Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 12:46:38AM +0900, Osamu Aoki wrote: Hi, On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 06:31:50AM -0600, Richard Owlett wrote: ... I've been a computer user since before Mr. Torvalds was born. I just never had reason to have contact with *nix. Even when working for DEC I was much more into analog than digital. I see. I guess you were a VMS or some mainframe user... As for apt-zip: http://alioth.debian.org/projects/apt-zip http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apt-zip.html http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=apt-zip It seems somewhat stalled. You may wish to takeover project to update it to be compatible with current apt repository. The last update was 2008. There is also apt-offline, which I think is still being maintained. http://apt-offline.alioth.debian.org/ I have used it successfully in the past. -- If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121118104838.GB24408@tal
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Chris Bannister wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 12:46:38AM +0900, Osamu Aoki wrote: Hi, On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 06:31:50AM -0600, Richard Owlett wrote: ... I've been a computer user since before Mr. Torvalds was born. I just never had reason to have contact with *nix. Even when working for DEC I was much more into analog than digital. I see. I guess you were a VMS or some mainframe user... As for apt-zip: http://alioth.debian.org/projects/apt-zip http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apt-zip.html http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=apt-zip It seems somewhat stalled. You may wish to takeover project to update it to be compatible with current apt repository. The last update was 2008. There is also apt-offline, which I think is still being maintained. http://apt-offline.alioth.debian.org/ I have used it successfully in the past. Version 1.2 was announced on this list back in April. As to DEC, we had a PDP-11 running either RT-11 or RSX-11M - forget which - doing data collection. As to the reference in the last couple of posts, I've seen many but not all. My initial approach to Linux was Read much, download little ;) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/50a8d344.1000...@cloud85.net
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Osamu Aoki wrote: Hi, On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 01:53:47PM -0600, Richard Owlett wrote: Terho Uotila wrote: Unless you want to try very minimal system you probably want shadow passwords. I do not understand. Going by text displayed during the installation I had the impression that shadow passwords were for those overly paranoid about supposed incremental security advantages. My machines will effectively be the ultimate in single user systems. I will be the only one with physical access. They will have only occasional restricted access to the internet over a dial up connection. It is very unlikely that there will ever be a LAN among my machines. I do not see that Debian even claims that shadow passwords *could* be of any benefit to me ;/ 1. Use of shadow is almost standard these days. 2. If your are attacked while you are using user account to access internet, the use of shadow password gives you one thin but extra layer of protection to protect your root account after your user account is hacked. 3. Disabling shadow does not give you much speed or space. Configuring system to odd configuration is usually not good idea since it is tested less. Chuckle. One does not usually associated the word normal/standard/typical with me. My whole goal is to do an install that I know is on the fringe. That is why I bought a used laptop which will _*NOT*_ be connected to the internet for by experiments. On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 11:04:21 -0600 Richard Owlett wrote: 2. Did not enable shadow passwords (...) 3. Attempted su, neither root nor user password accepted You may have hit a bug. Obviously there is a bug. The question is it me or Debian? In this context, more likely Debian or its upstream. I noticed a problem with disabling shadow passwords some time back and I don't know if anyone has fixed it, as (ahem) I haven't gotten around to reporting it yet... For you I have such a deal. I've submitted a bug [693...@bugs.debian.org] on which you may comment. This will be especially useful if the problem has been observed in something later than version 6.0.5. I recall (maybe wrongly) figuring out that when shadow passwords were not enabled, installer still saved root password into shadow before disabling it, or something on those lines. I don't know. Though ~3 score and 10, this is my first foray into *nix. Welcome and if you are newbie, stay within safe area :-) That's no fun. Do not try to do something complicated before getting system understood. I'm what once was referred to as a kinesthetic learner. I learn by doing. I've been a computer user since before Mr. Torvalds was born. I just never had reason to have contact with *nix. Even when working for DEC I was much more into analog than digital. I could fix my installation at the time by going into single user mode and changing root password, after which it worked correctly. I don't understand that. I did not know this but passwd package ships command called shadowconfig. Use shadowconfig on. See man shadowconfig and /usr/share/doc/passwd/README.Debian for more. (If you installed from CD, you may alternatively reinstall system ...) By the way, we have some basics for use as: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ Thanks for reminding me. I haven't used it as, being on a dial-up connection, online manuals are inconvenient. Is it available as a PDF or as a single HTML file? Is there a similar volume of preseeding, especially for those of us who insist on installing without the availability of an internet connection. [I'm in rural SW MO on the end of a 56k dial-up connection ;] Good luck, Osamu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/50a783b6.30...@cloud85.net
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Hi, On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 06:31:50AM -0600, Richard Owlett wrote: ... I've been a computer user since before Mr. Torvalds was born. I just never had reason to have contact with *nix. Even when working for DEC I was much more into analog than digital. I see. I guess you were a VMS or some mainframe user... As for apt-zip: http://alioth.debian.org/projects/apt-zip http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apt-zip.html http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=apt-zip It seems somewhat stalled. You may wish to takeover project to update it to be compatible with current apt repository. The last update was 2008. By the way, we have some basics for use as: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ Thanks for reminding me. I haven't used it as, being on a dial-up connection, online manuals are inconvenient. Is it available as a PDF or as a single HTML file? For installation, you should start with Install Manual: http://www.debian.org/releases/testing/installmanual http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/installmanual PDFs are available. If you use 64bit PC, you want amd64 version. It is good idea to read this if you really wish to tweak. It is available as Debian Package. http://packages.qa.debian.org/d/debian-reference.html apt-get install debian-reference-en This is more about Unix shell focused. Once you install it, you can see it via browser. (I know I used to have PDF. Building PDF for non-English via XML-XeTeX is still not so easy. That will be my next project. Maybe I should enable just for English and French first which I know is easy.) Another good source is THE DEBIAN ADMINISTRATOR'S HANDBOOK http://packages.qa.debian.org/d/debian-handbook.html apt-get install debian-handbook General guide. Is there a similar volume of preseeding, especially for those of us who insist on installing without the availability of an internet connection. [I'm in rural SW MO on the end of a 56k dial-up connection ;] I see. You got no speed limit for automobile but speed limit for Internet. 56k should be practically impossible for tracking testing without apt-zip. If you have access to fast network somewhere, download DVD-1 at least. That should give you decent system. (There are 2 more DVDs to be complete.) http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/ http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/errata All you need is few file images. You do not need network to install DVD or CD. (I checked how big archive is, it seems DLBL image is only one... so guess) If you do not install large desktop application and keep it just with consoles, tracking testing may be possible with direct 56k connection. Regards, Osamu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121117154638.GA18311@goofy.localdomain
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Hi,I thought about different approach ... Since On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 12:46:38AM +0900, Osamu Aoki wrote: Hi, On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 06:31:50AM -0600, Richard Owlett wrote: ... I've been a computer user since before Mr. Torvalds was born. I just never had reason to have contact with *nix. Even when working for DEC I was much more into analog than digital. I see. I guess you were a VMS or some mainframe user... As for apt-zip: http://alioth.debian.org/projects/apt-zip http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apt-zip.html http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=apt-zip It seems somewhat stalled. You may wish to takeover project to update it to be compatible with current apt repository. The last update was 2008. Usually, I recommend not to try to make full archive copy to reduce our server load. But if you are careful, this may be a simpler solution than fixing apt-zip. You may also avoid some parts of archive. These debian package maybe useful to be as efficient as possible to make partial mirror. debmirror http://packages.qa.debian.org/d/debmirror.html (This is made by debhelper developer and current) apt-mirror http://apt-mirror.sourceforge.net/ http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apt-mirror.html apt-p2phttp://www.camrdale.org/apt-p2p/ http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apt-mirror.html Osamu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121117161801.GA19855@goofy.localdomain
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Unless you want to try very minimal system you probably want shadow passwords. On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 11:04:21 -0600 Richard Owlett wrote: 2. Did not enable shadow passwords (...) 3. Attempted su, neither root nor user password accepted You may have hit a bug. I noticed a problem with disabling shadow passwords some time back and I don't know if anyone has fixed it, as (ahem) I haven't gotten around to reporting it yet... I recall (maybe wrongly) figuring out that when shadow passwords were not enabled, installer still saved root password into shadow before disabling it, or something on those lines. I could fix my installation at the time by going into single user mode and changing root password, after which it worked correctly. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121116125705.6ede7...@deneb.local.net
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Terho Uotila wrote: Unless you want to try very minimal system you probably want shadow passwords. I do not understand. Going by text displayed during the installation I had the impression that shadow passwords were for those overly paranoid about supposed incremental security advantages. My machines will effectively be the ultimate in single user systems. I will be the only one with physical access. They will have only occasional restricted access to the internet over a dial up connection. It is very unlikely that there will ever be a LAN among my machines. I do not see that Debian even claims that shadow passwords *could* be of any benefit to me ;/ On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 11:04:21 -0600 Richard Owlett wrote: 2. Did not enable shadow passwords (...) 3. Attempted su, neither root nor user password accepted You may have hit a bug. Obviously there is a bug. The question is it me or Debian? I noticed a problem with disabling shadow passwords some time back and I don't know if anyone has fixed it, as (ahem) I haven't gotten around to reporting it yet... For you I have such a deal. I've submitted a bug [693...@bugs.debian.org] on which you may comment. This will be especially useful if the problem has been observed in something later than version 6.0.5. I recall (maybe wrongly) figuring out that when shadow passwords were not enabled, installer still saved root password into shadow before disabling it, or something on those lines. I don't know. Though ~3 score and 10, this is my first foray into *nix. I could fix my installation at the time by going into single user mode and changing root password, after which it worked correctly. I don't understand that. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/50a699cb.4010...@cloud85.net
Re: Password problem confirmed as repeatable - was [Re: Newbie password problem(s)]
Hi, On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 01:53:47PM -0600, Richard Owlett wrote: Terho Uotila wrote: Unless you want to try very minimal system you probably want shadow passwords. I do not understand. Going by text displayed during the installation I had the impression that shadow passwords were for those overly paranoid about supposed incremental security advantages. My machines will effectively be the ultimate in single user systems. I will be the only one with physical access. They will have only occasional restricted access to the internet over a dial up connection. It is very unlikely that there will ever be a LAN among my machines. I do not see that Debian even claims that shadow passwords *could* be of any benefit to me ;/ 1. Use of shadow is almost standard these days. 2. If your are attacked while you are using user account to access internet, the use of shadow password gives you one thin but extra layer of protection to protect your root account after your user account is hacked. 3. Disabling shadow does not give you much speed or space. Configuring system to odd configuration is usually not good idea since it is tested less. On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 11:04:21 -0600 Richard Owlett wrote: 2. Did not enable shadow passwords (...) 3. Attempted su, neither root nor user password accepted You may have hit a bug. Obviously there is a bug. The question is it me or Debian? In this context, more likely Debian or its upstream. I noticed a problem with disabling shadow passwords some time back and I don't know if anyone has fixed it, as (ahem) I haven't gotten around to reporting it yet... For you I have such a deal. I've submitted a bug [693...@bugs.debian.org] on which you may comment. This will be especially useful if the problem has been observed in something later than version 6.0.5. I recall (maybe wrongly) figuring out that when shadow passwords were not enabled, installer still saved root password into shadow before disabling it, or something on those lines. I don't know. Though ~3 score and 10, this is my first foray into *nix. Welcome and if you are newbie, stay within safe area :-) Do not try to do something complicated before getting system understood. I could fix my installation at the time by going into single user mode and changing root password, after which it worked correctly. I don't understand that. I did not know this but passwd package ships command called shadowconfig. Use shadowconfig on. See man shadowconfig and /usr/share/doc/passwd/README.Debian for more. (If you installed from CD, you may alternatively reinstall system ...) By the way, we have some basics for use as: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ Good luck, Osamu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121117073208.GA25050@goofy.localdomain
