Re: License of specific fonts?

[toki]

On 2018-09-05 7:18 a.m., Simon Gottwald wrote:

> Hello and sorry to bother you with such a banal question!

It isn't a banal question.

I'm fairly confident that the overwhelming majority of font foundries
would rather people ask, and adhere to the terms of their license for a
specific font, or typeface, than use it in violation of their license.

> do I have to keep anything in mind with regards to the fonts contained and 
> their licensing?

Typically, font licenses cover the usage of the final work product,
ignoring how it is created. The exceptions tend to be fonts that are
exclusively distributed with a specific software program.

Read the license for the specific font, and if you have questions about
usage, either talk to a solicitor, or directly contact the font foundry
that created the typefaces in question.

From my perspective, the only safe fonts to use, are those that are
distributed under _The SIL Open Font License 1.1_. _SIL Open Font
License 1.001 update 5_, released in April 2017, is the most recent
version of that license.

I am not a lawyer.
This is not legal advice.


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Re: Wrong distro detected?

[toki]

On 2018-09-02 8:42 p.m., Rory O'Farrell wrote:

> It may be useful to know that the terminal command 
> inxi -S

Might need to emphasize that that is the majuscle S, not minuscle s.

> will display the distro name. I am sure there are other commands to do so of 
> which I am not aware.  

inxi -r gives repository type


jonathon




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Re: Wrong distro detected?

[toki]

On 2018-09-02 8:49 a.m., Matthias Seidel wrote:

> Apparently the problem is even bigger: I'm now running Ubuntu 16.04.5 x64 and 
> I'm still offered the RPMs (see table below)

Using Pale Moon 27.9.3 with English (Canada) as the UI language.

My User-Agent is "Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10_12_3;
rv:51.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/51.0"

https://www.openoffice.org/download/ offers me
OSX > 10.7 English US DMG.

Using Firefox ESR, on the same system.

My User-Agent is "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0)
Gecko/20100101 Firefox/52.0"

https://www.openoffice.org/download/ offers me the
Linux 64 Bit RPM English (US) 4.1.5

Using Midori 0.5.1 on the same system.

My User-Agent is "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux) AppleWebKit/538.15 (KHTML,
like Gecko) Chrome/46.0.2490.86 Safari/538.15 Midori/0.5"

https://www.openoffice.org/download/ offers me the
Linux 64 Bit RPM English (US) 4.1.5

FWIW, I use a 64 bit Linux distro that falsely claims to not use
SystemD. (Falsely becuase right now SystemD is using 50% CPU and 250 MB
RAM.)


jonathon





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Re: Wrong distro detected?

[toki]

On 2018-09-02 11:25 a.m., Rory O'Farrell wrote:
> I used the Firefox from the Ubuntu distro, and assumed that was a "standard" 
> Firefox.

Ubuntu adds their own special sauce, that, as is usual for those that
compile distros, completely, utterly, and absolutely breaks the program.

jonathon




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Re: IBM Plex font

[toki]

On 2018-08-09 7:15 p.m., Howard Cary Morris wrote:

> It would seem to me that we should  limit fonts to those on the user’s 
> computer plus those we can load from google (provided the internet is up). 
> That would be simplest with least overhead. (Any  other font available via 
> internet would also be OK.) Drawback, if when the user re-edits the file, the 
> internet or site is down might cause some problems.

One of the virtues of extensions, is that they can be constructed to
automatically install fonts that can be utilised by AOo. As such, why
not create an extension for this, or any other font that is proposed.

The biggest issue with extensions delivering fonts, is that font
families can be huge. NoTo Font Family clocks in at just under 1.1 GB in
size.  Granted, this is an exception, because it attempts to cover every
glyph in Unicode 6.0 (I say attempts to, because some glyphs in Unicode
6.0 are arguably missing.)

jonathon




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Re: Extention License information on the webinterface

[toki]

On 04/27/2018 07:27 PM, Andrea Pescetti wrote:

> But showing the license info would be useful and probably feasible.

An issue I've run into, for both the LibO extension and template
repositories, is that the license on the description page, and the
license in the template/extension are completely different.
(In one instance, the description page claimed GPL 3.0, but the license
within the extension was _your rights removed_.)

In other instances, the description page implies, if not outright claims
it is gratis, but the extension/template itself lays out a fee schedule,
with no classes being gratis.

Licensing information, and cost would be useful additions, provided they
are accurate. (I don't expect an extension whose price is demarcated in
Euro's to have a dollar equivalent, or vice-versus.)
On second thoughts, listing the cost would have to be run past Apache
Legal, to ensure GDPR compliance, among other things.

jonathon

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Re: Bad news regarding future Java use?

[toki]

On 04/20/2018 07:06 PM, Fernando Cassia wrote:

> People reading something, jumping to conclusions, and freaking out. Move 
> along, nothing to see here...

Given the Appeals Court ruling of 2018-03-27, corporations have reason
to be extremely cautious about their use of JAVA.

Not just JAVA, but since Oracle has a history of suing its customers,
their customers will be the first to pay the danegeld that that ruling
inflicts upon all and sundry.

jonathon

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Re: Search for duplicates

[toki]

On 04/10/2018 05:32 AM, Miriam Robarts wrote:

> It would be good to have a tool like this, so if I used the same adjective

_Linguist_ can provide a frequency list of every word used in the
document. It won't list synonyms next to each other. Linguist is no
longer maintained, so it might not work with AOo 4.x.  :(

I thought that _Language Tool_ had an optional style checker, but in
looking through the options in September 2017 version, it doesn't look
like it.  :(   Maybe it was for another language.

In theory, _Context Aware Synonym Suggester_ (CASS),  will walk through
a text, suggesting appropriate synonyms, catching "amazingly" and
"amazing" as quasi-duplicates. I've tried it once it or twice, but don't
remember the results.

Those extensions are either in the Apache Open Office extension
repository, or LibreOffice extension repository.
Both Language Tool and CASS are developed on GitHub.

jonathon

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Re: a question about the hyphenator

[toki]

On 04/09/2018 06:46 AM, Mauro Trevisan wrote:
>  Hi, I would like to ask you if there are some documentation on the
> hyphenation algorithm, particularly on the non-standard hyphenation and --
> mainly -- on the NEXTLEVEL keyword.

a) I haven't looked at the code;
b) This is from memory, based on material back when OOo 2.x was in
development;

As such, this might not reflect current practice, if not outright wrong.

There are two hyphenation algorithms in OOo.  One of them was created by
Lázló Németh. (Hoping I have the correct diacritic marks.) The other one
was a slightly modified form of the hyphenation program used by TeX.

The Tex derived hyphenation program is for "normal languages", where
everything is regular, and compounded words can be easily parsed and
broken apart, without losing meaning.

The program Lázló wrote is for non-normal languages. These are languages
that use a number of suffixes, prefixes, intefixes, and other things,
that more or less ensure that breaking the word can, and usually will
alter the meaning of the word, if not the sentence. It is not uncommon
that breaking one of these words in the wrong place, will change the
meaning of the entire paragraph. Hungarian is the best known European
language, with this type of behaviour.

His program also works for languages in which words can be compounded
upon words, to create new words. Break these words in the wrong place,
and one can easily overlook the misplaced hyphen. Even breaking them in
the right place can result in the hyphen being overlooked.

IIRC, Lázló wrote at least one paper, and did one or two presentations
on hyphenation in OOo.

jonathon

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Re: Openoffice and unsupported gstreamer 0.10 branch (for openoffice libavmediagst.so library)

[toki]

On 03/20/2018 01:42 PM, Damjan Jovanovic wrote:
> My sent emails show the patch was attached. 

Message ID:


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Re: Review of BlackDuck OpenHub

[toki]

On 03/16/2018 07:36 PM, Dave Fisher wrote:

> Sorry, I was not clear. 

I saw it as a request to look for trademark/copyright violations.
(One of my other projects is trying to determine who the de juro and de
facto copyright owner of about 100 books, written by the same person,
is. Paraphrasing who we thought the copyright owner was: "My dad did not
steal copyright ownership of that material. He did steal copyright
ownership of this material." So naturally, my head is in
trademark/copyright issues.)

FWIW, there were a couple of projects that, at first glance, would
warrant investigation as trademark/copyright violations.

Andrea Pescetti wrote:

> had I not known this was a page about OpenOffice, I wouldn't have
guessed this was OpenOffice.

I didn't realize that
https://www.openhub.net/p?query=openoffice=users was a sub-page.
Part of that is because I'm not familiar with OpenHub, and part of that
was that it looked more like a list of what can interact with OOo, than
a list of OOo components.

jonathon

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Re: technical question

[toki]

On 03/08/2018 05:29 PM, Leilani M. Pugh wrote:
> This is not a technical "how to" question.  This is something I would like
> to see added somehow, because you can't drag the top & bottom independently

AOo currently offers that functionality.

jonathon

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Re: Copyright year for our packages

[toki]

On 01/19/2018 06:34 PM, Matthias Seidel wrote:

> should be "2012-2018" now.

A lawyer (^2) that specialises in copyright law should be able to
explain the legal rationale. The only part I understood was that with
the hyphen, one loses rights, but with individual date listings, one
retains, or even gains rights. (^1)

At a minimum, run it past legal-discuss, before implementing the change.

I'm not a lawyer. This is not legal advice.

^1: This is a similar situation to including "All Rights Reserved" in
the copyright line. In the United States "All Rights Reserved" does not
currently add any additional rights. However, prior to 1978 (I think),
it did add specific rights, in the United States. Furthermore, in some
countries in South America (Argentina & Chile, IIRC) it still adds
specific rights to the copyright.

^2: I don't remember if it is South African, UK, US, Canadian, or
Mexican copyright law that loses rights, when a hyphen is used.

jonathon



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Re: A problem on OO Debian versions?

[toki]

On 01/01/2018 10:27 AM, Rory O'Farrell wrote:

> I have tested this on Xubuntu 16.04.3 (XFCE), Ubuntu 16.04.3 (Gnome), Debian 
> 9.30 (XFCE), all showing the same freeze.

Where are you getting the Debian build from?

jonathon



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Re: Publish new plugin on extensions page / extensions.openoffice.org mail server down

[toki]

On 12/10/2017 08:33 PM, Gabriel Margiani wrote:
> The plugin is here:
> https://extensions.openoffice.org/en/project/kartuli-ortograpiuli-leksikoni-georgian-spell-checking-dictionary

I just downloaded and installed on LibO. Presumably it will also work
for Aoo.

jonathon

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Re: [PROPOSAL] Start process for AOO 4.1.5-RC1

[toki]

On 12/04/2017 12:00 PM, Jim Jagielski wrote:
>> Are you accepting blockers?
> 
> I am, yes :)
>> We don't have a 4.1.5 blocker flag in Bugzilla, but I guess we can do 
>> without it if this is the only extra fix we will include - dictionary 
>> updates are routine. Of course, if the dictionary update is deemed not to be 
>> important we can skip it too.

English dictionaries has an updated release every month, but extensions
for AOo and LibO are only released every two months, unless there has
been a recent release, in which case the update extension release is
skipped.

In other words

English Dictionaries 2.55 was released on the first of December.

* No extension for LibO or AOo of English Dictionaries 2.55 will be
released.

*  English Dictionaries 2.56 will be released on the first of January 2018.
* An extension of English Dictionaries 2.56 will not be released for LibO;
* Unless an update of AOo is released in either December, or early
January, an extension of English Dictionaries 2.56 for AOo will be
released around 4 January 2018.

* English Dictionaries 2.57 will be released on the first of February.
* No extension for LibO or AOo for English Dictionaries 2.57 will be
released.

* English Dictionaries 2.58 will be released on the First of March.
* An extension of English Dictionaries 2.58 for AOo will be released
around 4 March.
* An extension of English Dictionaries 2.58 for LibO will be released
around 4 March.


The rational for skipping extension updates when a new version of LibO
or AOo is released, is to avoid the appearance of the program being
"broken", right after it is installed.

jonathon

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Re: OpenOffice

[toki]

On 05/07/2017 01:58 PM, Peter Kovacs wrote:

> We are openly declared dead.

It is called evidence based observation.

Specifically, looking at:
* Time taken to fix zero day exploits;
* Code contributions;
* Percentage open bugs/total bugs;
* Release schedule;
* Axillary support;
amongst other data-points;

> So you should start your demands at their side. 

For all practical purposes, TDF & LibO ignore both AOo and ASF.

>If they stop declaring us dead, you made a step in the direction of
cooperation.

The most noise about AOo being dead comes from ASF & AOo.

jonathon

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Re: trying to acquire Open Office.

[toki]

On 04/07/2017 01:00 AM, Sherry Sylvain wrote:
> You web site and download guidelines are so "technical" and convoluted, I 
> can't figure out what you're offering or who I get it. 

As the first line says: "Select your operating system, language, and
version".

How can that be further simplified, without eliminating the options that
are offered?

The simple thing is to only offer Version 4.1.3 Linux (x86-64) (DEB)
with Basque UI version, on the basis that Linux (x86-64) (DEB) is the
most stable operating system out there, Basque, being the only language
that has been continually used for more than ten thousand years, is
obviously the dominant language, used by more people, than its
competitors, the oldest of which is only 5.000 years old, and Version
4.1.3 because everybody obviously wants the latest, and greatest version
of the program, even if it won't run on their system.

jonathon

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Re: Do you offer a version of Access?

[toki]

On 03/18/2017 01:49 AM, Chuck Davis wrote:
> It's better than access.  It's HSQL.

Whilst, on technical merits, HSQL is probably better than the Jet
Database Engine, that isn't what non-database designers look at.
Instead, they look at ease of creating/editing/using a database. To that
end, Access is better than Base.

However, if one installs the Access2Base extension
http://extensions.openoffice.org/en/project/access2base-api-base-users
and spend some time studying the documentation, then playing with it,
the user experience of Base is almost on a par with Access.

jonathon

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Re: trying to get a template from the page...

[toki]

On 02/24/2017 08:58 AM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:

>> Regardless, what would be useful, would be a review of each of those 
>> templates.

> No, because it is unrealistic to want to control 15,000 templates. 

I was thinking of review, in terms of writing a review of the template,
the same way that one writes a review of a film, or a book.

However, a review of a submitted template, to ensure that it meets
specific criteria, would be more useful.

Even little things, like it being in an ODF file format, would be a good
starting point. (Do you want to explain why a file format used by Lotus
Approach is offered as an AOo template?)

> because the originals should be checked and kept up-to-date by their authors.

In as much as at least 10% of the templates never functioned correctly
with AOo in the first place, expecting them to be kept up to date,
appears to be placing an expectation upon the authors that they are
utterly unable to meet.

jonathon


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Re: trying to get a template from the page...

[toki]

On 02/21/2017 05:18 AM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:

> I do not understand why the templates can not be accessed directly at 
> Sourceforge 

They can be, but getting there is extremely tricky.

I quit doing so, because I usually ended up with the wrong template.

jonathon


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Re: [AOO-Templates]

[toki]

On 02/23/2017 10:31 AM, Martin Groenescheij wrote:

>> http://extensions.openoffice.org/en/project/professional-template-pack-ii-english

> And how are users informed about this?

Using the search box.

> it's only solved by cleaning our extension / template pages

Who has the authority to give somebody the power to clean it up, bearing
in mind that neither extensions, nor templates are delivered from a site
that is either controlled by, or operated by _The Apache Software
Foundation_.

jonathon

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Re: trying to get a template from the page...

[toki]

On 02/20/2017 07:08 PM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:

>> Please go to
>> http://templates.services.openoffice.org/
>> and say, which templates you can download.
> 
> This is meant as a joke? 

Regardless, what would be useful, would be a review of each of those
templates.

>On the site are more than 15,000 templates (2 seconds per template for
testing require more than 8 hours).

Assuming I know how to use the template, it takes me ten minutes to
download and test a single template.

If I don't know how to use a template, then testing can take far longer.

> Ok, I can give 5 examples of downloadable templates:

IOW, all the templates that are displayed on the template page, when one
first lands there.

My guess is that of the templates, roughly:
* 1% are on "Access Denied", pages;
* 5% have no downloadable content;
* 20% are not what they purport to be;
* 2% are in desperate need of additional documentation on how to
correctly use them;

jonathon



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Re: Fwd: trying to get a template from the page...

[toki]

On 02/20/2017 05:46 AM, Martin Groenescheij wrote:

> When will you clean-up the templates website?

Were I to cleanup either the template or extension site, I'd eliminate
at least two thirds of them.

jonathon

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Re: trying to get a template from the page...

[toki]

On 02/20/2017 11:10 AM, Mathias Röllig wrote:

> “Access denied” for ALL templates. 

Is there an obligation on the part of anybody, to explain why templates,
and extensions are not accessible?

>And that 2 month after Martin asked on this list

DuckDuckGo implies that the first time I answered a question about that
specific template was in October 2016.  My impression is that it was
much earlier than that.

http://openoffice.2283327.n4.nabble.com/AOO-Templates-td4683853.html


jonathon

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Re: Documentation needs

[toki]

On 02/15/2017 06:07 PM, Peter Kovacs wrote:

>From this perspective I'd start with an FAQ.

This is where it would be great if Solr, in conjunction with some of the
other technologies that are being developed by The Apache Software
Foundation could crawl through the various mailing lists, forums, etc,
and create a list of the 1,000 or so most commonly asked questions,
sorted by frequency of being asked.

###

>From a strictly personal perspective, I think that it will be simpler,
and easier to write new guides from scratch, than trying to update the
existing guides. (FWIW, I've said the same thing about guides for LibO
5.3.(^1))

LibO and AOo on the desktop are at the point where the differences
between them are such, that documentation written for one, is
inapplicable to the other.

For LibO, EO, and AnO on the Android platform, the differences between
them are so much greater, that what works for one, is completely
inapplicable to the other two.

jonathon


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Re: [discussion] Roadmap for Open Office

[toki]

On 03/12/16 12:21, Peter Kovacs wrote:

> But then wrote nothing more. I think if you come here, with the
> will to fight alone through all the mess, you will give up fast because
> you have no Idea what your next step is. 

https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Features
http://www.openoffice.org/development/releases/ooo_roadmap.pdf
https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Product_Release


But as can be seen, they are unmaintained.


jonathon

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Re: Questions about AOO Users

[toki]

On 24/11/16 08:29, RA Stehmann wrote:

> distribute AOO, all figures are not really significant to identify the number 
> of users.

Twould be much more appropriate to recommend software on the basis of
the client's proposed use case, using examples of users with similar
use-cases, that demonstrate how suitable, or unsuitable the proposed
solution is.

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Re: Questions about AOO Users

[toki]

On 23/11/16 22:10, Crystal wrote:

> I will need an answer on or before 28-Nov-2016 

Dropping a question like this the day before a _major_ holiday in the
US, with an expected response before the first workday after that
holiday, to ask specific questions about usage in the US is really bad
planning on somebody's part.

> 2.)Approximately how many users of OpenOffice are there worldwide?

Being FLOSS, there is no way to know if one download represents one
user, or 40,000 users. Likewise, there is no way to know if the same
person downloaded the program two or more times. Currently, there are
roughly 100,000 downloads of Apache OpenOffice every day.

To do the statistical analysis of OS, and where people download the
program from, go to
https://sourceforge.net/projects/openofficeorg.mirror/files/stats/json?start_date=2015-01-01_date=2016-11-22

One major issue, is that this data is from SourceForge, and reflects
that percentage of the population that uses either Windows, or Mac OS X.
Linux users tend to download AOo from the distro repository. Users of
versions of *Nix tend to compile from source.

> 3.)Do you have an estimate as to how many of those users are in the 
> United States?

For 1st quarter and 2nd quarter 2016, 15% of the downloads are from the
United States, but 36% of the downloads are for en_US.

Sorry, I don't have the URL for downloads by language pack. :(

Neither the web forum nor the mailing list provide data about where the
users are from.

> 4.)On average per year, how many times does OpenOffice release an 
> update/patch?

Currently, AOo does one release per year.

jonathon

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Re: Add This Feature to Writer ASAP

[toki]

On 30/09/2016 06:09, Kirk Fraser wrote:

> The most needed feature is a book section organizer like Scrivner which has

Organon

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Re: Become the IMAP client for documents [Re: Differentiate or Die]

[toki]

On 17/09/2016 10:46, Peter Kovacs wrote:

> (Maybe WPS is a good alternate to you then. I read in the german Linux

Why would a program whose developers, in the name of destroying the user
experience, removed features, functionalities, and capabilities. The
only user case in which that is a virtue, is one in which the user has
no qualms about not being able to open documents created with the software.

jonathon

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Re: Differentiate or Die

[toki]

On 09/09/2016 18:11, Jim Jagielski wrote:
> We should be in touch with what our users, and our potential users, want.

Do you mean something other
https://bz.apache.org/ooo/buglist.cgi?f1=votes=greaterthan=Bug%20Number_format=advanced=---=100

jonathon

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Re: Another LWN article

[toki]

On 08/09/2016 20:56, Jonathan Corbet wrote:

}> You should not have to pay to access the article via the subscriber link.

The link you posted enabled me to read the article, and the comments.

If somebody wants to post the following over there, they have my
blessing. ">" is my quoting that article

>LO. There are, to the best of my knowledge, four material differences
between AOO and LO:
>* A large number of features, code cleanups, and bug fixes are in LO
but not in AOO
>* LO has many active contributors and a community worthy of that name,
resulting in faster bugfix turnaround
>* LO has a working multi-platform build system
>* AOO has a permissive license.

For end users that care, the most significant difference between AOo and
LibO is that AOo has much better typographical control.  Furthermore,
the LibO road map implies that typographical control will get worse.

jonathon



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Re: What would OpenOffice NON-retirement involve?

[toki]

On 02/09/2016 19:06, Pedro Giffuni wrote:

>> What can Apache OpenOffice offer that related projects like
LibreOffice cannot?

> That is not an important question:

In terms of marketing that is the only question that is relevant.
It doesn't matter if you are trying to get more developers, or trying to
get more corporations to use AOo, or trying to get more individual users
to use AOo.

> The question is indeed what we want OpenOffice to be.

That would be the second question.
Part of the answer to that question, is a derivative of the first question.

> They may not necessarily want a green thing with different GUI and
different behaviour.

AOo can do roughly a dozen things, that LibO can not do. I'd be
surprised if as many as 0.01% of both the developer base, and the
user base of either program, could list those things.

The odds are that Joe Random User won't even notice the absence of those
12 things.

jonathon

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Re: [DISCUSS] What Would OpenOffice Retirement Involve? (long)

[toki]

On 02/09/2016 20:12, Dave Fisher wrote:

> I disagree with consumer vs corporate. Individuals have benefited greatly 
> from all of the free projects like HTTPD, 

HTTPD is a Daemon, run for websites --- corporate, not individuals.

>tomcat, 

Web server. Again, corporate, not individuals.

>poi

This is a set of Java Libraries. Again corporate, not individuals

>Tika,

Content detection software. Again corporate, not individuals

>Solr,
Enterprise search platform. Again, corporate not individuals

>Lucene,

Information retrieval software library.  Again, corporate not individuals.

> We are striving to be a community and not a marriage. The bar to enter or 
> exit a community is much different.

The problem with parables, as that the audience more often that not
fails to understand their meaning.

jonathon

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Re: [DISCUSS] What Would OpenOffice Retirement Involve? (long)

[toki]

On 02/09/2016 12:52, RA Stehmann wrote:

>> being an end-user focused effort. I would suggest we focus on not
>> being one, but instead being a framework or library that can be consumed
>> by actual end-user implementations.

> If AOO is not an end-user focused project 

AOo is one of the few --- perhaps only --- Apache Foundation project
that is end-user focused. It is the only one that is consumer, as
opposed to corporate focused.

As a framework, or library, the project would be much more aligned with
The Apache Foundation's sphere of expertise and knowledge.

> Also people, who build binaries are obsolete.

Even with frameworks, binaries have to be built. They simply aren't
distributed.

> The first way might be the "Apache way", but it is definitely not the way for 
> and of the OpenOffice community.

Upon meeting, the couple is entranced with each other, and get married.
Having learnt more about each other, they discover that things are not
what they thought they were, so they get divorced.
If both sides had been willing to make adjustments, the divorce would
not have happened.

jonathon

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Re: What would OpenOffice NON-retirement involve?

[toki]

On 02/09/2016 17:21, Phillip Rhodes wrote:

>> a Mac Mini with 500 GB hard disk and Mac OS Yosemite delivered on Sunday. 
> Is such a machine sufficiently powerful for building AOO, 

Yes.

>and doing so in a reasonable period of time?

That depends upon what the user considers "reasonable".

For full fledged development, I think it is inadequate, simply because
of the time it will take to build AOo. As a test bed machine, it is
adequate.

jonathon

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Re: What would OpenOffice NON-retirement involve?

[toki]

On 02/09/2016 14:59, Phillip Rhodes wrote:

> What is the most important thing/things we could be working on?  

On your own hardware:

Repeat:
   Build a Mac OS X Binary;
   Fix the error messages you get;
   Write notes about what you did;
   Test the program functionality;
Until it builds properly and all functions work as expected;

Then submit the patches and notes your you wrote to the SVN.

> How do we counter the FUD that is already being promulgated in
response to the "retirement" discussion?

At this stage, the only thing that might be adequate, is a release
before the end of the weekend, followed up by a release before New Years.

jonathon

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Re: Merge with LibreOffice?

[toki]

On 31/08/2016 16:26, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> The question I am left with is this: If a cousin development provides what 
> you want, why are you not satisfied with that?

There are functions and capabilities in AOo that are not in LibO or EO.
There are functions and capabilities in EO that are not in LibO or AOo.
There are functions and capabilities in LibO that are not in AOo or EO.

As such, until one of those contains all of the functions and
capabilities found in the other two, there will always be users whose
use case will require at least two, if not all three be installed.

jonathon

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Re: Independent Entity to Develop and Further AOO

[toki]

On 31/08/2016 16:26, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> One can always create an independent entity.  It hasn't happened.  By now, 
> the odds are clearly that it will not.  

The Document Foundation is an independent entity, building upon the OOo
3.x code base.

> My considered opinion is that the greatest barrier is lack of a meaningful 
> business/operation/funding model.

The business model is giving away the product, but selling support
services. Sun almost understood that model. Oracle understands that
model,but would rather throw away their product, than actually implement
that model at the SOHO, or smaller scale.

As a business model, it works for most of the Apache projects that
emerged from Incubation, and stayed out of the Attic.

> I also don't think working on Apache OpenOffice is much of a resume builder, 

What builds resumes is the specific contributions one makes. The
specific project, be it AOo, No Man's Sky, BLEACHER, or anything else,
is irrelevant.

>since there is no other project like it and probably will never be.

At least four other office suites utilize code from AOo. There are at
least a thousand office suites for Android, and iOS, for which AOo
development is a useful starting point.

> If my appraisal is sound, that leaves us with the question about 
> sustainability of the Apache OpenOffice project itself,

Go back to the revenue generation model.

Back in the 2003-2005 time frame, there were several organizations
licensing their rebranded version of OOo for between US$20 and US$5,000
per seat, per year. For various reasons, I quit tracking that data, and
thus don't know what the current situation is.

A decade ago, it was fairly difficult to find worksites of more than
1,000 that used OOo. Today, worksites of more than 5,000 users, using an
OOo derivative, are not not that scarce. Somebody is providing tech
support for those worksites.

jonathon

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Re: Merge with LibreOffice?

[toki]

On 03/08/2016 19:22, Phillip Rhodes wrote:

> Personally I think it would be ideal if the two projects could/would freely
> share code, but due to the license conflict, AOO can't reuse code
> from LO unless the author(s) is/are willing to also license it 

At this stage, there are enough differences between the two, that code
submitted to one of the projects usually has to be rewritten for other
project, which is usually fairly trivial.

I have not yet done my August "examine new extensions". In July, there
were roughly half a dozen extensions for LibO that were not installable
in AOo, with another half a dozen or so that were not testable, because
they were Windows only.

As far as templates go, there are two or three for LibO, that won't
function with AOo. (Mainly Calc. Major issue is column constraints in
AOo.) I'm not aware of any AOo templates that won't function with LibO.

jonathon


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Re: [REPORT] AOO 4.1.2 Deployment and Take-Up through 2016Q2

[toki]

On 19/07/2016 01:48, Dave Fisher wrote:

> 238 "countries" is impressive. Are any missed?

Depending upon who is doing the counting, and how they are counting,
there are between 198 and 350 countries in the world today.

That said, I was surprised by a couple of countries that were listed.
I'm guessing that SourceForge knows what it is doing.

jonathon

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Re: [REPORT] AOO 4.1.2 Deployment and Take-Up through 2016Q2

[toki]

On 16/07/2016 20:00, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> It turns out that downloads-by-destination (to within IP-address analysis) is 
> easy to get. 

That makes for some very interesting results.

jonathon

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Re: [REPORT] AOO 4.1.2 Deployment and Take-Up through 2016Q2

[toki]

On 14/07/2016 21:17, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

>>> .
> There's a Calc spreadsheet in the same folder that you can use to see how I 
> did it.

What is the unshortened URL?

jonathon

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Re: [REPORT] AOO 4.1.2 Deployment and Take-Up through 2016Q2

[toki]

On 13/07/2016 20:09, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

>> country/geographic unit?
> I'll have to dig deeper into what SourceForge provides. I'll let you know 
> when I find something.

Thanks.

> The full breakdown of languages based on the latest week sampled was compiled 
> and ranked in the spreadsheet document in PDF format at
> .

Got it.  Now to see what other statistical analysis I can do with it.

jonathon

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RE: [REPORT] AOO 4.1.2 Deployment and Take-Up through 2016Q2

[toki]

Dennis wrote:

>  US destinations .. 15% of the total.

Would it be possible to obtain percentage downloads for each
country/geographic unit?

>with 11 languages in the top 92%: English, French, German, Italian, Spanish, 
>Japanese, Russian, Polish,
Portuguese, Chinese and Dutch in decreasing order.

Would it be possible to obtain percentages for each of the 27 languages?

Wondering which languages and countries are overrepresented in
downloads, and which ones are under-represented in downloads.

jonathon

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RE: A Question about Open Office Password Protected Text Documenets

[toki]

Roger wrote:

>Is there any likelihood in the future of any ‘redundancy’ or suchlike where 
>these documents would be no longer accessible by future then current software 
>etc? 

The presence or absence of a specific feature or function being on the
roadmap, does not preclude it from being in a future version of the program.

Ideally, there will at least one version of a future program that can
read/write passwords created by the current algorithm, and by the
proposed/future password algorithm.

>in that there will always be an Open Office allied program capable of 
>unlocking their password protected format?

In as much as there is off the shelf software, that is not related to
OpenOffice.org, that can read/write passwords created using either the
current algorithm, and the former algorithm, I'm fairly confident that
any future algorithm changes to password creation, will be incorporated
into that off the shelf non-OOo related software. {That the software is
available, does not mean that it will display the password, within a
human lifetime.}

#

>From a security perspective, the password protection offered by
LibreOffice, Apache Open Office, etc, is roughly equivalent to closing
the door and windows of a house.

jonathon

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Re: English Dictionaries update cycle

[toki]

On 17/05/2016 00:02, Keith N. McKenna wrote:

>  I use the American variant that has not been updated since January. 

It has been at least two years since the English variant I use has been
updated.

###

What is the rationale for putting all of the English locale dictionaries
into the same extension?

If that really is needed, could locale specific extensions als be created?

jonathon

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Re: Excell 2003+

[toki]

On 22/04/2016 18:34, John Godfrey wrote:

> the sender told me it was generated by Excel 2003.

I'm guessing you made a typo for Excel 2013,

If it really is Excel 2003, and it really is an .xlsx file, then no the
issue will not fixed, because it can not be fixed. (IIRC, this is the
.xlsx version whose file format can't be shared with other computers,
with a subsequent patch from Microsoft removing that functionality.)

> Will there be an update to facilitate these files?

That depends upon why it won't open. Potential reasons are:
* The file is password protected;
* The file is encrypted;
* The file requires VBA libraries that AOo does not have access to;
* There is something in the file format that AOo doesn't understand, but
is otherwise valid;
* The file itself is corrupt. Try opening it with Excel, and see what
happens;
* Something else;

My guess is that the issue is VBA Libraries are not accessible. I might
be using the wrong name. These are the libraries used for the macro
language that Excel can understand.

jonathon






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Re: Cross Script vulnerabilities in AOo Extensions?

[toki]

On 07/04/2016 16:35, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> Multi-component collaborative exploit staging is possible although
unnecessary.

Rephrasing: For the time being, at least, one can "safely" ignore this
type of exploit, because other vectors are much easier to exploit.

Still, for those who are paranoid about security, this is yet another
cause for concern, for which they will have to create the appropriate
tools to verify the extension is not an exploit.

jonathon




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Cross Script vulnerabilities in AOo Extensions?

[toki]

All:

In reading
http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/04/noscript-and-other-popular-firefox-add-ons-open-millions-to-new-attack/
is the same type of vulnerability is possible with AOo extensions?

jonathon




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Re: MLA Format for students

[toki]

On 26/02/2016 13:56, CascioGeorge wrote:

>It would be nice to have a MLA format feature for students that is a one or 
>two click setup. 

A template for MLA formatted papers is available at
http://extensions.openoffice.org/en/project/mla-paper-template
This was released in October 2008, so it might not meet current MLA
Style Manual criteria. (The template cites URLs, which are downgraded in
MLA Style 7th Edition.)

Does that template satisfy your request?(^1)

If not, would modifications to the template suffice?  And if so, what
modifications are required.

If the template does not suffice, then what additional functionality or
capability would Apache OpenOffice need to have?

^1: A known weak point of AOo is its bibliographic citation
functionality. If that is part of the problem you are referring to,
there are a couple of work-arounds that aren't too painful to do.

jonathon

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Re: Question

[toki]

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On 18/01/2016 22:23, Detlef Nannen wrote:

> OO can write docx? Really? Is there an extension?

It is built-in.

However, usage of DocX is highly discouraged, due to Microsoft's
defective by design coding philosophy, which in this case is manifest by
MSO's inability for all but the most careful, expert users of MSO to
save documents in the same format of DocX as AOo utilizes.

Whilst AOo could "fix" this, the bug is that MSO doesn't adhere to the
ISO specifications.  The secondary reason for not using DocX, is that it
is, according to Microsoft, a file format suitable only for use by
_legacy_ documents.  IOW, documents created today are not suitable for D
ocX.

jonathon
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Re: OpenOffice and SourceForge: cruel wedding

[toki]

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On 08/01/2016 20:54, Roberto Galoppini wrote:
> Thanks for your patience, what follows it's the result of a joint meet
ing
> with our AdOps team and  our Managing Director.

Is "our AdOps team" a SourceForge team, or an Apache Software Foundation
Team?

jonathon
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Re: Re: Complaint Writer lost 36 pages of my document with no auto backup copy.

[toki]

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On 31/12/2015 19:49, Andreas Säger wrote:

> When you save another version in foreign file format, the current
document should remain the ODF source.

That part is a good idea.

> Foreign files should be loaded read-only and saved as ODF before editi
ng.

That works if, and only if the user can export to the foreign file forma
t.
> The term "backup" should be avoided all together in favour of "crash
> recovery". Can we really assure that our crash recovery tool works wit
h
> all supported file formats including the foreign ones?

"Crash Recovery", "Backup" and "Auto-Save" describe three different
process that can, but need not use the same document.

When to use each of those, depends upon the specific set of conditions
and use-cases that the user is experiencing at the time.

jonathon
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Re: Spellcheck and backup problems [was: Complaint Writer lost 36 pages of my document with no auto backup copy.

[toki]

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On 30/12/2015 16:59, Rory O'Farrell wrote:

> If not, it could cause an automatic installation of a reduced mode/pri
vate SVN installation, which would maintain backups of previous versions
 of the OO data files in use.

My suggestion would be to add that functionality to OOSVN.
http://extensions.services.openoffice.org/en/project/ooosvn.

For most use-cases, I'm not convinced that SVN is an appropriate
standard backup.  What I am convinced of, is that configuring, and using
SVN is beyond the skill set of the majority of AOO users.

jonathon
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Re: Complaint Writer lost 36 pages of my document with no auto backup copy.

[toki]

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On 30/12/2015 02:33, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> Is there a Bugzilla # on this?

I don't know.

I've forgotten who told me about it, but the consensus was that it was
easier to work around it, by ensuring that both "Save AutoReceovery
Information" and "Always create backup copy" are unchecked, than trying
to recreate the situation in which the bug is usually triggered.

jonathon
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Re: [LAZY CONSENSUS] Changes to local "code use" wording

[toki]

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On 29/12/2015 18:00, Kay Schenk wrote:

> In other words, if an author/developer licenses code with
> a particular license, is it not the intention of that developer to
> have the the product used in accordance with the license? And, if
> that is the case, why are any additional requests needed?

Due Diligence.
To ensure that the license that accompanied the code was the license
that the author/developer distributed the code under.

jonathon




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Re: Complaint Writer lost 36 pages of my document with no auto backup copy.

[toki]

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On 26/12/2015 15:55, Bill M wrote:

> I did find in options that in Options\Load Save\General “Always create
 a
> backup copy” was not checked. This should be checked by default. :(

a) There is an extremely obscure, semi-inconsistently ir-reproducible
bug in AOo, EO, and LibO that is triggered when "Always create backup
copy" is checked. This bug both destroys data, and prevents the backup
copy from being made.

b) Manually saving the file is superior to automated backup, precisely
one can save it to different folders, and thus rollback to earlier
states is possible. (I'm deliberately ignoring OoSVN here.)

jonathon
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Re: downloading to tablet

[toki]

On 10/11/2015 06:33, bpower4 wrote:

> I have Office on my computer – and find it excellent for the writing of 
> letters, etc.

An external keyboard is mandatory. Touch screens simply aren't
functional for writing more than about ten words at a time.
I'd suggest buying the cheapest keyboard possible, because they all
die/get destroyed within six months.

None of the office suites that run on tablets correctly handle styles.
As such, a plain text editor is more productive, even factoring in the
time required for doing presentation markup, semantic markup, and
structural markup, after perfecting the content.

There are two ODF compatible office suites for Android, that do not
require a continuous connection to the Internet:
* EuroOffice Calc, EuroOffice Word, EuroOffice Presentation (EO);
* Android Open Office (AnOO);

Overall, AnOO is able to open, and edit more complex documents, and
larger documents, than EO.

Slightly more extensions can be installed on EU, than AnOO. However,
assume that your favourite extensions are not installable. The direct
consequence of this, is that grammar checking, and spell-checking is
probably not available for your language.

Neither of these programs are suitable, if one is
viewing/editing/creating confidential documents.

jonathon



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Re: [QUESTION] Getting to AOO for Java (AOO4J)?

[toki]

On 15/11/2015 20:06, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> Please be more specific.  I can't tell from the previous post what you mean 
> by deserializing untrusted code.

There are a string of known zero day exploits that Oracle, for whatever
reason, has not released patches for, despite exploits having been in
the wild for more than 90 days.

jonathon




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Re: [QUESTION] Getting to AOO for Java (AOO4J)?

[toki]

On 08/11/2015 14:32, Patricia Shanahan wrote:

>I am just getting started on AOO, and don't know the history of this
discussion,

Pretty much since Sun purchased StarWriter, there have been proposals to
make OpenOffice.org Java only. If one considers NeoOffice to be a Java
fork, then it is the only proposal to have gained any traction.

>but here are some general advantages of Java:

Things such as
http://foxglovesecurity.com/2015/11/06/what-do-weblogic-websphere-jboss-jenkins-opennms-and-your-application-have-in-common-this-vulnerability/
are viewed as sufficient reason to avoid Java wherever and whenever
possible.

FWIW, that isn't the only list of known, unpatched zero day exploits of
Java, that are in the wild.

jonathon





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Re: [QUESTION] Usability of Non-Optional Java Dependencies

[toki]

On 10/29/2015 07:20 PM, Damjan Jovanovic wrote:

>> Three paths come to mind.
>>  A. Remove the Java dependencies.
> Impossible. JDBC drivers for example, are the lifeblood of Base.

FWIW, the hardest, to the point of being impossible to replace, is the
stuff that a11y tools rely on.

jonathon

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Re: Apache replacement

[toki]

On 10/10/15 13:48, donaldupre wrote:

>The decision making will stay with Apache.

There is nothing preventing an organization from collecting the source
code Apache releases, modifying it, and commercially distributing the
resulting program. As such, Apache's decision making becomes totally
irrelevant.

See for, example, EuroOffice.

jonathon

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Re: Wrongful information on the Wikipedia

[toki]

On 17/09/15 15:30, Phillip Rhodes wrote:

> This is about Wikipedia being accurate, and the simple truth is, 


Wikipedia is not about accuracy, nor is it about truth. What it is
about, is whether or not the delusions and hallucinations of the editors
can be supported by an appeal to an external authority.

jonathon

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Re: 2015-08-25 When Speaking as the Chair

[toki]

On 26/08/15 00:56, Tony Stevenson wrote:

 I don't want to have my communications to now be taken with
 more authority than they would were I not the Chair.   
 
 For anyone who knows how the ASF works they will know that this is not
 even possible. As you are no more senior, and therefore carry no more
 authority.

The key phrase is anybody who knows how the ASF works.

Most people don't, which is part of the reason why the template for
incubation as an Apache Project included an excessive fascination with
the Apache Way.

What Dennis is doing, is making explicit _The Apache Way_, and hoping
that journalists, etc will read that post, before they make their
incorrect assumptions.

jonathon

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Re: Two Languages: One ISO-639-# code

[toki]

On 20/05/2015 20:01, Rob Weir wrote:

 1. I have no idea what anyone in this thread is talking about, but it does 
 sound important.

It is about adding AOo support for minority languages that are
threatened, extinct, or dead.

Rephrased: Implementing full and complete support in AOo for languages
that have less than 1,000 (L1 + L2) users.

Unfortunately, a UI won't be available for most of those languages.  :(

jonathon



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Re: Two Languages: One ISO-639-# code

[toki]

On 19/05/2015 10:20, Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote:

 So in ISO 639-X the most accurate you can pinpoint it is xo and then xho.
 And in glotolog; you have mpon1252 as its most precise denominator.
 
 Now as it *happens* - this language is spoken in an area fully covered by a 
 single country - so you can use a 3166 as a country (-1, ZA) or (-2, ZA-EC, 
 ZA-NL) region specifier; and then refine it.
 As it happens that the region more or less maps to the language spoken
there (and lets argue that in that region or country no other languages
are spoken).

However, Xhosa is currently included in AOo, and is spoken in the same
country as mPondo. I _think_ that AOo currently uses ISO 3166-1 code
(IE: ZA).

 
 For a slightly different example, I give you Koine Greek and Attic Greek
 .
 Linguist-List codes them as grc-koi  grc-att, respectively.
 ISO 639-2 code is GRC. ISO 639-3 is GRC. No ISO 639-1 code.

 I wish all dialects/languages were as accommodating as:
 Gottolog lush1251
 ISO 639-1 none;
 ISO 639-2 none;
 ISO 639-3 LUT;
 ISO 639-3 SKA;
 ISO 639-3 SNO;
 ISO 639-3 SLH;
 (Note: AFAIK, there are no spell checkers or grammar checkers for those
 dialects, for any office suite.)
 
 So also good examples - and I think the same applies
 
 - you get broad specifiers on -1, -2 level.
 - you may get granular specifiers in -3 and -5 for the rarer/older 
 languages.
 - for dialects and more refined pinpointing you hit the limits of 639(-5) 
 and have
   two options; petition SIL/Library of Congress to add one (above 
 examples are all in scope); or rely on glottolog.
 
 and
 
 - using regional coding; 3166; is not really helping you - as they do not 
 define language.

ISO 3166-2  3166-1 codes are useful for locales. Which is the
difference between Xhosa, and mPondo. At least, if one accepts the legal
fiction that the enclaves are part of KwaZulu, and not Eastern Cape, and
also the debatable point that mPondo is either a distinct language or a
dialect of Xhosa.

I will grant that for the First Nation languages of Australia, ISO
3166-2 codes are not helpful, because the language changes at intervals
of between five and twenty five miles. (One farm in either Northern
Territories, or Western Australia can be the home of up to a dozen
different First Nation languages.)

 Pragmatically that means using an exact -3 if you have it (i.e. the exact 
 language match); 

relying on the nearest ‘above’ -5 language family identifier when there
is no -3 match to be had; and ONLY in the -5 case add whatever you can,
e.g. the glottolog identifier, to refine it.

That helps with most minority languages. There are some that glottolog
won't define a code for, on the grounds that they are, for all practical
purposes, extinct.

 or something along those lines. And discourage -1 and 3166 use; though permit 
 it in :other if there is no glottolog entry

That makes things easy.

Now to delve into a couple of spelling and grammar checkers, and change
them to those criteria.

And then submit the RFEs for those language/locales.

jonathon



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Re: Two Languages: One ISO-639-# code

[toki]

On 19/05/2015 08:05, Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote:

 In testing out various grammar and spell checkers, I've come across a
 couple of instances, where different languages/dialects share the sam
e
 ISO-639-# code.
 
 Can you give an example

ISO 639-1 is xo
ISO 639-2 is xho
ISO 639-3 is xho
Glotolog is xhos1239
ISO 3166-1 ZA / ZAF / 710
ISO 3166-2 ZA-EC

and

ISO 639-1 is xo
ISO 639-2 is xho
ISO 639-3 is xho
Glotolog is mpon1252
ISO 3166-1 ZA / ZAF / 710
ISO 3166-2 ZA-NL
(Please skip the debate about whether or not the enclaves are KwaZulu,
the Eastern Cape, or Lesotho.)

For a slightly different example, I give you Koine Greek and Attic Greek
.
Linguist-List codes them as grc-koi  grc-att, respectively.
ISO 639-2 code is GRC. ISO 639-3 is GRC. No ISO 639-1 code.

I wish all dialects/languages were as accommodating as:
Gottolog lush1251
ISO 639-1 none;
ISO 639-2 none;
ISO 639-3 LUT;
ISO 639-3 SKA;
ISO 639-3 SNO;
ISO 639-3 SLH;
(Note: AFAIK, there are no spell checkers or grammar checkers for those
dialects, for any office suite.)

jonathon



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Two Languages: One ISO-639-# code

[toki]

All:

In testing out various grammar and spell checkers, I've come across a
couple of instances, where different languages/dialects share the same
ISO code.

IOW:
The _current_ ISO 639-1, ISO 639-2, ISO 639-3, ISO 639-4, ISO 639-5, and
ISO 639-6 codes are the same. They do have different Glottolog Codes.

The only solutions I found from Google searches were:
* Use User-1 for one language, User-2 for the other language;
* Use a completely different language and locale for one language;

The issue with User-#, is that it is no longer found in standard
 builds.

The issue with use a completely different language, is that that
results in a language collision, when a user has to use both languages.

Question:
* What is the recommended practice for this type of situation.

###

Currently, this is an unusual case, but as the project extends into more
languages that are threatened, endangered, extinct, or dead, it will
become much more common.

###

I do have complete locale data for one or two of these conflicting
languages. However, since they share the same ISO 639-#, ISO 15924, and
 ISO 3166-1 Codes, I don't see how any program could
correctly differentiate between them. As a general rule, they do have
different ISO 3166-2 Codes.

ISO 3166-3 Codes are not of much use here, because they aren't old
enough for the languages that need them. (Chinese, Greek, and Hebrew,
amongst others.)

jonathon



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Re: AOo in a multi-lingual environment

[Toki]

On 7/15/2014 4:53 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
 It would be helpful to us to get a copy of this document to review.

a) By this document do you mean the document I wrote almost a decade
ago, or the document that I might write this year?

b) If the former is meant, how would decade old, unmaintained
documentation help you today?

jonathon

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Re: AOo in a multi-lingual environment

[Toki]

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On 7/11/2014 9:46 PM, Alexandro Colorado wrote:
 Great hope to see the patch on bugzilla about those changes to the
 source code.

Afore I write any code, I'd have to know why the functionality was
_removed_ in the first place.

jonathon

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AOo in a multi-lingual environment

[Toki]

All:

A couple of days ago I found my source copy of  version 0.6 of _OOo in a
Multi-Lingual Environment_ last night, in cleaning up files on my hard
drive. (This is from December 2004, and is for OOo 1.1.3-ZA.)

How fruitful would it be, to update it for AOo 4.x?

In spending roughly half an hour looking at what was described in that
document, my guess is that I'll be spending ten to fifteen hours trying
to determine the optimum workaround for the current version of LibO,
_if_ a workaround is possible, for each of around a dozen things that
were used as workarounds in OOo 1.1.3-ZA, that are not present in AOo 4.0.


jonathon


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Re: [DISCUSS] possible blog topic -- AOO and Linux: a marriage made in heaven! :)

[toki]

On April 21, 2014 4:04:30 AM PDT, Detlef Nannen  wrote:
May be it is possible to serve a AOO-Package including a Startscript.
Looking for the needed Version, asking for permission and running all
this for a easy Installation. A Job for specialists, but possible?

+1

I don't remember the program, but the Ubuntu PPA is nothing more than a shell 
script, which downloads the current version of the software, and installs 
everything in the correct place, with the appropriate desktop icons. This 
script does not need to be changed when the program is updated.  It also gives 
users the option of selecting the current stable version, the bleeding edge 
version, or the previous stable version.  (The developer removed the ability to 
install the daily build, on the grounds that people who need this script, 
should not do any type of testing.) Other distro PPAs have a similar 
install/update script for that software. 

jonathon

-- 
Your documents, your language, your way.

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Re: Ask OpenOffice #2 Top Questions: Now for the answers....

[Toki]

On 2/28/2014 8:13 AM, Roberto Galoppini wrote:


 * The presence of templates that are not Gratis;
 * The presence of templates that are not Libre;
 * Some of the vocabulary used by SourceForge;



 Not sure I understand this, can you please clarify? I'd be happy to 
change

 what could be a source of confusion.



a) One of the misconceptions about FLOSS, is that it is has to be 
gratis. Whilst FLOSS can be sold, the license permits everybody to race 
to the bottom, and offer the software for as close to gratis
 as their economic situation permits. This creates the expectation that 
the software is gratis.


There are some templates that require a payment to the creator, or other 
third party. In some instances, that is made clear during the 
downloading process.  In most instances, it is clear only after
careful study of the licensing portion of the template. The payment 
usually, but not always goes to a third party --- neither The Apache 
Foundation, nor the creator of the template.


b) Being an Apache Foundation project, my expectation is that templates 
be distributed under an Apache Licence. That is not the case. Instead, 
they range the gamut from BSD through proprietary licenses that are 
adamantly non-Libre.
 (The licenses fail Open Software Foundation, Free Software Foundation, 
and Debian Legal criteria for what constitutes a Libre licence


What would be helpful, would be if for each template:
* The license that it is distributed is clearly, and _accurately_ displayed;
* The cost, if any, is clearly displayed;
prior to downloading the template.

FWIW, the same thing also applies to extensions.


jonathon






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Re: Malware infection

[Toki]

On 2/22/2014 6:01 AM, John Barrett Rose wrote:



On my recommendation, a friend in Salzburg tried to install

 Openoffice.org on his iMac on Thursday 20 Feb and found it was infected
 with Genieo malware including fake Adobe and fake Java installations.


Please provide the exact URL that OpenOfice.org was downloaded from.


jonathon

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