Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Vincent Massol]

> On 18 Aug 2017, at 23:38, Marius Dumitru Florea 
>  wrote:
> 
> Looks good but I would show only 2 buttons: "Hide details" and "Open".
> "Uninstall" and the rest of the extension action buttons would be available
> from the drop down.

Yes that’s possible. Makes uninstall less visible but maybe that’s ok. It’s 
probably more consistent.

Thanks
-Vincent

> 
> Thanks,
> Marius
> 
> On Fri, Aug 18, 2017 at 5:47 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> 
>> 
>>> On 18 Aug 2017, at 16:29, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) 
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Aug 18, 2017 at 5:00 PM, Vincent Massol 
>> wrote:
>>> 
 I’ve created a design page for this at http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/
 bin/view/Proposal/ExtensionEntryPoints#Attachments
 
 And I’ve also proposed a new way to plug the entry point with the “Open”
 button.
 
>>> 
>>> Seems nice. Why is it a dropdown? what are the options?
>> 
>> ok I was sure you’d ask. It’s not actually :) I just took some html from
>> another place and forgot to modify this…
>> 
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>> 
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> Caty
>>> 
>>> 
 
 Let me know what you think.
 
 Thanks
 -Vincent
 
 
> On 14 Oct 2016, at 16:10, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> 
> Hi devs,
> 
> Problem
> ===
> 
> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
> 
> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a
 ConfigurableClass
> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
> 
> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel,
 the user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
> 
> Proposal
> 
> 
> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
 metadata
> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one)
 after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it
>> and
 be taken to the home page of the extension.
> 
> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
> 
> Implementation Details
> ==
> 
> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
> 
> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL
>> since
 that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
> ** The document reference
> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to
 “view"
> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query
 string
> 
> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference
 (EntityResourceReference to be precise). However we don’t have any
>> textual
 representation of it ATM.
> 
> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
> 
> Thanks
> -Vincent
> 
 
 
>> 
>> 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Vincent Massol]

> On 18 Aug 2017, at 16:29, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica)  wrote:
> 
> On Fri, Aug 18, 2017 at 5:00 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> 
>> I’ve created a design page for this at http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/
>> bin/view/Proposal/ExtensionEntryPoints#Attachments
>> 
>> And I’ve also proposed a new way to plug the entry point with the “Open”
>> button.
>> 
> 
> Seems nice. Why is it a dropdown? what are the options?

ok I was sure you’d ask. It’s not actually :) I just took some html from 
another place and forgot to modify this… 

Thanks
-Vincent

> 
> Thanks,
> Caty
> 
> 
>> 
>> Let me know what you think.
>> 
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>> 
>> 
>>> On 14 Oct 2016, at 16:10, Vincent Massol  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi devs,
>>> 
>>> Problem
>>> ===
>>> 
>>> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
>>> 
>>> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
>>> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a
>> ConfigurableClass
>>> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
>>> 
>>> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel,
>> the user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
>>> 
>>> Proposal
>>> 
>>> 
>>> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
>> metadata
>>> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one)
>> after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and
>> be taken to the home page of the extension.
>>> 
>>> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
>>> 
>>> Implementation Details
>>> ==
>>> 
>>> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
>>> 
>>> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL since
>> that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
>>> ** The document reference
>>> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to
>> “view"
>>> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query
>> string
>>> 
>>> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference
>> (EntityResourceReference to be precise). However we don’t have any textual
>> representation of it ATM.
>>> 
>>> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> -Vincent
>>> 
>> 
>> 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Ecaterina Moraru (Valica)]

On Fri, Aug 18, 2017 at 5:00 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:

> I’ve created a design page for this at http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/
> bin/view/Proposal/ExtensionEntryPoints#Attachments
>
> And I’ve also proposed a new way to plug the entry point with the “Open”
> button.
>

Seems nice. Why is it a dropdown? what are the options?

Thanks,
Caty


>
> Let me know what you think.
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
>
> > On 14 Oct 2016, at 16:10, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> >
> > Hi devs,
> >
> > Problem
> > ===
> >
> > We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
> >
> > 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
> > - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a
> ConfigurableClass
> > - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
> >
> > 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel,
> the user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
> >
> > Proposal
> > 
> >
> > * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
> metadata
> > * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one)
> after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and
> be taken to the home page of the extension.
> >
> > This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
> >
> > Implementation Details
> > ==
> >
> > * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
> >
> > * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL since
> that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
> > ** The document reference
> > ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to
> “view"
> > ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query
> string
> >
> > This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference
> (EntityResourceReference to be precise). However we don’t have any textual
> representation of it ATM.
> >
> > WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
> >
> > Thanks
> > -Vincent
> >
>
>

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Vincent Massol]

I’ve created a design page for this at 
http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/ExtensionEntryPoints#Attachments

And I’ve also proposed a new way to plug the entry point with the “Open” button.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks
-Vincent


> On 14 Oct 2016, at 16:10, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> 
> Hi devs,
> 
> Problem
> ===
> 
> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
> 
> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension. 
> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a ConfigurableClass
> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
> 
> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel, the 
> user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
> 
> Proposal 
> 
> 
> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension metadata
> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one) after 
> having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and be taken 
> to the home page of the extension.
> 
> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
> 
> Implementation Details
> ==
> 
> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
> 
> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL since that 
> needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
> ** The document reference
> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to “view"
> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query string
> 
> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference (EntityResourceReference 
> to be precise). However we don’t have any textual representation of it ATM.
> 
> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
> 
> Thanks
> -Vincent
> 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Marius Dumitru Florea]

There is also http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-9714 . It's not clear from
the title, but the point is to have a tab that shows the tree of pages that
have been installed (or that would be installed).

Thanks,
Marius

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 5:10 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:

> Hi devs,
>
> Problem
> ===
>
> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
>
> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a ConfigurableClass
> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
>
> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel, the
> user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
>
> Proposal
> 
>
> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
> metadata
> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one)
> after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and
> be taken to the home page of the extension.
>
> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
>
> Implementation Details
> ==
>
> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
>
> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL since
> that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
> ** The document reference
> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to
> “view"
> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query
> string
>
> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference
> (EntityResourceReference to be precise). However we don’t have any textual
> representation of it ATM.
>
> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> ___
> devs mailing list
> devs@xwiki.org
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>
___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Ecaterina Moraru (Valica)]

So several needs we need to satisfy (the below is just my vision):

- EM: when we install the extension it should be listed as installed
- App Index: if the extension is an app, it should be also found there
- App Bar: if the extension is an app and is intended for daily usage (or
if it was created locally by the user), could be listed automatically there
- Create step: if the app provides a template provider, it should be listed
in the create step
-- Templates: Admins will be able to configure the Templates from
Administrations
- Macros Index: if the extension is a macro or if the app provides macros,
they should be listed in the Macros Index (currently the XWiki.WikiMacros,
but in the future located in the Macros.WebHome). Admins will be able to
manage macros from here.
-- Editor macros: if the extension is a macro it should be listed in
CKEditor in the macros section (in the appropriate category)
- Page Administration: if the extension has some configuration intended for
normal users it could integrate it's configuration inside the Page
Administration
- Administration: if the extension needs global configuration options it
should provide a configurable class (and a category) and have it listed in
the Administration
- other?

So as general rules:
- Extensions: are managed/listed by EM, configured in Administration
- Applications: managed by App Index (we would need livetable + actions),
configured in Administration or Page Administration
- Macros: managed by Macros Index, configured where?
- Templates: managed by Templates Index ? :)
- Skins?
- CT?
- etc?

So the main problem is that we are missing pieces and also we don't have a
clear definition of what an application means and of what it's supposed to
provide (since most of the entities are optional). Since some entities are
optional is hard to make rules, so it's case by case. Also we have
inconsistencies in namings, displays and approaches for different types of
extensions.

Not sure what is the conclusion with the above listing, since I don't quite
have one. I was trying to gather some patterns.

The entry point for the Homepage in the EM is nice as idea. I don't think
is complete, since some apps will need to list also the configuration entry
point.

The only problem is that only Administrators will take advantage of it. We
need solutions also for end-users with listings in Indexes.

Also how do we know if the entry point is intended for Admins or Users (in
order to reuse it in AppIndex)?

But the questions still remains:
- what do we put in EM? (all)
- what do we list in *Index?
- what goes in AppBar?
- who provides configurations? and how do we group those configurations by
category? and how do we let the user know some also provide page
configurations?

Thanks,
Caty


On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 11:20 AM, Guillaume Delhumeau <
guillaume.delhum...@xwiki.com> wrote:

> I like this idea.
>
> Note: it could be implemented as an XObject having an "extensionId" field,
> so that we don't touch pom.xml. It's more the XWiki-way IMO.
>
> 2016-10-17 8:40 GMT+02:00 Alexandru Cotiuga :
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > I am in favour of this proposal since I expressed few months ago the need
> > of a link in the EM UI to easily access the extension's homepage.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Alex
> >
> > On Sun, Oct 16, 2016 at 3:12 AM, Eduard Moraru 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 6:37 PM, Vincent Massol 
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > > On 15 Oct 2016, at 13:30, Eduard Moraru 
> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > >
> > > > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Vincent Massol <
> vinc...@massol.net>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >>
> > > > >>> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne <
> > thomas.morta...@xwiki.com
> > > >
> > > > >> wrote:
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that
> > > only
> > > > >>> make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
> > > > >>> implemented as a xobject as usual.
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension
> UI.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application
> > > panel
> > > > >>> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
> > > > >>
> > > > >> It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation.
> > > > Apparently
> > > > >> I failed to explain the problem correctly.
> > > > >>
> > > > >> I’ll give more details:
> > > > >> * You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass
> (but
> > > you
> > > > >> don’t know that as a user)
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > I would say that an application would need both and Entry Point
> (i.e.
> > > > > homepage)
> > > >
> > > > I’d say this is optional. It would a pain to always mandate this. For
> > > > example the LDAP Application only 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Guillaume Delhumeau]

I like this idea.

Note: it could be implemented as an XObject having an "extensionId" field,
so that we don't touch pom.xml. It's more the XWiki-way IMO.

2016-10-17 8:40 GMT+02:00 Alexandru Cotiuga :

> Hi,
>
> I am in favour of this proposal since I expressed few months ago the need
> of a link in the EM UI to easily access the extension's homepage.
>
> Thanks,
> Alex
>
> On Sun, Oct 16, 2016 at 3:12 AM, Eduard Moraru 
> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 6:37 PM, Vincent Massol 
> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > > On 15 Oct 2016, at 13:30, Eduard Moraru 
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Vincent Massol 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>
> > > >>> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne <
> thomas.morta...@xwiki.com
> > >
> > > >> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that
> > only
> > > >>> make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
> > > >>> implemented as a xobject as usual.
> > > >>
> > > >> Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension UI.
> > > >>
> > > >>> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application
> > panel
> > > >>> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
> > > >>
> > > >> It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation.
> > > Apparently
> > > >> I failed to explain the problem correctly.
> > > >>
> > > >> I’ll give more details:
> > > >> * You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass (but
> > you
> > > >> don’t know that as a user)
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > > I would say that an application would need both and Entry Point (i.e.
> > > > homepage)
> > >
> > > I’d say this is optional. It would a pain to always mandate this. For
> > > example the LDAP Application only provides an Admin UI (it only helps
> to
> > > configure LDAP).
> > >
> > > So for me the entry point is another concept: it’s a link to a place
> > where
> > > the user should go to use the app. It can be pointing either to the
> app’s
> > > home page if there’s one, or the app’s Admin UI page.
> > >
> > > The goal of this thread is not to talk about home pages or Admin
> sections
> > > of extensions. It’s about discoverability and making it easy for users
> to
> > > start using any extension that is installed through the EM UI.
> > >
> >
> > AFAIU, we both agree on this :)
> >
> > What I wanted to point out was that an application/extension could also
> > provide its "settings", just like you have for Firefox addons, for
> example.
> > You should go to a list of installed extensions/apps (TBD) and see both a
> > way to access that extension/app, but also the way to configure it. IMO,
> we
> > should not reuse the entry point for configuration stuff (when there is
> no
> > UI, like the LDAP example). However, other apps/extensions could have
> both.
> >
> > IMO, it would be make more sense to talk about extensions here (i.e. at
> an
> > EM level), and not particularly about applications (i.e. along the lines
> of
> > Vincent's original suggestion). AFAIR, we now have extension categories.
> > Why bother with app panel UIXs or Application Descriptors, when EM
> already
> > provides all we need? We have the list of pages from EM and a way to
> > identify extensions that are of type "application". We now add the entry
> > point and the settings and we`re all good to go. It is up to the
> extension
> > to juggle the category, entry point and/or settings, if any of this
> applies
> > to it.
> >
> > Also, this would fit both EM's UI for an extension's details view, but
> also
> > the Application Index's listing of installed applications (which would
> just
> > be a listing only extensions of category "application", and maybe AWM
> apps
> > which are not extensions yet).
> >
> > No need to complicate things.
> >
> > -Eduard
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > > -Vincent
> > >
> > > > but also an optional Configuration section (i.e. administration
> > > > section defined by either a ConfigurableClass entry or even something
> > > > custom).
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Eduard
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> * After you’ve installed that extension, as a user, you don’t know
> > what
> > > to
> > > >> do. You need to go read the doc for the app to understand where you
> > > need to
> > > >> go to start using it.
> > > >>
> > > >> So I’m really convinced we need something better than what we have
> > now.
> > > >>
> > > >> Now after we move the Applications UIXP to the
> > > xwiki-platform-applications
> > > >> module, we could add an “entrypoint’ property in the UIXP but that
> > would
> > > >> mean that the Extension Manager UI module would depend on
> > > >> xwiki-platform-applications. We would need to decide if it’s ok. I
> > > think it
> > > >> is since it can be 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Alexandru Cotiuga]

Hi,

I am in favour of this proposal since I expressed few months ago the need
of a link in the EM UI to easily access the extension's homepage.

Thanks,
Alex

On Sun, Oct 16, 2016 at 3:12 AM, Eduard Moraru  wrote:

> On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 6:37 PM, Vincent Massol 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > > On 15 Oct 2016, at 13:30, Eduard Moraru  wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Vincent Massol 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >>> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne  >
> > >> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
> > >>>
> > >>> Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that
> only
> > >>> make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
> > >>> implemented as a xobject as usual.
> > >>
> > >> Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension UI.
> > >>
> > >>> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application
> panel
> > >>> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
> > >>
> > >> It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation.
> > Apparently
> > >> I failed to explain the problem correctly.
> > >>
> > >> I’ll give more details:
> > >> * You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass (but
> you
> > >> don’t know that as a user)
> > >>
> > >
> > > I would say that an application would need both and Entry Point (i.e.
> > > homepage)
> >
> > I’d say this is optional. It would a pain to always mandate this. For
> > example the LDAP Application only provides an Admin UI (it only helps to
> > configure LDAP).
> >
> > So for me the entry point is another concept: it’s a link to a place
> where
> > the user should go to use the app. It can be pointing either to the app’s
> > home page if there’s one, or the app’s Admin UI page.
> >
> > The goal of this thread is not to talk about home pages or Admin sections
> > of extensions. It’s about discoverability and making it easy for users to
> > start using any extension that is installed through the EM UI.
> >
>
> AFAIU, we both agree on this :)
>
> What I wanted to point out was that an application/extension could also
> provide its "settings", just like you have for Firefox addons, for example.
> You should go to a list of installed extensions/apps (TBD) and see both a
> way to access that extension/app, but also the way to configure it. IMO, we
> should not reuse the entry point for configuration stuff (when there is no
> UI, like the LDAP example). However, other apps/extensions could have both.
>
> IMO, it would be make more sense to talk about extensions here (i.e. at an
> EM level), and not particularly about applications (i.e. along the lines of
> Vincent's original suggestion). AFAIR, we now have extension categories.
> Why bother with app panel UIXs or Application Descriptors, when EM already
> provides all we need? We have the list of pages from EM and a way to
> identify extensions that are of type "application". We now add the entry
> point and the settings and we`re all good to go. It is up to the extension
> to juggle the category, entry point and/or settings, if any of this applies
> to it.
>
> Also, this would fit both EM's UI for an extension's details view, but also
> the Application Index's listing of installed applications (which would just
> be a listing only extensions of category "application", and maybe AWM apps
> which are not extensions yet).
>
> No need to complicate things.
>
> -Eduard
>
>
> >
> > Thanks
> > -Vincent
> >
> > > but also an optional Configuration section (i.e. administration
> > > section defined by either a ConfigurableClass entry or even something
> > > custom).
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Eduard
> > >
> > >
> > >> * After you’ve installed that extension, as a user, you don’t know
> what
> > to
> > >> do. You need to go read the doc for the app to understand where you
> > need to
> > >> go to start using it.
> > >>
> > >> So I’m really convinced we need something better than what we have
> now.
> > >>
> > >> Now after we move the Applications UIXP to the
> > xwiki-platform-applications
> > >> module, we could add an “entrypoint’ property in the UIXP but that
> would
> > >> mean that the Extension Manager UI module would depend on
> > >> xwiki-platform-applications. We would need to decide if it’s ok. I
> > think it
> > >> is since it can be considered as an application descriptor and I don’t
> > see
> > >> a problem of having the EM UI module know about application
> descriptors.
> > >>
> > >> WDYT?
> > >>
> > >> Thanks
> > >> Vincent
> > >>
> > >>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vincent Massol 
> > >> wrote:
> >  Hi devs,
> > 
> >  Problem
> >  ===
> > 
> >  We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
> > 
> >  1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
> 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Eduard Moraru]

On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 6:37 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:

>
> > On 15 Oct 2016, at 13:30, Eduard Moraru  wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Vincent Massol 
> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne 
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
> >>>
> >>> Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that only
> >>> make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
> >>> implemented as a xobject as usual.
> >>
> >> Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension UI.
> >>
> >>> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
> >>> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
> >>
> >> It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation.
> Apparently
> >> I failed to explain the problem correctly.
> >>
> >> I’ll give more details:
> >> * You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass (but you
> >> don’t know that as a user)
> >>
> >
> > I would say that an application would need both and Entry Point (i.e.
> > homepage)
>
> I’d say this is optional. It would a pain to always mandate this. For
> example the LDAP Application only provides an Admin UI (it only helps to
> configure LDAP).
>
> So for me the entry point is another concept: it’s a link to a place where
> the user should go to use the app. It can be pointing either to the app’s
> home page if there’s one, or the app’s Admin UI page.
>
> The goal of this thread is not to talk about home pages or Admin sections
> of extensions. It’s about discoverability and making it easy for users to
> start using any extension that is installed through the EM UI.
>

AFAIU, we both agree on this :)

What I wanted to point out was that an application/extension could also
provide its "settings", just like you have for Firefox addons, for example.
You should go to a list of installed extensions/apps (TBD) and see both a
way to access that extension/app, but also the way to configure it. IMO, we
should not reuse the entry point for configuration stuff (when there is no
UI, like the LDAP example). However, other apps/extensions could have both.

IMO, it would be make more sense to talk about extensions here (i.e. at an
EM level), and not particularly about applications (i.e. along the lines of
Vincent's original suggestion). AFAIR, we now have extension categories.
Why bother with app panel UIXs or Application Descriptors, when EM already
provides all we need? We have the list of pages from EM and a way to
identify extensions that are of type "application". We now add the entry
point and the settings and we`re all good to go. It is up to the extension
to juggle the category, entry point and/or settings, if any of this applies
to it.

Also, this would fit both EM's UI for an extension's details view, but also
the Application Index's listing of installed applications (which would just
be a listing only extensions of category "application", and maybe AWM apps
which are not extensions yet).

No need to complicate things.

-Eduard


>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> > but also an optional Configuration section (i.e. administration
> > section defined by either a ConfigurableClass entry or even something
> > custom).
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Eduard
> >
> >
> >> * After you’ve installed that extension, as a user, you don’t know what
> to
> >> do. You need to go read the doc for the app to understand where you
> need to
> >> go to start using it.
> >>
> >> So I’m really convinced we need something better than what we have now.
> >>
> >> Now after we move the Applications UIXP to the
> xwiki-platform-applications
> >> module, we could add an “entrypoint’ property in the UIXP but that would
> >> mean that the Extension Manager UI module would depend on
> >> xwiki-platform-applications. We would need to decide if it’s ok. I
> think it
> >> is since it can be considered as an application descriptor and I don’t
> see
> >> a problem of having the EM UI module know about application descriptors.
> >>
> >> WDYT?
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >> Vincent
> >>
> >>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vincent Massol 
> >> wrote:
>  Hi devs,
> 
>  Problem
>  ===
> 
>  We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
> 
>  1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
>  - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a
> >> ConfigurableClass
>  - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
> 
>  2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel,
> >> the user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
> 
>  Proposal
>  
> 
>  * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
> >> metadata
>  * Have the EM UI display the extension’s 

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Vincent Massol]

> On 15 Oct 2016, at 13:30, Eduard Moraru  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> 
>> 
>>> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne 
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
>>> 
>>> Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that only
>>> make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
>>> implemented as a xobject as usual.
>> 
>> Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension UI.
>> 
>>> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
>>> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
>> 
>> It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation. Apparently
>> I failed to explain the problem correctly.
>> 
>> I’ll give more details:
>> * You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass (but you
>> don’t know that as a user)
>> 
> 
> I would say that an application would need both and Entry Point (i.e.
> homepage)

I’d say this is optional. It would a pain to always mandate this. For example 
the LDAP Application only provides an Admin UI (it only helps to configure 
LDAP).

So for me the entry point is another concept: it’s a link to a place where the 
user should go to use the app. It can be pointing either to the app’s home page 
if there’s one, or the app’s Admin UI page.

The goal of this thread is not to talk about home pages or Admin sections of 
extensions. It’s about discoverability and making it easy for users to start 
using any extension that is installed through the EM UI.

Thanks
-Vincent

> but also an optional Configuration section (i.e. administration
> section defined by either a ConfigurableClass entry or even something
> custom).
> 
> Thanks,
> Eduard
> 
> 
>> * After you’ve installed that extension, as a user, you don’t know what to
>> do. You need to go read the doc for the app to understand where you need to
>> go to start using it.
>> 
>> So I’m really convinced we need something better than what we have now.
>> 
>> Now after we move the Applications UIXP to the xwiki-platform-applications
>> module, we could add an “entrypoint’ property in the UIXP but that would
>> mean that the Extension Manager UI module would depend on
>> xwiki-platform-applications. We would need to decide if it’s ok. I think it
>> is since it can be considered as an application descriptor and I don’t see
>> a problem of having the EM UI module know about application descriptors.
>> 
>> WDYT?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> Vincent
>> 
>>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vincent Massol 
>> wrote:
 Hi devs,
 
 Problem
 ===
 
 We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
 
 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
 - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a
>> ConfigurableClass
 - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
 
 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel,
>> the user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
 
 Proposal
 
 
 * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
>> metadata
 * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one)
>> after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and
>> be taken to the home page of the extension.
 
 This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
 
 Implementation Details
 ==
 
 * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
 
 * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL
>> since that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
 ** The document reference
 ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to
>> “view"
 ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query
>> string
 
 This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference
>> (EntityResourceReference to be precise). However we don’t have any textual
>> representation of it ATM.
 
 WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
 
 Thanks
 -Vincent

___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Eduard Moraru]

Hi,

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:

>
> > On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne 
> wrote:
> >
> > This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
> >
> > Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that only
> > make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
> > implemented as a xobject as usual.
>
> Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension UI.
>
> > For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
> > so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
>
> It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation. Apparently
> I failed to explain the problem correctly.
>
> I’ll give more details:
> * You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass (but you
> don’t know that as a user)
>

I would say that an application would need both and Entry Point (i.e.
homepage) but also an optional Configuration section (i.e. administration
section defined by either a ConfigurableClass entry or even something
custom).

Thanks,
Eduard


> * After you’ve installed that extension, as a user, you don’t know what to
> do. You need to go read the doc for the app to understand where you need to
> go to start using it.
>
> So I’m really convinced we need something better than what we have now.
>
> Now after we move the Applications UIXP to the xwiki-platform-applications
> module, we could add an “entrypoint’ property in the UIXP but that would
> mean that the Extension Manager UI module would depend on
> xwiki-platform-applications. We would need to decide if it’s ok. I think it
> is since it can be considered as an application descriptor and I don’t see
> a problem of having the EM UI module know about application descriptors.
>
> WDYT?
>
> Thanks
> Vincent
>
> > On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vincent Massol 
> wrote:
> >> Hi devs,
> >>
> >> Problem
> >> ===
> >>
> >> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
> >>
> >> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
> >> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a
> ConfigurableClass
> >> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
> >>
> >> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel,
> the user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
> >>
> >> Proposal
> >> 
> >>
> >> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension
> metadata
> >> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one)
> after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and
> be taken to the home page of the extension.
> >>
> >> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
> >>
> >> Implementation Details
> >> ==
> >>
> >> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
> >>
> >> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL
> since that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
> >> ** The document reference
> >> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to
> “view"
> >> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query
> string
> >>
> >> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference
> (EntityResourceReference to be precise). However we don’t have any textual
> representation of it ATM.
> >>
> >> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >> -Vincent
> >>
> >> ___
> >> devs mailing list
> >> devs@xwiki.org
> >> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Thomas Mortagne
> > ___
> > devs mailing list
> > devs@xwiki.org
> > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>
> ___
> devs mailing list
> devs@xwiki.org
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>
___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Vincent Massol]

Hi Paul,

> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:05, Paul Libbrecht  wrote:
> 
> 
> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne  wrote:
>> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
>> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.
> 
> Well, that would be a job for extensions.xwiki.org:
> - prioritise entry-points in search results
> - display appropriately that some extensions are of a given type 
> (entry-point, dependency, … macro?)

My use case/need isn’t related to e.x.o but to one's XWiki instance.

Thanks
-Vincent

> 
> paul
> 
___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Vincent Massol]

> On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne  wrote:
> 
> This does not make any sense at general Extension level.
> 
> Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that only
> make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
> implemented as a xobject as usual.

Yes, it could be implemented as a UIXP/XObject of the Extension UI.

> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.

It’s not enough at all. That was my main point and explanation. Apparently I 
failed to explain the problem correctly.

I’ll give more details:
* You install a XAR extension that provides a ConfigurableClass (but you don’t 
know that as a user)
* After you’ve installed that extension, as a user, you don’t know what to do. 
You need to go read the doc for the app to understand where you need to go to 
start using it.

So I’m really convinced we need something better than what we have now.

Now after we move the Applications UIXP to the xwiki-platform-applications 
module, we could add an “entrypoint’ property in the UIXP but that would mean 
that the Extension Manager UI module would depend on 
xwiki-platform-applications. We would need to decide if it’s ok. I think it is 
since it can be considered as an application descriptor and I don’t see a 
problem of having the EM UI module know about application descriptors.

WDYT?

Thanks
Vincent

> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:
>> Hi devs,
>> 
>> Problem
>> ===
>> 
>> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
>> 
>> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
>> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a ConfigurableClass
>> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
>> 
>> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel, the 
>> user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
>> 
>> Proposal
>> 
>> 
>> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension 
>> metadata
>> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one) 
>> after having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and be 
>> taken to the home page of the extension.
>> 
>> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
>> 
>> Implementation Details
>> ==
>> 
>> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
>> 
>> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL since 
>> that needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
>> ** The document reference
>> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to “view"
>> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query 
>> string
>> 
>> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference (EntityResourceReference 
>> to be precise). However we don’t have any textual representation of it ATM.
>> 
>> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>> 
>> ___
>> devs mailing list
>> devs@xwiki.org
>> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Thomas Mortagne
> ___
> devs mailing list
> devs@xwiki.org
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Paul Libbrecht]

On 14 Oct 2016, at 19:03, Thomas Mortagne  wrote:
> For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
> so I don't really see the point of adding something else.

Well, that would be a job for extensions.xwiki.org:
- prioritise entry-points in search results
- display appropriately that some extensions are of a given type (entry-point, 
dependency, … macro?)

paul


signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs

Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Entry point for Extensions

[Thomas Mortagne]

This does not make any sense at general Extension level.

Could be custom metadata that apply to XAR extensions. Since that only
make sense for XAR extensions I would prefer to have this be
implemented as a xobject as usual.

For me this is already the job of the uix we use for application panel
so I don't really see the point of adding something else.

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vincent Massol  wrote:
> Hi devs,
>
> Problem
> ===
>
> We have 2 issues right now when installing an extension in XWiki:
>
> 1) It’s not clear where is the entry point of that extension.
> - Example1: an app that is only for admins and only has a ConfigurableClass
> - Example2: an app that provides a macro and doesn’t have a UI
>
> 2) Even when an extension registers itself in the Applications Panel, the 
> user still need to refresh the page or navigate away to see it.
>
> Proposal
> 
>
> * Introduce the concept of Entry point (a.k.a home page) in Extension metadata
> * Have the EM UI display the extension’s entry point (when there’s one) after 
> having installed the extension so that the user can click on it and be taken 
> to the home page of the extension.
>
> This would make extensions more discoverable IMO.
>
> Implementation Details
> ==
>
> * Some maven extension metadata properties in pom.xml
>
> * A format to represent an entry point. It shouldn’t be a full URL since that 
> needs to be computed at runtime. Basically it should contain:
> ** The document reference
> ** The action to use (view, admin, etc) - optional, should default to “view"
> ** The query string to use - optional, should default to an empty query string
>
> This corresponds to the notion of ResourceReference (EntityResourceReference 
> to be precise). However we don’t have any textual representation of it ATM.
>
> WDYT? Good idea? Bad idea?
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> ___
> devs mailing list
> devs@xwiki.org
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs



-- 
Thomas Mortagne
___
devs mailing list
devs@xwiki.org
http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs