Re: [Development] [webkit-qt] qtwebkit changes to qt/4.8
On Sunday, April 01, 2012 02:37:35 PM ext Kenneth Rohde Christiansen wrote: Hi there, We still are going to ship Qt WebKit1 API as part of the Qt5 module QtWebKitWidgets (I am not sure the name is final though) so it is a good idea to upstream I would say. Even things which are related to Qt4 only as the WebKit1 part should, to my knowledge, still work with Qt4, and who knows whether the community (or say Digia) wants to release a new version of QtWebKit for Qt4. Just my point of view I agree with Kenneth. In general changes to Qt 4's WebKit should just be backports from trunk. Ideally they're applied to the qtwebkit-2.2 branch and then imported into src/3rdparty/webkit. The person approving the change in Gerrit could forward-port the change to qtwebkit-2.2 on Gitorious and then we fix the version and re-import into src/3rdparty/webkit shortly before the next 4.8.x patch release. (This is more or less what I did for 4.8.2 now) In this particular case the change hasn't happend upstream yet it seems, so I agree with Girish's -1. With regards to Qt 4 support in WebKit trunk, I think that unless somebody steps up to care about and maintain the Qt 4 port, we should keep it around around until Qt 5 is released and has become a viable alternative. Depending on the quality and feedback that would ideally be Qt 5.0.0, but it could also be a patch release or a minor release. After that point I think we should remove Qt 4 support from trunk, unless a new maintainer is found. Simon Kenneth On Sat, Mar 31, 2012 at 1:57 AM, Girish Ramakrishnan gir...@forwardbias.in wrote: Hi QtWebKit team, What's the best way to deal with patches to QtWebKit1/qt4 (for example, http://codereview.qt-project.org/#change,21292) ? Is the strategy still to get it all upstream? Since, I assume, there is QtWebKit 2.3 planned how will this patch end up in Qt? (Is the answer that it won't ever end up in Qt4?) If the answer is to get it all upstream - would you agree that the sanity bot should complain when anyone tries to commit to src/3rdparty/webkit ? Thanks, Girish ___ webkit-qt mailing list webkit...@lists.webkit.org http://lists.webkit.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/webkit-qt ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Dropping the Q prefix from class names
2012/4/1 joao.abeca...@nokia.com: To every-concerned-one-of-you, I hope you do realize that we share all of those same concerns. We do! :-) You rock :) The best 1st April joke so far :) -- --- Artur Duque de Souza openBossa INdT - Instituto Nokia de Tecnologia --- Blog: http://blog.morpheuz.cc PGP: 0xDBEEAAC3 @ wwwkeys.pgp.net --- ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
Chris, Thanks for your answer. So, the low-down is that it's not (practically) possible to use QML without V8, and even if V8 did have a interpreter backend, it would be too slow to be useable? If so, I guess I'm going to have to find a way to get V8 working on iOS... christopher.ad...@nokia.com wrote: (04/02/2012 01:19) In summary: not very far, with v4 only. So the question is: could the dependence on v8 within QtDeclarative be changed, so that a naive JS implementation could be used instead, if v8 is not available on that platform? Theoretically: yes. Practically: no. We gain a lot of advantages from tight integration with v8 (and indeed, we want to increase the tightness of that integration in order to improve performance further, eg, caching C++-side property resolution etc) and the performance of a naïve interpreter would probably be a showstopper anyway (even if v4 was improved to handle more cases than it does currently). Also, it's a huge amount of work to #ifdef out all of the v8 integration within QtQml and QtQuick currently (and even more work to use hypothetical JS-backend-abstracting APIs provided by QtJsBackend as a true JS abstraction, which would also have massive performance implications). ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
Hi, On 02/04/2012, at 2:21 PM, ext Ian wrote: Chris, Thanks for your answer. So, the low-down is that it's not (practically) possible to use QML without V8, and even if V8 did have a interpreter backend, it would be too slow to be useable? If so, I guess I'm going to have to find a way to get V8 working on iOS… V8 with an interpreter backend would probably be fine. However, V8 doesn't have such a backend and writing one would be an enormous effort - akin to one of their architecture ports. The key to getting V8 running on iOS will be executing writable pages. Unless you can solve that - and in a way that keeps Apple happy if you ever want to deploy such apps - everything else will be in vein. Cheers, Aaron christopher.ad...@nokia.com wrote: (04/02/2012 01:19) In summary: not very far, with v4 only. So the question is: could the dependence on v8 within QtDeclarative be changed, so that a naive JS implementation could be used instead, if v8 is not available on that platform? Theoretically: yes. Practically: no. We gain a lot of advantages from tight integration with v8 (and indeed, we want to increase the tightness of that integration in order to improve performance further, eg, caching C++-side property resolution etc) and the performance of a naïve interpreter would probably be a showstopper anyway (even if v4 was improved to handle more cases than it does currently). Also, it's a huge amount of work to #ifdef out all of the v8 integration within QtQml and QtQuick currently (and even more work to use hypothetical JS-backend-abstracting APIs provided by QtJsBackend as a true JS abstraction, which would also have massive performance implications). ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 13.02.08, aaron.kenn...@nokia.com wrote: Hi, On 02/04/2012, at 2:21 PM, ext Ian wrote: Chris, Thanks for your answer. So, the low-down is that it's not (practically) possible to use QML without V8, and even if V8 did have a interpreter backend, it would be too slow to be useable? If so, I guess I'm going to have to find a way to get V8 working on iOS… V8 with an interpreter backend would probably be fine. However, V8 doesn't have such a backend and writing one would be an enormous effort - akin to one of their architecture ports. I estimated a 40k contribution to do that. The key to getting V8 running on iOS will be executing writable pages. Unless you can solve that - and in a way that keeps Apple happy if you ever want to deploy such apps - everything else will be in vein. I don't think Apple will ever allow that. I don't think Apple will allow executing any code that isn't loaded strictly from disk. -- Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center Intel Sweden AB - Registration Number: 556189-6027 Knarrarnäsgatan 15, 164 40 Kista, Stockholm, Sweden signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Maintainer TrustMes
Thiago: Does the project maintain a list of Subject Matter Experts from which 1) volunteers could be solicited or 2) reviewers could be drafted? If not, *SHOULD* the project maintain such a list? Otherwise, it's as we saw in T2... http://noffload.net/uploader/files/1/term2/t2-%28498%29.jpg Trust me! Atlant -Original Message- From: development-bounces+aschmidt=dekaresearch@qt-project.org [mailto:development-bounces+aschmidt=dekaresearch@qt-project.org] On Behalf Of Thiago Macieira Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 09:22 To: development@qt-project.org Subject: [Development] Maintainer TrustMes Hello One of the duties of a maintainer is to ensure that every contribution to the code he/she maintains is being reviewed. That is, if no one else approves or rejects, the maintainer has the duty to make that happen. I've done this in the past and approved based on +1 given by other people, or by reviewing stuff myself. What are we supposed to do when no one else approves or rejects a commit that we created ourselves? Or worse, when no one reviews at all? My question applies mostly to QtDBus, since I don't expect most people will know anything about that module. I've (ab)used Stephen's goodwill to review simple things, but I don't expect him to understand the message delivery path for example. What is the suggested procedure? -- Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center Intel Sweden AB - Registration Number: 556189-6027 Knarrarnäsgatan 15, 164 40 Kista, Stockholm, Sweden This e-mail and the information, including any attachments, it contains are intended to be a confidential communication only to the person or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender and destroy the original message. Thank you. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Maintainer TrustMes
On Mon, Apr 02, 2012 at 10:22:12AM -0300, ext Thiago Macieira wrote: What is the suggested procedure? the answer is already in the commit policy, point 12. there is no approved way for bypassing even a superficial review. hardly a problem - there is always somebody on irc available for a quick sanity check. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Maintainer TrustMes
On 2. apr. 2012, at 15.22, ext Thiago Macieira wrote: One of the duties of a maintainer is to ensure that every contribution to the code he/she maintains is being reviewed. That is, if no one else approves or rejects, the maintainer has the duty to make that happen. I've done this in the past and approved based on +1 given by other people, or by reviewing stuff myself. What are we supposed to do when no one else approves or rejects a commit that we created ourselves? Or worse, when no one reviews at all? My question applies mostly to QtDBus, since I don't expect most people will know anything about that module. I've (ab)used Stephen's goodwill to review simple things, but I don't expect him to understand the message delivery path for example. What is the suggested procedure? Code reviews, in general, are good. Even by people that don't necessarily know the code. I think it would be fine to +2 yourself after you gathered +1s, if you can't get +2s in any other way. Cheers, João ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
On 02/04/2012 08:06, ext Thiago Macieira wrote: On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 13.02.08, aaron.kenn...@nokia.com wrote: On 02/04/2012, at 2:21 PM, ext Ian wrote: Chris, Thanks for your answer. So, the low-down is that it's not (practically) possible to use QML without V8, and even if V8 did have a interpreter backend, it would be too slow to be useable? If so, I guess I'm going to have to find a way to get V8 working on iOS… V8 with an interpreter backend would probably be fine. However, V8 doesn't have such a backend and writing one would be an enormous effort - akin to one of their architecture ports. I estimated a 40k contribution to do that. The key to getting V8 running on iOS will be executing writable pages. Unless you can solve that - and in a way that keeps Apple happy if you ever want to deploy such apps - everything else will be in vein. I don't think Apple will ever allow that. I don't think Apple will allow executing any code that isn't loaded strictly from disk. What do they use themselves for their own webkit JS engine? -- .marius ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
Hmmm, so from what I understand, there may be a bytecode backend for V8 at some point (for platforms like MIPS for example), but that work hasn't begun in any way other than maybe some time in the future, and even if it was decided to implement that, it's quite some time off. AFAIK Apple blocks what they find out about, and lets the rest pass until someone complains or something bad happens. The big problems here are using private APIs (they do static analysis, so there are ways around that), and altering the application's provision (if they notice they will probably block on that regardless of how it's been changed). They don't appear to analyse the app at runtime, so I'm not sure how they would know about a 3rd party JIT ( apart from the provisioning). I'm not sure which actual JIT they use for their own stuff, but I'm pretty sure it's not available outside of their webkit implementation. Guess the next step will be getting V8 to run at all on iOS (and finding a way of testing it without a platform plugin)... Thanks for the input! Thiago Macieira thiago.macie...@intel.com wrote: (04/02/2012 14:06) On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 13.02.08, aaron.kenn...@nokia.com wrote: Hi, On 02/04/2012, at 2:21 PM, ext Ian wrote: Chris, Thanks for your answer. So, the low-down is that it's not (practically) possible to use QML without V8, and even if V8 did have a interpreter backend, it would be too slow to be useable? If so, I guess I'm going to have to find a way to get V8 working on iOS? V8 with an interpreter backend would probably be fine. However, V8 doesn't have such a backend and writing one would be an enormous effort - akin to one of their architecture ports. I estimated a 40k contribution to do that. The key to getting V8 running on iOS will be executing writable pages.. Unless you can solve that - and in a way that keeps Apple happy if you ever want to deploy such apps - everything else will be in vein. I don't think Apple will ever allow that. I don't think Apple will allow executing any code that isn't loaded strictly from disk. -- Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center Intel Sweden AB - Registration Number: 556189-6027 Knarrarnäsgatan 15, 164 40 Kista, Stockholm, Sweden ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 14.04.24, marius.storm-ol...@nokia.com wrote: I don't think Apple will ever allow that. I don't think Apple will allow executing any code that isn't loaded strictly from disk. What do they use themselves for their own webkit JS engine? Probably JavaScriptCore + SquirrelFish Extreme, which does JIT. But that's not relevant. Apple isn't bound by Apple rules. You can't apply the store rules for the base OS. -- Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center Intel Sweden AB - Registration Number: 556189-6027 Knarrarnäsgatan 15, 164 40 Kista, Stockholm, Sweden signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 16.17.35, Ian wrote: Hmmm, so from what I understand, there may be a bytecode backend for V8 at some point (for platforms like MIPS for example), but that work hasn't MIPS has opted instead to write an assembler backend. The effort would have to be for yet other platforms, like SPARC or PowerPC. Or, if someone finally decides that writing assembly directly is a bad idea since you have nothing to compare against. begun in any way other than maybe some time in the future, and even if it was decided to implement that, it's quite some time off. AFAIK Apple blocks what they find out about, and lets the rest pass until someone complains or something bad happens. The big problems here are using private APIs (they do static analysis, so there are ways around that), and altering the application's provision (if they notice they will probably block on that regardless of how it's been changed). They don't appear to analyse the app at runtime, so I'm not sure how they would know about a 3rd party JIT ( apart from the provisioning). I'm not sure which actual JIT they use for their own stuff, but I'm pretty sure it's not available outside of their webkit implementation. If a JIT works on bytecode, that's ok. The bytecode doesn't need to be interpreted. A JIT producing machine instructions would either need to be emulated (which V8 can do), or make the memory writable and use mprotect for that. Guess the next step will be getting V8 to run at all on iOS (and finding a way of testing it without a platform plugin)... -- Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center Intel Sweden AB - Registration Number: 556189-6027 Knarrarnäsgatan 15, 164 40 Kista, Stockholm, Sweden signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Maintainer TrustMes
On 02/04/2012 08:22, ext Thiago Macieira wrote: One of the duties of a maintainer is to ensure that every contribution to the code he/she maintains is being reviewed. That is, if no one else approves or rejects, the maintainer has the duty to make that happen. I've done this in the past and approved based on +1 given by other people, or by reviewing stuff myself. What are we supposed to do when no one else approves or rejects a commit that we created ourselves? Or worse, when no one reviews at all? My question applies mostly to QtDBus, since I don't expect most people will know anything about that module. I've (ab)used Stephen's goodwill to review simple things, but I don't expect him to understand the message delivery path for example. What is the suggested procedure? You don't have to have intimate knowledge about a module to review code constructs against policies etc. And if there's no one else with knowledge about a module, it's probably a good idea for someone to step up and learn a little about that particular module. It's not good that only 1 person knows a module, in case that person gets sick, get hit by a bus (morbid I know, but still a possibilty) etc. In any case, try to get someone to review at least the code syntax parts, and see if you can persuade them to learning the technical bits as well. Last resort, the Chief Maintainer has the ultimate responsibility ;) -- .marius ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
Too many technical terms that I don't have (or want) intimate understanding of... :/ What I'm going to take away from this discussion is that it is expensive and complex to implement anything other than what there is right now, and if any work would be done on that in the forseeable future, it would take a commercial sponsor to make that happen. Obviously noone here (including me) wants to take on making alternatives unless they're going to be paid (lots of money) to do that (or have some other pressing motivation) I'll try (if the ABI issues do not make it completely unfeasible) to get V8 working on iOS by methods that are not restricted by Apple's App Store rules. Anyone wanting to use it, will then either need to take the risk that Apple will reject their app (either immediately, or some time down the line after it has been accepted), and provide their own solution to that issue if it's a problem. Of course if the ABI issues or something else blocks my efforts, then someone will have to sponsor a solution that both works for the platform ( technically) and for the App Store rules... IIRC the actual Apple restriction regards Java interpreters/compilers is that they are not used to run code that is downloaded from the web, so the issue at hand here really is being able to run self-modifying code in such a way that doesn't violate the App Store rules (or get noticed by the people enforcing them). I'm hoping (I haven't looked at it much yet), that it would be fairly obvious as to where the memory protection stuff would need to go in V8? Thiago Macieira thiago.macie...@intel.com wrote: (04/02/2012 15:25) On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 16.17.35, Ian wrote: Hmmm, so from what I understand, there may be a bytecode backend for V8 at some point (for platforms like MIPS for example), but that work hasn't MIPS has opted instead to write an assembler backend. The effort would have to be for yet other platforms, like SPARC or PowerPC. Or, if someone finally decides that writing assembly directly is a bad idea since you have nothing to compare against. begun in any way other than maybe some time in the future, and even if it was decided to implement that, it's quite some time off. AFAIK Apple blocks what they find out about, and lets the rest pass until someone complains or something bad happens. The big problems here are using private APIs (they do static analysis, so there are ways around that), and altering the application's provision (if they notice they will probably block on that regardless of how it's been changed). They don't appear to analyse the app at runtime, so I'm not sure how they would know about a 3rd party JIT ( apart from the provisioning). I'm not sure which actual JIT they use for their own stuff, but I'm pretty sure it's not available outside of their webkit implementation. If a JIT works on bytecode, that's ok. The bytecode doesn't need to be interpreted. A JIT producing machine instructions would either need to be emulated (which V8 can do), or make the memory writable and use mprotect for that. Guess the next step will be getting V8 to run at all on iOS (and finding a way of testing it without a platform plugin)... -- Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT) intel.com Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center Intel Sweden AB - Registration Number: 556189-6027 Knarrarnäsgatan 15, 164 40 Kista, Stockholm, Sweden ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] V8 on iOS
Hi, On 02/04/2012, at 3:04 PM, ext marius.storm-ol...@nokia.com wrote: On 02/04/2012 08:06, ext Thiago Macieira wrote: On segunda-feira, 2 de abril de 2012 13.02.08, aaron.kenn...@nokia.com wrote: On 02/04/2012, at 2:21 PM, ext Ian wrote: Chris, Thanks for your answer. So, the low-down is that it's not (practically) possible to use QML without V8, and even if V8 did have a interpreter backend, it would be too slow to be useable? If so, I guess I'm going to have to find a way to get V8 working on iOS… V8 with an interpreter backend would probably be fine. However, V8 doesn't have such a backend and writing one would be an enormous effort - akin to one of their architecture ports. I estimated a 40k contribution to do that. The key to getting V8 running on iOS will be executing writable pages. Unless you can solve that - and in a way that keeps Apple happy if you ever want to deploy such apps - everything else will be in vein. I don't think Apple will ever allow that. I don't think Apple will allow executing any code that isn't loaded strictly from disk. What do they use themselves for their own webkit JS engine? My understanding is that they have a special exception for the web browser application to run the Nitro javascript engine (a fancy marketing name for JavaScript Core with JIT turned on), but they continue to use JSC with the byte code backend for everything else. I believe this is what led to the somewhat embarrassing iOS 4.3 situation where web apps ran significantly faster in a browser (using JIT), than they did when they were added to the home screen (where they didn't use JIT). I think that was fixed in 5.0. Perhaps an iOS guru could provide more details. Cheers, Aaron -- .marius ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Hiding Tabs in QTabWidget
On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 09:42:43PM +0200, Carsten Breuer wrote: Hi Jordi, great :-) Good News :-). BTW: I guess in Qt style it should be bool tabVisible(int index) const; void setTabVisible(int index, bool); Jordi's bool isTabVisible(int index) const; was correct, as the function returns a bool. Andre' ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Maintainer TrustMes
On 02/04/2012, at 11:56 PM, ext Thiago Macieira wrote: If no one else wants to learn about it, there's little I can do about it. I'm no one's boss. But I still have a responsibility to ensure all changes are reviewed, including mine. I know a bit about it, and won't mind helping out. Lorn Potter Senior Software Engineer, Core Enablers/QtSensors ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
[Development] qtwayland: Project MESSAGE: Warning: unknown QT module: compositor
I don't know where to report bug about qtwayland. Any commens? main.cpp .\main.cpp(41) : fatal error C1083: Cannot open include file: 'waylandcompositor.h': No such file or directory textureblitter.cpp NMAKE : fatal error U1077: 'D:\qpSOFT\DEVx86\bin\cl.EXE' : return code '0x2' Stop. NMAKE : fatal error U1077: 'D:\qpSOFT\DEVx86\bin\nmake.exe' : return code '0x2' Stop. NMAKE : fatal error U1077: 'cd' : return code '0x2' Stop. -- Regards Loaden ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] qtwayland: Project MESSAGE: Warning: unknown QT module: compositor
Hi, You can not compile it under Windows. What you need is a modern linux which using wayland display server protocol instead of the old X11 protocol. Regards, Debao 2012/4/2 Loaden loa...@gmail.com: I don't know where to report bug about qtwayland. Any commens? main.cpp .\main.cpp(41) : fatal error C1083: Cannot open include file: 'waylandcompositor.h': No such file or directory textureblitter.cpp NMAKE : fatal error U1077: 'D:\qpSOFT\DEVx86\bin\cl.EXE' : return code '0x2' Stop. NMAKE : fatal error U1077: 'D:\qpSOFT\DEVx86\bin\nmake.exe' : return code '0x2' Stop. NMAKE : fatal error U1077: 'cd' : return code '0x2' Stop. -- Regards Loaden ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org http://lists.qt-project.org/mailman/listinfo/development
