RE: $21 million per day
CNET is doing a very good job of getting the word out... I received this link in an email I received today from CNET... http://download.cnet.com/8301-2007_4-57566982-12/free-office-2013-alternatives/?tag=nl.e415s_cid=e415 Although they did not mention that AOO directly, they did mention LibreOffice and also put a link to AOO since LibreOffice originated from AOO. Pete... Peter J Romano prom...@msn.com When you were born, you cried and the world rejoiced. Live your life so that when you die, the world cries and you rejoice. - Cherokee Proverb Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2013 21:40:36 -0600 From: libby1...@att.net To: market...@openoffice.apache.org CC: prom...@msn.com; dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: $21 million per day Hello. Mastercard sells a mixture of services from financial services, banking, as well as consumer data to other companies. They also have revenue streams off of POS (point of sale) transactions and interest payments from consumers and businesses. Creating a value statement for those who are already aware of AOO to increase usage and word of mouth will be difficult. This goes as well for those that we all might have heard of that do not even know there are alternatives to Microsoft Office at all. -- Libby On 2/6/2013 21:30, PETER ROMANO wrote: What does Mastercard sell ? Pete... Peter J Romano prom...@msn.com Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2013 08:43:08 -0500 Subject: $21 million per day From: robw...@apache.org To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
Re: $21 million per day
Hello. Mastercard sells a mixture of services from financial services, banking, as well as consumer data to other companies. They also have revenue streams off of POS (point of sale) transactions and interest payments from consumers and businesses. Creating a value statement for those who are already aware of AOO to increase usage and word of mouth will be difficult. This goes as well for those that we all might have heard of that do not even know there are alternatives to Microsoft Office at all. -- Libby On 2/6/2013 21:30, PETER ROMANO wrote: What does Mastercard sell ? Pete... Peter J Romano prom...@msn.com Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2013 08:43:08 -0500 Subject: $21 million per day From: robw...@apache.org To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
Re: $21 million per day
On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 9:58 PM, Sally Khudairi s...@apache.org wrote: Hello Dave --great to hear from you, and with a wonderful subject :-) I'm happy to help, and can work with both Rob and Don (and whomever else would like to participate) on getting something formal out the door. Sally, happy to spread the news via SourceForge and our channel media if you wish so. Roberto Is there a timeframe in mind? Next week, I presume? Thanks in advance, Sally From: Dave Fisher dave2w...@comcast.net To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; ASF Marketing Publicity pr...@apache.org Cc: market...@openoffice.apache.org Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2013, 15:54 Subject: Re: $21 million per day Hi Sally, Please see this message thread: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-dev/201302.mbox/%3CCAP-ksoiJx5QqRvAQpHTJJ2_VasPCji9gTi4R3PH8bg_ntwkJ9A%40mail.gmail.com%3E Rob is working on a blog post, but I think that this is something worthy of an ASF press release as it shows substantial value provided to the public. Thanks and Regards, Dave On Feb 6, 2013, at 12:42 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob -- This e- mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above. It may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail and any attachment(s) is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by replying to this e-mail and delete the message and any attachment(s) from your system. Thank you.
Re: $21 million per day
Beautiful. Thanks so much, Roberto. This is hugely appreciated! Cheers chat soon, Sally From: Roberto Galoppini rgalopp...@geek.net To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; Sally Khudairi s...@apache.org Cc: Dave Fisher dave2w...@comcast.net; ASF Marketing Publicity pr...@apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org market...@openoffice.apache.org Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 5:00 Subject: Re: $21 million per day On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 9:58 PM, Sally Khudairi s...@apache.org wrote: Hello Dave --great to hear from you, and with a wonderful subject :-) I'm happy to help, and can work with both Rob and Don (and whomever else would like to participate) on getting something formal out the door. Sally, happy to spread the news via SourceForge and our channel media if you wish so. Roberto Is there a timeframe in mind? Next week, I presume? Thanks in advance, Sally From: Dave Fisher dave2w...@comcast.net To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; ASF Marketing Publicity pr...@apache.org Cc: market...@openoffice.apache.org Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2013, 15:54 Subject: Re: $21 million per day Hi Sally, Please see this message thread: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-dev/201302.mbox/%3CCAP-ksoiJx5QqRvAQpHTJJ2_VasPCji9gTi4R3PH8bg_ntwkJ9A%40mail.gmail.com%3E Rob is working on a blog post, but I think that this is something worthy of an ASF press release as it shows substantial value provided to the public. Thanks and Regards, Dave On Feb 6, 2013, at 12:42 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers. But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc: $7.391 billion -- OfficeMax: $7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob -- This e- mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above. It may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail and any attachment(s) is strictly prohibited. If you have received
RE: $21 million per day
-Original Message- From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 9:43 PM To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: $21 million per day On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob You can buy Microsoft products considerably below their official prices quoted on Microsoft's web sites. On http://geizhals.de/eu/894430 you can compare real market prices for different European languages in different countries and from different vendors. Microsoft Office Home and Student (1 computer) sample best prices (VAT included, shipment excluded) as of Feb. 7th Germany: 105,11 Euro Poland: 110,11 Euro = PLN 460 Italy: 108,04 Euro Differences are mostly due to differences in VAT percentage, e.g. Germany 19%, Poland 23%. Sample Amazon prices Amazon.de: 112,69 Euro Amazon.at: 112,69 Euro Amazon.it: 114,24 Euro Amazon.co.uk: £96.50 = 111,50 EUR surprisingly expensive Amazon.es: 127,35 Euro Amazon.fr: 129,90 Euro In general, the real market price in European countries seems to be mostly in the range of 110,00 Euro to 115,00 Euro Hans We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
Re: $21 million per day
On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:34 AM, Hans Zybura hzyb...@zybura.com wrote: -Original Message- From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 9:43 PM To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: $21 million per day On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob You can buy Microsoft products considerably below their official prices quoted on Microsoft's web sites. On http://geizhals.de/eu/894430 you can compare real market prices for different European languages in different countries and from different vendors. Microsoft Office Home and Student (1 computer) sample best prices (VAT included, shipment excluded) as of Feb. 7th Germany: 105,11 Euro Poland: 110,11 Euro = PLN 460 Italy: 108,04 Euro Differences are mostly due to differences in VAT percentage, e.g. Germany 19%, Poland 23%. Ah, good observation. That would explain the difference in the US price. In the US most internet sales are free of sales tax. And even where there is tax it is not listed in the sticker price, but is added after. -Rob Sample Amazon prices Amazon.de: 112,69 Euro Amazon.at: 112,69 Euro Amazon.it: 114,24 Euro Amazon.co.uk: £96.50 = 111,50 EUR surprisingly expensive Amazon.es: 127,35 Euro Amazon.fr: 129,90 Euro In general, the real market price in European countries seems to be mostly in the range of 110,00 Euro to 115,00 Euro Hans We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
RE: $21 million per day
-Original Message- From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2013 1:14 PM To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; hzyb...@zybura.com Subject: Re: $21 million per day On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:34 AM, Hans Zybura hzyb...@zybura.com wrote: -Original Message- From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 9:43 PM To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; market...@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: $21 million per day On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob You can buy Microsoft products considerably below their official prices quoted on Microsoft's web sites. On http://geizhals.de/eu/894430 you can compare real market prices for different European languages in different countries and from different vendors. Microsoft Office Home and Student (1 computer) sample best prices (VAT included, shipment excluded) as of Feb. 7th Germany: 105,11 Euro Poland: 110,11 Euro = PLN 460 Italy: 108,04 Euro Differences are mostly due to differences in VAT percentage, e.g. Germany 19%, Poland 23%. Ah, good observation. That would explain the difference in the US price. In the US most internet sales are free of sales tax. And even where there is tax it is not listed in the sticker price, but is added after. When a price tag is published on a web site/publication/catalogue/in a brick-and-mortar shop aimed at the general public, this is not allowed in Europe. Only in a distinct b2b context one is allowed to publish a so called net price (Nettopreis) where sales tax is not included. And even then the fact has to be explicitly stated and clearly visible. Sales people are usually careful in this respect - one could get sued quite easily, otherwise. Hans -Rob Sample Amazon prices Amazon.de: 112,69 Euro Amazon.at: 112,69 Euro Amazon.it: 114,24 Euro Amazon.co.uk: £96.50 = 111,50 EUR surprisingly expensive Amazon.es: 127,35 Euro Amazon.fr: 129,90 Euro In general, the real market price in European countries seems to be mostly in the range of 110,00 Euro to 115,00 Euro Hans We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from
Re: $21 million per day
Hi Rob, This is great information. It makes me very proud to be a part of Apache OpenOffice. This is something that should be part of our next board report. It is probably worth discussing if this is press release material with Sally at press@ Thanks and Regards, Dave On Feb 6, 2013, at 5:43 AM, Rob Weir wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
Re: $21 million per day
Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Regards Michael signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: $21 million per day
On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob Regards Michael
Re: $21 million per day
On 6 February 2013 17:33, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob @Rob. Nice work as usual, digging out these numbers. I think however (along the lines of Dave) that this is realy something the press could use for a good story, and it would be so much better to tell it to the world, instead of just us in here (we already know we provide a great service). I can already see the title how non-profit organisations help goverments and companies save billions to counter the crisis. Any reporter would like that :-) rgds Jan I Regards Michael
Re: $21 million per day
On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:33, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob @Rob. Nice work as usual, digging out these numbers. I think however (along the lines of Dave) that this is realy something the press could use for a good story, and it would be so much better to tell it to the world, instead of just us in here (we already know we provide a great service). I can already see the title how non-profit organisations help goverments and companies save billions to counter the crisis. Any reporter would like that :-) OK. I'll form this into a blog post. -Rob rgds Jan I Regards Michael
Re: $21 million per day
On 6 February 2013 17:50, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:33, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob @Rob. Nice work as usual, digging out these numbers. I think however (along the lines of Dave) that this is realy something the press could use for a good story, and it would be so much better to tell it to the world, instead of just us in here (we already know we provide a great service). I can already see the title how non-profit organisations help goverments and companies save billions to counter the crisis. Any reporter would like that :-) OK. I'll form this into a blog post. just a question, does ASF / AOO never do press releases, I am used to that e.g. a blog post goes hand in hand with a press release. But I am not sure what the politics are in ASF. We also had our respin, which we did not even publish internally in asf, and I see other projects write a lot about their releases. rgds Jan I. -Rob rgds Jan I Regards Michael
RE: $21 million per day
Dear AOO dev community, I'm impressed! As you describe your value in public blogs and elsewhere, it would be very helpful if you emphasize the impact you are having on the welfare and education of the world's less wealthy populace who can't afford commercial software. To put this in context, the IRS [1] is currently asking non-profit software foundations to demonstrate that they are serving the public benefit and not merely the economic interests of software developers and corporations. So while it is entirely honest to say that we're donating the equivalent of $21 million per day of free software, it is also important to emphasize that this goes largely to the benefit of the world's most deserving. /Larry [1] IRS = U.S. Internal Revenue Service Lawrence Rosen Rosenlaw Einschlag, a technology law firm (www.rosenlaw.com) 3001 King Ranch Rd., Ukiah, CA 95482 Office: 707-485-1242 -Original Message- From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 8:50 AM To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: $21 million per day On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:33, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob @Rob. Nice work as usual, digging out these numbers. I think however (along the lines of Dave) that this is realy something the press could use for a good story, and it would be so much better to tell it to the world, instead of just us in here (we already know we provide a great service). I can already see the title how non-profit organisations help goverments and companies save billions to counter the crisis. Any reporter would like that :-) OK. I'll form this into a blog post. -Rob rgds Jan I Regards Michael
Re: $21 million per day
On 02/06/2013 05:49 AM, Dave Fisher wrote: Hi Rob, This is great information. It makes me very proud to be a part of Apache OpenOffice. yes, indeed! An incredible insight! This is something that should be part of our next board report. It is probably worth discussing if this is press release material with Sally at press@ Thanks and Regards, Dave On Feb 6, 2013, at 5:43 AM, Rob Weir wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob -- MzK A great deal of talent is lost to the world for want of a little courage. -- Sydney Smith
Re: $21 million per day
On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 12:04 PM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:50, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:33, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob @Rob. Nice work as usual, digging out these numbers. I think however (along the lines of Dave) that this is realy something the press could use for a good story, and it would be so much better to tell it to the world, instead of just us in here (we already know we provide a great service). I can already see the title how non-profit organisations help goverments and companies save billions to counter the crisis. Any reporter would like that :-) OK. I'll form this into a blog post. just a question, does ASF / AOO never do press releases, I am used to that e.g. a blog post goes hand in hand with a press release. But I am not sure what the politics are in ASF. It depends on what you mean by a press release If you mean a formal press release, submitted to a wire service, that could be done. But those services are not free. At the other end, we have the informal tone of the blog, which sometimes gets notice by the press. In between we can have pages on the website that are in the form of a press release. We did that with the 3.4.0 release, for example: http://www.openoffice.org/news/aoo34.html. That got a lot of coverage, but I suspect the newsworthiness of the topic is more to credit than the page format. In fact, we had originally drafted it on the blog and then moved it to the website due to some last-minute technical issues with the blog. One way to think of it is this: a press release is designed to be easily consumed by the working journalist. It has a clear lead, is easy to read, has material that can easily be quoted, and of course is newsworthy. A blog post is more conversational, more leisurely, might have more personality, and the audience is more for the users and the larger community, We probably want a mix. We also had our respin, which we did not even publish internally in asf, and I see other projects write a lot about their releases. We did have a blog post on the respin, as well as an announcement sent out to annou...@openoffice.apache.org (9000 subscribers). But I don't think anyone sent it to annou...@apache.org. We should probably include them for release announcements. IMHO the missed opportunity is in engaging the local media, discussion forums, blogs, technical press, etc., for these new languages. We can issue
Re: $21 million per day
If this is a metric we are interested, we can easily get better ideas of unknowns with polls. Though not scientific, its better to hold up claims we have than nothing. A marketing activity would be to do polls, announce on the download and home page, and announce via social media updates/tweets. An example of a poll. http://micropoll.com/t./KEtFbZQfYy Why do you use Apache OpenOffice? A. I saved money, I would have had to pay for an Office Suite. B. I like this free alternative the most. I wouldn't pay for Office Software. C. I like this free alternative the most. I would pay for Office Software if I had to. How many computers do you have Apache OpenOffice installed on? A. 1-2 B. 3-4 C. 5-9 D. 10+ (Not A)'s generally have to pay for multiple licenses. This gets us closer to cost avoidance, not value provided. But its another metric that is also impressive and has strong wind in companies. Samer On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 1:00 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 12:04 PM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:50, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM, janI j...@apache.org wrote: On 6 February 2013 17:33, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:45 AM, RA Stehmann anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de wrote: Am 06.02.2013 14:43, schrieb Rob Weir: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Freedom is far to expensive. (I think you have to multiply the download figures, because people have the really used right to share AOO and they have the right to install it on any number of computers.) Of course, Microsoft also has multi-user and multi-PC licenses as well, which sell at a discount to the price of a single-user license. So it is not strictly a multiplication. But it does make our value a little greater. We also have Base and Draw, so we have additional applications than just Home and Business has, but we're not quite Office Professional since we don't have Publisher. But I think the numbers are a good rough estimate. -Rob @Rob. Nice work as usual, digging out these numbers. I think however (along the lines of Dave) that this is realy something the press could use for a good story, and it would be so much better to tell it to the world, instead of just us in here (we already know we provide a great service). I can already see the title how non-profit organisations help goverments and companies save billions to counter the crisis. Any reporter would like that :-) OK. I'll form this into a blog post. just a question, does ASF / AOO never do press releases, I am used to that e.g. a blog post goes hand in hand with a press release. But I am not sure what the politics are in ASF. It depends on what you mean by a press release If you mean a formal press release, submitted to a wire service, that could be done. But those services are not free. At the other end, we have the informal tone of the blog, which sometimes gets notice by the press. In between we can have pages on the website that are in the form of a press release. We did that with the 3.4.0 release, for example: http://www.openoffice.org/news/aoo34.html. That got a lot of coverage, but I suspect the newsworthiness of the topic is more
Re: $21 million per day
On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
Re: $21 million per day
Hi Sally, Please see this message thread: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-dev/201302.mbox/%3CCAP-ksoiJx5QqRvAQpHTJJ2_VasPCji9gTi4R3PH8bg_ntwkJ9A%40mail.gmail.com%3E Rob is working on a blog post, but I think that this is something worthy of an ASF press release as it shows substantial value provided to the public. Thanks and Regards, Dave On Feb 6, 2013, at 12:42 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers.But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc:$7.391 billion -- OfficeMax:$7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
Re: $21 million per day
Hello Dave --great to hear from you, and with a wonderful subject :-) I'm happy to help, and can work with both Rob and Don (and whomever else would like to participate) on getting something formal out the door. Is there a timeframe in mind? Next week, I presume? Thanks in advance, Sally From: Dave Fisher dave2w...@comcast.net To: dev@openoffice.apache.org; ASF Marketing Publicity pr...@apache.org Cc: market...@openoffice.apache.org Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2013, 15:54 Subject: Re: $21 million per day Hi Sally, Please see this message thread: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/openoffice-dev/201302.mbox/%3CCAP-ksoiJx5QqRvAQpHTJJ2_VasPCji9gTi4R3PH8bg_ntwkJ9A%40mail.gmail.com%3E Rob is working on a blog post, but I think that this is something worthy of an ASF press release as it shows substantial value provided to the public. Thanks and Regards, Dave On Feb 6, 2013, at 12:42 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Yes, yes, we're a non-profit organization. We don't charge for Apache OpenOffice. We don't pay developers. But we still do produce something of value, and that value can be estimated. People need office productivity software. The main alternative to OpenOffice is Microsoft Office, perhaps the Home and Student edition. The latest version (2013) sells for $139.99 on Amazon. This is for the downloadable version. So I'm thinking more on this, and there is an assumption here that the price I pay for Office in the US is the same as anyone else pays around the world. But this is unlikely to be true. This is a classic example of where the fixed costs are in the development and are high, and the variable costs are in the media and distribution and are very low. So a global vendor's optimal strategy is to adjust the pricing country-by-country or region-by-region, to maximize their profits. They can drop the prince in some countries and raise it in others based on ability to pay. I'd love to have some help exploring the magnitude of these differences, to see if they are significant. Let's use the price Microsoft quotes for Home and Student 2013. We want the 1PC perpetual license, not the per-year subscription price. Start from here: http://office.microsoft.com. I had to then go to Products, For Home and Learn more. When I check the US price I get $139.99 When I check the German site (http://office.microsoft.com/de-de) I am quoted 139,00 €. That is $188.04 today. When I check the Australian website I am quoted $169.00 which is $174.42 USD. The Russian website quotes 3499.00 rubles, which is $116.30. So I'm seeing some higher and some lower. Does anyone see pricing that is outside of the range USD 116.30 - 188.04 ? This complicates the analysis, but I don't think it changes the story much. -Rob We have averaged 153K downloads per day of Apace OpenOffice over the last week. That is an average value to the public of $21.5 million per day. Or $7.833 billion (7.833 thousand million) per year. To put that in perspective, here are comparable annual sales figures for some familiar companies: -- Campbell Soup Company: $7.882 billion -- Royal Caribbean Cruises: $7.657 billion -- Mastercard, Inc: $7.391 billion -- OfficeMax: $7.094 billion So we're providing tremendous value to the public. We should be proud of what we've accomplished over the past decade. Note: We could certainly debate the exact value provided to users. Determining what a user would do if they did not get AOO for free is tricky. But the logic above is similar to how the BSA estimates losses to Microsoft from software piracy. They assume that the person who pirates Office would buy it if they did not pirate it. So it seems fair to use that same logic to estimate the value provided to users by a legal free alternative like Apache OpenOffice. Regards, -Rob
