Debian Buster RC2 : Mise en veille systématique

[Christian Quentin]

Bonsoir, 

Que je clique sur le bouton Eteindre/Redémarrer ou que je tape halt dans
un terminal (ou shutdown now), le résultat est le même : le PC met très
longtemps à s'éteindre et finalement se met en veille. J'ai un petit
voyant lumineux qui confirme que le PC (un portable HP 15_bw0xx) reste
sous tension.

Ce qui est plus problématique, c'est que je ne vois pas comment sortir
de veille. Le bouton on/off n'a pas d'effet, les touches fn non plus. 

La seule solution pas très élégante que j'ai trouvée jusqu'à maintenant,
c'est de maintenir le bouton on/off appuyé une dizaine de secondes pour
l'éteindre complètement. 

Autre indice : quand je rallume le PC et que Debian s'initialise, je
vois passer la ligne suivante : 

resuming from hibernation 

suivi de quelques lignes qui indiquent un arrêt brutal et une remise en
ordre du système de fichiers à l'aide du journal. 

Tout ce que j'ai lu jusqu'à maintenant ne m'a pas permis d'avancer. 

Je ne souhaite pas nécessairement utiliser les modes de veille, le PC
démarre sur un SSD et un arrêt/rédémarrage classique me conviendrait
tout à fait ! 

Si vous avez des idées de pistes à explorer, je suis preneur. 

Christian

Re: How to have password shown?

[deloptes]

Renato Gallo wrote:

> For the use his old father might do with a computer I think that cheap
> board could do. Plus, it's used by babies can be used by everyone.
> Plus, it's ready out of the box for the use it's meant.
> Plus can be customized for his father use like a tailored tuxedo (better
> in some ways than a computer they are probably sharing).

but it is not that Raspberry has it, it is just that Raspberry Debian
installation is configured so.

You are strangely confusing things here.

Re: How to have password shown?

[deloptes]

Renato Gallo wrote:

> Fingerprints are a good option
> 
> Renato Gallo
> 

No, they are not and it was explained previously why

Re: How to have password shown?

[deloptes]

Renato Gallo wrote:

> You did but nevertheless to give such an option would be a bad idea
> (someone could be crazy enough to be tempted to use it).

For his fathers computer - are you serious? I guess his father does not
care.

Re: armhf vs buster problem #2

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 03 July 2019 17:08:05 Gene Heskett wrote:
It was recommended I move these questions to the debian-user list, so 
here it is.

> On Wednesday 03 July 2019 16:07:04 Andreas Jellinghaus wrote:
> > No idea. Sorry if I missed a mail with the reasons why stock debian
> > wouldn't work?
>
> The application needs a realtime kernel as its controlling metal
> cutting machinery.
>
> > On my ordroid-hc1 I build an sd card image on my deskop as described
> > in the wiki:
> > https://wiki.debian.org/InstallingDebianOn/OdroidHC1
> >
> > And with apt search I can see a realtime kernel is available:
> >
> > linux-image-rt-armmp/testing 4.19+105 armhf
>
> Maybe for your odroid, but the newest for raspian armhf is 4.19.50.
>
> I bought an odroid for this project around 3 years ago, but bricked it
> trying to get linux installed.  What the don't tell you is that its a
> UEFI board, and the linux installers of the day didn't have a clue
> what to do about UEFI. So I've got a C2 that cost me two months to
> get, that because those folks are downright dishonest in not telling
> you that in their advertising, only in the bios did I discover that it
> had a TPM chip in it, which if its disabled in the bios, does not
> bypass that crap, bricking it instead and worse, you can't reverse it
> without spending another $125 for a jtag programmer. I already had a
> $100 bill in it and was not impressed enough to spend any more on it,
> so I next bought a pair of pi3b's.  Which are running the machine
> fairly well except for the video frame rate.  You can count the frames
> per second but you only need one hand as full screen its only about 2
> per second. Buster supposedly has new, faster drivers, but so far I
> have yet to get a realtime kernel and buster to meet on the same u-sd.
>
> >   Linux for ARMv7 multiplatform compatible SoCs (meta-package),
> > PREEMPT_RT
> >
> > Maybe that could work for you?
>
> Unforch the armhf .deb of 4.19.50-rt-preempt-v7 I have built was not
> built to be installed by a u-boot aware builder.
>
> > Good luck with your project.
> >
> > Andreas
> >
> > Am Mi., 3. Juli 2019 um 21:15 Uhr schrieb Gene Heskett
> >  >
> > > I just yesterday watched RealtimePi make me an image for arm-v7.
> > > It went all the motions of building a 4.4.114-rt-v7 kernel out of
> > > a arm-hf buster zip containing a 4.19.50-v7 kernel.  So knowing
> > > the 4.4.114-tr-preempt kernel would be replaced if I ever got the
> > > network to work, I added a /etc/apt/preferences.d/kernel.pref to
> > > pin the kernel.
> > >
> > > But imagine my surprise when I plugged that u-sd into the pi and
> > > booted it, one of the first things I note is that the images
> > > installed kernel is a 4.19.50-v7, which may be straight from the
> > > raspian-buster-zip RealtimePi started with.
> > >
> > > So, how do I convince CustomPiOS to both build the 4.19.50, with
> > > realtime patches applied, and then hand it back to RealtimePi to
> > > use building the image? I have done that independently from
> > > RealtimePi but no clue how make either of the guysoft utilities to
> > > actually use it.
> > >
> > > Help please, and thank you.
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > > --
> > > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> > >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
> > > respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis
> > > Genes Web page 
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 

Re: Assorted arm-buster problems #1

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 03 July 2019 16:12:31 Reco wrote:

And Gene moved. Question unanswered yet.
>   Hi.
>
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:57:35PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Regardless of what I do, I cannot get rid of the avahi junk in an ip
> > a report, so my local 192.168.xx.nn/24 net is the only thing that
> > works. pinging a net name like yahoo.com gets me a successful
> > address. But no response from yahoo because its sending the ping
> > from an avahi based address, which since thats outside of my /24
> > netmask, doesn't get thru the router.
> >
> > So, how do I get rid of the avahi stuff?
> >
> > I've a nominally 10 machine 192.168.nn.xx that is 100% static based
> > on host files so I want avahi absolutely and totally neutered,
> > emasculated, gone Forever plus 100 years at least.
> >
> > How can I do that?
>
> Just a friendly advise. Consider moving this to debian-user, as this
> particular problem is not ARM-specific.
>
> Also please consider posting all future similar problems (involving
> configuration of a resolver, IP routing and package management) to
> debian-user.
>
> Thank you in advance, Reco


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Qobi Ben Nun]

É justamente o mal uso das ferramentas. Como tinha sido mencionado 
anteriormente, Telegram e afins são práticos, porém falta muito bom senso e 
bons hábitos pra que funcione devidamente.

Não posso dizer pelos outros, mas sou um brasileiro que gosta de ler. :-) Não 
sem motivo que estou aqui interagindo com vocês. 



Em 3 de julho de 2019 21:18:23 BRT, Gilberto F da Silva <2458...@gmail.com> 
escreveu:
>-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>Hash: SHA1
>
>On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 08:43:01AM -0300, Qobi Ben Nun wrote:
>> Primeiro, que nem sempre as respostas ficam embaixo das perguntas e
>depois o que tem de gente fazendo a mesma pergunta quase que o tempo
>todo sem nem se dar ao trabalho de buscar no histórico grupos é de se
>estressar. Tudo bem que ao fazer isso, vai gerar grande confusão também
>porque se escreve muito mal, de forma fragmentada, sem fornecer
>informação que ajude a resolver as dúvidas.
>> Estou chegando a conclusão de que não é a ferramenta usada. Seja um
>tipo ou outro, tem quem faça bobagem e subutilizam a ferramenta.
>
>  Por que o pessoal abandonou o hábito de responder depois das
>  perguntas e deixaram de quotar as mensagens? 
>
>- -- 
>
>Stela dato:2.458.668,511  Loka tempo:2019-07-03 21:16:39 Merkredo 
>- -==-
>"O livre arbítrio na realidade não é livre, pois é uma coação você só 
>pode escolher dois caminhos, um é bom e outro é ruim. Livre arbítrio 
>mesmo é poder escolher muitos caminhos, todos bons".
>-- Perrone
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>=1Z9K
>-END PGP SIGNATURE-

-- 
Enviado de meu dispositivo Android com K-9 mail. Desculpe-me pela brevidade.

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Gilberto F da Silva]

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On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 08:43:01AM -0300, Qobi Ben Nun wrote:
> Primeiro, que nem sempre as respostas ficam embaixo das perguntas e depois o 
> que tem de gente fazendo a mesma pergunta quase que o tempo todo sem nem se 
> dar ao trabalho de buscar no histórico grupos é de se estressar. Tudo bem que 
> ao fazer isso, vai gerar grande confusão também porque se escreve muito mal, 
> de forma fragmentada, sem fornecer informação que ajude a resolver as dúvidas.
> Estou chegando a conclusão de que não é a ferramenta usada. Seja um tipo ou 
> outro, tem quem faça bobagem e subutilizam a ferramenta.

  Por que o pessoal abandonou o hábito de responder depois das
  perguntas e deixaram de quotar as mensagens? 

- -- 

Stela dato:2.458.668,511  Loka tempo:2019-07-03 21:16:39 Merkredo 
- -==-
"O livre arbítrio na realidade não é livre, pois é uma coação você só 
pode escolher dois caminhos, um é bom e outro é ruim. Livre arbítrio 
mesmo é poder escolher muitos caminhos, todos bons".
-- Perrone
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=1Z9K
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: armv7 vs buster problem #3

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 03 July 2019 18:06:18 John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:

> Hi Gene!
>
> On 7/3/19 10:42 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Just one of the things its taken over. Now we have a different
> > command to set the hostname too if you want it to stick over a
> > reboot.  Someone a couple weeks ago showed me how to do that for
> > hostname only. I've no clue how it does that because it can do it
> > even if /etc/hostname has been made immutable. In fact I'd call that
> > a major security breech.
>
> Could you move this discussion over to the debian-user mailing list?
> As already mentioned by Reco earlier, those questions aren't specific
> to ARM.
>
> As for systemd and related stuff, I would recommend reading through
> the documentation a bit which explains a lot of these things. I think
> you will make faster progress by understanding the concepts rather
> than asking for every single problem you are running into.
>
> Regarding why systemd has its own hostname command is simple: The
> original Unix hostname command doesn't set the hostname persistently
> (you had write the file yourself) and you had to reboot the machine to
> make sure the new hostname was propagated everywhere across the system
> (after writing the file) which is no longer the case with systemd
> where these changes are propagated using dbus which the old hostname
> command didn't support [1].
>
> The new systemd hostnamectl makes sure other processes are immediately
> notified if the hostname gets changed and I think that's something
> reasonable to expect. With the old approach, it could happen that
> after issuing the hostname command to rename the host, that some
> processes still saw the old hostname, so the system got into an
> inconsistent state.
>
> In most cases where systemd provides its own solution for a certain
> feature, there are actually pretty good technical reasons why that was
> done. In most cases, it was necessary because the old Unix version of
> a command was rather limited in functionality or had certain design
> problems.
>
> Adrian
>
> > [1]
> > https://blog.fpmurphy.com/2014/10/revisiting-the-systemd-d-bus-inter
> >face.html

I read/scanned thru this 2 or 3 times without finding any clues to fix 
what ails this install, I suspect from the dates of that thread, its 5+ 
years too old.

But it does give me hope that there are good answers out there, 
someplace...

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Gilberto F da Silva]

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On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:22:24PM -0300, G. Felipe Pereira da Silva wrote:
> Concordo contigo Francisco.
> Uma coisa boa que aprendi na iniciação cientifica foi isso.
> Primeiro: Google, comunidades, listas e depois de esgotadas as possibilidades
> perguntar aos universitários :)
> É até meio estranho para um usuário debian essa falta de autonomia.

  Hoje em dia há muitos vídeos "Bem amigos hoje eu vou estar ensinando
  a voc como fazer para..."

  Eu acho chato ver vídeos para resolver problemas de configuração.
  De qualquer, a informação está lá.

- -- 

Stela dato:2.458.668,509  Loka tempo:2019-07-03 21:12:34 Merkredo 
- -==-
"Como todas as religiões, a Sagrada Religião da Unicórnio Rosa 
Invisível é baseada sobre Lógica e fé. Nós temos fé que Ela é Rosa; 
nós Logicamente sabemos que Ela é Invisível, porque nós não podemos 
vê-la".
-- Anônimo, paródia criada por ateus
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Re: armv7 vs buster problem #3

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 03 July 2019 18:06:18 John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:

> Hi Gene!
>
> On 7/3/19 10:42 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Just one of the things its taken over. Now we have a different
> > command to set the hostname too if you want it to stick over a
> > reboot.  Someone a couple weeks ago showed me how to do that for
> > hostname only. I've no clue how it does that because it can do it
> > even if /etc/hostname has been made immutable. In fact I'd call that
> > a major security breech.
>
> Could you move this discussion over to the debian-user mailing list?
> As already mentioned by Reco earlier, those questions aren't specific
> to ARM.
>
> As for systemd and related stuff, I would recommend reading through
> the documentation a bit which explains a lot of these things. I think
> you will make faster progress by understanding the concepts rather
> than asking for every single problem you are running into.
>
> Regarding why systemd has its own hostname command is simple: The
> original Unix hostname command doesn't set the hostname persistently
> (you had write the file yourself) 

Six of one, half dozen of the other. In the former case eeryone knew you 
had to call up nano and edit the hostname into /etc/hostname.  Now we 
have a new method that isn't even fixed by a reboot according to sudo.  
And whats the hands down most popular command in the day or so it takes 
ti sort the basket of rattlesnakes the installer hands you ? sudo of 
course.

> and you had to reboot the machine to 
> make sure the new hostname was propagated everywhere across the system
> (after writing the file) which is no longer the case with systemd
> where these changes are propagated using dbus which the old hostname
> command didn't support [1].
>
> The new systemd hostnamectl makes sure other processes are immediately
> notified if the hostname gets changed and I think that's something
> reasonable to expect.

IF, note all caps, then why does sudo bitch so much?

> With the old approach, it could happen that 
> after issuing the hostname command to rename the host, that some
> processes still saw the old hostname, so the system got into an
> inconsistent state.
>
> In most cases where systemd provides its own solution for a certain
> feature, there are actually pretty good technical reasons why that was
> done. In most cases, it was necessary because the old Unix version of
> a command was rather limited in functionality or had certain design
> problems.
>
If it is supposed to tell everything that the hostname has changed, it 
has a huge bug because it didn't tell sudo.
> Adrian
>
> > [1]
> > 
https://blog.fpmurphy.com/2014/10/revisiting-the-systemd-d-bus-interface.html


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Gilberto F da Silva]

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On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:58:46AM -0300, Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA, 
Leandro wrote:
> Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 à 11:27, ndre  a écrit :
> >
> > Mon 01 Jul 2019 às 16:36:39 (1562009799), l...@dutras.org enviou:
> > >
> > > Devo discordar, é uma catástrofe o desuso de protocolos abertos e
> > > federados.  Ainda fosse XMPP…
> >
> > IRC?
> >
> > Tomando o canal debian-br como indicador, aparentemente ninguém tem
> > nenhum problema rodando o debian há meses.
> 
> Até gosto do IRC, mas agora é nicho e não vejo possibilidade dele
> substituir o XMPP.

  Olhando friamente, o Telegram, WhatsApp e afins são muito mais
  práticos.  Você precisa mandar uma foto? Basta tirar com a câmera do
  próprio celular. O inconveniente são os chatos que ficam enviando
  gifs e fotos de qualquer besteira.
  

- -- 

Stela dato:2.458.668,504  Loka tempo:2019-07-03 21:06:01 Merkredo 
- -==-
O fato é que depois de viajar anos, esse Voyager não descobriu 
nenhuma forma de vida inteligente pelaí. O Cosmos, ao que parece, é 
igualzinho  à Terra.
-- Millôr Fernandes
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Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Gilberto F da Silva]

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On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 03:02:11PM -0300, Lucio Stringari Junior wrote:
> das últimas vezes que eu usei o IRC eu não obtive resposta alguma, até
> parece que quem está lá cnectado não está proximo do pc e nem volta no mesmo
> dia.
> 
> atualmente estou de Telegram mesmo, é onde as pessoas estão, e estou lendo o
> livro do Debian Handbook.   Noto que muitas questões seriam já respondidas
> se a pessoa tivesse lido esse livro, estou tendo uma ótima experiencia com a
> leitura.

  Brasileiro não gosta de ler. Tente comprar uma estante de livros
  para entender o que estou dizendo.  

- -- 

Stela dato:2.458.668,503  Loka tempo:2019-07-03 21:04:01 Merkredo 
- -==-
"A inspiração da Bíblia depende da ignorância da pessoa que a lê".
-- Robert G. Ingersoll, político e professor Americano
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Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Gilberto F da Silva]

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On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:26:34AM -0300, ndre wrote:
> Mon 01 Jul 2019 às 16:36:39 (1562009799), l...@dutras.org enviou:
> > Le lun. 1 juil. 2019 à 05:46, Helio Loureiro  a 
> > écrit :
> > >
> > > Felizmente telegram e similares mataram o uso de mailing lists.
> > 
> > Devo discordar, é uma catástrofe o desuso de protocolos abertos e
> > federados.  Ainda fosse XMPP…
> 
> IRC?
> 
> Tomando o canal debian-br como indicador, aparentemente ninguém tem
> nenhum problema rodando o debian há meses.

  Dentro da internet umas coisas aparecem e depois saem de moda.

- -- 

Stela dato:2.458.668,502  Loka tempo:2019-07-03 21:02:46 Merkredo 
- -==-
"Dizer que um crente é mais feliz do que um cético é como dizer que 
um bêbado é mais feliz que um sóbrio".
-- George Bernard Shaw
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Oldest Usable x86 CPU for Stretch (Was: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

[Matthew Crews]

On 7/3/19 10:20 AM, Stefan Monnier wrote:
>> That said I do not believe that any existing i386 32-bit-only hardware
>> that is still floating around even supports the virtual machine
>> extensions necessary to run a true VM host.
> 
> I haven't use qemu on my 32bit only i686 machines recently, but I see no
> reason why it wouldn't work any more.

You know, this got me thinking. What *is* the oldest 32-bit x86 CPU that
we can use in Stretch for a VM host? And assuming we are talking
out-of-the-box experience, ie I download a standard ISO and fire it up.

And to be honest, I don't know. Debian seems to support as old as the
Pentium Pro, but I'm not sure what compiler flags that we use, ie what
CPU extensions are required. I remember a couple of years ago I had to
dig up a very old version of Puppy Linux (with a very old Kernel
version) to run an AMD K6-2 laptop because of missing CPU extensions. So
I'm wondering if the kernel that ships with Debian is the same.

Any ideas?

Note: I don't care about the practicality of this.

-Matt



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: Égaliseur virtuel

[hamster]

Le 03/07/2019 à 23:46, benoit...@ouvaton.org a écrit :
> Je me suis mal exprimé dans mon précédant post.
> Ce que je recherche est un égaliseur virtuel.

http://linuxmao.org/Cat%C3%A9gorie+effets+audio
Je te laisse chercher le mot "égaliseur" (avec un accent sur le é) dans
la colonne "description".

Égaliseur virtuel

[benoitlst]

Je me suis mal exprimé dans mon précédant post.
Ce que je recherche est un égaliseur virtuel.

Benoit

Re: Extension "tray icons"

[benoitlst]

Le 2019-07-01 10:18, David BERCOT a écrit :

Bonjour,

Sous Debian Sid avec Gnome, afin d'afficher des icônes diverses (par
exemple celle de Thunderbird, de VirtualBox, etc.) dans la barre de
tâches "systray", j'utilise l'extension SimpleTray.
Celle-ci fonctionne parfaitement... au démarrage de ma session.
En revanche, après un passage en veille, à la sortie de cette
veille, je n'ai plus que les icônes "de base" (réseau, son, etc.).

Avez-vous une option qui fonctionne tout le temps ?


Bonsoir,

J'utilise

https://packages.debian.org/buster/stalonetray

Avec openbox

--
Benoit

Table de mixage virtuelle

[benoitlst]

Bonjour,

Je recherche une table de mixage virtuelle (pour mixer les fréquences 
sonores) mais pas un truc aussi sophistiqué, qu'Ardour ou Audacity, 
juste quelques curseurs virtuels de fréquence, comme ce que l'on trouve 
sur les chaîne HIFi.


Alsamixer permet de mixer les sorties, mais pas les fréquences.

Libre bien sûr et si possible en paquet debian (L'ordi que j'utilise 
pour écouter de la musique est en jessie).



Merci d'avance


--
Benoit

Re: Expression régulière

[Migrec]

Bonjour,

Merci. Effectivement, je suppose que c'est là pour détecter une absence 
de valeur, en tout cas une valeur non exploitable (des espaces, des 
retours chariots, etc.)


--
Migrec

Le 02/07/2019 à 12:11, Daniel Caillibaud a écrit :

Le 01/07/19 à 21h49, Migrec  a écrit :

Mais j'ai encore du mal à comprendre ce que l'expression cible.

Elle est très large, car elle cible toute chaîne contenant un caractère "non
espace" précédée d'autant de caractères qu'on veut (0 inclus) suivie
d'autant de caractères qu'on veut (idem).

Donc en fait la seule chose qu'elle ne match pas est une chaine ne
contenant aucun caractère "non espace" (ou tabulation ou …), soit une
chaîne vide ou ne contenant que des espaces|tabulations.

(.|\n)*[^\s](.|\n)*
^^ n'importe quel caractère (fin de ligne compris)
   ^ en 0 à N exemplaires
^ un caractère non espace
 ^^ n'importe quel caractère (fin de ligne compris)
   ^ en 0 à N exemplaires

Je vois pas trop dans quel cas ça peut être utile, mais je connais pas le
contexte.

Re: How to have password shown?

[David Wright]

On Wed 03 Jul 2019 at 18:34:28 (+0300), Reco wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 03:29:27PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> > Would be nice for any cracker if it could be possible to get access by 
> > shoulder surfing my fingerprint reader ;)

One hears gruesome stories about fingerprint security.

> Using a fingerprint instead of a password is a bad idea. Using a
> fingerprint instead of a username - that's OK.
> 
> You can change a password if it's leaked.
> You cannot change your fingerprint (legally, that is). And one leaves
> fingerprints on every surface one touches.

And on occasions it can be hard to come up with a good impression;
for example, after a week or two's rock climbing in the Cuillin of Skye,
the tips of your fingers are worn smooth by the gabbro.

But it does disappoint me that there aren't more options for how
characters are reflected (or not) when typing passwords; not
forgetting passphrases either. LUKS types asterisks under some
circumstances and nothing under others. I haven't managed to pin down
how that decision is made or which binary makes it.

You can make shoulder-surfing more difficult by overwriting each
character a fraction of a second after it's typed.

Cheers,
David.

Re: Accents

[Ernest Adrogué]

2019-07- 2, 17:07 (+0200); Jordi escriu:
> El problema es el seguent : Primer les lletres accentuades surten be,
> pero despres durant el dia es canvien a: `a `e `i `o `u ´a´e´i´o´u
> ¨a¨e¨i¨o¨u, no se que fer per poder localitzar el problema, ja que com
> dic, al principi va be, pero despres no se perque es canvia. Faig
> servir el cinnamon i, o sento, els controladors nvidia privatius.
> 
> A les pantalles F1, F2 ... els accents surten be, i al cinnamon amb
> diferents usuaris malament. Alguna ajuda?

Mira la sortida de "setxkbmap -query" o "localectl status" en el primer
login i si canvia quan surts i tornes a entrar.

Per anar bé, t'hauria de dir layout "es"

$ setxkbmap -query
rules:  evdev
model:  pc105
layout: es
variant:cat
options:ctrl:nocaps,compose:rctrl


Salut.

Re: Accents

[Jordi Vila]

Com podeu veure, ara estic en la primera sessió del dia i els accents
funcionen bé:

àèìòùáéíóú ä ë ï ö ü

No puc reiniciar l'ordinador cada vegada que faig un logout. Se que amb
KDE hi ha alguna línia a les configuracions que fan que el logout del KDE
sigui complet i no es quedi res penjat a la memòria. Ja m'ho miraré amb
calma.

Salutacions

Jordi

> A mi això em passa de tant en tant en un dels ordinadors que tinc, i
amb
> algunes aplicacions concretes. Ara no puc ser més precís perquè no ho
> tinc davant, he fet alguna actualització i no he verificat si encara
> passa. El més curiós és que si canviava el focus a una altra aplicació
i
> després tornava a la que tenia el problema, aleshores ja tornava a
> funcionar correctament.
>
> No he investigat més perquè el problema no és massa freqüent i amb el
> "workaround" aquest ja vaig tirant.
>
> Cordialment,
>
> Orestes.
>
> --
> Cordialment,
>
> Orestes Mas

Fwd: Re: Accents

[Jordi Vila]

- Start Forwarded Message -
Sent: Wed, 03 Jul 2019 20:44:52 +0200 (CEST)
From: "Jordi Vila"
To: "Orestes Mas"
Subject: Re: Accents

Com podeu veure, ara estic en la primera sessió del dia i els accents
funcionen bé:

àèìòùáéíóú ä ë ï ö ü

No puc reiniciar l'ordinador cada vegada que faig un logout. Se que amb
KDE hi ha alguna línia a les configuracions que fan que el logout del KDE
sigui complet i no es quedi res penjat a la memòria. Ja m'ho miraré amb
calma.

Salutacions

Jordi

> A mi això em passa de tant en tant en un dels ordinadors que tinc, i
amb
> algunes aplicacions concretes. Ara no puc ser més precís perquè no ho
> tinc davant, he fet alguna actualització i no he verificat si encara
> passa. El més curiós és que si canviava el focus a una altra aplicació
i
> després tornava a la que tenia el problema, aleshores ja tornava a
> funcionar correctament.
>
> No he investigat més perquè el problema no és massa freqüent i amb el
> "workaround" aquest ja vaig tirant.
>
> Cordialment,
>
> Orestes.
>
> --
> Cordialment,
>
> Orestes Mas


- End Forwarded Message -
Com podeu veure, ara estic en la primera sessió del dia i els accents funcionen bé:
 
àèìòùáéíóú ä ë ï ö ü
No puc reiniciar l'ordinador cada vegada que faig un logout. Se que amb KDE hi ha alguna línia a les configuracions que fan que el logout del KDE sigui complet i no es quedi res penjat a la memòria. Ja m'ho miraré amb calma.
 
Salutacions
 
Jordi
 
> A mi això em passa de tant en tant en un dels ordinadors que tinc, i amb > algunes aplicacions concretes. Ara no puc ser més precís perquè no ho > tinc davant, he fet alguna actualització i no he verificat si encara > passa. El més curiós és que si canviava el focus a una altra aplicació i > després tornava a la que tenia el problema, aleshores ja tornava a > funcionar correctament. >  > No he investigat més perquè el problema no és massa freqüent i amb el > "workaround" aquest ja vaig tirant. >  > Cordialment, >  > Orestes. >  > --  > Cordialment, >  > Orestes Mas

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Lucio Stringari Junior]

das últimas vezes que eu usei o IRC eu não obtive resposta alguma, até 
parece que quem está lá cnectado não está proximo do pc e nem volta no 
mesmo dia.


atualmente estou de Telegram mesmo, é onde as pessoas estão, e estou 
lendo o livro do Debian Handbook.   Noto que muitas questões seriam já 
respondidas se a pessoa tivesse lido esse livro, estou tendo uma ótima 
experiencia com a leitura.





On 03/07/2019 11:26, ndre wrote:

Mon 01 Jul 2019 às 16:36:39 (1562009799), l...@dutras.org enviou:

Le lun. 1 juil. 2019 à 05:46, Helio Loureiro  a écrit :


Felizmente telegram e similares mataram o uso de mailing lists.


Devo discordar, é uma catástrofe o desuso de protocolos abertos e
federados.  Ainda fosse XMPP…


IRC?

Tomando o canal debian-br como indicador, aparentemente ninguém tem
nenhum problema rodando o debian há meses.

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[Michael Stone]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:05:05PM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote:

- start by reinstall Debian using a 64bit system this time


If it had been done 10 years ago it wouldn't need to be done now. :) If 
you just don't want to bother that's fine, but not great advice for 
anyone starting out.



In my experience VMs running in a 32bit Debian system on a Core
2 processor (i.e. one of the first amd64-compatible CPU from Intel)
offer adequate performance.  I probably wouldn't use that for a server
under any real load, but VMs can be useful in all kinds of situations.


VMs running on a core 2 definitely have unfixable security issues and 
aren't great performers. That certainly limits the use cases.



It's certainly possible to run software-only virtualization on an
ancient CPU, but at that point (since it would clearly just be to
scratch an itch, not for any practical reason) why ask for opinions
instead of just playing around if playing around is the only goal?


I get the impression that by "if playing around is the only goal" you
mean something like "if it's not within the context of a commercial
deployment".  Sometimes the need is very real (not just for playing
around) but doesn't have anything to do with maximizing hardware
utilization in a datacenter.


Since faster and more efficient hardware can literally be found for free 
these days, running on something that old has a strong component of 
personal choice. Which is fine, but not a strong argument. Put a 
different way, it's fine if that's what you want to do, but terrible 
advice for others. 

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[Stefan Monnier]

> Because the hardware features to permit efficient virtualization weren't
> available on i386-only CPUs. (And there's really no good reason to run a VM
> host [vs guest] in i386 mode if it can run in amd64 mode.)

By "there's really no good ..." I think you mean "I can't think of any
good ...".

For reference, here's the reason why I did it last time: I needed to
update the small Debian install I have on my USB rescue key.  I had
a few choices:
- boot inside a qemu on my 32bit Debian system.
- reboot my system into the rescue key (hence losing the current state
  of my session and all that stuff and being unable to use my machine
  for anything else while that rescue system was updating itself).
- do the same but hoping that hibernate+resume will work, so while
  I still can't use the machine during the upgrade, at least maybe
  I didn't lose all my session's state (tho resume often fails, in my
  experience).
- start by reinstall Debian using a 64bit system this time, just on the
  hunch that maybe it'll be marginally faster at running the upgrade
  within the VM (tho this is normally limited mostly by the USB key
  write speed).

Now, which of those choices sounds more silly to you?

In my experience VMs running in a 32bit Debian system on a Core
2 processor (i.e. one of the first amd64-compatible CPU from Intel)
offer adequate performance.  I probably wouldn't use that for a server
under any real load, but VMs can be useful in all kinds of situations.

> It's certainly possible to run software-only virtualization on an
> ancient CPU, but at that point (since it would clearly just be to
> scratch an itch, not for any practical reason) why ask for opinions
> instead of just playing around if playing around is the only goal?

I get the impression that by "if playing around is the only goal" you
mean something like "if it's not within the context of a commercial
deployment".  Sometimes the need is very real (not just for playing
around) but doesn't have anything to do with maximizing hardware
utilization in a datacenter.


Stefan

Re: Re : Re : Passer de Debian Stretch 32 bits à 64 bits

[Sébastien NOBILI]

Le mercredi 03 juillet 2019 à 19:12, Eric Degenetais a écrit :
> Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 18:54,  a écrit :
> > Encore une question : j’ai trois paquets cassés (mariadb).
> > Le passage à amd64 mettra à jour les trois paquets en version amd64 cassés
> > ?
> >
> Je ne peux pas prouver que la réparation ne se fera pas, mais si j'étais
> dans ce cas j'essaierais de réparer avant la migration pour ne pas démarrer
> un processus déjà touchy sur des bases malsaines.

Tout à fait d’accord. Pendant le processus, tu vas souvent amener ton frontal
APT (apt-get, aptitude) à renoncer car trop de paquets sont cassés. Mets-toi
dans la meilleure situation possible : système sain.

Sébastien

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[Michael Stone]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 01:20:06PM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote:

think in this day and age it is a bit silly to try and run a VM on a
32-bit host


Why?  Often the question is not "which hardware should I pick to run
this VM" but "what kinds of technology should I use to run this software
on this hardware".  When "this hardware" is 32bit, and a VM is needed
between the two, then that's that.


Because the hardware features to permit efficient virtualization weren't 
available on i386-only CPUs. (And there's really no good reason to run a 
VM host [vs guest] in i386 mode if it can run in amd64 mode.)



That said I do not believe that any existing i386 32-bit-only hardware
that is still floating around even supports the virtual machine
extensions necessary to run a true VM host.


I haven't use qemu on my 32bit only i686 machines recently, but I see no
reason why it wouldn't work any more.


It's certainly possible to run software-only virtualization on an 
ancient CPU, but at that point (since it would clearly just be to
scratch an itch, not for any practical reason) why ask for opinions 
instead of just playing around if playing around is the only goal?

Re: How to have password shown?

[Stefan Monnier]

> For the use his old father might do with a computer I think that cheap
> board could do.

Cheap or not, new hardware implies more garbage to dispose of, (a lot)
more carbon emissions to produce the new hardware, ...

BTW, for all I know, the OP might already be running Raspbian on a PI ;-)


Stefan

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[G. Felipe Pereira da Silva]

Concordo contigo Francisco.
Uma coisa boa que aprendi na iniciação cientifica foi isso.
Primeiro: Google, comunidades, listas e depois de esgotadas as
possibilidades perguntar aos universitários :)
É até meio estranho para um usuário debian essa falta de autonomia.

Em qua, 3 de jul de 2019 às 11:59, Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA, Leandro <
l...@dutras.org> escreveu:

> Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 à 11:27, ndre  a écrit :
> >
> > Mon 01 Jul 2019 às 16:36:39 (1562009799), l...@dutras.org enviou:
> > >
> > > Devo discordar, é uma catástrofe o desuso de protocolos abertos e
> > > federados.  Ainda fosse XMPP…
> >
> > IRC?
> >
> > Tomando o canal debian-br como indicador, aparentemente ninguém tem
> > nenhum problema rodando o debian há meses.
>
> Até gosto do IRC, mas agora é nicho e não vejo possibilidade dele
> substituir o XMPP.
>
>
> --
> skype:leandro.gfc.dutra?chat  Yahoo!: ymsgr:sendIM?lgcdutra
> +55 (61) 3546 7191  gTalk: xmpp:leand...@jabber.org
> +55 (61) 9302 2691ICQ/AIM: aim:GoIM?screenname=61287803
> BRAZIL GMT−3  MSN: msnim:chat?contact=lean...@dutra.fastmail.fm
>
>

-- 
Cordialmente,

*Gleidson Felipe Pereira da Silva*

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[Stefan Monnier]

> I have an innate desire to help people, but more importantly I give
> people the benefit of the doubt. Besides I self-taught myself a few
> things along the way, so I consider it a win.

Yes, please (and please remind me of that as well when I fail to follow
it ;-)

>> Now, which one of you is going to tell him that running virtual
>> machines is a bit of a stretch on a 32-bit host?

Huh?  The only systems on which I have ever run virtual machines were
all 32bit Debian systems.  Now admittedly, I tend to count LXC as a VM,
so maybe this is imprecise, but even w.r.t actual VMs they've all
been 32bit.

> think in this day and age it is a bit silly to try and run a VM on a
> 32-bit host

Why?  Often the question is not "which hardware should I pick to run
this VM" but "what kinds of technology should I use to run this software
on this hardware".  When "this hardware" is 32bit, and a VM is needed
between the two, then that's that.

What might be silly is to think that this choice can't be the best one.

> (or for that matter, run a 32-bit host at all if your
> hardware supports 64-bit,

That's what I do on half of my machines, yes (the other half is a mix
of 32bit-only and 64bit-only systems).

> That said I do not believe that any existing i386 32-bit-only hardware
> that is still floating around even supports the virtual machine
> extensions necessary to run a true VM host.

I haven't use qemu on my 32bit only i686 machines recently, but I see no
reason why it wouldn't work any more.

> Containers like Docker?  Sure, those should still work,

Of course they do.  Just like `chroot` (of which they're basically an
extension) they require no special hardware support of any kind.


Stefan

RE: Invertir en el Personal: Prestaciones, Compensaciones, Bonos, Beneficios

[Lic . Jessica Cadena]

Definitivamente hay que invertir en retribuciones fijas, variables, mixtas…

Cómo Implementar un ATRACTIVO PLAN DE
COMPENSACIONES y BENEFICIOS 4.0

Monterrey, N.L. – 22 de Julio 2019
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Para que una Empresa genere compromiso en sus empleados y atraiga a nuevo 
talento, es importante tener un ATRACTIVO PLAN de Compensaciones y Beneficios 
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Asiste a este Programa de Especialización y empieza a desarrollar una 
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Re: Re : Re : Passer de Debian Stretch 32 bits à 64 bits

[Eric Degenetais]

Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 18:54,  a écrit :

> Le 03/07/2019 12:00:49, Sébastien NOBILI a écrit :
>
> > Oui, en effet. J’ai mal lu, répondu trop vite et donc à côté.
> > Avec le multiarch activé, la libc i386 installée, les dépendances i386
> > satisfaites, ça fonctionnera (sur un système amd64).
>
> Super.
> Encore une question : j’ai trois paquets cassés (mariadb).
> Le passage à amd64 mettra à jour les trois paquets en version amd64 cassés
> ?
>
Je ne peux pas prouver que la réparation ne se fera pas, mais si j'étais
dans ce cas j'essaierais de réparer avant la migration pour ne pas démarrer
un processus déjà touchy sur des bases malsaines.

>
> nicolas patrois : pts noir asocial
> --
> RÉALISME
>
> M : Qu'est-ce qu'il nous faudrait pour qu'on nous considère comme des
> humains ? Un cerveau plus gros ?
> P : Non... Une carte bleue suffirait...
>

Éric Dégenètais

>
>
>
>

Re : Re : Passer de Debian Stretch 32 bits à 64 bits

[nicolas . patrois]

Le 03/07/2019 12:00:49, Sébastien NOBILI a écrit :

> Oui, en effet. J’ai mal lu, répondu trop vite et donc à côté.
> Avec le multiarch activé, la libc i386 installée, les dépendances i386
> satisfaites, ça fonctionnera (sur un système amd64).

Super.
Encore une question : j’ai trois paquets cassés (mariadb).
Le passage à amd64 mettra à jour les trois paquets en version amd64 cassés ?

nicolas patrois : pts noir asocial
-- 
RÉALISME

M : Qu'est-ce qu'il nous faudrait pour qu'on nous considère comme des humains ? 
Un cerveau plus gros ?
P : Non... Une carte bleue suffirait...

Re: How to have password shown?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 06:34:28PM +0300, Reco wrote:
>   Hi.
> 
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 03:29:27PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> > Would be nice for any cracker if it could be possible to get access by 
> > shoulder surfing my fingerprint reader ;)
> 
> Using a fingerprint instead of a password is a bad idea. Using a
> fingerprint instead of a username - that's OK.
> 
> You can change a password if it's leaked.
> You cannot change your fingerprint (legally, that is). And one leaves
> fingerprints on every surface one touches.

Good point :-)

This [1] (alas, in German) describes how the CCC lifted (and published)
the fingerprint of Wolfgang Schäuble [2], at that time German minister
of the Interior, a pretty sharp advocate of authoritarian security.

Now that was 2008: they had to get hold of a glass he had in his hands.
These days, reportedly, a good digital camera is enough for that.

Cheers

[1] 
https://www.heise.de/security/meldung/CCC-publiziert-die-Fingerabdruecke-von-Wolfgang-Schaeuble-Update-193732.html
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfgang_Sch%C3%A4uble

-- tomas "never use biometric data as a strong identifier"


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Re: [OT] send all email from certain From: addresses into a spam

[andreimpopescu]

On Mi, 03 iul 19, 11:53:11, Michael Stone wrote:
> 
> maildrop is definitely recommended these days (especially for anyone still
> running procmail).

imapfilter works fine if you use IMAP and your server has poor or no 
filtering (exposed to users).

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser


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Re: [OT] send all email from certain From: addresses into a spam

[Michael Stone]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 06:44:42PM +0300, Reco wrote:

Hi.

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:39:22AM -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 06:30:32PM +0300, Reco wrote:
> I'm merely curious why you have to write a new program for this.
> I mean, there are maildrop and procmail for client-side and sieve for
> the server-side already.

procmail might have worked, but it's more of a pain to learn procmail
than it is to write my own filter.  I also get more flexibility this way.

The write-up of my approach is at
.


Maildrop does exactly this. For instance,

^From:.*User Name/

Transforms to this snippet of .mailfilter:

if ( /^From:.*User Name/:h )
to /dev/null

Works with exim, postfix and probably qmail OOB.


maildrop is definitely recommended these days (especially for anyone 
still running procmail). 

Re: [OT] send all email from certain From: addresses into a spam

[Reco]

Hi.

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:39:22AM -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 06:30:32PM +0300, Reco wrote:
> > I'm merely curious why you have to write a new program for this.
> > I mean, there are maildrop and procmail for client-side and sieve for
> > the server-side already.
> 
> procmail might have worked, but it's more of a pain to learn procmail
> than it is to write my own filter.  I also get more flexibility this way.
> 
> The write-up of my approach is at
> .

Maildrop does exactly this. For instance, 

^From:.*User Name/

Transforms to this snippet of .mailfilter:

if ( /^From:.*User Name/:h )
to /dev/null

Works with exim, postfix and probably qmail OOB.

Reco

Re: [OT] send all email from certain From: addresses into a spam

[Greg Wooledge]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 06:30:32PM +0300, Reco wrote:
> I'm merely curious why you have to write a new program for this.
> I mean, there are maildrop and procmail for client-side and sieve for
> the server-side already.

procmail might have worked, but it's more of a pain to learn procmail
than it is to write my own filter.  I also get more flexibility this way.

The write-up of my approach is at
.

Re: How to have password shown?

[Reco]

Hi.

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 03:29:27PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> Would be nice for any cracker if it could be possible to get access by 
> shoulder surfing my fingerprint reader ;)

Using a fingerprint instead of a password is a bad idea. Using a
fingerprint instead of a username - that's OK.

You can change a password if it's leaked.
You cannot change your fingerprint (legally, that is). And one leaves
fingerprints on every surface one touches.

Reco

[OT] send all email from certain From: addresses into a spam

[Reco]

folder (was: Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)
Reply-To: 
In-Reply-To: <20190703123416.gw2...@eeg.ccf.org>

Hi.

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 08:34:16AM -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 05:01:11AM +0200, Matthew Crews wrote:
> > I have no idea what an Owlett thread is,
> 
> It's what you're seeing right now.
> 
> It's also the reason I end up writing a filtering program to send all
> email from certain From: addresses into a spam folder.

I'm merely curious why you have to write a new program for this.
I mean, there are maildrop and procmail for client-side and sieve for
the server-side already.

Reco

Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

 writes:

> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 01:34:00PM +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
>> Jonas Smedegaard  writes:
>> 
>> > Quoting Rodolfo Medina (2019-07-03 14:42:13)
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks indeed...  He will do...  making errors in typing a blind password
>> and re-typing it again and again till it's all right...  ;-)
>
> You can set the paasword to empty:
>
>   sudo passwd -d 
>
> Then, he'd just have to enter his user name and is logged in
> without any password typing.


Thanks, if he should find the blind password really difficult, that's what I'll
do...

Rodolfo

Re: How to have password shown?

[Greg Wooledge]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 05:19:09PM +0200, to...@tuxteam.de wrote:
> You mean, password login via ssh is automatically disabled for
> a passwordless user?
> 
> Smart move, that :)

That's correct.  A passwordless account cannot login via ssh using
password authentication.  You just get a failure every time you try.

Re: How to have password shown?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 05:13:44PM +0200, Nicolas George wrote:
> to...@tuxteam.de (12019-07-03):
> > That said, you might want to disable ssh logins for that user
> 
> They are not stupid: that is already the default.

You mean, password login via ssh is automatically disabled for
a passwordless user?

Smart move, that :)

Thanks
-- tomás


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Nicolas George]

to...@tuxteam.de (12019-07-03):
> That said, you might want to disable ssh logins for that user

They are not stupid: that is already the default.

Regards,

-- 
  Nicolas George


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Re: How to have password shown?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 01:34:00PM +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> Jonas Smedegaard  writes:
> 
> > Quoting Rodolfo Medina (2019-07-03 14:42:13)
> >> 
> >> 
> >> Thanks...  of course it is...  absolutely.  I wanted to have him accustomed
> >> with using a password...  only, he still does many errors at keyboard...
> >
> > I think I understand the scope of this challenge.
> >
> > Would it be sensible for your case to a) use a 3-4 character password 
> > coupled with a PAM plugin that checks for the presence of a USB key 
> > containing some unique file?
> >
> > That would keep the notion of typing a password for logging in, while 
> > being simpler to type, sidestepping the lower security by a secondary 
> > check which (at leat for some) would not be a too weird addition).
> 
> 
> Thanks indeed...  He will do...  making errors in typing a blind password and
> re-typing it again and again till it's all right...  ;-)

You can set the paasword to empty:

  sudo passwd -d 

Then, he'd just have to enter his user name and is logged in
without any password typing.

That said, you might want to disable ssh logins for that user
(otherwise, anyone could log in remotely with ease -- use another
user to log in remotely, if you need, or even better, use a key
pair). Likewise, it might be advisable to disable sudo for this
account. See [1], [2]

Cheers

[1] 
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/11700690/how-do-i-completely-remove-root-password
[2] 
https://askubuntu.com/questions/281074/can-i-set-my-user-account-to-have-no-password

-- t


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Renato Gallo  writes:

> http://www.eldy.eu/software/download/
>
> Renato Gallo 


Well, thanks, but...  no, I just want him to use it the same way I do...  in
the clever Linux and Debian Linux manner that we all know and appreciate..
Making things too easy is not always a good idea...

Cheers,

Rodolfo

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA , Leandro]

Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 à 11:27, ndre  a écrit :
>
> Mon 01 Jul 2019 às 16:36:39 (1562009799), l...@dutras.org enviou:
> >
> > Devo discordar, é uma catástrofe o desuso de protocolos abertos e
> > federados.  Ainda fosse XMPP…
>
> IRC?
>
> Tomando o canal debian-br como indicador, aparentemente ninguém tem
> nenhum problema rodando o debian há meses.

Até gosto do IRC, mas agora é nicho e não vejo possibilidade dele
substituir o XMPP.


-- 
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+55 (61) 9302 2691ICQ/AIM: aim:GoIM?screenname=61287803
BRAZIL GMT−3  MSN: msnim:chat?contact=lean...@dutra.fastmail.fm

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

http://www.eldy.eu/software/download/

Renato Gallo 


- Original Message -
From: andreimpope...@gmail.com
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:33:44 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

On Mi, 03 iul 19, 14:17:34, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> 
> Thanks for your suggestion...  No, it's very simple and familiar with him...

A keyboard with a different layout (e.g. alphabetic) might also help 
with the password.

> it's just that he's at his really first experiences with a computer machine 
> and
> a computer keyboard...  He passes most of his time in front of TV and maybe
> using a computer may help him and be interesting for him...

This usually needs some "killer app".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killer_application

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

Re: ncurses?

[dickey]

On Tuesday, July 2, 2019 at 8:30:04 PM UTC-4, Jude DaShiell wrote:
> Try running script if the system is already installed then run each of
> the problem commands then type exit.  You'll get a file called
> typescript which is ansi text that probably will get through the spam
> filters if you include it in the body of your message and do not attach
> it.  If the ansi can be cleaned out of typescript the reading will be
> cleaner and the file a little shorter.
> 
> On Tue, 2 Jul 2019, ghe wrote:
...
> > I asked for help with this a few days ago and attached a screenshot to
> > show what my problem is. There've been no replies -- I guess graphics
> > are caught by a spam filter somewhere.
> >
> > The problem is that, on sbox, alsamixer and aptitude are badly displayed
> > -- alsamixer so bad that it's not usable. The vertical lines in
> > alsamixer are broken into pieces and the pieces are offset a quarter of
> > an inch or so. The horizontals aren't broken, but their positions are
> > offset like the vertical pieces. Some of them.
...

Actually stripping the "ansi" out of the "typescript" file makes it hard to see 
what's going on (I don't see OP's screenshot).  Whether and how ncurses does 
line-drawing depends on the TERM variable and the locale variables -- and how 
well it works depends on the actual terminal (program...).

Lynx doesn't do much with line-drawing, except in menus (such as in the Options 
screen).

If you have a "typescript", sending that as an attachment for discussion on the 
bug-ncurses mailing list will get more response than to debian-user.

Re: How to have password shown?

[andreimpopescu]

On Mi, 03 iul 19, 14:17:34, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> 
> Thanks for your suggestion...  No, it's very simple and familiar with him...

A keyboard with a different layout (e.g. alphabetic) might also help 
with the password.

> it's just that he's at his really first experiences with a computer machine 
> and
> a computer keyboard...  He passes most of his time in front of TV and maybe
> using a computer may help him and be interesting for him...

This usually needs some "killer app".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killer_application

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser


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Re: Lançamento da Buster

[ndre]

Mon 01 Jul 2019 às 16:36:39 (1562009799), l...@dutras.org enviou:
> Le lun. 1 juil. 2019 à 05:46, Helio Loureiro  a écrit :
> >
> > Felizmente telegram e similares mataram o uso de mailing lists.
> 
> Devo discordar, é uma catástrofe o desuso de protocolos abertos e
> federados.  Ainda fosse XMPP…

IRC?

Tomando o canal debian-br como indicador, aparentemente ninguém tem
nenhum problema rodando o debian há meses.


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Re: [Off-topic] - Raspeberry PI

[Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA]

Le 3 juillet 2019 11:20:54 GMT-03:00, ndre  a écrit :
>Tue 02 Jul 2019 às 12:31:22 (1562081482), vitorhug...@hotmail.com
>enviou:
>> O Debian roda liso sobre o Raspeberry PI?
>
>TL;DR: Não.
>
>Ver "Raspberry Pi issues" no link abaixo:
>
>https://wiki.debian.org/RaspberryPi

Por isso existe o Raspian
-- 
Envoyé de mon appareil Android avec Courriel K-9 Mail. Veuillez excuser ma 
brièveté.

Re: [Off-topic] - Raspeberry PI

[ndre]

Tue 02 Jul 2019 às 12:31:22 (1562081482), vitorhug...@hotmail.com enviou:
> O Debian roda liso sobre o Raspeberry PI?

TL;DR: Não.

Ver "Raspberry Pi issues" no link abaixo:

https://wiki.debian.org/RaspberryPi


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Brian  writes:

> On Wed 03 Jul 2019 at 13:34:00 +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
>
>> 
>> Thanks indeed...  He will do...  making errors in typing a blind password
>> and re-typing it again and again till it's all right...  ;-)
>
> Most people mistype at some time; have you considered why your father
> might be doing it? Logins with convoluted or complex passwords do not
> help, so consider 12345678 or the date of his birthday. I'm tempted to
> say that either would reduce mishaps.


Thanks for your suggestion...  No, it's very simple and familiar with him...
it's just that he's at his really first experiences with a computer machine and
a computer keyboard...  He passes most of his time in front of TV and maybe
using a computer may help him and be interesting for him...

Rodolfo

Re: How to have password shown?

[Brian]

On Wed 03 Jul 2019 at 13:34:00 +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:

> Jonas Smedegaard  writes:
> 
> > Quoting Rodolfo Medina (2019-07-03 14:42:13)
> >> 
> >> 
> >> Thanks...  of course it is...  absolutely.  I wanted to have him accustomed
> >> with using a password...  only, he still does many errors at keyboard...
> >
> > I think I understand the scope of this challenge.
> >
> > Would it be sensible for your case to a) use a 3-4 character password 
> > coupled with a PAM plugin that checks for the presence of a USB key 
> > containing some unique file?
> >
> > That would keep the notion of typing a password for logging in, while 
> > being simpler to type, sidestepping the lower security by a secondary 
> > check which (at leat for some) would not be a too weird addition).
> 
> 
> Thanks indeed...  He will do...  making errors in typing a blind password and
> re-typing it again and again till it's all right...  ;-)

Most people mistype at some time; have you considered why your father
might be doing it? Logins with convoluted or complex passwords do not
help, so consider 12345678 or the date of his birthday. I'm tempted to
say that either would reduce mishaps.

-- 
Brian.

Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Jonas Smedegaard  writes:

> Quoting Rodolfo Medina (2019-07-03 14:42:13)
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks...  of course it is...  absolutely.  I wanted to have him accustomed
>> with using a password...  only, he still does many errors at keyboard...
>
> I think I understand the scope of this challenge.
>
> Would it be sensible for your case to a) use a 3-4 character password 
> coupled with a PAM plugin that checks for the presence of a USB key 
> containing some unique file?
>
> That would keep the notion of typing a password for logging in, while 
> being simpler to type, sidestepping the lower security by a secondary 
> check which (at leat for some) would not be a too weird addition).


Thanks indeed...  He will do...  making errors in typing a blind password and
re-typing it again and again till it's all right...  ;-)

Rodolfo

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

Would be nice for any cracker if it could be possible to get access by shoulder 
surfing my fingerprint reader ;)

Renato Gallo 


- Original Message -
From: "Carl Fink" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 3:10:18 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:17:45PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> If you are living alone in a bunker under an alien planet surface ok 
> "shoulder surfing is not an issue"

If someone is shoulder-surfing, and really wants the password, she will just
watch your fingers, Renato. Slightly harder but not hard, especially with
video cameras the size of a grape now being easily available.
-- 
Carl Fink   nitpick...@nitpicking.com 

Read John Grant's book, Corrupted Science: http://a.co/9UsUoGu 
Dedicated to ... Carl Fink!

Re: How to have password shown?

[Jonas Smedegaard]

Quoting Rodolfo Medina (2019-07-03 14:42:13)
> Håkon Alstadheim  writes:
> 
> > Den 03.07.2019 13:24, skrev Rodolfo Medina:
> >> Hi all...
> >>
> >> Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into 
> >> Debian in tty console, or also within X system when changing to 
> >> root?  It is for my old father...  it'd be easier for him to see 
> >> what he's typing.  In internet I found some procedures to have 
> >> asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear text as well?  
> >> Maybe it isn't as I understand...
> >
> > If the machine is physically secure, I'd find out about automatic 
> > login (aka autologin) to X (check the config of your display 
> > manager, you might conceivably want to use a different 
> > displaymanager) .
> >
> > For root access, check out man sudoers, the EXAMPLES section will 
> > get you started, find out about NOPASSWD.
> >
> > If the machine is NOT physically secure, think long and hard about 
> > what you will do.
> 
> 
> Thanks...  of course it is...  absolutely.  I wanted to have him accustomed
> with using a password...  only, he still does many errors at keyboard...

I think I understand the scope of this challenge.

Would it be sensible for your case to a) use a 3-4 character password 
coupled with a PAM plugin that checks for the presence of a USB key 
containing some unique file?

That would keep the notion of typing a password for logging in, while 
being simpler to type, sidestepping the lower security by a secondary 
check which (at leat for some) would not be a too weird addition).


 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Carl Fink]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:17:45PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> If you are living alone in a bunker under an alien planet surface ok 
> "shoulder surfing is not an issue"

If someone is shoulder-surfing, and really wants the password, she will just
watch your fingers, Renato. Slightly harder but not hard, especially with
video cameras the size of a grape now being easily available.
-- 
Carl Fink   nitpick...@nitpicking.com 

Read John Grant's book, Corrupted Science: http://a.co/9UsUoGu 
Dedicated to ... Carl Fink!

Re: How to have password shown?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:42:46PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> Raspberry pi's Raspbian has X without password by default.

But that's... insecure! Bh :^)

Really: replacing clear-text password in a console with autologin
for X. Sheesh.

Now more seriously:

 - the OP has explicitly asked for console
 - you can configure autologin for X on any GNU/Linux
   based installation (how do you think Raspbian accomplishes
   that?) -- the OP might do that on his father's box, if
   that fulfills his needs.
 - the OP has been now told umpteen times that this is baaad.
   It's ok now, is it? ;-)

Authoritarian security is just security theater.

Cheers
-- t


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Nicolas George]

Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
> You forgot the "probably sharing" part of the message.
> You forgot that Rasbian is Debian for Raspberry pi + Desktop autologin by 
> default (without the research and config part).
> You forgot that Raspberry is really cheap.

I forgot none of this things. You obviously understood properly none of
my messages. Too bad for you. Have a good life.

-- 
  Nicolas George


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

Fingerprints are a good option

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: "Jonas Smedegaard" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 3:00:04 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

Quoting to...@tuxteam.de (2019-07-03 14:12:22)
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:24:54AM +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> > Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into 
> > Debian in tty console, or also within X system when changing to 
> > root?  It is for my old father...  it'd be easier for him to see 
> > what he's typing.  In internet I found some procedures to have 
> > asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear text as well?  
> > Maybe it isn't as I understand...
> 
> I think /bin/login isn't set up to allow that (at least that's what a 
> cursory reading of its man page tells me). I fear the only way for you 
> would be to modify its source and recompile...

I am aware that I am not really addressing the original poster's 
question, but possibly helpful anyway:

I can suggest to consider options where typing a password is replaced by 
presence of something physically, using packages like these:

libpam-biometric / libpam-fprintd - fingerprint
libpam-blue - bluetooth device
libpam-p11 / libpam-pkcs11 / libpam-poldi - smartcard
libpam-ssh-agent-auth - user-to-root access
libpam-yubico / libpam-u2f - hardware dongle
libpam-script - custom routine

I am curious which solutions you end up with for your father, as I am 
working on streamined¹ setup of similar use cases.

I would also appreciate constructive² opinions and feedback from anyone 
experienced with these various ways of sidestepping password-based 
system login.


 - Jonas

¹ See https://box.redpill.dk/ if curious

² Posts blindly assuming that all Debian must be treated as a fortress 
will be silently deleted

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

You forgot the "probably sharing" part of the message.
You forgot that Rasbian is Debian for Raspberry pi + Desktop autologin by 
default (without the research and config part).
You forgot that Raspberry is really cheap.

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: "Nicolas George" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:56:19 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
> For the use his old father might do with a computer I think that cheap board 
> could do.

And what is he supposed to do with the computer he already has for that
purpose? Throw it away?

> Plus can be customized for his father use like a tailored tuxedo

You realize that Debian can be customized, right?

Regards,

-- 
  Nicolas George

Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Nicolas George  writes:

> Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
>> For the use his old father might do with a computer I think that cheap board
>> could do.
>
> And what is he supposed to do with the computer he already has for that
> purpose? Throw it away?
>
>> Plus can be customized for his father use like a tailored tuxedo
>
> You realize that Debian can be customized, right?
>
> Regards,


:-) :-)

Re: How to have password shown?

[Jonas Smedegaard]

Quoting to...@tuxteam.de (2019-07-03 14:12:22)
> On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:24:54AM +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> > Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into 
> > Debian in tty console, or also within X system when changing to 
> > root?  It is for my old father...  it'd be easier for him to see 
> > what he's typing.  In internet I found some procedures to have 
> > asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear text as well?  
> > Maybe it isn't as I understand...
> 
> I think /bin/login isn't set up to allow that (at least that's what a 
> cursory reading of its man page tells me). I fear the only way for you 
> would be to modify its source and recompile...

I am aware that I am not really addressing the original poster's 
question, but possibly helpful anyway:

I can suggest to consider options where typing a password is replaced by 
presence of something physically, using packages like these:

libpam-biometric / libpam-fprintd - fingerprint
libpam-blue - bluetooth device
libpam-p11 / libpam-pkcs11 / libpam-poldi - smartcard
libpam-ssh-agent-auth - user-to-root access
libpam-yubico / libpam-u2f - hardware dongle
libpam-script - custom routine

I am curious which solutions you end up with for your father, as I am 
working on streamined¹ setup of similar use cases.

I would also appreciate constructive² opinions and feedback from anyone 
experienced with these various ways of sidestepping password-based 
system login.


 - Jonas

¹ See https://box.redpill.dk/ if curious

² Posts blindly assuming that all Debian must be treated as a fortress 
will be silently deleted

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private


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Re: How to have password shown?

[Nicolas George]

Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
> For the use his old father might do with a computer I think that cheap board 
> could do.

And what is he supposed to do with the computer he already has for that
purpose? Throw it away?

> Plus can be customized for his father use like a tailored tuxedo

You realize that Debian can be customized, right?

Regards,

-- 
  Nicolas George


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Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Francisco M Neto]

100% de acordo. Aqui pelo menos as conversas são mais "civilizadas", o pessoal
toma um mínimo de cuidado com a língua portuguesa e em geral o pessoal até
lembra de usar o ponto de interrogação. 

No Telegram já teve umas vezes que eu não sabia se o sujeito estava fazendo uma
pergunta ou afirmando alguma coisa.

E como o Telegram é mais acessível muita gente trata ele como "helpdesk", do
tipo "responde aí". E tá na cara que 90% das perguntas vêm de gente que não se
deu ao trabalho de jogar no google...

--Francisco

On Wed, 2019-07-03 at 08:43 -0300, Qobi Ben Nun wrote:
> Primeiro, que nem sempre as respostas ficam embaixo das perguntas e depois o
> que tem de gente fazendo a mesma pergunta quase que o tempo todo sem nem se
> dar ao trabalho de buscar no histórico grupos é de se estressar. Tudo bem que
> ao fazer isso, vai gerar grande confusão também porque se escreve muito mal,
> de forma fragmentada, sem fornecer informação que ajude a resolver as dúvidas.
> Estou chegando a conclusão de que não é a ferramenta usada. Seja um tipo ou
> outro, tem quem faça bobagem e subutilizam a ferramenta.
> 
> 
> 
> Em 2 de julho de 2019 09:23:14 BRT, Gilberto F da Silva <2458...@gmail.com>
> escreveu:
> > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> > Hash: SHA1
> > 
> > On Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 11:08:32PM -0300, G. Felipe Pereira da Silva
> > wrote:
> > > Boa noite,
> > > 
> > > Estou no grupo do debian Brasil no telegram.
> > > Tem-se como vantagem a praticidade/agilidade
> > > Contudo, não é organizado  como uma lista e acredito que o
> > conhecimento fique
> > > restrito lá.
> > 
> >  Pelo menos, lá as respostas ficam embaixo das perguntas.
> > 
> > - -- 
> > 
> > Stela dato:2.458.667,015  Loka tempo:2019-07-02 09:21:54 Mardo
> > - -==-
> > A filosofia é composta de respostas incompreensíveis para questões 
> > insolúveis.
> >-- Henry B. Adams, historiador americano
> > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
> > Comment: +-+
> > Comment: !   Gilberto F da Silva - ICQ 136.782.571 !
> > Comment: +-+
> > 
> > iF0EARECAB0WIQR6BybJIKBLy3+8xXcnG6Ba0yEbDgUCXRtMrwAKCRAnG6Ba0yEb
> > DojnAJwO85CyXIBq0DvoDvRm6ua/Gpc80QCfULckZm7FxDPHJ7Hj9d8taTtyOTw=
> > =g7Dr
> > -END PGP SIGNATURE-
-- 
[]'s,

Francisco M Neto

GPG: 4096R/D692FBF0


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

For the use his old father might do with a computer I think that cheap board 
could do.
Plus, it's used by babies can be used by everyone.
Plus, it's ready out of the box for the use it's meant.
Plus can be customized for his father use like a tailored tuxedo (better in 
some ways than a computer they are probably sharing).

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: "Nicolas George" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:44:44 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
> Raspberry pi's Raspbian has X without password by default.
> The new board raspberry 4 is out with 4 gigs and a better cpu (I have 
> preordered it for around 60 € from melopero shop).
> Might be a nice solution for the old father.

Are you really suggesting buying complete new hardware to solve a minor
software configuration issue?

Regards,

-- 
  Nicolas George

Re: How to have password shown?

[Nicolas George]

Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
> Raspberry pi's Raspbian has X without password by default.
> The new board raspberry 4 is out with 4 gigs and a better cpu (I have 
> preordered it for around 60 € from melopero shop).
> Might be a nice solution for the old father.

Are you really suggesting buying complete new hardware to solve a minor
software configuration issue?

Regards,

-- 
  Nicolas George


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

Raspberry pi's Raspbian has X without password by default.
The new board raspberry 4 is out with 4 gigs and a better cpu (I have 
preordered it for around 60 € from melopero shop).
Might be a nice solution for the old father.

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: "Håkon Alstadheim" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:24:42 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

Den 03.07.2019 13:24, skrev Rodolfo Medina:
> Hi all...
>
> Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian in
> tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my old
> father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet I 
> found
> some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear
> text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...

If the machine is physically secure, I'd find out about automatic login 
(aka autologin) to X (check the config of your display manager, you 
might conceivably want to use a different displaymanager) .

For root access, check out man sudoers, the EXAMPLES section will get 
you started, find out about NOPASSWD.

If the machine is NOT physically secure, think long and hard about what 
you will do.

Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Håkon Alstadheim  writes:

> Den 03.07.2019 13:24, skrev Rodolfo Medina:
>> Hi all...
>>
>> Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian
>> in tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my
>> old father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet
>> I found some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to
>> have a clear text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...
>
> If the machine is physically secure, I'd find out about automatic login (aka
> autologin) to X (check the config of your display manager, you might
> conceivably want to use a different displaymanager) .
>
> For root access, check out man sudoers, the EXAMPLES section will get you
> started, find out about NOPASSWD.
>
> If the machine is NOT physically secure, think long and hard about what you
> will do.


Thanks...  of course it is...  absolutely.  I wanted to have him accustomed
with using a password...  only, he still does many errors at keyboard...

Cheers,

Rodolfo

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

You did but nevertheless to give such an option would be a bad idea 
(someone could be crazy enough to be tempted to use it).

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: "Rodolfo Medina" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:26:24 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

Renato Gallo  writes:

>  and that's s good security-wise
>
> Renato Gallo 


Renato, thanks...

but didn't I clearly specify the special circumstances of my (strange, I agree)
request...?  It seems to me that I did...

Cheers,

Rodolfo

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[Greg Wooledge]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 05:01:11AM +0200, Matthew Crews wrote:
> I have no idea what an Owlett thread is,

It's what you're seeing right now.

It's also the reason I end up writing a filtering program to send all
email from certain From: addresses into a spam folder.

Re: [Off-topic] - Raspeberry PI

[Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA , Leandro]

Le mar. 2 juil. 2019 à 17:00, Vitor Hugo  a écrit :
>
> Entendo; alguem chegou a instalar e utilizar; ele roda liso ou somente é um 
> pequeno quebra galho?

É a distribuição oficial do Raspberry π, até onde entendo.  Nada de
quebra-galho.


-- 
skype:leandro.gfc.dutra?chat  Yahoo!: ymsgr:sendIM?lgcdutra
+55 (61) 3546 7191  gTalk: xmpp:leand...@jabber.org
+55 (61) 9302 2691ICQ/AIM: aim:GoIM?screenname=61287803
BRAZIL GMT−3  MSN: msnim:chat?contact=lean...@dutra.fastmail.fm

Re: How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Renato Gallo  writes:

>  and that's s good security-wise
>
> Renato Gallo 


Renato, thanks...

but didn't I clearly specify the special circumstances of my (strange, I agree)
request...?  It seems to me that I did...

Cheers,

Rodolfo

Re: ncurses?

[Greg Wooledge]

On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 05:45:32PM -0600, ghe wrote:
> When I run one of these programs and 'ps aux' I see lynx or alsamixer or
> aptitude, but no ncurses. I'm not sure what, if anything, that means.
> But I expected to see ncurses.

ncurses is a C library.  A C program like lynx may be linked against
this library, and you would (usually) see that with ldd:

wooledg:~$ ldd /usr/bin/lynx | grep ncurses
libncursesw.so.6 => /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libncursesw.so.6 
(0x7f85b0929000)

A library isn't a separate process, and you won't see it listed in the
output of ps or top.

Re: How to have password shown?

[Håkon Alstadheim]

Den 03.07.2019 13:24, skrev Rodolfo Medina:

Hi all...

Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian in
tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my old
father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet I found
some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear
text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...


If the machine is physically secure, I'd find out about automatic login 
(aka autologin) to X (check the config of your display manager, you 
might conceivably want to use a different displaymanager) .


For root access, check out man sudoers, the EXAMPLES section will get 
you started, find out about NOPASSWD.


If the machine is NOT physically secure, think long and hard about what 
you will do.

Re: Output from apt-get update.

[Greg Wooledge]

On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 03:10:06PM -0700, pe...@easthope.ca wrote:
> dalton has dnsmasq.  From distant recollection, name resolution failed when 
> the system was running and dnsmasq was not.  That motivated direct reference 
> to IP addresses.  To the best of my knowledge, an IP address should suffice 
> to 
> identify a server or possibly a cluster of them. 

An entry in /etc/hosts would probably be a better choice.  In the case
of HTTP requests, the hostname needs to be sent inside the request to
identify the correct virtual host.

(Now, maybe that particular mirror isn't on a virtual host, but in
general, most HTTP requests *should* be treated as virtual hosts.  Using a
raw IP address in the URL typically won't get you the right result.)

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

If you are living alone in a bunker under an alien planet surface ok "shoulder 
surfing is not an issue"

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: "tomas" 
To: "renato" 
Cc: "Rodolfo Medina" , "debian-user" 

Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:14:14 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:10:50PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> one of the worst ideas I've ever heard since 1974
> 
> read this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoulder_surfing_(computer_security)

I assume Rodolfo knows all that. Perhaps the context is one where
.

Security is not about blindly following rules :^)

Cheers
-- t

Re: How to have password shown?

[Nicolas George]

Renato Gallo (12019-07-03):
>  and that's s good security-wise

The good practice, security-wise, is to start by understanding the
situation and the threat.

Regards,

-- 
  Nicolas George


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Re: How to have password shown?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 02:10:50PM +0200, Renato Gallo wrote:
> one of the worst ideas I've ever heard since 1974
> 
> read this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoulder_surfing_(computer_security)

I assume Rodolfo knows all that. Perhaps the context is one where
shoulder surfing is not an issue.

Security is not about blindly following rules :^)

Cheers
-- t


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

 and that's s good security-wise

Renato Gallo 

- Original Message -
From: to...@tuxteam.de
To: "Rodolfo Medina" 
Cc: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:12:22 PM
Subject: Re: How to have password shown?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:24:54AM +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> Hi all...
> 
> Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian in
> tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my old
> father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet I 
> found
> some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear
> text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...

I think /bin/login isn't set up to allow that (at least that's what a cursory
reading of its man page tells me). I fear the only way for you would be to
modify its source and recompile...

Cheers
-- tomás

Re: How to have password shown?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 11:24:54AM +, Rodolfo Medina wrote:
> Hi all...
> 
> Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian in
> tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my old
> father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet I 
> found
> some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear
> text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...

I think /bin/login isn't set up to allow that (at least that's what a cursory
reading of its man page tells me). I fear the only way for you would be to
modify its source and recompile...

Cheers
-- tomás


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Description: Digital signature

Re: Debian Release Fest 10? Stockholm

[Luna Jernberg]

https://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item=Debian-10.0-Testing

Debian folket vill ha hjälp att testa nya Debian som släpps senare under
denna veckan

On Wed, Jun 19, 2019 at 8:20 AM Luna Jernberg  wrote:

> Now when i think about it i will be in Uppsala
>
> On Wed, Jun 19, 2019 at 6:54 AM Luna Jernberg 
> wrote:
>
>> https://wiki.debian.org/ReleasePartyBuster Någon som hade tänkt att köra
>> något i Stockholm i Juli ?
>>
>

Re: How to have password shown?

[Renato Gallo]

one of the worst ideas I've ever heard since 1974

read this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoulder_surfing_(computer_security)

Renato Gallo 

System Engineer 
sede legale e operativa: Via Privata Cefalonia, 14 - 20156 - Milano (MI) 
Tel. +39 02 - 87049490 
Fax +39 02 - 48677349 
Mobile. +39 342 - 6350524 
Wi | FreeNumbers: https://freenumbers.way-interactive.com 
Wi | SMS: https://sms.way-interactive.com 
Wi | Voip: https://voip.way-interactive.com 
Asterweb: http://www.asterweb.org 

Le informazioni contenute in questo messaggio e negli eventuali allegati sono 
riservate e per uso esclusivo del destinatario. 
Persone diverse dallo stesso non possono copiare o distribuire il messaggio a 
terzi. 
Chiunque riceva questo messaggio per errore è pregato di distruggerlo e di 
informare immediatamente [ mailto:i...@sigmaware.it | info@ ] asterweb.org

- Original Message -
From: "Rodolfo Medina" 
To: "debian-user" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 1:24:54 PM
Subject: How to have password shown?

Hi all...

Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian in
tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my old
father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet I found
some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear
text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...

Thanks for any help,

Cheers,

Rodolfo

Re: Re : Passer de Debian Stretch 32 bits à 64 bits

[Sébastien NOBILI]

Bonjour,

Le mardi 02 juillet 2019 à 23:42, Pascal Hambourg a écrit :
> Tatata. Merci de relire la question. Il ne s'agit pas d'exécuter un binaire
> i386 extrait à la sauvage mais faisant partie d'un paquet *installé*
> proprement donc a priori avec toutes ses dépendances, et notamment une libc
> i386.

Oui, en effet. J’ai mal lu, répondu trop vite et donc à côté.

Avec le multiarch activé, la libc i386 installée, les dépendances i386
satisfaites, ça fonctionnera (sur un système amd64).

Merci d’avoir corrigé ;) et désolé pour ceux que j’ai pu embrouiller…

Sébastien

Re: Lançamento da Buster

[Qobi Ben Nun]

Primeiro, que nem sempre as respostas ficam embaixo das perguntas e depois o 
que tem de gente fazendo a mesma pergunta quase que o tempo todo sem nem se dar 
ao trabalho de buscar no histórico grupos é de se estressar. Tudo bem que ao 
fazer isso, vai gerar grande confusão também porque se escreve muito mal, de 
forma fragmentada, sem fornecer informação que ajude a resolver as dúvidas.
Estou chegando a conclusão de que não é a ferramenta usada. Seja um tipo ou 
outro, tem quem faça bobagem e subutilizam a ferramenta.



Em 2 de julho de 2019 09:23:14 BRT, Gilberto F da Silva <2458...@gmail.com> 
escreveu:
>-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>Hash: SHA1
>
>On Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 11:08:32PM -0300, G. Felipe Pereira da Silva
>wrote:
>> Boa noite,
>> 
>> Estou no grupo do debian Brasil no telegram.
>> Tem-se como vantagem a praticidade/agilidade
>> Contudo, não é organizado  como uma lista e acredito que o
>conhecimento fique
>> restrito lá.
>
>  Pelo menos, lá as respostas ficam embaixo das perguntas.
>
>- -- 
>
>Stela dato:2.458.667,015  Loka tempo:2019-07-02 09:21:54 Mardo
>- -==-
>A filosofia é composta de respostas incompreensíveis para questões 
>insolúveis.
>-- Henry B. Adams, historiador americano
>-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
>Comment: +-+
>Comment: !   Gilberto F da Silva - ICQ 136.782.571 !
>Comment: +-+
>
>iF0EARECAB0WIQR6BybJIKBLy3+8xXcnG6Ba0yEbDgUCXRtMrwAKCRAnG6Ba0yEb
>DojnAJwO85CyXIBq0DvoDvRm6ua/Gpc80QCfULckZm7FxDPHJ7Hj9d8taTtyOTw=
>=g7Dr
>-END PGP SIGNATURE-

-- 
Enviado de meu dispositivo Android com K-9 mail. Desculpe-me pela brevidade.

How to have password shown?

[Rodolfo Medina]

Hi all...

Is there any a way to have my user-password shown when logging into Debian in
tty console, or also within X system when changing to root?  It is for my old
father...  it'd be easier for him to see what he's typing.  In internet I found
some procedures to have asterisks shown; would it be possible to have a clear
text as well?  Maybe it isn't as I understand...

Thanks for any help,

Cheers,

Rodolfo

Re: Output from apt-get update.

[Dan Ritter]

pe...@easthope.ca wrote: 
> 
> The mainboard interface appears as eth0.
> "ip link show" reports eth0 is up.
> "ip addr show" reports an IPv6 address for eth0.  No IPv4 address.
> 
> ping to a neighbour reports 
>   connect: network is unreachable
>   
> Is IPv6 the default now?  Shorewall configuration needs updating?
> 

On a default Debian install, both IPv4 and IPv6 addresses will
be configured if detected: a DHCP request will be sent to obtain
an IPv4 address, and SLAAC will be used to get an IPv6 address.

It's normal for ip addr show eth0 to give you something like:

2: eth0:  mtu 1500 qdisc
pfifo_fast state UP group default qlen 1000
link/ether fc:ab:14:a9:92:db brd ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
inet 10.2.0.2/16 brd 10.2.255.255 scope global eth0
   valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever
inet6 fe80::feaa:14ff:fea9:92db/64 scope link 
   valid_lft forever preferred_lft forever

which shows both IPv4 and IPv6 addresses assigned to eth0.

-dsr-

Re: Accents

[Narcis Garcia]

Que altres em corregeixin si m'equivoco:

A diferència d'Ubuntu, la distribució Debian té els últims paquets
sempre publicats. Això significa que, si actualitzes el teu sistema
«buster» divendres ($ apt full-upgrade) no tindràs quasi diferències
dissabte.

Dissabte entenc que es donarà la versió per «tancada» i es publicaran
les imatges de disc (*.ISO) de Debian 10.0 com a oficial i nova Stable.
Immediatament després d'això començarà la versió Bullseye (futura 11).


__
I'm using this express-made address because personal addresses aren't
masked enough at this mail public archive. Public archive administrator
should fix this against automated addresses collectors.
El 2/7/19 a les 23:30, Jordi Vila ha escrit:
> Bones. Nomes tinc un teclat configurat, cap mes.
> 
> Despres d'haver creat un parell d'usuaris per fer proves he vist que la
> primera vegada que engegen l'escriptori cinnamon, el teclat funciona be,
> 
> Pero despres del primer logout, el teclat deixa de funcionar amb els
> accents correctes. A partir d'aqui, ja nomes torna a la normalitat
> reiniciant l'ordinador. hauria de fer mes proves pero per ara, aquesta
> es la conclusio. Aixo no passava amb la distribucio de 32 bits i el
> maquinari antic.
> 
> Si no hi ha cap solucio simple, esperare a veure que pasa amb el
> "Buster". Ara mateix es l'unic escriptori que tinc instal·lat en espera
> del que passi el dissabte ...
> 
>  
> 
> Salutacions
> 
> Jordi.
> 
>  
> 
> On Tue, 2 Jul 2019 22:43:45 +0200, Narcis Garcia wrote:
> 
>> Aquest problema, tal com el descriu en Josep, me l'havia trobat amb
>> Ubuntu-Gnome; 13.04, 13.10 i 14.04
>> En el seu dia vaig haver de fer un programa que interceptava i corregia
>> «al vol» els canvis de distribució de teclat, perquè sinó era inviable
>> l'ús de Gnome per als usuaris.
>>
>> Primer convé comprovar si n'hi ha prou amb treure les distribucions de
>> teclat (Configuració Regional ~ Fonts d'entrada) que no siguin la única
>> que t'interessa.
>> Si amb això no n'hi ha prou, puc mirar de rescatar el programet que
>> automatitza la rectificació.
>>
>>
> 

Re: ncurses?

[tomas]

On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 05:45:32PM -0600, ghe wrote:
> Buster, Supermicro 5036T (aka sbox), Radeon HD 6450/7450/8450 according
> to lspci, RME Hammerfall sound card

[...]

> The problem is that, on sbox, alsamixer and aptitude are badly displayed
> -- alsamixer so bad that it's not usable. The vertical lines in
> alsamixer are broken into pieces and the pieces are offset a quarter of
> an inch or so. The horizontals aren't broken, but their positions are
> offset like the vertical pieces. Some of them.

Also: what is the value of your TERM environment variable? Are you calling
the program via sudo, or directly from a root shell?

Cheers
-- t


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Description: Digital signature

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[tomas]

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 08:17:22AM -, Curt wrote:
> On 2019-07-03,   wrote:
> >
> >> I have an innate desire to help people, but more importantly I give
> >> people the benefit of the doubt. Besides I self-taught myself a few
> >> things along the way, so I consider it a win.
> >
> > I prefer that one, too :)
> 
> People get the benefit of the doubt until they remove all doubt, at
> which point your easy altruism reverses itself into a kind of pandering
> to the selfishness you pretend to decry. 

Let's agree to differ, then.

Cheers
-- t


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Description: Digital signature

Re: Expression régulière

[Dominique Dumont]

On Monday, 1 July 2019 21:49:26 CEST Migrec wrote:
> Il devrait y avoir une valeur qui est absente et que le script détecte.

Je dois avouer que je ne comprends toujours pas le problème à résoudre.

Tu peux donner un exemple d'XML "qui va" et un "qui ne va pas" ?

Dod

Re: 70-persistent-net-rules no longer supported?

[Brian]

On Wed 03 Jul 2019 at 09:15:47 +0200, Stephan Seitz wrote:

> On Di, Jul 02, 2019 at 08:14:02 +0100, Brian wrote:
> > My upgrade from stretch to buster left networking as it was before. My
> > 70-persistent-net.rules is
> > 
> > SUBSYSTEM=="net", ACTION=="add", DRIVERS=="?*", 
> > ATTR{address}=="00:90:dc:a2:4d:26",
> > ATTR{dev_id}=="0x0", ATTR{type}=="1", KERNEL=="eth*", NAME="eth0"
> > 
> > Following Curt's suggestion I removed the relevant module and rebooted.
> > 'ip a' shows eth0. The advice in the Release Notes
> 
> You probably meant that you removed the line?

No, I meant what I wrote, but didn't put much investigation or thought
into into what I was doing. In any case, it was somewhat secondary to
to my other points. I can well imagine that the OP's scepticism as to
the advice in

https://www.debian.org/releases/testing/i386/release-notes/ch-information.en.html#migrate-interface-names

has not diminished.

-- 
Brian.

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

[Curt]

On 2019-07-03,   wrote:
>
>> I have an innate desire to help people, but more importantly I give
>> people the benefit of the doubt. Besides I self-taught myself a few
>> things along the way, so I consider it a win.
>
> I prefer that one, too :)

People get the benefit of the doubt until they remove all doubt, at
which point your easy altruism reverses itself into a kind of pandering
to the selfishness you pretend to decry. 

> Cheers

Re: 70-persistent-net-rules no longer supported?

[Curt]

On 2019-07-03, Stephan Seitz  wrote:
>
>>Following Curt's suggestion I removed the relevant module and rebooted.
>>'ip a' shows eth0. The advice in the Release Notes
>
> You probably meant that you removed the line?
>
> I noticed that since Debian 9 this file is added to the initrd. So if you
> change or delete the file you have to rebuild the initrd before
> rebooting.

I was wondering about this, too. 

Michael Biebl bug reproduction test did not involve a reboot
('udevadm trigger --action=add' regenerates, sources, or
re-reads---I don't know the correct term--the rule in
'/etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules').

So with a rule in that file he unloaded and reloaded his network module
(and all was good, the interface adopting the custom name defined in
the file). Then he ran

 udevadm trigger --action=add

reproducing the bug (interface renamed to a default name though 
a custom name was set in '70-persistent-net.rules').

> Shade and sweet water!
>
>   Stephan

Re: Sauvegarde Windows

[Eric Degenetais]

Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 08:48, Daniel Caillibaud  a écrit :

> Le 02/07/19 à 18h42, Belaïd  a écrit :
> > Tu peux juste sauvegarder le dossier perso de ton utilisateur qui est
> > localisé dans C:\Utilisateurs\compteUtilisateur (ou
> > C:\Users\compteUtilisateur). Ce dossier regroupe toute les données de
> > l'utilisateur (les données mais pas les applications)
>
> C'est pas chiffré ?
>
Pas par Windows. Certains PC peuvent avoir des disques chiffrés mais c'est
par des composants tiers.

>
>
> Il me semblait qu'à partir d'une certaine version de windows les données
> personnelles des utilisateurs étaient chiffrées (notamment le dossier "Mes
> Documents"), j'avais mal compris ?
>
> Si c'est le cas, il faudrait d'abord que l'utilisateur windows concerné,
> sous sa session windows, copie tous les contenus qu'il veut sauvegarder
> dans un dossier hors de ses dossiers personnels.
>
> C'est aussi plus prudent d'exporter liste de contacts, de favoris, etc.,
> chacun dans un fichier à un format standard, pour les réimporter ailleurs
> ensuite (plutôt que d'espérer pouvoir récupérer le dossier de préférences
> d'un logiciel).
>
> --
> Daniel
>
> Celui-là, on ne le connait ni des lèvres ni des dents.
>

Éric Dégenètais

>
>

Re: Re : Re : Passer de Debian Stretch 32 bits à 64 bits

[Eric Degenetais]

Le mer. 3 juil. 2019 06:29,  a écrit :

> Le 02/07/2019 21:42:56, Pascal Hambourg a écrit :
>
> > Tatata. Merci de relire la question. Il ne s'agit pas d'exécuter un
> > binaire i386 extrait à la sauvage mais faisant partie d'un paquet
> > *installé* proprement donc a priori avec toutes ses dépendances, et
> > notamment une libc i386.
>
> Donc des applications en 32 bits munies des bibliothèques 32 bits qui vont
> bien fonctionneront dans un système 64 bits ?
> Je conserve ce que me donne ldd et ça suffira ?
>
Une couche de compatibilité est prévue pour qu'un système 64bits puisse
exécuter des binaires 32bits. Comme déjà souligné par Pascal Hambourg il
est préférable de passer par le système de gestion de paquets, mais avec la
couche de compatibilité en place on peut exécuter un ELF 32 bits pour peu
que ses dépendances soient installées, oui. D'ailleurs par extension on
peut aussi faire tourner des exécutables win32 à travers wine, je l'ai fait
des années en 64bits à l'époque où je jouais à WoW et StarCraft II


>
> nicolas patrois : pts noir asocial
> --
> RÉALISME
>
> M : Qu'est-ce qu'il nous faudrait pour qu'on nous considère comme des
> humains ? Un cerveau plus gros ?
> P : Non... Une carte bleue suffirait..
>
Cordialement

Éric Dégenètais

>