Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
I just got Xorg 7.0 by an dist upgrade. My Raptor GFX was not working with xorg 7.0 after the upgrade (blank screen after start of X and no recover of frambuffer console after termination). However there were no big problems with Xorg 6.9. It seems that the glint driver is broken in current testing. As from the logfile the broken driver does not recognize the right size of video ram: 4048 instead of 8192 My solution so far: xorg 7.0 will work together with the 6.9 version of the glint driver. I only copied the old version above the new one. Another problem I found with xorg 7.0: The symlink /etc/X11/app-defaults -> /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/app-defaults is gone. This causes problems with old programs which look there for files. Does anyone have the same problems with the glint driver, or maybe a working setup with xorg 7.0? -- Christian -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Wed, 21 Jun 2006 18:42:46 +0200, Ludovic Courtès <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I think we have >> verified that the file has the correct md5sum before, so it's not >> corrupt... > > Actually, it _looks_ corrupt after X crashed. But upon reboot + fsck (+ > additional reboot if `fsck' feels like it), the file is correct. I have just finish reinstalling my U5 after an X crash that erased my parition table. Be carefull, looks like there's a big BUG in the xorg. -- - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, Today, 10 hours, 34 minutes, 9 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > So it looks like it just opens the module file (descriptor 8) and reads > the first 256 bytes of it. I have no clue why read could block on a normal > file like that. It's not that `read ()' blocks but rather that `strace' fails to read the memory region pointed to by the second argument to `read ()' (e.g., its `ptrace ()' call never returned). > Do you have some weird filesystem? No, ext3. > I think we have > verified that the file has the correct md5sum before, so it's not > corrupt... Actually, it _looks_ corrupt after X crashed. But upon reboot + fsck (+ additional reboot if `fsck' feels like it), the file is correct. > Can you Stop-A at this point to get to the prom? If you can, > the ctrace command might give you stack trace which can be useful in > debugging it. Unfortunately I can't because (i) at that point the screen is off ;-) and (ii) I don't have any null-modem cable to get the console output via the serial line. Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Wednesday 21 June 2006 05:24, Frans Pop wrote: > On Wednesday 21 June 2006 04:47, Steve Pacenka wrote: > > I accepted the defaults presented by xserver-xorg's bare metal setup, > > which for "$ARCH" = "sparc" is XkbRules = "sun" and XkbModel = "type5". > > As posted before on this list, this is bug #368214. > > >if kernel <= 2.4 > > case architecture > > sparc) Xkbrules = sun > > someotherarchitecture) XkbRules = otherarcpopularkeyboard > > *) Xkbrules = xorg > > esac > >else > > Xkbrules = xorg > >fi > > Would you be willing to try to code that properly in the relevant script > and to file it as a suggested patch to that bug report? Frans and friends, I will code something in valid syntax that expressess the above concept, and generate a diff against a particular .deb version's content. The construct KERNELVERSION=`uname -r|cut -d. -f1-2` provides the first two parts of the running kernel version. Is there a better way to do that in a package installation script? Such a patch can go in with a bug against xserver-xorg (wishlist level?); I don't think it will be tested by current XSF packagers. > Another, possibly simpler but sparc-specific, solution would be: >if architecture is sparc > if kernel <= 2.4 > default XkbRules = sun > else > default XkbRules = xorg > fi >else > default XkbRules = xorg >fi That should be okay for Sparc. I tried to leave a hook and hint where future updaters could cover other arches than Sparc that still use kernels 2.4. -- SP -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
(no need to CC me; I read the list) On Wednesday 21 June 2006 16:22, you wrote: > I will code something in valid syntax that expressess the above > concept, and generate a diff against a particular .deb version's > content. Cool! > Such a patch can go in with a bug against xserver-xorg (wishlist > level?); I don't think it will be tested by current XSF packagers. Please just send the patch to the existing bug report that I mentioned. No need to create a new one. I'd suggest a mail with the following content. This will make sure that the fact a patch is available is registered in the BTS. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Bug#368214: Wrong keyboard configured for Sparc with 2.6 kernels Body: tags 368214 + patch thanks > That should be okay for Sparc. I tried to leave a hook and hint where > future updaters could cover other arches than Sparc that still use > kernels 2.4. Yes, I understood that. I'm just unsure how many other arches have the same problem. And even then, it may be "cleaner" to do it on a per arch basis as then the exceptions are probably easier to remove later. Just make sure that you add the code to determine kernel version in a place where it is available for all arches. Cheers, FJP pgprUMCRUNhUH.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Wednesday 21 June 2006 04:47, Steve Pacenka wrote: > I accepted the defaults presented by xserver-xorg's bare metal setup, > which for "$ARCH" = "sparc" is XkbRules = "sun" and XkbModel = "type5". As posted before on this list, this is bug #368214. >if kernel <= 2.4 > case architecture > sparc) Xkbrules = sun > someotherarchitecture) XkbRules = otherarcpopularkeyboard > *) Xkbrules = xorg > esac >else > Xkbrules = xorg >fi Would you be willing to try to code that properly in the relevant script and to file it as a suggested patch to that bug report? Another, possibly simpler but sparc-specific, solution would be: if architecture is sparc if kernel <= 2.4 default XkbRules = sun else default XkbRules = xorg fi else default XkbRules = xorg fi pgpIX72QwtGJM.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
> "JS" == Jurij Smakov writes:
Hi Jurij,
>> write(0, "(II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modul"..., 45) = 45
>> open("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", O_RDONLY) = 8
>> read(8,
>>
>> (The last line is verbatim: X and `strace' hang right at this point.)
> That looks bad. It hangs in the kernel. The corresponding piece
> from my log looks like that:
It is worse than that(*). Not only does the X server crash, the
module file gets busted too, and I mean it gets corrupted on the
disk, the file system appears to get along well, though (at least a
full e2fsck does not barf). In my case that is usually `libramdac.so'
that gets swept away, but I have seen `libxaa.so' get corrupted as
well. The eye examination (after `file' and `nm') also confirms that
the shared modules turn into a pile of crap.
Oleg
(*) `uname -r' reports `2.6.17-rc3-sparc64', and the Xorg version is
7.0.22, any extra information available on demand.
> So it looks like it just opens the module file (descriptor 8) and
> reads the first 256 bytes of it. I have no clue why read could
> block on a normal file like that. Do you have some weird
> filesystem? I think we have verified that the file has the
> correct md5sum before, so it's not corrupt... Can you Stop-A at
> this point to get to the prom? If you can, the ctrace command
> might give you stack trace which can be useful in debugging it.
> Best regards,
> Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC
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Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Mon, 19 Jun 2006, Ludovic Courtès wrote:
write(0, "(II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modul"..., 45) = 45
open("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", O_RDONLY) = 8
read(8,
(The last line is verbatim: X and `strace' hang right at this point.)
That looks bad. It hangs in the kernel. The corresponding piece from my
log looks like that:
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=364811, ...}
) = 0
write(0, "(II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modul"..., 45) = 45
open("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", O_RDONLY) = 8
read(8, "\177ELF\1\2\1\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\3\0\2\0\0\0\1\0\0d\274"...,
256) = 256
lseek(8, 0, SEEK_SET) = 0
open("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", O_RDONLY) = 9
read(9, "\177ELF\1\2\1\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\3\0\2\0\0\0\1\0\0d\274"...,
512) = 512
fstat64(9, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644, st_size=364811, ...}) = 0
mmap(NULL, 335632, PROT_READ|PROT_EXEC, MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_DENYWRITE, 9, 0) =
0xf5ba8000
mmap(0xf5bf8000, 8192, PROT_READ|PROT_WRITE|PROT_EXEC,
MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_FIXED|MAP_DENY
WRITE, 9, 0x5) = 0xf5bf8000
close(9)= 0
close(8)= 0
So it looks like it just opens the module file (descriptor 8) and reads
the first 256 bytes of it. I have no clue why read could block on a normal
file like that. Do you have some weird filesystem? I think we have
verified that the file has the correct md5sum before, so it's not
corrupt... Can you Stop-A at this point to get to the prom? If you can,
the ctrace command might give you stack trace which can be useful in
debugging it.
Best regards,
Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tuesday 20 June 2006 10:42, Martin Marques wrote: > On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Jurij Smakov wrote: > > Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the > > latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during > > installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs > > solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!). > > Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions > > of installed packages: > > > > xorg7.0.22 > > xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8 > > xserver-xorg-video-ati 6.5.8.0-1 > > > > The actual xorg.conf used and the log of the server starting up are > > available at > > > > http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.conf-ultra5-ati > > http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.log-ultra5-ati > > OK, I'm having some trouble with Xorg. I followed the procedure, installed > the exact versions mentioned above, and X doesn't start. Martín, My fresh Ultra 5 config and log, for working video, keyboard, and mouse are at http://wri.cfe.cornell.edu/sparc/u5-xorg7-xorg.conf http://wri.cfe.cornell.edu/sparc/u5-xorg7-Xorg.0.log What are the diffs between your and my xorg.conf? > Now, first of all I found that there is no x_accel module, so I added the > line Option "no_accel" "true". That remove this error: > > (WW) INVALID IO ALLOCATION b: 0x2c00400 e: 0x2c004ff correcting^G > (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so is an unrecognized module type > (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "xaa" (unknown module type, 6) I get the WW warning. libxaa.so loads for me. > But after that I got this error: > > (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libshadowfb.so is an unrecognized module type > (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "shadowfb" (unknown module type, 6) I get "cannot shadow an accelerated frame buffer". Both of the failing modules are part of the xserver-xorg-core package. Perhaps that package did not unpack properly or there is some disk corruption. (I've had some corruption on an IDE drive in an Ultra 10.) Did you try reinstalling that package via apt-get --reinstall install xserver-xorg-core > The problem is that I can't set the frambuffer to off. My Console works > with frame buffer, and I have been unlucky setting FB off in silo.conf: > > image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.17-rc3-sparc64 > label=linux2.6.17 > root=/dev/hda1 > initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.6.17-rc3-sparc64 > append="video=sbusfb:off" > read-only Why does the framebuffer need to be turned off? atyfb is the kernel driver for the framebuffer in an Ultra 5. > > The full output from X is: Your /var/log/Xorg.0.log would be much more informative. Email it to me if you don't want to post it due to length. -- SP
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tuesday 20 June 2006 11:30, Stuart Brady wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 19, 2006 at 11:02:56PM -0400, Steve Pacenka wrote:
> > After installing xserver.xorg, the generated xorg.conf file was good for
> > ATI video. It needed a keyboard touchup to use the correct map
> > ("sun(type5)" instead of "sun") and I don't yet have Ctrl-Alt-Fn key
> > switching among vts. It assumed a low performance monitor.
>
> That's odd. I'm using pc105, and it works. The input layer in
> Linux 2.6 convert to the PC scancodes now. Are you sure xorg isn't just
> using default rules?
I accepted the defaults presented by xserver-xorg's bare metal setup, which
for "$ARCH" = "sparc" is XkbRules = "sun" and XkbModel = "type5".
I'm incorrect about using XkbRules = "sun(type5)". That may be correct for
kernel 2.4 but it is wrong for 2.6. The correct values when using a type 5
keyboard and kernel 2.6 are XkbRules = "xorg" and XkbModel = "pc105".
Welcome back Ctrl-Alt-Fn. (These same values worked with 6.9, so upgraders
may not be affected by the suboptimal Debian config script in xserver-org.)
The problem is that xserver-xorg's Debian config script sets poor default
keyboard rules for Sparc kernel 2.6. It uses (excuse pidgin shell)
if architecture is sparc
default XkbRules = sun
else
default XkbRules = xorg
fi
It could improve its defaults for Sparc and for non-Sparc 2.4 kernel users by
if kernel <= 2.4
case architecture
sparc) Xkbrules = sun
someotherarchitecture) XkbRules = otherarcpopularkeyboard
*) Xkbrules = xorg
esac
else
Xkbrules = xorg
fi
-- thanks, SP
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Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Jurij Smakov wrote: Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!). Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions of installed packages: xorg7.0.22 xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8 xserver-xorg-video-ati 6.5.8.0-1 The actual xorg.conf used and the log of the server starting up are available at http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.conf-ultra5-ati http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.log-ultra5-ati OK, I'm having some trouble with Xorg. I followed the procedure, installed the exact versions mentioned above, and X doesn't start. Now, first of all I found that there is no x_accel module, so I added the line Option "no_accel" "true". That remove this error: (WW) INVALID IO ALLOCATION b: 0x2c00400 e: 0x2c004ff correcting^G (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so is an unrecognized module type (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "xaa" (unknown module type, 6) But after that I got this error: (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libshadowfb.so is an unrecognized module type (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "shadowfb" (unknown module type, 6) The problem is that I can't set the frambuffer to off. My Console works with frame buffer, and I have been unlucky setting FB off in silo.conf: image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.17-rc3-sparc64 label=linux2.6.17 root=/dev/hda1 initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.6.17-rc3-sparc64 append="video=sbusfb:off" read-only The full output from X is: X Window System Version 7.0.0 Release Date: 21 December 2005 X Protocol Version 11, Revision 0, Release 7.0 Build Operating System:Linux 2.6.17-rc1 sparc Current Operating System: Linux bugs 2.6.17-rc3-sparc64 #2 Mon May 22 11:15:31 UTC 2006 sparc64 Build Date: 16 March 2006 Before reporting problems, check http://wiki.x.org to make sure that you have the latest version. Module Loader present Markers: (--) probed, (**) from config file, (==) default setting, (++) from command line, (!!) notice, (II) informational, (WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown. (==) Log file: "/var/log/Xorg.0.log", Time: Tue Jun 20 11:08:06 2006 (==) Using config file: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf" (EE) end of block range 0xcb < begin 0x2c8 (EE) end of block range 0xc0001b < begin 0x2c00018 (EE) end of block range 0xcb < begin 0x2c8 (EE) end of block range 0xc0001b < begin 0x2c00018 (WW) INVALID IO ALLOCATION b: 0x2c00400 e: 0x2c004ff correcting^G (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libshadowfb.so is an unrecognized module type (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "shadowfb" (unknown module type, 6) (EE) Screen(s) found, but none have a usable configuration. Fatal server error: no screens found -- 21:50:04 up 2 days, 9:07, 0 users, load average: 0.92, 0.37, 0.18 - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador -
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Mon, Jun 19, 2006 at 11:02:56PM -0400, Steve Pacenka wrote:
> After installing xserver.xorg, the generated xorg.conf file was good for ATI
> video. It needed a keyboard touchup to use the correct map ("sun(type5)"
> instead of "sun") and I don't yet have Ctrl-Alt-Fn key switching among vts.
> It assumed a low performance monitor.
That's odd. I'm using pc105, and it works. The input layer in
Linux 2.6 convert to the PC scancodes now. Are you sure xorg isn't just
using default rules?
--
Stuart Brady
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Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tuesday 20 June 2006 12:13, Martin Marques wrote: > Wasn't it that SPARC32 wasn't going to have any more support in new > Debian etch? I didn't follow the thread to the end, but I remember the > discussion. That would probably be the case if the 2.6 kernel would not have had support for sparc32. As the 2.6 kernel _does_ support sparc32, there's no reason to drop it. Now we only have to try to get the remaining issues fixed... pgpktWqWKgROW.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Sun, 18 Jun 2006, Steve Pacenka wrote: On Saturday 17 June 2006 18:37, Martin Marques wrote: On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 22:56:46 +0200, Frans Pop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: There is also: Bug#368214: Wrong keyboard configured for Sparc with 2.6 kernels And of course the recent: Bug#373821: Unavailable xserver-xorg-video-sun* necessary for many Sparc Which SPARC need these packages? Any Sparc32 (sunbw2, suntcx, suncg14, suncg3, suncg6) except Javastation, Sparc64 with Creator or Elite framebuffers (sunffb). Wasn't it that SPARC32 wasn't going to have any more support in new Debian etch? I didn't follow the thread to the end, but I remember the discussion. -- 21:50:04 up 2 days, 9:07, 0 users, load average: 0.92, 0.37, 0.18 - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador -
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tuesday 20 June 2006 05:02, Steve Pacenka wrote:
> It needed a keyboard touchup to use the correct map
> ("sun(type5)" instead of "sun")
This is #368214.
> and I don't yet have Ctrl-Alt-Fn key switching among vts.
Hmm.
pgpJ3svs8jo4i.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Saturday 17 June 2006 16:46, Jurij Smakov wrote:
> Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the
> latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during
> installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs
> solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!).
> Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions
> of installed packages:
>
> xorg 7.0.22
> xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8
> xserver-xorg-video-ati6.5.8.0-1
I just finished a fresh U5 (w/4M VRAM) install of Etch; kernel 2.6.15-1. The
ati Xorg 7.0 driver works without incident at 1024x768 in 24 bits.
After installing xserver.xorg, the generated xorg.conf file was good for ATI
video. It needed a keyboard touchup to use the correct map ("sun(type5)"
instead of "sun") and I don't yet have Ctrl-Alt-Fn key switching among vts.
It assumed a low performance monitor.
This is pretty good for a generated x*.conf file under Sparc, so I'd call this
a success.
The three packages cited above all have the same versions in my installation.
Promising!
-- SP
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Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> you write: >FWIW there are 2 variants of Ultra5 video. >Early models only had enough video RAM for 8 bit video, later ones were >24 bit capable. All are 24-bit capable, it's just 1 meg vs 4 megs video ram. While solaris dosn't support it, 16-bit works fine in linux. I use 16-bit on my ultra-5 (parts from two systems: older motherboard, 333mhz cpu) Ultra-10 uses the same motherboard, therefore has the same onboard video. The UPA slot is blocked on the ultra-5, so only the ultra-10 can support the creator graphics. -- Blars Blarson [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.blars.org/blars.html With Microsoft, failure is not an option. It is a standard feature. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi,
One day, 4 hours, 17 minutes, 33 seconds ago,
Ludovic Courtès wrote:
> Also, is the ATI driver known to work on other platforms?
I sucessfully installed and used Xorg 7.0 with an ATI driver (from
Debian GNU/Linux) on a PPC today.
Besides, in case it can make sense to someone, here are the last
visible system calls from X:
write(0, "(II) LoadModule: \"xaa\"", 22) = 22
write(0, "\n", 1) = 1
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/", {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0755, st_size=4096,
...}) = 0
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/libxaa.so", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No
such file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/xaa_drv.so", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No
such file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/xaa.so", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No such
file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/libxaa.a", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No
such file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/xaa_drv.a", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No
such file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/xaa.a", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No such
file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/libxaa.o", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No
such file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/xaa_drv.o", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No
such file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/linux/xaa.o", 0xffe07760) = -1 ENOENT (No such
file or directory)
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/", {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0755, st_size=4096, ...}) = 0
stat64("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=364811, ...}) = 0
write(0, "(II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modul"..., 45) = 45
open("/usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so", O_RDONLY) = 8
read(8,
(The last line is verbatim: X and `strace' hang right at this point.)
If someone could post an `strace' log of a (working) Xorg 6.9, that
might be helpful.
Thanks,
Ludovic.
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Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, Yesterday, 21 hours, 58 minutes, 15 seconds ago, Chris Newport wrote: > FWIW there are 2 variants of Ultra5 video. > Early models only had enough video RAM for 8 bit video, later ones were > 24 bit capable. [...] > AFAIK all 270MHz models are 8 bit, but I am not sure about when the > change happened. My U5 (which has a 400 MHz UltraSPARC IIi) is 24-bit capable. I used to have a 1024x768x16 setting with Xorg 6.9. Here is the output of `lspci': 01:02.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc 3D Rage Pro 215GP (rev 5c) (prog-if 00 [VGA]) Flags: bus master, stepping, medium devsel, latency 64, IRQ 7409760 Memory at 1ffe100 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=16M] I/O ports at 1fe02c00400 [size=256] Memory at 1ffe200 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=4K] Expansion ROM at 1ffe002 [disabled] [size=128K] Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: sparc etch status (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 22:24:42 -0700 (PDT), Jurij Smakov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Martin Marques wrote: > >> Talking of that... is Debian/SPARC gonna make it to etch? I can't run >> KDE apps without having a hang once in a while (especially kmail (which >> I don't use anymore) and konqueror). swf is also boken in the latest >> testing. rapidsvn can't do diffs, but this could be a general problem >> inglobbing all platforms, and not something particular to SPARC. > > It would be great if you could investigate what causes these problems and > file bugs, if they are not already filed. Extra points if you can fix > them, if it's sparc-specific, in 90% of cases it's some kind of unaligned > access issue. I did file a bug report on the KDE issue (about 6 months ago). -- - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Ludovic Courtès wrote: The patch in question fixes problems encountered for applications using `mremap ()'. In the case of X, it may be a lower-level, specific problem (I'd have said DMA or some such, but I am not familiar at all with how X interacts with the kernel and video RAM). FWIW there are 2 variants of Ultra5 video. Early models only had enough video RAM for 8 bit video, later ones were 24 bit capable. Making the wrong assumptions in a driver could cause problems, is this bug reproducible on both variants ?. AFAIK all 270MHz models are 8 bit, but I am not sure about when the change happened. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, Today, 3 hours, 37 minutes, 28 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > The only thing I can suggest is to try building a kernel with a recent > patch (attached, should be included in .17), which fixes some rarely > occuring memory corruptions, sometimes resulting in busted dpkg databases. I did that some time ago, and was very hopeful ;-), but it didn't make any difference [0]. The patch in question fixes problems encountered for applications using `mremap ()'. In the case of X, it may be a lower-level, specific problem (I'd have said DMA or some such, but I am not familiar at all with how X interacts with the kernel and video RAM). Thanks, Ludovic. [0] http://www.spinics.net/lists/sparclinux/msg00193.html -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi,
On Sun, 18 Jun 2006, Ludovic Court�s wrote:
Just to reconfirm: It fails reproduceably with your `xorg.conf' here.
The symptoms are the same as reported before, notably the apparent file
system breakage after X failed and exited.
Maybe some kernel/XSF folks could share with us their opinion on this?
This would be nice since I have no idea how to proceed to provide more
useful reports now.
The only thing I can suggest is to try building a kernel with a recent
patch (attached, should be included in .17), which fixes some rarely
occuring memory corruptions, sometimes resulting in busted dpkg databases.
Since you are experiencing some file corruptions as well, it might be the
same issue. Please let me know if it helps.
Also, is the ATI driver known to work on other platforms?
No clue.
Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CCFrom [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Jun 1 21:51:14 2006
Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 17:52:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], sparclinux@vger.kernel.org
Subject: [PATCH]: Fix D-cache corruption in mremap() (was Re: 2.6.17-rc3+git
seems to corrupt dpkg databases)
Thanks to some excellent corrupted status and available files
Daniel sent to me, I was able to track down the bug. This
bug has been around basically forever, just minor data layout
changes due to arbitrary unrelated kernel and userland library
modifications make the bug go away for some time and then
reappear. It was always there.
Anyways, give this patch below a test, it should fix things.
It is against the current 2.6.17 tree.
I'll also post a little reproducer program that can be used to
accurately see if the patch really fixes the problem on your
machine or not, which should help with the variability of the
dpkg corruption case.
Please test this, I need to know if this works for everyone
or not.
Thanks.
diff-tree 0b0968a3e691771bf87e1ce747b2c7d23b5526c8 (from
951bc82c53f30ec6b4c2d04a051e74ea9a89b669)
Author: David S. Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu Jun 1 17:47:25 2006 -0700
[SPARC64]: Fix D-cache corruption in mremap
If we move a mapping from one virtual address to another,
and this changes the virtual color of the mapping to those
pages, we can see corrupt data due to D-cache aliasing.
Check for and deal with this by overriding the move_pte()
macro. Set things up so that other platforms can cleanly
override the move_pte() macro too.
Signed-off-by: David S. Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
diff --git a/include/asm-generic/pgtable.h b/include/asm-generic/pgtable.h
index 358e4d3..c2059a3 100644
--- a/include/asm-generic/pgtable.h
+++ b/include/asm-generic/pgtable.h
@@ -159,17 +159,8 @@ static inline void ptep_set_wrprotect(st
#define lazy_mmu_prot_update(pte) do { } while (0)
#endif
-#ifndef __HAVE_ARCH_MULTIPLE_ZERO_PAGE
+#ifndef __HAVE_ARCH_MOVE_PTE
#define move_pte(pte, prot, old_addr, new_addr)(pte)
-#else
-#define move_pte(pte, prot, old_addr, new_addr)
\
-({ \
- pte_t newpte = (pte); \
- if (pte_present(pte) && pfn_valid(pte_pfn(pte)) && \
- pte_page(pte) == ZERO_PAGE(old_addr)) \
- newpte = mk_pte(ZERO_PAGE(new_addr), (prot)); \
- newpte; \
-})
#endif
/*
diff --git a/include/asm-mips/pgtable.h b/include/asm-mips/pgtable.h
index 702a28f..69cebbd 100644
--- a/include/asm-mips/pgtable.h
+++ b/include/asm-mips/pgtable.h
@@ -70,7 +70,15 @@ extern unsigned long zero_page_mask;
#define ZERO_PAGE(vaddr) \
(virt_to_page(empty_zero_page + (((unsigned long)(vaddr)) &
zero_page_mask)))
-#define __HAVE_ARCH_MULTIPLE_ZERO_PAGE
+#define __HAVE_ARCH_MOVE_PTE
+#define move_pte(pte, prot, old_addr, new_addr)
\
+({ \
+ pte_t newpte = (pte); \
+ if (pte_present(pte) && pfn_valid(pte_pfn(pte)) && \
+ pte_page(pte) == ZERO_PAGE(old_addr)) \
+ newpte = mk_pte(ZERO_PAGE(new_addr), (prot)); \
+ newpte; \
+})
extern void paging_init(void);
diff --git a/include/asm-sparc64/pgtable.h b/include/asm-sparc64/pgtable.h
index c44e746..cd464f4 100644
--- a/include/asm-sparc64/pgtable.h
+++ b/include/asm-sparc64/pgtable.h
@@ -689,6 +689,23 @@ static inline void set_pte_at(struct mm_
#define pte_clear(mm,addr,ptep)\
set_pte_at((mm), (addr), (ptep), __pte(0UL))
+#ifdef DCACHE_ALIASING_POSSIBLE
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, Yesterday, 19 hours, 31 minutes, 37 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the > latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during > installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs > solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!). > Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions > of installed packages: > > xorg 7.0.22 > xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8 > xserver-xorg-video-ati6.5.8.0-1 > > The actual xorg.conf used and the log of the server starting up are > available at > > http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.conf-ultra5-ati > http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.log-ultra5-ati Just to reconfirm: It fails reproduceably with your `xorg.conf' here. The symptoms are the same as reported before, notably the apparent file system breakage after X failed and exited. Maybe some kernel/XSF folks could share with us their opinion on this? This would be nice since I have no idea how to proceed to provide more useful reports now. Also, is the ATI driver known to work on other platforms? Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: sparc etch status (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
On Sun, 18 Jun 2006, Hendrik Sattler wrote: Am Sonntag, 18. Juni 2006 07:24 schrieb Jurij Smakov: everything pretty much depends on whether 2.6.17 kernel comes out before it's too late (and makes it into etch). out now, time to ask the debian kernel team to go for it. HS It is scheduled for upload to unstable tomorrow :-). Time to do some test builds! Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: sparc etch status (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
Am Sonntag, 18. Juni 2006 07:24 schrieb Jurij Smakov: > everything pretty much depends on whether 2.6.17 kernel comes out before > it's too late (and makes it into etch). out now, time to ask the debian kernel team to go for it. HS -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: sparc etch status (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
On Sun, 18 Jun 2006, Clint Adams wrote: Regarding the chances of sparc getting into etch, I would say that everything pretty much depends on whether 2.6.17 kernel comes out before it's too late (and makes it into etch). According to buildd admins, sparc Or the necessary fixes are backported into 2.6.16. The neccessary fixes for the SMP crash problem where never identified, to the best of my knowledge. Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: sparc etch status (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
> Regarding the chances of sparc getting into etch, I would say that > everything pretty much depends on whether 2.6.17 kernel comes out before > it's too late (and makes it into etch). According to buildd admins, sparc Or the necessary fixes are backported into 2.6.16. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Saturday 17 June 2006 18:37, Martin Marques wrote: > On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 22:56:46 +0200, Frans Pop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > There is also: > > Bug#368214: Wrong keyboard configured for Sparc with 2.6 kernels > > And of course the recent: > > Bug#373821: Unavailable xserver-xorg-video-sun* necessary for many Sparc > > Which SPARC need these packages? Any Sparc32 (sunbw2, suntcx, suncg14, suncg3, suncg6) except Javastation, Sparc64 with Creator or Elite framebuffers (sunffb). -- SP -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
sparc etch status (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Martin Marques wrote: Talking of that... is Debian/SPARC gonna make it to etch? I can't run KDE apps without having a hang once in a while (especially kmail (which I don't use anymore) and konqueror). swf is also boken in the latest testing. rapidsvn can't do diffs, but this could be a general problem inglobbing all platforms, and not something particular to SPARC. It would be great if you could investigate what causes these problems and file bugs, if they are not already filed. Extra points if you can fix them, if it's sparc-specific, in 90% of cases it's some kind of unaligned access issue. Regarding the chances of sparc getting into etch, I would say that everything pretty much depends on whether 2.6.17 kernel comes out before it's too late (and makes it into etch). According to buildd admins, sparc buildds are running reliably with 2.6.17-rc1 kernel, while they have crashed with earlier versions, creating the main obstacle for inclusion in etch. Also, 2.6.17 is the first upstream kernel which supports the new Sun's Niagara processors, so we would not want to miss out on that also. Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
sparc xorg drivers available (was: Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64)
On Fri, 16 Jun 2006, Steve Pacenka wrote: According to David Nusinow of XSF, these drivers need a maintainer. He lacks hardware for testing. Source is in the XSF subversion repository. I've offered an Ultra 2, which may need memory if my scrounging does not succeed. I'm willing to be a tester for drivers of what I keep running in noncritical roles, which is Creator3D, Elite3D, cg14, and onboard ATI in U5/10. I'll try to build the unavailable packages and my own version of the xserver-xorg-video-ati package using XSF subversion sources. I've got to talk to David today online, and he was very glad to hear that there is interest in maintaining the sparc drivers. He offered his full cooperation, and I'll probably be getting commit access to the XSF svn repo, so that we can keep these packages in good shape. In the meantime, I've built the source and binary packages for sunbw2, suncg14, suncg3, suncg6, sunffb, sunleo and suntcx, and placed them at http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/ There is a couple of minor patches I had to apply to get them to build correctly, they are available in the patches subdirectory. Steve, it would be great if you could start and maintain a wiki page, tracking the current testing status, since you seem to have access to most hardware :-). I'll try to test what I can (at the moment it's ATI only, but I hope to be able to do better than that in the future). Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
One more thing related with this issue. When I try to install xserver-xorg-video-ati it wants to remove kcontrol, kdesktop, konq-plugins, konqueror, etc. Is this OK (I don't think so). Maybe it has to do with the fact that KDE is being updated the last few days. Anyway, monday in national holiday here in Argentina, so on tuesday things may change. :-D bugs:~# apt-get install xserver-xorg-video-ati xserver-xorg-input-mouse xserver-xorg-input-kbd Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree... Done The following extra packages will be installed: libglu1-mesa libxfont1 x11-common xbase-clients xfonts-100dpi xfonts-75dpi xfonts-base xfonts-encodings xfonts-utils xkb-data xlibmesa-glu xserver-xfree86 xserver-xorg xserver-xorg-core xserver-xorg-input-all xserver-xorg-input-evdev xserver-xorg-input-synaptics xserver-xorg-input-wacom Suggested packages: mesa-utils mdetect read-edid libglide2 gsynaptics ksynaptics qsynaptics Recommended packages: laptop-detect xresprobe discover1 xkeyboard-config The following packages will be REMOVED: kcontrol kdesktop konq-plugins konqueror libdps1 libgle3 libwxgtk2.4-1 libwxgtk2.6-0 libxft1 python-wxgtk2.4 xfree86-common xfs xscreensaver-gl xserver-common xutils The following NEW packages will be installed: libglu1-mesa libxfont1 xfonts-encodings xfonts-utils xkb-data xserver-xorg xserver-xorg-core xserver-xorg-input-all xserver-xorg-input-evdev xserver-xorg-input-kbd xserver-xorg-input-mouse xserver-xorg-input-synaptics xserver-xorg-input-wacom xserver-xorg-video-ati The following packages will be upgraded: x11-common xbase-clients xfonts-100dpi xfonts-75dpi xfonts-base xlibmesa-glu xserver-xfree86 7 upgraded, 14 newly installed, 15 to remove and 9 not upgraded. On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 13:46:19 -0700 (PDT), Jurij Smakov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Ludovic Court�s wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> 2 days, 15 hours, 43 minutes, 47 seconds ago, >> Martin Marques wrote: >>> A couple of months ago I tried upgrading my XFree86 to Xorg On my U5 > with that ATI video card. The result is that the whole workstation > freezes, and I have to turn it off (reset boton doesn't work in this > case). What I'm sure is that it wasn't Xorg 7.0 (6 something). >> >> I used to use Xorg 6.9 from `unstable' on my U5 and it ran flawlessly. >> This is weird since Xorg 7.0 is described as no more than 6.9 + the >> GNU build framework [0]. > > Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the > latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during > installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs > solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!). > Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions > of installed packages: > > xorg 7.0.22 > xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8 > xserver-xorg-video-ati6.5.8.0-1 > > The actual xorg.conf used and the log of the server starting up are > available at > > http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.conf-ultra5-ati > http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.log-ultra5-ati > > Best regards, > > Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC > -- - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 22:56:46 +0200, Frans Pop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > There is also: > Bug#368214: Wrong keyboard configured for Sparc with 2.6 kernels > And of course the recent: > Bug#373821: Unavailable xserver-xorg-video-sun* necessary for many Sparc Which SPARC need these packages? > installing and working properly on Sparc in time for Etch... Talking of that... is Debian/SPARC gonna make it to etch? I can't run KDE apps without having a hang once in a while (especially kmail (which I don't use anymore) and konqueror). swf is also boken in the latest testing. rapidsvn can't do diffs, but this could be a general problem inglobbing all platforms, and not something particular to SPARC. -- - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 13:46:19 -0700 (PDT), Jurij Smakov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Ludovic Court�s wrote: > >> I used to use Xorg 6.9 from `unstable' on my U5 and it ran flawlessly. >> This is weird since Xorg 7.0 is described as no more than 6.9 + the >> GNU build framework [0]. > > Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the > latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during > installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs > solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!). > Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions > of installed packages: > > xorg 7.0.22 > xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8 > xserver-xorg-video-ati6.5.8.0-1 My xorg.conf file had this: Section "Device" Identifier "ATI Technologies, Inc. 3D Rage Pro 215GP" Driver "ati" BusID "PCI:1:2:0" Option "UseFBDev" "true" EndSection So I guess (looking at your xorg.conf) that all I have to do is comment the Option of UseFBDev. Excelent! -- - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Saturday 17 June 2006 22:46, Jurij Smakov wrote: > Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the > latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during > installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine > hangs solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf > (bad!). Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. > Versions of installed packages: There is also: Bug#368214: Wrong keyboard configured for Sparc with 2.6 kernels And of course the recent: Bug#373821: Unavailable xserver-xorg-video-sun* necessary for many Sparc We really need to put in some time together with XOrg maintainers to get X installing and working properly on Sparc in time for Etch... Any volunteers? Cheers, FJP pgpZmDQprU1Pq.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006, Ludovic Court�s wrote: Hi, 2 days, 15 hours, 43 minutes, 47 seconds ago, Martin Marques wrote: A couple of months ago I tried upgrading my XFree86 to Xorg On my U5 with that ATI video card. The result is that the whole workstation freezes, and I have to turn it off (reset boton doesn't work in this case). What I'm sure is that it wasn't Xorg 7.0 (6 something). I used to use Xorg 6.9 from `unstable' on my U5 and it ran flawlessly. This is weird since Xorg 7.0 is described as no more than 6.9 + the GNU build framework [0]. Just to reconfirm: I've just reinstalled my Ultra5, updated it to the latest sid and installed xorg. The xorg.conf file it generates during installation is indeed broken, as it uses fbdev driver. The machine hangs solid when an attempt is made to do startx with this xorg.conf (bad!). Changing the driver to ati makes everything work nicely though. Versions of installed packages: xorg7.0.22 xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-8 xserver-xorg-video-ati 6.5.8.0-1 The actual xorg.conf used and the log of the server starting up are available at http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.conf-ultra5-ati http://www.wooyd.org/debian/xorg/xorg.log-ultra5-ati Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, 2 days, 15 hours, 43 minutes, 47 seconds ago, Martin Marques wrote: > A couple of months ago I tried upgrading my XFree86 to Xorg On my U5 with > that ATI video card. The result is that the whole workstation freezes, and I > have to turn it off (reset boton doesn't work in this case). What I'm sure is > that it wasn't Xorg 7.0 (6 something). I used to use Xorg 6.9 from `unstable' on my U5 and it ran flawlessly. This is weird since Xorg 7.0 is described as no more than 6.9 + the GNU build framework [0]. Thanks, Ludovic. [0] http://x.org/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Thursday 15 June 2006 00:33, Jurij Smakov wrote: > On Wed, 14 Jun 2006, Steve Pacenka wrote: > > I would hesitate to try Xorg 7 from Debian Sparc repositories except when > > thee is no alternative, i.e. bare metal. Working pre-7 versions have > > disappeared from Testing so there is no easy way to revert if 7.0 is > > broken. A definite mass breakage is that neither Testing nor Sid > > contains any of the xserver-xorg-video-sun* packages that provide drivers > > for ffb, tgx, leo, etc. > > Are those drivers available upstream and are not available as packages > purely due to faulty packaging? Has this problem been brought to the > attention of XSF in any way? According to David Nusinow of XSF, these drivers need a maintainer. He lacks hardware for testing. Source is in the XSF subversion repository. I've offered an Ultra 2, which may need memory if my scrounging does not succeed. I'm willing to be a tester for drivers of what I keep running in noncritical roles, which is Creator3D, Elite3D, cg14, and onboard ATI in U5/10. I'll try to build the unavailable packages and my own version of the xserver-xorg-video-ati package using XSF subversion sources. No promises about results or earliness. -- SP > > Best regards, > > Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Wed, 14 Jun 2006, Steve Pacenka wrote: I would hesitate to try Xorg 7 from Debian Sparc repositories except when thee is no alternative, i.e. bare metal. Working pre-7 versions have disappeared from Testing so there is no easy way to revert if 7.0 is broken. A definite mass breakage is that neither Testing nor Sid contains any of the xserver-xorg-video-sun* packages that provide drivers for ffb, tgx, leo, etc. Are those drivers available upstream and are not available as packages purely due to faulty packaging? Has this problem been brought to the attention of XSF in any way? Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tue, 13 Jun 2006 20:38:49 +0200, Ludovic Courtès <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > (About broken Xorg 7.0 on an Ultra 5.) > > Has anybody else tried Xorg 7.0 on an Ultra 5 (or similar) with an ATI > 3D Rage Pro? Or am I the only one experiencing problems? The wiki > page [0] currently only shows Jurij's success with an ATI board and a > failure with a Raptor board. A couple of months ago I tried upgrading my XFree86 to Xorg On my U5 with that ATI video card. The result is that the whole workstation freezes, and I have to turn it off (reset boton doesn't work in this case). What I'm sure is that it wasn't Xorg 7.0 (6 something). What I did then was downgrade to XFree86 from stable and leave it there. I may try again to upgrade this wekend. -- - Lic. Martín Marqués | SELECT 'mmarques' || Centro de Telemática| '@' || 'unl.edu.ar'; Universidad Nacional| DBA, Programador, del Litoral | Administrador - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tuesday 13 June 2006 14:38, Ludovic Courtès wrote: > Has anybody else tried Xorg 7.0 on an Ultra 5 (or similar) with an ATI > 3D Rage Pro? Or am I the only one experiencing problems? The wiki > page [0] currently only shows Jurij's success with an ATI board and a > failure with a Raptor board. > > At least, this proves that I can live without X. ;-) I would hesitate to try Xorg 7 from Debian Sparc repositories except when thee is no alternative, i.e. bare metal. Working pre-7 versions have disappeared from Testing so there is no easy way to revert if 7.0 is broken. A definite mass breakage is that neither Testing nor Sid contains any of the xserver-xorg-video-sun* packages that provide drivers for ffb, tgx, leo, etc. A U60 I'm building has no X after a misguided dist-upgrade that wiped out Xorg 6.9, which was working well. -- :^( , SP > > Thanks, > Ludovic. > > [0] http://wiki.debian.org/XorgOnSparc
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, (About broken Xorg 7.0 on an Ultra 5.) 34 days, 20 hours, 32 minutes, 16 seconds ago, Ludovic Courtès wrote: > I should note that the above remark applied to 2.6.15, probably _before_ > running X. With 2.6.16-1 (from sid), I can observe the following funny > thing: > > # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so > /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so: Sun disk label 'ST39111A cyl 17660 alt 2 > hd 16 sec 63' 14285 phys cys, 51 alts/cyl, 0 blocks, boot block present > > With 2.6.15, it's now `libramdac.so' that gets broken: > > # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so > /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so: sparc executable > > This randomness may explain why we do not experience the same problems. Has anybody else tried Xorg 7.0 on an Ultra 5 (or similar) with an ATI 3D Rage Pro? Or am I the only one experiencing problems? The wiki page [0] currently only shows Jurij's success with an ATI board and a failure with a Raptor board. At least, this proves that I can live without X. ;-) Thanks, Ludovic. [0] http://wiki.debian.org/XorgOnSparc -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Wed, May 10, 2006 at 07:19:36PM +0200, Ludovic Courtès wrote: > Hi, > > Today, 13 hours, 42 minutes, 29 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > > On Tue, 9 May 2006, Ludovic Courtès wrote: > > > > >I should note that the above remark applied to 2.6.15, probably _before_ > > >running X. With 2.6.16-1 (from sid), I can observe the following funny > > >thing: > > > > > > # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so > > > /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so: Sun disk label 'ST39111A cyl 17660 alt 2 > > > hd 16 sec 63' 14285 phys cys, 51 alts/cyl, 0 blocks, boot block present > > > > > >With 2.6.15, it's now `libramdac.so' that gets broken: > > > > > > # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so > > > /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so: sparc executable > > > > > >This randomness may explain why we do not experience the same problems. > > > > Ugh. The only thing which comes to mind is that your kernel got > > miscompiled somehow. Dave Miller mentioned on sparclinux list that gcc 4.1 > > causes problems, perhaps you are using it to build the kernels? > > No, I'm running the Debian kernels from `unstable'. > > So the way X talks to the kernel/hardware must be quite unorthodox. > Maybe some DMA issue or something like that? > I'd rather look at the hardware. That kind of problem smells like ram chip or control gone berserk. Seb -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, Today, 13 hours, 42 minutes, 29 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > On Tue, 9 May 2006, Ludovic Courtès wrote: > > >I should note that the above remark applied to 2.6.15, probably _before_ > >running X. With 2.6.16-1 (from sid), I can observe the following funny > >thing: > > > > # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so > > /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so: Sun disk label 'ST39111A cyl 17660 alt 2 > > hd 16 sec 63' 14285 phys cys, 51 alts/cyl, 0 blocks, boot block present > > > >With 2.6.15, it's now `libramdac.so' that gets broken: > > > > # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so > > /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so: sparc executable > > > >This randomness may explain why we do not experience the same problems. > > Ugh. The only thing which comes to mind is that your kernel got > miscompiled somehow. Dave Miller mentioned on sparclinux list that gcc 4.1 > causes problems, perhaps you are using it to build the kernels? No, I'm running the Debian kernels from `unstable'. So the way X talks to the kernel/hardware must be quite unorthodox. Maybe some DMA issue or something like that? Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Tue, 9 May 2006, Ludovic Courtès wrote: I should note that the above remark applied to 2.6.15, probably _before_ running X. With 2.6.16-1 (from sid), I can observe the following funny thing: # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so: Sun disk label 'ST39111A cyl 17660 alt 2 hd 16 sec 63' 14285 phys cys, 51 alts/cyl, 0 blocks, boot block present With 2.6.15, it's now `libramdac.so' that gets broken: # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so: sparc executable This randomness may explain why we do not experience the same problems. Ugh. The only thing which comes to mind is that your kernel got miscompiled somehow. Dave Miller mentioned on sparclinux list that gcc 4.1 causes problems, perhaps you are using it to build the kernels? Have people been running X-free (no pun here) workloads, like builds, with recent kernels on sparc64? Do they trigger any such problem? Yeah, I'm regularly building test kernels on a headless Ultra-60, running the latest available kernel (2.6.16, 2.6.17-rc), and it has been working quite nicely for me. Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, 7 days, 28 minutes, 11 seconds ago, Ludovic Courtès wrote: > > Hm, this file loads fine for me: > > > > (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so > > (II) Module xaa: vendor="X.Org Foundation" > > compiled for 7.0.0, module version = 1.2.0 > > ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 0.8 > > > > sha1sum of this file is: > > > > 7bfc397c6d7f0a174f46aede663c5338aacf6472 /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so > > Same file here, but it still doesn't load -- but I no longer get this > message. ;-) I should note that the above remark applied to 2.6.15, probably _before_ running X. With 2.6.16-1 (from sid), I can observe the following funny thing: # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so: Sun disk label 'ST39111A cyl 17660 alt 2 hd 16 sec 63' 14285 phys cys, 51 alts/cyl, 0 blocks, boot block present With 2.6.15, it's now `libramdac.so' that gets broken: # file /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libramdac.so: sparc executable This randomness may explain why we do not experience the same problems. Anyway, I ran `apt-get install --reinstall xserver-xorg-core' to see what would happen. `debsums' then reported that _this_ package was no longer corrupt. Re-running X right after that made the system hang after the following (famous) message: error opening security policy file /etc/X11/xserver/SecurityPolicy I tried various configurations with `hdparm' on the hard disk in question and that doesn't seem to make any significant difference. Although I haven't been able to reproducibly demonstrate it, apparent file corruption seems to occur after running X (i.e., when X fails without crashing the whole system). Conclusion: the kernel might be the guilty party, but X is still suspicious as well. ;-) Have people been running X-free (no pun here) workloads, like builds, with recent kernels on sparc64? Do they trigger any such problem? Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, Today, 16 hours, 42 minutes, 43 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > I've upgraded today to exactly the same versions (and 2.6.16-10), and it > still works fine. I don't have a /etc/X11/xserver/SecurityPolicy file, or > /etc/X11/xserver directory, for that matter :-/. I do get the same > warnings and errors though (except the SecurityPolicy thing), they do not > seem to affect the functionality. It looks like bug 362246, please supply > additional information to it. I had this file: it had been left from `xserver-common'. I removed it using `dpkg --purge'. Now X simply hangs without issuing this message, both with 2.6.15 and 16. > Hm, this file loads fine for me: > > (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so > (II) Module xaa: vendor="X.Org Foundation" > compiled for 7.0.0, module version = 1.2.0 > ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 0.8 > > sha1sum of this file is: > > 7bfc397c6d7f0a174f46aede663c5338aacf6472 /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so Same file here, but it still doesn't load -- but I no longer get this message. ;-) > In general, my situation is probably a bit simpler, I've installed new > xorg from scratch, so I'm probably not hitting all the juicy upgrade > bugs... Right. I'm clueless now. I'd be tempted to say that there are even more important issues than packaging issues. These "end of block range" messages typically lead me to think that Xorg 7 is currently buggy, or at least the video drivers at hand. I suppose similar problems occur on other arches as well? Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Mon, 1 May 2006, Ludovic Court�s wrote: Using a 2.6.16 kernel and today's Xorg packages with the `xorg.conf' you sent, all I get is this: X Window System Version 7.0.0 ... (==) Log file: "/var/log/Xorg.0.log", Time: Tue May 2 06:42:58 2006 (==) Using config file: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf" (EE) end of block range 0xcb < begin 0x2c8 (EE) end of block range 0xc0001b < begin 0x2c00018 (EE) end of block range 0xcb < begin 0x2c8 (EE) end of block range 0xc0001b < begin 0x2c00018 (WW) INVALID IO ALLOCATION b: 0x2c00400 e: 0x2c004ff correcting error opening security policy file /etc/X11/xserver/SecurityPolicy ... followed by a blank screen, and a machine hang. The packages I use are slightly more recent that those you mention on the wiki: xorg7.0.15 xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-7 xserver-xorg-video-ati 6.5.8.0-1 I've upgraded today to exactly the same versions (and 2.6.16-10), and it still works fine. I don't have a /etc/X11/xserver/SecurityPolicy file, or /etc/X11/xserver directory, for that matter :-/. I do get the same warnings and errors though (except the SecurityPolicy thing), they do not seem to affect the functionality. It looks like bug 362246, please supply additional information to it. Now, with a 2.6.15 kernel and the same `xorg.conf', the machine does _not_ hang but X spits out the same messages, except that the "error opening security policy file" line is replaced with: (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so is an unrecognized module type (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "xaa" (unknown module type, 6) (EE) Screen(s) found, but none have a usable configuration. Hm, this file loads fine for me: (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so (II) Module xaa: vendor="X.Org Foundation" compiled for 7.0.0, module version = 1.2.0 ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 0.8 sha1sum of this file is: 7bfc397c6d7f0a174f46aede663c5338aacf6472 /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so In general, my situation is probably a bit simpler, I've installed new xorg from scratch, so I'm probably not hitting all the juicy upgrade bugs... Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Mon, May 01, 2006 at 11:17:25PM +0200, Ludovic Court?s wrote: > > xorg7.0.15 > xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-7 > xserver-xorg-video-ati 6.5.8.0-1 > > Now, with a 2.6.15 kernel and the same `xorg.conf', the machine does _not_ > hang but X spits out the same messages, except that the "error opening > security policy file" line is replaced with: > > (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so is an unrecognized module type > (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "xaa" (unknown module type, 6) > (EE) Screen(s) found, but none have a usable configuration. > > Fatal server error: > no screens found > > (Then X exits with -1.) The same occurs with a 2.6.14 kernel. > > So there's something fishy going on here. Are you saying so you can > start Xorg 7 without even seeing the "end of block range" messages? i saw something vaguely similar on my sunblade100, when it needed libxau... jim -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
Hi, 7 days, 23 hours, 57 minutes, 39 seconds ago, Jurij Smakov wrote: > On Sun, 23 Apr 2006, Ludovic Court?s wrote: > >I just tried the brand new Xorg 7 packages on my U5 (it has an ATI 3D Rage > >Pro 215GP board with 16 MB of RAM). Basically, whether I use the ATI or FB > >driver, the system hangs soon after Xorg started. > > Hi Ludovic, > > I have an Ultra5 with the same graphics card, and I was able to start xorg > on it after some tweaking. Working /etc/X11/xorg.conf is attached. Using a 2.6.16 kernel and today's Xorg packages with the `xorg.conf' you sent, all I get is this: X Window System Version 7.0.0 ... (==) Log file: "/var/log/Xorg.0.log", Time: Tue May 2 06:42:58 2006 (==) Using config file: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf" (EE) end of block range 0xcb < begin 0x2c8 (EE) end of block range 0xc0001b < begin 0x2c00018 (EE) end of block range 0xcb < begin 0x2c8 (EE) end of block range 0xc0001b < begin 0x2c00018 (WW) INVALID IO ALLOCATION b: 0x2c00400 e: 0x2c004ff correcting error opening security policy file /etc/X11/xserver/SecurityPolicy ... followed by a blank screen, and a machine hang. The packages I use are slightly more recent that those you mention on the wiki: xorg7.0.15 xserver-xorg-core 1.0.2-7 xserver-xorg-video-ati 6.5.8.0-1 Now, with a 2.6.15 kernel and the same `xorg.conf', the machine does _not_ hang but X spits out the same messages, except that the "error opening security policy file" line is replaced with: (EE) /usr/lib/xorg/modules/libxaa.so is an unrecognized module type (EE) ATI: Failed to load module "xaa" (unknown module type, 6) (EE) Screen(s) found, but none have a usable configuration. Fatal server error: no screens found (Then X exits with -1.) The same occurs with a 2.6.14 kernel. So there's something fishy going on here. Are you saying so you can start Xorg 7 without even seeing the "end of block range" messages? Thanks, Ludovic. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Xorg 7 on sparc64
On Sun, 23 Apr 2006, Ludovic Court�s wrote: Hello, I just tried the brand new Xorg 7 packages on my U5 (it has an ATI 3D Rage Pro 215GP board with 16 MB of RAM). Basically, whether I use the ATI or FB driver, the system hangs soon after Xorg started. Hi Ludovic, I have an Ultra5 with the same graphics card, and I was able to start xorg on it after some tweaking. Working /etc/X11/xorg.conf is attached. By the way, I've started the XorgOnSparc wiki page [0], where everyone is welcome to document their experiences and share the configuration tips for various sparc boxes. [0] http://wiki.debian.org/XorgOnSparc Best regards, Jurij Smakov[EMAIL PROTECTED] Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC# /etc/X11/xorg.conf (xorg X Window System server configuration file) # # This file was generated by dexconf, the Debian X Configuration tool, using # values from the debconf database. # # Edit this file with caution, and see the /etc/X11/xorg.conf manual page. # (Type "man /etc/X11/xorg.conf" at the shell prompt.) # # This file is automatically updated on xserver-xorg package upgrades *only* # if it has not been modified since the last upgrade of the xserver-xorg # package. # # If you have edited this file but would like it to be automatically updated # again, run the following command: # sudo dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg Section "Files" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/misc" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/100dpi/:unscaled" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/75dpi/:unscaled" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/Type1" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/100dpi" FontPath"/usr/share/fonts/X11/75dpi" # path to defoma fonts FontPath"/var/lib/defoma/x-ttcidfont-conf.d/dirs/TrueType" EndSection Section "Module" Load"i2c" Load"bitmap" Load"ddc" Load"dri" Load"extmod" Load"freetype" Load"glx" Load"int10" Load"type1" Load"vbe" EndSection Section "InputDevice" Identifier "Generic Keyboard" Driver "kbd" Option "Protocol" "standard" Option "CoreKeyboard" Option "XkbRules" "sun(type5)" EndSection Section "InputDevice" Identifier "Configured Mouse" Driver "mouse" Option "CorePointer" Option "Device""/dev/input/mice" Option "Protocol" "ExplorerPS/2" Option "Emulate3Buttons" "true" EndSection Section "Device" Identifier "ATI Technologies, Inc. 3D Rage Pro 215GP" Driver "ati" # Option "UseFBDev" "true" EndSection Section "Monitor" Identifier "Generic Monitor" Option "DPMS" HorizSync 31-72 VertRefresh 50-120 EndSection Section "Screen" Identifier "Default Screen" Device "ATI Technologies, Inc. 3D Rage Pro 215GP" Monitor "Generic Monitor" DefaultDepth16 SubSection "Display" Depth 1 Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480" EndSubSection SubSection "Display" Depth 4 Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480" EndSubSection SubSection "Display" Depth 8 Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480" EndSubSection SubSection "Display" Depth 15 Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480" EndSubSection SubSection "Display" Depth 16 Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480" EndSubSection SubSection "Display" Depth 24 Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480" EndSubSection EndSection Section "ServerLayout" Identifier "Default Layout" Screen "Default Screen" InputDevice "Generic Keyboard" InputDevice "Configured Mouse" EndSection Section "DRI" Mode0666 EndSection
