Re: Debian m17n method under X with UTF-8

2004-10-17 Thread Osamu Aoki
Hi,

On Sat, Oct 16, 2004 at 11:50:18AM +0800, Arne Goetje wrote:
 On Saturday 16 October 2004 07:34, Osamu Aoki wrote:
  How are you making Debian into UTF-8 and multilingual/multi-locale
  system while switching between normal gnome and Xfce? So far, I did
  not find this trivial.
 
 Well, in my case, I found SCIM to be the best solution. 

SCIM does not address needs to access traditional consoles. So this
multilingual environment problem is not just easy IM.

I agree SCIM is a good option and that is why I sponsored its simple bug
fix upload recently.

This package m17n-env is about offering access to the traditional
consoles too.  (Also giving option to choose traditional IM too.)  You
know, Debian is choice.  Also writing documentation for UTF-8 conversion
is not as clean as telling to install helper package to do it instantly
:-)  If you are using .xsession to do your customization, GDM desktop
environment choice may result skipping your SCIM setting under Xfce or 
KDE. So there are many aspect to it.  If you get into emacs settings
like language-env package, the issues will be much bigger but I did not
go that far.  Again, it is in

  deb http://people.debian.org/~osamu/package/ ./

Also post-1.0 version of SCIM needs to be packaged with scim-uim and
others. It is on-going task. If you can help, please drop me a personal
mail.   (I may drop experimental compile of SCIM there soon, too.)

 I don't need to care about locales any more, because SCIM doesn't care
 about locales, as long as you use any UTF-8 locale as default. 

Maybe you do not need it.  But there are many data in non-UTF-8
encodings and editor access to them is essential for the smooth
transition.

 If you want to try SCIM, compile it from source 
 (www.freedesktop.org/Software/scim/), the debian packages don't work 
 for me.

... well you need post-1.0 program sets for some features.  Some API 
has changed.

 The SCIM approach is in my opinion the only useful one, since the locale 
 should only reflect which language you prefer and in which country you 
 are. It should have nothing to do with input methods, as long as your 
 system is UTF-8.

That is sometimes not an easy option for editing traditionally encoded 
files.

Osamu




Re: Debian m17n method under X with UTF-8

2004-10-16 Thread Arne Goetje
On Saturday 16 October 2004 07:34, Osamu Aoki wrote:
 Hi folks,

 How are you making Debian into UTF-8 and multilingual/multi-locale
 system while switching between normal gnome and Xfce? So far, I did
 not find this trivial.

Well, in my case, I found SCIM to be the best solution. I don't need to 
care about locales any more, because SCIM doesn't care about locales, 
as long as you use any UTF-8 locale as default. I just switch on SCIM 
which input method I prefer and can insert CJK into any UTF-8 aware 
application. The locale setting only refers to which language I want to 
have to display the windowmanager and system messages.
GTK2 apps and mozilla, ooo etc. need to have LC_CTYPE to be set to any 
CJK UTF-8 locale to accept SCIM input.
If you want to try SCIM, compile it from source 
(www.freedesktop.org/Software/scim/), the debian packages don't work 
for me.

So, as I prefer my system to be in english, I use en_US.UTF-8 as main 
locale and zh_TW.UTF-8 as LC_CTYPE. XMODIFIERS has to be set to 
@im=SCIM.

The SCIM approach is in my opinion the only useful one, since the locale 
should only reflect which language you prefer and in which country you 
are. It should have nothing to do with input methods, as long as your 
system is UTF-8.

Just my 2 conts.

Cheers
Arne
-- 
Arne Gtje () [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
(Spam catcher.  Address might change in future!)
PGP/GnuPG key: 1024D/685D1E8C
Fingerprint: 2056 F6B7 DEA8 B478 311F  1C34 6E9F D06E 685D 1E8C
Key available at wwwkeys.pgp.net.   Encrypted e-mail preferred.