Re: SSH never free
Marco d'Itri [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Oct 02, Herbert Xu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The patent makes it non-free, so does the new license.
Really? In my country RSA is not patented, why should I care about what
happens in someone else country?
Please have a look at our policy.
--
Debian GNU/Linux 2.1 is out! ( http://www.debian.org/ )
Email: Herbert Xu ~{PmVHI~} [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/
PGP Key: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/pubkey.txt
Re: SSH never free
On Oct 02, Herbert Xu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The patent makes it non-free, so does the new license. Really? In my country RSA is not patented, why should I care about what happens in someone else country? -- ciao, Marco
LZW patent (was: SSH never free)
Quoting Bob Nielsen: Does anyone know when the LZW patent expires? According to http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?pn=US04558302__ it was awarded on June 20, 1983. This means that it will expire on June 20 or 21, 2003. -- ((lambda (x) (list x (list (quote quote) x))) (quote (lambda (x) (list x (list (quote quote) x) -- A LISP quine written by Seth David Schoen +++ath
Re: SSH never free
[ RSA is no longer included. ] [ IDEA is no longer included. ] IDEA was the only part of ssh that made it non-free, prohibiting commercial use. Wrong, RSA makes it non-free, and so does their license. Wrong, RSA makes it non-us. I can freely use RSA here.
Re: SSH never free
On Sun, Oct 03, 1999 at 08:54:48AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote: PS: the RSA patent expires in 2001 (or is it 2002?), anyway. 20 September 2000. -- Joseph Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] Debian GNU/Linux developer GnuPG: 2048g/3F9C2A43 - 20F6 2261 F185 7A3E 79FC 44F9 8FF7 D7A3 DCF9 DAB3 PGP 2.6: 2048R/50BDA0ED - E8 D6 84 81 E3 A8 BB 77 8E E2 29 96 C9 44 5F BE -- * Simunye is so happy she has her mothers gene's Dellaran you better give them back before she misses them! pgpzW2HSCz1gM.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: SSH never free
On Sat, Oct 02, 1999 at 11:57:07PM -0700, Joseph Carter wrote: On Sun, Oct 03, 1999 at 08:54:48AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote: PS: the RSA patent expires in 2001 (or is it 2002?), anyway. 20 September 2000. Does anyone know when the LZW patent expires? -- Bob Nielsen Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tucson, AZ AMPRnet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] DM42nh http://www.primenet.com/~nielsen
Re: SSH never free
On Fri, Oct 01, 1999 at 05:39:12PM -0400, Ben Collins wrote: On Fri, Oct 01, 1999 at 02:16:03PM -0700, Ryan Murray wrote: restrictive); see below for details. [ RSA is no longer included. ] [ IDEA is no longer included. ] IDEA was the only part of ssh that made it non-free, prohibiting commercial use. Wrong, RSA makes it non-free, and so does their license. Whoops...typing faster than thinking, it seems. Of course, in Canada I don't have to use rsaref, so it makes it easier to forget...:) -- Ryan Murray ([EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Software Designer, Glenayre Technologies Inc. The opinions expressed here are my own.
Re: SSH never free
Jason Gunthorpe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 1 Oct 1999, James Troup wrote:
[ RSA is no longer included. ]
Wait wait, doesn't this mean that ssh RSA authentication is gone as well??
Did they replace it with DSS/DH or what? IMHO ssh would cease to be very
usefull as a security tool without a public key mechism, not to mention
that existin ssh clients would not be able to securely connect to obsd-ssh
servers :
They use libssl, which begs the question why isn't libssl in non-US/non-free?
--
Debian GNU/Linux 2.1 is out! ( http://www.debian.org/ )
Email: Herbert Xu ~{PmVHI~} [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/
PGP Key: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/pubkey.txt
Re: SSH never free
At 10:06 +1000 1999-10-02, Herbert Xu wrote: They use libssl, which begs the question why isn't libssl in non-US/non-free? Uh, because it isn't non-free? If we step into the patents make something non-free trap, then we probably have a lot of things in main that should be moved to non-free because they technically infringe on someone's stupid patent. Perhaps you are confused, ssh became non-free despite patents in 1.2.13, it is *NOT* the patents that make ssh non-free. Another thing, technically our ssh package is illegal to use in the US because it does not use RSAREF. -- Joel Klecker (aka Espy)Debian GNU/Linux Developer URL:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] URL:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] URL:http://web.espy.org/ URL:http://www.debian.org/
Re: SSH never free
Joel Klecker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
At 10:06 +1000 1999-10-02, Herbert Xu wrote:
They use libssl, which begs the question why isn't libssl in non-US/non-free?
Uh, because it isn't non-free?
Here's a quote from the policy:
`Non-free' contains packages which are not compliant with the DFSG or
which are encumbered by patents or other legal issues that make their
distribution problematic.
If we step into the patents make something non-free trap, then we
probably have a lot of things in main that should be moved to
non-free because they technically infringe on someone's stupid patent.
Please list them so that we can move them over there *now*.
Perhaps you are confused, ssh became non-free despite patents in
1.2.13, it is *NOT* the patents that make ssh non-free.
The patent makes it non-free, so does the new license.
Another thing, technically our ssh package is illegal to use in the
US because it does not use RSAREF.
Ain't I lukcy then that I don't live in the US :)
--
Debian GNU/Linux 2.1 is out! ( http://www.debian.org/ )
Email: Herbert Xu ~{PmVHI~} [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/
PGP Key: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/pubkey.txt
Re: SSH never free
Joel Klecker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If we step into the patents make something non-free trap, then we probably have a lot of things in main that should be moved to non-free because they technically infringe on someone's stupid patent. Living in the UK, where there are currently no software patenets, I tend to agree with you. But there is some inconsistancy, for example all the gif that is in non-free because of patents. -- I consume, therefore I am pgp7VRzSf3p51.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: SSH never free
Herbert Xu [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: They use libssl, which begs the question why isn't libssl in non-US/non-free? Uh, because I keep forgetting. I've been meaning to do that since Guy split non-US up... I guess I'll go file a bug against ftp.debian.org. -- James
Re: SSH never free
On Sat, Oct 02, 1999 at 10:06:24AM +1000, Herbert Xu wrote: They use libssl, which begs the question why isn't libssl in non-US/non-free? i thought that only copyright/license and *not* patent issues determined whether we considered something to be free or non-free. e.g. libssl is completely free software in the free world, but encumbered by a patent problem in the world's favourite police state. craig PS: the RSA patent expires in 2001 (or is it 2002?), anyway. -- craig sanders
SSH never free
I am pretty sure that SSH was never free software. Could you show me the license on the version that they started with? Is there any chance that you could put me in touch with the OpenBSD people who are working on this?
Re: SSH never free
Richard Stallman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am pretty sure that SSH was never free software. Could you show me the license on the version that they started with? - This file is part of the ssh software, Copyright (c) 1995 Tatu Ylonen, Finland COPYING POLICY AND OTHER LEGAL ISSUES As far as I am concerned, the code I have written for this software can be used freely for any purpose. Any derived versions of this software must be clearly marked as such, and if the derived work is incompatible with the protocol description in the RFC file, it must be called by a name other than ssh or Secure Shell. However, I am not implying to give any licenses to any patents or copyrights held by third parties, and the software includes parts that are not under my direct control. As far as I know, all included source code is used in accordance with the relevant license agreements and can be used freely for any purpose (the GNU license being the most restrictive); see below for details. [ RSA is no longer included. ] [ IDEA is no longer included. ] [ DES is now external. ] [ GMP is now external. No more GNU licence. ] [ Zlib is now external. ] [ The make-ssh-known-hosts script is no longer included. ] [ TSS has been removed. ] The MD5 implementation in md5.c was taken from PGP and is due to Colin Plumb. Comments in the file indicate that it is in the public domain. The 32-bit CRC implementation in crc32.c is due to Gary S. Brown. Comments in the file indicate it may be used for any purpose without restrictions. Note that any information and cryptographic algorithms used in this software are publicly available on the Internet and at any major bookstore, scientific library, and patent office worldwide. More information can be found e.g. at http://www.cs.hut.fi/crypto;. The legal status of this program is some combination of all these permissions and restrictions. Use only at your own responsibility. You will be responsible for any legal consequences yourself; I am not making any claims whether possessing or using this is legal or not in your country, and I am not taking any responsibility on your behalf. NO WARRANTY BECAUSE THE PROGRAM IS LICENSED FREE OF CHARGE, THERE IS NO WARRANTY FOR THE PROGRAM, TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW. EXCEPT WHEN OTHERWISE STATED IN WRITING THE COPYRIGHT HOLDERS AND/OR OTHER PARTIES PROVIDE THE PROGRAM AS IS WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESSED OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO THE QUALITY AND PERFORMANCE OF THE PROGRAM IS WITH YOU. SHOULD THE PROGRAM PROVE DEFECTIVE, YOU ASSUME THE COST OF ALL NECESSARY SERVICING, REPAIR OR CORRECTION. IN NO EVENT UNLESS REQUIRED BY APPLICABLE LAW OR AGREED TO IN WRITING WILL ANY COPYRIGHT HOLDER, OR ANY OTHER PARTY WHO MAY MODIFY AND/OR REDISTRIBUTE THE PROGRAM AS PERMITTED ABOVE, BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR DAMAGES, INCLUDING ANY GENERAL, SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE PROGRAM (INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO LOSS OF DATA OR DATA BEING RENDERED INACCURATE OR LOSSES SUSTAINED BY YOU OR THIRD PARTIES OR A FAILURE OF THE PROGRAM TO OPERATE WITH ANY OTHER PROGRAMS), EVEN IF SUCH HOLDER OR OTHER PARTY HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. - Is there any chance that you could put me in touch with the OpenBSD people who are working on this? Theo de Raadt [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the head of OpenBSD, and as far as I can see, he is the person who initiated the project they have now dubbed OpenSSH (1.0). Hope this helps... -- James
Re: SSH never free
On Fri, Oct 01, 1999 at 09:52:42PM +0100, James Troup wrote: I am pretty sure that SSH was never free software. Could you show me the license on the version that they started with? - This file is part of the ssh software, Copyright (c) 1995 Tatu Ylonen, Finland COPYING POLICY AND OTHER LEGAL ISSUES As far as I am concerned, the code I have written for this software can be used freely for any purpose. Any derived versions of this software must be clearly marked as such, and if the derived work is incompatible with the protocol description in the RFC file, it must be called by a name other than ssh or Secure Shell. However, I am not implying to give any licenses to any patents or copyrights held by third parties, and the software includes parts that are not under my direct control. As far as I know, all included source code is used in accordance with the relevant license agreements and can be used freely for any purpose (the GNU license being the most restrictive); see below for details. [ RSA is no longer included. ] [ IDEA is no longer included. ] IDEA was the only part of ssh that made it non-free, prohibiting commercial use. -- Ryan Murray ([EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Software Designer, Glenayre Technologies Inc. The opinions expressed here are my own.
Re: SSH never free
On 1 Oct 1999, James Troup wrote: [ RSA is no longer included. ] Wait wait, doesn't this mean that ssh RSA authentication is gone as well?? Did they replace it with DSS/DH or what? IMHO ssh would cease to be very usefull as a security tool without a public key mechism, not to mention that existin ssh clients would not be able to securely connect to obsd-ssh servers : Jason
Re: SSH never free
On Fri, Oct 01, 1999 at 02:16:03PM -0700, Ryan Murray wrote: restrictive); see below for details. [ RSA is no longer included. ] [ IDEA is no longer included. ] IDEA was the only part of ssh that made it non-free, prohibiting commercial use. Wrong, RSA makes it non-free, and so does their license. Ben
Re: SSH never free
On 01-Oct-99 Jason Gunthorpe wrote: On 1 Oct 1999, James Troup wrote: [ RSA is no longer included. ] Wait wait, doesn't this mean that ssh RSA authentication is gone as well?? Did they replace it with DSS/DH or what? IMHO ssh would cease to be very usefull as a security tool without a public key mechism, not to mention that existin ssh clients would not be able to securely connect to obsd-ssh servers : There is rsa.c written by someone in Finland (I believe the original ssh author).
