Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
On Sun, May 09, 2010 at 08:42:48PM -0700, Robert Ransom wrote: You need a definition of 'suckless user interface' before you start specifying guidelines for how to produce one. Here's a draft: A suckless user interface is: * useful, * usable, * transparent, * either discoverable or well-documented, * reliable, * as simple as possible, and no simpler, and * customizable. you forget the most important point: you don't design suckless software for the user. You educate the user first, then design software for the new, enlightened man. furthermore, as simple as possible, and no simpler and customizable are very very arguable (in b4 shitstorm) Mate
Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
- Original message - Does suckless really need a WIMP-toolkit? I hope not. Well...this design is not wimp at all, there's no plans to add menus. And the thing is that curses is broken and depends on quite broken text console interface. The idea was trying to offer a cleaner way to do user interfaces for many platforms without the restrictions of a console interface. I really prefer to tap my phone than open the keyboard and type a 4 pipe command. Which is not the same situation on desktop...where keyboard is preferible. And well.. In touchscreens is quite good to use too. A text console sucks more on this kind of devices. That aside, I made some comments to garbeam regarding the code in #cat-v last week, Logs or gtfo I don't remember much but I was not impressed, specially with the whole event/callbacks system, which is a really retarded way to build GUIs. Can you explain me or design a simpler way allowing same or more extensibility? I give many turns to this idea until implementing this design. So far it looks like a really crappy version of GTK. uriel On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 3:00 PM, panc...@youterm.com wrote: Anselm and me have been talking to get a proper initial design to bring a minimalistic widget toolkit to the masses. After few months of thinking, typing test programs and so on I have managed to get a working state for the project, so I'm exposing the results of this work in this mail looking for people who is interested on helping to the project with ideas, patches and so on. SWK is a comprehensive widget kit that aims to be simple, lightweight and support many graphical backends (SDL, x11..) At the moment I have focused the development on SDL, and I have managed to use it in desktop, n900 and a dingoo console. But there's still bugs to fix, things to optimize, missing features and other stuff that is not yet done..but described in TODO. The current set of widgets: void swk_button(SwkEvent *e); void swk_label(SwkEvent *e); void swk_entry(SwkEvent *e); void swk_password(SwkEvent *e); void swk_filler(SwkEvent *e); void swk_option(SwkEvent *e); void swk_separator(SwkEvent *e); void swk_progress(SwkEvent *e); void swk_image(SwkEvent *e); void swk_sketch(SwkEvent *e); Text processing is pretty basic, no formatting, no cursor support, etc.. The creation of new widgets is as simple as defining such a event handler function and embed it into an array of SwkBox'es to the SwkWindow in use. Some of the basics of the design are: - 1 window per-app - automatic scrolling area, so no hidden elements - clean/separated graphical API - no trees, just plain 1 dimensional array of widgets - rows are defined by NEWLINE elements - automatic alignment based of minimum values and swk layout - 2KLOC :) (now is 800LOC) I would explain so many things more about the library, but I think is better if you give a look at the source and try the examples. Feel free to give me feedback and dont be shy to send patches. To build the current version you need: sdl, sdl-ttf and sdl-image Try it and let me know what do you think about it hg clone http://hg.suckless.org/swk Happy hacking --pancake
Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
Mate Nagy dixit (2010-05-10, 09:47): you don't design suckless software for the user. You educate the user first, then design software for the new, enlightened man. Sounds like we've had that history lesson in the thirties... -- [a]
Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
On Mon, 10 May 2010 10:00:12 +0200 pancake panc...@youterm.com wrote: I really prefer to tap my phone than open the keyboard and type a 4 pipe command. Which is not the same situation on desktop...where keyboard is preferible. +1 Dieter
Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 10:20:33AM +0200, pancake wrote: [...] * support for right-to-left scripts, Point this understand dont I. [...] There are languages (such as arabic) that are not written in the latin left-to-right fashion but exactly the other way round (i.e. you have to start reading at the right end of a line and end at the left). Gregor Best pgpWGaONyAqHm.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 10:31:29AM +0200, Gregor Best wrote: There are languages (such as arabic) that are not written in the latin left-to-right fashion but exactly the other way round (i.e. you have to start reading at the right end of a line and end at the left). indeed! let's depend on pango so we can support these issues elegantly, out of the box! whee Mate
Re: [dev] SWK: The simple widget kit
On 05/10/10 10:31, Gregor Best wrote: On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 10:20:33AM +0200, pancake wrote: [...] * support for right-to-left scripts, Point this understand dont I. [...] There are languages (such as arabic) that are not written in the latin left-to-right fashion but exactly the other way round (i.e. you have to start reading at the right end of a line and end at the left). Gregor Best I was not planning to add support to this in the library itself. If we add support to this we should add support for top-down, and other forms like rotated text, etc.. The thing is that , as Mate said, that pango already does that, and this can be integrated with SWK as external optional dependency. --pancake
Re: [dev] [surf] fix for running script.js
Hi, On Sun, May 09, 2010 at 07:27:25PM +0200, Troels Henriksen wrote: script.js will not be run unless the site you are visiting (or has visited in the past?) uses Javascript. This is bad. The attached patch makes surf run script.js in every newly created web view. Nice job - I see that this has been integrated into hg. Scripts still don't work if you have page JavaScript turned off, though. Is there any way around this? S -- Sean Whitton / s...@silentflame.com OpenPGP KeyID: 0x3B6D411B http://seanwhitton.com/
[dev] Disconnect signals when closing web view
The attached patch fixes a crashing bug in surf. There's still plenty of crashing bugs left, though, so the difference is probably only academic at this point (and this feels ugly anyway - what's going on with GTK signal processing?) diff -r d9957625b700 surf.c --- a/surf.c Sun May 09 22:51:26 2010 +0200 +++ b/surf.c Mon May 10 21:17:25 2010 +0200 @@ -234,6 +234,9 @@ int i; Client *p; +/* We don't want signals to pop up while we are in mid-destruction */ + g_signal_handlers_disconnect_matched(GTK_WIDGET(c-view), G_SIGNAL_MATCH_DATA, 0, 0, 0, 0, c); + gtk_widget_destroy(c-indicator); gtk_widget_destroy(GTK_WIDGET(c-view)); gtk_widget_destroy(c-scroll); -- \ Troels /\ Henriksen
Re: [dev] about handling the event loop of wmii
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 8:14 AM, Emmanuel Oga emmanuel...@gmail.com wrote: I'm doing some experiments on scripting wmii with the help of eventmachine. I mounted the wmii fs [...] Then, I came up with this: http://gist.github.com/390396 Why not talk directly to wmii via 9P instead of going through a mount (which will invalidate any benefits you might gain from eventmachine)? In a way EM feels like a natural way of handling an event loop. Agreed. I would suggest grabbing Rumai's message library[1] and building your own transport layer[2] using EventMachine on top. However, note that Rumai already uses a single-threaded re-entrant transport strategy following the XCB cookie approach[3], so I don't know how much more benefit EventMachine will provide. [1] http://github.com/sunaku/rumai/blob/master/lib/rumai/ixp/message.rb [2] http://github.com/sunaku/rumai/blob/master/lib/rumai/ixp/transport.rb#L116 [3] http://www.x.org/releases/X11R7.5/doc/libxcb/tutorial/#requestsreplies this voice on the back of my mind that keeps telling my this might be overkill ... EM = mounted 9P = wmii(overkill) EM= wmii(maybe not)
