Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Il giorno ven, 14/12/2012 alle 09.28 +1000, Peter Hutterer ha scritto: On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:26:14PM +, Sérgio Basto wrote: On Sex, 2012-09-21 at 01:14 +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 12:48:34AM +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 04:44:48PM +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click For xorg.conf.d snippets, use this section instead: Section InputClass Identifier Enable touchpad tapping MatchDriver synaptics Option TapButton 1 EndSection I forgot, this is also described here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Input_device_configuration#Example:_Tap-to-click Seeing cat /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/00-system-setup-keyboard.conf # This file is autogenerated by system-setup-keyboard. Any # modifications will be lost. this file is deprecated and should've been removed in the F17 cycle by systemd-localed. if it's still there, you can remove it. /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/00-system-setup-keyboard.conf is still present in F17, in fact: $ rpm -qf /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/00-system-setup-keyboard.conf system-setup-keyboard-0.8.8-2.fc17.x86_64 $ rpm -qf /usr/lib/systemd/system/systemd-localed.service systemd-44-21.fc17.x86_64 Nicola -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:26:14PM +, Sérgio Basto wrote: On Sex, 2012-09-21 at 01:14 +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 12:48:34AM +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 04:44:48PM +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click For xorg.conf.d snippets, use this section instead: Section InputClass Identifier Enable touchpad tapping MatchDriver synaptics Option TapButton 1 EndSection I forgot, this is also described here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Input_device_configuration#Example:_Tap-to-click Seeing cat /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/00-system-setup-keyboard.conf # This file is autogenerated by system-setup-keyboard. Any # modifications will be lost. this file is deprecated and should've been removed in the F17 cycle by systemd-localed. if it's still there, you can remove it. I remembered that Fedora also could make system-config-synaptics like others system-configs . touchpad settings are generally quite user-specific. while IMO it's reasonable to have a system-wide default keyboard layout that is non-US we don't need the same for synaptics. the driver will come up with defaults and the touchpad will be usable. for real configuration (e.g. scroll methods) the desktop environment should provide a way to configure it on a per-user basis. and command system-setup-keyboard is not present in F18, we got localectl set-x11-keymap [1]. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Input_device_configuration . updated, thanks. And system-config-keyboard ? [1] as wrote in other email: 3. Overwrite /etc/sysconfig/keyboard with following content: # This file is obsolete and may be removed, its settings # were migrated on date by running: # localectl set-x11-keymap this is something you should probably file a systemd bug for. Cheers, Peter Thanks, -- Sérgio M. B. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Ter, 2012-12-11 at 14:04 +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 02:02:57PM +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 05:15:46PM +, Sérgio Basto wrote: On Seg, 2012-12-10 at 09:05 +0100, valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. -- Adam Williamson Hi Adam, when I asked upstream on few similar simple tweaks usually answers was something like this: We don't care, you can change it the way you like it. Any comments? Of course, I have my script, that I run when is necessary. cat ~/syncl.sh synclient VertTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient HorizTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i scroll synclient VertEdgeScroll=1 synclient HorizEdgeScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i tap synclient TapButton1=1 synclient TapButton2=1 synclient TapButton3=1 Why do you have a script for that instead of an xorg.conf.d snippet which would make this permanent? yeah, good tip thanks, just did now cat /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/01-touchpad.conf Section InputClass Identifier tap-by-default and other custom settings MatchIsTouchpad on Option TapButton1 1 Option TapButton2 1 Option TapButton3 1 Option VertEdgeScroll 1 Option HorizEdgeScroll 1 Option VertTwoFingerScroll 1 Option HorizTwoFingerScroll 1 EndSection Thanks, -- Sérgio M. B. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Sex, 2012-09-21 at 01:14 +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 12:48:34AM +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 04:44:48PM +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click For xorg.conf.d snippets, use this section instead: Section InputClass Identifier Enable touchpad tapping MatchDriver synaptics Option TapButton 1 EndSection I forgot, this is also described here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Input_device_configuration#Example:_Tap-to-click Seeing cat /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/00-system-setup-keyboard.conf # This file is autogenerated by system-setup-keyboard. Any # modifications will be lost. I remembered that Fedora also could make system-config-synaptics like others system-configs . and command system-setup-keyboard is not present in F18, we got localectl set-x11-keymap [1]. So we need update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Input_device_configuration . And system-config-keyboard ? [1] as wrote in other email: 3. Overwrite /etc/sysconfig/keyboard with following content: # This file is obsolete and may be removed, its settings # were migrated on date by running: # localectl set-x11-keymap Thanks, -- Sérgio M. B. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. -- Adam Williamson Hi Adam, when I asked upstream on few similar simple tweaks usually answers was something like this: We don't care, you can change it the way you like it. Any comments? -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Seg, 2012-12-10 at 09:05 +0100, valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. -- Adam Williamson Hi Adam, when I asked upstream on few similar simple tweaks usually answers was something like this: We don't care, you can change it the way you like it. Any comments? Of course, I have my script, that I run when is necessary. cat ~/syncl.sh synclient VertTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient HorizTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i scroll synclient VertEdgeScroll=1 synclient HorizEdgeScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i tap synclient TapButton1=1 synclient TapButton2=1 synclient TapButton3=1 Best regards, -- Sérgio M. B. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 05:15:46PM +, Sérgio Basto wrote: On Seg, 2012-12-10 at 09:05 +0100, valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. -- Adam Williamson Hi Adam, when I asked upstream on few similar simple tweaks usually answers was something like this: We don't care, you can change it the way you like it. Any comments? Of course, I have my script, that I run when is necessary. cat ~/syncl.sh synclient VertTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient HorizTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i scroll synclient VertEdgeScroll=1 synclient HorizEdgeScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i tap synclient TapButton1=1 synclient TapButton2=1 synclient TapButton3=1 Why do you have a script for that instead of an xorg.conf.d snippet which would make this permanent? Cheers, Peter -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 02:02:57PM +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 05:15:46PM +, Sérgio Basto wrote: On Seg, 2012-12-10 at 09:05 +0100, valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. -- Adam Williamson Hi Adam, when I asked upstream on few similar simple tweaks usually answers was something like this: We don't care, you can change it the way you like it. Any comments? Of course, I have my script, that I run when is necessary. cat ~/syncl.sh synclient VertTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient HorizTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i scroll synclient VertEdgeScroll=1 synclient HorizEdgeScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i tap synclient TapButton1=1 synclient TapButton2=1 synclient TapButton3=1 Why do you have a script for that instead of an xorg.conf.d snippet which would make this permanent? christ, I need more coffee. sorry, misread the config file. this is indeed a configuration that would be overwritten by gnome with no direct UI. Anyway, this seems something that https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=635486 should address Cheers, Peter -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Martin Sourada wrote: I wonder if you have problem with touch-screen smart-phones as well, it's essentially the same thing as far as your fingers are concerned. I don't know, I still use an old dumbphone with actual number buttons. :-) Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Hi, Wiadomość napisana przez drago01 w dniu 27 wrz 2012, o godz. 17:42: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 5:39 PM, Till Maas opensou...@till.name wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 02:47:47PM +0200, drago01 wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Tomas Radej tra...@redhat.com wrote: I don't expect much of a consensus to arise around this point, so I suggest we check if in the main environments, the tap-to-click setting is easily accessible and user-friendly. This state won't bother people who have problems with tap-to-click, and won't pose problems for people who want to have it on. I think that it's safe to assume that if the user installed Fedora successfully, they realize that to enable clicking with their touchpad, they need to go to Mouse/Touchpad settings and set it there in a checkbox. The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. It is easier to enable something that is missing than to disable some annoying behaviour whose cause is unknown. For example if you miss tap-to-click, you know what you need to search for to enable it. If the touchpad behaves strange because of accidental clicks, it is not that clear whether this is a bad setting or a hardware or software defect. Not buying that. If you tap and nothing happens you may also think that something is broken why does my touchpad not work ... this is even more likely then your scenario. So this argument is flawed as well. Let's maybe try to look at this from another perspective: - tap to click is one of the features of a device class named touchpad, right? - we are now setting this feature to *OFF* by default, right? OK, so, are there any other devices, where we are turning off *some* or *all* of their features by default? If the answer is NO - then tap to click should be also set to ON by default. If the answer is YES - then we can try to think: 1. what are the reasons of having some features disabled by default? 2. does this particular feature match here? This could help avoiding such controversies in the future. regards, -- Jarosław Górny RHCE: 805008212834187 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On 09/26/2012 11:58 AM, Martin Sourada wrote: What I have personal issues with is accidental tapping while typing, but that can be avoided by using Disable touchpad when typing setting... For that reason, I like my touchpads switched off by default. No touchpad, no issue. Having to set a focus on another window, just because a sleeve touched the pad is only annoying and unnecessary. I also use my keyboard far more often than any mouse/touchpad/trackpoint. We have seen for or five different preferences: I don't think, we should change that default. -- Matthias Runge mru...@matthias-runge.de mru...@fedoraproject.org -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Hi Adam, On Wed, 26 Sep 2012 08:54:07 -0700 Adam Williamson wrote: When lots of people who clearly aren't complete idiots tell you something happens to them, it's probably best just to accept that it does, because arguing that you can't possibly see how it could possibly happen to them is only going to make you look churlish. there's no need to jump the gun ;-) While, after rereading my post I kind of see where you've got the impression (looks like one or two words I meant to write are missing there), I did not mean that as an argument, just a point of view -- what I meant is that my brain does not process *why* it happens (tap while move), but that *does not* mean I don't accept that it happens for real people. There's a huge difference between knowing and understanding ;-) Hence why I also included the question about smart phones, because I believe that while interaction via touch-pad is indirect and relative (you don't actually see the screen under your finger; you move objects relative to where you start), the interaction is physically pretty much same -- when you move right it moves right (whatever it is you're moving -- on notebook usually cursor, on touch-screen usually some object), when you tap, it clicks exactly where you are... Also some people seemed to misunderstand -- I do understand why you can accidentally tap while typing (i.e. accidentally use touch-pad, while using keyboard) and that's already handled by an existing configuration option. The only thing I personally don't understand (but accept that it happens) is that you can actually use touch-pad for moving and meanwhile accidentally tap. Martin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Hi, On 09/26/2012 08:51 PM, les wrote: Please, you can enable this feature if you want it, and if your touchpad handles it well, then good for you. Tapping is a feature, not a characteristic of touch pad use, and as such should be accessible to those who want it, but not enabled by default. Just my personal point of view. Regards, Les H I agree with this. Unless your touchpad's buttons are broken (like mine, but that's beside the point), you can move around the system, no problem, and enable tap-to-click at will. The question that comes with this is if the switch is easily accessible. In Gnome it is (albeit it has a funny label - 'Enable mouse clicks with touchpad' - what's wrong with 'Tap to click'?), but it appeared only recently in XFCE. I don't know about other environments which we ship, please submit your experience. I don't expect much of a consensus to arise around this point, so I suggest we check if in the main environments, the tap-to-click setting is easily accessible and user-friendly. This state won't bother people who have problems with tap-to-click, and won't pose problems for people who want to have it on. I think that it's safe to assume that if the user installed Fedora successfully, they realize that to enable clicking with their touchpad, they need to go to Mouse/Touchpad settings and set it there in a checkbox. Tomas Radej -- FAS, IRC nick tradej -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Tomas Radej tra...@redhat.com wrote: Hi, On 09/26/2012 08:51 PM, les wrote: Please, you can enable this feature if you want it, and if your touchpad handles it well, then good for you. Tapping is a feature, not a characteristic of touch pad use, and as such should be accessible to those who want it, but not enabled by default. Just my personal point of view. Regards, Les H I agree with this. Unless your touchpad's buttons are broken (like mine, but that's beside the point), you can move around the system, no problem, and enable tap-to-click at will. The question that comes with this is if the switch is easily accessible. In Gnome it is (albeit it has a funny label - 'Enable mouse clicks with touchpad' - what's wrong with 'Tap to click'?), but it appeared only recently in XFCE. I don't know about other environments which we ship, please submit your experience. I don't expect much of a consensus to arise around this point, so I suggest we check if in the main environments, the tap-to-click setting is easily accessible and user-friendly. This state won't bother people who have problems with tap-to-click, and won't pose problems for people who want to have it on. I think that it's safe to assume that if the user installed Fedora successfully, they realize that to enable clicking with their touchpad, they need to go to Mouse/Touchpad settings and set it there in a checkbox. The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. I don't think that continuing this discussion makes much sense. There are people who want/like it and there are some who do not ... unless we can detect that (i.e read the users mind) we cannot find a solution that works for everybody. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. This is exactly right, there really is no right/wrong answer to this. For many it simply depends on what system you're using. If I'm using my Lenovo then I definitely don't want tap-to-click enabled because it has button both above and below the trackpad that work perfectly fine. If I'm using a newer-model MacBook I want tap-to-click turned on because the whole trackpad clicks which can be cumbersome/hard to press vs. simple tapping. If I'm using an old MacBook that actually has a physical trackpad button I want tap-to-click off because it's an old laptop and the trackpad is getting worn and picky when it comes to detecting input properly. As others have pointed out this is actually one of the easiest to find settings and changing it is beyond trivial for even the most basic users. There is simply no good case to change defaults as there are too many variables at play. On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 7:47 AM, drago01 drag...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Tomas Radej tra...@redhat.com wrote: Hi, On 09/26/2012 08:51 PM, les wrote: Please, you can enable this feature if you want it, and if your touchpad handles it well, then good for you. Tapping is a feature, not a characteristic of touch pad use, and as such should be accessible to those who want it, but not enabled by default. Just my personal point of view. Regards, Les H I agree with this. Unless your touchpad's buttons are broken (like mine, but that's beside the point), you can move around the system, no problem, and enable tap-to-click at will. The question that comes with this is if the switch is easily accessible. In Gnome it is (albeit it has a funny label - 'Enable mouse clicks with touchpad' - what's wrong with 'Tap to click'?), but it appeared only recently in XFCE. I don't know about other environments which we ship, please submit your experience. I don't expect much of a consensus to arise around this point, so I suggest we check if in the main environments, the tap-to-click setting is easily accessible and user-friendly. This state won't bother people who have problems with tap-to-click, and won't pose problems for people who want to have it on. I think that it's safe to assume that if the user installed Fedora successfully, they realize that to enable clicking with their touchpad, they need to go to Mouse/Touchpad settings and set it there in a checkbox. The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. I don't think that continuing this discussion makes much sense. There are people who want/like it and there are some who do not ... unless we can detect that (i.e read the users mind) we cannot find a solution that works for everybody. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel -- Steve Morrissey Information Technology Systems Services University of Minnesota Duluth o: 218.726.8866 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On 09/27/2012 03:07 PM, Steve Morrissey wrote: The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. This is exactly right, there really is no right/wrong answer to this. For many it simply depends on what system you're using. If I'm using my Lenovo then I definitely don't want tap-to-click enabled because it has button both above and below the trackpad that work perfectly fine. I know, right, I should have specified that I suggest that because it's the status quo. TR -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 02:47:47PM +0200, drago01 wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Tomas Radej tra...@redhat.com wrote: I don't expect much of a consensus to arise around this point, so I suggest we check if in the main environments, the tap-to-click setting is easily accessible and user-friendly. This state won't bother people who have problems with tap-to-click, and won't pose problems for people who want to have it on. I think that it's safe to assume that if the user installed Fedora successfully, they realize that to enable clicking with their touchpad, they need to go to Mouse/Touchpad settings and set it there in a checkbox. The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. It is easier to enable something that is missing than to disable some annoying behaviour whose cause is unknown. For example if you miss tap-to-click, you know what you need to search for to enable it. If the touchpad behaves strange because of accidental clicks, it is not that clear whether this is a bad setting or a hardware or software defect. This has already manifested for me with the slow keys feature that GDM enables and makes one believe that the keyboard died. Regards Till -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 5:39 PM, Till Maas opensou...@till.name wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 02:47:47PM +0200, drago01 wrote: On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Tomas Radej tra...@redhat.com wrote: I don't expect much of a consensus to arise around this point, so I suggest we check if in the main environments, the tap-to-click setting is easily accessible and user-friendly. This state won't bother people who have problems with tap-to-click, and won't pose problems for people who want to have it on. I think that it's safe to assume that if the user installed Fedora successfully, they realize that to enable clicking with their touchpad, they need to go to Mouse/Touchpad settings and set it there in a checkbox. The problem with your argument is that it can go with both directions. We can have it enabled by default and in case the user is annoyed by it he/she can turn it off. It is easier to enable something that is missing than to disable some annoying behaviour whose cause is unknown. For example if you miss tap-to-click, you know what you need to search for to enable it. If the touchpad behaves strange because of accidental clicks, it is not that clear whether this is a bad setting or a hardware or software defect. Not buying that. If you tap and nothing happens you may also think that something is broken why does my touchpad not work ... this is even more likely then your scenario. So this argument is flawed as well. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 10:42 AM, drago01 drag...@gmail.com wrote: Not buying that. If you tap and nothing happens you may also think that something is broken why does my touchpad not work ... this is even more likely then your scenario. So this argument is flawed as well. But was tap to click ever enabled by default in Fedora then suddenly switched to disabled? If the default has always been disabled, why would a user have the expectation that tapping is broken when it was never a default in the first place? Moreover, a simple google of fedora tap to click tells you exactly how to enable it. This discussion is creating a problem where there isn't one. Tap to click is also disabled in OS X by default and I think Mac users are able to figure it out just fine. If they can find the setting, Fedora users can as well :) -- Steve Morrissey Information Technology Systems Services University of Minnesota Duluth o: 218.726.8866 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 05:42:47PM +0200, drago01 wrote: Not buying that. If you tap and nothing happens you may also think that something is broken why does my touchpad not work ... this is even more likely then your scenario. So this argument is flawed as well. You know more that it is broken. You know then the tap-to-click feature is missing and have a clear and reproducible error report I tap on the touchpad and the click is not noticed. It is a lot easier to notice that something is missing and to describe it than to notice that something is there that is sometimes causing trouble. Regards Till -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 05:42:47PM +0200, drago01 wrote: Not buying that. If you tap and nothing happens you may also think that something is broken why does my touchpad not work ... this is even more likely then your scenario. So this argument is flawed as well. The default isn't being changed, so this entire discussion is flawed. -- Matthew Garrett | mj...@srcf.ucam.org -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, 2012-09-27 at 13:59 +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: Hi Adam, On Wed, 26 Sep 2012 08:54:07 -0700 Adam Williamson wrote: When lots of people who clearly aren't complete idiots tell you something happens to them, it's probably best just to accept that it does, because arguing that you can't possibly see how it could possibly happen to them is only going to make you look churlish. there's no need to jump the gun ;-) While, after rereading my post I kind of see where you've got the impression (looks like one or two words I meant to write are missing there), I did not mean that as an argument, just a point of view -- what I meant is that my brain does not process *why* it happens (tap while move), but that *does not* mean I don't accept that it happens for real people. There's a huge difference between knowing and understanding ;-) Hence why I also included the question about smart phones, because I believe that while interaction via touch-pad is indirect and relative (you don't actually see the screen under your finger; you move objects relative to where you start), the interaction is physically pretty much same -- when you move right it moves right (whatever it is you're moving -- on notebook usually cursor, on touch-screen usually some object), when you tap, it clicks exactly where you are... To answer the question, I don't have the problem on smartphones, no. But I don't think it's a very useful comparison. You tap a lot more and drag a lot less on smartphones; tapping on something is the normal interaction, and you usually drag only for some kind of gesture. There's no cursor to move around. On a laptop, moving the cursor is probably what you do the most of. Add to that that the technologies used in the two aren't precisely the same and they're probably calibrated differently, and...it's just not a very germane comparison, really. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, 27 Sep 2012 17:39:27 +0200 Till Maas wrote: This has already manifested for me with the slow keys feature that GDM enables and makes one believe that the keyboard died. Yes, this happened to me once as well... I was really bewildered as to what to do. But I think with tapping it's the other way around than you suggest -- when Fedora switched the default to disabled (I don't recall which version it was), I really thought something was broken -- just like with the keyboard. No matter how much I tapped, nothing happened. :-o Now I know it's because tapping is disabled but at that time I thought it was hardware feature, not something you disable in software configuration. So until I learned what actually happened I really thought something was broken and I didn't know what. However, as I said earlier, I do not want to change the default (again), both camps are probably equally numbered, and changes to default that are not strongly supported (either by unbreakable arguments or overwhelming numbers) are more disturbing than helpful. I would just like to better understand the other camp. And Adam is doing a pretty helpful job on that front ;-) Cheers, Martin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Thu, Sep 27, 2012 at 09:09:51PM +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: On Thu, 27 Sep 2012 17:39:27 +0200 Till Maas wrote: This has already manifested for me with the slow keys feature that GDM enables and makes one believe that the keyboard died. Yes, this happened to me once as well... I was really bewildered as to what to do. But I think with tapping it's the other way around than you suggest -- when Fedora switched the default to disabled (I don't recall which version it was), I really thought something was broken -- just like with the keyboard. No matter how much I tapped, nothing happened. :-o disabled upstream in version 0.15.0 (June 2008), Fedora re-enabled it in response to #439386 (which somehow got merged upstream again for 0.15.2), but that was then finally disabled upstream with version 1.0 (Feb 2009). It has been disabled since, except for the Apple touchpads which don't have physical buttons. Cheers, Peter Now I know it's because tapping is disabled but at that time I thought it was hardware feature, not something you disable in software configuration. So until I learned what actually happened I really thought something was broken and I didn't know what. However, as I said earlier, I do not want to change the default (again), both camps are probably equally numbered, and changes to default that are not strongly supported (either by unbreakable arguments or overwhelming numbers) are more disturbing than helpful. I would just like to better understand the other camp. And Adam is doing a pretty helpful job on that front ;-) Cheers, Martin -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Sun, 23 Sep 2012 16:44:16 +0200 Kevin Kofler wrote: drago01 wrote: Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). On my notebook, touchpad tapping is off of course. I have this problem each time I try to use somebody else's touchpad which has tapping enabled. Many different touchpads, always the same problem. So it's not just a particular crappy touchpad. I wonder if you have problem with touch-screen smart-phones as well, it's essentially the same thing as far as your fingers are concerned. As it never happened to me, it's kind of a mystery how you can accidentally type while moving... Also there's one nice feature on touchpads with tap-to-click, that you can double-tap-and-move to drag (and drop afterward). What I have personal issues with is accidental tapping while typing, but that can be avoided by using Disable touchpad when typing setting... The good thing about tapping is, as someone else already said, a) you don't have to move your finger (i.e. you click where you moved, which is pretty much intuitive). This is a massive win when you click often. b) It's silent (the touchpad buttons usually emit rather loud clicking noise which is annoying, especially when clicking often). c) You do not have to press as hard when tapping. d) You can scroll using touchpad. That said, I still prefer wireless mouse to touchpad and, when not travelling, also use it, so I don't get bothered much by the current default setting. Martin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 11:58 +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: On Sun, 23 Sep 2012 16:44:16 +0200 Kevin Kofler wrote: drago01 wrote: Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). On my notebook, touchpad tapping is off of course. I have this problem each time I try to use somebody else's touchpad which has tapping enabled. Many different touchpads, always the same problem. So it's not just a particular crappy touchpad. I wonder if you have problem with touch-screen smart-phones as well, it's essentially the same thing as far as your fingers are concerned. As it never happened to me, it's kind of a mystery how you can accidentally type while moving... Also there's one nice feature on touchpads with tap-to-click, that you can double-tap-and-move to drag (and drop afterward). When lots of people who clearly aren't complete idiots tell you something happens to them, it's probably best just to accept that it does, because arguing that you can't possibly see how it could possibly happen to them is only going to make you look churlish. It happens to Kevin, it happens to me, it happens to lots of other people, which is why the experts in the field have set the default they have. They didn't make it up out of thin air. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Please do not call idiots anybody this is a community. Respect no a MTV Jersey Shore programm. I do not understand that say Kevin. I talk about No buttons around the touchpad. I speak of the touch pad that allows you to do almost the same as a mouse. A lot users wants enabled by default these touch pad I say. On Sep 26, 2012 4:54 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 11:58 +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: On Sun, 23 Sep 2012 16:44:16 +0200 Kevin Kofler wrote: drago01 wrote: Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). On my notebook, touchpad tapping is off of course. I have this problem each time I try to use somebody else's touchpad which has tapping enabled. Many different touchpads, always the same problem. So it's not just a particular crappy touchpad. I wonder if you have problem with touch-screen smart-phones as well, it's essentially the same thing as far as your fingers are concerned. As it never happened to me, it's kind of a mystery how you can accidentally type while moving... Also there's one nice feature on touchpads with tap-to-click, that you can double-tap-and-move to drag (and drop afterward). When lots of people who clearly aren't complete idiots tell you something happens to them, it's probably best just to accept that it does, because arguing that you can't possibly see how it could possibly happen to them is only going to make you look churlish. It happens to Kevin, it happens to me, it happens to lots of other people, which is why the experts in the field have set the default they have. They didn't make it up out of thin air. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 18:13 +0100, Álvaro Castillo wrote: Please do not call idiots anybody this is a community. Respect no a MTV Jersey Shore programm. Sorry if it was unclear, but I didn't call anyone an idiot. I said that the people who complain about accidental touchpad presses are clearly *not* idiots, and there was no implication that and therefore, other people are idiots. I was just saying that there clearly are people who have the problem with unintended touchpad presses, and those people are known not to be complete idiots, so there's no reason to discount their testimony. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
I wonder if this couldn't be a RFE for anaconda. Maybe not possible, however couldn't we allow the upload of a kickstart 'snippet' or something where users installing Fedora could provide snippets to set the defaults at install time? Something where it doesn't really need a full blown kickstart, but somehow merges only the pieces that are inputted?? This way there are the defaults, but a community of 'user preference' snippets could exist etc... Just a random thought. -- Nathanael d. Noblet t 403.875.4613 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 12:15 -0600, Nathanael D. Noblet wrote: I wonder if this couldn't be a RFE for anaconda. Maybe not possible, however couldn't we allow the upload of a kickstart 'snippet' or something where users installing Fedora could provide snippets to set the defaults at install time? Something where it doesn't really need a full blown kickstart, but somehow merges only the pieces that are inputted?? This way there are the defaults, but a community of 'user preference' snippets could exist etc... kickstarts can already be partial and anaconda will prompt for anything that's not covered. I've never tested a kickstart which *only* did % post, which is more or less what this would be (AFAICS), though. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On 09/26/2012 12:23 PM, Adam Williamson wrote: On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 12:15 -0600, Nathanael D. Noblet wrote: I wonder if this couldn't be a RFE for anaconda. Maybe not possible, however couldn't we allow the upload of a kickstart 'snippet' or something where users installing Fedora could provide snippets to set the defaults at install time? Something where it doesn't really need a full blown kickstart, but somehow merges only the pieces that are inputted?? This way there are the defaults, but a community of 'user preference' snippets could exist etc... kickstarts can already be partial and anaconda will prompt for anything that's not covered. I've never tested a kickstart which *only* did % post, which is more or less what this would be (AFAICS), though. Yeah, something where it could accept a file upload, or typed right in... or one day loaded from a list of community snippets to include. -- Nathanael d. Noblet t 403.875.4613 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 18:13 +0100, Álvaro Castillo wrote: Please do not call idiots anybody this is a community. Respect no a MTV Jersey Shore programm. I do not understand that say Kevin. I talk about No buttons around the touchpad. I speak of the touch pad that allows you to do almost the same as a mouse. A lot users wants enabled by default these touch pad I say. On Sep 26, 2012 4:54 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Wed, 2012-09-26 at 11:58 +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: On Sun, 23 Sep 2012 16:44:16 +0200 Kevin Kofler wrote: drago01 wrote: Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). On my notebook, touchpad tapping is off of course. I have this problem each time I try to use somebody else's touchpad which has tapping enabled. Many different touchpads, always the same problem. So it's not just a particular crappy touchpad. I wonder if you have problem with touch-screen smart-phones as well, it's essentially the same thing as far as your fingers are concerned. As it never happened to me, it's kind of a mystery how you can accidentally type while moving... Also there's one nice feature on touchpads with tap-to-click, that you can double-tap-and-move to drag (and drop afterward). When lots of people who clearly aren't complete idiots tell you something happens to them, it's probably best just to accept that it does, because arguing that you can't possibly see how it could possibly happen to them is only going to make you look churlish. It happens to Kevin, it happens to me, it happens to lots of other people, which is why the experts in the field have set the default they have. They didn't make it up out of thin air. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel I do not want touch pad taps enabled by default. I do have the problem, and most people I know have the problem that the touch pads are not all sufficiently debounced to make this feature useful. Nor do most of them handle multiple point touches well, or many other issues such as dry hands that will cause skipping and be interpreted as taps. Please, you can enable this feature if you want it, and if your touchpad handles it well, then good for you. Tapping is a feature, not a characteristic of touch pad use, and as such should be accessible to those who want it, but not enabled by default. Just my personal point of view. Regards, Les H -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 26, 2012 at 11:58:51AM +0200, Martin Sourada wrote: On Sun, 23 Sep 2012 16:44:16 +0200 Kevin Kofler wrote: drago01 wrote: Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). On my notebook, touchpad tapping is off of course. I have this problem each time I try to use somebody else's touchpad which has tapping enabled. Many different touchpads, always the same problem. So it's not just a particular crappy touchpad. I wonder if you have problem with touch-screen smart-phones as well, it's essentially the same thing as far as your fingers are concerned. not quite. smart-phones are explicit touch screens and the only interaction you have with them is touch. and it's direct-touch interaction as well. on a touchpad, an indirect device by nature, accidental touches can happen while the keyboard is being used. That depends on touchpad size, hand size, position of the hands, finger conductivity and even environmental conditions. As it never happened to me, it's kind of a mystery how you can accidentally type while moving... Also there's one nice feature on touchpads with tap-to-click, that you can double-tap-and-move to drag (and drop afterward). What I have personal issues with is accidental tapping while typing, but that can be avoided by using Disable touchpad when typing setting... The good thing about tapping is, as someone else already said, a) you don't have to move your finger (i.e. you click where you moved, which is pretty much intuitive). This is a massive win when you click often. fwiw, intuitive is a dangerous word to use. learned is better and more accurate in most cases. b) It's silent (the touchpad buttons usually emit rather loud clicking noise which is annoying, especially when clicking often). note that the noise is feedback to the user that the event happened. I recall a study by (I think) MS that showed the importance of this. if you have software that does not react to a button press event, users on physical devices (mouse) are inclined to think the software is broken, users on touch devices (touchscreen) are inclined to think the touchscreen is broken. depending on the scenario, this can be an important distinction. c) You do not have to press as hard when tapping. d) You can scroll using touchpad. scrolling and tapping are unrelated in our driver. Cheers, Peter That said, I still prefer wireless mouse to touchpad and, when not travelling, also use it, so I don't get bothered much by the current default setting. Martin -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Hi, Ankur Sinha wrote: We set up a page about this (The link was sent to the list too iirc) https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click#KDE It still misses the KDE method. Could someone please add it? Please add info about gdm etc also if you think it should be present there. The systemwide method also works for KDE Plasma of course, but I added instructions for kcm_touchpad, which is the GUI way to set this up in the KDE Plasma Workspaces. Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
drago01 wrote: Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). On my notebook, touchpad tapping is off of course. I have this problem each time I try to use somebody else's touchpad which has tapping enabled. Many different touchpads, always the same problem. So it's not just a particular crappy touchpad. Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Álvaro Castillo wrote: If you do not like touchpad. Can disable on your laptop with Fn keys. 1. not all laptops have this and 2. what if I want to use the touchpad, just not with tapping? Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 04:44:48PM +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click For xorg.conf.d snippets, use this section instead: Section InputClass Identifier Enable touchpad tapping MatchDriver synaptics Option TapButton 1 EndSection this will only match on devices using the synaptics driver and you can leave the rest up to the default configurations, no need to copy/modify any other files. Cheers, Peter -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 04:44:48PM +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click For xorg.conf.d snippets, use this section instead: Section InputClass Identifier Enable touchpad tapping MatchDriver synaptics Option TapButton 1 EndSection this will only match on devices using the synaptics driver and you can leave the rest up to the default configurations, no need to copy/modify any other files. Cheers, Peter -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 at 12:48:34AM +1000, Peter Hutterer wrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 04:44:48PM +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click For xorg.conf.d snippets, use this section instead: Section InputClass Identifier Enable touchpad tapping MatchDriver synaptics Option TapButton 1 EndSection I forgot, this is also described here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Input_device_configuration#Example:_Tap-to-click Cheers, Peter -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 11:57:12AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 08:35 -0400, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. Where does my notebook's touchpad fall in this continuum? At the bottom corners of the touch-sensitive area are two buttons which click with tactile feedback, but yet are still part of the touch-sensitive surface. In other words, the bottom corners can actually be deformed/depressed. FWIW, I enabled tap-to-click -- did I just answer my own question? -- simply because my wife and I both found the mouse to be moving off target too often when tried using these buttons. As far as evdev is concerned those are almost certainly just perfectly normal buttons, i.e., they send a 'button press' event. The fact that they also function as part of the touch-sensitive surface is probably irrelevant. So evdev would see your touchpad as one with buttons, and wouldn't enable tap-to-click. the device looks like a single-button touchpad with four-finger capabilities. important is the INPUT_PROP_BUTTONPAD property which we translate to the ClickPad option on driver startup (on older kernels that option/property needs to be set manually). if clickpad support is enabled in the driver, we have a number of different code paths that handle this type of device to support the basic functionalities like dragdrop. that's also the reason why we didn't backport this to F16, it's just too much effort. Cheers, Peter -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 23:11 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote: Thanks for all the suggestions, I took the X11 config option which *just works* I honestly think this should be the default. At least, if there is a setting it should be system wide rather than personal / effective only after login, because devices with touchpads are predominantly personal devices not shared workstations... GNOME 3 has a kind-of convention where there's a button in the settings applets to make settings system-wide which you might want to make system-wide. It then prompts you for admin privileges and makes the setting system-wide if you pass. This could be a candidate for that treatment, I guess. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Kevin Kofler kevin.kof...@chello.at wrote: Álvaro Castillo wrote: I want know... Why Fedora doesn't included TapButton support of touchpad by default? Because it's off by default in the upstream synaptics driver and Fedora does not change that setting. And IMHO it's off by default for a reason; I don't understand why people want that annoying feature at all. Because some people that can actually use it (i.e I never accidentally click when trying to move the mouse; maybe you just have a crappy touchpad?). The advantage is that you can click without moving your finger away from the touchpad it is way faster. I don't care about the default setting but for me it is annoying (trying to click on livecd which has the default settings feels broken as nothing happens). -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Hi, On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Kevin Kofler kevin.kof...@chello.at wrote: I don't understand why people want that annoying feature at all. It's a mistake to project your annoyance with a given feature onto the masses. I always enable the feature but it is an ongoing annoyance that it is disabled at GDM, is there any way to force it to default to on for the whole system? I find it's great for quiet clicking and is easier on the fingers than clicking a physical button. Also it's much better user experience to click somewhere you finger already is than to look down for a button or reposition by touch (given that there are often two physical buttons). Also I use several laptops and the button arrangement is always subtly different, if I can tap to click on all of them, it's a big usability win. -Cam -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Camilo Mesias cam...@mesias.co.uk wrote: I always enable the feature but it is an ongoing annoyance that it is disabled at GDM, is there any way to force it to default to on for the whole system? I have the following in /etc/dconf/db/gdm.d/10-local-settings: [org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/mouse] active=true [org/gnome/settings-daemon/peripherals/touchpad] tap-to-click=true You will need to run dconf update as root for the change to take effect. Regards, Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. Where does my notebook's touchpad fall in this continuum? At the bottom corners of the touch-sensitive area are two buttons which click with tactile feedback, but yet are still part of the touch-sensitive surface. In other words, the bottom corners can actually be deformed/depressed. FWIW, I enabled tap-to-click -- did I just answer my own question? -- simply because my wife and I both found the mouse to be moving off target too often when tried using these buttons. -- John Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org wrote on 09/18/2012 08:09:33: From: Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Date: 09/18/2012 08:10 Subject: Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default? Sent by: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Camilo Mesias cam...@mesias.co.uk wrote: I always enable the feature but it is an ongoing annoyance that it is disabled at GDM, is there any way to force it to default to on for the whole system? I have the following in /etc/dconf/db/gdm.d/10-local-settings: [org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/mouse] active=true [org/gnome/settings-daemon/peripherals/touchpad] tap-to-click=true You will need to run dconf update as root for the change to take effect. Regards, Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Any ideas on the equivalent for KDM? -- John Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Il giorno mar, 18/09/2012 alle 08.35 -0400, john.flor...@dart.biz ha scritto: From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. Where does my notebook's touchpad fall in this continuum? At the bottom corners of the touch-sensitive area are two buttons which click with tactile feedback, but yet are still part of the touch-sensitive surface. In other words, the bottom corners can actually be deformed/depressed. FWIW, I enabled tap-to-click -- did I just answer my own question? -- simply because my wife and I both found the mouse to be moving off target too often when tried using these buttons. It's called a ClickPad, it's supported in X.org released with F17. Nicola -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Sep 18, 2012 2:56 PM, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: Any ideas on the equivalent for KDM? No, sorry. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
From: Nicola Soranzo nsora...@tiscali.it Il giorno mar, 18/09/2012 alle 08.35 -0400, john.flor...@dart.biz ha scritto: From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. Where does my notebook's touchpad fall in this continuum? At the bottom corners of the touch-sensitive area are two buttons which click with tactile feedback, but yet are still part of the touch-sensitive surface. In other words, the bottom corners can actually be deformed/depressed. FWIW, I enabled tap-to-click -- did I just answer my own question? -- simply because my wife and I both found the mouse to be moving off target too often when tried using these buttons. It's called a ClickPad, it's supported in X.org released with F17. Nicola Oh! Thanks for that info. Indeed we're running F17 on it (Samsung 5 series IIRC) without any issues at all. Fedora may work great on it, but this old dog isn't adapting so well to the new tricks of these touchy-clicky things. Oh well, praise be the new days where it all just works vs. the old days where you prayed the most critical bits worked. =) -- John Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 1:55 PM, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org wrote on 09/18/2012 08:09:33: From: Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Date: 09/18/2012 08:10 Subject: Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default? Sent by: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Camilo Mesias cam...@mesias.co.uk wrote: I always enable the feature but it is an ongoing annoyance that it is disabled at GDM, is there any way to force it to default to on for the whole system? I have the following in /etc/dconf/db/gdm.d/10-local-settings: [org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/mouse] active=true [org/gnome/settings-daemon/peripherals/touchpad] tap-to-click=true You will need to run dconf update as root for the change to take effect. Regards, Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Any ideas on the equivalent for KDM? Why not enable it in xorg itself - from memory you can look for a file like /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-synaptics.conf (or possibly in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf or similar) Then ensure that you have a section like: Section InputClass Identifier touchpad catchall Driver synaptics MatchIsTouchpad on MatchDevicePath /dev/input/event* Option TapButton1 1 Option TapButton2 2 Option TapButton3 3 Option VertEdgeScroll on EndSection When you boot you should have touchpad buttons available even at the KDM greeter stage for login - (I guess same for GDM though I am a KDE user only) I have been doing this for several years with my laptops -- mike c -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Yest... Need edit files to use something as touchpad :) On Sep 18, 2012 2:11 PM, mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 1:55 PM, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org wrote on 09/18/2012 08:09:33: From: Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Date: 09/18/2012 08:10 Subject: Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default? Sent by: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Camilo Mesias cam...@mesias.co.uk wrote: I always enable the feature but it is an ongoing annoyance that it is disabled at GDM, is there any way to force it to default to on for the whole system? I have the following in /etc/dconf/db/gdm.d/10-local-settings: [org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/mouse] active=true [org/gnome/settings-daemon/peripherals/touchpad] tap-to-click=true You will need to run dconf update as root for the change to take effect. Regards, Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Any ideas on the equivalent for KDM? Why not enable it in xorg itself - from memory you can look for a file like /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-synaptics.conf (or possibly in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf or similar) Then ensure that you have a section like: Section InputClass Identifier touchpad catchall Driver synaptics MatchIsTouchpad on MatchDevicePath /dev/input/event* Option TapButton1 1 Option TapButton2 2 Option TapButton3 3 Option VertEdgeScroll on EndSection When you boot you should have touchpad buttons available even at the KDM greeter stage for login - (I guess same for GDM though I am a KDE user only) I have been doing this for several years with my laptops -- mike c -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
If you do not like touchpad. Can disable on your laptop with Fn keys. However who can use it need edit somefiles...add code to uses it So. I never occurs that I pushed my finger accidentaly and moved cursor. Lol On Sep 18, 2012 2:16 PM, Álvaro Castillo net...@fedoraproject.org wrote: Yest... Need edit files to use something as touchpad :) On Sep 18, 2012 2:11 PM, mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 1:55 PM, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org wrote on 09/18/2012 08:09:33: From: Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Date: 09/18/2012 08:10 Subject: Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default? Sent by: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Camilo Mesias cam...@mesias.co.uk wrote: I always enable the feature but it is an ongoing annoyance that it is disabled at GDM, is there any way to force it to default to on for the whole system? I have the following in /etc/dconf/db/gdm.d/10-local-settings: [org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/mouse] active=true [org/gnome/settings-daemon/peripherals/touchpad] tap-to-click=true You will need to run dconf update as root for the change to take effect. Regards, Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Any ideas on the equivalent for KDM? Why not enable it in xorg itself - from memory you can look for a file like /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-synaptics.conf (or possibly in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf or similar) Then ensure that you have a section like: Section InputClass Identifier touchpad catchall Driver synaptics MatchIsTouchpad on MatchDevicePath /dev/input/event* Option TapButton1 1 Option TapButton2 2 Option TapButton3 3 Option VertEdgeScroll on EndSection When you boot you should have touchpad buttons available even at the KDM greeter stage for login - (I guess same for GDM though I am a KDE user only) I have been doing this for several years with my laptops -- mike c -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
From: mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com From: Florian Müllner fmuell...@gnome.org Any ideas on the equivalent for KDM? Why not enable it in xorg itself - from memory you can look for a file like /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-synaptics.conf (or possibly in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf or similar) Then ensure that you have a section like: Section InputClass Identifier touchpad catchall Driver synaptics MatchIsTouchpad on MatchDevicePath /dev/input/event* Option TapButton1 1 Option TapButton2 2 Option TapButton3 3 Option VertEdgeScroll on EndSection When you boot you should have touchpad buttons available even at the KDM greeter stage for login - (I guess same for GDM though I am a KDE user only) Perfect! I'll give that a try soon, but it looks just like what I wanted. I figured there was something like this, but hadn't snooped around yet -- this will save me much time. Thanks! I have been doing this for several years with my laptops I'm relatively new to owning a laptop. Used them for years at work but those were bungled with Windoze. Win7 lived all of about 5m on my Samsung before something worthwhile (F17) was installed after which it immediately soared in value by a factor of nearly infinity. :-) -- John Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 08:35 -0400, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. Where does my notebook's touchpad fall in this continuum? At the bottom corners of the touch-sensitive area are two buttons which click with tactile feedback, but yet are still part of the touch-sensitive surface. In other words, the bottom corners can actually be deformed/depressed. FWIW, I enabled tap-to-click -- did I just answer my own question? -- simply because my wife and I both found the mouse to be moving off target too often when tried using these buttons. As far as evdev is concerned those are almost certainly just perfectly normal buttons, i.e., they send a 'button press' event. The fact that they also function as part of the touch-sensitive surface is probably irrelevant. So evdev would see your touchpad as one with buttons, and wouldn't enable tap-to-click. (I hereby include my permanent disclaimer that I'm just the idiot monkey, and any time someone who's not an idiot monkey comes along and contradicts me, you can confidently assume I'm wrong...so if ajax or whot or someone shows up and says I'm wrong, then I damn well am.) -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Date: 09/18/2012 14:57 Subject: Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default? Sent by: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 08:35 -0400, john.flor...@dart.biz wrote: From: Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. Where does my notebook's touchpad fall in this continuum? At the bottom corners of the touch-sensitive area are two buttons which click with tactile feedback, but yet are still part of the touch-sensitive surface. In other words, the bottom corners can actually be deformed/depressed. FWIW, I enabled tap-to-click -- did I just answer my own question? -- simply because my wife and I both found the mouse to be moving off target too often when tried using these buttons. As far as evdev is concerned those are almost certainly just perfectly normal buttons, i.e., they send a 'button press' event. The fact that they also function as part of the touch-sensitive surface is probably irrelevant. So evdev would see your touchpad as one with buttons, and wouldn't enable tap-to-click. If memory serves (which, in my case, is always questionable), that matches my experience: I had to enable the feature; it wasn't on by default. (I hereby include my permanent disclaimer that I'm just the idiot monkey, and any time someone who's not an idiot monkey comes along and contradicts me, you can confidently assume I'm wrong...so if ajax or whot or someone shows up and says I'm wrong, then I damn well am.) Hey! That's mine too, except you can s/ajax|whot/nearly anyone/g. Offer void where not prohibited. -- John Florian -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Thanks for all the suggestions, I took the X11 config option which *just works* I honestly think this should be the default. At least, if there is a setting it should be system wide rather than personal / effective only after login, because devices with touchpads are predominantly personal devices not shared workstations... -Cam -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 23:11 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote: Thanks for all the suggestions, I took the X11 config option which *just works* I honestly think this should be the default. At least, if there is a setting it should be system wide rather than personal / effective only after login, because devices with touchpads are predominantly personal devices not shared workstations... -Cam Hi folks, We set up a page about this (The link was sent to the list too iirc) https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click#KDE It still misses the KDE method. Could someone please add it? Please add info about gdm etc also if you think it should be present there. -- Thanks, Warm regards, Ankur: FranciscoD Please only print if necessary. Looking to contribute to Fedora? Look here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Join_SIG http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha http://dodoincfedora.wordpress.com/ signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Qua, 2012-09-19 at 11:13 +1000, Ankur Sinha wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 23:11 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote: Thanks for all the suggestions, I took the X11 config option which *just works* I honestly think this should be the default. At least, if there is a setting it should be system wide rather than personal / effective only after login, because devices with touchpads are predominantly personal devices not shared workstations... -Cam Hi folks, We set up a page about this (The link was sent to the list too iirc) https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click#KDE It still misses the KDE method. Could someone please add it? Please add info about gdm etc also if you think it should be present there. Hi, I don't read all thread , sorry I'm repeating someone , but I use synclient to configure my touchpad. I have a simple script that I run in my home user, when I lose my configuration, which is just after a systemctl restart udev-trigger.service, not often neither after reboots ~/syncl.sh synclient VertTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient HorizTwoFingerScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i scroll synclient VertEdgeScroll=1 synclient HorizEdgeScroll=1 synclient -l | grep -i tap synclient TapButton1=1 synclient TapButton2=1 synclient TapButton3=1 -- Sérgio M. B. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Álvaro Castillo wrote: I want know... Why Fedora doesn't included TapButton support of touchpad by default? Because it's off by default in the upstream synaptics driver and Fedora does not change that setting. And IMHO it's off by default for a reason; I don't understand why people want that annoying feature at all. I always accidentally click when trying to move the mouse pointer using a touchpad with tapping enabled. And any remotely decent touchpad has separate buttons to use. Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Álvaro Castillo wrote: others doesn't like it, ok, but a who doesn't like it, not affect on your navigation, can ignore this. That's just not true. Tapping affects the users who don't want it in 2 ways: 1. If the user actually uses the touchpad, he/she ends up accidentally clicking when just trying to move the mouse pointer. This always happens to me when I attempt to use a touchpad with tapping enabled and I curse loudly at the broken setting. 2. Even if the user does NOT use the touchpad, he/she can end up accidentally touching it and triggering a click. Without tapping, it only triggers a harmless pointer move. In both cases, tapping is most definitely NOT wanted and cannot just be ignored. It needs to be disabled and that ought to be the default. Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 01:32 +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote: Álvaro Castillo wrote: I want know... Why Fedora doesn't included TapButton support of touchpad by default? Because it's off by default in the upstream synaptics driver and Fedora does not change that setting. And IMHO it's off by default for a reason; I don't understand why people want that annoying feature at all. I always accidentally click when trying to move the mouse pointer using a touchpad with tapping enabled. And any remotely decent touchpad has separate buttons to use. That's my experience too, I can't stand tap to click. It's just anecdata, but it does seem to be the case that it's a pretty even split between those who like it, those who hate it and those who don't care. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, 2012-09-18 at 01:32 +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote: Álvaro Castillo wrote: I want know... Why Fedora doesn't included TapButton support of touchpad by default? Because it's off by default in the upstream synaptics driver and Fedora does not change that setting. And IMHO it's off by default for a reason; I don't understand why people want that annoying feature at all. I always accidentally click when trying to move the mouse pointer using a touchpad with tapping enabled. And any remotely decent touchpad has separate buttons to use. Oh, I should also note that, IIRC, the intent is that the driver should detect if there are no physical buttons and enable tap-to-click in this case. So touchpads which have no buttons and are only supposed to work with tap-to-click should be OK. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Gnome and KDE has default utility for mouse and touchpad configuration. XFCE on Fedora 17 that's mean XFCE 4.8 no utility but we gonna see mouse and touchpad utility on next version ( XFCE 4.10 on Fedora 18 ) Tour link for XFCE ; http://www.xfce.org/about/tour XFCE 4.8 touchpad = http://thangnguyennang.wordpress.com/2012/06/24/howto-enable-tapping-xfce-on-fedora-17/ But LXDE we need to do manually on terminal as far as I see LXDE spin by adding these two lines to /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf: Code: Option TapButton1 1 Option RBCornerButton 3 (Line 1: left mouse tap / Line 2: right mouse tap in lower right corner) On 12 September 2012 08:54, Ankur Sinha sanjay.an...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 20:03 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. I thought so too. I was wondering what the DE agnostic way of enabling tapping would be though. I use gnome, and the mouse utility does this for me. However, when folks on other DEs, such as XFCE ask me how to do it, I don't quite have an answer. Could someone please outline the correct way of enabling tapping and other options (for instance horizontal scrolling, two finger scrolling..) on various DEs ? Even if each DE has a specific way, please can you post with what it is? I can compile the information on a wiki page to aid users, with relevant links to upstreams if they want to take up changing defaults with them. -- Thanks, Warm regards, Ankur: FranciscoD Please only print if necessary. Looking to contribute to Fedora? Look here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Join_SIG http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha http://dodoincfedora.wordpress.com/ -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel -- -- Onuralp SEZER Fedora Ambassadors http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors EMEAhttp://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/EMEAMember / Turkey Fedora Translations Turkish Team Memberhttps://fedora.transifex.net/projects/p/fedora/team/tr/ Fedora KDE User (Smolt Reporthttp://www.smolts.org/client/show_all/pub_f8e3aacb-d047-4ff0-ad50-b91b2a6ecf1e ) -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 6:54 AM, Ankur Sinha sanjay.an...@gmail.com wrote: I thought so too. I was wondering what the DE agnostic way of enabling tapping would be though. I use gnome, and the mouse utility does this for me. However, when folks on other DEs, such as XFCE ask me how to do it, I don't quite have an answer. Could someone please outline the correct way of enabling tapping and other options (for instance horizontal scrolling, two finger scrolling..) on various DEs ? Even if each DE has a specific way, please can you post with what it is? I can compile the information on a wiki page to aid users, with relevant links to upstreams if they want to take up changing defaults with them. $ synclient TapButton1=1 is to enable touchpad clic -- Álvaro Castillo http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Netsys Linux user #547784 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 7:04 AM, Álvaro Castillo net...@fedoraproject.orgwrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 6:54 AM, Ankur Sinha sanjay.an...@gmail.comwrote: I thought so too. I was wondering what the DE agnostic way of enabling tapping would be though. I use gnome, and the mouse utility does this for me. However, when folks on other DEs, such as XFCE ask me how to do it, I don't quite have an answer. Could someone please outline the correct way of enabling tapping and other options (for instance horizontal scrolling, two finger scrolling..) on various DEs ? Even if each DE has a specific way, please can you post with what it is? I can compile the information on a wiki page to aid users, with relevant links to upstreams if they want to take up changing defaults with them. $ synclient TapButton1=1 is to enable touchpad clic -- Álvaro Castillo http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Netsys Linux user #547784 Maybe add this on all DE, WM...et LXDE spin by adding these two lines to /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf: Code: Option TapButton1 1 Option RBCornerButton 3 Could problem solved? -- Álvaro Castillo http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Netsys Linux user #547784 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On 2012-09-11 23:06, Álvaro Castillo wrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 7:04 AM, Álvaro Castillo net...@fedoraproject.org wrote: On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 6:54 AM, Ankur Sinha sanjay.an...@gmail.com wrote: I thought so too. I was wondering what the DE agnostic way of enabling tapping would be though. I use gnome, and the mouse utility does this for me. However, when folks on other DEs, such as XFCE ask me how to do it, I don't quite have an answer. Could someone please outline the correct way of enabling tapping and other options (for instance horizontal scrolling, two finger scrolling..) on various DEs ? Even if each DE has a specific way, please can you post with what it is? I can compile the information on a wiki page to aid users, with relevant links to upstreams if they want to take up changing defaults with them. $ synclient TapButton1=1 is to enable touchpad clic -- Álvaro Castillo http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Netsys [1] Linux user #547784 Maybe add this on all DE, WM...et LXDE spin by adding these two lines to /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf: Code: Option TapButton1 1 Option RBCornerButton 3 Could problem solved? The correct place to put the file would be /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d , not /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d . User/admin customization always goes in /etc. The /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d directory exists for any distribution packages that want to ship xorg config snippets, it shouldn't be used by sysadmin/user. So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_enable_touchpad_click -- Thanks, Warm regards, Ankur: FranciscoD Please only print if necessary. Looking to contribute to Fedora? Look here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Join_SIG http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha http://dodoincfedora.wordpress.com/ signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 4:44 PM, Ankur Sinha sanjay.an...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, 2012-09-11 at 23:16 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: So instead of /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf you should create /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/50-synaptics.conf . Other than that, I think the advice is good. Hi, Thanks Adam, Onuralp, Alvaro. I've created a page here[1]. Please review it and correct it if required. Thanks for putting this together. I, for one have had to search around to enable tapping after a fresh install. Cheers, Amit. -- http://echorand.me -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Hello devel list, I want know... Why Fedora doesn't included TapButton support of touchpad by default? I saw AskFedora and FedoraForum.org, and it happened to me too after install or show live CD to people, a lot users request, or asking about How to setup TapButton. It's ok, you can enable it from GNOME control panel, or touchpad tool, or KDE touchpad configuration, but who have installed only LXDE, XFCE... or another Window Manager...? How do? Search solution on Internet? Greetings! -- Álvaro Castillo http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Netsys Linux user #547784 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On 2012-09-11 19:33, Álvaro Castillo wrote: Hello devel list, I want know... Why Fedora doesn't included TapButton support of touchpad by default? I saw AskFedora and FedoraForum.org, and it happened to me too after install or show live CD to people, a lot users request, or asking about How to setup TapButton. It's ok, you can enable it from GNOME control panel, or touchpad tool, or KDE touchpad configuration, but who have installed only LXDE, XFCE... or another Window Manager...? How do? Search solution on Internet? It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 4:03 AM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.comwrote: It's a function of the desktop, and we go with the upstream desktop defaults, AFAIK. Mmm, sorry, I cannot understand very well. Im spanish and my english is limited, I can not take things for granted. Desktop, you mean, desktops PCs, right? -- Álvaro Castillo http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Netsys Linux user #547784 -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
Ok, but I do not understand why a simple thing is not set by default? bit empathic? a lot users want is enabled by default, others doesn't like it, ok, but a who doesn't like it, not affect on your navigation, can ignore this. There is no good default, you set it one way, you get a crapton of hate mail, you set it the other you get a crapton of hate mail. Therefore you provide a discoverable settings box, if your desktop is too crap to do that then complain to them. Dave. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Why is not enabled TapButton of touchpad on Fedora by default?
On 12/09/12 05:33, Jon Ciesla wrote: Meaning Desktop Environments, like GNOME, KDE, XFCE, etc. We use their default settings. Which with regards to your current problem means ... if you want to have it changed, go upstream and ask it to be changed there. Matěj -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
