Re: Ready for alpha 1, any volunteer to make it happen?

2013-04-25 Thread Giorgio Pioda
Hi,

What is the best prepared install medium?

The wheezy testing, wheezy nolocal, or the DVD image?

Regards

Giorgio

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 08:20:50AM +0200, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> [Giorgio Pioda]
> > Wheezy ?
> 
> Yes.  Sorry for not making it clear.
> 
> > Ok, let's work on it (by myself or my assistant)
> 
> Great.  Wolfgang and others started on the release notes on IRC last
> night.  See http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/ReleaseNotes/Wheezy >
> for the current status.
> 
> -- 
> Happy hacking
> Petter Reinholdtsen
> 
> 
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First alpha release of Debian Edu/Skolelinux based on Debian Wheezy

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen

New features for Debian Edu ~7.0.0 alpha0 released 2013-04-26
=

This is the release notes for for Debian Edu / Skolelinux ~7.0.0 edu
alpha0, based on Debian with codename "Wheezy".

About Debian Edu and Skolelinux
---

Debian Edu, also known as Skolelinux[1], is a Linux distribution based
on Debian providing an out-of-the box environment of a completely
configured school network. Immediatly after installation a school server
running all services needed for a school network is set up just waiting
for users and machines being added via GOsa², a comfortable Web-UI. A
netbooting environment is prepared using PXE, so after initial
installation of the main server from CD, DVD or USB stick all other
machines can be installed via the network.

 1) http://www.skolelinux.org/ >

This is the first test release based on Wheezy (which currently is not
released yet). Basically this is an updated and slightly improved
version compared to the Squeeze release.

Software updates

  * Everything which is new in Debian Wheezy, eg:
   + Linux kernel 3.2.x
   + Desktop environments KDE "Plasma" 4.8.4, GNOME 3.4, and LXDE 4
 (KDE is installed by default; to choose GNOME or LXDE: see
 manual.)
   + Web browser Iceweasel 10 ESR
   + LibreOffice 3.5.4
   + LTSP 5.4.2
   + GOsa 2.7.4
   + CUPS print system 1.5.3
   + Educational toolbox GCompris 12.01
   + Music creator Rosegarden 12.04
   + Image editor Gimp 2.8.2
   + Virtual universe Celestia 1.6.1
   + Virtual stargazer Stellarium 0.11.3
   + Scratch visual programming environment 1.4.0.6
   + New version of debian-installer from Debian Wheezy, see
 installation manual[2] for more details.
   + Debian Wheezy includes about 37000 packages available for
 installation.
   + More information about Debian Wheezy 7.0 is provided in the
 release notes[3] and the installation manual[4].

  2) http://www.debian.org/releases/wheezy/installmanual >
  3) http://www.debian.org/releases/wheezy/releasenotes >
  4) http://www.debian.org/releases/wheezy/installmanual >

Documentation
-

  * The (English[5]) Debian Edu Wheezy Manual is fully translated to
German, French, Italian and Danish. Partly translated versions exist
for Norwegian Bokmal and Spanish.

  5) http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Documentation/Wheezy >

LDAP related changes


  * Slight changes to some objects and acls to have more types to
choose from when adding systems in GOsa. Now systems can be of type
server, workstation, printer, terminal or netdevice.

Other changes
-
  * LTSP clients start as diskless workstation / thin client can be
configured via command line argument -- or individually adding an
entry in lts.conf or LDAP.
  * GOsa gui: Now some options that seemed to be available, but are non
functional, are greyed out (or are not clickable). Some tabs are
completely hidden to the end user, others even to the GOsa admin.

Regressions
---
  * No mass import of user account data in GOsa (ldif or csv) available
yet.

No updated artwork
--
  * Updated artwork which is visible during installation, in the login
screen and as desktop wallpaper is still missing or the same as we
had for our Squeeze based release.

Where to get it
---
To download the multiarch netinstall CD release you can use
  * ftp://ftp.skolelinux.org/skolelinux-cd/wheezy/
  * http://ftp.skolelinux.org/skolelinux-cd/wheezy/
  * rsync -avzP ftp.skolelinux.org::skolelinux-cd/wheezy/

The MD5SUM of this image is:
  * c5e773ddafdaa4f48c409c682f598b6c

The SHA1SUM of this image is:
  * 25934fabb9b7d20235499a0a51f08ce6c54215f2

How to report bugs
--

http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/HowTo/ReportBugs

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Re: Ready for alpha 1, any volunteer to make it happen?

2013-04-25 Thread Wolfgang Schweer
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 11:33:22PM +0200, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> [Wolfgang Schweer]
> > Should be done now. Anything missing still?
> 
> Looks good, but yes.  It need a short intro for those that do not know
> what Debian Edu / Skolelinux is all about.  Several of the recevers
> will never have heard about us before.  I guess we can cut-n-paste
> something from earlier announcements.  When that is in place, I
> believe it is ready to go out. :)

ok, done.

 
> I guess we also should prepare some press release to announce the
> work, to try to get some journalists interested?

Will phone Kurt about that for Germany.
 
> The new ISO is in place, and I believe it is a good one for alpha0.

me, too.

Wolfgang



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Re: Ready for alpha 1, any volunteer to make it happen?

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Wolfgang Schweer]
> Should be done now. Anything missing still?

Looks good, but yes.  It need a short intro for those that do not know
what Debian Edu / Skolelinux is all about.  Several of the recevers
will never have heard about us before.  I guess we can cut-n-paste
something from earlier announcements.  When that is in place, I
believe it is ready to go out. :)

I guess we also should prepare some press release to announce the
work, to try to get some journalists interested?

The new ISO is in place, and I believe it is a good one for alpha0.

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Re: Ready for alpha 1, any volunteer to make it happen?

2013-04-25 Thread Wolfgang Schweer
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 09:33:13PM +0200, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> I propose we put the first alpha release in 
> ftp://ftp.skolelinux.no/skolelinux-cd/wheezy/ >, and call the
> ISO debian-edu~7.0+edu0~a0-CD.iso.  Note, the ISO placed there now is
> not the final alpha0 image.  The file name and ISO label is modelled
> after the Squeeze ISO file names and ISO label.
> 
> The release notes need to be updated with download instructions and
> testing instructions.
> 
> If no-one report any problems with the current build, I want to stamp
> the next ISO build as alpha0.  It will get a new ISO label, but that
> is about it.
> 
> Wolfgang, can you wrap up the release notes and announce it when it is
> done?  http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/ReleaseNotes/Wheezy >
> look good, but please everyone check it out if there is anything
> missing?
 
Should be done now. Anything missing still?

Wolfgang



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Re: [debian-lan-devel] eduroaming on squeeze (was samba support)

2013-04-25 Thread Giorgio Pioda
I prepared also a educlient Ubuntu profile.

It is unfortunately working only with several Ubuntu version. Sure 10.04.
I don't remember if it is working well under 12.04

Cheers

Giorgio

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 06:41:06PM +0200, Julien Lambot wrote:
> Installation of latest deb from http://dati.spse.ch/~gfwp/eduroaming/ went
> without major issue (only dependencies).
> 
> I will report on tests during next week (along with Debian-edu)
> 
> Thanks for your suggestions!
> 
> Best regards
> 
> Julien
> 
> 
> On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 4:48 PM, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> 
> >
> > [Andreas B. Mundt]
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > we would like to implement something like 'roaming workstations' in
> > > debian-lan.  Can someone give us some hints on how to do that best?
> > > Is there any experience available with roaming workstations, do they
> > > work sucessfully, or are there known problems?
> >
> > I would suggest to do a test installation of Debian Edu and look how it
> > was done there, and show up on #debian-edu and ask if you fail to figure
> > out anything.
> >
> > We use sssd + libpam-mklocaluser to get the effect we want.
> >
> > --
> > Happy hacking
> > Petter Reinholdtsen
> >
> > ___
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> > debian-lan-de...@lists.alioth.debian.org
> > http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/debian-lan-devel
> >

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Re: Ready for alpha 1, any volunteer to make it happen?

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
I propose we put the first alpha release in 
ftp://ftp.skolelinux.no/skolelinux-cd/wheezy/ >, and call the
ISO debian-edu~7.0+edu0~a0-CD.iso.  Note, the ISO placed there now is
not the final alpha0 image.  The file name and ISO label is modelled
after the Squeeze ISO file names and ISO label.

The release notes need to be updated with download instructions and
testing instructions.

If no-one report any problems with the current build, I want to stamp
the next ISO build as alpha0.  It will get a new ISO label, but that
is about it.

Wolfgang, can you wrap up the release notes and announce it when it is
done?  http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/ReleaseNotes/Wheezy >
look good, but please everyone check it out if there is anything
missing?

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Re: [debian-lan-devel] eduroaming on squeeze (was samba support)

2013-04-25 Thread Julien Lambot
Installation of latest deb from http://dati.spse.ch/~gfwp/eduroaming/ went
without major issue (only dependencies).

I will report on tests during next week (along with Debian-edu)

Thanks for your suggestions!

Best regards

Julien


On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 4:48 PM, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:

>
> [Andreas B. Mundt]
> > Hi all,
> >
> > we would like to implement something like 'roaming workstations' in
> > debian-lan.  Can someone give us some hints on how to do that best?
> > Is there any experience available with roaming workstations, do they
> > work sucessfully, or are there known problems?
>
> I would suggest to do a test installation of Debian Edu and look how it
> was done there, and show up on #debian-edu and ask if you fail to figure
> out anything.
>
> We use sssd + libpam-mklocaluser to get the effect we want.
>
> --
> Happy hacking
> Petter Reinholdtsen
>
> ___
> debian-lan-devel mailing list
> debian-lan-de...@lists.alioth.debian.org
> http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/debian-lan-devel
>


Re: [debian-lan-devel] samba support

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Mike Gabriel]
> Just for clarity: do you mean Windows workstation with roaming
> profiles or do you mean the roaming workstation Debian Edu
> installation profile?

I talk about the Debian Edu roaming workstation.  I have no idea about
Windows workstation.  So windows have roaming workstations too?

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Re: [debian-lan-devel] samba support

2013-04-25 Thread Mike Gabriel

Hi Petter, Hi Andreas,

On Do 25 Apr 2013 16:48:43 CEST Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:



[Andreas B. Mundt]

Hi all,

we would like to implement something like 'roaming workstations' in
debian-lan.  Can someone give us some hints on how to do that best?
Is there any experience available with roaming workstations, do they
work sucessfully, or are there known problems?


I would suggest to do a test installation of Debian Edu and look how it
was done there, and show up on #debian-edu and ask if you fail to figure
out anything.

We use sssd + libpam-mklocaluser to get the effect we want.


Just for clarity: do you mean Windows workstation with roaming  
profiles or do you mean the roaming workstation Debian Edu  
installation profile?


The subjects alludes that you mean the first.

Greets,
Mike


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Re: [debian-lan-devel] samba support

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen

[Andreas B. Mundt]
> Hi all,
> 
> we would like to implement something like 'roaming workstations' in
> debian-lan.  Can someone give us some hints on how to do that best?
> Is there any experience available with roaming workstations, do they
> work sucessfully, or are there known problems?

I would suggest to do a test installation of Debian Edu and look how it
was done there, and show up on #debian-edu and ask if you fail to figure
out anything.

We use sssd + libpam-mklocaluser to get the effect we want.

-- 
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Petter Reinholdtsen


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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu (Was: Install scratch by default on Debian Edu Desktops in Wheezy?)

2013-04-25 Thread Marius Kotsbak

Den 25. april 2013 09:54, skrev Petter Reinholdtsen:

> >   flashplugin-nonfree

>teachers get angry when gnash doesn't work

If only there was a good free software alternative.:)



The free alternative is HTML5 in web browsers. This is going to solve 
itself as the plugin is even removed from new Android 
installations/upgrades/devices, and the web site owners probably soon 
stop using flash (or export to HTML/JS if it is possible) so that the 
majority of their users are also able to see the content.


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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Nigel Barker]
> All of the scim packages can go. This is what I have (ibus-anthy
> brings them all in):

Thank you.  Done.  Will be in alpha1.

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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu

2013-04-25 Thread nigel barker
On 25 April 2013 18:09, Petter Reinholdtsen  wrote:

>
> Right.  Please have a look at
>  http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/debian-edu/branches/wheezy/debian-edu/tasks/lang-ja-desktop?view=markup
>  >
> and let us know if other plackages should be replaced too.


All of the scim packages can go. This is what I have (ibus-anthy
brings them all in):

anthy
anthy-common
ibus-anthy
libanthy0:i386

thanks
nigel


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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Nigel Barker]
> I don't have konqueror, because I'm using lxde. Will lxde be an option
> in debian edu wheezy?

I believe lxde already was an option in Squeezy.  But a little tested
one, so I do not know if it is or was working.  I believe the task
file was using the packages you recommended.  Just install with
desktop=lxde.  Those caring for lxde need to test and fix the problems
remaining. 

Please test and let us know if it do not work. :)

>> Will this replace or complement the scim-anthy package already in
>> the lang-ja-desktop task?
>>
> 
> replace.

Right.  Please have a look at
http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/debian-edu/branches/wheezy/debian-edu/tasks/lang-ja-desktop?view=markup
 >
and let us know if other plackages should be replaced too.

> Liberation is installed by default I think. However this packages
> has more fonts, even the dreaded comic sans. When people bring their
> ppt or even odp made at home, there is a better chance of it looking
> ok.  Personally I don't like non-free either, but I have to keep
> people happy, and that's what these packages are for. But anyway,
> they are just an aptitude away. I certainly don't want anyone to
> think I am pushing these packages in any way. Rather I just wondered
> if you were interested to see what else I install apart from
> scratch.

It was very welcome, and already triggered improvement that should
make it to alpha1. :)

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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu (Was: Install scratch by default on Debian Edu Desktops in Wheezy?)

2013-04-25 Thread nigel barker
On 25 April 2013 16:54, Petter Reinholdtsen  wrote:

> I see the advantages, but worry that Konqueror, Iceweasel and Chromium
> are too many browsers to include.

I don't have konqueror, because I'm using lxde. Will lxde be an option
in debian edu wheezy?

>
>> >   ibus-anthy
>> type Japanese
>
> Will this replace or complement the scim-anthy package already in the
> lang-ja-desktop task?
>

replace.


> Also non-free.  :( We include the free font ttf-liberation instead.
> Why isn't this an option for you?  See
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberation_fonts > for details.

Liberation is installed by default I think. However this packages has
more fonts, even the dreaded comic sans. When people bring their ppt
or even odp made at home, there is a better chance of it looking ok.
Personally I don't like non-free either, but I have to keep people
happy, and that's what these packages are for. But anyway, they are
just an aptitude away. I certainly don't want anyone to think I am
pushing these packages in any way. Rather I just wondered if you were
interested to see what else I install apart from scratch.

thanks
nigel


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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu

2013-04-25 Thread Holger Levsen
Hi Petter,

On Donnerstag, 25. April 2013, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> I am not against installing chromium as such, but I fear the cognitive
> strain we continue to increase on the pupils and teachers. 

I do follow the cognitive strain argument, except for when its not valid ;-)

Users are usually very well aware of chrome and firefox, so having these 
choices is a relief for most of them, except when they expect chromium and 
icewease and get the other. (Or was it the other way round? :)

It's really common nowadays to *use* different webbrowsers.

> > having chromium (or foo or bar or baz) is a direct benefit.
> It will also be a direct disadvantage, if we just make it harder for
> people to figure out what programs to use.

I see this problem for a many other applications we ship, but not for every-
day used webbrowsers.
 
> I believe the advantage of dropping the multi-arch netinst CD is
> non-existing,
[...]
> But I believe dropping the multi-arch DVDs is a good idea as it will
> allow us to make them feature complete and equivalent to the netinst
> CD installs.

if this gives us one set of similarily behaving installation media, I think 
thats better. So the DVD images would be large netinst images?


cheers,
Holger




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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Holger Levsen]
> Hi,
> 
> On Donnerstag, 25. April 2013, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> > I see the advantages, but worry that Konqueror, Iceweasel and Chromium
> > are too many browsers to include.
> 
> we should install+include chromium.

I am not against installing chromium as such, but I fear the cognitive
strain we continue to increase on the pupils and teachers.  Every time
we add a new package and especially when we add yet another package
doing almost the same as another instaleld package, we make it harder
for our users.  Your argumentation seem to ignore these issues, so I
am a bit unsure if you believe more options are only good, or if you
also believe they are problematic.

> we should drop this idea of having a combined amd64+i386install
> medium, it bites us all the time and the benefit is small, at best.

Well, it also make sure we think hard about increasing the number of
options and thus the cognitive strain of our users.  This is for me a
very good thing. :)

> having chromium (or foo or bar or baz) is a direct benefit.

It will also be a direct disadvantage, if we just make it harder for
people to figure out what programs to use.

> my proposal:
> - i386 only netinst CD
> - amd64 only netinst CD
> - i386 only DVD
> - amd64 only DVD
> - i386+amd64 netinst like medium, not bound by CD size constrainst (aka 2gb 
> usbstick image)

I believe the advantage of dropping the multi-arch netinst CD is
non-existing, as the only problem we have is that we choose to install
etckeeper a bit early.  If we accept to install it after the kernel
instead of before, we have no problem with the netinst CD.  Also, if
we choose to create 700 MiB CD instead of 650 MiB CD, there is no
problem at all.  Why are we not using 700 MiB now?  I believe we did
so earlier.  So, I oppose splitting the netinst CD into single-arch
CDs.

But I believe dropping the multi-arch DVDs is a good idea as it will
allow us to make them feature complete and equivalent to the netinst
CD installs.

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Re: More new packages for Debian Edu (Was: Install scratch by default on Debian Edu Desktops in Wheezy?)

2013-04-25 Thread Holger Levsen
Hi,

On Donnerstag, 25. April 2013, Petter Reinholdtsen wrote:
> I see the advantages, but worry that Konqueror, Iceweasel and Chromium
> are too many browsers to include.

we should install+include chromium.

we should drop this idea of having a combined amd64+i386install medium, it 
bites us all the time and the benefit is small, at best.

having chromium (or foo or bar or baz) is a direct benefit.

plus all the time we waste trying to make things fit.

my proposal:
- i386 only netinst CD
- amd64 only netinst CD
- i386 only DVD
- amd64 only DVD
- i386+amd64 netinst like medium, not bound by CD size constrainst (aka 2gb 
usbstick image)

This way chromium will nicely fit.


cheers,
Holger


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More new packages for Debian Edu (Was: Install scratch by default on Debian Edu Desktops in Wheezy?)

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Nigel Barker]
>>   bluefish
> teaching html and css in middle and high school

Right.  We should at least put it on our watch list (aka Ignore or
Suggests in our tasks).  Added as recommends to the development task.
The development task is not currently installed by default.

> >   chromium
> a)sometimes iceweasel doesn't work, esp on interactive sites like codecademy
> b) little kids don't know how to fix "iceweasel already running"

I see the advantages, but worry that Konqueror, Iceweasel and Chromium
are too many browsers to include.

> >   drpython
> teaching python in middle and high school. Its simple, checks syntax
> and has a run button! (I'm currently evaluating geany as a
> replacement, because kids struggle to get dr python working at home)
> >   gvrng
> for its ready-made set of lessons for beginning programmers
> >   python-easygui
> beginning python is more fun that way

These should probably go into the development task?  Added as
recommendations.

> >   escputil
> many teachers have an epson printer covered by this util

Not sure how useful this is to add to the default installation.  Added
as a ignore in the printer driver section of the common task to put it
on our radar.

> >   flashplugin-nonfree
> teachers get angry when gnash doesn't work

If only there was a good free software alternative. :)

> >   freemind
> mind maps for older kids. vym has issues if you try to use maps on
> different versions, and doesn't work at home.

Added to the misc task.

> >   ibus-anthy
> type Japanese

Will this replace or complement the scim-anthy package already in the
lang-ja-desktop task?

> >   icedtea-plugin
> java applets

Already included by default.

> >   kdegraphics
> For kolourpaint, which I failed to be able to install by itself

Already installed by default, I believe.

> >   scratch
> already mentioned enough on this thread!

Already added based on this thread.

> >   ttf-larabie-deco
> for fun

Well, why not.  Added to desktop-other as a recommends.

> >   ttf-mscorefonts-installer
> for compatibility

Also non-free.  :( We include the free font ttf-liberation instead.
Why isn't this an option for you?  See
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberation_fonts > for details.

> >   vlc
> plays many media types and converts between them

Already installed by default.

> I don't want to contribute to bloat, but you can see above why I use
> them and consider if others would also, perhaps?

Thank you very much.

> I am also interested in hearing what others say. Such as, "we use X
> for that purpose, because it does Y"

Yes, I would love to hear from others too. :)

-- 
Happy hacking
Petter Reinholdtsen


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Re: ext3 vs ext4

2013-04-25 Thread Petter Reinholdtsen
[Giorgio Pioda]
> Hi,
> 
> is there any special reason to still use ext3 instead of the
> standard (for wheezy) ext4 in the automatic partitioning of the
> Tjener?

No.

It is done because we still use the old recipes initially created for
Lenny.  Please provide a patch for debian-edu-install to change
this. :)

Anyone brave enough to try btrfs instead?  I doubt it is a good choice
for wheezy, but perhaps for later... :) I guess we could drop the LVM
stuff too if we go that way.

-- 
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Petter Reinholdtsen


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ext3 vs ext4

2013-04-25 Thread Giorgio Pioda
Hi,

is there any special reason to still use ext3 instead of 
the standard (for wheezy) ext4 in the automatic
partitioning of the Tjener?

Regards

Giorgio
-- 
Giorgio Pioda - Sysadmin SPSE-Tenero
Cell +41 79 629 20 63
Uff. +41 91 735 62 48


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