Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Am 2006-08-24 23:29:42, schrieb Matej Cepl: Paul Johnson wrote: So what's /usr/games? for games installed from .deb packages (/usr/ should be limited just to whatever was put there by dpkg). Thanks. Someone with knowledge. ;-) I have downloaded several games and compiled it static... It is realy fun, since you can distribute it in a tgz to all distributions... Greetings Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSM LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Am 2006-08-24 23:29:42, schrieb Matej Cepl: Paul Johnson wrote: So what's /usr/games? for games installed from .deb packages (/usr/ should be limited just to whatever was put there by dpkg). Thanks. Someone with knowledge. ;-) I have downloaded several games and compiled it static... It is realy fun, since you can distribute it in a tgz to all distributions... Greetings Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSM LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Am 2006-07-25 10:32:10, schrieb Zbigniew Wiech: I also has this problem. There's a lot of free games attached to childrens' magazines. Most of them are only for Windows, there is no way to play them on linux. With all respect to WINEs people, its in very ... beta stage. It failed to open anything I tried. In my opinion strong standardisation of linux would help. What's the point for game developper to produce 70 versions of the game for all kinds of linuxes, only to reach 5% of population ? Why does Mozille run on ALL Linux versions? Easy: It is static compiled and bring its OWN libe with. Even Winsuck-Games bring there OWN libs with, because you do not need to install it because they run fully from CD/DVD. Greetings Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSM LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Am 2006-07-25 06:42:50, schrieb John Hasler: Zbigniew writes: There's a lot of free games attached to childrens' magazines. Most of them are only for Windows, there is no way to play them on linux. If they are gratis, why do they need to be closed-source? Because the Spy-Ware which is looking for stuff... ...illegal mp3, AVI, daddies payments, debt, ... Greetings Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSM LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Am 2006-07-25 08:03:34, schrieb Roberto C. Sanchez: That's what LSB is for. If it ony it were that simple :-) LSB *requires* RPM! Yuck! GAMES should be installed in /opt/game/ or ~/bin/game/ IF games are good coded and static compiled they are working always and on any locations. Greetings Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSM LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
On Thursday 24 August 2006 06:01, Michelle Konzack wrote: Am 2006-07-25 08:03:34, schrieb Roberto C. Sanchez: That's what LSB is for. If it ony it were that simple :-) LSB *requires* RPM! Yuck! GAMES should be installed in /opt/game/ or ~/bin/game/ IF games are good coded and static compiled they are working always and on any locations. So what's /usr/games? -- Paul Johnson Email and IM (XMPP Google Talk): [EMAIL PROTECTED] pgpjIXdPuqtZL.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Paul Johnson wrote: IF games are good coded and static compiled they are working always and on any locations. So what's /usr/games? for games installed from .deb packages (/usr/ should be limited just to whatever was put there by dpkg). Matěj -- GPG Finger: 89EF 4BC6 288A BF43 1BAB 25C3 E09F EF25 D964 84AC http://www.ceplovi.cz/matej/blog/, Jabber: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23 Marion St. #3, (617) 876-1259, ICQ 132822213 The politician attempts to remedy the evil by increasing the very thing that caused the evil in the first place: legal plunder. -- Frederick Bastiat -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: just some thoughts
-Original Message- From: Paul Johnson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Tuesday 25 July 2006 06:41, Juergen Fiedler wrote: On Mon, Jul 24, 2006 at 07:04:43PM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote: [...] Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Point them in the direction of Cedega That would be because Cedega is still far from supporting all games Get coding then. They let you contribute to their CVS. Suggest: code for Wine, not Cedega: Wine is OpenSource. *** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of computer viruses. www.hubbell.com - Hubbell Incorporated
Re: just some thoughts
On Tue, Jul 25, 2006 at 06:08:38AM +0100, Wulfy wrote: Chuckk Hubbard wrote: It's with shame that I even admit this affects me, but if yall didn't know, the social site myspace.com has just moved all its multimedia content to Flash 9.0 due to security problems they had with the previous version, and Adobe has yet to come up with Flash Player 9.0 for Linux. They have a blog from their head developer: http://blogs.adobe.com/penguin.swf/ but I can't help thinking it reads like it was written to try to sound chummy with penguinheads while dragging their feet about just programming the damn thing. The Flash Player project manager says that it's expected in early 2007. Seems deliberate to me, but then I'm paranoid. No doubt it would be done in short order if it were released as FOSS. Right now, I wouldn't mind having a v8... I wanted to go to site with v8 and had to instll wine/firefox and then v8 as a plugin. It was so so on speed and response. But I agree it sucks not because Im not a myspace users but because it is yet another example of companies dragging their heels on getting linux apps produced. If theyd open the source, they'd get the expertise of the FLOSS community work and I'm sure the app would have LESS security hole! cheers, Kev -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: | | : :' : The Universal | debian.home.pipeline.com | | `. `' Operating System| go to counter.li.org and | | `-http://www.debian.org/ |be counted! #238656 | | my keysever: pgp.mit.edu | my NPO: cfsg.org | signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: just some thoughts
El mar, 25-07-2006 a las 03:06 -0400, Kevin Mark escribió: On Tue, Jul 25, 2006 at 06:08:38AM +0100, Wulfy wrote: Chuckk Hubbard wrote: It's with shame that I even admit this affects me, but if yall didn't know, the social site myspace.com has just moved all its multimedia content to Flash 9.0 due to security problems they had with the previous version, and Adobe has yet to come up with Flash Player 9.0 for Linux. They have a blog from their head developer: http://blogs.adobe.com/penguin.swf/ but I can't help thinking it reads like it was written to try to sound chummy with penguinheads while dragging their feet about just programming the damn thing. The Flash Player project manager says that it's expected in early 2007. Seems deliberate to me, but then I'm paranoid. No doubt it would be done in short order if it were released as FOSS. Right now, I wouldn't mind having a v8... I wanted to go to site with v8 and had to instll wine/firefox and then v8 as a plugin. It was so so on speed and response. But I agree it sucks not because Im not a myspace users but because it is yet another example of companies dragging their heels on getting linux apps produced. If theyd open the source, they'd get the expertise of the FLOSS community work and I'm sure the app would have LESS security hole! cheers, Kev talking and talking .. where to find flash player v8 plugin for firefox? -- Leinier C. Salfran [EMAIL PROTECTED] IPI Jose Maceo Grajales signature.asc Description: Esta parte del mensaje está firmada digitalmente
Odp: Re: just some thoughts
I also has this problem. There's a lot of free games attached to childrens' magazines. Most of them are only for Windows, there is no way to play them on linux. With all respect to WINEs people, its in very ... beta stage. It failed to open anything I tried. In my opinion strong standardisation of linux would help. What's the point for game developper to produce 70 versions of the game for all kinds of linuxes, only to reach 5% of population ? regards Zbigniew David Baron [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2006-07-24 21:49 Do debian-user@lists.debian.org DW Temat Re: just some thoughts Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). Linux has a wealth of games and my daughter uses it every day. The only thing for which I boot up windows is music production because of all the projects already on windows software. I look forward to discarding the windows even for this soon. What I no longer do in windows is email and browzing. Everyone knows why. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
Aw, we have minesweeper, that's all anyone really needs. On 7/24/06, Cybe R. Wizard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In the Great Book it has Been Written that on Mon, 24 Jul 2006 09:57:46 -0600 Art Edwards [EMAIL PROTECTED] didst appear within my Magick Viewing Screen and, being somewhat pleasantly supplicatory, did polemicize thusly: Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). In my own (admittedly limited) experience that is very true. The few computer users I know personally are all Win gamers. Until top-notch NFL, golfing and hunting games come to Linux these fellows won't change although each have approached me about changing already. Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Cybe R. Wizard -- Press 'START' to stop Winduhs -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Far and away the best prize that life has to offer is the chance to work hard at work worth doing. -Theodore Roosevelt -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Zbigniew writes: There's a lot of free games attached to childrens' magazines. Most of them are only for Windows, there is no way to play them on linux. If they are gratis, why do they need to be closed-source? In my opinion strong standardisation of linux would help. What's the point for game developper to produce 70 versions of the game for all kinds of linuxes, only to reach 5% of population ? That's what LSB is for. -- John Hasler -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
On Tue, Jul 25, 2006 at 06:42:50AM -0500, John Hasler wrote: Zbigniew writes: There's a lot of free games attached to childrens' magazines. Most of them are only for Windows, there is no way to play them on linux. If they are gratis, why do they need to be closed-source? That is a good point. I have emailed the authors of a few Windows-only utilities (which were closed source freeware) asking them to open source their apps. Some don't care and others are fearful of the idea of open source. It is sad but true. In my opinion strong standardisation of linux would help. What's the point for game developper to produce 70 versions of the game for all kinds of linuxes, only to reach 5% of population ? That's what LSB is for. If it ony it were that simple :-) LSB *requires* RPM! Yuck! -Roberto -- Roberto C. Sanchez http://familiasanchez.net/~roberto signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: just some thoughts
Chuckk Hubbard wrote: Aw, we have minesweeper, that's all anyone really needs. On 7/24/06, Cybe R. Wizard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In the Great Book it has Been Written that on Mon, 24 Jul 2006 09:57:46 -0600 Art Edwards [EMAIL PROTECTED] didst appear within my Magick Viewing Screen and, being somewhat pleasantly supplicatory, did polemicize thusly: Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). In my own (admittedly limited) experience that is very true. The few computer users I know personally are all Win gamers. Until top-notch NFL, golfing and hunting games come to Linux these fellows won't change although each have approached me about changing already. Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Cedega ... :-| -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
On Mon, Jul 24, 2006 at 07:04:43PM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote: [...] Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Point them in the direction of Cedega and ask them why they're still wasting money on Windows. That would be because Cedega is still far from supporting all games that people want to play. For example, I looked up the next game I am going to get, Prince of Persia: Warrior Within. Turns out the installer works OK, but the game doesn't run at all. And no, I am not inclined to limit my choice of games based on mostly political considerations. I guess I'll stick with my tried and true solution: I'll use my game console for gaming and Linux for the rest. Just my $0.02 --j signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: just some thoughts
On Tue, Jul 25, 2006 at 03:23:38AM -0400, Leinier C. Salfran wrote: El mar, 25-07-2006 a las 03:06 -0400, Kevin Mark escribió: I wanted to go to site with v8 and had to instll wine/firefox and then v8 as a plugin. It was so so on speed and response. But I agree it sucks not because Im not a myspace users but because it is yet another example of companies dragging their heels on getting linux apps produced. If theyd open the source, they'd get the expertise of the FLOSS community work and I'm sure the app would have LESS security hole! cheers, Kev talking and talking .. where to find flash player v8 plugin for firefox? At Adobe.com, but only for Windows Firefox. Kevin installed WINE, which lets him run Windows software on a Linux box. -- Carl Fink [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you attempt to fix something that isn't broken, it will be. -Bruce Tognazzini -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
Roberto writes: LSB *requires* RPM! So what? -- John Hasler -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
On Tuesday 25 July 2006 06:41, Juergen Fiedler wrote: On Mon, Jul 24, 2006 at 07:04:43PM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote: [...] Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Point them in the direction of Cedega and ask them why they're still wasting money on Windows. That would be because Cedega is still far from supporting all games that people want to play. For example, I looked up the next game I am going to get, Prince of Persia: Warrior Within. Turns out the installer works OK, but the game doesn't run at all. And no, I am not inclined to limit my choice of games based on mostly political considerations. I guess I'll stick with my tried and true solution: I'll use my game console for gaming and Linux for the rest. Get coding then. They let you contribute to their CVS. -- Paul Johnson Email and IM (XMPP Google Talk): [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber: Because it's time to move forward http://ursine.ca/Ursine:Jabber pgpEOajF7eFHV.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: just some thoughts
On Tue, Jul 25, 2006 at 11:10:20AM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote: Get coding then. They let you contribute to their CVS. I don't see the point. There are very few (if any) games I would be interested in playing for either Windows or Linux that I can't get for my PS2. Is Katamari Damacy available on Windows yet? signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Odp: Re: just some thoughts
On Tue, Jul 25, 2006 at 06:42:50AM -0500, John Hasler wrote: Zbigniew writes: There's a lot of free games attached to childrens' magazines. Most of them are only for Windows, there is no way to play them on linux. If they are gratis, why do they need to be closed-source? Maybe it's just traditional on Windows. Maybe somebody decided that children don't know what to do with source code. Maybe someone wants to keep the source code to himself so that he can make umpteen free games to attach to childrens' magazines and charge the magazine a fee for each one. -- hendrik -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
I agree with the argument about people engaged in the creative arts. I just started using lilypond, which does put out some very nice looking charts. It may also be the least intuitive code I've touched in maybe five years. There is a windows tool called bandbox that works very well. What I don't understand is the false dichotomy between a free OS and proprietary code that would run on top of it. Would I buy bandbox ported to Linux? YES. Even more important are games. My children run XP because the games run on XP. There are now a few games ported to linux that I'm trying to check out, but there have to be significanly more (like a majority) before I can evict XP from the house. Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). Art Edwards On Sat, Jul 22, 2006 at 01:06:45AM -0400, Chuckk Hubbard wrote: On 7/21/06, Kevin Mark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It costs a lot (in terms of money and developement) to take any current linux software and make it 'newbie fiendly' and close to the supposed ease of 'ms products'. You are free to work on this and ask for help but so far the only folks doing it are ubuntu and they are backed by a billionaire. If only warren buffet had given few billion to Debian! I agree, but as far as ease of use, that does and always will matter to the majority of people using computers as a means to an end. I installed AGNULA Linux out of curiosity, and no, none of the audio programs come close to the customizability and ease of use of something like Digital Performer. The most brilliant artists are not the most brilliant systems people, as much as the brilliant systems people might want that to be true. Anyone doing something creative with computers wants to spend as little time as possible thinking around the interface, and it seems, to an extent, this is something the proprietary teams spend far more time on than most Linux developers. So be it, but until this (gradually) changes, most professional artists and content people will strongly prefer to spend a few hundred dollars extra to shave a few nanoseconds off their production time (e.g., a hotkey instead of a mouse click). One exception I've noticed already is Blender, which seems to be all about the interface, which its users love. This is not the case with Rosegarden. :( I know the usual response is Well Linux doesn't want those people. But I don't buy it. Linux *has* gotten far easier to use and I have no doubt much of the software will continue to do so. No, we don't need those people, but we'll be glad to have them as they (gradually) migrate over, and we'll brag about it once they're here. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts [now OT and silly]
On Mon, Jul 24, 2006 at 09:57:46 -0600, Art Edwards wrote: [...] Even more important are games. My children run XP because the games run on XP. There are now a few games ported to linux that I'm trying to check out, but there have to be significanly more (like a majority) before I can evict XP from the house. Dad, why did you have to install an operating system that is incompatible with 98% of all existing games? Well, I couldn't find an operating system that is incompatible with 100% of all existing games... (Adapted from an old FoxTrot strip which was originally about the iFruit brand of computers.) -- Regards, Florian -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). Linux has a wealth of games and my daughter uses it every day. The only thing for which I boot up windows is music production because of all the projects already on windows software. I look forward to discarding the windows even for this soon. What I no longer do in windows is email and browzing. Everyone knows why. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
In the Great Book it has Been Written that on Mon, 24 Jul 2006 09:57:46 -0600 Art Edwards [EMAIL PROTECTED] didst appear within my Magick Viewing Screen and, being somewhat pleasantly supplicatory, did polemicize thusly: Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). In my own (admittedly limited) experience that is very true. The few computer users I know personally are all Win gamers. Until top-notch NFL, golfing and hunting games come to Linux these fellows won't change although each have approached me about changing already. Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Cybe R. Wizard -- Press 'START' to stop Winduhs -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
On Monday 24 July 2006 13:46, Cybe R. Wizard wrote: In the Great Book it has Been Written that on Mon, 24 Jul 2006 09:57:46 -0600 Art Edwards [EMAIL PROTECTED] didst appear within my Magick Viewing Screen and, being somewhat pleasantly supplicatory, did polemicize thusly: Port games to linux and the adoption rate would skyrocket (IMHO). In my own (admittedly limited) experience that is very true. The few computer users I know personally are all Win gamers. Until top-notch NFL, golfing and hunting games come to Linux these fellows won't change although each have approached me about changing already. Them: Can I run my games? Me: Let me see 'em. No. Them: I guess I'll have to stick with Windows. You can't imagine how frustrating that can be. Point them in the direction of Cedega and ask them why they're still wasting money on Windows. -- Paul Johnson Email and IM (XMPP Google Talk): [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jabber: Because it's time to move forward http://ursine.ca/Ursine:Jabber pgpLw3Jh6oKdp.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: just some thoughts
It's with shame that I even admit this affects me, but if yall didn't know, the social site myspace.com has just moved all its multimedia content to Flash 9.0 due to security problems they had with the previous version, and Adobe has yet to come up with Flash Player 9.0 for Linux. They have a blog from their head developer: http://blogs.adobe.com/penguin.swf/ but I can't help thinking it reads like it was written to try to sound chummy with penguinheads while dragging their feet about just programming the damn thing. The Flash Player project manager says that it's expected in early 2007. Seems deliberate to me, but then I'm paranoid. No doubt it would be done in short order if it were released as FOSS. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
Chuckk Hubbard wrote: It's with shame that I even admit this affects me, but if yall didn't know, the social site myspace.com has just moved all its multimedia content to Flash 9.0 due to security problems they had with the previous version, and Adobe has yet to come up with Flash Player 9.0 for Linux. They have a blog from their head developer: http://blogs.adobe.com/penguin.swf/ but I can't help thinking it reads like it was written to try to sound chummy with penguinheads while dragging their feet about just programming the damn thing. The Flash Player project manager says that it's expected in early 2007. Seems deliberate to me, but then I'm paranoid. No doubt it would be done in short order if it were released as FOSS. Right now, I wouldn't mind having a v8... -- Blessings Wulfmann Wulf Credo: Respect the elders. Teach the young. Co-operate with the pack. Play when you can. Hunt when you must. Rest in between. Share your affections. Voice your opinion. Leave your Mark. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: just some thoughts
On Friday 21 July 2006 07:03, crank u. say wrote: You could promote Linux, and even sell Linux I believe with this approach: I believe this has already been answered extensively by the Linux Advocacy HOWTO.¹ 1. You need a reliable group of Linux experts who have internet access [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2. They will need to have technical, physical and legal ability and authority to take control of a computer that a potential client authorizes them to take control of That's beyond the scope of Free Software. You're more than welcome to start your own company to do that, but I wouldn't expect any Free Software oriented distro to do more than point you to the part of the GPL that says No Warranty. 3. A client (a human being who wants a custom operating system installed to their needs and wants--programs they will be able to use and not any more) will by telephone interview or online questionaire, describe and define what applications they want and need, which in turn will be included in a Linux framework to fit their abilities to actuallyuse them as they are familiar with using application programs. Why not start your own programmer-for-hire business then? This will generally be GUI with defaults that make sense, and options limited for less experienced users and greater for more experienced users. That's called KDE. 4. I am absolutely convinvinced that a seemingly custom Linux operating system could be produced fairly quickly--quickly enough from any number of distros stripped of the superfluous Linux trivia (over half of any distro i have ever seen--all the geek stuff that you throw in for good measure and people like me puzzle over even after seeing the applications for over a year), Debian installs nothing but a base system by default: You don't even get X or any editor other than vi by default. You have to install everything else. If you find something superfluous on a Debian system, it's because *you* (or someone else with root access to your machine) told it to put it there. then personalized by installing for easy use the best applications that people ask for--Firefox browser, not Konqueror, Mozilla Suite would be nice because it has the composer to make simple web pages (forget those other 30 or so arcane editors always in Linux Distros), NVU I swear by and have never found it it a Linux distro, Skype and not the rest of the geek voip phones that you like but no one uses. What's wrong with Konqueror, other than it doesn't have your brand name on it? :o) Seriously, Konqueror also appears in OSX as Safari, thus being the default browser on two major desktop environments. And have you used Mozilla in an environment other than Gnome on Linux? Ugly and slow comes to mind (though I love it on Windows, since it's less noticeable as everything tends towards *FUGLY* and slow there). Open Office is acceptable, but Office compatibility should also be an option even if it costs for some proprietary software. I'm not convinced this is a real argument, since not even Microsoft Office can save and open as many versions of Microsoft Office formats as even Microsoft Office itself. I think KOffice is pretty close to the same par at this point. Have you actually used OpenOffice with Aunt Tillie² audience yet? I have. It works great, the elderly nurses I used to work with preferred the simpler, more straightforward organization of OO.o to Microsoft Office.³ After all, a person will gladly pay for a unique and personal (custom, on e-of-a-kind or whatever marketing term serves you), that has been install by someone to order and even fine tuned and serviced (for a modest fee) to suit the client and to make optimal use of his specific hardware as wellIn other words; if any one of you geniuses would spend an hour or two to put a stable secure operating system based on a core of a Linux distro that was stripped of all the stuff most people do not want, but complete with the applications that people do want and are familiar with (and that work through simple GUI), I think people would pay $50 or so, if out of nothing else but vanity of having a system custonm assembled (not written from scratch--that's stupid) for their use and installed for them so they can be assured that their system is ready to do what they want to do as soon as they start using it and will hold together over time.Hasd anyone (or group of Linux geniuses) ever tried anything at all like this or considered it? You might want to take a look at the Debian Social Contract to see why free software exists, because it appears you are missing the point almost entirely. http://www.debian.org/social_contract ¹ Linux Advocacy HOWTO: http://ursine.ca/cgi-bin/dwww/usr/share/doc/HOWTO/en-html/Advocacy.html ² Aunt Tillie: http://ursine.ca/Aunt_Tillie ³ This was a big win with my boss at the time, who was fretting the idea of having to get into license compliance
Re: just some thoughts
Hi $USER with an idea about a linux distro, On Fri, Jul 21, 2006 at 03:03:48PM +0100, crank u. say wrote: You could promote Linux, and even sell Linux I believe with this approach: 1. You need a reliable group of Linux experts who have internet access 2. They will need to have technical, physical and legal ability and authority to take control of a computer that a potential client authorizes them to take control of 3. A client (a human being who wants a custom operating system installed to their needs and wants--programs they will be able to use and not any more) will by telephone interview or online questionaire, describe and define what applications they want and need, which in turn will be included in a Linux framework to fit their abilities to actuallyuse them as they are familiar with using application programs. This will generally be GUI with defaults that make sense, and options limited for less experienced users and greater for more experienced users. For people who surf the net but have little concept of security hazards or safeguards, the person who makes the Linux package will use their judgement to include essential safeguards by default. 4. I am absolutely convinvinced that a seemingly custom Linux operating system could be produced fairly quickly--quickly enough from any number of distros stripped of the superfluous Linux trivia (over half of any distro i have ever seen--all the geek stuff that you throw in for good measure and people like me puzzle over even after seeing the applications for over a year), then personalized by installing for easy use the best applications that people ask for--Firefox browser, not Konqueror, Mozilla Suite would be nice because it has the composer to make simple web pages (forget those other 30 or so arcane editors always in Linux Distros), NVU I swear by and have never found it it a Linux distro, Skype and not the rest of the geek voip phones that you like but no one uses. Open Office is acceptable, but Office compatibility should also be an option even if it costs for some proprietary software.After all, a person will gladly pay for a unique and personal (custom, on e-of-a-kind or whatever marketing term serves you), that has been install by someone to order and even fine tuned and serviced (for a modest fee) to suit the client and to make optimal use of his specific hardware as wellIn other words; if any one of you geniuses would spend an hour or two to put a stable secure operating system based on a core of a Linux distro that was stripped of all the stuff most people do not want, but complete with the applications that people do want and are familiar with (and that work through simple GUI), I think people would pay $50 or so, if out of nothing else but vanity of having a system custonm assembled (not written from scratch--that's stupid) for their use and installed for them so they can be assured that their system is ready to do what they want to do as soon as they start using it and will hold together over time.Hasd anyone (or group of Linux geniuses) ever tried anything at all like this or considered it? First, Debian is created for a target audience: people who want to do-it-their-way, not a super-user-fiendly newbie point and clicky disto. Ubuntu is sort of trying to do this as are other derivatives. There is even libranet and xandros. Debian has always been a great distro to create a distro. Look at skoelinux. It costs a lot (in terms of money and developement) to take any current linux software and make it 'newbie fiendly' and close to the supposed ease of 'ms products'. You are free to work on this and ask for help but so far the only folks doing it are ubuntu and they are backed by a billionaire. If only warren buffet had given few billion to Debian! cheers Kev -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: | | : :' : The Universal | debian.home.pipeline.com | | `. `' Operating System| go to counter.li.org and | | `-http://www.debian.org/ |be counted! #238656 | | my keysever: pgp.mit.edu | my NPO: cfsg.org | signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: just some thoughts
On 7/21/06, Kevin Mark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It costs a lot (in terms of money and developement) to take any current linux software and make it 'newbie fiendly' and close to the supposed ease of 'ms products'. You are free to work on this and ask for help but so far the only folks doing it are ubuntu and they are backed by a billionaire. If only warren buffet had given few billion to Debian! I agree, but as far as ease of use, that does and always will matter to the majority of people using computers as a means to an end. I installed AGNULA Linux out of curiosity, and no, none of the audio programs come close to the customizability and ease of use of something like Digital Performer. The most brilliant artists are not the most brilliant systems people, as much as the brilliant systems people might want that to be true. Anyone doing something creative with computers wants to spend as little time as possible thinking around the interface, and it seems, to an extent, this is something the proprietary teams spend far more time on than most Linux developers. So be it, but until this (gradually) changes, most professional artists and content people will strongly prefer to spend a few hundred dollars extra to shave a few nanoseconds off their production time (e.g., a hotkey instead of a mouse click). One exception I've noticed already is Blender, which seems to be all about the interface, which its users love. This is not the case with Rosegarden. :( I know the usual response is Well Linux doesn't want those people. But I don't buy it. Linux *has* gotten far easier to use and I have no doubt much of the software will continue to do so. No, we don't need those people, but we'll be glad to have them as they (gradually) migrate over, and we'll brag about it once they're here. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
