Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
Jaya Kumar wrote: > Overall XO > - > Peak power consumption: ?? > Typical power consumption: ?? http://wiki.laptop.org/go/XO_Power_Draw Feel free to duplicate my experiments and send me your results/questions/suggestions. On area that needs looking at again is Sleep mode. The plan in sleep mode (and other low power non-wlan modes) is to put the WLAN into reset rather than just removing the firmware. -- Richard Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> One Laptop Per Child ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 10:35 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 8:27 AM, Walter Bender <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I'll be getting my hands on a one2onemate next week. I'll report back >> what I learn, but I wouldn't condemn it sight unseen. At the very >> least, it is Linux based, suggesting that ideas for improvement can be >> realized. > > To be clear, I have mixed feelings about it. > The software looks easier and more efficient to use. > I'm quite sure that the device will crush an OLPC XO > in purchasing decisions. At least it runs Linux. > > What horrifies me is WHY this device will win. Based on my experience in market research, I disagree. Not with the idea that some schools will go for the cheap solution, regardless of its merits, but that they will predominate. Research on the effectiveness of various laptops in education is getting started, and I am confident of the kind of results that will come out of the studies that ask the appropriate questions in a valid experimental design. I am also confident of the economic value of our program to communities that embrace it. I am more concerned in the short run with the apparent intention of some school officials to poison the market for such programs, by putting laptops into schools with no thought of integrating them into curricula or lesson plans, and then saying, "See? They don't work." Unless, of course, it's just plain incompetence. Reported in the New York Times, "Seeing No Progress, Some Schools Drop Laptops", http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/04/education/04laptop.html?ex=1335931200&en=65dac8df966cdd80&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss (Very shoddy reporting, BTW. No mention of schools that are succeeding no numbers, no background at all.) > Despite the existance of a laptop bag, it really > is not designed to go home with students. The > thing is banana-shaped. This device is designed > for in-school abuse. One look at the cart should > explain everything: students get the device for an > hour, and then it is taken away. That's perfect for > a budget. Purchasing hardware for the school is > something everybody understands; purchasing it > for the kids (child ownership) is totally alien. > The device is a spyware-special too, making it > easy to snoop on the students. > > It would take a real effort by OLPC to stop this > rotten concept, but I don't see that happening. > OLPC coldly and habitually ignores the USA. OLPC can do nothing about this directly. The community can have some influence, by getting into the discussion with every legislature and every school board considering a laptop program. Nicholas Negroponte refuses to let us know who they are, so we must recruit people to the task ourselves. But remember, "Against stupidity the Gods themselves contend in vain." -- Edward Cherlin End Poverty at a Profit by teaching children business http://www.EarthTreasury.org/ "The best way to predict the future is to invent it."--Alan Kay ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
Bernie Innocenti wrote: >> a serious problem in the most underserved areas --- the price trend >> is for the second >> generation of the "low cost" laptops to head back to $500. >> The Asus 900 has a suggested list of $550 ? > > That's weird marketing... ASUS and Intel know they will have to > beat OLPC's offer head to head. Not in the adult-use case USA market! ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Saturday 10 May 2008 5:07:22 am Jim Gettys wrote: > 1:1 is really *very* important, for many reasons, not the least of which > is the following: > > If a teacher cannot *rely* on a child having access to a computer for > teaching their class and/or homework, you are, in essence, asking them > to greatly *increase* their work-load, Isn't this all-or-nothing stance an extreme viewpoint? There are issues in the current teaching practices and many teachers do acknowledge their limitations. So why not use laptops (shared) to tackle some of these issues? It may not be perfect solution but solving some is better than solving none. For instance, Stellarium can be used affordably by teachers around the world. I know of teachers who use Stellarium to teach children about celestial bodies. They find the digital medium much easier than blackboard or models. The kids then use their notes to explore night sky on their own (no worries about running out of battery :-)). Children fascinated by night sky start taking a deeper interest in schooling. Ever wondered why a circle is marked as 360 degrees and not 100? BTW, I was just exploring the occultation of Mars by Moon with my daughter a while back. The real sky got obscured by clouds :-(. Subbu ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
Not disagreeing about importance, but this is again a question of access and not of ownership. "1:1" in the classroom without ownership may not provide access at home. ownership without power infrastructure may not provide access. SJ remembering the 6 years he had computer-dependent courses before getting his own laptop On Fri, May 9, 2008 at 7:37 PM, Jim Gettys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 1:1 is really *very* important, for many reasons, not the least of which > is the following: > > If a teacher cannot *rely* on a child having access to a computer for > teaching their class and/or homework, you are, in essence, asking them > to greatly *increase* their work-load, by having to prepare two > curricula, one computer based, and one conventionally based (on paper, > chalkboard, or in extreme cases dirt). Teaching is tough enough as it > is without making the teacher's workload go up. > > - Jim > > -- > Jim Gettys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > One Laptop Per Child > > ___ > Devel mailing list > Devel@lists.laptop.org > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel > ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
1:1 is really *very* important, for many reasons, not the least of which is the following: If a teacher cannot *rely* on a child having access to a computer for teaching their class and/or homework, you are, in essence, asking them to greatly *increase* their work-load, by having to prepare two curricula, one computer based, and one conventionally based (on paper, chalkboard, or in extreme cases dirt). Teaching is tough enough as it is without making the teacher's workload go up. - Jim -- Jim Gettys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> One Laptop Per Child ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Fri, May 9, 2008 at 4:36 PM, Stephen John Smoogen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, May 9, 2008 at 1:23 PM, K. K. Subramaniam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > On Friday 09 May 2008 9:33:26 pm Eben Eliason wrote: > >> > Even if you were to provide an computer exclusively to each child, > they > >> > are unlikely to be in use all day long. Programmers in IT companies > may > >> > spend their whole day before a computer, but children do have a life > >> > beyond the keyboard :-). > >> > >> You bring up two points both of which, I feel, support the goals of > >> OLPC and Sugar. First, child ownership ensures that the kids get to > >> take the laptops /home/ with them. > > Access to computing should not be confused with ownership of laptops. Ask > > anyone who used a laptop for more than a few hours away from a power > > socket :-) > Subbu, this is a very good point. The mechanisms of empowerment we talk about are mainly access to knowledge, connection with others, and a creative environment; and persistent access to one's own writing and creative works. > Or that in some places a child can not own anything as they are > effectively 'owned' by their parents until they are of age. > This is also an issue. > > Ownership per se means nothing to them. What they need > > is access to a learning environment. Often, a village school is the only > > place where they can learn. > < Education can happen even on entry level laptops in such schools. The > higher > > cost could be offset by sharing one laptop between two kids (OLP2C!). > A worthy if difficult exercise : identifying great learning environments & games that can be effectively shared through a fixed-geography lab, through a fixed-geo lab with another computer that sits at home, through mobile laptops shared among a number of people (OLPnC), and those that only work well in the case of saturation and olpc. SJ ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Fri, May 9, 2008 at 1:23 PM, K. K. Subramaniam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Friday 09 May 2008 9:33:26 pm Eben Eliason wrote: >> > Even if you were to provide an computer exclusively to each child, they >> > are unlikely to be in use all day long. Programmers in IT companies may >> > spend their whole day before a computer, but children do have a life >> > beyond the keyboard :-). >> >> You bring up two points both of which, I feel, support the goals of >> OLPC and Sugar. First, child ownership ensures that the kids get to >> take the laptops /home/ with them. > Access to computing should not be confused with ownership of laptops. Ask > anyone who used a laptop for more than a few hours away from a power > socket :-). > Or that in some places a child can not own anything as they are effectively 'owned' by their parents until they are of age. > For many kids, "home" is a single room affair. They spend most of their waking > hours in the outdoors. "I live in a very big house where the sky is the > roof", joked a kid. Ownership per se means nothing to them. What they need > is access to a learning environment. Often, a village school is the only > place where they can learn. > > See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xETrXmnRDco for a reality check. > Thankyou for the link... there are places inside the United States that are not too different from there... and they have the same needs. > Education can happen even on entry level laptops in such schools. The higher > cost could be offset by sharing one laptop between two kids (OLP2C!). > > Subbu > ___ > Devel mailing list > Devel@lists.laptop.org > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel > -- Stephen J Smoogen. -- BSD/GNU/Linux How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a good deed in a naughty world. = Shakespeare. "The Merchant of Venice" ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Friday 09 May 2008 9:33:26 pm Eben Eliason wrote: > > Even if you were to provide an computer exclusively to each child, they > > are unlikely to be in use all day long. Programmers in IT companies may > > spend their whole day before a computer, but children do have a life > > beyond the keyboard :-). > > You bring up two points both of which, I feel, support the goals of > OLPC and Sugar. First, child ownership ensures that the kids get to > take the laptops /home/ with them. Access to computing should not be confused with ownership of laptops. Ask anyone who used a laptop for more than a few hours away from a power socket :-). For many kids, "home" is a single room affair. They spend most of their waking hours in the outdoors. "I live in a very big house where the sky is the roof", joked a kid. Ownership per se means nothing to them. What they need is access to a learning environment. Often, a village school is the only place where they can learn. See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xETrXmnRDco for a reality check. Education can happen even on entry level laptops in such schools. The higher cost could be offset by sharing one laptop between two kids (OLP2C!). Subbu ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Fri, May 9, 2008 at 4:09 AM, K. K. Subramaniam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thursday 08 May 2008 1:50:59 pm Albert Cahalan wrote: >> From time to time, you get "computer day". It could be >> a few times a year or once a week. Most likely this is >> decided by the teacher, who must then try to reserve the >> computers for the desired day. At the beginning of class, >> somebody delivers the equipment to the classroom. > How is this different from other shared resources like globes, encyclopedias, > microscopes, projectors etc.? IMHO, the real issue is not that computers are > shared but most teachers have not integrated computing media fully into their > teaching methods. > > Even if you were to provide an computer exclusively to each child, they are > unlikely to be in use all day long. Programmers in IT companies may spend > their whole day before a computer, but children do have a life beyond the > keyboard :-). You bring up two points both of which, I feel, support the goals of OLPC and Sugar. First, child ownership ensures that the kids get to take the laptops /home/ with them. Regardless of how much of their day they spend in front of the computer at school, they are welcome to use it (not forced to!) on their own outside of the classroom setting, allowing them to explore and learn in their own way and in their own time. Second, it's true that many kids can't become engaged with computers, and in particular with their use in many classroom settings. This is why Sugar strives to encourage collaboration and creation, such that the computer can become a tool that actually enriches their "life beyond the keyboard." (The laptop can be used to play music, make home movies, take photos on a hike, read a book, etc. None of these would I consider mundane "computer" tasks.) - Eben ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thursday 08 May 2008 1:50:59 pm Albert Cahalan wrote: > From time to time, you get "computer day". It could be > a few times a year or once a week. Most likely this is > decided by the teacher, who must then try to reserve the > computers for the desired day. At the beginning of class, > somebody delivers the equipment to the classroom. How is this different from other shared resources like globes, encyclopedias, microscopes, projectors etc.? IMHO, the real issue is not that computers are shared but most teachers have not integrated computing media fully into their teaching methods. Even if you were to provide an computer exclusively to each child, they are unlikely to be in use all day long. Programmers in IT companies may spend their whole day before a computer, but children do have a life beyond the keyboard :-). > In general, nobody gets much time with the computers. > It certainly isn't yours; you can't keep any personal > data on it. You're lucky when the computer you get handed > has not been vandalized by a previous user Looks like times have changed. These days, serious schools use multi-user systems like Linux to prevent vandalism and let children carry their personal data on a flash memory chip. With software like Squeak, one can carry years worth of school projects on a single chip. Subbu ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thu, 2008-05-08 at 13:35 -0400, Albert Cahalan wrote: > > It would take a real effort by OLPC to stop this > rotten concept, but I don't see that happening. > OLPC coldly and habitually ignores the USA. Not true... several cities are doing things. But certainly we believe in child control of a laptop; not a shared device that they get a small amount of the day - Jim -- Jim Gettys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> One Laptop Per Child ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 8:27 AM, Walter Bender <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'll be getting my hands on a one2onemate next week. I'll report back > what I learn, but I wouldn't condemn it sight unseen. At the very > least, it is Linux based, suggesting that ideas for improvement can be > realized. To be clear, I have mixed feelings about it. The software looks easier and more efficient to use. I'm quite sure that the device will crush an OLPC XO in purchasing decisions. At least it runs Linux. What horrifies me is WHY this device will win. Despite the existance of a laptop bag, it really is not designed to go home with students. The thing is banana-shaped. This device is designed for in-school abuse. One look at the cart should explain everything: students get the device for an hour, and then it is taken away. That's perfect for a budget. Purchasing hardware for the school is something everybody understands; purchasing it for the kids (child ownership) is totally alien. The device is a spyware-special too, making it easy to snoop on the students. It would take a real effort by OLPC to stop this rotten concept, but I don't see that happening. OLPC coldly and habitually ignores the USA. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
Does anyone know what the battery life is like on the one2onemate gadget? I take an interest in all laptops like this. No one has really come up with the magic formula here. Software can be changed out/adapted but not the hardware. Even the XO which was designed for it doesn't have a good battery life story. Well, story maybe... -- John. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On 08.05.2008, at 05:31, Jaya Kumar wrote: > On Wed, May 7, 2008 at 8:08 PM, Carol Lerche <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Display >> >> ...and several pointers to further info in the reference section at >> the end > > Thanks Carol. Some of the data was there. Appended ?? marks the info I > haven't been able to fill in yet. > > MLJ display > -- > 7.5" TFT 1200x900 0.127mm pixel RGB666 > 152.4 mm × 114.3 mm; > * reflective mode: power consumption 0.1–0.2Watts > * backlight mode: power consumption 0.2–1.0Watts > > brightness: ?? > horizontal/vertical viewing angles: ?? > contrast ratio: ?? (min, typ, max) > operating temperature range: ?? > center point white luminance: ?? There was a test of a B1 machine in c't magazine's display lab: http://www.heise.de/mobil/The-One-Laptop-per-Child-project-enters-its-critical-phase--/artikel/88916/3 They determined the brightness at 64 cd/m2, and contrast at 82:1. However, due to the reflectiveness of the screen a high brightness is unnecessary and would only drain the battery, while the contrast is more than sufficient (newspaper typically has 10:1). - Bert - ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
s/site/sight/ -walter On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 8:27 AM, Walter Bender <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'll be getting my hands on a one2onemate next week. I'll report back > what I learn, but I wouldn't condemn it site unseen. At the very > least, it is Linux based, suggesting that ideas for improvement can be > realized. > > -walter > > > > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 4:20 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 3:17 AM, Samuel Klein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 2:25 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > Bernie Innocenti writes: > > > > >>> http://www.one2onemate.com/ > > >> > > >> This is optimized for teacher thinking. They win. :-( > > > > > > Yuck. Surely you are joking... I find it hard to be > > > inspired by any aspect of that machine. > > > > I'm definitely not joking, and not at all inspired. > > This machine makes me cringe; it totally reminds me > > of what I got as a kid in the USA. (updated for 2008) > > > > From time to time, you get "computer day". It could be > > a few times a year or once a week. Most likely this is > > decided by the teacher, who must then try to reserve the > > computers for the desired day. At the beginning of class, > > somebody delivers the equipment to the classroom. > > > > In general, nobody gets much time with the computers. > > It certainly isn't yours; you can't keep any personal > > data on it. You're lucky when the computer you get handed > > has not been vandalized by a previous user. > > > > Nothing much useful happens with the computers. Using them > > means that the school can keep kids occupied while being > > able to claim that they are providing computer education. > > > > Shared computers are cheap. > > > > > > >> The GUI and apps are superior, at least from the viewpoint of > > >> a school system. You get an Excel-compatible spreadsheet, > > >> a Word-compatible word processor, Tux Paint, Flash player, and a > > >> desktop that hasn't been inspired to the point of unusability. > > > > > > While it is true they have a spreadsheet and crude typing tutor, > > > both GUI and apps seem pretty awful. > > > > That may be, but it sure beats what the XO is shipping with. > > I think you see the XO's software with rose-tinted glasses. > > > > > > ___ > > Devel mailing list > > Devel@lists.laptop.org > > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel > > > ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
I'll be getting my hands on a one2onemate next week. I'll report back what I learn, but I wouldn't condemn it site unseen. At the very least, it is Linux based, suggesting that ideas for improvement can be realized. -walter On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 4:20 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 3:17 AM, Samuel Klein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 2:25 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Bernie Innocenti writes: > > >>> http://www.one2onemate.com/ > >> > >> This is optimized for teacher thinking. They win. :-( > > > > Yuck. Surely you are joking... I find it hard to be > > inspired by any aspect of that machine. > > I'm definitely not joking, and not at all inspired. > This machine makes me cringe; it totally reminds me > of what I got as a kid in the USA. (updated for 2008) > > From time to time, you get "computer day". It could be > a few times a year or once a week. Most likely this is > decided by the teacher, who must then try to reserve the > computers for the desired day. At the beginning of class, > somebody delivers the equipment to the classroom. > > In general, nobody gets much time with the computers. > It certainly isn't yours; you can't keep any personal > data on it. You're lucky when the computer you get handed > has not been vandalized by a previous user. > > Nothing much useful happens with the computers. Using them > means that the school can keep kids occupied while being > able to claim that they are providing computer education. > > Shared computers are cheap. > > > >> The GUI and apps are superior, at least from the viewpoint of > >> a school system. You get an Excel-compatible spreadsheet, > >> a Word-compatible word processor, Tux Paint, Flash player, and a > >> desktop that hasn't been inspired to the point of unusability. > > > > While it is true they have a spreadsheet and crude typing tutor, > > both GUI and apps seem pretty awful. > > That may be, but it sure beats what the XO is shipping with. > I think you see the XO's software with rose-tinted glasses. > > > ___ > Devel mailing list > Devel@lists.laptop.org > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel > ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On the XO, YMMWV (your milage will vary) very, very greatly depending on how the machine is being used (and how (im)mature our software is), much more than most machines. We have extensive measurements of what the individual pieces consume; less good is the state of our power management, which is far from what it needs to be due to insufficient resources (help greatfully accepted). Note that some of this work is work that will help everyone's laptops; and other parts requires hardware capabilities we have we've not seen elsewhere. - Jim On Wed, 2008-05-07 at 20:00 -0700, Jaya Kumar wrote: > 2008/5/6 John Watlington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > > The XO has a good reason for existance (MLJ's display, and attention to low > > power design). > > I'm just curious. I was wondering if you have a pointer to specific > data about the MLJ display like exact specs on power consumption, > brightness, horizontal/vertical viewing angles, contrast ratio in the > various modes. Same question for the overall XO power consumption as > well. I'm sure you've already posted this but I couldn't find it. > > Thanks, > jaya > ___ > Devel mailing list > Devel@lists.laptop.org > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- Jim Gettys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> One Laptop Per Child ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 3:17 AM, Samuel Klein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 2:25 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Bernie Innocenti writes: >>> http://www.one2onemate.com/ >> >> This is optimized for teacher thinking. They win. :-( > > Yuck. Surely you are joking... I find it hard to be > inspired by any aspect of that machine. I'm definitely not joking, and not at all inspired. This machine makes me cringe; it totally reminds me of what I got as a kid in the USA. (updated for 2008) >From time to time, you get "computer day". It could be a few times a year or once a week. Most likely this is decided by the teacher, who must then try to reserve the computers for the desired day. At the beginning of class, somebody delivers the equipment to the classroom. In general, nobody gets much time with the computers. It certainly isn't yours; you can't keep any personal data on it. You're lucky when the computer you get handed has not been vandalized by a previous user. Nothing much useful happens with the computers. Using them means that the school can keep kids occupied while being able to claim that they are providing computer education. Shared computers are cheap. >> The GUI and apps are superior, at least from the viewpoint of >> a school system. You get an Excel-compatible spreadsheet, >> a Word-compatible word processor, Tux Paint, Flash player, and a >> desktop that hasn't been inspired to the point of unusability. > > While it is true they have a spreadsheet and crude typing tutor, > both GUI and apps seem pretty awful. That may be, but it sure beats what the XO is shipping with. I think you see the XO's software with rose-tinted glasses. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 2:25 AM, Albert Cahalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Bernie Innocenti writes: > > > http://www.one2onemate.com/ > > This is optimized for teacher thinking. They win. :-( > Yuck. Surely you are joking... I find it hard to be inspired by any aspect of that machine. The GUI and apps are superior, at least from the viewpoint of > a school system. You get an Excel-compatible spreadsheet, > a Word-compatible word processor, Tux Paint, Flash player, and a > desktop that hasn't been inspired to the point of unusability. > While it is true they have a spreadsheet and crude typing tutor, both GUI and apps seem pretty awful. And I don't know what to say about the demo photos with paper imitations of the display, and children using the 'display' under a tree. The whole strikes me as hard to fix, whether or not it is dropkickable. SJ ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
Bernie Innocenti writes: > Wow, there are way more than I thought, already. > And they missed this one: > > http://www.one2onemate.com/ This is optimized for teacher thinking. They win. :-( There is a cart, for moving the laptops to and from classrooms. It has shaped holes for the laptops. It supplies enough power to charge 32 laptops from a 15 amp circuit. There is software for the teacher (using Windows) to monitor all the students. There is no hinge to break. If the laptop hits the floor face-down on top of an object, the screen is protected. The GUI and apps are superior, at least from the viewpoint of a school system. You get an Excel-compatible spreadsheet, a Word-compatible word processor, Tux Paint, Flash player, and a desktop that hasn't been inspired to the point of unusability. There will be a cart or two for the whole school to share. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Wed, May 7, 2008 at 8:08 PM, Carol Lerche <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Display > > ...and several pointers to further info in the reference section at the end Thanks Carol. Some of the data was there. Appended ?? marks the info I haven't been able to fill in yet. MLJ display -- 7.5" TFT 1200x900 0.127mm pixel RGB666 152.4 mm × 114.3 mm; * reflective mode: power consumption 0.1–0.2Watts * backlight mode: power consumption 0.2–1.0Watts brightness: ?? horizontal/vertical viewing angles: ?? contrast ratio: ?? (min, typ, max) operating temperature range: ?? center point white luminance: ?? Overall XO - Peak power consumption: ?? Typical power consumption: ?? Thanks, jaya ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Display ...and several pointers to further info in the reference section at the end On Wed, May 7, 2008 at 8:00 PM, Jaya Kumar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 2008/5/6 John Watlington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > > The XO has a good reason for existance (MLJ's display, and attention to > low > > power design). > > I'm just curious. I was wondering if you have a pointer to specific > data about the MLJ display like exact specs on power consumption, > brightness, horizontal/vertical viewing angles, contrast ratio in the > various modes. Same question for the overall XO power consumption as > well. I'm sure you've already posted this but I couldn't find it. > > Thanks, > jaya > ___ > Devel mailing list > Devel@lists.laptop.org > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel > -- "Always do right," said Mark Twain. "This will gratify some people and astonish the rest." ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
2008/5/6 John Watlington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > The XO has a good reason for existance (MLJ's display, and attention to low > power design). I'm just curious. I was wondering if you have a pointer to specific data about the MLJ display like exact specs on power consumption, brightness, horizontal/vertical viewing angles, contrast ratio in the various modes. Same question for the overall XO power consumption as well. I'm sure you've already posted this but I couldn't find it. Thanks, jaya ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Wed, May 7, 2008 at 7:27 PM, Bernie Innocenti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Martin Langhoff wrote: > > > Yes. Suspend eats up a ton of battery on mine. I don't think they > > spent significant engineering time on power mgmt on the board there - > > which is a major disappointment :-( > > Is the classmate any better? I never tested that aspect... > > Frankly, I have much more expectations from those small devices > derived from the mobile industry such as the Nokia N800 to scale > up to become good ultra-low-cost laptops. > > These legacy PC architectures make no longer much sense once we're > free to recompile everything from scratch. A clear instance of The Innovator's Dilemma. Good book, BTW. > -- >\___/ > _| o | Bernie Innocenti - http://www.codewiz.org/ > \|_X_| "It's an education project, not a laptop project!" > ___ > > > Devel mailing list > Devel@lists.laptop.org > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel > -- Edward Cherlin End Poverty at a Profit by teaching children business http://www.EarthTreasury.org/ "The best way to predict the future is to invent it."--Alan Kay ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
Martin Langhoff wrote: > Yes. Suspend eats up a ton of battery on mine. I don't think they > spent significant engineering time on power mgmt on the board there - > which is a major disappointment :-( Is the classmate any better? I never tested that aspect... Frankly, I have much more expectations from those small devices derived from the mobile industry such as the Nokia N800 to scale up to become good ultra-low-cost laptops. These legacy PC architectures make no longer much sense once we're free to recompile everything from scratch. -- \___/ _| o | Bernie Innocenti - http://www.codewiz.org/ \|_X_| "It's an education project, not a laptop project!" ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 8:56 AM, Bernie Innocenti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Ignoring the fact that most of the new "low-cost" laptops require > > much more power --- > > The EEE PC I have just bought heats up in the bag when suspended... > and seems to have a noisy fan inside. Yes. Suspend eats up a ton of battery on mine. I don't think they spent significant engineering time on power mgmt on the board there - which is a major disappointment :-( m -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
John Watlington wrote: > The XO has a good reason for existance (MLJ's display, and attention > to low power design). I agree. We had 1-2 years advantage over the others, and some kickass researchers in house. > Ignoring the fact that most of the new "low-cost" laptops require > much more power --- The EEE PC I have just bought heats up in the bag when suspended... and seems to have a noisy fan inside. > a serious problem in the most underserved areas --- the price trend > is for the second > generation of the "low cost" laptops to head back to $500. > The Asus 900 has a suggested list of $550 ? That's weird marketing... ASUS and Intel know they will have to beat OLPC's offer head to head. Please don't compare the list price with volume prices. You have to multiply by a factor of 1.5 to 2. > A comparison of the possible XO replacements is provided as an > attachment. > The information comes from: > http://www.liliputing.com/2008/04/over-past-six-months-or-so-asus-everex_24.html Wow, there are way more than I thought, already. And they missed this one: http://www.one2onemate.com/ -- \___/ _| o | Bernie Innocenti - http://www.codewiz.org/ \|_X_| "It's an education project, not a laptop project!" ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Its.an.education.project] Sugar on the EEE PC
The XO has a good reason for existance (MLJ's display, and attention to low power design). Ignoring the fact that most of the new "low-cost" laptops require much more power --- a serious problem in the most underserved areas --- the price trend is for the second generation of the "low cost" laptops to head back to $500. The Asus 900 has a suggested list of $550 ? A comparison of the possible XO replacements is provided as an attachment. The information comes from: http://www.liliputing.com/2008/04/over-past-six-months-or-so-asus- everex_24.html Cheers, wad On May 6, 2008, at 4:02 PM, Dr.-Ing. Rohrmoser wrote: Yes I made it work on a EEE PC using a dual boot configuration. Sugar runs, but activities suffer because of the limited screen resolution. I am waiting for the new Asus 900 Model. If you like to try it anyway, the procedure is documented in: ftp://rohrmoser-engineering.de/pub/XO-LiveCD/XO-LiveCD_080321.pdf - wolfgang Low Cost Laptop.pdf Description: Adobe PDF document ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
