Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
Hi, :-) On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 12:20, Sonic4Spuds wrote: > "productivity software for home and office" +2 David Nelson -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
On 11/24/2010 03:47 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: On 11/24/2010 12:27 PM, David Nelson wrote: Hi, :-) On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 01:27, Carl Symons wrote: I use LibreOffice, but I don't use an "office productivity solution" I'd prefer "personal productivity software" or "personal productivity package"... 0.2 cents. David Nelson How about "productivity software for home and office"? +1 Sounds professional. I think that a Professional feel is something that many opensource projects lack. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Request: Installation Instructions
Hi, :-) I think the issue of difficulty of installing LibO on Linux is not going to last long... I'm sure that as soon as a stable release of LibO is out then Linux distribs are going to add it to their repos, and their software installation tools (such as Ubuntu's Software Center). All the talk of the "difficulty" of owning/using a Linux system is really a thing of the past... distribs such as Fedora Core and Ubuntu have made this OS usable even for non-experts (and I only mention FC and Ubuntu because their the ones I've used). In any case, I'll draft that how-to over the next day or two and file a "bug"... +1 for everyone mentioning the need for courtesy, friendliness, understanding and open-mindedness when communicating on the lists - especially when dealing with the end user support, but also as a general principle of behavior within the project. David Nelson -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On 11/24/2010 7:00 AM, Michael Wheatland wrote: On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Charles Marcus wrote: Does Drupal Forums allow one to 'subscribe' (get email notifications) to both Main Topics/Sections as well as individual threads? The Drupal messaging/notification system can provide subscriptions and mail back responses for ANY part of the site. Topics, Sections, Threads, Areas of the site, Even every post across the site in a specific language to go to extremes. If you want a subscription available for something that is not available when the Drupal site goes Beta then you can request it and it will be added easily, but we will try to anticipate all possible use cases. The input and output of the system is fully configurable. You can even get your subscriptions sent to you in Twitter, Facebook or Jabber (Google Chat) messages if you want. Plug and play really. Michael Wheatland Drupal is sounding really good! From what you're saying, it seems that whatever mode of communication they choose, somebody who asks a question can be fully interactive with the community in things such as answering follow-up questions, getting additional clarification, and so on, without having to make commitments to receive all the mail (or a digest) for a list or log in to a forum. The lack of this kind of continuity is what I feel has been a "fatal flaw" in the handling of questions from unsubscribed users -- for instance, with the often-suggested modification of the Reply To header to include the unsubscribed user. (In that case, for example, only replies made directly to the original post would be sent to the unsub; everything else requires special handling based on the knowledge that the user is not subscribed.) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: functionality issues discussions
On 11/23/2010 11:16 PM, Marwan Gedeon wrote: > I'm sorry if asking this here is inappropriate, I couldn't find the > answer in FAQ, neither another mailing list dedicated for that purpose: > what is the proper place/people to resort to, in order to report/resolve > issues with current LibreOffice's beta release? Is bugzilla > (https://bugs.freedesktop.org/) my best shot here? > Thank you > > Check via: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=libreoffice to see if it's already been reported. If not, please go ahead and file a new bug. I'd also recommend checking the users list and the dev list to see if it's been reported there as well. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Language DEB-packs should be uploaded to the repository
One of my pet peeves with the LibO repository is that the language packs must be downloaded separately - and to make it worse, LibO will refuse to run until the language pack for my language (Spanish in my case) is downloaded and installed. Wouldn't it be better to upload the packs to the repository? - Carlos Solís -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On 11/23/2010 8:07 PM, Marc Paré wrote: Hi Robert et al: Here is the information from Jean Hollis Weber from the documentation team. Jean is one of the senior leads on the documentation team. == Marc, thanks for passing this on. Some factual info regarding the OOo user guides: 1) The ODTs of the OOo user guides are available as well as the PDF versions. At one point we were not allowed to put the ODTs on the main OOo website because of license differences, but there are links to where one can get them. 2) In most cases, the PDFs are *smaller* in filesize than the ODTs. 3) The PDFs of the OOo Writer Guide and the other user guides in their current form (for V3.2) are NOT formatted for 5X7, although at least one older version of those books was made available in the PDF used for the pre-printed guide sold through Lulu, which is close to that size. The current are formatted for reading on screen and for printing 2-up on A4/US paper. After complaints from users who wanted to print them, the draft V3.3 guides (and the first draft of the LibO guides) have been reformatted for printing on A4/US paper size. 4) OOo provides the user guides in chapters as well as full books, because we know that often people want only a subset of the information. 5) Surely the answer to "if you are a new user, this is the one you want" is the book titled _Getting Started with OOo_. Having said all that, I agree that improvements could (and should) be made. I think the current "Getting Started with OOo" book, at over 350 pages, is much too long. My original intention was to have it no more than 200 pages, but it grew... people kept adding things and it's hard to decide -- or agree upon -- what to cut out. Turning some of the chapters, particularly the chapter on Writer, into stand-alone books of about 100 pages, is a good idea. Expand a bit on what's there and include pointers to more detailed into in the full Writer Guide, which runs around 500 pages. Aside: I would like to split the Writer Guide into two books, one with basic info and one with more advanced topics like master documents and forms. The book of basic info does need to include the basics of style use, because styles are fundamental to so many features of Writer. Shipping a user guide with the product is a good idea, but runs into the practical difficulty of getting stuff written/updated in time. The docs always run behind, mainly because there are not enough people to work on them. --Jean As well, other personal emails suggested that adding it to the download would probably not be acceptable, for the same reasons discussed before. Cheers Marc I'm just trying to catch up with this discussion, but how about if the installation process included an offer to download documentation, and provided some options about that (e.g., basic introductory material for Writer/Calc/Impress/..., the current Getting Started, the full guides, or whatever) as well as links to the online documents? If this material could be captured for later use, too (perhaps as a Documentation option in the Start menu or the equivalent), that would be good. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Request: Installation Instructions
On 11/24/2010 04:56 PM, Robert Derman wrote: >..snip. > I haven't followed this particular thread very closely, but nevertheless > one thing seems to be appearant, and that is why Linux only has a few > percent of the PC OS market and Windows has the vast majority of it. > Most people who use computers are not computer experts, or computer > hobyists, and don't want to be, for them a computer is a tool they need > to use in order to acomplish what they need to. Learning how to do > command line entry is not something they want to do. Perhaps they > actually have a life, a spouse, kids other things they want to spend > their time on. They want programs that install by clicking on Install, > Next, Next, Next, Finish. As long as Linux doesn't work that way, they > will stay away from it. > > Most people don't actually buy Windows, it comes installed on the laptop > they buy, so why would they want to bother with an operating system that > they have to install? Especially if it isn't easy to install. And why > would they want to bother with applications that don't install easily? > I suspect that this is why most copies of OOo and in the future LO will > be Windows compatible versions. > Robert, I agree with your statement, as far as it goes, but there is another factor that is also involved. There are as yet, as far as I know, no schools that teach Linux. The closest is those colleges and universities that teach UNIX which, at the command line, is very similar. College and University are expensive, and many people, unless they are intending to go into computers in some professional capacity, just can't afford that expense. Many people don't know what man pages are or how to use them. And for those that do, the man pages are about as informative as a Microsoft help file: absolutely correct information that provides no real guidance or help. [Insert old joke about the helicopter pilot and the Microsoft campus here] That leaves those who ARE willing to learn in a difficult position, unless there are helpful friends around that can provide the guidance they need. Very often we, and I am included in that small population, not only don't know the answers to how to do something, we don't even know the questions (which is why I tell people that I'm a perpetual n00bie. Despite what I DO know, there's still too much that I don't and don't even know how to ask about). For Linux purists here's a clue: help your fellow person. Don't assume that they have to know everything in order to use a Linux system, but provide them with the guidance they need so they can. Craig Tyche -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] CD/DVD distribution
Hi Marc, *, Marc Paré schrieb: > Le 2010-11-24 08:58, Friedrich Strohmaier a écrit : [.. LibO disk image work setup ..] >> We'll come back here, but as far as I see, we pretty unlikely will >> succeed to manage releasing an international (english) version of >> the first stable LibO in time. [..] > Could you make an announcement when you are up and running on this > list Shure. Remember: "Offer for hands willing to help" :o)) > or even better on the marketing mailist? Good Idea. :o)) > I think it would be interesting for everyone to know about your work. > I will just post this short discussion on the marketing list so that > the marketing team can refer to it later. Thanks. Gruß/regards -- Friedrich Libreoffice-Box http://libreofficebox.org/ LibreOffice and more on CD/DVD images (german version already started) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Request: Installation Instructions
..snip. Whether it's user friendly or not depends on the user. If he/she/it is open to learning a *few* new things, it is extremely user friendly. There is, however, a segment of the population that actively resists learning *anything*. That's why: the more user-friendly, the more Libò will spread throughout the world... I have a problem when it comes to rewarding people that refuse to make an effort to learn. Notice, I said "refuse", not "incapable of" The same question is always asked in educational circles. We never know under which circumstances the user is here, nor do we know of the level of comprehension, reading abilities, cultural differences, linguistic abilities, whether they are here by clicking on the wrong link etc. There could be many reasons why users may be incapable of learning steps. There are just too many variables. The best and most practical way is to help them out. The bottom line is that we would like every type of individuals to use our office suite and to be happy with it. I have yet to be on one "help" list or help forum where this question has not been asked and the best approach has always been to be courteous and help out. It always leave the user grateful and satisfied. Let's not assume that they can't/refuse"won't make an effort to learn and just help them out. After all, they are here for help. If there are too many of these individuals on our help lists, then I would say that our help list has internal problems that need to be addressed. This would be more of our problem than theirs. Cheers Marc I haven't followed this particular thread very closely, but nevertheless one thing seems to be appearant, and that is why Linux only has a few percent of the PC OS market and Windows has the vast majority of it. Most people who use computers are not computer experts, or computer hobyists, and don't want to be, for them a computer is a tool they need to use in order to acomplish what they need to. Learning how to do command line entry is not something they want to do. Perhaps they actually have a life, a spouse, kids other things they want to spend their time on. They want programs that install by clicking on Install, Next, Next, Next, Finish. As long as Linux doesn't work that way, they will stay away from it. Most people don't actually buy Windows, it comes installed on the laptop they buy, so why would they want to bother with an operating system that they have to install? Especially if it isn't easy to install. And why would they want to bother with applications that don't install easily? I suspect that this is why most copies of OOo and in the future LO will be Windows compatible versions. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
On 11/24/2010 12:27 PM, David Nelson wrote: Hi, :-) On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 01:27, Carl Symons wrote: I use LibreOffice, but I don't use an "office productivity solution" I'd prefer "personal productivity software" or "personal productivity package"... 0.2 cents. David Nelson How about "productivity software for home and office"? -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Request: Installation Instructions
Le 2010-11-24 16:20, Robert Holtzman a écrit : On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 12:30:38PM +0100, Valter Mura wrote: In data lunedì 22 novembre 2010 22:28:54, Robert Holtzman ha scritto: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 06:50:36PM +0100, Rene Engelhard wrote: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 03:52:41PM +, Lee Hyde wrote: original poster is making. Windows users are presented with a single setup.exe while debian/ubuntu users are presented with a multitude of individual .deb files. This is not user friendly! Nonsense. dpkg -i *.deb is user friendly, despite what you want to claim. That graphical tools might make it difficult is no argument. ..snip. Whether it's user friendly or not depends on the user. If he/she/it is open to learning a *few* new things, it is extremely user friendly. There is, however, a segment of the population that actively resists learning *anything*. That's why: the more user-friendly, the more Libò will spread throughout the world... I have a problem when it comes to rewarding people that refuse to make an effort to learn. Notice, I said "refuse", not "incapable of" The same question is always asked in educational circles. We never know under which circumstances the user is here, nor do we know of the level of comprehension, reading abilities, cultural differences, linguistic abilities, whether they are here by clicking on the wrong link etc. There could be many reasons why users may be incapable of learning steps. There are just too many variables. The best and most practical way is to help them out. The bottom line is that we would like every type of individuals to use our office suite and to be happy with it. I have yet to be on one "help" list or help forum where this question has not been asked and the best approach has always been to be courteous and help out. It always leave the user grateful and satisfied. Let's not assume that they can't/refuse"won't make an effort to learn and just help them out. After all, they are here for help. If there are too many of these individuals on our help lists, then I would say that our help list has internal problems that need to be addressed. This would be more of our problem than theirs. Cheers Marc -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: changed footers of all documentfoundation and libreoffice.org mailing lists
Le 2010-11-24 06:17, Andrea Pescetti a écrit : Sigrid Carrera wrote: 2010/11/24 Florian Effenberger: What do others think? I still clearly favor the non-poetic version ;) I have no real preference. But in my opinion, the "non-poetic" version looks to me more "professional". So I vote for this one. I will very rarely get to read that line, being it the last line of the standard message appendix, but I'd favor the "professional" (and by this I mean "non-poetic") version too. Regards, Andrea. I vote with the professional version. Marc -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 12:30:38PM +0100, Valter Mura wrote: > In data lunedì 22 novembre 2010 22:28:54, Robert Holtzman ha scritto: > > > On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 06:50:36PM +0100, Rene Engelhard wrote: > > > On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 03:52:41PM +, Lee Hyde wrote: > > > > original poster is making. Windows users are presented with a single > > > > setup.exe while debian/ubuntu users are presented with a multitude of > > > > individual .deb files. This is not user friendly! > > > > > > Nonsense. dpkg -i *.deb is user friendly, despite what you want to claim. > > > That graphical tools might make it difficult is no argument. > > > >..snip. > > > > Whether it's user friendly or not depends on the user. If he/she/it is > > open to learning a *few* new things, it is extremely user friendly. > > There is, however, a segment of the population that actively resists > > learning *anything*. > > That's why: the more user-friendly, the more Libò will spread throughout the > world... I have a problem when it comes to rewarding people that refuse to make an effort to learn. Notice, I said "refuse", not "incapable of" -- Bob Holtzman Key ID: 8D549279 "If you think you're getting free lunch, check the price of the beer" -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
Hi Bernhard, René, Thanks for giving some guidance and explanation here, Bernhard. Bernhard Dippold wrote (24-11-10 21:24) Mentioning Ubuntu as an example here disqualifies you already. Please stop this kind of attitude immediately. Insulting others can't be the way to discuss *any* topic on our lists. I have the impression that René does mean this as a sort of technical determination, rather than a personal qualification. Used in this way, it is rather unusual, I guess and possibly hard to understand for the average reader. So a bit different wording surely would help. René, I would appreciate I you can give your view on this. Regards, Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
Le 2010-11-24 07:38, Michele Colagrossi a écrit : Hi Mr. Derman, each humans hate passwords :) And who does not have a too easy. I recommend PasswordSafe (or similar) from SourceForge.net. This programs help you to manage your passwords. Ciao Am 24.11.2010 13:06, schrieb Charles Marcus: On 2010-11-23 5:01 PM, Robert Derman wrote: I just have to respond to this, I hate forums or anything else that required the use of PASSWORDS!!! I already have 10 times too many passwords to remember or keep track of and I want absolutely NO more. Frankly I wish the entire computer and software industry would flush the whole idea of passwords down the loo and come up with something else entirely. www.passwordmaker.org Of course it requires Firefox... I also think it is a matter of education. I start teaching kids in grade 4 how to create safer passwords and we do role playing in class to see if we can figure out each others encryption methods. Once these kids reach grade 8 they are more informed on how to create more robust passwords. I'm the tech guy at our school and meet with grades 4-8 twice a year re: password use. Once the kids know how to create encrypted passwords, they tend to use fewer passwords and have an easier time changing or updating their passwords. Cheers Marc -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
Hi René, Rene Engelhard schrieb: On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 07:50:59AM -0600, Sonic4Spuds wrote: This is not the case, many people on debian based systems are new to linux. Linux Mint and Ubuntu both use debian as their base. These [...] are some of the best distros for new users, who usually have a fear of the terminal and typing command arguments. And their quality is bad. Even if it were - it depends on what you expect. Windows quality isn't the best either, but this doesn't mean that Windows or Ubuntu should be excluded from being a platform/distro where we invite people to test and use LibreOffice. LibreOffice is not the place to draw people to "true" Linux - it's about users and their needs. And if our Ubuntu users can be helped by providing a short "how-to install" this should definitely be considered as worth to be included in the product. Mentioning Ubuntu as an example here disqualifies you already. Please stop this kind of attitude immediately. Insulting others can't be the way to discuss *any* topic on our lists. You may have a strong opinion on Ubuntu quality, but this doesn't mean anything to your attitude against Sonic4Spuds (whatever his/her name might be). On a developer list you might expect on a certain degree of developer's background information, even if I don't think you can insist on it. But we're here on the main discuss list of LibreOffice. Our community doesn't consist of developers only, but of a great variety of different experts, supporters and people willing to help in one or another area. Everybody should try to stay friendly in his/her postings, re-read them before sending and decide to modify them (or not to send them at all) if they might attack others personally. Best regards Bernhard -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
Hi, :-) On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 01:27, Carl Symons wrote: > I use LibreOffice, but I don't use an "office productivity solution" I'd prefer "personal productivity software" or "personal productivity package"... 0.2 cents. David Nelson -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
On Wed, 2010-11-24 at 09:27 -0800, Carl Symons wrote: > I use LibreOffice, but I don't use an "office productivity solution" > (c&p'd from Mission). What's needed is a phrase that accurately and > succinctly provides a conceptual container for LibreOffice elements. > Something that connects for users. To me, "office productivity > solution" or "office suite" sound like overblown marketing (no offense > meant by that). I agree that the terms "office productivity solution" and "office suite" are problematic. But note that the vision/mission statements are not directed at the public, but to the project. That means clearness trumps catchiness. How the vision/mission statement and values as a whole or in aspects can be communicated to the public is a secondary issue. > "LibreOffice" already locates the products in the Office world. It may > be that people now associate "Office" with the kinds of tasks that > LibreOffice supports. But how about a student paper, a recipe > collection, and other activities that are not really done at or in an > office? Be it MS Office or any other office suite, the tools are used in other contexts as offices, no doubt. However, I would like to avoid pulling in multimedia authoring, scientific computing and enterprise-grade database management with a too broad statement ;) > How about just a simple statement of the LibreOffice components? > Suggestions below, none of which do the trick for me, but maybe a > trigger for more creative people... As mentioned, the statement should focus on the needs and wants to be addressed, not specific solution. Listing the components implies that they are the correct solutions as is. > LibreOffice Tools for Work > Software for writing, presenting and record-keeping > LibreOffice Collection > LibreOffice Tools for (the) People "writing, presenting and record-keeping" might hit what it actually is about pretty well. Thanks! -- Thorsten Wilms thorwil's design for free software: http://thorwil.wordpress.com/ -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
I don't care what its called.. I just want to to open a document so I can view and optionally ammed and even save it.. Simple as that for an enduser point of view. As long as its in the same format x-platform I'm happy I dont really care how its works, I just want an interface thats easy to install does what it says on the tin and done.. ta pete On 24 November 2010 17:27, Carl Symons wrote: > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:51 AM, Thorsten Wilms wrote: >> Hi! >> >> This only saw a little bit of discussion on the marketing list (after >> the first draft was met with silence here). >> >> I like the interpretation, that there is not much to anything >> objectionable or to add, better than the alternatives, so I went on and >> placed the newest version on: >> http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Mission >> >> Actually, I would really like to have a better definition of what is >> being addressed with a so called office suite. What's the thing that >> ties the package together? >> >> >> -- >> Thorsten Wilms >> > > I use LibreOffice, but I don't use an "office productivity solution" > (c&p'd from Mission). What's needed is a phrase that accurately and > succinctly provides a conceptual container for LibreOffice elements. > Something that connects for users. To me, "office productivity > solution" or "office suite" sound like overblown marketing (no offense > meant by that). > > Kudos to Microsoft for laying claim to "Office". The "kleenex" of > business software...a generic name. Microsoft also use "office suite", > and have likely somewhere used something about "office productivity". > > "LibreOffice" already locates the products in the Office world. It may > be that people now associate "Office" with the kinds of tasks that > LibreOffice supports. But how about a student paper, a recipe > collection, and other activities that are not really done at or in an > office? > > How about just a simple statement of the LibreOffice components? > Suggestions below, none of which do the trick for me, but maybe a > trigger for more creative people... > > LibreOffice Tools for Work > Software for writing, presenting and record-keeping > LibreOffice Collection > LibreOffice Tools for (the) People > > This is a hard question, Thorsten. But it's a good one to communicate > whatever sets LibO apart. > > Carl > > -- > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org > Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ > *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity *** > > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: CD/DVD distribution
Le 2010-11-24 08:58, Friedrich Strohmaier a écrit : Hi Marc, *, Marc Paré schrieb: Le 2010-11-23 19:20, Bernhard Dippold a écrit : [...] There is already a team working on a downloadable ISO for a DVD containing not only the product, but documentation and other resources too. They started in the Germanophone OOo community as "PrOOo-Box" (http://www.prooo-box.org) and continue their work for LibreOffice - starting from the German version, but will work on an international level too: http://www.libreofficebox.org/ Best regards Bernhard Thanks for the link Bernhard. Is this group listed anywhere on the OOo website? Yes, but only in german NL part: http://de.openoffice.org/downloads/download.html?version=3.2.1 http://de.openoffice.org/downloads/cd.html may be jump in points for in any manner german capable interested people. Where do you think that we would list it on our LibreOffice.org site? This is great! We're alive and have already released a first beta with LibO-beta2 to grab here (german, Bittorrent only): http://torrent.projects.ooodev.org:6969/torrents/LibreOffice_3.3.0-1_DVD_snapshot-20101112-22.25.13_libreoffice-box_allplatforms_libreofice-box_de.iso.torrent?info_hash=47dd3235a48b67860fe91b44ea7e0b83f925796f but we need some time to come up with offers for hands willing to help. We recently changed contents from hand coding to CMS (Silverstripe - thanks Christian!), will change the machine soon and move to tdf infrastucture and are therefore busy with setting up things. We'll come back here, but as far as I see, we pretty unlikely will succeed to manage releasing an international (english) version of the first stable LibO in time. Gruß/regards Thanks Friedrich Could you make an announcement when you are up and running on this list or even better on the marketing mailist? I think it would be interesting for everyone to know about your work. I will just post this short discussion on the marketing list so that the marketing team can refer to it later. Thanks again. Marc Marketing Team member -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Vision/Mission
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:51 AM, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > Hi! > > This only saw a little bit of discussion on the marketing list (after > the first draft was met with silence here). > > I like the interpretation, that there is not much to anything > objectionable or to add, better than the alternatives, so I went on and > placed the newest version on: > http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Mission > > Actually, I would really like to have a better definition of what is > being addressed with a so called office suite. What's the thing that > ties the package together? > > > -- > Thorsten Wilms > I use LibreOffice, but I don't use an "office productivity solution" (c&p'd from Mission). What's needed is a phrase that accurately and succinctly provides a conceptual container for LibreOffice elements. Something that connects for users. To me, "office productivity solution" or "office suite" sound like overblown marketing (no offense meant by that). Kudos to Microsoft for laying claim to "Office". The "kleenex" of business software...a generic name. Microsoft also use "office suite", and have likely somewhere used something about "office productivity". "LibreOffice" already locates the products in the Office world. It may be that people now associate "Office" with the kinds of tasks that LibreOffice supports. But how about a student paper, a recipe collection, and other activities that are not really done at or in an office? How about just a simple statement of the LibreOffice components? Suggestions below, none of which do the trick for me, but maybe a trigger for more creative people... LibreOffice Tools for Work Software for writing, presenting and record-keeping LibreOffice Collection LibreOffice Tools for (the) People This is a hard question, Thorsten. But it's a good one to communicate whatever sets LibO apart. Carl -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [steering-discuss] Community bylaws
Hi Michael, Michael Meeks wrote (22-11-10 11:50) Hi guys, On Sat, 2010-11-20 at 01:57 +0100, Bernhard Dippold wrote: Cor Nouws schrieb: Has been considered that this leads to a situation where each year people have to get used to the tasks, the other board members etc. so that maybe it is a bit inefficient? This is fairly normal, and there is usually both change and continuity in things like the GNOME board. Also, old-timers are usually around and willing to help out mentoring / getting people up-to-speed. Well, that is a good question. My personal take was at first for a 2 years mandate. Then some others thought that 6 months would be good. I sliced the apple into two :) I like a year-long term; it seems a good balance. What is a balance between a reasonable, common term (2 or 3 years) and non-sense (6 months)? In line with this, I would propose split elections: Appr. 50% of the seats each year. +1 So - I havn't got to looking at this in detail yet; but I strongly recommend a 'fair' voting scheme - such as used by GNOME - ie. STV. This Can you pls tell what STV is? And what has a fair voting scheme to do with 100% each year or 50% each year? makes it very difficult for a contributor with 51% of the votes to get 100% of the seats [ which 1st past the post assures ]. However - the obvious benefits of STV are really watered down by a smaller electorate due to rounding errors; obviously, if (using STV) you elect one person at a time, you have some of the first-past-the-post problems. Then, there is the admin overhead of elections, and the problems of getting people to vote more regularly. Both voting each year for 100% of the seats, or each year for 50% of the seats, result in one election per year. With less counting in the letter case ;-) Thus, overall - I would strongly recommend a single, big vote, once per year to elect everyone - and not worry about the continuity issues: they tend to fix themselves. The electorate tends to value such things as "experience" in the candidate's statements. The reasons you gave, that were clear for me so far, did not at all convince me. Maybe you can further explain what you think to gain with 100% of the seats each year? Regards, Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org List archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/steering-discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [steering-discuss] Community bylaws
Hello David, Le Wed, 24 Nov 2010 19:42:12 +0800, David Nelson a écrit : > Hi, :-) > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 00:52, Charles-H. Schulz > wrote: > > yup. But after Michael's points, I also think we might clarify and > > simplify all this a great deal. In a nutshell > > > > 1) the ESC does not get to vote, it's not elected, and it's a > > technical body. The AB can propose candidate(s), but cannot vote. > > 2) BoD appoints the CH, by vote or by consensus. People can nominate > > themselves and send their nomination to the BoD no later than 2 > > months before the election date. The AB can also nominate one or > > several candidates and sends the name(s) to the BoD no later than 2 > > months before the election. > > > > That way, it's easier and faster. Any thoughts? > > > > Best, > > Charles. > > Yes, I get the idea. If it's alright with you guys, I'll figure out > how to draft that in, and will give a heads-up when I've done so (over > the next 24 hours, because I'm slave to a client for the coming > hours). Is that OK? it's more than ok, thank you again! > > Also, I have an idea about a couple of legal experts I could contact > and, if they're willing, invite them to jump in on this thread and > maybe help arrive at some really bullet-proof bye-laws... should I do > that? Well, we do have lawyers to, for instance we have Gianluca here (but I'm sure there are others) and also Florian Effenberger who despite any evidence of the contrary, is not a system administrator :-) Best, Charles. > > David Nelson > -- Charles-H. Schulz Membre du Comité exécutif The Document Foundation. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org List archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/steering-discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] First LibO problem - OOo didn't do this...
Hi Charles, Charles Marcus wrote (23-11-10 22:36) Ok, first real issue I've had with LibO... I have an old phone system that generates reports in CVS format. OOo always opened these with the number columns formatted as - numbers. LibO is formatting *some* of them as text fields, and when I change them to numbers with no decimals (to remove the .00 it is adding to them that OOo also never did), it adds the stupid ' character to the beginning of every cell, thus making it impossible to format these as numbers. How can I easily remove the ' symbol from the beginning of every field? I have cam accross the same problem. In OOo 3.3.0 there are some new settings on the dialogue that imports the csv, in the section Other Options. If you fidlle a bit with those, you will find out how it works. (I can't remember what worked for me) Regards, Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
Hi Marco, *, M. Fioretti schrieb: [..] > as I already said, more than promoting any support mode as the only > one, my proposal is more limited to NOT making useless/embarassing the > email mode. Right now, the only other proposals that come to my mind > to make support as efficient as possible are: >- add some "problem category" field to the form I mention in my > article (e.g. "My problem is: 1) format compatibility, 2) > configuration, 3 macros) >- instead of sending an email, that form inside LibO may just query > the search engine of the Drupal website. .. and offer one more possibility?: "No satisfying answer found? - Ask a question!" which is sent to any resource, choosen to give useful answers, in a dedicated fashion and with a dedicated way to reach the requesting person. That might be an instant Email or confirm message containing links to (future) results or emails anouncing each answer by link to a public place - *not with answer inside* to not provocate an unhelpfull reply! my 2¢ Gruß/regards -- Friedrich Libreoffice-Box http://libreofficebox.org/ LibreOffice and more on CD/DVD images (german version already started) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Content of Beta3 Windows Install-Packages
Andrea Pescetti wrote: > but probably they are just symlinks on mirrors, not taking any > additional space. > Indeed. -- Thorsten -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] CD/DVD distribution (was: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice)
Hi Marc, *, Marc Paré schrieb: > Le 2010-11-23 19:20, Bernhard Dippold a écrit : [...] >> There is already a team working on a downloadable ISO for a DVD >> containing not only the product, but documentation and other >> resources too. >> They started in the Germanophone OOo community as "PrOOo-Box" >> (http://www.prooo-box.org) and continue their work for LibreOffice - >> starting from the German version, but will work on an international >> level too: >> http://www.libreofficebox.org/ >> Best regards >> Bernhard > Thanks for the link Bernhard. Is this group listed anywhere on the OOo > website? Yes, but only in german NL part: http://de.openoffice.org/downloads/download.html?version=3.2.1 http://de.openoffice.org/downloads/cd.html may be jump in points for in any manner german capable interested people. > Where do you think that we would list it on our LibreOffice.org site? > This is great! We're alive and have already released a first beta with LibO-beta2 to grab here (german, Bittorrent only): http://torrent.projects.ooodev.org:6969/torrents/LibreOffice_3.3.0-1_DVD_snapshot-20101112-22.25.13_libreoffice-box_allplatforms_libreofice-box_de.iso.torrent?info_hash=47dd3235a48b67860fe91b44ea7e0b83f925796f but we need some time to come up with offers for hands willing to help. We recently changed contents from hand coding to CMS (Silverstripe - thanks Christian!), will change the machine soon and move to tdf infrastucture and are therefore busy with setting up things. We'll come back here, but as far as I see, we pretty unlikely will succeed to manage releasing an international (english) version of the first stable LibO in time. Gruß/regards -- Friedrich Libreoffice-Box http://libreofficebox.org/ LibreOffice and more on CD/DVD images (german version already started) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] First LibO problem - OOo didn't do this...
Charles, On Tue, 2010-11-23 at 16:36 -0500, Charles Marcus wrote: > Redacted sample file attached. Which I don't see... Perhaps this list prohibits attachments? Can you send me the file directly? Kohei -- Kohei Yoshida, LibreOffice hacker, Calc -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Charles Marcus wrote: > Does Drupal Forums allow one to 'subscribe' (get email notifications) to > both Main Topics/Sections as well as individual threads? The Drupal messaging/notification system can provide subscriptions and mail back responses for ANY part of the site. Topics, Sections, Threads, Areas of the site, Even every post across the site in a specific language to go to extremes. If you want a subscription available for something that is not available when the Drupal site goes Beta then you can request it and it will be added easily, but we will try to anticipate all possible use cases. The input and output of the system is fully configurable. You can even get your subscriptions sent to you in Twitter, Facebook or Jabber (Google Chat) messages if you want. Plug and play really. Michael Wheatland -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
Hi Mr. Derman, each humans hate passwords :) And who does not have a too easy. I recommend PasswordSafe (or similar) from SourceForge.net. This programs help you to manage your passwords. Ciao Am 24.11.2010 13:06, schrieb Charles Marcus: > On 2010-11-23 5:01 PM, Robert Derman wrote: >> I just have to respond to this, I hate forums or anything else that >> required the use of PASSWORDS!!! I already have 10 times too many >> passwords to remember or keep track of and I want absolutely NO more. >> Frankly I wish the entire computer and software industry would flush the >> whole idea of passwords down the loo and come up with something else >> entirely. > > www.passwordmaker.org > > Of course it requires Firefox... > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On 2010-11-23 5:01 PM, Robert Derman wrote: > I just have to respond to this, I hate forums or anything else that > required the use of PASSWORDS!!! I already have 10 times too many > passwords to remember or keep track of and I want absolutely NO more. > Frankly I wish the entire computer and software industry would flush the > whole idea of passwords down the loo and come up with something else > entirely. www.passwordmaker.org Of course it requires Firefox... -- Best regards, Charles -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On 2010-11-23 12:55 PM, Ian Lynch wrote: > Since the project is moving to Drupal, it makes sense to use Drupal forums > since then there is just one system to manage. Does Drupal Forums allow one to 'subscribe' (get email notifications) to both Main Topics/Sections as well as individual threads? -- Best regards, Charles -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
In data martedì 23 novembre 2010 10:21:08, Sveinn í Felli ha scritto: > Þann þri 23.nóv 2010 02:17, skrifaði Michael Wheatland: > > On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 11:41 AM, Robert Holtzman wrote: > >> On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 10:31:58PM +0100, Rene Engelhard wrote: > >>> On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 02:28:54PM -0700, Robert Holtzman wrote: > open to learning a *few* new things, it is extremely user friendly. > There is, however, a segment of the population that actively resists > learning *anything*. > >>> > >>> And that's a problem. > >> > >> I would say that's *the* problem. > >> Bob Holtzman > > > > The message does not seem to be getting through here. > > Simply: This type of personal criticism is unacceptable in the > > LibreOffice community. > > Maybe this can serve as a warning; we should carefully hurry > to put up more specialised communication channels (avoiding > group isolation but still minimizing similar clashes). I see > the argument made by Rene as somewhat valid - but only in a > certain context. > Which it is not on the [tdf-discuss] list but might be on an > [tdf-devel-discuss] list (although some manners could be > useful). > > It's quite surreal to see some power users/developers not > seeing or refusing to see that the whole concept of the > software in question IS a big metaphor: Office. > And its users are using GUIs and other metaphors for > handling the software; for even the most capable of them the > CLI is at best scary. +1 -- Valter Registered Linux User #466410 http://counter.li.org Kubuntu Linux: www.kubuntu.org OpenOffice.org: www.openoffice.org -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On Wed, 24 Nov 2010 08:02:11 +0100, Alexander Thurgood wrote: > Does such a system also prevent false representation, i.e. someone > passing themselves off as another member ? With a userid and password > combo, this is much harder to do, it seems (notwithstanding one's > computer being hacked and one's ID/pwds being stolen) ? Good forums provide the possibility to log in with OpenID, not requiring additional passwords and still providing authentication. I we should have that plugin enabled in our wiki.TDF.org site anyway... Sebastian -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
In data lunedì 22 novembre 2010 22:28:54, Robert Holtzman ha scritto: > On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 06:50:36PM +0100, Rene Engelhard wrote: > > On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 03:52:41PM +, Lee Hyde wrote: > > > original poster is making. Windows users are presented with a single > > > setup.exe while debian/ubuntu users are presented with a multitude of > > > individual .deb files. This is not user friendly! > > > > Nonsense. dpkg -i *.deb is user friendly, despite what you want to claim. > > That graphical tools might make it difficult is no argument. > >..snip. > > Whether it's user friendly or not depends on the user. If he/she/it is > open to learning a *few* new things, it is extremely user friendly. > There is, however, a segment of the population that actively resists > learning *anything*. That's why: the more user-friendly, the more Libò will spread throughout the world... -- Valter Registered Linux User #466410 http://counter.li.org Kubuntu Linux: www.kubuntu.org OpenOffice.org: www.openoffice.org -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [steering-discuss] next SC confcall on Sunday
Hi all SC members, On 22/11/2010 12:35, Florian Effenberger wrote: Hello, thanks for taking part in the poll. The next public Steering Committee Conference Call will take place this Sunday, November 28th, 1500 UTC For your local date and time, see the time zone selector at http://www.doodle.com/vtfkz4f2es79ftad As usual, dial-in instructions and the agenda will be made available at http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/TDF/Steering_Committee_Meetings and we're looking forward to you taking part in our call! I've added the item : Structure of the native language websites to our next conf call. I would like you read Michael mails here before the call http://www.libreoffice.org/lists/website/msg01190.html as a basis for our discussion. Thanks! Kind regards Sophie -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to steering-discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org List archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/steering-discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
In data lunedì 22 novembre 2010 17:57:46, jonathon ha scritto: > On 11/22/2010 03:07 PM, Rene Engelhard wrote: > > Because dpkg -i *.deb is esssentialy setup.exe. > > That would be true if, and only if there was _one_ deb to install, in > which gdeb would by used, not dpkg. > > >Don't tell me anyone using Windows must not know setup.exe to install > > software? > > Out in the world of Joe Sixpack, autoexec.run on the CD/DVD/BluRay is > the program that installs software. > > > There is no goddamn need for it. > > By that token, there in no need for _any_ program, on any os, other than > emacs. > > >(That Ubuntu people in 90% of cases have no clue how they do basic > > system tasks doesn't make it more needed) > > That lack of knowledge makes it imperative that that how to install the > files be included. If that includes an explanation of how to use dpkg, > so be it. IMHO, everything must be explained for novices/newbies in Linux. Regarding the Ubuntu system, a simple double click on a .deb package should autorun the installation, but I also would ask the mantainers/developers of the Ubuntu project to add Libò in their repositories. This should lead to a quite smart installation for all people. Ciao -- Valter Registered Linux User #466410 http://counter.li.org Kubuntu Linux: www.kubuntu.org OpenOffice.org: www.openoffice.org -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] changed footers of all documentfoundation and libreoffice.org mailing lists
Sigrid Carrera wrote: > 2010/11/24 Florian Effenberger : > > What do others think? I still clearly favor the non-poetic version ;) > > I have no real preference. But in my opinion, the "non-poetic" version > looks to me more "professional". So I vote for this one. I will very rarely get to read that line, being it the last line of the standard message appendix, but I'd favor the "professional" (and by this I mean "non-poetic") version too. Regards, Andrea. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendlyuser support in LibreOffice
"Robert Derman" wrote in message news:4cec9cb9.10...@pressenter.com... Alexander Thurgood wrote: Le 23/11/10 23:01, Robert Derman a écrit : I just have to respond to this, I hate forums or anything else that required the use of PASSWORDS!!! I already have 10 times too many passwords to remember or keep track of and I want absolutely NO more. Frankly I wish the entire computer and software industry would flush the whole idea of passwords down the loo and come up with something else entirely. How else would one prevent bots from joining the lists and spamming them ? If you want an example, of how bad it has become, join a usenet newsgroup and see how much crud gets posted on it. Use Captcha when a user registers. How else would one provide a given user a modicum of security and identification ? I don't know offhand, but the geniuses in the computer and software industries need to find a better way. Passwords are NOT the answer. -- Harold Fuchs London, England -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] [QA] Libò 3.3b3 - Impress freezes o pening these files
Hi Everyone, I just wanto to poit out an issue that we (Libò 3.3b3, x86-64, linux platform) have in common with the upcoming new vanilla version (3.3.0rc6). What a new nice time to collaborate and underline the convenience to be one rather than two???!!! This is the vanilla issue http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=115761 Please tell me if you want that I also post an issue on FreeDesktop Bugzilla. Have a nice day, Carlo p.s. You could also find the files here: - http://download.plio.it/tmp/OpenOfficeOrgLD2008.odp - 4.9 Mbyte - http://download.plio.it/tmp/OpenOfficeOrgLD2009.odp - 11.4 Mbyte -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
Robert Derman wrote: > I do know however that ODF > if far more economical of file size than PDF, I have noticed that on > documents that I have written with Writer and then output as PDFs. Jean already clarified this is not the case, but if you need numbers this is the comparison for the Italian version of the Getting Started Guide in 18 Chapters: ODT version 13092K total PDF version 10732K total So using PDF is clearly not a disadvantage in terms of file size in this case. Regards, Andrea. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] functionality issues discussions
On Wed, 24 Nov 2010 01:16:53 -0600, Marwan Gedeon wrote: I'm sorry if asking this here is inappropriate, I couldn't find the answer in FAQ, neither another mailing list dedicated for that purpose: what is the proper place/people to resort to, in order to report/resolve issues with current LibreOffice's beta release? Is bugzilla (https://bugs.freedesktop.org/) my best shot here? Thank you There are developer lists, and also a developer IRC room that can also help you with issues regarding bugs. Yes bugzilla is the current error tracker in freedesktop. Also look on the wiki about QA and other related documents at wiki.documentfoundation.org -- Alexandro Colorado OOoES A.C - http://oooes.org GPG: 68D072E6 -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Vision/Mission
Hi! This only saw a little bit of discussion on the marketing list (after the first draft was met with silence here). I like the interpretation, that there is not much to anything objectionable or to add, better than the alternatives, so I went on and placed the newest version on: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Mission Actually, I would really like to have a better definition of what is being addressed with a so called office suite. What's the thing that ties the package together? -- Thorsten Wilms thorwil's design for free software: http://thorwil.wordpress.com/ -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] changed footers of all documentfoundation and libreoffice.org mailing lists
Hi Flo, 2010/11/24 Florian Effenberger : > What do others think? I still clearly favor the non-poetic version ;) I have no real preference. But in my opinion, the "non-poetic" version looks to me more "professional". So I vote for this one. Sigrid -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Content of Beta3 Windows Install-Packages
Thorsten Behrens wrote: > Christian Lohmaier wrote: > > Brazilian version has traditionally (i.e. OOo-times) been a different > > package/has not been called OpenOffice.org in Brazil, but BrOffice due > > to trademark issues. ... > > > Yep - but since BrOffice is a well-established brand, and under > community control, we'll continue to use it for the pt_BR versions. I cannot find references now, but the trademark issue for OpenOffice.org had already been solved in Brazil earlier this year, wasn't it? And the Brazilians decided to keep using the established name "BrOffice" for branding reasons, even when OpenOffice.org was an option too. So it makes sense to apply the same reasoning in the LibreOffice case, even though the duplicate multi-language installation files seem a bit too much... but probably they are just symlinks on mirrors, not taking any additional space. Regards, Andrea. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] changed footers of all documentfoundation and libreoffice.org mailing lists
Florian Effenberger wrote (24-11-10 10:49) What do others think? I still clearly favor the non-poetic version ;) No preference for me. Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] changed footers of all documentfoundation and libreoffice.org mailing lists
What do others think? I still clearly favor the non-poetic version ;) Jesso Murugan wrote on 2010-11-23 05.03: I am from India, and I guess I belong to the 'international' community. We prefer "cannot" too, "can not" is quite awkward. However, I prefer the poetic version - "publicly archived for eternity". -- Florian Effenberger Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 6:00 AM, Ian Lynch wrote: > Only draw back I can think of is potentially broken links. One option to avoid broken links might be linking to the site search tool rather than individual pages, this would ensure all pages can be found even if they are moved, as well as consistency across languages which is the keystone of the Drupal system. Michael Wheatland -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 11:49 PM, Rene Engelhard wrote: > And their quality is bad. Mentioning Ubuntu as an example here disqualifies > you already. In Your Humble Opinion. Again please avoid attacks on individuals or groups of users. This risks alienating a large group of users. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On 23 November 2010 18:14, T. J. Brumfield wrote: > There are open software stacks with various CMS tools where you can combine > wiki, blog, forum, and FAQ functionality together. A community site could > have articles on the front end to help demonstate features, provide > tutorials, expose new templates and extensions, etc. > > Users can provide comments and questions on the articles as well as post in > the forums. Duplicate questions are bound to occur in forums. The problem > with that is retyping the same solutions time and time again. But if there > is an integrated wiki/knowledgebase in the site, then you can link to the > solution there. > > My concern is that many users expect help to be present in the application > itself, and not everyone is willing to go and find answers in a community. > Could the application itself pull its "Help" functionality from online > resources? > That is quite common with Linux applications. Certainly links from the application help to on-line search of discussions etc should be relatively easy. Only draw back I can think of is potentially broken links. One advantage to linking to say a public editable page would be that if you found the help unhelpful but then realised why you could document it for others and eventually the improvements could find their way in to the application help. -- Ian Ofqual Accredited IT Qualifications The Schools ITQwww.theINGOTs.org +44 (0)1827 305940 You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: A proposal for effective, volunteer-friendly user support in LibreOffice
On 23 November 2010 17:28, Nathan wrote: > On 11/23/2010 11:57 AM, plino wrote: > >> >> I do agree that volunteer-friendly user support is the key for the success >> of >> any Open Source project. >> >> However, in my opinion e-mail and mailing lists are obsolete and >> ineffective >> tools. >> >> A user forum (with optional mail notification) and a wiki are much more >> powerful tools. >> >> A forum makes it much easier to create a hierarchy of helpers based on >> merit >> and on the other hand to handle poorly behaved users. >> >> A wiki can be an organized structure of accumulated knowledge. >> > i agree, a forum would be more efficient and easier to manage. Out of all > the open source forum solutions currently out, I would have to say that > Vanilla forums is the best. Between active development, aesthetically > appealing, up to date feature sets, it has it all. > > http://www.vanillaforums.org > > -- > Thanks for your time, > Nathan Heafner Since the project is moving to Drupal, it makes sense to use Drupal forums since then there is just one system to manage. > > -- > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to > discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org > Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ > *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity *** > > -- Ian Ofqual Accredited IT Qualifications The Schools ITQwww.theINGOTs.org +44 (0)1827 305940 You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 07:50:59AM -0600, Sonic4Spuds wrote: > This is not the case, many people on debian based systems are new to > linux. Linux Mint and Ubuntu both use debian as their base. These And those still have to know basics. Even totally nonsensical beginner documents I find printed in random bookstores mention on how you do essential stuff on the console. > are some of the best distros for new users, who usually have a fear > of the terminal and typing command arguments. And their quality is bad. Mentioning Ubuntu as an example here disqualifies you already. Grüße/Regards, René -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Request: Installation Instructions
Hi, On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 09:21:08AM +, Sveinn í Felli wrote: > It's quite surreal to see some power users/developers not seeing or > refusing to see that the whole concept of the software in question > IS a big metaphor: Office. Wrong, I do see it. > And its users are using GUIs and other metaphors for handling the > software; for even the most capable of them the CLI is at best > scary. Correct, they are *users* _of the office_. For that I agree, they don't need to worry. For people *installing* the office and thus effectively *asministering* their system it *does* matter. > And the sysadmins I've been working with are normally too overloaded > to remember upgrading manually the LibO/OOo packages on their > systems (my language is not yet in the official distribution > channels). They want their software to come through official and > reliable repositories. > So it took about 30 minutes of searching and fiddling to create a > Packages.gz file and publishing the packages as our localised .deb > repository. Think it's similar for other flavors like yum .rpm. > Still I'd like a primary metapackage so we could install/deinstall > ONE package instead of the whole bunch. You can trivially create one if you have the above in a Packages.gz anyways. > Anyway, I presume LibO will not be distributed this way in the > future, 'dpkg -i *.deb' or 'rpm -ivh *.rpm' will be reserved for > testing/development/adventurous people. > Linux users will get their LibreOffice through their package > managers, probably via distribution specific repositories. I think I Exactly. Grüße/Regards, René -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
