Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
On 16.03.2007 11:54, Ross Gardler wrote: Also perhaps some other information could be tied in.. such as who are the experts on which blocks or areas within Cocoon Independent from the counter argument already given the Cocoon changes site [1] already gives this information in a more verbose way. Nobody needs to maintain this list explicitely and nobody might get the feeling that private mails are encouraged. That's not more verbose, it also provides a simple list of contributors to a specific version and contributors to prrevious versions (see the end of the document). However, this only credits people who have an entry in status.xml, so does not credit people who have done other work, such as user support, dev discussion, issue tracking etc. My comment was not about giving any credits, it was just about assigning people to code and getting contact to "experts" on specific code areas (what Ross McDonald aimed to). While having this information explicitely was discouraged I said it is already there - implicitely and more verbose. Jörg
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Joerg Heinicke wrote: On 14.03.2007 09:27, Ross McDonald wrote: I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? In that way an up-to-date list of committers would be useful... Also perhaps some other information could be tied in.. such as who are the experts on which blocks or areas within Cocoon, so people who are newer to it could find out very quickly where to get help, given that the state of the docs is still somewhat patchy. This would save a lengthy exploration of the mailing lists, and get names up in obvious public view (such as on our soon to be released new website :-) ). Independent from the counter argument already given the Cocoon changes site [1] already gives this information in a more verbose way. Nobody needs to maintain this list explicitely and nobody might get the feeling that private mails are encouraged. Jörg [1] http://cocoon.apache.org/2.1/changes.html That's not more verbose, it also provides a simple list of contributors to a specific version and contributors to prrevious versions (see the end of the document). However, this only credits people who have an entry in status.xml, so does not credit people who have done other work, such as user support, dev discussion, issue tracking etc. Of course, status.xml could be used to record important events outside of the code base too. For example, an important design discussion could be recorded in status.xml with a link to the mail archives for reference. The onus is then on the people involved with the discussion to ensure that the details are recorded, otherwise they don't get credited with participation. An alternative would be to extract activity details from mailing list archives, issue tracker logs etc. But that all sounds like extra work to me. Ross
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Ross McDonald wrote: Quite right, I don't.. but it must happen right ? Ross Yes, and when it has I have encouraged them to ask their question on the list as they are far more likely to get an answer and the answer may benefit others. Ralph On 14 Mar 2007, at 13:22, Grzegorz Kossakowski wrote: Ralph Goers napisał(a): Ross McDonald wrote: Hi all. I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? You shouldn't be sending emails to committers privately to ask for help. Many don't like it. +1 And it really harms the community. -- Grzegorz Kossakowski
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
On 14.03.2007 09:27, Ross McDonald wrote: I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? In that way an up-to-date list of committers would be useful... Also perhaps some other information could be tied in.. such as who are the experts on which blocks or areas within Cocoon, so people who are newer to it could find out very quickly where to get help, given that the state of the docs is still somewhat patchy. This would save a lengthy exploration of the mailing lists, and get names up in obvious public view (such as on our soon to be released new website :-) ). Independent from the counter argument already given the Cocoon changes site [1] already gives this information in a more verbose way. Nobody needs to maintain this list explicitely and nobody might get the feeling that private mails are encouraged. Jörg [1] http://cocoon.apache.org/2.1/changes.html
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
On 14.03.2007 08:39, Reinhard Poetz wrote: I want to share two thoughts: - the probably best source of information to find out whether a project and its committers are (in)active is looking at the mailing lists and the changes docs. +1 What's the additional value of having a list containing the current activity state? Good question. Thinking about it I have rarely used such lists. The only thing coming to my mind is the distinction of one man show projects from healthy communities. But this is not a reason for Cocoon as it is quite obvious from the other sources that it can't be a one man show. For more than 3 or 5 people such a list has no longer much expressiveness. Jörg
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
On Wednesday 14 March 2007 16:51, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote: I agree with all parts. Perhaps with the exception that I am even less active on Cocoon, but follow it more for historical and emotional reasons... Cheers Niclas
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Quite right, I don't.. but it must happen right ? Ross On 14 Mar 2007, at 13:22, Grzegorz Kossakowski wrote: Ralph Goers napisał(a): Ross McDonald wrote: Hi all. I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? You shouldn't be sending emails to committers privately to ask for help. Many don't like it. +1 And it really harms the community. -- Grzegorz Kossakowski
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Ralph Goers napisał(a): > Ross McDonald wrote: >> Hi all. >> >> I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no >> longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from >> those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? > You shouldn't be sending emails to committers privately to ask for > help. Many don't like it. +1 And it really harms the community. -- Grzegorz Kossakowski
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Ross McDonald wrote: Hi all. I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? You shouldn't be sending emails to committers privately to ask for help. Many don't like it. Ralph
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
On 3/14/07, Reinhard Poetz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: ..."Do people think it's useful to have an up-to-date list of committers/PMC members that contains information about who is active?.. It would be useful but IMHO it's impossible to keep such a list up to date, or it's too much work. Am I active? I haven't committed code for many months, I'll most probably not work on 2.2 yet I'm helping here and there on the lists, and fixing the occasional bug. Go figure, 10% active maybe? What might be useful and easy to maintain would be a list where committers can voluntarily indicate what parts of Cocoon they're actively working on or interested in at the moment. A wiki page would be good enough for this, in addition to the "list of past and present committers" mentioned below. ... - the probably best source of information to find out whether a project and its committers are (in)active is looking at the mailing lists and the changes docs... Big +1 - mainting a committers list containing the current activity state causes some bureaucracy for us. The less work we have the better. +1 again I like the "list of past and present committers" at http://cocoon.apache.org/community/members.html but I would dump http://cocoon.apache.org/2.1/who.html which is not up to date and probably inconsistent with the other one in places. ...So what do you think? (I will interpret "no answers" as "nobody cares" which is also an important information for us).. I'm sure many of us care, thanks for getting the ball rolling. -Bertrand
Re: Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Hi all. I suppose a list of active committers will prevent people who are no longer active from receiving emails they don't want to receive from those looking for help.. so it may stop dead end investigations? In that way an up-to-date list of committers would be useful... Also perhaps some other information could be tied in.. such as who are the experts on which blocks or areas within Cocoon, so people who are newer to it could find out very quickly where to get help, given that the state of the docs is still somewhat patchy. This would save a lengthy exploration of the mailing lists, and get names up in obvious public view (such as on our soon to be released new website :-) ). Just a couple of my thoughts. Ross On 14 Mar 2007, at 07:39, Reinhard Poetz wrote: Cocoon is an open source project that has been existing for about 9! years. Many people helped us to grow and to develop and some of them became committers. According to our rules, every committer can join the Cocoon PMC.[1] On our private@ mailing list we recently had a dicsussion about what we should do with those committers and PMC members who have become inactive in the meantime (yes, 9 years is a looong time). I want to move this discussion to the public Cocoon mailing lists for two reasons: Firstly, there is no need to discuss such things in private and secondly, I would like to know what those who are not committers expect from us. Let's start the discussion with the question: "Do people think it's useful to have an up-to-date list of committers/PMC members that contains information about who is active? I want to share two thoughts: - the probably best source of information to find out whether a project and its committers are (in)active is looking at the mailing lists and the changes docs. What's the additional value of having a list containing the current activity state? - mainting a committers list containing the current activity state causes some bureaucracy for us. The less work we have the better. So what do you think? (I will interpret "no answers" as "nobody cares" which is also an important information for us) [1] http://www.apache.org/foundation/how-it-works.html#roles -- Reinhard Pötz Vice President, Apache Cocoon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Inactive Cocoon committers and PMC members
Cocoon is an open source project that has been existing for about 9! years. Many people helped us to grow and to develop and some of them became committers. According to our rules, every committer can join the Cocoon PMC.[1] On our private@ mailing list we recently had a dicsussion about what we should do with those committers and PMC members who have become inactive in the meantime (yes, 9 years is a looong time). I want to move this discussion to the public Cocoon mailing lists for two reasons: Firstly, there is no need to discuss such things in private and secondly, I would like to know what those who are not committers expect from us. Let's start the discussion with the question: "Do people think it's useful to have an up-to-date list of committers/PMC members that contains information about who is active? I want to share two thoughts: - the probably best source of information to find out whether a project and its committers are (in)active is looking at the mailing lists and the changes docs. What's the additional value of having a list containing the current activity state? - mainting a committers list containing the current activity state causes some bureaucracy for us. The less work we have the better. So what do you think? (I will interpret "no answers" as "nobody cares" which is also an important information for us) [1] http://www.apache.org/foundation/how-it-works.html#roles -- Reinhard Pötz Vice President, Apache Cocoon
