Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?--Thanks All!
Hello: Thank you to all you replied to my original message. Also, appreciated the follow up to the replies. Stephen may have hit the nail on the head with the circular reference issue. I have a far amount of that going on. I took care of only one big unit that used many references back to the mainform which in turn used that pas. It helped a little, but I'm not done yet, since this issue didn't show up until fairly recently and the circular reference issue has been around longer. There are at least two other big units which have circular ref's to the mainform. I'll be trying out a number of the other suggestions, too. If I can get substantial improvements, I'll report back to let everyone know what worked--it may be helpful to others. I am looking forward to getting a new computer and will definitely take your suggestions to heart. Right now its kind of a Catch22 issue, in that I need to get this program done (my first actual money maker :) ), so I can afford to buy the computer, but I sure could use the faster compile times now so I can get the program done! Thanks, again! Chuck Belanger ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
>> If your system is clean the other processes (all except Delphi) should take [together] lees than 1% of your CPU. Also all processes (all except Delphi) should take less then 200MB of RAM. A 'normal' swap for a clean system should be also below 200MB (for a computer with 1GB RAM). All data are for WinXP. Cosmin Prund wrote: > Where did you get those numbers? From my computer of course. Yes, I know they look pretty big. The actual numbers are smaller in my computer. I increased them because others may not have a clean system and garbage registry, useless services and background programs may increase that amount a little bit. > doesn't even include a media player! Well, this depends on your choice. Some people prefer to give a huge share of their CPU to a poor designed player like Windows Media Player. Others are using alternative programs that taxes less than 2.5% of the CPU. The worst hog I used was Winamp but even it can be convinced to stay below 3% if you made a single modification in the 'Settings' window. Anyway I don't really think that somebody that have problems compiling (because of lack of CPU) will use a hog media player and still complaining that he can't do his job. > My list of stuff that's competing for CPU power is fairly long. Can you post the list? I am really curios about it, because I have only one program that goes to 50% CPU usage but only for a short period when I upload files (and I am sure this is a bug in the program because there is no need to take so much CPU for a lazy 20Kbps upload). Total Commander can do the same thing with 0% CPU. The rest of them are using an average (all together, including the audio player) below 5% (2.5% in each CPU). > An 32-bit-only single core new processor is a laptop processor OR a budget processor. I am not interested in hardware news (I already purchased a new computer in the spring) so I do not know want is available and what is not on the market. In spring it was possible to get a single core (cheaper) CPU at HIGHER frequency than a dual core. In that case, a high frequency single core CPU was better for Delphi (which cannot use two cores at once). Nevertheless, I suppose than today the single cores are already out of the market so I think you are right. THE only choice is a dual core. The 64 bits is (for today) also a waste of money. Take a look at comparative tests (like Tom's Hardware) and you will see that the gain is in most cases 0% (if you are using regular programs like media players, browsers, text processors, email). Delphi for sure will not take advantage of those 64 bits. Maybe in few years more software will take advantage on those 2 cores and 64 bits. However, today it is too early, especially for us, Borland's guys. ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
We also have the problem with the "limbo" at the start of an editting session. I finally traced it to the virusscan software! We put .pas, .dfm, .dcu and .bpl in the exceptions list and the problem has pretty much vanished. As mentioned in other replies, program structure and module cross-referencing also plays a factor, but for us it was the time it took to scan during the background compile process. Sid Gudes wrote: > I've got a similar problem, although not as severe as what you > mentioned below. The "limbo" of high disk access only occurs once at > the start of my editing session, and my guess is that Delphi is > trying to pull together all the info it needs for code completion > and/or code parameters. You could try turning those off and see if it helps. > > Also, even 1 GB of RAM may not be enough if you have a lot of > resident processes. Do a Ctrl-Alt-Del to bring up task manager, and > look at the "Commit Charge" at bottom right. If the first number is > close to 1 GB (say 900 megs or so) then you might have thrashing > going on, which slows things up a lot. In that case adding more RAM > should help. > > > At 08:48 AM 10/15/2007, Chuck Belanger wrote: > >> Hello: >> >> As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some point--about >> 10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming VERY much slower. What used >> to be seconds to compile, takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add >> a few keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo where the >> disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't continue until it is finished. >> Looks like some kind of auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost >> as long as compiling does. >> >> I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. >> >> I've done the following. Anything else I can do? >> >> Increased RAM from 512mb to 1Gb - this cut down compile time by half, >> but still way slower than it was before. >> >> Also, noticed that even small, test projects compile slower. >> >> Noticed my C: drive (used for WindowsXP, SP2, btw) and my D: partition >> for programs and data, was getting low on disk space so I repartitioned >> that from 10-20 gb, which helped only a little, although helped Windows >> noticeably. >> >> Thanks for any tips, >> >> Chuck Belanger >> >> >> ___ >> Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org >> http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi >> > > Regards, > Sid Gudes > PIA Systems Corporation > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > ___ > Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org > http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi > -- Del Texley IS Administrator LIPA (541) 484-6430 This transmission (including any attachments) may contain confidential information, privileged material (including material protected by the solicitor-client or other applicable privileges), or constitute non-public information. Any use of this information by anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately reply to the sender and delete this information from your system. Use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this transmission by unintended recipients is not authorized and may be unlawful. ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
RE: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
> CubicDesign wrote: > Subject: Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do? > > > I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. > > > A dual core will not help you anyway (unless you are running CPU hungry > processes while programming in Delphi) because Delphi does not know how > to use it. Delphi compiler is single threaded (at least Delphi7 it is > but I seriously doubt that they made it multithread)! While a dual core CPU might not help much with Delphi alone, it will indirectly help by helping with other things like I/O and running all those other applications that inevitably run on a programmer's computer. My list of stuff that's competing for CPU power is fairly long and it doesn't even include a media player! > If you system is clean the other processes (all except Delphi) should > take [together] lees than 1% of your CPU. Also all processes (all > except Delphi) should take less then 200MB of RAM. > A 'normal' swap for a clean system should be also below 200MB (for a > computer with 1GB RAM). All data are for WinXP. Where did you get those numbers? > If you meet the following conditions then you clearly have a clean > system. It also means that you computer is just not enough for your > project. In this case, nothing can help you except a hardware upgrade. > If your mainboard supports a higher CPU then I recommend you to upgrade > it (and do not look for a cheap CPU with a small cache). A 64 bits CPU > also will not help you at all so be careful where you spend your money. Actually I'd specifically say "go for a dual core 64 bit CPU" (if one needs un upgrade). That's because I don't think you can find new 32-bit-only CPU's those days and because both AMD's and Intel's top processor families are multi-core. An 32-bit-only single core new processor is a laptop processor OR a budget processor. Also I'd include some other items in the "upgrade" list: At the top of the list is RAM, second is a FAST hard drive (I'm thinking 1 rpm here). And to the original poster: Also look for large DFM files in your project. Saving those large DFM files can take a really, really long time. If you find such a beast it probably contains a lot of stuff that can better be left outside the exe (ex: data in TJvData containers, large images in TImage containers). Try moving the data outside the exe and everything will be simpler. -- Cosmin Prund ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
> Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 07:48:30 -0700 > From: Chuck Belanger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to > do? To: Delphi Listserve > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; > format=flowed > > Hello: > > As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some > point--about 10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming > VERY much slower. What used to be seconds to compile, > takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add a few > keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo > where the disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't > continue until it is finished. Looks like some kind of > auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost as long as > compiling does. > Delete your dpr and dsk files If you make mistakes like me then clean the database and keep it on a machine that you don't crash. Firebird lock files - wow can I make them huge :) Mick ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
> I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. A dual core will not help you anyway (unless you are running CPU hungry processes while programming in Delphi) because Delphi does not know how to use it. Delphi compiler is single threaded (at least Delphi7 it is but I seriously doubt that they made it multithread)! If you system is clean the other processes (all except Delphi) should take [together] lees than 1% of your CPU. Also all processes (all except Delphi) should take less then 200MB of RAM. A 'normal' swap for a clean system should be also below 200MB (for a computer with 1GB RAM). All data are for WinXP. If you meet the following conditions then you clearly have a clean system. It also means that you computer is just not enough for your project. In this case, nothing can help you except a hardware upgrade. If your mainboard supports a higher CPU then I recommend you to upgrade it (and do not look for a cheap CPU with a small cache). A 64 bits CPU also will not help you at all so be careful where you spend your money. The second solution will be to split your program in smaller parts (EXE, DLL) and call/compile them only when needed. Chuck Belanger wrote: > Hello: > > As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some point--about > 10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming VERY much slower. What used > to be seconds to compile, takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add > a few keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo where the > disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't continue until it is finished. > Looks like some kind of auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost > as long as compiling does. > > I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. > > I've done the following. Anything else I can do? > > Increased RAM from 512mb to 1Gb - this cut down compile time by half, > but still way slower than it was before. > > Also, noticed that even small, test projects compile slower. > > Noticed my C: drive (used for WindowsXP, SP2, btw) and my D: partition > for programs and data, was getting low on disk space so I repartitioned > that from 10-20 gb, which helped only a little, although helped Windows > noticeably. > > Thanks for any tips, > > Chuck Belanger > > > ___ > Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org > http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi > > ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
Hello Chuck, we had a similar problem with a very large project. At one point it would compile so slowly that I could write down the names of the units being compiled. It turned out that it was to do with circular references. We had one master unit "Master" which referenced more than 100 other units, eg: "Slave1", "Slave2", etc. up until "SlaveN". Now each slave unit also referenced "Master". The compiler does not appear to treat this very efficiently. Once we broke the circular reference for the 100 files the compile time dropped to a couple of seconds. We achieved this by creating a new unit and moving the Slave references from Master to this new unit. We were able to do this because we were just making sure that the Slave units were linked in to the project and not actually required by Master. You might not be so lucky and it might require a bit more thought. Hope that this helps. -- Best regards, Stephenmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
> I've done the following. Anything else I can do? 1) Have a look at the memory swapping using task manager to see if 1GB is enough or not (should have no swapping at all) 2) Defragment you disk. 3) Have a look at your anti-virus, anti-spyware which could take a long time scann for your files. Try disabling those utility (just for testing). 4) Use task manager to see which program use CPU while you compile. 5) Break you huge exe into smaller parts, for example using DLL or runtime packages. Contribute to the SSL Effort. Visit http://www.overbyte.be/eng/ssl.html -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Author of ICS (Internet Component Suite, freeware) Author of MidWare (Multi-tier framework, freeware) http://www.overbyte.be - Original Message - From: "Chuck Belanger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Delphi Listserve" Sent: Monday, October 15, 2007 4:48 PM Subject: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do? > Hello: > > As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some point--about > 10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming VERY much slower. What used > to be seconds to compile, takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add > a few keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo where the > disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't continue until it is finished. > Looks like some kind of auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost > as long as compiling does. > > I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. > > I've done the following. Anything else I can do? > > Increased RAM from 512mb to 1Gb - this cut down compile time by half, > but still way slower than it was before. > > Also, noticed that even small, test projects compile slower. > > Noticed my C: drive (used for WindowsXP, SP2, btw) and my D: partition > for programs and data, was getting low on disk space so I repartitioned > that from 10-20 gb, which helped only a little, although helped Windows > noticeably. > > Thanks for any tips, > > Chuck Belanger > > > ___ > Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org > http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
Off the top: * Check your virtual memory settings. They may be too low. * Defrag your hard disk. * Look for adware, malware and trojans. * Turn off autoindexing on drives if ON. * Remove unnecessary startup programs. * Delete all DCUs and rebuild the project. Jerry At 10:48 AM 10/15/2007, you wrote: >Hello: > >As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some point--about >10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming VERY much slower. What used >to be seconds to compile, takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add >a few keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo where the >disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't continue until it is finished. >Looks like some kind of auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost >as long as compiling does. > >I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. > >I've done the following. Anything else I can do? > >Increased RAM from 512mb to 1Gb - this cut down compile time by half, >but still way slower than it was before. > >Also, noticed that even small, test projects compile slower. > >Noticed my C: drive (used for WindowsXP, SP2, btw) and my D: partition >for programs and data, was getting low on disk space so I repartitioned >that from 10-20 gb, which helped only a little, although helped Windows >noticeably. > >Thanks for any tips, > >Chuck Belanger > > >___ >Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org >http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
Re: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
I've got a similar problem, although not as severe as what you mentioned below. The "limbo" of high disk access only occurs once at the start of my editing session, and my guess is that Delphi is trying to pull together all the info it needs for code completion and/or code parameters. You could try turning those off and see if it helps. Also, even 1 GB of RAM may not be enough if you have a lot of resident processes. Do a Ctrl-Alt-Del to bring up task manager, and look at the "Commit Charge" at bottom right. If the first number is close to 1 GB (say 900 megs or so) then you might have thrashing going on, which slows things up a lot. In that case adding more RAM should help. At 08:48 AM 10/15/2007, Chuck Belanger wrote: >Hello: > >As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some point--about >10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming VERY much slower. What used >to be seconds to compile, takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add >a few keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo where the >disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't continue until it is finished. >Looks like some kind of auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost >as long as compiling does. > >I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. > >I've done the following. Anything else I can do? > >Increased RAM from 512mb to 1Gb - this cut down compile time by half, >but still way slower than it was before. > >Also, noticed that even small, test projects compile slower. > >Noticed my C: drive (used for WindowsXP, SP2, btw) and my D: partition >for programs and data, was getting low on disk space so I repartitioned >that from 10-20 gb, which helped only a little, although helped Windows >noticeably. > >Thanks for any tips, > >Chuck Belanger > > >___ >Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org >http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi Regards, Sid Gudes PIA Systems Corporation [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
RE: As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
Hi Chuck Try switching off Code Completion and Tooltip symbol insight in Tools>>Editor options>>Code Insite HTH Roland ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
As EXE grows Delphi (7) gets way slower; what to do?
Hello: As the program that I'm working has been growing, at some point--about 10-12 mb EXE size--Delphi 7 started becoming VERY much slower. What used to be seconds to compile, takes 2 minutes. Whenever I scroll or even add a few keystrokes to the editor, Delphi goes into some limbo where the disk drive is accessed a lot and I can't continue until it is finished. Looks like some kind of auto save or auto compile, but it takes almost as long as compiling does. I'm using a single CPU, 2.5 gHz system. I've done the following. Anything else I can do? Increased RAM from 512mb to 1Gb - this cut down compile time by half, but still way slower than it was before. Also, noticed that even small, test projects compile slower. Noticed my C: drive (used for WindowsXP, SP2, btw) and my D: partition for programs and data, was getting low on disk space so I repartitioned that from 10-20 gb, which helped only a little, although helped Windows noticeably. Thanks for any tips, Chuck Belanger ___ Delphi mailing list -> Delphi@elists.org http://www.elists.org/mailman/listinfo/delphi
