOCALTEXMF 2>/dev/null || true

I was under the impression that "new-prerm failed-upgrade" was called
only to clean up after the failing old prerm script.  But rereading 6.5,
I understand that the new prerm is called as a replacement for the
failed old prerm, and if it succeeds, the upgrade can proceed without
problems.  Am I right?

TIA, Frank
-- 
Frank Küster
Inst. f. Biochemie der Univ. Zürich
Debian Developer

Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Henning Makholm]

Scripsit David Nusinow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> From reading the responses from Andreas, rather than people trying poorly
> to interpret him, it's pretty apparent that they'll be giving freely
> licensed talks a greater weight than non-free ones. They're also going to
> make it easy to choose a free license from their interface. Furthermore, it
> implies a very strong desire to have freely licensed materials

All of that is nice and well, but it does not change the fact that a
DSFG-free license is not *required*.

> Hopefully if you don't like the way they run the conference
> you'll get involved in the future and help to make it even better.

I am perfectly happy with the way the conference is being run. I am
opposing those people who want the organisers to change the way it is
being run, such that DFSG-nonfree papers will be thrown out simply
because of the licensing.

-- 
Henning Makholm   "It was intended to compile from some approximation to
 the M-notation, but the M-notation was never fully defined,
because representing LISP functions by LISP lists became the
 dominant programming language when the interpreter later became available."


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Re: Resignation and uploads

[Nathanael Nerode]

Wouter Verhelst wrote:
> Oh, and here's something else to ponder: Maybe, just maybe, James has
> more time to go to Ubuntu below zero than he has to handle keyring
> updates because he prioritizes by what gets the bills paid. As most of
> us do, I suppose.

Maybe, just maybe, someone else should be authorized to update the keyring 
then, if James is so busy he can't handle it.

This sort of thing has happened repeatedly with James Troup, who has clearly 
volunteered for more than he can manage -- many thanks to his giving heart, 
but it's obvious additional people need to be assigned the power to do these 
jobs.  Branden?

-- 
Nathanael Nerode  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

This space intentionally left blank.


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Henning Makholm]

Scripsit Anthony Towns 

> In case you hadn't noticed, for the Debian project's purposes software
> is a synonym for computer programs; if it weren't the reversion of the
> social contract would have had no effect on the "non-free documentation
> in main" question.

I case you hadn't noticed, there was a major _difference_ in opionons
about how "software" was to be interpreted. The editorial
clarification in 2004-003 removed the confusion by avoiding the
ambiguous word "software", but that does in no way mean that the
ambiguity does not exist.

-- 
Henning Makholm "This imposes the restriction on any
  procedure statement that the kind and type
 of each actual parameter be compatible with the
   kind and type of the corresponding formal parameter."


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Neil McGovern]

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 03:04:51PM +0100, Henning Makholm wrote:
> Scripsit David Nusinow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> > From reading the responses from Andreas, rather than people trying poorly
> > to interpret him, it's pretty apparent that they'll be giving freely
> > licensed talks a greater weight than non-free ones. They're also going to
> > make it easy to choose a free license from their interface. Furthermore, it
> > implies a very strong desire to have freely licensed materials
> 
> All of that is nice and well, but it does not change the fact that a
> DSFG-free license is not *required*.
> 

At the moment, this is correct.

A discussion was had on the mailing list[0] and the irc channel[1] on a
similar issue, whether we should allow non-free software for the
presentation of slides.

I updated the site to state:
"If using slides, please consider that your audience will consist of


  
people who use free software, and your choice of application to prepare 


  
and display the slides should reflect this if at all possible." 


  



  
I think this strikes a good balance of: 


  
"Use free software! Use free software! Use free software! Oh, ok, if you


  
really can't, I suppose we'll let you get away with it. But you should
really."

> > Hopefully if you don't like the way they run the conference
> > you'll get involved in the future and help to make it even better.
> 
> I am perfectly happy with the way the conference is being run. I am
> opposing those people who want the organisers to change the way it is
> being run, such that DFSG-nonfree papers will be thrown out simply
> because of the licensing.
> 

Interestingly, no one has asked us to do so on the team list.

Regards,
Neil McGovern
[0] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[1] #debconf-team @ Freenode
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Re: [Help] How to fix a buggy prerm script in sarge?

[Frank Küster]

Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>>>   If your old prerm fails, the new prerm should be called with
>>> "failed-upgrade" as its first argument (see Policy 6.4 and 6.5),
>>> so you can do any necessary workarounds there.  Errors in postrm
>>> are handled similarly.
>>
>> But what would be the "necessary workarounds"?  The offending lines are:
>>
>>   LOCALTEXMF=/usr/local/share/texmf
>>   rm -f $LOCALTEXMF/ls-R
>>   rmdir $LOCALTEXMF 2>/dev/null || true
>
> I was under the impression that "new-prerm failed-upgrade" was called
> only to clean up after the failing old prerm script.  But rereading 6.5,
> I understand that the new prerm is called as a replacement for the
> failed old prerm, and if it succeeds, the upgrade can proceed without
> problems.  Am I right?

I think I am right, but I still need further advice.  There are two
tetex source packages, tetex-base with the arch-independent stuff, and
tetex-bin with the arch dependent stuff.  Both only work together if the
major versions match, and therefore tetex-base currently Conflicts:
tetex-bin (<= 2.99.7), and on the other hand tetex-bin Depends:
tetex-base (>= 3.0-4).  Since there's no smooth way to update one after
the other with these settings, apt usually removes tetex-base with
--force-depends, then unpacks tetex-bin, then unpacks the new tetex-base
and starts configuring.

Now if the prerm script of tetex-base fails in this szenario, the new
prerm is *not* called with failed-upgrade, because formally it is just a
removal.

Is there a way to tweak internal dependency relationships between -base
and -bin to the effect that upon upgrade of a system that has both
installed it is always tetex-bin that is removed with --force-depends?

TIA, Frank

-- 
Frank Küster
Inst. f. Biochemie der Univ. Zürich
Debian Developer

Bug#339026: ITP: sguil -- Realtime network security monitor

[Lars Bahner]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Lars Bahner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: sguil
  Version : 0.5.3
  Upstream Author : Bamm Visscher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.sguil.org/
* License : QPL
  Description : Realtime network security monitor

Upstream is willing to change license if I can convince
the authors of sancp and barnyard to do likewise.

Sguil (pronounced sgweel) is built by network security analysts for
network security analysts. Sguil's main component is an intuitive GUI
that provides realtime events from snort/barnyard. It also includes
other components which facilitate the practice of Network Security
Monitoring and event driven analysis of IDS alerts.


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Bug#339025: ITP: sancp -- network security tool designed to collect statistical information from network traffic

[Lars Bahner]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Lars Bahner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: sancp
  Version : 1.6.1
  Upstream Author : John Curry [ john dot curry at metre dot net ] 
* URL : http://www.metre.net/sancp.html
* License : QPL
  Description : network security tool designed to collect statistical 
information from network traffic

I am querying upstream for a new license.

This is a network security tool designed to collect statistical
information regarding network traffic, as well as, collect the
traffic itself in pcap format, all for the purpose of: auditing,
historical analysis, and network activity discovery. Rules can
be used to distinguish normal from abnormal traffic and support
tagging connections with: rule id, node id, and status id.
>From an intrusion detection standpoint, every connection is an
event that must be validated through some means. Sancp uses rules
to identify, record, and tag traffic of interest. 'Tagging' a
connection is a new feature since v1.4.0 Connections ('stats')
can be loaded into a database for further analysis.

Sancp rules control three types of logging for a connection: pcap,
stats, and realtime 'pcap' refers to packet data collected on the
connection in tcpdump format, 'stats' refers to a single line
summary of an entire connection once it is 'closed' 'realtime' is
a snapshot of 'stats' based on the initial packet, for immediate
reporting. Both 'stats' and 'realtime' contain a number of fields
used for recording packet statistics, TCP flags, p0f data, and
other vitals about how we handle the connection.


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Andrew Saunders]

On 11/14/05, Henning Makholm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I case you hadn't noticed, there was a major _difference_ in opionons
> about how "software" was to be interpreted. The editorial
> clarification in 2004-003 removed the confusion by avoiding the
> ambiguous word "software"

Unfortunately not. :-(

The GR's author explained[1] that both the DFSG and the SC required
clarifying, but that in the interests of simplicity the necessary
changes would be dealt with in separate GRs. Thus, 2004-003 clarified
only the SC. Until his follow-up GR amending the DFSG is proposed and
passed, the ambiguity will remain.

[1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2005/07/msg00435.html

--
Andrew Saunders

Bug#339029: ITP: barnyard -- output spool reader for Snort

[Lars Bahner]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Lars Bahner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: barnyard
  Version : 0.2.0
  Upstream Author : Andrew R. Baker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Martin Roesch <[EMAIL 
PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://sourceforge.net/projects/barnyard/
* License : QPL
  Description : output spool reader for Snort

I am querying author io. to change the license

This program decouples output overhead from the Snort network intrusion
detection system and allows Snort to run at full speed. It takes input
and output plugins and can therefore be used to convert almost any
spooled file.


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 23:21:38 +1000, Anthony Towns  
said: 

> On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 06:59:41AM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Marco d'Itri) writes:
>> > On Nov 13, Thomas Bushnell BSG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> I think the best reason to ask or require contributors to
>> >> licenses their papers in a DFSG form is so that Debian can
>> >> distribute the papers as part of Debian.
>> > I think this is an awful reason, considering that Debian already
>> > contains too many non-software packages.
>> I'm sorry, I was under the impression that every package in Debian
>> was software.  Are you confusing software and computer programs?

> In case you hadn't noticed, for the Debian project's purposes
> software is a synonym for computer programs; if it weren't the
> reversion of the social contract would have had no effect on the
> "non-free documentation in main" question. Indeed, the secretary
> refused to allow a GR proposal to revert that policy without
> limiting the social contract to talking about free "software".


The editorial change actually had no effect on the social
 contract, which is why it was called an editorial change. So, by
 definition, since there was no real change to social contract,
 everything that is encoded in debian using 1's and 0's is software,
 as opposed to hardware or wetware.

Do not pretend that your particular interpretation is the
 universally accepted one; the fact that no one objected to the GR
 title means that people who were paying attention agreed with
 everything is software, and people not paying attention, well. At the
 very least, there are varying interpretations, and pretending there
 are not does not help your thesis any.

manoj
-- 
Men who cherish for women the highest respect are seldom popular with
them. Joseph Addison
Manoj Srivastava   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 15:04:51 +0100, Henning Makholm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 

> Scripsit David Nusinow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> From reading the responses from Andreas, rather than people trying
>> poorly to interpret him, it's pretty apparent that they'll be
>> giving freely licensed talks a greater weight than non-free
>> ones. They're also going to make it easy to choose a free license
>> from their interface. Furthermore, it implies a very strong desire
>> to have freely licensed materials

> All of that is nice and well, but it does not change the fact that a
> DSFG-free license is not *required*.

Which is a pity.

The same benefit that accrue from freedom of software still
 remain if that software bits represent a presentation; the
 software/presentation can be modified to suit a particular need, and
 redistributed, excepts can be used in other presentations, ica can be
 part of a larger educational  effort. Like any other software, having
 the free software/presentation bits  leads to collaboation,
 invention, and greater benefit to the community of users.

It is a pity that a conference of debian developers, and
 others interested in developing debian, which is itself dedicated to
 being wholly free, and who has just rejected the GFDL as not being
 free enough to be a part of debian, is now saying that in order to be
 a part of Debian's conference, anything goes, and the sole rationale
 given is that non-free stuff, while restricting the usage rights of
 the community, is OK to ensure the success of the conference. 

I se this as saying that  freedom is OK until it comes to
 something real, like holding a conference, and then the whole
 community/rights/freedom thingy is unworkable and too restrictive for
 words.

There has been no argument that the rights of software freedom
 would not apply to software that represents presentations, only that
 somehow freedom implies you do not get the best of what is out there.

Yes, a pity.

>> Hopefully if you don't like the way they run the conference you'll
>> get involved in the future and help to make it even better.

> I am perfectly happy with the way the conference is being run. I am
> opposing those people who want the organisers to change the way it
> is being run, such that DFSG-nonfree papers will be thrown out
> simply because of the licensing.

Yes, I understannd you are in opposition. What you have not
 explained is why, or why are the reasons that software that
 represents programs or software that represents documentation should
 be free do not also apply to software that represents presentation
 materials.  Why is it that the end user who looks st the presentation
 support software should not also gain the benefit of any free
 software, to edit, modify, incorporate into larger works, and freely
 distribute the result to others in the community.

manoj

-- 
There are two ways of disliking poetry; one way is to dislike it, the
other is to read Pope.  -- Oscar Wilde
Manoj Srivastava   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Colin Watson]

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 11:17:06PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 04:56:37PM +0100, Francesco Poli wrote:
> > It resembles describing charity as "investment with no return".
> 
> Perhaps; though there are differences. Charity does have returns: both
> emotionally/psychologically, and in helping people get up on their feet
> so they can trade with you / work for you / employ you in future.
> Charitable donations might have different tax considerations too.
> 
> By contrast, BSD-like licenses do nothing but give up your rights.
> Copyleft licenses do something in between -- giving up your rights in
> the hope that others will give up there's in return.

People get emotional/psychological benefits from giving away their free
software work under BSD/copyleft licences too; people hope that they'll
get contributions to their work from other people in return from making
it freely available (even if they don't require contributions under even
the limited set of circumstances in which copyleft licences require
them); and people have certainly found employment as a result of people
making use of things they've given away under free licences, although I
don't think that's the primary motivator for most people much more than
it is in the case of charity.

I can't say that I understand your "by contrast" here. There are
certainly differences, but, with the exception of tax considerations,
most of the things you list don't really seem to be among them.

Cheers,

-- 
Colin Watson   [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: CDBS and other build systems

[Jani Monoses]

Could anybody point me to some documentation or example of writing custom 
rules/classes for CDBS?

BTW, is there other build systems like CDBS?

WBR,
Ivan Dubrov




The best I could find is
https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml


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Re: [Help] How to fix a buggy prerm script in sarge?

[Frank Küster]

Daniel Burrows <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 12:25:01PM +0100, Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> was heard to say:
>> we just received a bug report that is caused by a buggy prerm script
>> in the package in sarge (it fails because it doesn't handle read-only
>> /usr/local properly).  Is there any way to fix this, except documenting
>> it in the release notes?
>
>   If your old prerm fails, the new prerm should be called with
> "failed-upgrade" as its first argument (see Policy 6.4 and 6.5),
> so you can do any necessary workarounds there.  Errors in postrm
> are handled similarly.

But what would be the "necessary workarounds"?  The offending lines are:

  LOCALTEXMF=/usr/local/share/texmf
  rm -f $LOCALTEXMF/ls-R
  rmdir $LOCALTEXMF 2>/dev/null || true

Since we cannot make /usr/local writable in the new prerm if it is
mounted read-only, the only means I currently see would be to edit the
old version's prerm script.  Which has been said would get a no from the
release team;  I'll have to verify that of nobody comes up with an
alternative. 

And I think lintian/linda should check for lines involving /usr/local
that do no error checking.

Regards, Frank
-- 
Frank Küster
Inst. f. Biochemie der Univ. Zürich
Debian Developer

library renaming due to changed libstdc++ configuration

[Matthias Klose]

[Sent to d-d-a as well, didn't arrive there yet]

Another round of package renamings of some libraries written in C++ is
needed. Background:

libstdc++6 is currently configured to use the mt allocator based on
discussions in April 2004 with upstream libstdc++ developers. This
configuration turned out to be a mistake (memory leaks, and the
allocator is still buggy), other distributions did change back to the
new allocator (the default one) in mid-2005 (FC in July 2005). The
change does not have an effect on symbols exported from libstdc++, but
it does have an effect on symbols exported by libraries which use
containers (using an allocator) from the template headers.

The proposal by upstream is to configure libstdc++ to use the new
allocator again (the default one).

The change will remove the *mt_alloc* symbols defined in some
libraries, just by recompiling with a new compiler package. Therefore
the package names of these libraries have be changed again. The list
of libraries is attached below.

Discussion with the release team can be found at
http://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2005/11/threads.html

The workaround to build most of KDE using g++-3.4 on arm/m68k/hppa can
be removed, g++ should be used instead.

What has to be done:

 * Identify all library packages depending on libstdc++ and
   exporting *mt_alloc* symbols. See below.

 * Provide gcc-3.4 and gcc-4.0 packages configured using the default
   (new) allocator. These packages are currently available from
  http://people.debian.org/~doko/gcc-4.0/ (4.0.2-4)
  http://people.debian.org/~doko/gcc-3.4/ (3.4.4-10)

 * File bug reports for each library package in the list below.
   Will be done on Monday Nov 14.

 * Stop uploading packages listed below, stop the buildd's building
   these packages

 * Upload updated gcc-3.4 and gcc-4.0 packages.
   Will be done on Tuesday Nov 15, around 22:00 UTC

 * Upgrade the buildd's to the updated gcc-3.4 and gcc-4.0 packages.

 * Build new packages with the updated gcc-3.4 and gcc-4.0 packages
   only.

 * Rename and rebuild the libraries listed below. The new suffix for
   these packages should be in any case "c2a" (instead of "c2"). No
   new suffix is needed when the soname changes in a new upstream
   upload. The libfoo1c2a packages need to conflict/replace the old
   libfoo1c2 package (and keep existing conflict/replaces). You can
   find more details in
   http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2005/07/msg1.html

 * Once dependencies are fulfilled for all architectures, request
   binNMU's for all other packages depending on a library package with
   a changed package name.
   If a source upload is necessary for other fixes, wait as well until
   dependencies are fulfilled for all architectures.

Please add/remove packages from the list below, if the list should
have additional entries, or packages should be skipped (i.e. no C++
API).

For all packages below, a NMU policy is proposed, to upload these
packages three work days, after an upload becomes possible.

List of source packages with libraries, which need to be renamed:

   A Mennucc1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libprinterconf
   snmpkit
   A. Maitland Bottoms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   vtk
   APT Development Team 
   apt
   Al Stone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libcoyotl
   Andreas Fester <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   log4cxx
   Andreas Rottmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libmusicbrainz-2.0
   libmusicbrainz-2.1
   libsigcx
   Andres Salomon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   mysql++
   Andrew Lau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   openexr
   Aurelien Jarno <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   lineakd
   Bartosz Fenski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libparagui1.0
   Ben Burton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   regina-normal
   Berin Lautenbach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   xalan
   Bradley Bell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   bakery2.3
   glibmm2.4
   gnome-vfsmm2.6
   gtkmm
   gtkmm2.0
   gtkmm2.4
   libbonobouimm1.3
   libglademm2.4
   libgnomecanvasmm2.6
   libgnomeuimm2.6
   orbit2cpp
   Brian May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   dar
   Chris Leishman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libxml++
   libxml++2.6
   Christophe Prud'homme <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libcorelinux
   Christopher L Cheney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   taglib
   Christopher Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   gwenview
   Daniel Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   adplug
   libextractor
   Daniel Burrows <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   gengameng
   libsigc++-2.0
   tse3
   Daniel Glassey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   sword
   Daniel Schepler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   libcapsinetwork
   libmath++
   Debian ACE+TAO maintainers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   ace
   Debian Boost Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   boost
   Debian KDE Extras Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   digikam
   Debian QA Group <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   macrosystem
   regexx
   Debian Qt/KDE Maintainers 
   arts
   kdelibs
   Debian VoIP Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   openh323
  

Bug#339044: ITP: kitty -- a Qt/KDE based RSS podcast and video aggregator

[Uwe Hermann]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Uwe Hermann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

* Package name: kitty
  Version : 0.9.2
  Upstream Author : KesieV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.kesiev.com/kittyguide/home/
* License : GPL
  Description : a Qt/KDE based RSS podcast and video aggregator

Kitty is a simple graphical podcast and video podcast client which allows
you to tune in, watch, download and bookmark podcasts and video podcasts.


Uwe.
-- 
Uwe Hermann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://www.hermann-uwe.de | http://www.crazy-hacks.org
http://www.it-services-uh.de  | http://www.phpmeat.org
http://www.unmaintained-free-software.org | http://www.holsham-traders.de


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Re: library renaming due to changed libstdc++ configuration

[damog]

On 12:14 Mon 14 Nov 2005, Matthias Klose wrote:
> [Sent to d-d-a as well, didn't arrive there yet]

Did you actually sign the mail to d-d-a?

Quoting http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/:
Only messages signed by a Debian developer will be accepted by this
list.

Cheers,

-- 
David Moreno Garza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   |  http://www.damog.net/
   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  |  GPG: C671257D
 Luchemos por un mundo sin violencia.


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Re: library renaming due to changed libstdc++ configuration

[Aurelien Jarno]

Matthias Klose a écrit :

 * Once dependencies are fulfilled for all architectures, request
   binNMU's for all other packages depending on a library package with
   a changed package name.
   If a source upload is necessary for other fixes, wait as well until
   dependencies are fulfilled for all architectures.


I don't know who will handle those binNMU, but would it be possible to 
have, during the period of the transition, a list of the packages that 
have been currently binNMUed? That would help the unofficial ports to 
follow the transition. This is true at least for kfreebsd-i386, but I 
think that is also the case for amd64, armeb, m32r, hurd-i386 (even if 
it is in the archive, the w-b database is not hosted by Debian).


I propose a list on wiki.debian.org, but maybe there is a better solution.

--
  .''`.  Aurelien Jarno | GPG: 1024D/F1BCDB73
 : :' :  Debian developer   | Electrical Engineer
 `. `'   [EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   `-people.debian.org/~aurel32 | www.aurel32.net


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Rich Walker]

Manoj Srivastava <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

>
> The same benefit that accrue from freedom of software still
>  remain if that software bits represent a presentation; the
>  software/presentation can be modified to suit a particular need, and
>  redistributed, excepts can be used in other presentations, ica can be
>  part of a larger educational  effort. Like any other software, having
>  the free software/presentation bits  leads to collaboation,
>  invention, and greater benefit to the community of users.
>
> It is a pity that a conference of debian developers, and
>  others interested in developing debian, which is itself dedicated to
>  being wholly free, and who has just rejected the GFDL as not being
>  free enough to be a part of debian, is now saying that in order to be
>  a part of Debian's conference, anything goes, and the sole rationale
>  given is that non-free stuff, while restricting the usage rights of
>  the community, is OK to ensure the success of the conference. 

Hold on - does this mean I will or won't be able to do
 apt-get install debconf6-doc
?

cheers, Rich.


-- 
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technical director 251 Liverpool Road   |
need a Hand?   London  N1 1LX   | +UK 20 7700 2487
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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Andreas Schuldei]

* Rich Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005-11-14 18:46:50]:
> Hold on - does this mean I will or won't be able to do
>  apt-get install debconf6-doc

you will, and most likely it will be 100% complete. if someone
packages it.


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approx (was Re: apt-proxy)

[Eric Cooper]

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 08:40:04AM +0100, Brian May wrote:
> Is a back port available for sarge? If not, how feasible would it be
> to create on? Does it depend on anything not in sarge?

Approx needs the current version of libocamlnet-ocaml-dev,
but otherwise should compile and work OK in sarge.

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 08:40:04AM +0100, Eduard Bloch wrote:
> Update your package description please. Current apt-cacher does not
> require Apache.

Yes, I noticed that when I saw the recent thread about apt-cacher's
path_map option.  It should be fixed in the next upload.

As far as I can see, the primary difference is that approx supports
FTP to remote repositories (which apt-cacher is likely to do too in
the future), and is compiled to native code (which may not matter in
practice).  A secondary difference is that approx doesn't keep any
meta information (HTTP headers) in the cache, just the downloaded
files themselves.

Apt-cacher has more flexibility in name mapping, and can integrate (or
not) with an existing webserver.  Is that a fair comparison?

-- 
Eric Cooper e c c @ c m u . e d u


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Brian Nelson]

Andreas Schuldei <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> * Rich Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005-11-14 18:46:50]:
>> Hold on - does this mean I will or won't be able to do
>>  apt-get install debconf6-doc
>
> you will, and most likely it will be 100% complete. if someone
> packages it.

Uhhh, why would something like that be packaged?  Just put it on
http://www.debconf.org or something.  Don't bloat the archive with more
crap like this.

-- 
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Re: Three way link exchange with your-legal-advice.co.uk

[jitender]

 
Dear Webmaster I handle online 
marketing for my clients As an ogoing process to increase the link 
popularity of my client site, i am looking for some good quality sites to 
exchange links..I would request you to kindly consider my client site and add 
this to your link page with the following details: URL: http://www.classyflowers.co.uk/Link 
Text:Classy FlowersDescription: Over the past three years online, we have 
built the fastest growing and most trusted network of florists up and down the 
UK. Your Link will be added at : http://www.mosaic-service.org/shopping/flowers.html URL: 
http://www.awesomeflowers.co.uk/Link 
Text:Awesome FlowersDescription: All of us at Awesome Flowers are dedicated 
to providing the convenience, selection, and value of sending your flowers 
throughout the UK.Your Link will be added at : http://www.ebrandz.org/shopping.htm We 
are asking for triangular link exchange. Triangular link swapping is much more 
relevant than Reciprocal link exchange and has more benefit for SEO purposes. 
This way both the sites will get one way link in a kind. Let me 
know once you add my site at your link page. I will add yours immediately at my 
directory : http://www.bathroom-faq.co.uk/home-and-garden-sites.php I 
am hoping an early and positive response from your 
side. Regards Jitender Singh[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Mortgages/Finance

[jitender]

 
Dear Webmaster I handle online 
marketing for my clients As an ogoing process to increase the link 
popularity of my client site, i am looking for some good quality sites to 
exchange links..I would request you to kindly consider my client site and add 
this to your link page with the following details: URL: http://www.classyflowers.co.uk/Link 
Text:Classy FlowersDescription: Over the past three years online, we have 
built the fastest growing and most trusted network of florists up and down the 
UK. Your Link will be added at : http://www.mosaic-service.org/shopping/flowers.html URL: 
http://www.awesomeflowers.co.uk/Link 
Text:Awesome FlowersDescription: All of us at Awesome Flowers are dedicated 
to providing the convenience, selection, and value of sending your flowers 
throughout the UK.Your Link will be added at : http://www.ebrandz.org/shopping.htm We 
are asking for triangular link exchange. Triangular link swapping is much more 
relevant than Reciprocal link exchange and has more benefit for SEO purposes. 
This way both the sites will get one way link in a kind. Let me 
know once you add my site at your link page. I will add yours immediately at my 
directory : http://www.bathroom-faq.co.uk/home-and-garden-sites.php I 
am hoping an early and positive response from your 
side. Regards Jitender Singh[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Shall Debian's su conform to other implementations

[Lars Wirzenius]

Loudly promoting my own software here...

la, 2005-11-12 kello 10:39 -0200, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh kirjoitti:
> On Sat, 12 Nov 2005, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > > Besides, depends/pre-depends and conflicts should be more than enough if
> > > done right.
> > 
> > Yes, this is what is meant by supporting partial upgrades.  "Supporting
> 
> Ah, ok.  THAT is what I meant too, in a roundabout way.  So we're in
> agreement.
> 
> > partial upgrades" doesn't mean "any given package should be upgradable on
> > its own without upgrading any others"; it means "no apt-get install command
> > should be able to break the system".
> 
> Too bad this isn't really true, it is usually a bad idea to mix
> oldstable+stable for more time than what is strictly necessary to upgrade
> the entire system to stable. Not all dependencies are always correctly
> expressed as versioned dependencies metadata.  So you can get breakages that
> the maintainers don't know about and would never test for explicitly.
> 
> The people doing backports actually help a LOT to track down these bugs as
> they happen :-)

Another that developers can do is this:

sudo piuparts -d sarge -d etch -d sid -al foo.log foo

where foo is the name of their package. This needs a fairly fast access
to a mirror, however, but that can be somewhat avoided by creating a
chroot snapshot (see options -b and -s).

I'm running this on all packages in sid, and filing bugs about any
problems I find, but it does take time and it would be preferable that
package maintainers who can do it themselves do so.

Of course, what piuparts tests is not a complete test of all the
functionality of the package, only that the basics of installation,
upgrade, and removal work. Wait for version 2, please. :)

-- 
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+paste.


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Rich Walker]

Brian Nelson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Andreas Schuldei <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> * Rich Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005-11-14 18:46:50]:
>>> Hold on - does this mean I will or won't be able to do
>>>  apt-get install debconf6-doc
>>
>> you will, and most likely it will be 100% complete. if someone
>> packages it.
>
> Uhhh, why would something like that be packaged?  Just put it on
> http://www.debconf.org or something.  Don't bloat the archive with more
> crap like this.
>
> -- 
> Captain Logic is not steering this tugboat.

And the rest of the documentation? What use is the Maintainers Guide to
a user? Why would you need the Linux Gazette in the archives? I see
games there too - purge them, quick!

cheers, Rich.

(Captain Logic is my co-pilot.)


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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Francesco Poli]

On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 23:17:06 +1000 Anthony Towns wrote:

> > Well, it's not an inaccurate description (I think), but you would
> > use such a definition only if you think that charity is a stupid
> > thing to do...
> 
> So, if I'm parsing you right, you're saying that a person (such as
> myself) would only describe free software as giving up rights (such as
> I did) only if that person (me) thought that free software was a
> stupid thing to do?
> 
> If that's not what you're trying to say, would you kindly look back
> over your argument, and retract the error?

I said "resembles to", which is not "is equal to".
My example about charity intentionally amplified the situation to make
it clearer (I was hoping...).
If it confused things further, I apology.

"Investment with no return" seems (at least to me, YMMV) a stronger
phrase than "giving up rights". As a consequence, I didn't mean to say
that you think that free software is a stupid thing to do.
Just that you (well, Henning, IIRC) seemed to want to discourage people
to license in a DFSG-free manner by calling it in a way that makes it
appear as something better avoiding.

Again, I'm not an English native speaker. Apologies if sometimes I do
not choose words well enough... 

-- 
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..
  Francesco Poli GnuPG Key ID = DD6DFCF4
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Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Brian Nelson]

Rich Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Brian Nelson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> Andreas Schuldei <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>>
>>> * Rich Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005-11-14 18:46:50]:
 Hold on - does this mean I will or won't be able to do
  apt-get install debconf6-doc
>>>
>>> you will, and most likely it will be 100% complete. if someone
>>> packages it.
>>
>> Uhhh, why would something like that be packaged?  Just put it on
>> http://www.debconf.org or something.  Don't bloat the archive with more
>> crap like this.
>
> And the rest of the documentation? What use is the Maintainers Guide to
> a user? 

It's relevant because it's about creating packages.  A dump of all stuff
from Debconf is not going to be as relevant or as generally useful.
Anything from Debconf that could be useful should be merged into the
Developer's Reference or something; not just dumped into a separate
package.

> Why would you need the Linux Gazette in the archives? 

We don't!  It's freaking useless.

> I see games there too - purge them, quick!

WTF?

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Re: Azureus magnet-link functionality

[Shaun Jackman]

In the following email Chris suggests that I add support for bit
torrent magnet:// URLs under Gnome2 in the Azureus package by setting
the gconftool-2 parameter /desktop/gnome/url-handlers/magnet/command
to call Azureus. This seems like a pretty reasonable thing to do, but
it must be done for each user that runs Azureus. Since Azureus is a
Java program, /usr/bin/azureus is already a shell script. Should I add
a couple lines here that call gconftool-2? Any other suggestions on
how to accomplish this same task?

Cheers,
Shaun

2005/11/14, Chris Everts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Hi Shaun,
>
> I have found a simple script in the ed2k-gui package
> (http://surfnet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/ed2k-gtk-gui/ed2k-gtk-gui_0.6.4_i386.deb)
>  that enabled the ed2k link functionality in Gnome. I then realised the same 
> should also work for magnet-links. And indeed it does.
>
> I thought maybe you can include it as an extra in the azureus package so
> people can choose to enable this functionality.
>
> My itch is scratched.
>
> regards,
> Chris Everts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Re: Licenses for DebConf6

[Anthony Towns]

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 05:38:10PM +, Colin Watson wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 11:17:06PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote:
> > On Sun, Nov 13, 2005 at 04:56:37PM +0100, Francesco Poli wrote:
> > > It resembles describing charity as "investment with no return".
> > Perhaps; though there are differences. Charity does have returns: both
> > emotionally/psychologically, and in helping people get up on their feet
> > so they can trade with you / work for you / employ you in future.
> > Charitable donations might have different tax considerations too.
> > By contrast, BSD-like licenses do nothing but give up your rights.
> > Copyleft licenses do something in between -- giving up your rights in
> > the hope that others will give up there's in return.
> People get emotional/psychological benefits from giving away their free
> software work under BSD/copyleft licences too; 

Sure, but that doesn't stop it from being a give away of your rights. It
only (potentially) stops it from being an "investment with no return".

> I can't say that I understand your "by contrast" here. There are
> certainly differences, but, with the exception of tax considerations,
> most of the things you list don't really seem to be among them.

I never claimed writing free software was an investment with no return.

Cheers,
aj



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Re: Azureus magnet-link functionality

[Ken Bloom]

Shaun Jackman wrote:
> In the following email Chris suggests that I add support for bit
> torrent magnet:// URLs under Gnome2 in the Azureus package by setting
> the gconftool-2 parameter /desktop/gnome/url-handlers/magnet/command
> to call Azureus. This seems like a pretty reasonable thing to do, but
> it must be done for each user that runs Azureus. Since Azureus is a
> Java program, /usr/bin/azureus is already a shell script. Should I add
> a couple lines here that call gconftool-2? Any other suggestions on
> how to accomplish this same task?

A configuration option would be nice so that you don't go stealing our
favorite protocol handlers just because we decide to try one out.

-- 
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Re: gnome-swallow_1.2-2_source.changes REJECTED

[Pierre THIERRY]

Scribit Manoj Srivastava dies 11/11/2005 hora 22:35:
> You gotta start trusting somewhere. Our web of trust starts with the
> Developers in the keyring, we trust these people not to muck with the
> binaries.

You trust them, but not any user of Debian will want to trust them so
much. Some will want some degree of confidence that the binaries are
clean...

Would it cost too much to implement?

Doubtfully,
Nowhere man
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Re: gnome-swallow_1.2-2_source.changes REJECTED

[Pierre THIERRY]

Scribit Josselin Mouette dies 12/11/2005 hora 18:37:
> It was already suggested to accept only source+binary uploads, but to
> rebuild the binaries on the upload's architecture anyway.

Has there been a consensus on rejecting that solution?

Curiously,
Nowhere man
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Re: petsc_2.3.0-1_i386.changes REJECTED

[Steve Langasek]

[redirecting this to -devel; discussions of ftp team NEW queue policies are
 off-topic for -release.]

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 05:13:47PM -0500, Adam C Powell IV wrote:

> > And thats what I asked for, yes. Drop the version from -dev|-dbg|-doc,
> > use the shlib system for the rest (which makes packages built against it
> > depending on the right version) and have fun.

> I understand that, and the whole proposal.  And it will break a lot of
> things for many of my users, who need to use old versions of the -dev
> packages at the same time -- which is why I do the versioned -dev
> packages and the alternatives system.

*Why* do users need to use old versions of -dev packages at the same time?
How can it be so important to maintain parallel installable versions of
devel packages for a library package that has only *one* reverse-dependency
in Debian?

For that matter, why is it important that Debian provide support for
coinstallability with older packages that are, evidently, not important
enough themselves to be supported by Debian?

Anyway, the empty petsc-dev package is completely pointless.  It can't be
used sanely as a dependency or build-dependency, because it does *not*
guarantee a constant interface thanks to petsc's FHS-incompatible layout.
I think it would be better if there *were* a single petsc-dev package
containing the header files and library links in FHS locations, making
libpetsc2.2.0-dev unnecessary; but if this is not to be the case for
whatever reason, then petsc-dev ought to be dropped.  In any case, I agree
with Joerg that there ought to only be one -dev package here...

> So now the needs/requests of the users are less important to Debian than
> removing two empty packages?

Users often make requests that would be bad for the system as a whole if we
honored them unconditionally.  Package indices that grow without bounds are
one way that choices that may be good for a subset of users come with a cost
for the rest of our users.

-- 
Steve Langasek   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer   to set it on, and I can move the world.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.debian.org/


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