Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Darac Marjal]

On 29/10/2023 12:00, mick.crane wrote:

On 2023-10-28 18:31, Roy J. Tellason, Sr. wrote:

On Saturday 28 October 2023 07:25:39 am gene heskett wrote:

On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:
> On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
>> I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the
>> "proper" way of collecting sensors readings?
>
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :
>> please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
>> metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a 
number

>> of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).
>
I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to 
it,

there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely
nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the
systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?


I've seen that fairly often,  particularly with software packages.
It's a real aggravation at times.


I've sometimes thought it would be useful if at the top of man pages 
there was.

"Why would I use this" with explanation.


I suppose that's what the "summary" line is for:

 * ls - list directory contents
 * munin-node - A daemon to gather information in cooperation with the
   main Munin program
 * sensors - print sensors information
 * synaptic - graphical management of software packages



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Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[gene heskett]

On 10/29/23 08:01, mick.crane wrote:

On 2023-10-28 18:31, Roy J. Tellason, Sr. wrote:

On Saturday 28 October 2023 07:25:39 am gene heskett wrote:

On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:
> On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
>> I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the
>> "proper" way of collecting sensors readings?
>
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :
>> please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
>> metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a 
number

>> of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).
>
I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to it,
there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely
nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the
systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?


I've seen that fairly often,  particularly with software packages.
It's a real aggravation at times.


I've sometimes thought it would be useful if at the top of man pages 
there was.

"Why would I use this" with explanation.


Something along those lines would sure generate the huzzahs here.

mick

.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[mick.crane]

On 2023-10-28 18:31, Roy J. Tellason, Sr. wrote:

On Saturday 28 October 2023 07:25:39 am gene heskett wrote:

On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:
> On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
>> I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the
>> "proper" way of collecting sensors readings?
>
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :
>> please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
>> metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a number
>> of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).
>
I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to 
it,

there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely
nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the
systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?


I've seen that fairly often,  particularly with software packages.
It's a real aggravation at times.


I've sometimes thought it would be useful if at the top of man pages 
there was.

"Why would I use this" with explanation.

mick

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Roy J. Tellason, Sr.]

On Saturday 28 October 2023 07:25:39 am gene heskett wrote:
> On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:
> > On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
> >> I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
> >> "proper" way of collecting sensors readings?
> > 
> > https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :
> >> please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
> >> metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a number
> >> of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).
> > 
> I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to it, 
> there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely 
> nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the 
> systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?

I've seen that fairly often,  particularly with software packages.  It's a real 
aggravation at times.

-- 
Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and
ablest -- form of life in this section of space,  a critter that can
be killed but can't be tamed.  --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters"
-
Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James 
M Dakin

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[gene heskett]

On 10/28/23 07:53, Darac Marjal wrote:


On 28/10/2023 12:25, gene heskett wrote:

On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:

On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
"proper" way of collecting sensors readings?


https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :

please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a number
of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).


I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to 
it, there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely 
nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the 
systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?


Strictly speaking, Munin does two things: it runs a collection of 
plugins and it stores the results of those plugins in RRDs.


Munin works in a server/node pattern. Typically one runs Munin (the 
server part) on a central computer with a web server. Munin will then 
reach out to "Munin-Node" (running either on the same computer or on 
other computers around your network). "Munin-Node" runs the plugins 
(which may do just about anything in any language you like. They can be 
written in perl or python or C or shell; they can fetch CPU metrics, or 
disk metrics, or they can query the amount of coffee in the pot or they 
can tell you how your stocks/shares are doing - basically anything that 
can be represented as a number). The Munin-Node protocol is a fairly 
simple text protocol. Munin receives the metrics and stores these in 
RRDs. Munin also produces a web page containing graphs from the RRDs.


If a more visual demonstration would help, take a look at 
http://demo.munin-monitoring.org/munin-monitoring.org/demo.munin-monitoring.org/ to see the kinds of things you can do.


Thats impressive, and informatve, but not my cup of tea. I don't need to 
graph things in real time A postage stamp sized list of voltage srcs and 
what they measure, updated at 1 to 5 second intervals, ditto for fan 
speeds if a tach line is available. would suit me just fine.


Thank you.

If should, perhaps, be noted that using RRDs to store metrics - while 
still quite serviceable and a good fit for a small system - is 
considered a bit old hat these days. The problem with RRDs is that the 
graphs produced tend to be static (if you want to zoom in, or only show 
one of the lines on the graph etc, you have to re-render the image). The 
modern way is to separate out the collection of metrics, the 
gathering/collating of metrics and the visualisation of metrics into 
their own programs (i.e. the UNIX philosophy). If you want do go down 
that route, you can look into:


  * Collecting
  o collectd
  o telegraf
  o statsd
  o node-exporter
  o etc
  * Gathering
  o Prometheus
  o InfluxDB
  o Graphite
  o OpenTSDB
  * Visualisation
  o Grafana
  o Kibana



Thank you.


https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/rrdcollect
is linked from https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/rrdcollect
and has "[2023-01-30] Removed 0.2.10-4 from unstable" entry in the 
"News" section.




.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Darac Marjal]

On 28/10/2023 12:25, gene heskett wrote:

On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:

On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
"proper" way of collecting sensors readings?


https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :

please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a number
of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).


I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to 
it, there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely 
nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the 
systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?


Strictly speaking, Munin does two things: it runs a collection of 
plugins and it stores the results of those plugins in RRDs.


Munin works in a server/node pattern. Typically one runs Munin (the 
server part) on a central computer with a web server. Munin will then 
reach out to "Munin-Node" (running either on the same computer or on 
other computers around your network). "Munin-Node" runs the plugins 
(which may do just about anything in any language you like. They can be 
written in perl or python or C or shell; they can fetch CPU metrics, or 
disk metrics, or they can query the amount of coffee in the pot or they 
can tell you how your stocks/shares are doing - basically anything that 
can be represented as a number). The Munin-Node protocol is a fairly 
simple text protocol. Munin receives the metrics and stores these in 
RRDs. Munin also produces a web page containing graphs from the RRDs.


If a more visual demonstration would help, take a look at 
http://demo.munin-monitoring.org/munin-monitoring.org/demo.munin-monitoring.org/ 
to see the kinds of things you can do.


If should, perhaps, be noted that using RRDs to store metrics - while 
still quite serviceable and a good fit for a small system - is 
considered a bit old hat these days. The problem with RRDs is that the 
graphs produced tend to be static (if you want to zoom in, or only show 
one of the lines on the graph etc, you have to re-render the image). The 
modern way is to separate out the collection of metrics, the 
gathering/collating of metrics and the visualisation of metrics into 
their own programs (i.e. the UNIX philosophy). If you want do go down 
that route, you can look into:


 * Collecting
 o collectd
 o telegraf
 o statsd
 o node-exporter
 o etc
 * Gathering
 o Prometheus
 o InfluxDB
 o Graphite
 o OpenTSDB
 * Visualisation
 o Grafana
 o Kibana



Thank you.


https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/rrdcollect
is linked from https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/rrdcollect
and has "[2023-01-30] Removed 0.2.10-4 from unstable" entry in the 
"News" section.




.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.


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Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[gene heskett]

On 10/28/23 00:14, Max Nikulin wrote:

On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
"proper" way of collecting sensors readings?


https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :

please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a number
of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).


I just looked at munin in synaptic, But while there lots of parts to it, 
there is not a single word that indicates what it does? Absolutely 
nothing that tells me it can monitor the system fans or measure the 
systems voltages.  What does it actually DO?


Thank you.


https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/rrdcollect
is linked from https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/rrdcollect
and has "[2023-01-30] Removed 0.2.10-4 from unstable" entry in the 
"News" section.




.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Jeffrey Walton]

On Fri, Oct 27, 2023 at 2:39 PM Greg  wrote:
>
> I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the
> "proper" way of collecting sensors readings?

Also take a look at . It is
available in Debian 12.

Jeff

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Max Nikulin]

On 28/10/2023 01:39, Greg wrote:
I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
"proper" way of collecting sensors readings?


https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1029995 :

please consider removing rrdcollect. Its a tool/daemon to collect
metrics from the local system into RRD files. There are quite a number
of alternatives in Debian to do the same, better (munin, et al).


https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/rrdcollect
is linked from https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/rrdcollect
and has "[2023-01-30] Removed 0.2.10-4 from unstable" entry in the 
"News" section.

Re: [Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Charles Curley]

On Fri, 27 Oct 2023 20:39:09 +0200
Greg  wrote:

> I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
> "proper" way of collecting sensors readings?

I'm not sure about proper, but sensors works for the purpose.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

[Bookworm] collecting sensors data

[Greg]

Hi there,

I just noticed that there is no rrdcollect in Bookworm. What is the 
"proper" way of collecting sensors readings?


Thanks in advance for any help

Greg