Re: Pssst! [Kotlin Support]

[John Kostaras]

$ find . -name *otlin*
./.git/logs/refs/remotes/origin/kotlin-donation
./java/kotlin.editor
./java/kotlin.editor/src/org/netbeans/modules/kotlin
./java/kotlin.editor/src/org/netbeans/modules/kotlin/editor/Kotlin.kt.template
./java/kotlin.editor/src/org/netbeans/modules/kotlin/editor/Kotlin.tmLanguage.json
./java/kotlin.editor/src/org/netbeans/modules/kotlin/editor/kotlin_file.png
./java/kotlin.editor/src/org/netbeans/modules/kotlin/editor/kotlin_file.svg
./java/kotlin.editor/src/org/netbeans/modules/kotlin/editor/kotlin_f...@2x.png

On Mon, 11 Oct 2021 at 14:45, Josh Juneau  wrote:

> There is also this older Kotlin plugin, which looks like it may have been
> the initial work by JetBrains.
>
> https://github.com/JetBrains/kotlin-netbeans
>
> This one is at least in a modular format, whereas the other repository
> includes all of NetBeans.  I think that the basic Kotlin support was merged
> into NetBeans already, so maybe that is the code from this repository.
>
> Josh Juneau
> juneau...@gmail.com
> http://jj-blogger.blogspot.com
> Apress Author 
>
>
>
> On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 4:15 PM Eric Bresie  wrote:
>
> > So what are the options for this?  Bring it in as a “cluster”, merge it,
> > break it out and manage as an independent (and publish to the new plug-in
> > center) plug-in?
> >
> > Eric
> >
> > On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 4:02 PM Christian Lenz 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > There is this branch
> > > https://github.com/apache/netbeans/tree/kotlin-donation but last
> changes
> > > were in Dezember last year.
> > >
> > > Von: Eric Bresie
> > > Gesendet: Sonntag, 10. Oktober 2021 16:25
> > > An: Netbeans Developer List
> > > Betreff: Re: Pssst! [Kotlin Support]
> > >
> > > I was talking about references to Kotlin like (1),(3),(5).
> > >
> > > As I understand it, there is some basic functionality
> > (highlight/coloring,
> > > editing), some of which involved a Kotlin plugin originally developed
> by
> > > JetBrain (4) which was not being maintained and was being donated to
> the
> > > Apache Netbeans group.  Based on the PR (2), it seems like it was
> > accepted
> > > but not sure if it was in a branch or in mainline Netbeans master.
> > >
> > > References
> > > (1)
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/rdacdb451a163a12c77850dd18877f1ecce9de5468aed030a063cc303%40%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> > > (2) https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/1398
> > > (3)
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/7b94ee7479bd09532243bef45af528f730dcbb6256c7f10dc2de0d89%40%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> > > (4) https://github.com/JetBrains/kotlin-netbeans/issues
> > > (5)
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/rb43470160dcee184837623eddb29defcb0410c02fb71b7607d816225%40%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> > >
> > > Eric Bresie
> > > ebre...@gmail.com
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 8:42 AM Emilian Bold 
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Looks like Kotlin is working as intended and funneling people into
> > > > IntelliJ.
> > > >
> > > > --emi
> > > >
> > > > On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 5:38 AM Owen Thomas <
> > owen.paul.tho...@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I have found myself cajoled into using IntelliJ because it allows
> one
> > > to
> > > > use Java and Kotlin sources simultaneously. To do this however, I
> have
> > > had
> > > > to create a new project using Gradle and copy my Java sources to this
> > new
> > > > project because IntelliJ thumbs it's nose at Ant projects. So, now I
> am
> > > > pondering the prospect of continuing with the Ant project in NetBeans
> > and
> > > > discarding the Kotlin sources, or making the transition to Gradle
> (and
> > > > perhaps IntelliJ) permanent. The second option (minus the move to
> > > IntelliJ
> > > > perhaps) is inevitable, but I do feel as though IntelliJ is making
> the
> > > > decision on what is an appropriate build tool for me at a time when I
> > do
> > > > not think it necessary to entertain such a move.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'd like it better if NetBeans was able to intermix Kotlin and Java
> > in
> > > a
> > > > way similar to IntelliJ, but without making a judgement call on what
> > > build
> > > > tool I choose to use.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Sun, 10 Oct 2021 at 00:23, Eric Bresie 
> wrote:
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Unrelated but at some point, there was discussion of integrating
> > > Kotlin
> > > > support (I believe donated by JetBrain developer)…did anything
> further
> > > > happen with that?
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Or is Kotlin another candidate for “new LSP language
> > implementation”?
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Eric
> > > > >>
> > > > >> On Fri, Oct 8, 2021 at 11:03 PM Owen Thomas <
> > > owen.paul.tho...@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Okay... I make a provisional withdrawal and reserve the right to
> > > > reassert.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> On Fri, 8 Oct 2021 at 18:59, Owen Thomas <
> > owen.paul.tho...@gmail.com
> > > >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > 

Re: Mocking framework

[Glenn Holmer]

On 10/11/21 07:43, Neil C Smith wrote:

On Sun, 10 Oct 2021 at 03:33, Tim Boudreau  wrote:

So you have to run a bunch of harder to set up integration tests if you
actually want to know if you broke something. The unit tests are a lovely
Potemkin village that show fabulous “coverage” and tell you nothing about
whether the software works. They are useless.


Thanks, Tim, for the whole post, and particularly this point - spot on!


I enjoyed that, too. "a lovely Potemkin village", heh.

--
Glenn Holmer (Linux registered user #16682)
"After the vintage season came the aftermath -- and Cenbe."null
-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org

For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists

Re: Mocking framework

[Neil C Smith]

On Sun, 10 Oct 2021 at 03:33, Tim Boudreau  wrote:
> So you have to run a bunch of harder to set up integration tests if you
> actually want to know if you broke something. The unit tests are a lovely
> Potemkin village that show fabulous “coverage” and tell you nothing about
> whether the software works. They are useless.

Thanks, Tim, for the whole post, and particularly this point - spot on!

Neil

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org

For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists

LTS / release target attribute - WAS Lazy Consensus threads

[Neil C Smith]

Moving some discussion points / questions off the lazy consensus threads ...

On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 at 14:57, Eric Bresie  wrote:
> So does this mean updating source/target attributes throughout as well?

No!  It means doing that on a per module basis where strictly
necessary and reviewed, as per Jaroslav's suggestions.

> Is it possible to run any of the “java hints” across the code base and see
> where java 11 migration actions may be needed?

I don't think now is the time for that unless it involves code that no
longer functions in later JDKs?!

On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 at 15:34, Eric Bresie  wrote:
> With no longer providing LTS (or is that just none presently planned),

As written they amount to the same thing.  The thing about lazy
consensus is that generally you can -1 if you're willing to step up
and work on an alternative.  Despite Laszlo's great work on a couple
of updates, we don't really have anyone still working on triaging
issues, backporting and doing updates to really justify us calling it
an LTS.  So, at least in my opinion, as and until a small group of
people want to volunteer to do that and make an LTS work (and define
what LTS means), we're not really in any position to provide one.

> what
> about the NETCAT teams role?  I could be wrong, but as I recall NETCAT
> testing tended to be more done as part of LTS releases.  Would that no
> longer be the case?

To be decided.  Various options have been discussed in the past.  We
could open up the tests for all beta testers, or run different tribes
on different releases, or stop it entirely, or   I left it out
again, because I've no idea what option would pass consensus at the
moment.  Or, quite frankly, even what I think we should do.

> Assume some of the NETCAT type testing may be somewhat addressed by
> automated CI testing but not sure if that’s the whole story.

Definitely not! :-)

> What is meant by “archived” here?
>
> * NetBeans 12.0 will be archived from the point of NetBeans 12.6 release.
>
> Is this notionally like saying it’s no longer supported, artifacts will be
> moved out of the mainline view/context (i.e. web pages showing as “old”
> archived builds)?  Is this treated similar to the Netbeans 8.x releases
> pre-Apache?

No, treated the same as every previous Apache release - eg. same thing
as everything before 12.5.  Moved off mirrors to ASF archive, not
included on main download pages, etc.

Best wishes,

Neil

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@netbeans.apache.org

For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists

Re: Pssst! [Kotlin Support]

[Josh Juneau]

There is also this older Kotlin plugin, which looks like it may have been
the initial work by JetBrains.

https://github.com/JetBrains/kotlin-netbeans

This one is at least in a modular format, whereas the other repository
includes all of NetBeans.  I think that the basic Kotlin support was merged
into NetBeans already, so maybe that is the code from this repository.

Josh Juneau
juneau...@gmail.com
http://jj-blogger.blogspot.com
Apress Author 



On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 4:15 PM Eric Bresie  wrote:

> So what are the options for this?  Bring it in as a “cluster”, merge it,
> break it out and manage as an independent (and publish to the new plug-in
> center) plug-in?
>
> Eric
>
> On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 4:02 PM Christian Lenz 
> wrote:
>
> > There is this branch
> > https://github.com/apache/netbeans/tree/kotlin-donation but last changes
> > were in Dezember last year.
> >
> > Von: Eric Bresie
> > Gesendet: Sonntag, 10. Oktober 2021 16:25
> > An: Netbeans Developer List
> > Betreff: Re: Pssst! [Kotlin Support]
> >
> > I was talking about references to Kotlin like (1),(3),(5).
> >
> > As I understand it, there is some basic functionality
> (highlight/coloring,
> > editing), some of which involved a Kotlin plugin originally developed by
> > JetBrain (4) which was not being maintained and was being donated to the
> > Apache Netbeans group.  Based on the PR (2), it seems like it was
> accepted
> > but not sure if it was in a branch or in mainline Netbeans master.
> >
> > References
> > (1)
> >
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/rdacdb451a163a12c77850dd18877f1ecce9de5468aed030a063cc303%40%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> > (2) https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/1398
> > (3)
> >
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/7b94ee7479bd09532243bef45af528f730dcbb6256c7f10dc2de0d89%40%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> > (4) https://github.com/JetBrains/kotlin-netbeans/issues
> > (5)
> >
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/rb43470160dcee184837623eddb29defcb0410c02fb71b7607d816225%40%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> >
> > Eric Bresie
> > ebre...@gmail.com
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 8:42 AM Emilian Bold 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Looks like Kotlin is working as intended and funneling people into
> > > IntelliJ.
> > >
> > > --emi
> > >
> > > On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 5:38 AM Owen Thomas <
> owen.paul.tho...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I have found myself cajoled into using IntelliJ because it allows one
> > to
> > > use Java and Kotlin sources simultaneously. To do this however, I have
> > had
> > > to create a new project using Gradle and copy my Java sources to this
> new
> > > project because IntelliJ thumbs it's nose at Ant projects. So, now I am
> > > pondering the prospect of continuing with the Ant project in NetBeans
> and
> > > discarding the Kotlin sources, or making the transition to Gradle (and
> > > perhaps IntelliJ) permanent. The second option (minus the move to
> > IntelliJ
> > > perhaps) is inevitable, but I do feel as though IntelliJ is making the
> > > decision on what is an appropriate build tool for me at a time when I
> do
> > > not think it necessary to entertain such a move.
> > > >
> > > > I'd like it better if NetBeans was able to intermix Kotlin and Java
> in
> > a
> > > way similar to IntelliJ, but without making a judgement call on what
> > build
> > > tool I choose to use.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Sun, 10 Oct 2021 at 00:23, Eric Bresie  wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> Unrelated but at some point, there was discussion of integrating
> > Kotlin
> > > support (I believe donated by JetBrain developer)…did anything further
> > > happen with that?
> > > >>
> > > >> Or is Kotlin another candidate for “new LSP language
> implementation”?
> > > >>
> > > >> Eric
> > > >>
> > > >> On Fri, Oct 8, 2021 at 11:03 PM Owen Thomas <
> > owen.paul.tho...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Okay... I make a provisional withdrawal and reserve the right to
> > > reassert.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Fri, 8 Oct 2021 at 18:59, Owen Thomas <
> owen.paul.tho...@gmail.com
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > 
> > >  Java and Kotlin interoperability is a fabrication. Stick with Java
> > or
> > > stick with Kotlin. Don't try it; it will only lead one to rip one's
> face
> > > off.
> > > >>
> > > >> --
> > > >> Eric Bresie
> > > >> ebre...@gmail.com
> > >
> > > -
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@netbeans.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@netbeans.apache.org
> > >
> > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> Eric Bresie
> ebre...@gmail.com
>