Re: about xfce and window managers
On 27 Nov 2012, John L. Cunningham wrote: On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:09:07PM +, Anthony Campbell wrote: Xmonad is good but for configuration you have to delve into Haskell, In my experience, it's not that bad. Mostly because someone has probably already done what you want it to do AND blogged about it. So you just have to cut-and-paste. which is quite an undertaking. Dwm is easier to configure (in C, but you don't really need to know C to change things). I3 and spectrwm both are I use dwm on all my desktops. Have you heard of anyone using it as a window manager inside a desktop environment? My google-fu is failing me. -- John Yes, I resorted to cut-and-paste from stuff on the net for xmonad myself, but I felt that this was a second-best solution. Xmonad has a good discussion forum, which helps. I don't know about using any tiling wm on a desktop - I haven't used one for years. AC -- Anthony Campbell - a...@acampbell.org.uk http://www.acampbell.org.uk http://www.reviewbooks.org.uk http://www.skepticviews.org.uk http://www.acupuncturecourse.org.uk http://www.smashwords.com/profile.view/acampbell -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121128084923.ga21...@acampbell.org.uk
Re: about xfce and window managers
On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 10:42:12AM -0500, John L. Cunningham wrote: On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 07:16:09PM +0200, Klearchos-Angelos Gkountras wrote: I am currently using debian sid with xfce 4.8 . I want to make tiling the windows like awesome or kinda like that . Have you thought about using Xmonad as the wm? http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Xmonad/Using_xmonad_in_XFCE I haven't used it in xfce, but I did use it as the wm for Gnome2 and I was very pleased. You could also use openbox for the wm in XFCE, although, XFCE has its own, yes? (xfwm or something) I use openbox all by itself and love it. ./tony -- http://www.tonybaldwin.me all tony, all the time! 3F330C6E signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: about xfce and window managers
On 26 Nov 2012, John L. Cunningham wrote: On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 07:16:09PM +0200, Klearchos-Angelos Gkountras wrote: I am currently using debian sid with xfce 4.8 . I want to make tiling the windows like awesome or kinda like that . Have you thought about using Xmonad as the wm? http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Xmonad/Using_xmonad_in_XFCE I haven't used it in xfce, but I did use it as the wm for Gnome2 and I was very pleased. John Xmonad is good but for configuration you have to delve into Haskell, which is quite an undertaking. Dwm is easier to configure (in C, but you don't really need to know C to change things). I3 and spectrwm both are configured with plain text files. Of all of them, my current favourite is spectrwm (especially version 2.1.0, not yet packaged for Debian). I've got a lot about my experiments with tiling wms on my linux page and my blog. AC -- Anthony Campbell - a...@acampbell.org.uk http://www.acampbell.org.uk http://www.reviewbooks.org.uk http://www.skepticviews.org.uk http://www.acupuncturecourse.org.uk http://www.smashwords.com/profile.view/acampbell -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121127160907.gb17...@acampbell.org.uk
Re: about xfce and window managers
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:09:07PM +, Anthony Campbell wrote: On 26 Nov 2012, John L. Cunningham wrote: On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 07:16:09PM +0200, Klearchos-Angelos Gkountras wrote: I am currently using debian sid with xfce 4.8 . I want to make tiling the windows like awesome or kinda like that . Have you thought about using Xmonad as the wm? http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Xmonad/Using_xmonad_in_XFCE I haven't used it in xfce, but I did use it as the wm for Gnome2 and I was very pleased. John I use xmonad 0.10 with xfce 4.8 (guided by the link mentioned above) and it works by default very well. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121127165350.gb18...@gmail.com
Re: about xfce and window managers
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:09:07PM +, Anthony Campbell wrote: Xmonad is good but for configuration you have to delve into Haskell, In my experience, it's not that bad. Mostly because someone has probably already done what you want it to do AND blogged about it. So you just have to cut-and-paste. which is quite an undertaking. Dwm is easier to configure (in C, but you don't really need to know C to change things). I3 and spectrwm both are I use dwm on all my desktops. Have you heard of anyone using it as a window manager inside a desktop environment? My google-fu is failing me. -- John -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121127174135.gb26...@infotech.vrg.org
Re: about xfce and window managers
On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 07:16:09PM +0200, Klearchos-Angelos Gkountras wrote: I am currently using debian sid with xfce 4.8 . I want to make tiling the windows like awesome or kinda like that . Have you thought about using Xmonad as the wm? http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Xmonad/Using_xmonad_in_XFCE I haven't used it in xfce, but I did use it as the wm for Gnome2 and I was very pleased. John -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121126154211.gc3...@infotech.vrg.org
about xfce and window managers
I am currently using debian sid with xfce 4.8 . I want to make tiling the windows like awesome or kinda like that . Ok , when will xfce4.10 will be on sid or which repo about xfce 4.10 might I can use ? IMHO experimental xfce 4.10 is buggy . I can help to fix that I guess. When I tried to working on awesome or fluxbox I havent connect to gnome network manager and I got error about privilengts . -- Klearchos-Angelos Gkountras http://jemaduxblog.blogspot.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121125171609.GA7875@thinkpad
Re: about xfce and window managers
On Sun, 2012-11-25 at 19:16 +0200, Klearchos-Angelos Gkountras wrote: I am currently using debian sid with xfce 4.8 . I want to make tiling the windows like awesome or kinda like that . Ok , when will xfce4.10 will be on sid or which repo about xfce 4.10 might I can use ? IMHO experimental xfce 4.10 is buggy . I can help to fix that I guess. When I tried to working on awesome or fluxbox I havent connect to gnome network manager and I got error about privilengts . Respect :) Xfce 4.10 seems to be an issue on all Linux distros. I don't think that it's Xfce only, but indirectly has to do with GNOME, systemd compatibility, dependencies, dbus etc.. I'm also missing backwards compatibility for current Linux applications. If app X isn't good switch to app Y and drop all your old data. I started with KDE3, when it was dropped I switched to GNOME2, when this was dropped, I switched to Xfce and now Xfce became unusable for my needs too. On another list I wrote, that nowadays startup only takes 3 seconds, but to open an email does take 30 seconds. Ok, ok, startup still takes a little bit longer and to open an email is still a little bit faster, but it does describes a little bit what happens on my machine. YMMV, Ralf -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1353865667.2508.158.camel@q
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
Dan Hitt dan.h...@gmail.com wrote: This is a sort of subquery to the question of how to change window managers. (And thanks again Johan, Camaleón, and Indulekha for your earlier help.) So the question is: supposing you compile a window manager yourself, so that it does not come from the packaging system. What is the standard best way of setting this new window manager as yours? It certainly won't exist in any of the lists on the login page, since debian could not know about it. So, i googled around, and there's this page http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/doc/debian/ch-X.html which recommends just making an executable file /home/USER/.xsession and putting in a sequence of commands there---which could just be the path to your window manager. I tried this, and . . . . it works. But i feel a little uneasy about this, like this is not a best practice, or some newer release of debian may break it. (Note that the window manager i built is WindowMaker 0.95.2 which is a few revisions ahead of the squeeze version. And although it certainly works, and i can launch applications, it doesn't look at all like the squeeze version. For example, it has a solid light purple background, instead of the debian swirls.) Thanks in advance for any info. The best way is to make a debian package of it, then install it with dpkg. Check this out: http://wiki.debian.org/HowToPackageForDebian Have fun! -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120430133632.GA22554@radhesyama
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
Thanks Indulekha and Johan for the suggestions. Indulekha, making a package is an intriguing idea, but probably too ambitious for me at the moment. Johan, your net is much more suggestive than mine :) I did google around but didn't see that method. There's also apparently yet another way, which is not as systematic as the ones suggested by Indulekha and Johan, and sort of similar to the ~/.xsession, but to do it in ~/.xinitrc. That is from Pierre-Philipp Braun: http://pbraun.nethence.com/doc/wm/windowmaker.html I appreciate everybody's help in setting up my debian system. dan On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 6:36 AM, Indulekha indule...@theunworthy.com wrote: Dan Hitt dan.h...@gmail.com wrote: This is a sort of subquery to the question of how to change window managers. (And thanks again Johan, Camaleón, and Indulekha for your earlier help.) So the question is: supposing you compile a window manager yourself, so that it does not come from the packaging system. What is the standard best way of setting this new window manager as yours? It certainly won't exist in any of the lists on the login page, since debian could not know about it. So, i googled around, and there's this page http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/doc/debian/ch-X.html which recommends just making an executable file /home/USER/.xsession and putting in a sequence of commands there---which could just be the path to your window manager. I tried this, and . . . . it works. But i feel a little uneasy about this, like this is not a best practice, or some newer release of debian may break it. (Note that the window manager i built is WindowMaker 0.95.2 which is a few revisions ahead of the squeeze version. And although it certainly works, and i can launch applications, it doesn't look at all like the squeeze version. For example, it has a solid light purple background, instead of the debian swirls.) Thanks in advance for any info. The best way is to make a debian package of it, then install it with dpkg. Check this out: http://wiki.debian.org/HowToPackageForDebian Have fun! -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120430133632.GA22554@radhesyama -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caophizksc6zbejd0ghrf7um5_u_gr76f772jijv7xn-fctd...@mail.gmail.com
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
This is a sort of subquery to the question of how to change window managers. (And thanks again Johan, Camaleón, and Indulekha for your earlier help.) So the question is: supposing you compile a window manager yourself, so that it does not come from the packaging system. What is the standard best way of setting this new window manager as yours? It certainly won't exist in any of the lists on the login page, since debian could not know about it. So, i googled around, and there's this page http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/doc/debian/ch-X.html which recommends just making an executable file /home/USER/.xsession and putting in a sequence of commands there---which could just be the path to your window manager. I tried this, and . . . . it works. But i feel a little uneasy about this, like this is not a best practice, or some newer release of debian may break it. (Note that the window manager i built is WindowMaker 0.95.2 which is a few revisions ahead of the squeeze version. And although it certainly works, and i can launch applications, it doesn't look at all like the squeeze version. For example, it has a solid light purple background, instead of the debian swirls.) Thanks in advance for any info. dan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAOphizK6erpShrkXbt8eyAOdTQdNymjZR_UXQqhOXe1MW=q...@mail.gmail.com
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
2012-04-30 05:36, Dan Hitt skrev: This is a sort of subquery to the question of how to change window managers. So the question is: supposing you compile a window manager yourself, so that it does not come from the packaging system. What is the standard best way of setting this new window manager as yours? It certainly won't exist in any of the lists on the login page, since debian could not know about it. So, i googled around, and there's this page http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/doc/debian/ch-X.html which recommends just making an executable file /home/USER/.xsession and putting in a sequence of commands there---which could just be the path to your window manager. I tried this, and . . . . it works. But i feel a little uneasy about this, like this is not a best practice, or some newer release of debian may break it. My internet suggests to look in the /usr/share/xsessions folder, and create a new file there. The files there appear to be .desktop files, whose format should be defined be the internet somewhere (a freedesktop.org-related format, I believe). I have not tested this. Regards Johan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jnl75c$38a$1...@dough.gmane.org
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 21:36:09 -0700, Dan Hitt wrote: I'm running debian 6.0.4 (squeeze). I'm attempting to change my window manager from the default metacity to wmaker (WindowMaker). I attempted the change by sudo update-alternatives --display x-window-manager and then choosing the wmaker alternative. (...) Mmm, juts a quick note. You can try with: update-alternatives --config x-window-manager Which will ask you about the preferred option. Then you can check the current setting with --display. You can also consider in selecting WM from the available window managers dropdown menu at the login screen. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jn983p$qo9$1...@dough.gmane.org
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
Thanks Camaleón and Johan for your suggestions. For reference, here's what happened: Camaleón: i did try the update-alternatives path, including the --display option to check. It reports wmaker, but has no effect otherwise that i can tell. The idea of choosing a window manager a login time is intriguing, but for my system (6.0.4 squeeze) there doesn't seem to be an option to do this. Johan: I tried the gui method you suggested for changing the wm (and i believe your path was correct). This time there was an effect, but not much and sort of the wrong one :( What happened was that the screen drawing shifted upwards, as if it were no longer taking into account the menu bar along the top of the entire screen. So a few things had their top parts hidden by this shift, but none of the wmaker stuff seemed to be present. But it is very valuable nevertheless --- i imagine that i have to disable the entire gnome apparatus somehow (but don't know whether wmaker is savvy enough to manage under those circumstances). Thanks in advance for any other advice anybody may have. (Is anybody actually using WindowMaker on this list? Maybe my problem is i'm posting to the wrong list? :) But thanks everybody for your help because you certainly are very helpful!) dan On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 9:18 AM, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 21:36:09 -0700, Dan Hitt wrote: I'm running debian 6.0.4 (squeeze). I'm attempting to change my window manager from the default metacity to wmaker (WindowMaker). I attempted the change by sudo update-alternatives --display x-window-manager and then choosing the wmaker alternative. (...) Mmm, juts a quick note. You can try with: update-alternatives --config x-window-manager Which will ask you about the preferred option. Then you can check the current setting with --display. You can also consider in selecting WM from the available window managers dropdown menu at the login screen. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jn983p$qo9$1...@dough.gmane.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caophizkd3jkj1rbx3qv4h3stysxe58htjc_z4htnhngxpni...@mail.gmail.com
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 02:10:03PM -0700, Dan Hitt wrote: Thanks Camaleón and Johan for your suggestions. For reference, here's what happened: Camaleón: i did try the update-alternatives path, including the --display option to check. It reports wmaker, but has no effect otherwise that i can tell. The idea of choosing a window manager a login time is intriguing, but for my system (6.0.4 squeeze) there doesn't seem to be an option to do this. Johan: I tried the gui method you suggested for changing the wm (and i believe your path was correct). This time there was an effect, but not much and sort of the wrong one :( What happened was that the screen drawing shifted upwards, as if it were no longer taking into account the menu bar along the top of the entire screen. So a few things had their top parts hidden by this shift, but none of the wmaker stuff seemed to be present. But it is very valuable nevertheless --- i imagine that i have to disable the entire gnome apparatus somehow (but don't know whether wmaker is savvy enough to manage under those circumstances). Thanks in advance for any other advice anybody may have. (Is anybody actually using WindowMaker on this list? Maybe my problem is i'm posting to the wrong list? :) But thanks everybody for your help because you certainly are very helpful!) dan On Squeeze, which uses GDM3, you need to enter your login name before the option to change your session appears. Once you choose a different window manager, that will be the default for that user. I use Fluxbox, and GDM3 logs me into a Fluxbox session every time. I did not change anything with the update-alternatives command (mostly because the other users on this system default to Gnome). -Rob -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120425213648.gb13...@aurora.owens.net
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
On 04/25/2012 05:10 PM, Dan Hitt wrote: Thanks Camaleón and Johan for your suggestions. For reference, here's what happened: Camaleón: i did try the update-alternatives path, including the --display option to check. It reports wmaker, but has no effect otherwise that i can tell. The idea of choosing a window manager a login time is intriguing, but for my system (6.0.4 squeeze) there doesn't seem to be an option to do this. Johan: I tried the gui method you suggested for changing the wm (and i believe your path was correct). This time there was an effect, but not much and sort of the wrong one :( What happened was that the screen drawing shifted upwards, as if it were no longer taking into account the menu bar along the top of the entire screen. So a few things had their top parts hidden by this shift, but none of the wmaker stuff seemed to be present. But it is very valuable nevertheless --- i imagine that i have to disable the entire gnome apparatus somehow (but don't know whether wmaker is savvy enough to manage under those circumstances). Thanks in advance for any other advice anybody may have. (Is anybody actually using WindowMaker on this list? Maybe my problem is i'm posting to the wrong list? :) But thanks everybody for your help because you certainly are very helpful!) Yes, but I also have fluxbox, blackbox, icewm, openbox and twm installed and have not used the alternatives, ever to get them running. Long ago I installed them to see which one I liked and they are still installed. I use,mainly fluxbox and it has a Windows Manager option that shows all tha WM's I have installed. I, not very often, switch to one of the others but always end up using fluxbox. I have some gnome apps but never loaded it up after seeing what it looked like in Ubuntu. So my way of setting the WM's may not work unless you dump Gnome. Hope this helps Wayne On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 9:18 AM, Camaleónnoela...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 21:36:09 -0700, Dan Hitt wrote: I'm running debian 6.0.4 (squeeze). I'm attempting to change my window manager from the default metacity to wmaker (WindowMaker). I attempted the change by sudo update-alternatives --display x-window-manager and then choosing the wmaker alternative. (...) Mmm, juts a quick note. You can try with: update-alternatives --config x-window-manager Which will ask you about the preferred option. Then you can check the current setting with --display. You can also consider in selecting WM from the available window managers dropdown menu at the login screen. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jn983p$qo9$1...@dough.gmane.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4f986fda.1010...@gmail.com
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
Dan Hitt dan.h...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks in advance for any other advice anybody may have. (Is anybody actually using WindowMaker on this list? Maybe my problem is i'm posting to the wrong list? :) But thanks everybody for your help because you certainly are very helpful!) I was using wmaker until maybe two years ago, but it seems to have fallen behind to the point it just doesn't play well with a lot of modern software anymore. Now I use fvwm, but frankly configuration is not for the impatient or the faint of heart. Openbox is nearly as powerful as fvwm, and is a lot easier to configure, though it's too late for me -- I'm now hopelessly addicted to the power and flexibility of fvwm. Then again I'm one of those weirdos who actually *enjoys* staying up all night reading man and info pages. :) There used to be a couple of preconfigured versions of fvwm, one called 95 (hideous win95- like config), and one called crystal (too bloaty and overwrought for me last I tried it). Not sure if those are even still around though... Openbox just uses an xml config file, so it's actually quite simple to configure once you find a good example or two. Could be better documented, but all settings are somewhat discoverable (the obconf gui doesn't even begin to cover what you can achieve). -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120425225856.GA30224@radhesyama
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
Thanks Rob, Wayne, and Indulekha for your help (and thanks again Johan and Camaleón for your earlier help). Rob, thanks for pointing out where the window manager selection was on the screen (in my case, at the bottom, and as you said, only visible after the user account is selected). That actually worked and i'm using wmaker (WindowMaker) now. Wayne --- i thought that i would have to dump gnome as you indicated. Maybe i've done it partially? I only have a very hazy feel for what is running or not---some components of the gnome system are running though, according to ps aux | grep gnome (gdm-simple-slave, polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1, gnome-terminal, and gnome-pty-helper). Indulekha --- if you would care to answer --- what is the software that wmaker does not interact well with? I'm a complete neophyte here (new to debian and new to wmaker) so would appreciate any information about it. (The reason i'm trying out wmaker is that i think it should be most compatible with gnustep, but that's another long story.) Thanks again everybody for all the info and suggestions. dan On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 3:58 PM, Indulekha indule...@theunworthy.com wrote: Dan Hitt dan.h...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks in advance for any other advice anybody may have. (Is anybody actually using WindowMaker on this list? Maybe my problem is i'm posting to the wrong list? :) But thanks everybody for your help because you certainly are very helpful!) I was using wmaker until maybe two years ago, but it seems to have fallen behind to the point it just doesn't play well with a lot of modern software anymore. Now I use fvwm, but frankly configuration is not for the impatient or the faint of heart. Openbox is nearly as powerful as fvwm, and is a lot easier to configure, though it's too late for me -- I'm now hopelessly addicted to the power and flexibility of fvwm. Then again I'm one of those weirdos who actually *enjoys* staying up all night reading man and info pages. :) There used to be a couple of preconfigured versions of fvwm, one called 95 (hideous win95- like config), and one called crystal (too bloaty and overwrought for me last I tried it). Not sure if those are even still around though... Openbox just uses an xml config file, so it's actually quite simple to configure once you find a good example or two. Could be better documented, but all settings are somewhat discoverable (the obconf gui doesn't even begin to cover what you can achieve). -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120425225856.GA30224@radhesyama -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caophiz+jbfkpf9ytsrrjt5u5739+ihqm_cbovbt0o3k9z3o...@mail.gmail.com
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
In linux.debian.user, you wrote: Indulekha --- if you would care to answer --- what is the software that wmaker does not interact well with? I had trouble with terminator (my preferred terminal emulator) and also with conky, which I use insted of a dock or system tray. Bear in mind, I switched nearly two years ago so it might be better now. ISTR there was an annoying problem with fullscreen video, too, but I don't remember what exactly. Probably xine-ui, which I finally dumped for vlc. Probably should have mentioned, I haven't used gnome since like 2004. Also I'm not much of a mouse lover, my config is completely keyboard driven. I loved wmaker for a long time, but fvwm has spoiled me now. :) I'm a complete neophyte here (new to debian and new to wmaker) so would appreciate any information about it. (The reason i'm trying out wmaker is that i think it should be most compatible with gnustep, but that's another long story.) I think most everything is pretty compatible with gnustep -- I have to exclude kde4.x from that though, as I've only had a few hours being tortured by it a few times and that was quite enough! :) If you stick with wmaker, the wmakerconf package is much more powerful than the default config tools in wmaker. -- ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ Indulekha -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120426023841.GA1275@radhesyama
changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
I'm running debian 6.0.4 (squeeze). I'm attempting to change my window manager from the default metacity to wmaker (WindowMaker). I attempted the change by sudo update-alternatives --display x-window-manager and then choosing the wmaker alternative. When i run update-alternatives --display x-window-manager i believe it indicates that wmaker is my window manager. The exact output is: x-window-manager - manual mode link currently points to /usr/bin/wmaker /usr/bin/metacity - priority 60 slave x-window-manager.1.gz: /usr/share/man/man1/metacity.1.gz /usr/bin/twm - priority 40 slave x-window-manager.1.gz: /usr/share/man/man1/twm.1.gz /usr/bin/wmaker - priority 50 slave x-window-manager.1.gz: /usr/share/man/man1/wmaker.1x.gz Current 'best' version is '/usr/bin/metacity'. But the display looks absolutely unchanged (even after logging out and back in, and even after rebooting). So i presume that this means i need to change some other display components? Or do some other steps besides just running the update-alternatives program? Thanks in advance for any clues or links to FAQs or any other documentation i should consult. dan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caophiz+qwhgs4ywqsy_n_s8cvnkd7uwciwpsuphjurvghu+...@mail.gmail.com
Re: changing window managers in debian 6.0.4
2012-04-25 06:36, Dan Hitt skrev: I'm running debian 6.0.4 (squeeze). I'm attempting to change my window manager from the default metacity to wmaker (WindowMaker). I attempted the change by sudo update-alternatives --display x-window-manager and then choosing the wmaker alternative. I think gnome uses its own configuration system rather than debian's. I think it goes something like this: Open gconf-editor (install it if it is not already installed). Find the correct place to edit (I do not have a gnome2 installation here). It may be desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanager, as suggested by the internet. You could search for required_components and I think you should find the right place. You should see that windowmanager is set to metacity. Change it to whatever you like (wmaker, I guess). At least that procedure worked for me when I switched form metacity to compiz. There is also the command line way. As I have never used it I will not propose it, but the internet hints at gconftool-2 -s /desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanager xmonad --type string as the command line way of setting the windowmanager to xmonad. / johan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jn82au$da4$1...@dough.gmane.org
Re: Tiling Window Managers [était: des outils qui changent la vie]
steph elucubrated on 2009-03-25: Edi Stojicevic estojice...@debianworld.org: * Yves Rutschle debian.anti-s...@rutschle.net [2009-03-25 10:03:56 +0100] wrote : *ION*, un des seuls window managers. (qui est particulièrement adapté à l'usage de vim, mutt, latex et autres texteries). Regarde du côté du window manager awesome qui est vraiment pas mal du tout :) Je viens de découvrir un window manager particulièrement pratique: wmii. Il m'a fait abandonner fluxbox que j'utilisais depuis plus de deux ans. Du côté des gestionnaires de fenêtres en mosaïque, j'utilise xmonad que je trouve très puissant et très stable car développé en haskell, et qui a l'avantage d'être en développement très actif (enfin, pour ce type de programme). Une grande partie de la puissance vient des modules additionnels: aptitude install xmonad libghc6-xmonad-contrib-dev Élie -- Il est utile de connaître son ennemi - ne serait-ce que parce qu'un jour on aura peut-être l'occasion de s'en faire un ami. -+- Margaret Thatcher -+- -- Lisez la FAQ de la liste avant de poser une question : http://wiki.debian.org/fr/FrenchLists Vous pouvez aussi ajouter le mot ``spam'' dans vos champs From et Reply-To: Pour vous DESABONNER, envoyez un message avec comme objet unsubscribe vers debian-user-french-requ...@lists.debian.org En cas de soucis, contactez EN ANGLAIS listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: minimalist window managers [was Re: Preferred applications: IDE, text-editor, music player.]
On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 1:50 PM, Andrew Sackville-West [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I started with wmii, played with some others, and then stumbled on xmonad and got hooked. to each their own. Just like vimperator... tried it but I'm apparently not a vim guy... emacs seems to suit me better, thus vimperator was a bad fit. I find I use a text browser more and more. what about conkeror? It was an extension to give Firefox Emacs-style keybindings, but is now a separate XULRunner browser. http://conkeror.org/ Cheers, Kelly Clowers -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: minimalist window managers [was Re: Preferred applications: IDE, text-editor, music player.]
On Fri, Jun 20, 2008 at 12:01:59AM -0700, Kelly Clowers wrote: On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 1:50 PM, Andrew Sackville-West [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I started with wmii, played with some others, and then stumbled on xmonad and got hooked. to each their own. Just like vimperator... tried it but I'm apparently not a vim guy... emacs seems to suit me better, thus vimperator was a bad fit. I find I use a text browser more and more. what about conkeror? It was an extension to give Firefox Emacs-style keybindings, but is now a separate XULRunner browser. http://conkeror.org/ interesting, thanks for this. A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: minimalist window managers [was Re: Preferred applications: IDE, text-editor, music player.]
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 05:16:47PM -0500, Kevin Monceaux wrote: A, On Wed, 18 Jun 2008, Andrew Sackville-West wrote: if you decide to investigate other minimalist WM's you might look at xmonad. It's all keyboard controlled, tiled with a variety of customizable tiling layouts. pretty fun(unctional). Actually, I was using xmonad before switching to DWM. I'll take configuring DWM via editing a C header file(config.h) and recompiling DWM over Haskell any day. :-) Actually I've tried xmonad, ion3, ratpoison, awesome, evilwm, stumpwm, and probably a few others I'm forgetting. I ended up trying DWM a couple of times before I got hooked. Oh, did I mention I use the vimperator Firefox plugin to give my browser a vim look/feel. I started with wmii, played with some others, and then stumbled on xmonad and got hooked. to each their own. Just like vimperator... tried it but I'm apparently not a vim guy... emacs seems to suit me better, thus vimperator was a bad fit. I find I use a text browser more and more. A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
minimalist window managers [was Re: Preferred applications: IDE, text-editor, music player.]
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 01:38:42PM -0500, Kevin Monceaux wrote: Nuno, On Wed, 18 Jun 2008, Nuno Magalhães wrote: The thing is i have a few requirements: i want applications that are not desktop-dependant (i.e. Gnome or KDE) and do not rely upon Java. This rules out a lot of text editors. For console, i use nano, for GUI i'm using leafpad, any other suggestions? I've gone to the extreme with desktop-independence. I use DWM as my window manager and have it tweaked such that unless I happen to have a browser or image/movie viewer open it looks just like the Linux console. The only window decorations is a one pixel wide border to show which window has focus, which I can toggle off/on. DWM can be completely controlled via the keyboard. I use the plain Jane console version of vim even when using it under X in a urxvt window. if you decide to investigate other minimalist WM's you might look at xmonad. It's all keyboard controlled, tiled with a variety of customizable tiling layouts. pretty fun(unctional). A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: minimalist window managers [was Re: Preferred applications: IDE, text-editor, music player.]
A, On Wed, 18 Jun 2008, Andrew Sackville-West wrote: if you decide to investigate other minimalist WM's you might look at xmonad. It's all keyboard controlled, tiled with a variety of customizable tiling layouts. pretty fun(unctional). Actually, I was using xmonad before switching to DWM. I'll take configuring DWM via editing a C header file(config.h) and recompiling DWM over Haskell any day. :-) Actually I've tried xmonad, ion3, ratpoison, awesome, evilwm, stumpwm, and probably a few others I'm forgetting. I ended up trying DWM a couple of times before I got hooked. Oh, did I mention I use the vimperator Firefox plugin to give my browser a vim look/feel. Kevin http://www.RawFedDogs.net http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org Bruceville, TX Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes. Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
non-packaged window managers?
I wanted to try some window managers (and add ons) not yet packaged for debian testing. What is best way to handle it? And I want to update the Debian Menu so I can choose this custom wm from my other Debian-aware wms and I also wish to add the Debian Menu to my custom wm. And I want to add my custom wm to gdm. Zach -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: non-packaged window managers?
El mar, 12-06-2007 a las 19:11 -0400, Zach escribió: I wanted to try some window managers (and add ons) not yet packaged for debian testing. What is best way to handle it? And I want to update the Debian Menu so I can choose this custom wm from my other Debian-aware wms and I also wish to add the Debian Menu to my custom wm. And I want to add my custom wm to gdm. I think the best way to handle it is using the Debian way for compiling: aptitude show dpkg-dev aptitude show dh-make The entries on the debian menu are in /usr/share/applications, check out the syntax of the files there. Usually the debian menu will be there, if it's not you'll have to look at the wm docs and learn how to tell the menu where to find the menu entries. To add the wm to gdm check /usr/share/xsessions . Gabriel. -- Gabriel Parrondo GNU/Linux User #404138 GnuPG Public Key ID: BED7BF43 JID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only difference between theory and practice is that, in theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. signature.asc Description: Esta parte del mensaje está firmada digitalmente
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Thu, 2 Nov 2006 18:52:12 -0800 Seeker5528 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] Currently I am mixing and matching stuff, starting what I want to run from a .xsession file in my home directory. My .xsession file looks like this: # Begin .xsession gnome-settings-daemon gnome-panel #skippy docker -iconsize 64 wmifs -i eth0 wmwave wmifs -i eth2 wmmon wmnetselect -e /usr/bin/firefox -t fbpager -w wallpaper-tray kmix kmixctrl --restore exec fluxbox #End .xsession [...] Now that's what I call eclectic. :-) -- Liam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On (31/10/06 13:19), Jeronimo Pellegrini wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. Well another convert :) openbox is almost as functional but without the extra 'fluff' as you say. It also seems more predictable in terms of behaviour. fluxbox used to do some strange things when trying to 'stick' gkrellm to every workspace. Thanks Clive -- www.clivemenzies.co.uk ... ...strategies for business -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
* Clive Menzies ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. Well another convert :) openbox is almost as functional but without the extra 'fluff' as you say. It also seems more predictable in terms of behaviour. fluxbox used to do some strange things when trying to 'stick' gkrellm to every workspace. I like Openbox a lot, though I wish it had desktop warping, but since using Debian Etch I cannot get it to work right. Any panel I use, so far I have tried fbpanel and pypanel, seems to swallow any windows permanently. If I minimize a window I cannot click on the button and restore it. I tried compiling the apps myself but nothing seemed to change. Oddly, it is being able to use things like pypanel which is what I prefer about Openbox. Patrick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Tue, 31 Oct 2006 14:51:12 + B. Hoffmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My question is which wm to use, as Gnome install metacity by default and I don't have experience with anything else. There's a lot of information on Google Groups and in the Debian archives, however I have a more specific question (bearing in mind this will be used as desktop and ratpoison is not an option). Personally I prefer fluxbox, whether I am using it stand alone, with KDE or with Gnome. Currently I am mixing and matching stuff, starting what I want to run from a .xsession file in my home directory. My .xsession file looks like this: # Begin .xsession gnome-settings-daemon gnome-panel #skippy docker -iconsize 64 wmifs -i eth0 wmwave wmifs -i eth2 wmmon wmnetselect -e /usr/bin/firefox -t fbpager -w wallpaper-tray kmix kmixctrl --restore exec fluxbox #End .xsession Since I am using Gnome panel, visibility of the fluxbox panel is set to false, and using kmix this way you have to edit ~/.kde/share/config/kmixrc setting Visible=false or kmix has this annoying habit of popping up every time you log in instead of waiting until you click it's tray icon. Later, Seeker -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Ron Johnson wrote: Get off my lawn, you young whippersnappers! Oh, stop being such a grumpy old man. :-p *Window* manager != *display* manager. Yeah I know, but both have to be... SHINY!!! :-D Best regards, -- George Borisov DXSolutions Ltd signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Window managers-which one?
On 31 Oct 2006, Douglas Tutty wrote: I use icewm. It does everything I want without the struggle of adding features to a less featurful wm and is low on resource usage. It must be fast because it doesn't get in the way on the 486. Doug. Another vote for icewm. I've tried numerous others but always come back to icewm in the end. Anthony -- Anthony Campbell - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microsoft-free zone - Using Linux Gnu-Debian http://www.acampbell.org.uk (blog, book reviews, on-line books and sceptical articles) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11/01/06 03:18, George Borisov wrote: Ron Johnson wrote: Get off my lawn, you young whippersnappers! Oh, stop being such a grumpy old man. :-p *Window* manager != *display* manager. Yeah I know, but both have to be... SHINY!!! :-D Bah humbug!!! - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Is common sense really valid? For example, it is common sense to white-power racists that whites are superior to blacks, and that those with brown skins are mud people. However, that common sense is obviously wrong. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFSKQHS9HxQb37XmcRArEIAKDvMKnjXbDcDOGEXkuirkNMErfBNACfVeiA 5d8psPS8YQ+P1k+8CLRM4Vk= =8OAW -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Ron Johnson wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11/01/06 03:18, George Borisov wrote: Ron Johnson wrote: Get off my lawn, you young whippersnappers! Oh, stop being such a grumpy old man. :-p *Window* manager != *display* manager. Yeah I know, but both have to be... SHINY!!! :-D Bah humbug!!! In a multi-seat Debian system where there are several videocards/xservers/monitors/keyboards/mice, all of which is now possible in Etch/Sid with just xorg.conf gdm is a must. It shows the logon screen on each monitor and the user just logs on. The startx alternative would be excruciatingly difficult: first going over to the monitor with VT's, logging on as user, giving the right startx command, walking over to the monitor you have chosen, and you leave your vt dangling. H -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
B. Hoffmann wrote: Hi all ! I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Then proceeded to install xfce and synaptic and that's it so far. Don't want any unnecessary fluff this time. My question is which wm to use, as Gnome install metacity by default and I don't have experience with anything else. There's a lot of information on Google Groups and in the Debian archives, however I have a more specific question (bearing in mind this will be used as desktop and ratpoison is not an option). 1. How does sawfish compare in functionality and is it a good option with xfce? 2. Anybody have experience with qvwm? 3. Intending to use Crystal-fvwm later on, will any of these play nice with fvwm too? Must confess I'm still a bit confused as to what exactly a WM does as some seem to have themes available for them which I thought was down to the DE. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? I use fvwm exclusively. PRO: very versatile. CON: 1. I am now wedded to .fvwm2rc 2. I have no idea of the total capability of fvwm. H -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
B. Hoffmann wrote: BTW, Xfce seems to manage windows currently but it's not terribly smooth, it's giving a sort of rolling effect when redrawing, that's why the quest for something better. Yes, I had the same feeling with both Xfce and icewm. That's the reason I stuck with gnome. It works, after all The only issue is file browser in my version of Gnome which is disgusting and xedit which works slw, but I'm used on it. -- Mladen Adamovic http://www.online-utility.org http://www.cheapvps.info http://www.vpsreview.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Tue, 31 Oct 2006 13:55:40 -0800 Marc Shapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Douglas Tutty wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: On (31/10/06 14:51), B. Hoffmann wrote: I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I like basic functionality, configurability, without bloat; I have been running a 486 for years... I use icewm. It does everything I want without the struggle of adding features to a less featurful wm and is low on resource usage. It must be fast because it doesn't get in the way on the 486. I have been using fvwm since I started with linux and Debian about 8 years ago. That was on a 486/33MHz with 12MB of memory. I installed Debian on a 128MB removable disk. I have used KDE on a few occaisions, but I generally prefer a clear, uncluttered screen. I also don't care for all of the extra processes that get started by KDE apps, even when you are not running KDE. One of the main reasons I don't run any kde apps. There are a few nice ones but if you start one up you then need to kill off 7 others manually when you close it. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Anthony Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 31 Oct 2006, Douglas Tutty wrote: I use icewm. It does everything I want without the struggle of adding features to a less featurful wm and is low on resource usage. It must be fast because it doesn't get in the way on the 486. Doug. Another vote for icewm. I've tried numerous others but always come back to icewm in the end. For someone like me who grew-up with Windows, icewm was a good choice. I didn't want all the bloat in KDE or Gnome and, after some tweaking, icewm has gotten pretty close to my (good or bad) habits from Windows. Regards, Andrei -- If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. (Albert Einstein) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Micha Feigin wrote: On Tue, 31 Oct 2006 13:55:40 -0800 Marc Shapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Douglas Tutty wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: On (31/10/06 14:51), B. Hoffmann wrote: I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I like basic functionality, configurability, without bloat; I have been running a 486 for years... I use icewm. It does everything I want without the struggle of adding features to a less featurful wm and is low on resource usage. It must be fast because it doesn't get in the way on the 486. I have been using fvwm since I started with linux and Debian about 8 years ago. That was on a 486/33MHz with 12MB of memory. I installed Debian on a 128MB removable disk. I have used KDE on a few occaisions, but I generally prefer a clear, uncluttered screen. I also don't care for all of the extra processes that get started by KDE apps, even when you are not running KDE. One of the main reasons I don't run any kde apps. There are a few nice ones but if you start one up you then need to kill off 7 others manually when you close it. Precisely! The last two that I actually used were kcalc and kate. They have been replaced by galculator and SciTE and I am quite happy about it. Nothing left to start up artsd and interfere with my sound, or to startup a million kdeinit processes. Removing libartsc0 did a marvellous job of eliminating kde and its apps from my box. -- Marc Shapiro No boom today. Boom tomorrow. There's always a boom tomorrow. What?! Look, somebody's got to have some damn perspective around here. Boom. Sooner or later ... boom! - Susan Ivanova: B5 - Grail -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On 11/1/06, Marc Shapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Precisely! The last two that I actually used were kcalc and kate. They have been replaced by galculator and SciTE and I am quite happy about it. Nothing left to start up artsd and interfere with my sound, or to startup a million kdeinit processes. Removing libartsc0 did a marvellous job of eliminating kde and its apps from my box. It seems to me like the KDE processes used to not go away, but now they do. For example, I closed Amarok (only kde app I had running) less that a minute ago and all the kde processes are now gone (without killing them manually). As for arts, yeah, it sucks (waiting for kde 4 and phonon...). My solution was to disable the sound system in the kde control center, and then remove the arts package. I left the libarts packages, because some programs depend on them, but without artsd, libarts can't hurt anything. Of course, if you can manage without any kde apps, that's great, but I need my Amarok, and occasionally kword, kivio, krita, ksnapshot and konq. Cheers, Kelly -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Wednesday 01 November 2006 10:53 am, Andrei Popescu wrote: For someone like me who grew-up with Windows, icewm was a good choice. I didn't want all the bloat in KDE or Gnome and, after some tweaking, icewm has gotten pretty close to my (good or bad) habits from Windows. I use KDE or wmaker. -- Paganism is populated almost entirely by white middle class academia ... A whopping 75 percent of them participate in grindingly boring interpretations of deviant sexuality. - alliekatt -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Window managers-which one?
BTW, Xfce seems to manage windows currently but it's not terribly smooth, it's giving a sort of rolling effect when redrawing, that's why the quest for something better. Thanks. -- Kind Regards, B. Hoffmann -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On (31/10/06 14:51), B. Hoffmann wrote: I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Then proceeded to install xfce and synaptic and that's it so far. Don't want any unnecessary fluff this time. My question is which wm to use, as Gnome install metacity by default and I don't have experience with anything else. There's a lot of information on Google Groups and in the Debian archives, however I have a more specific question (bearing in mind this will be used as desktop and ratpoison is not an option). 1. How does sawfish compare in functionality and is it a good option with xfce? 2. Anybody have experience with qvwm? 3. Intending to use Crystal-fvwm later on, will any of these play nice with fvwm too? Must confess I'm still a bit confused as to what exactly a WM does as some seem to have themes available for them which I thought was down to the DE. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? Apologies for bringing this up again! Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. Regards Clive -- www.clivemenzies.co.uk ... ...strategies for business -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
B. Hoffmann wrote: I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Then proceeded to install xfce and synaptic and that's it so far. Don't want any unnecessary fluff this time. Not sure why you need Gnome in the first place. If you are happy with Xfce (do you mean Xfce4?) then you can just do (after installing the base system and Xserver): aptitude install xfce4 If you want even less bloat then you can install Xfce4 components individually (takes a bit more effort). You will also need a display manager (unless you like the whole startx thing). xdm - small and simple and can look nice with a bit of effort wdm - small and simple but ugly :-( gdm - pretty and simple but not small and depends on lots of Gnome libraries kdm - probably pretty as well (don't use it) but depends on pretty much the entire of KDE. I personally use gdm, but I used wdm before (before getting too depressed about how ugly it is.) Best regards, -- George Borisov DXSolutions Ltd signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Window managers-which one?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 10/31/06 09:24, George Borisov wrote: B. Hoffmann wrote: [snip] You will also need a display manager (unless you like the whole startx thing). Grouchy Geek says, Since you can start X with startx, by definition, you do *not need* a display manager. xdm - small and simple and can look nice with a bit of effort wdm - small and simple but ugly :-( gdm - pretty and simple but not small and depends on lots of Gnome libraries kdm - probably pretty as well (don't use it) but depends on pretty much the entire of KDE. I personally use gdm, but I used wdm before (before getting too depressed about how ugly it is.) Why waste RAM on something you have *no* need for and doesn't *do* anything that the console does just as well? - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Is common sense really valid? For example, it is common sense to white-power racists that whites are superior to blacks, and that those with brown skins are mud people. However, that common sense is obviously wrong. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFR31fS9HxQb37XmcRArEjAJ41Ieym0ZX9YT585gGzfSU6o0MTKwCgwyib rd2zm3H1Lhw1zutg+N65tUc= =vD8w -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
B. Hoffmann: Must confess I'm still a bit confused as to what exactly a WM does as some seem to have themes available for them which I thought was down to the DE. Yes and No. A WM is supposed to, well, manage windows (or give the user the chance to do it). Typically this includes: * place windows somewhere on the desktop (may be interactive) * decorate windows with titlebars, borders, action buttons (minimize, maximize, close etc.). Of course the window decoration (not the content!) may be themed. * draw a taskbar somewhere on the desktop * some sort of desktop decoration (background image, icons etc.) While everything except the first job is purely optional, most WMs do other things, too. They provide virtual desktops, have some kinde of start menu, show time date etc. Desktop environments do all this, too, but they try to integrate the work of several programs. Sometimes this is done in a way that makes every single program more useful if it is running together with the other ones. Gnome, for example, has (at least) three important programs running, which interact with the user: * Metacity, the WM (Very, very basic. Draws window borders and positions windows in a widely accepted, but IMO braindead manner.) * gnome-panel, draws the bars at the top and bottom of the default desktop and uses other programs (applets) to show something useful (menu, taskbar, date time, systray, $younameit). * nautilus, the file manager, which is also responsible for drawing desktop icons. (A design decision apparently adopted from Windows, but Maybe Apple does this, too. Either way, I don't understand it.) What's so nice about this is that things like Drag'n'Drop from the (nautilus-managed) desktop to a gnome-panel work. And you can alter the look and feel in one central place for all (DE-aware) applications. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? While I am not completely sure about fvwm, as I have never used it, IceWM is definitely not a DE but a WM. It does have far more features than a WM strictly needs (themes, start menu, battery, CPU network monitor, clock, intelligent window placement, tons of configuration options) but it does not interact with other programs in any special way. It is pretty self-contained. And it doesn't care if you start another program to manage the desktop (icons, background image) or use a different program to display a taskbar. By the way, you can use IceWM when running Gnome (replacing Metacity). If you are searching for a lightweight WM and are not afraid to tweak text files (only key=value kind of syntax), I can only recommend giving IceWM a try. I use it since my first days with Linux and still love it. It's just not as shiny as a Gnome or Xfce4 desktop (but close). J. -- Fashion is more important to me than war, famine, disease or art. [Agree] [Disagree] http://www.slowlydownward.com/NODATA/data_enter2.html signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Window managers-which one?
On 10/31/06, Jeronimo Pellegrini [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. I was a long time fluxbox user, but I didn't really like the task bar. I'd rather use something like WindowMaker, which manages windows more like a Mac. I used WindowMaker for a while, but it didn't work well with all programs. I finally found Enlightenment (pun intended). It's very stable and has just enough fluff, in the form of user feedback, so that it has a more solid feel than Fluxbox. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. J. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Jeronimo Pellegrini escribe: I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. Count another vote for openbox, it's damn light and damn beautiful and turns a 486 into a ready for internet box. Cordially, Ismael -- Ismael Valladolid Torres Il est vain de pleurer sur l'esprit, il suffit de travailler pour lui. Albert Camus http://digitrazos.info/ http://lamediahostia.blogspot.com/OpenPGP key ID: 0xDE721AF4 http://www.hispasonic.com/foro73.html Jabber ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] pgpUxn9eKqfdn.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:57:44AM -0800, Jason Dunsmore wrote: On 10/31/06, Jeronimo Pellegrini [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. I was a long time fluxbox user, but I didn't really like the task bar. Yes! Neither did I. And my openbox doesn't show one (it's optional). :-) I'd rather use something like WindowMaker, which manages windows more like a Mac. I used WindowMaker for a while, but it didn't work well with all programs. I finally found Enlightenment (pun intended). It's very stable and has just enough fluff, in the form of user feedback, so that it has a more solid feel than Fluxbox. I've found Enlightenment too bloated... But that's a matter of taste, so... :-) J. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Window managers-which one?
Hi all ! I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Then proceeded to install xfce and synaptic and that's it so far. Don't want any unnecessary fluff this time. My question is which wm to use, as Gnome install metacity by default and I don't have experience with anything else. There's a lot of information on Google Groups and in the Debian archives, however I have a more specific question (bearing in mind this will be used as desktop and ratpoison is not an option). 1. How does sawfish compare in functionality and is it a good option with xfce? 2. Anybody have experience with qvwm? 3. Intending to use Crystal-fvwm later on, will any of these play nice with fvwm too? Must confess I'm still a bit confused as to what exactly a WM does as some seem to have themes available for them which I thought was down to the DE. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? Apologies for bringing this up again! -- Kind Regards, B. Hoffmann -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Ron Johnson wrote: I personally use gdm, but I used wdm before (before getting too depressed about how ugly it is.) Why waste RAM on something you have *no* need for and doesn't *do* anything that the console does just as well? Because I like shiny. Shiny == good. Anyway, I have the RAM to spare, so... SHINY!!! If it makes you feel better, the main reason I use a window manager is so that I can have lots of consoles open at the same time (what else would you use this GUI thing for?) ;-) Best regards, -- George Borisov DXSolutions Ltd signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Window managers-which one?
On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: On (31/10/06 14:51), B. Hoffmann wrote: I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I like basic functionality, configurability, without bloat; I have been running a 486 for years... I use icewm. It does everything I want without the struggle of adding features to a less featurful wm and is low on resource usage. It must be fast because it doesn't get in the way on the 486. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
On (31/10/06 13:19), Jeronimo Pellegrini wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I went pretty much the same way, but then one day I thought fluxbox was kind of slow to draw menus etc... And I found openbox! It's fast, looks just like fluxbox, except that it doesn't have the extra fluff. :-) You may want to give it a try. Not one I've tried... so yes I'll give it a whirl :) Regards Clive -- www.clivemenzies.co.uk ... ...strategies for business -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 10/31/06 11:39, George Borisov wrote: Ron Johnson wrote: I personally use gdm, but I used wdm before (before getting too depressed about how ugly it is.) Why waste RAM on something you have *no* need for and doesn't *do* anything that the console does just as well? Because I like shiny. Shiny == good. Anyway, I have the RAM to spare, so... SHINY!!! Get off my lawn, you young whippersnappers! If it makes you feel better, the main reason I use a window manager is so that I can have lots of consoles open at the same time (what else would you use this GUI thing for?) ;-) You will also need a display manager *Window* manager != *display* manager. - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Is common sense really valid? For example, it is common sense to white-power racists that whites are superior to blacks, and that those with brown skins are mud people. However, that common sense is obviously wrong. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFR6UnS9HxQb37XmcRAsdHAJ9DP2FZFY3qFC1Z6gT/uCyW8NzEWQCgzjFD khu9j7xjO4LY/8UvpsgkF+Q= =huLZ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Douglas Tutty wrote: On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 03:40:48PM +, Clive Menzies wrote: On (31/10/06 14:51), B. Hoffmann wrote: I' ve been installing purely a base sytem this time as opposed to before always going with the default install with Gnome. Also for example icewm and fvwm seem to be both window managers and DE's? Since getting into Debian I've progressed down the scale (of bloat) from KDE to Xfce to Enlightenment to Fluxbox. I'm very happy now but guess I may get bored and try something else but fluxbox is lean mean but pretty functional. I like basic functionality, configurability, without bloat; I have been running a 486 for years... I use icewm. It does everything I want without the struggle of adding features to a less featurful wm and is low on resource usage. It must be fast because it doesn't get in the way on the 486. I have been using fvwm since I started with linux and Debian about 8 years ago. That was on a 486/33MHz with 12MB of memory. I installed Debian on a 128MB removable disk. I have used KDE on a few occaisions, but I generally prefer a clear, uncluttered screen. I also don't care for all of the extra processes that get started by KDE apps, even when you are not running KDE. -- Marc Shapiro No boom today. Boom tomorrow. There's always a boom tomorrow. What?! Look, somebody's got to have some damn perspective around here. Boom. Sooner or later ... boom! - Susan Ivanova: B5 - Grail -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Window managers-which one?
Thank you for all the replies and good explanations, and a bit of a laugh. Jochen Schulz wrote: Yes and No. A WM is supposed to, well, manage windows (or give the user the chance to do it). Typically this includes: * place windows somewhere on the desktop (may be interactive) * decorate windows with titlebars, borders, action buttons (minimize, maximize, close etc.). Of course the window decoration (not the content!) may be themed. Jochen: Does this mean that the Themes in Gnome for window frames (Crux etc.) are really metacity themes and were not available if metacity was not installed? George Borisov wrote: Not sure why you need Gnome in the first place. If you are happy with Xfce (do you mean Xfce4?) then you can just do (after installing the base system and Xserver): Yes I mean Xfce4. Xfce for me is now just a faster better Gnome. It's getting amazingly full featured and with Zenwalk and Vector standard and some other distros showcasing it it really shines. I liked Gnome and most of its apps a lot but lately found it rather slow. The journey just started, probably will end up with only something like blackbox like you guys one day. If you want even less bloat then you can install Xfce4 components individually (takes a bit more effort). Nice to end up with only what you want and nothing more. Got fluxbox on a small DSL partition but for now it's Xfce on the main desktop. Plus - how do you get icons to display on your fluxbox work space? What about Sawfish? -- Kind Regards, B. Hoffmann
Re: Window managers-which one?
Plus - how do you get icons to display on your fluxbox work space? Install the program idesk. In your startup file, at /home/user/.fluxbox/startup, add idesk (without quotes). Start fluxbox and you'll see a home icon. If my memory serves me correctly, I think it's pretty easy to create other icons. Files managing the icons are in the /home/user/.idesktop directory. Mark -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adding other window managers
Hi all I have been using slackware based distros and on that distro I know my way around. The help I need is in how to add another window manager to the, what I presume is gdm in debian sarge. In slackware its almost as simple as editing one file. It doesnt seem that simple in debain. Wait, I am confused... you want to use another window manager than the one you are currently using, yes? I do not think you do this with gdm, but with GNOME. If you mean GNOME, then do the following: 1) Install window manager via apt-get 2) Find path of window manager (probably /usr/bin/window_manager) 3) Open gconf-editor 4) Go to Desktop - Gnome - Applications - window_manager 5) Edit the values 6) Restart X (log out and in again, or run /etc/init.d gdm restart as root). Cheers, Leonid Grinberg [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy on 13/09/05 17:39, wrote: [can change the window manager in gnome] by changing the window manager command in here ~/.gconf/desktop/gnome/applications/window_manager/%gconf.xml I discovered that sawfish, metacity and enlightenment work. Blackbox and uwm don't (weird effects happen instead though - quite interesting!). Still to try wmaker and a couple of others. The problem with gnome is that it stalls on startup for about 3 to 5 mins with certain window managers: wmaker, uwm, blackbox, icewm but for others (enlightenment, metacity, lwm) it's not a problem. I think it lies with either gnome-proxy or gnome-session, I'm not sure how to find out. Any clues anyone? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy: The problem with gnome is that it stalls on startup for about 3 to 5 mins with certain window managers: wmaker, uwm, blackbox, icewm I don't use Gnome but I tried it with IceWM and it didn't stall back then. I think it lies with either gnome-proxy or gnome-session, I'm not sure how to find out. Any clues anyone? No, sorry. But I've read that the current (unstable) version of the default gnome login scripts don't start gnome-proxy anymore because it takes so much time to start. Don't know if anyone actually needs it. J. -- If I could have anything in the world it would have to be more money. [Agree] [Disagree] http://www.slowlydownward.com/NODATA/data_enter2.html signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I discovered that sawfish, metacity and enlightenment work. Blackbox and uwm don't (weird effects happen instead though - quite interesting!). Still to try wmaker and a couple of others. I haven't found a window manager fulfills all the little quirks that I want a window manager to perform yet. I've also tried many window managers. Which little quirks do you want? I find that little things can really make a big difference. Kai -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Angelo Bertolli [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. A number of window managers have a focus new windows option. It may work to turn that off. I don't know whether your wm has such an option, though. Kai -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Angelo on 14/09/05 06:00, wrote: On Tuesday 13 September 2005 07:59 pm, David Purton wrote: On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 12:51:59AM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Angelo Bertolli on 13/09/05 19:16, wrote: Antonio Rodriguez wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. I tried a couple of window managers with gnome a long time ago, but had no luck. What exactly do you mean by stealing focus? I see different behaviour from different window managers. For instance enlightenment gives focus to the window that the mouse is over, but without bringing it forward. Not sure if what you mean, but it really annoys me that in gnome 2.10, when you open an app then, go back to a different app and keep using it while waiting for the new one to load, as soon as the new one finishes loading and displays, it steals the focus - very annoying. I heard a rumour that this is fixed in 2.12 Yes, this is exactly what I'm talking about. Long-loading programs like Mozilla and OpenOffice.org are annoying this way. I thought the fault was with Metacity though. Happens with enlightenment as well. You're right, it is annoying, but it only happens once a day or so, for me at least. There is a bug report on it but it seems to be filed against epiphany: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=151943 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Kai Grossjohann on 14/09/05 09:16, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I discovered that sawfish, metacity and enlightenment work. Blackbox and uwm don't (weird effects happen instead though - quite interesting!). Still to try wmaker and a couple of others. I haven't found a window manager fulfills all the little quirks that I want a window manager to perform yet. I've also tried many window managers. Which little quirks do you want? I find that little things can really make a big difference. When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. I would like to have focus when I click on any part of a window, not just the title bar. It's taking a while to get used to enlightenment, since I can use the mouse to select text in a window without actually selecting the window, and then when I press delete, it deletes something in the other window, not the text. Sounds weird, and it is! I'd also like to have a key combination that will call up the gnome log-out dialog. Used to be ALT+F1 in metacity in my original installation but I've lost it since. I also want to restrict the desktop to just one instance, I don't use this feature. I keep finding mis-clicks with the mouse or a fumble on the keyboard (does happen!) throws me into another desktop. The list would go on but I don't want to bore you, Adam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Hi, My two cents to the window manager monologue... :) On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 10:17:42AM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Kai Grossjohann on 14/09/05 09:16, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I discovered that sawfish, metacity and enlightenment work. Blackbox and uwm don't (weird effects happen instead though - quite interesting!). Still to try wmaker and a couple of others. I haven't found a window manager fulfills all the little quirks that I want a window manager to perform yet. I've also tried many window managers. Which little quirks do you want? I find that little things can really make a big difference. When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. I'm using enlightenment and while there is no 'list' with Alt-Tab, it still goes through all the apps and raises them with focus each in turn with Alt-Tab. There is also a list of the applications with middle-click to the Dragbar, but the Dragbar might be under the apps if there are a lot of apps open in the desktop. I would like to have focus when I click on any part of a window, not just the title bar. It's taking a while to get used to enlightenment, since I can use the mouse to select text in a window without actually selecting the window, and then when I press delete, it deletes something in the other window, not the text. Sounds weird, and it is! This sounds very weird. I have set the 'Focus follows the mouse' so whenever I click a window it gets the focus and I know which window I'm working with. Also somebody pointed out the annoying 'focus stealing' when opening e.g. firefox and working with another application while waiting the firefox to open. In enlightenment I have unchecked the 'All new windows first get the focus' and now I can work with another application while firefox opens without firefox stealing the focus :) I'd also like to have a key combination that will call up the gnome log-out dialog. Used to be ALT+F1 in metacity in my original installation but I've lost it since. In enlightenment Ctrl-Alt-Del brings the logout-dialog. Note: it is different from Ctrl-Alt-Backspace which probably kills the xsession. It is a bit weird because I have ctrlaltdel:/sbin/shutdown in my inittab, but I guess enlightenment keybindings overwrite it. It can probably be changed but I haven't bothered because it works. I also want to restrict the desktop to just one instance, I don't use this feature. I keep finding mis-clicks with the mouse or a fumble on the keyboard (does happen!) throws me into another desktop. I'm not sure if this is what you mean but in enlightenment the Virtual desktop settings and Multiple desktop settings can be set to just one desktop. The list would go on but I don't want to bore you, Adam Simo -- :r ~/.signature signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. WindowMaker does this, I think. Then, sawfish can do it with an extra module. Lessee... Perhaps merlin-ugliness is the package in question. I would like to have focus when I click on any part of a window, not just the title bar. This is the behavior for many window managers. I think all of the ones that do click to focus allow this. (For twm and derivatives, it might be difficult to do.) Some window managers have a setting that allows you to choose whether or not the application should receive the click that gives focus. I have configured sawfish such that a button 1 click is passed through, but a button 3 click is swallowed. This means if I have a window where clicking somewhere might do something I don't want, then I click mouse 3 and the window gets focus without receiving any click event. I'd also like to have a key combination that will call up the gnome log-out dialog. Used to be ALT+F1 in metacity in my original installation but I've lost it since. I think that's a Gnome configuration. I'd search in the Gnome keyboard configuration dialogs. I also want to restrict the desktop to just one instance, I don't use this feature. I keep finding mis-clicks with the mouse or a fumble on the keyboard (does happen!) throws me into another desktop. This is probably also a Gnome setting. Are you using Gnome? I think you said that you were using Gnome together with some non-default window manager. In that case, some settings might be controlled by Gnome, rather than the window manager. When in doubt, search for the same setting in the Gnome configuration thingy and also in the window manager configuration and try changing it in both places to see what happens. Kai -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Kai Grossjohann on 14/09/05 13:01, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. WindowMaker does this, I think. Then, sawfish can do it with an extra module. Lessee... Perhaps merlin-ugliness is the package in question. Thanks Simo, Kai. Just made my desktop environment 100 times better. That last problem above is the sticking point - I'll check out the docs and the mailing list for enlightenment to see if I can find a way of changing it. If not, I'll defect over to sawfish or wmaker. There's another niggle I've got but it's trivial - underneath my top panel from gnome, is the panel from enlightenment and the only advantage I can see for it is that as Simo said you can middle click it and get the list of open apps. Is there anything else you can do with it? I can't stick applets on it so it looks pretty vestigial. Adam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Wed, 14 Sep 2005 10:17:42 +0100 Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. IceWM I would like to have focus when I click on any part of a window, not just the title bar. It's taking a while to get used to enlightenment, since I can use the mouse to select text in a window without actually selecting the window, and then when I press delete, it deletes something in the other window, not the text. Sounds weird, and it is! IceWM I'd also like to have a key combination that will call up the gnome log-out dialog. Used to be ALT+F1 in metacity in my original installation but I've lost it since. Maybe I misunderstand. Log off the 'net? Pon/poff work very well. So does the net button on GKrellM. Otherwise there is gRun: gRun is especially useful if you do not use the GNOME desktop which has a built-in run command, and if you use a window-manager (e.g. IceWM) where you can define a keyboard shortcut (e.g. Alt-F2) for starting gRun. Otherwise, if you mean to log off of the computer, click, click in the menu or just ctrlaltbackspace I also want to restrict the desktop to just one instance, I don't use this feature. I keep finding mis-clicks with the mouse or a fumble on the keyboard (does happen!) throws me into another desktop.] IceWM can do that. (but multiple desktops are /so/ cool!) The list would go on but I don't want to bore you, Adam I think you'd be happy with IceWM as it is configurable to do most of what you want so far. In addition you'll need Iceconf or Icepref for configuration. Cybe R. Wizard -- Q: What's the difference between MicroSoft Windows and a virus? A: Apart from the fact that viruses are supported by their authors, use optimized, small code and usually perform well, none. Winduhs -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 01:37:52PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Kai Grossjohann on 14/09/05 13:01, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. WindowMaker does this, I think. Then, sawfish can do it with an extra module. Lessee... Perhaps merlin-ugliness is the package in question. Thanks Simo, Kai. Just made my desktop environment 100 times better. That last problem above is the sticking point - I'll check out the docs and the mailing list for enlightenment to see if I can find a way of changing it. If not, I'll defect over to sawfish or wmaker. There's another niggle I've got but it's trivial - underneath my top panel from gnome, is the panel from enlightenment and the only advantage I can see for it is that as Simo said you can middle click it and get the list of open apps. Is there anything else you can do with it? I can't stick applets on it so it looks pretty vestigial. Adam The only thing (that I know) the enlightenment panel is meant for, is dragging the desktop to show a desktop below the active one. So that's useful when using multiple desktops. Other than that it has that application list, but you get the apps list also by Alt-Middle-Clicking the desktop, so you can safely remove the panel from Special FX Settings... 'Display desktop dragbar'. Simo -- :r ~/.signature signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: adventures with window managers
On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 03:19:14PM +0300, Simo Kauppi wrote: Hi, My two cents to the window manager monologue... :) On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 10:17:42AM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: When I use ALT-Tab to cycle thro all open apps, I would like to see all apps in a list or a row with the current selected app highlighted. I saw one window manager doing it just how I like it but don't remember which one now. I'm using enlightenment and while there is no 'list' with Alt-Tab, it still goes through all the apps and raises them with focus each in turn with Alt-Tab. There is also a list of the applications with middle-click to the Dragbar, but the Dragbar might be under the apps if there are a lot of apps open in the desktop. I'd also like to have a key combination that will call up the gnome log-out dialog. Used to be ALT+F1 in metacity in my original installation but I've lost it since. In enlightenment Ctrl-Alt-Del brings the logout-dialog. Note: it is different from Ctrl-Alt-Backspace which probably kills the xsession. It is a bit weird because I have ctrlaltdel:/sbin/shutdown in my inittab, but I guess enlightenment keybindings overwrite it. It can probably be changed but I haven't bothered because it works. Following myself... The keybindings for enlightenment seem to be quite easy to change. I just copied the /usr/share/enlightenment/config/keybindings.cfg to ~/.enlightenment/keybindings.cfg and edit it. E.g. to make the logout-dialog come up with Alt-F1, find the __KEY F1 __EVENT __KEY_PRESS __MODIFIER_KEY __ALT __ACTION __A_GOTO_DESK 0 and change the action line to __ACTION __A_EXIT logout This works especially if you don't use multiple desktops, as the Alt-F1 is normally used to switch to desktop 0. Of course you can modify the Ctrl-Alt-Del keybinding or create your own binding e.g. for Ctrl-F1 __NEXT_ACTION __KEY F1 __EVENT __KEY_PRESS __MODIFIER_KEY __CTRL __ACTION __A_EXIT logout And you can make the Alt-Tab to bring up the task list __KEY Tab __MODIFIER_KEY __ALT __EVENT __KEY_PRESS __ACTION __A_FOCUS_NEXT by changing the action line to __ACTION __A_SHOW_MENU taskmenu And so on... Simo -- :r ~/.signature signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: adventures with window managers
Cybe R. Wizard on 14/09/05 13:38, wrote: IceWM can do that. (but multiple desktops are /so/ cool!) I think you'd be happy with IceWM as it is configurable to do most of what you want so far. In addition you'll need Iceconf or Icepref for configuration. Thanks for those tips. Got most of it configured at least in enlightenment. So I just tried icewm. I came unstuck pretty quickly. Firstly it didn't really like gnome and took about 3 mins to start up instead of 5 secs. I think it has something to do with the gnome-session although it's difficult to tell. Some other window managers have the same problem. Once icewm was running, I tried configuring it. I didn't get a list of fonts to choose from. Shouldn't there be a drop-down font list in iceconf? I'm not sure about the icewm panel. It looked like it had a fixed set of applets, and there are a few more I like, such as the keyboard locale chooser, program launchers, volume control etc which icewm doesn't appear to have. The program switcher panel which comes up when pressing alt-tab is good, but I know there's an even better one out there where they are listed vertically. Can this be changed for another program-switcher module in icewm? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Cybe R. Wizard on 14/09/05 13:38, wrote: I think you'd be happy with IceWM as it is configurable to do most of what you want so far. In addition you'll need Iceconf or Icepref for configuration. one major plus point for icewm - it starts all programs with a window the same size as the available desktop. That's just what I like. Enlightenment brings them up with a size = 1/4 desktop area. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy wrote: Cybe R. Wizard on 14/09/05 13:38, wrote: I think you'd be happy with IceWM as it is configurable to do most of what you want so far. In addition you'll need Iceconf or Icepref for configuration. one major plus point for icewm - it starts all programs with a window the same size as the available desktop. It might be an option but it has never done that for me by default. Paul Scott -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Kai Grossjohann on 12/09/05 11:58, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I didn't realise Gnome was a window manager. Yet it runs with sawfish. Makes me think I should be able to choose Gnome and Enlightenment, but how? Gnome is not a window manager. Gnome contains many programs, one of which is a window manager. There should be a Gnome setting for changing the window manager. So you could try that. Alas, as I don't use Gnome myself, I don't know where to find that setting. I found a really crap way of changing the window manager in gnome - you kill the current one, launch the new one you want from the command line and then save the session (by exiting I think, if I understand the implication). I'm using selectwm and there's an auto-generated file ~/.selectwmrc which specifies the window managers that appear in the menu and the commands that launch them. What would be really cool would be some way of hooking up selectwm so that it could launch any of the window managers in gnome. Or is that way too much to ask of gnome? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Kai Grossjohann on 12/09/05 11:58, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I didn't realise Gnome was a window manager. Yet it runs with sawfish. Makes me think I should be able to choose Gnome and Enlightenment, but how? Gnome is not a window manager. Gnome contains many programs, one of which is a window manager. There should be a Gnome setting for changing the window manager. So you could try that. Alas, as I don't use Gnome myself, I don't know where to find that setting. interestingly I just found a config file: ~/.gconf/desktop/gnome/applications/window_manager/%gconf.xml containing the command for the window manager in gnome. I wonder what happens if I change that command to selectwm??? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Kai Grossjohann on 12/09/05 11:58, wrote: Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I didn't realise Gnome was a window manager. Yet it runs with sawfish. Makes me think I should be able to choose Gnome and Enlightenment, but how? Gnome is not a window manager. Gnome contains many programs, one of which is a window manager. There should be a Gnome setting for changing the window manager. So you could try that. Alas, as I don't use Gnome myself, I don't know where to find that setting. by changing the window manager command in here ~/.gconf/desktop/gnome/applications/window_manager/%gconf.xml I discovered that sawfish, metacity and enlightenment work. Blackbox and uwm don't (weird effects happen instead though - quite interesting!). Still to try wmaker and a couple of others. I haven't found a window manager fulfills all the little quirks that I want a window manager to perform yet. This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Antonio Rodriguez wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. I tried a couple of window managers with gnome a long time ago, but had no luck. I think you can change your window manager with gconf: desktop - gnome - applications - window_manager -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Angelo Bertolli on 13/09/05 19:16, wrote: Antonio Rodriguez wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. I tried a couple of window managers with gnome a long time ago, but had no luck. What exactly do you mean by stealing focus? I see different behaviour from different window managers. For instance enlightenment gives focus to the window that the mouse is over, but without bringing it forward. I think you can change your window manager with gconf: desktop - gnome - applications - window_manager Which menu is that? Or program? I can't see it anywhere in my gnome. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 12:51:59AM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Angelo Bertolli on 13/09/05 19:16, wrote: Antonio Rodriguez wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. I tried a couple of window managers with gnome a long time ago, but had no luck. What exactly do you mean by stealing focus? I see different behaviour from different window managers. For instance enlightenment gives focus to the window that the mouse is over, but without bringing it forward. Not sure if what you mean, but it really annoys me that in gnome 2.10, when you open an app then, go back to a different app and keep using it while waiting for the new one to load, as soon as the new one finishes loading and displays, it steals the focus - very annoying. I heard a rumour that this is fixed in 2.12 cheers dc -- David Purton [EMAIL PROTECTED] For the eyes of the LORD range throughout the earth to strengthen those whose hearts are fully committed to him. 2 Chronicles 16:9a signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: adventures with window managers
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Adam Hardy wrote: Angelo Bertolli on 13/09/05 19:16, wrote: Antonio Rodriguez wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. I tried a couple of window managers with gnome a long time ago, but had no luck. What exactly do you mean by stealing focus? I see different behaviour from different window managers. For instance enlightenment gives focus to the window that the mouse is over, but without bringing it forward. I think you can change your window manager with gconf: desktop - gnome - applications - window_manager Which menu is that? Or program? I can't see it anywhere in my gnome. You can get it by running gconf-editor command or using Gnome Main menu - - Applications - System Tools - Configuration Editor. - -- Phu -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDJ38U7r05L83BjjIRArOZAJ47UIhb5T9KXDla9HSSidxNyAu3swCggcNn +PDgaAg3LOAsnxIdHbq0XGs= =zbLL -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Tuesday 13 September 2005 07:59 pm, David Purton wrote: On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 12:51:59AM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Angelo Bertolli on 13/09/05 19:16, wrote: Antonio Rodriguez wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:39:58PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: This thread is turning into a bit of monologue. Does nobody else have issues with their window manager? Or even better, solved them? Adam, keep talking. It is an interesting monologue. Yes, I'd like to find out a way to keep windows from stealing focus if at all possible. I tried a couple of window managers with gnome a long time ago, but had no luck. What exactly do you mean by stealing focus? I see different behaviour from different window managers. For instance enlightenment gives focus to the window that the mouse is over, but without bringing it forward. Not sure if what you mean, but it really annoys me that in gnome 2.10, when you open an app then, go back to a different app and keep using it while waiting for the new one to load, as soon as the new one finishes loading and displays, it steals the focus - very annoying. I heard a rumour that this is fixed in 2.12 Yes, this is exactly what I'm talking about. Long-loading programs like Mozilla and OpenOffice.org are annoying this way. I thought the fault was with Metacity though. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Almut Behrens on 12/09/05 01:15, wrote: On Sun, Sep 11, 2005 at 11:47:04PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Adam Hardy on 11/09/05 23:00, wrote: UWM: Your X-Server doesn't support the SHAPES extension . terminating I can't find any reference to SHAPES extension in synaptic. Where does it reside? [snip] Just make sure you have this in your XF86Config: Section Module Loadextmod ... ... EndSection I am actually using xorg.conf, but that was exactly the same. Thanks alot. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy on 12/09/05 09:59, wrote: Almut Behrens on 12/09/05 01:15, wrote: On Sun, Sep 11, 2005 at 11:47:04PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Adam Hardy on 11/09/05 23:00, wrote: UWM: Your X-Server doesn't support the SHAPES extension . terminating I can't find any reference to SHAPES extension in synaptic. Where does it reside? [snip] Just make sure you have this in your XF86Config: Section Module Loadextmod ... ... EndSection I am actually using xorg.conf, but that was exactly the same. Thanks alot. Now that I've got rid of the errors, I realise I don't know what window manager is what. I'm running selectwm which launches a little dialog box showing a list of window managers: Gnome, KDE, Enlightenment, Sawfish, Blackbox etc I'm probably going to go with Enlightenment, but I'm still checking them all out. I didn't realise Gnome was a window manager. Yet it runs with sawfish. Makes me think I should be able to choose Gnome and Enlightenment, but how? When I choose enlightenment, or blackbox for instance, I don't get any panels with applets as in Gnome. Is there a way to set them up in Enlightenment? Or doesn't it do them? I'm launching x-server from the cmd line with startx and an .xinitrc containing the selectwm command. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I didn't realise Gnome was a window manager. Yet it runs with sawfish. Makes me think I should be able to choose Gnome and Enlightenment, but how? Gnome is not a window manager. Gnome contains many programs, one of which is a window manager. There should be a Gnome setting for changing the window manager. So you could try that. Alas, as I don't use Gnome myself, I don't know where to find that setting. Kai -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: changing window managers
On Sun, Sep 11, 2005 at 02:48:42PM +0200, Thomas Jollans wrote: Joachim Fahnenmüller wrote: Sorry if the question is stupid, but: What is a session manager, and how does it get involved? THX AFAIK the session manager is a program that a) starts the programs of a desktop env (gnome needs nautilus,metacity,gnome-panel and maybe more) b) starts certain other programs (e.g. in gnome: recovers a session). for more detail : man xsm Cool: I have never used a session mgr, and I thought I don't have one, but: [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ which xsm /usr/bin/X11/xsm Thanks again, -- Joachim Fahnenmüller -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: changing window managers
Joachim Fahnenmüller wrote: Sorry if the question is stupid, but: What is a session manager, and how does it get involved? THX AFAIK the session manager is a program that a) starts the programs of a desktop env (gnome needs nautilus,metacity,gnome-panel and maybe more) b) starts certain other programs (e.g. in gnome: recovers a session). for more detail : man xsm -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
adventures with window managers
I just put a .xinitrc file in my $HOME with 'blackbox' as the window manager, and I found a 'window manager' submenu. This allows me to change from blackbox to metacity or afterwm or several others, but enlightenment, sawfish and uwm wont run, giving an error like this: X-window does not contain the SHAPE library This isn't exactly what it said, since it was -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy on 11/09/05 22:53, wrote: I just put a .xinitrc file in my $HOME with 'blackbox' as the window manager, and I found a 'window manager' submenu. This allows me to change from blackbox to metacity or afterwm or several others, but enlightenment, sawfish and uwm wont run, giving an error like this: X-window does not contain the SHAPE library This isn't exactly what it said, since it was Sorry, that was pretty dumb. Clicked Send by mistake. The exact message was: UWM: Your X-Server doesn't support the SHAPES extension . terminating I can't find any reference to SHAPES extension in synaptic. Where does it reside? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
Adam Hardy on 11/09/05 23:00, wrote: UWM: Your X-Server doesn't support the SHAPES extension . terminating I can't find any reference to SHAPES extension in synaptic. Where does it reside? Just realised you probably don't install SHAPES, rather upgrade something to a version that does implement it, right? Saw in the archives an answer to a similar question that I should do load extmod in my XF86Config Module section. Can't find any extmod in my kernel config. Any advice? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Sun, Sep 11, 2005 at 11:47:04PM +0100, Adam Hardy wrote: Adam Hardy on 11/09/05 23:00, wrote: UWM: Your X-Server doesn't support the SHAPES extension . terminating I can't find any reference to SHAPES extension in synaptic. Where does it reside? Just realised you probably don't install SHAPES, rather upgrade something to a version that does implement it, right? Saw in the archives an answer to a similar question that I should do load extmod in my XF86Config Module section. That's correct. Just make sure you have this in your XF86Config: Section Module Loadextmod ... ... EndSection Can't find any extmod in my kernel config. Any advice? It has nothing to do with the kernel config -- it's an extension to the X protocol. The respective module/lib implementing the SHAPE extension (and various others) comes with the X-server /usr/X11R6/lib/modules/extensions/libextmod.a BTW, with xdpyinfo you can check which extensions your X-server supports. See the list following number of extensions:. Cheers, Almut -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adventures with window managers
On Sep 12 2005, Almut Behrens wrote: BTW, with xdpyinfo you can check which extensions your X-server supports. See the list following number of extensions:. Be careful, though, that not all extensions may work. For instance, the output of xdpyinfo may list the xv extension, even though it is not implemented (to see if it is, try xvinfo). Hope this helps, Rogério Brito. -- Rogério Brito : [EMAIL PROTECTED] : http://www.ime.usp.br/~rbrito Homepage of the algorithms package : http://algorithms.berlios.de Homepage on freshmeat: http://freshmeat.net/projects/algorithms/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: changing window managers
Larry Fletcher on 08/09/05 02:51, wrote: I don't use a desktop. It takes about 3 seconds for startx to launch icewm using icewm-session in either ~/.xsession or x-session-manager. I used to use metacity (default with sarge) and it took 10 seconds maybe, and then I tried using others and it now takes 5 minutes. It's the window manager which causes it to hang for so long, but I can't work out what the problem is. I tried posting a similar message to gmane.linux.debian.user as suggested in another thread, but it didn't seem to work. So if the list gets 2 copies of this message that's the reason. Rats! I don't mind subscribing to another list to display my troubles but which one? There are a bunch of relevant-seeming debian lists, but searching on them doesn't produce any useful archived threads. But then again, it's probably my crap key words :( Adam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: changing window managers
David Jardine [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 06:56:00PM +0200, Kai Grossjohann wrote: John L Fjellstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: .xsession or .xinitrc Not sure what the difference between those two files are. .xinitrc is invoked by xinit. startx invokes xinit. .xsession is read by xdm. (And I think by other foodm programs, too, such as kdm, gdm.) With no ?dm installed, with no ~/.initrc file, and with one word (fvwm) in .xsession, things work for me (using startx). Could you test your theory by renaming ~/.xsession to, say, ~/.HIDDEN.xsession, then starting a new X session? There are other places than ~/.xinitrc that could have caused fvwm to be invoked from startx, e.g. /etc/alternatives/x-window-manager. [time passes] Oh! There is a file /etc/X11/xinit/xinitrc which sources /etc/X11/Xsession, which in turn sources ~/.xsession. D'oh. Fascinating. Kai -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: changing window managers
On Tue, Sep 06, 2005 at 01:19:32PM -0700, Larry Fletcher wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED] you wrote: On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 11:10:11AM -0700, Larry Fletcher wrote: After looking around some more I found out the x-session-manager works for startx, but it's not updated when new window managers are installed. The x-session-manager updates: /etc/alternatives/@x-session-manager Why should the session manager symlink be changed by a window manager? The x-window-manager is updated when new window managers are installed, so maybe @x-session-manager should link to @x-window-manager? No - x-session-manager should point to a session manager, and x-window-manager to a window manager, respectively. If you have a ~/.xsession file, you may have specified a window manager in it. I didn't have a ~/.xsession or ~/.xinitrc file. Otherwise, odds are the symlink from /usr/bin/x-window-manager is being used. Okay. Now I see there is a difference between a session manager and a window manager. Apparently some window managers have session managers and need them to run properly and some window managers don't use them. The problem was I installed a window manager that didn't install a session manager and since the old session manager was still installed the new window manager wouldn't run. I also found it interesting that ~/.xinitrc takes precedence over ~/.xsession, and x-session-manager takes precedence over x-window-manager. So it doesn't work to use both ~/.xsession and ~/.xinitrc. The best option seems to be to put the session manager in ~/.xsession and not use ~/.xinitrc. And if there is no session manager, to put the window manager in ~/.xsession. Either that or learn how to configure x-session-manager and x-window-manager. Larry Sorry if the question is stupid, but: What is a session manager, and how does it get involved? THX -- Joachim Fahnenmüller -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: changing window managers
Joachim Fahnenmüller [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sorry if the question is stupid, but: What is a session manager, and how does it get involved? A window manager allows you to move and resize windows, iconify them, and so on. A session manager remembers which windows (applications) were open and starts them on the next login. A session manager may also remeber the geometries of the windows involved, and perhaps the workspace they were on. Most people use a window manager, but not everyone needs a session manager. I, for example, just put the programs I want in ~/.xinitrc. Kai -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
