Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Monday, 1 July 2013 at 03:26:22 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 22:49:41 +, Graham St Jack wrote: Fixed the problem, and also: * split bub.d up into several smaller files, * added a Makefile to bootstrap the building of bub, and * added a bub.cfg and Bubfile as a trivial example of how to use bub. Please add an install: target to the Makefile. Thank you.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
Hooo, a self-contained build tool? That's cool. 1. Are arbitrary make-style commands supported? For example, on windows one may want to compile resources. Resources consist of a declaration .rc file, icons and manifest files, which are compiled into .res file, though only .rc file is passed to the resource compiler, but other files are still dependencies of course. 2. How to do heterogeneous linking? Again on windows an executable can be linked from code .obj's, resource .res and module definition .def: gcc main.o r.res mytool.def -o mytool.exe 3. Probably not actual for big projects. Can build workspase be created automatically by bub instead of explicitly by bub-config... for some default mode? 4. If a build server does builds from scratch, shouldn't it be better for performance to compile several source files in one command? Also applies to user builds: when one wants to install a project from source, he usually does it only once and from scratch. Have you any idea, how this affects compilation speed of c, c++ and d? Though dmd frontend can go out of memory.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 22:49:41 +, Graham St Jack wrote: On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 07:44:07 +0200, Rob T wrote: This build system seems to be very well suited for building complex large projects in a sensible way. I successfully tested the example build on Debian linux. I will definitely explore this further using one of my own projects. One issue I immediately ran into, is when I run bub incorrectly it hangs after writing the bail message to console. ctrl-c does not kill it, and I have to run a process kill commandto terminate. Seems it gets stuck in doBailer() while(true) loop, but I only glanced at the source quickly before posting back here. --rt I recently made a big change to the inter-thread communication code, and there are a few problems there still. I will look into it. Fixed the problem, and also: * split bub.d up into several smaller files, * added a Makefile to bootstrap the building of bub, and * added a bub.cfg and Bubfile as a trivial example of how to use bub.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 00:59:15 +0200, John Colvin wrote: On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 00:10:37 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: Having side-by-side comparisons of D against bash scripts and C++ modules had the effect of turning almost all the other team members into D advocates. Any chance we could know what team this is? (Sorry if this is common knowledge) It is the development team at my previous workplace. I haven't asked them for permission, so I would rather not say who they are. David Bryant (the previous poster) was a member of that team though, and he will be happy to provide details.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Saturday, 29 June 2013 at 07:54:30 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 00:59:15 +0200, John Colvin wrote: On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 00:10:37 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: Having side-by-side comparisons of D against bash scripts and C++ modules had the effect of turning almost all the other team members into D advocates. Any chance we could know what team this is? (Sorry if this is common knowledge) It is the development team at my previous workplace. I haven't asked them for permission, so I would rather not say who they are. David Bryant (the previous poster) was a member of that team though, and he will be happy to provide details. I am still part of that team. We still use the early predecessor of bub to build several projects from a large C++ codebase, but I am looking forward to switching to bub at the end of the current project. For example, one project uses ~2000 cc/h files containing ~390,000 lines (before any code generation). After a successfull build, running the build again takes about 2s to figure out that everything is up to date. Knowing both build tools, I expect that time to remain about the same after the switch to bub. Yes, I have become a D advocate. Our production code is still mostly C++, but a large part of our system-level testing is now written in D (~15,000 lines). Bash scripts are becoming rarer too. :)
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
Am Thu, 27 Jun 2013 10:26:01 +0200 schrieb eles e...@eles.com: On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 07:32:32 UTC, eles wrote: CTRL-Z works for me. I think it expects input. Ignore it. It just suspends it. You might want to check how many programs you thought to have killed like this so far in your running session. It might eat up your RAM. -- Marco
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 23:03:40 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: This isn't a build tool for everyone, but it really does make a big difference on big projects. Well I'm noticing some interesting concepts, such as being able to associate an include or import file with the library to link in, so that it gets done automatically simply by using the include/import file, great idea assuming I understood that correctly. One thing you may want to consider, or maybe this is already possible, is add the ability to optionally specify something like *.d so that all .d files get included from a folder, rather than have to always individually specify them manually. Also more concise documentation with clearer examples would be invaluable. I'm currently unsure if I need to restructure my existing project folders to fit bub or if bub can be configured to fit my existing projects. --rt
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
How does this build tool handle projects with multiple executables ? For example the util-linux package contains dozens of utilities or a project might have a CLI and a GUI version. Or there might be slight alterations like setting a version or debug flag: -debug=threading -version=demo -- Marco
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:05:08 +0200, Rob T wrote: On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 23:03:40 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: This isn't a build tool for everyone, but it really does make a big difference on big projects. Well I'm noticing some interesting concepts, such as being able to associate an include or import file with the library to link in, so that it gets done automatically simply by using the include/import file, great idea assuming I understood that correctly. That is correct. A side effect of assigning headers to libraries is that bub can then enforce the visibility rules and give understandable error messages almost instantaneously when you transgress them. Another consequence is that the compiler only needs to be given a few -I directives because you aren't using them to control visibility. One thing you may want to consider, or maybe this is already possible, is add the ability to optionally specify something like *.d so that all .d files get included from a folder, rather than have to always individually specify them manually. A useful idea. I will add it to the list. Also more concise documentation with clearer examples would be invaluable. I'm currently unsure if I need to restructure my existing project folders to fit bub or if bub can be configured to fit my existing projects. Documentation is always tough to pitch at the right level. I will see what I can do. Whether you need to restructure your project depends on whether you have already thought about dependencies and arranged things accordingly. My suggestion is to extend the example a bit and get a feel for how it works, then think about what that means for your project.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:28:03 +0200, Marco Leise wrote: How does this build tool handle projects with multiple executables ? For example the util-linux package contains dozens of utilities or a project might have a CLI and a GUI version. Or there might be slight alterations like setting a version or debug flag: -debug=threading -version=demo A central theme in bottom-up-build is to produce any number of build artifacts: libraries, executables, tests, etc. Different versions are catered for with: bub-config --mode=whatever build-dir The mode is described in your configuration file, and results in a build directory set up specifically for that mode. If you want multiple modes, use multiple build directories. Take a look in example/bub.cfg.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
Am Fri, 28 Jun 2013 07:03:27 + (UTC) schrieb Graham St Jack graham.stj...@internode.on.net: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:28:03 +0200, Marco Leise wrote: How does this build tool handle projects with multiple executables ? For example the util-linux package contains dozens of utilities or a project might have a CLI and a GUI version. Or there might be slight alterations like setting a version or debug flag: -debug=threading -version=demo A central theme in bottom-up-build is to produce any number of build artifacts: libraries, executables, tests, etc. Different versions are catered for with: bub-config --mode=whatever build-dir The mode is described in your configuration file, and results in a build directory set up specifically for that mode. If you want multiple modes, use multiple build directories. Take a look in example/bub.cfg. Sounds good! -- Marco
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On 27/06/13 09:40, Graham St Jack wrote: Bottom-up-build (bub) is a build system written in D which supports building of large C/C++/D projects. I've worked with Graham in the past and can attest to bub's coolness. My pet project 'terminol' is about a month away from an initial release, but given that is uses the bub build system, and that Graham has made his announcement, it could be interest now to anyone wishing to see a small project that uses bub: https://github.com/bagnose/terminol Briefly: terminol is a lightweight terminal emulator for Linux, essentially aimed at being a rxvt-unicode refresh. It should checkout, build fine with bub, but so far I'm the only one who ever has. I'm sorry, it's not written in D (it's written in C++11) but I am a huge fan of D. Having worked with GNU Make, Jam and autotools (and looked closely at several others) I find bub very pleasant to use indeed. I won't repeat the benefits that Graham already espoused. I think the focus with bub thus far has been to develop its core approaches: unifying C/C++/D, bottom-up-build, library inference, circularity detection, etc. As such, it is a little unfurnished at the edges. For example, bub does not have a defined scheme for determining things like: what libraries does the user have available and what are their peculiarities (versions, location, etc). At the moment the user may need to do a bit of bub.cfg customisation of their own to make things work. Those things are the next hurdle and will be interesting to discuss. However I think bub already demonstrates the promise of greatness and is worth taking a good look at. David Bryant
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 00:10:37 UTC, Graham St Jack wrote: Having side-by-side comparisons of D against bash scripts and C++ modules had the effect of turning almost all the other team members into D advocates. Any chance we could know what team this is? (Sorry if this is common knowledge)
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 05:44:16 UTC, Rob T wrote: One issue I immediately ran into, is when I run bub incorrectly it hangs after writing the bail message to console. ctrl-c does not kill it, and I have to run a process kill commandto terminate. CTRL-Z works for me. I think it expects input.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Thursday, 27 June 2013 at 07:32:32 UTC, eles wrote: CTRL-Z works for me. I think it expects input. Ignore it. It just suspends it.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
Hm, bub.. Sounds like it should work with 'dub' nicely ;) Looks promising and I'd really love to see some build tool other then rdmd getting to the point it can be called standard. Makefile's sometimes are just too inconvenient.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On 6/26/13 5:10 PM, Graham St Jack wrote: Bottom-up-build (bub) is a build system written in D which supports building of large C/C++/D projects. http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/1h6p2w/bottomupbuild_a_build_system_for_ccd/ Andrei
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 07:44:07 +0200, Rob T wrote: This build system seems to be very well suited for building complex large projects in a sensible way. I successfully tested the example build on Debian linux. I will definitely explore this further using one of my own projects. One issue I immediately ran into, is when I run bub incorrectly it hangs after writing the bail message to console. ctrl-c does not kill it, and I have to run a process kill commandto terminate. Seems it gets stuck in doBailer() while(true) loop, but I only glanced at the source quickly before posting back here. --rt I recently made a big change to the inter-thread communication code, and there are a few problems there still. I will look into it.
Re: Announcing bottom-up-build - a build system for C/C++/D
This build system seems to be very well suited for building complex large projects in a sensible way. I successfully tested the example build on Debian linux. I will definitely explore this further using one of my own projects. One issue I immediately ran into, is when I run bub incorrectly it hangs after writing the bail message to console. ctrl-c does not kill it, and I have to run a process kill commandto terminate. Seems it gets stuck in doBailer() while(true) loop, but I only glanced at the source quickly before posting back here. --rt
