Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
On Jul 25, 2012, at 5:53 PM, Bob Proulx wrote: Mark Allums wrote: Bob Proulx wrote: Mark Allums wrote: No, it's dependency hell. No. Dependency Hell[1] would require a rigidity of dependencies that are difficult to resolve. These resolve fine. And as is they are not causing any problems. It is just suggesting that if you don't want gnome installed then it would, if you told it to do so, remove the lint associated with it. Well, okay. But being require to manually mark 100+ packages in order to remove one seems needlessly tedious. Debian is a harsh mistress. What would you suggest as an alternative and how would it be implemented? Mark Allums wrote: I still think that kind of purge shouldn't be possible. a more granular approach would be appreciated. Rather than have the top level virtual packages (gnome, in this case) depend on over 60 second level packages, could the to- level recommend a small number (say less than a dozen) second level packages that each represent a major subsystem of the Gnome Desktop Environment. Each second level subsystem would then depend-on or recommend, in turn, a manageable number of actual packages -- perhaps with some overlap as necessary amongst the low-level libraries and leaf packages. This would allow a more modular approach and let people purge (or never install in the first place) those packages they don't need. If done carefully, it might also allow users to mix-and-match from amongst a collection of third level packages that provide a given functionality represented by a given second-level virtual package. Just a thought... And, no, I'm not volunteering to do a sample implementation -- I don't have the necessary Debian Packaging skills. I'm just putting the idea out for discussion. Rick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/f834da1d-437b-4e95-ae46-d976afabd...@pobox.com
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
On Mi, 25 iul 12, 18:53:36, Bob Proulx wrote: I would prefer having more smaller bundles that could be installed piecemeal. However the upstream gnome developers don't feel the same way. They would like to see a 100% gnome system top to bottom and think doing anything else is wrong according to their philosophy. We will have to agree to disagree. For me if there were a set of meta-packages such as desktop-extras or some such that would be my preference over having a huge gnome meta-package. There is gnome-core (which still depends on a lot of stuff) and also gnome-session. That puts you into exactly the same situation as the original poster. The 'abiword' package could be removed. That would force removal of 'gnome', which is okay since it is just a meta-package and you don't need it. But then dpkg will announce that the long list of things marked as automatically installed by gnome are now candidates for removal exactly as we are discussing here. Nitpick: dpkg doesn't care about this, it's the higher level package managers (apt/itude). Kind regards, Andrei -- Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Unfortunately this does not appear to have solved it after all- after running both apt-get install on the packages empathy wanted to remove (gnome, gnome-core, gnome-desktop-environment, task-gnome-desktop) and apt-mark manual, attempting to purge empathy tries to remove these same packages again. I marked Empathy itself as manually installed; that didn't work either. Thanks, Regards, Cortman On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 2:33 PM, Claudius Hubig debian_1...@chubig.net wrote: Hello cortman, cortman c0rt...@gmail.com wrote: So I ran apt-get purge empathy from the command line, which uninstalled it just fine- but now when I run apt-get for any other reason it returns a long list of packages that were automatically installed and are no longer required. Below is a complete list. 0 15:36 0 claudius@ares: /media/nffs/std $ apt-cache rdepends empathy empathy Reverse Depends: gnome-core [...] gnome-desktop-environment Hence, probably gnome-core and/or gnome-desktop-enviroment were also removed when you removed empathy. These are meta-packages which in turn pull in all the other packages. You will hence have to mark these other packages you want to keep as automatically installed. Probably the best way to do this is to choose the relevant main packages (for example, rhythmbox) and do # apt-get install rhythmbox which should mark rhythmbox as manually installed (and therefore won’t propose the removal of, for example, rhythmbox-data). Of course, you can also just mark all packages as manually installed. And no, this is not a bug but a feature :) Best regards, Claudius -- A board is the planck unit of boredom. http://chubig.net telnet nightfall.org 4242 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/cadfaa3+z2m3vc2pkfuufb-ucq+_uqv3x1td9y4mky2tg1tq...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Hello cortman, cortman c0rt...@gmail.com wrote: Unfortunately this does not appear to have solved it after all- after running both apt-get install on the packages empathy wanted to remove (gnome, gnome-core, gnome-desktop-environment, task-gnome-desktop) and apt-mark manual, attempting to purge empathy tries to remove these same packages again. I marked Empathy itself as manually installed; that didn't work either. You cannot install gnome, gnome-core, gnome-desktop-environment or task-gnome-desktop without installing empathy. If you want to remove empathy but keep the other packages normally pulled in by gnome, you will have to mark _these_ (rhythmbox, libreoffice etc.) as installed manually. Best regards, Claudius -- A board is the planck unit of boredom. http://chubig.net telnet nightfall.org 4242 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Ok- I must have misunderstood- apparently there's no way to uninstall empathy without also uninstalling the gnome metapackages, the trick is to mark all the contents of the packages as manually installed, therefore you can uninstall the metapackage safely. Correct? Regards, Cortman On Thu, Jul 26, 2012 at 4:11 PM, Claudius Hubig debian_1...@chubig.net wrote: Hello cortman, cortman c0rt...@gmail.com wrote: Unfortunately this does not appear to have solved it after all- after running both apt-get install on the packages empathy wanted to remove (gnome, gnome-core, gnome-desktop-environment, task-gnome-desktop) and apt-mark manual, attempting to purge empathy tries to remove these same packages again. I marked Empathy itself as manually installed; that didn't work either. You cannot install gnome, gnome-core, gnome-desktop-environment or task-gnome-desktop without installing empathy. If you want to remove empathy but keep the other packages normally pulled in by gnome, you will have to mark _these_ (rhythmbox, libreoffice etc.) as installed manually. Best regards, Claudius -- A board is the planck unit of boredom. http://chubig.net telnet nightfall.org 4242 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CADFAa3L8pkHP4xOwSXR8iVVPdx=wtifocrtwfcx5vmvggp5...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Hello cortman, cortman c0rt...@gmail.com wrote: Ok- I must have misunderstood- apparently there's no way to uninstall empathy without also uninstalling the gnome metapackages, the trick is to mark all the contents of the packages as manually installed, therefore you can uninstall the metapackage safely. Dependencies rather than contents, but, yes. Best regards, Claudius -- A board is the planck unit of boredom. http://chubig.net telnet nightfall.org 4242 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Hello cortman, cortman c0rt...@gmail.com wrote: So I ran apt-get purge empathy from the command line, which uninstalled it just fine- but now when I run apt-get for any other reason it returns a long list of packages that were automatically installed and are no longer required. Below is a complete list. 0 15:36 0 claudius@ares: /media/nffs/std $ apt-cache rdepends empathy empathy Reverse Depends: gnome-core [...] gnome-desktop-environment Hence, probably gnome-core and/or gnome-desktop-enviroment were also removed when you removed empathy. These are meta-packages which in turn pull in all the other packages. You will hence have to mark these other packages you want to keep as automatically installed. Probably the best way to do this is to choose the relevant main packages (for example, rhythmbox) and do # apt-get install rhythmbox which should mark rhythmbox as manually installed (and therefore won’t propose the removal of, for example, rhythmbox-data). Of course, you can also just mark all packages as manually installed. And no, this is not a bug but a feature :) Best regards, Claudius -- A board is the planck unit of boredom. http://chubig.net telnet nightfall.org 4242 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
On 7/25/2012 1:17 PM, cortman wrote: Hi all, I have a brand new installation of Debian Wheezy, updated to the current weekly build installed on my Toshiba A505 laptop. I chose to install the graphical desktop environment, laptop uitilites, and standard system utilities at tasksel during installation. The Gnome desktop comes with a number of programs I don't want or use, such as Empathy and Epiphany. So I ran apt-get purge empathy from the command line, which uninstalled it just fine- but now when I run apt-get for any other reason it returns a long list of packages that were automatically installed and are no longer required. Below is a complete list. abiword abiword-common abiword-plugin-grammar abiword-plugin-mathview aisleriot ant ant-optional at-spi2-core baobab ca-certificates-java cheese dconf-tools default-jre default-jre-headless ekiga empathy-common espeak-data file-roller finger fonts-cantarell fonts-lyx fonts-opensymbol fonts-sil-gentium fonts-sil-gentium-basic gcalctool gdebi gdm3 gedit gedit-common gedit-plugins gir1.2-atspi-2.0 gir1.2-gdata-0.0 gir1.2-gnomekeyring-1.0 gir1.2-goa-1.0 gir1.2-gucharmap-2.90 gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-3.0 gir1.2-rb-3.0 gir1.2-tracker-0.14 gir1.2-vte-2.90 gir1.2-webkit-3.0 gir1.2-wnck-3.0 glchess glines gnect gnibbles gnobots2 gnome-backgrounds gnome-dictionary gnome-disk-utility gnome-documents gnome-font-viewer gnome-games gnome-games-data gnome-games-extra-data gnome-icon-theme-extras gnome-mag gnome-nettool gnome-orca gnome-packagekit gnome-packagekit-data gnome-screenshot gnome-search-tool gnome-sudoku gnome-system-log gnome-video-effects gnomine gnotravex gnotski gnuchess gnuchess-book gnumeric gnumeric-common grilo-plugins-0.1 gtali gucharmap guile-2.0-libs hamster-applet hyphen-en-us iagno icedtea-6-jre-cacao icedtea-6-jre-jamvm icedtea-netx icedtea-netx-common inkscape iputils-tracepath java-common libabiword-2.9 libapache-pom-java libatk-adaptor libatk-adaptor-data libatk-bridge2.0-0 libatk-wrapper-java libatk-wrapper-java-jni libatspi1.0-0 libatspi2.0-0 libavahi-ui-gtk3-0 libbrlapi0.5 libcapi20-3 libcmis-0.2-0 libcolamd2.7.1 libcolorblind0 libcommons-beanutils-java libcommons-collections3-java libcommons-compress-java libcommons-digester-java libcommons-logging-java libcommons-parent-java libdb-java libdb-je-java libdb5.1-java libdb5.1-java-jni libdee-1.0-4 libdiscid0 libdmapsharing-3.0-2 libdotconf1.0 libespeak1 libexttextcat-data libexttextcat0 libgdict-1.0-6 libgdict-common libgdome2-0 libgdome2-cpp-smart0c2a libgdu-gtk0 libgeocode-glib0 libgexiv2-1 libgnome-mag2 libgoffice-0.8-8 libgoffice-0.8-8-common libgpod-common libgpod4 libgraphite2-2.0.0 libgrilo-0.1-0 libgtk-vnc-2.0-0 libgtkmathview0c2a libgtkmm-2.4-1c2a libgupnp-av-1.0-2 libgvnc-1.0-0 libhsqldb-java libhyphen0 libicu4j-java libjaxp1.3-java libjline-java libjtidy-java liblinear-tools liblinear1 liblink-grammar4 libloudmouth1-0 liblouis-data liblouis2 liblucene2-java libmagick++5 libminiupnpc5 libmtp-common libmtp-runtime libmtp9 libmythes-1.2-0 libnatpmp1 libodbc1 libopal3.10.4 libots0 libplot2c2 libpstoedit0c2a libpt2.10.4 libraw5 libregexp-java libreoffice libreoffice-base libreoffice-base-core libreoffice-calc libreoffice-common libreoffice-core libreoffice-draw libreoffice-emailmerge libreoffice-evolution libreoffice-filter-binfilter libreoffice-filter-mobiledev libreoffice-gnome libreoffice-gtk libreoffice-help-en-us libreoffice-impress libreoffice-java-common libreoffice-math libreoffice-report-builder-bin libreoffice-style-galaxy libreoffice-style-tango libreoffice-writer librhythmbox-core6 libservlet2.5-java libsonic0 libspeechd2 libsrtp0 libsvm-tools libtelepathy-farstream2 libunique-1.0-0 libunique-3.0-0 libvisio-0.0-0 libwnck-common libwnck22 libwpd-0.9-9 libwpg-0.2-2 libwps-0.2-2 libwv-1.2-4 libxalan2-java libxerces2-java libxml-commons-external-java libxml-commons-resolver1.1-java libxz-java liferea liferea-data lightsoff link-grammar-dictionaries-en lp-solve mahjongg media-player-info minissdpd mobile-broadband-provider-info mythes-en-us nautilus-sendto-empathy network-manager-gnome nmap openjdk-6-jre openjdk-6-jre-headless openjdk-6-jre-lib p7zip-full perlmagick pstoedit python-brlapi python-louis python-mako python-markupsafe python-pyatspi2 python-speechd python-uno python-wnck python-zeitgeist quadrapassel rdesktop rhythmbox rhythmbox-data rhythmbox-plugin-cdrecorder rhythmbox-plugins seahorse shotwell shotwell-common simple-scan sound-juicer sound-theme-freedesktop speech-dispatcher swell-foop telepathy-gabble telepathy-idle telepathy-logger telepathy-salut transmission-common transmission-gtk ttf-liberation ttf-sil-gentium-basic tzdata-java uno-libs3 unoconv ure vinagre vino xbrlapi xdg-user-dirs-gtk xfonts-mathml zeitgeist-core Is this a bug? Regards, Cortman No, it's dependency hell. MAA
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Thanks much Claudius. Solved. Regards, Cortman On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 2:33 PM, Claudius Hubig debian_1...@chubig.net wrote: Hello cortman, cortman c0rt...@gmail.com wrote: So I ran apt-get purge empathy from the command line, which uninstalled it just fine- but now when I run apt-get for any other reason it returns a long list of packages that were automatically installed and are no longer required. Below is a complete list. 0 15:36 0 claudius@ares: /media/nffs/std $ apt-cache rdepends empathy empathy Reverse Depends: gnome-core [...] gnome-desktop-environment Hence, probably gnome-core and/or gnome-desktop-enviroment were also removed when you removed empathy. These are meta-packages which in turn pull in all the other packages. You will hence have to mark these other packages you want to keep as automatically installed. Probably the best way to do this is to choose the relevant main packages (for example, rhythmbox) and do # apt-get install rhythmbox which should mark rhythmbox as manually installed (and therefore won’t propose the removal of, for example, rhythmbox-data). Of course, you can also just mark all packages as manually installed. And no, this is not a bug but a feature :) Best regards, Claudius -- A board is the planck unit of boredom. http://chubig.net telnet nightfall.org 4242 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CADFAa3+sWH-tyTDO6S5h+AjXHqLQkrw7FD=fy1ujok14de9...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Mark Allums wrote: cortman wrote: Is this a bug? No, it's dependency hell. No. Dependency Hell[1] would require a rigidity of dependencies that are difficult to resolve. These resolve fine. And as is they are not causing any problems. It is just suggesting that if you don't want gnome installed then it would, if you told it to do so, remove the lint associated with it. In this way it is a feature of dpkg. You install foo. Installing foo pulls in foo-common and foo-data. You remove foo. That would leave foo-common and foo-data behind. But this feature allows you to clean those up easily. That's good. When used for a very large metapackage such as gnome which is used to pull in a large amount of the rest of the system then dpkg won't know if that means it should keep the dependencies or not. Obviously a human is smart enough to know how to handle it but coding artificial intelligence has a long history of being hard to get right. I go through and mark the high level packages as manually installed by running the install command again. Since they are already installed it won't do anything but mark them as being wanted. For example: apt-get install libreoffice And after every marking look again and repeat with another high level package until the list is trimmed. I avoid marking 'lib*' packages since those are usually better left automatic. You can tell the difference by the names. And along the way you might find that you really do want to remove some of the lint which you never use. Bob [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dependency_hell signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
On Mi, 25 iul 12, 14:37:52, Bob Proulx wrote: I go through and mark the high level packages as manually installed by running the install command again. Since they are already installed it won't do anything but mark them as being wanted. For example: apt-get install libreoffice Just for the archives: apt-mark is the dedicated tool to do all sorts of markings :p (auto, manual, hold, etc.). Kind regards, Andrei -- Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
On 7/25/2012 3:37 PM, Bob Proulx wrote: Mark Allums wrote: cortman wrote: Is this a bug? No, it's dependency hell. No. Dependency Hell[1] would require a rigidity of dependencies that are difficult to resolve. These resolve fine. And as is they are not causing any problems. It is just suggesting that if you don't want gnome installed then it would, if you told it to do so, remove the lint associated with it. In this way it is a feature of dpkg. You install foo. Installing foo pulls in foo-common and foo-data. You remove foo. That would leave foo-common and foo-data behind. But this feature allows you to clean those up easily. That's good. When used for a very large metapackage such as gnome which is used to pull in a large amount of the rest of the system then dpkg won't know if that means it should keep the dependencies or not. Obviously a human is smart enough to know how to handle it but coding artificial intelligence has a long history of being hard to get right. I go through and mark the high level packages as manually installed by running the install command again. Since they are already installed it won't do anything but mark them as being wanted. For example: apt-get install libreoffice And after every marking look again and repeat with another high level package until the list is trimmed. I avoid marking 'lib*' packages since those are usually better left automatic. You can tell the difference by the names. And along the way you might find that you really do want to remove some of the lint which you never use. Bob [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dependency_hell Well, okay. But being require to manually mark 100+ packages in order to remove one seems needlessly tedious. Debian is a harsh mistress. I would wish that those meta-packages weren't so inclusive. I recall an incident where I wanted to remove some cruft (can't recall, but it was something silly, like AMOR) and apt wanted to remove 3/4 of the packages on my system, over 700 packages. Granted, a lot of that was stuff I installed on a workstation/desktop of mine just to play with, or for no sane reason. That was why I was removing things. Still, it seemed very drastic at the time, and still does. Mark -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/501078d0.5020...@allums.com
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Andrei POPESCU wrote: Bob Proulx wrote: I go through and mark the high level packages as manually installed by running the install command again. Since they are already installed it won't do anything but mark them as being wanted. For example: apt-get install libreoffice Just for the archives: apt-mark is the dedicated tool to do all sorts of markings :p (auto, manual, hold, etc.). Cool! I did not know about that command. And it appears to have been around since at least November 2007. Wow. I am really behind the times on that command. I see it also handles holding and unholding packages ala 'dpkg --set-selections' too. Neat! Thanks for pointing it out. Bob signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
Mark Allums wrote: Bob Proulx wrote: Mark Allums wrote: No, it's dependency hell. No. Dependency Hell[1] would require a rigidity of dependencies that are difficult to resolve. These resolve fine. And as is they are not causing any problems. It is just suggesting that if you don't want gnome installed then it would, if you told it to do so, remove the lint associated with it. Well, okay. But being require to manually mark 100+ packages in order to remove one seems needlessly tedious. Debian is a harsh mistress. What would you suggest as an alternative and how would it be implemented? And I think you are exagerating it quite a bit saying hundred plus packages to mark individually. It is probably only a half dozen to a dozen when you get right down to it. All of those lib* packages make it look like a lot but if you look at the dependency tree behind libreoffice and a handful of others you will see that they are all covered with those large brushes. I personally would rather the gnome meta-packages weren't so all encompassing. In particular I am in the camp that thinks network-manager should not be a dependency. But that is a whole different 200+ message thread of discussion that has happened many times both on debian-user and debian-devel so please let's not hit that tired topic here. Suffice to say that something smaller would be nice. I would prefer having more smaller bundles that could be installed piecemeal. However the upstream gnome developers don't feel the same way. They would like to see a 100% gnome system top to bottom and think doing anything else is wrong according to their philosophy. We will have to agree to disagree. For me if there were a set of meta-packages such as desktop-extras or some such that would be my preference over having a huge gnome meta-package. I would wish that those meta-packages weren't so inclusive. Inclusive? Or exclusive? For me it is any rigid inflexibility that causes problems. Depends with flexible versions are okay for me. Proper use of Recommends and Suggests is best. I recall an incident where I wanted to remove some cruft (can't recall, but it was something silly, like AMOR) and apt wanted to remove 3/4 of the packages on my system, over 700 packages. Next time you hit a case like that it would be great if you would bring up the exact example for discussion. Because I don't think it was doing what you are thinking it was doing. For example let's say you don't use and don't want 'abiword' installed on your system. You go to remove it. But the gnome package depends upon abiword. That puts you into exactly the same situation as the original poster. The 'abiword' package could be removed. That would force removal of 'gnome', which is okay since it is just a meta-package and you don't need it. But then dpkg will announce that the long list of things marked as automatically installed by gnome are now candidates for removal exactly as we are discussing here. It won't actually remove them unless you tell it to do so. It just prints the scary message listing them as candidates for an autoremove. As discussed they can be marked as manual and kept just fine. Granted, a lot of that was stuff I installed on a workstation/desktop of mine just to play with, or for no sane reason. That was why I was removing things. Still, it seemed very drastic at the time, and still does. The only situation I can think of (and probably to be corrected five minutes after posting by someone more astute) would be if you tried to remove a lower level library. Everything above it in the dependency tree that depends upon it will be removed because they would be broken without it. But that is just as it should be. On the topic of actually wanting to remove a lot of packages... Personally a tool that I like to use to clean the lint on my system is 'deborphan'. Sometimes with 'orphaner'. But mostly just manually with 'deborphan' and then if I like it with 'apt-get purge $(deborphan)' repeating as needed until everything has been removed that I want removed. Bob signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Purge Empathy messes up apt
On 7/25/2012 7:53 PM, Bob Proulx wrote: I recall an incident where I wanted to remove some cruft (can't recall, but it was something silly, like AMOR) and apt wanted to remove 3/4 of the packages on my system, over 700 packages. Next time you hit a case like that it would be great if you would bring up the exact example for discussion. Because I don't think it was doing what you are thinking it was doing. For example let's say you don't use and don't want 'abiword' installed on your system. You go to remove it. But the gnome package depends upon abiword. That puts you into exactly the same situation as the original poster. The 'abiword' package could be removed. That would force removal of 'gnome', which is okay since it is just a meta-package and you don't need it. But then dpkg will announce that the long list of things marked as automatically installed by gnome are now candidates for removal exactly as we are discussing here. Yes, it was a forest of dependency trees. But that does not nullify my point. It won't actually remove them unless you tell it to do so. It just prints the scary message listing them as candidates for an autoremove. As discussed they can be marked as manual and kept just fine. Of course I canceled the operation. However, this was not a production system, and I was lazy, I had no huge investment in the setup, so I wiped clean and reinstalled, instead, upgrading to testing in the process. Granted, a lot of that was stuff I installed on a workstation/desktop of mine just to play with, or for no sane reason. That was why I was removing things. Still, it seemed very drastic at the time, and still does. The only situation I can think of (and probably to be corrected five minutes after posting by someone more astute) would be if you tried to remove a lower level library. Everything above it in the dependency tree that depends upon it will be removed because they would be broken without it. But that is just as it should be. On the topic of actually wanting to remove a lot of packages... Personally a tool that I like to use to clean the lint on my system is 'deborphan'. Sometimes with 'orphaner'. But mostly just manually with 'deborphan' and then if I like it with 'apt-get purge $(deborphan)' repeating as needed until everything has been removed that I want removed. Bob Thank you for taking the time to give me this advice and help. What I do as a policy since is keep things tidy and not install unnecessary packages. I have used deborphan, but it is not perfect, so fortunately, it isn't very often needed. The Debian relationship is a love/hate relationship. I still think that kind of purge shouldn't be possible. a more granular approach would be appreciated. Mark -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5010b7ad.8020...@allums.com
