[tdf-discuss] iWork LibreOffice ODF.

[Laurence Jeloudev]

To LibreOffice,

http://winsupersite.com/office/apples-iwork-foibles-should-be-warning-microsoft 

I read an article I found on the web in regards to the new IWORK 2013 suite, 
which Apple released last week for free to any consumer who purchases a new 
Apple mac or iOS device.

The articles states from a point of view, that Apple had removed features from 
its previous version desktop office suite to incorporate simplicity and 
features that were on the same level as its software that it had created on its 
iOS devices platform and its web apps platform on the internet. The journalist 
stated in the article that it was a “dumb down approach” towards its previous 
version of desktop applications and Microsoft Office on the Mac and PC. 

After reading some of the comments from the article it got me thinking as to 
how this approach effects Free Office Suites and in particular LibreOffice.

I watched a stream from LibreOffice Conference 2013, that was related to 
running LO on the iOS platform, and on mobile devices. 

1. Would LibreOffice remove features in its full desktop suite, if it created a 
mobile version with less features?
2. Is iWork a threat to free office suites in terms of features, compatibility 
and free office suites in general?
3. (maybe not related to LO. I may have to ask this question somewhere else.) 
Why doesn’t Apple iWork suite have Open Document Format Support? (Apart from 
being a proprietary product.) And i know apple provide textedit as a 
replacement, so it is not like they don’t know what ODF is.

ljelly.



 

 

  

 

 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Initial Reactions to 4.0.0

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Fantastic release. 
There was an issue with servers yesterday for mac builds. 
I downloaded the dmg it did not work twice on my connection. I then used the 
torrent link and the connection was as fast as lightning. It was good to have 
an alternative. 
4.0 is a great release. 
LJ


On 09/02/2013, at 7:01 AM, Cor Nouws  wrote:

> Hi Robert,
> 
> Robert Boehm wrote (08-02-13 18:26)
> 
>> release.  So far so good...this is a good releasenot aware of any
>> bugs affecting
>> [...]
>> But this 4.0 seems to me to be the best initial release yet
>> 
>> Thanks to everyone!
> 
> Thanks for your encouraging and positive feed back.
> I hear similar sounds from people around me!
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> 
> -- 
> - Cor
> - http://nl.libreoffice.org
> - www.librelex.org
> 
> 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I agree. 
It might even be quicker to download from a website. 
Users wouldn't first of all have to have an account to download the software. 
And once it's installed it's ready to go to open most file formats including 
the best maintained ODF support from LO. 
One of the solutions, is by spreading the word to users from other users. If a 
company cannot provide open source standards than users can. If there are more 
open source users there would be less users using non open source software.  
It is open to the user to actually use the software for there own needs and 
requirements. 

Note: this will also be forwarded back to the discussion list. 
LJ. 

On 07/02/2013, at 8:56 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina"  wrote:

> If people can still download from a website then the app stores shouldn’t be 
> a problem at this stage.
>  
> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: 07 February 2013 10:55
> To: Jonathan Aquilina
> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
>  
> As a suggestion it might be that apple can not directly control open source 
> software. 
> How is it not open source?
> http://www.opensource.apple.com/ 
> Have ODF file types skipped apples open source protocols for Mac OS X?
> And again it's that users have no knowledge of open alternatives and 
> Microsoft and apple both know this for the mac platform.
> 
> On 07/02/2013, at 7:37 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina"  wrote:
> 
> Apple has nothing to do with it unless you are talking about releasing to
> ios then that is a whole other can of worms or even to the mac app store. It
> has something to do with the way mac has things setup which is in a way anti
> open source.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: 07 February 2013 09:34
> To: Jonathan Aquilina; Libreoffice Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
> 
> I think the only way vendor lock in awareness can be achieved on the mac
> platform. 
> Would be for apple to acknowledge in there license agreement of document
> software that they do not support ODF formats. And a support documentation
> that lists a reason why and a discussion link as to what ODF formats are.
> Such as a the ODF foundation site. Where there could be a list of
> alternatives for ODF format software for mac users. 
> Or a similar solution to having a description similar to the exe file on the
> mac that states that it is a windows binary file with a link that is
> documentation that is then supported with a step process of alternative
> software.  
> That way users would be aware first of all. Decline apple and its vendor
> lock in process in the agreement and use an open alternative.  
> 
> LJ
> 
> On 07/02/2013, at 7:22 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina" 
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Is there a newer version of office for mac as I am on 2011 and I admit
> that doesn't do it? Maybe if they have a newer version that I am not
> aware of that does do it.
>  
> -Original Message-
> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com]
> Sent: 07 February 2013 09:21
> To: Jonathan Aquilina
> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
>  
> Not on the mac platform.
>  
> Sent from my iPad
>  
> On 07/02/2013, at 7:20 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina"
> 
> wrote:
>  
> Keep in mind that office 2010 and above supports odf formats and you
> have the choice to choose between Microsoft's proprietary formats or
> odf. When you run word for example for the first time it would ask
> you if you want to use xml formats or odf formats.
>  
> -Original Message-
> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com]
> Sent: 07 February 2013 09:14
> To: Jonathan Aquilina
> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
>  
> Personally I could be mistaken,
> But many mac users that I know of do not use ODF formats at all,
> because it is not included in proprietary software that is for Mac OS X.
> There first instinct I believe is to go straight to the windows
> platform and convert the document and not install a new open source
> office suite that can open the file.
> Thus I believe the problem then stems even further.
> There is no real practical prompt suggestion, awareness marketing
> advertisement from apple or Microsoft that this file can be opened
> using another program on the same apple platform.
> Wether it be LO or not.
> I believe ODF formats for some mac users can be like opening an exe
> file on a mac platform. It is completely foreign to the user.
>  
> LJ.
>  
>  
>  
>  
> On 07/02/2013, at 6:56 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina"
> 
> wrote

Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I think the only way vendor lock in awareness can be achieved on the mac 
platform. 
Would be for apple to acknowledge in there license agreement of document 
software that they do not support ODF formats. And a support documentation that 
lists a reason why and a discussion link as to what ODF formats are. Such as a 
the ODF foundation site. Where there could be a list of alternatives for ODF 
format software for mac users. 
Or a similar solution to having a description similar to the exe file on the 
mac that states that it is a windows binary file with a link that is 
documentation that is then supported with a step process of alternative 
software.  
That way users would be aware first of all. Decline apple and its vendor lock 
in process in the agreement and use an open alternative.  

LJ

On 07/02/2013, at 7:22 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina"  wrote:

> Is there a newer version of office for mac as I am on 2011 and I admit that
> doesn't do it? Maybe if they have a newer version that I am not aware of
> that does do it.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: 07 February 2013 09:21
> To: Jonathan Aquilina
> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
> 
> Not on the mac platform. 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 07/02/2013, at 7:20 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina" 
> wrote:
> 
>> Keep in mind that office 2010 and above supports odf formats and you 
>> have the choice to choose between Microsoft's proprietary formats or 
>> odf. When you run word for example for the first time it would ask you 
>> if you want to use xml formats or odf formats.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com]
>> Sent: 07 February 2013 09:14
>> To: Jonathan Aquilina
>> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
>> 
>> Personally I could be mistaken,
>> But many mac users that I know of do not use ODF formats at all, 
>> because it is not included in proprietary software that is for Mac OS X.
>> There first instinct I believe is to go straight to the windows 
>> platform and convert the document and not install a new open source 
>> office suite that can open the file.
>> Thus I believe the problem then stems even further.
>> There is no real practical prompt suggestion, awareness marketing 
>> advertisement from apple or Microsoft that this file can be opened 
>> using another program on the same apple platform.
>> Wether it be LO or not. 
>> I believe ODF formats for some mac users can be like opening an exe 
>> file on a mac platform. It is completely foreign to the user.
>> 
>> LJ. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 07/02/2013, at 6:56 PM, "Jonathan Aquilina" 
>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> What would be interesting to see with the comment about mac below. 
>>> What are the current statistics of LO downloads for mac.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Laurence Jeloudev [mailto:ljelou...@gmail.com]
>>> Sent: 07 February 2013 08:03
>>> To: M. Fioretti; Libreoffice Discussion List
>>> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness
>>> 
>>> ODF formats are still not implemented to a point where consumers can 
>>> forget about what software they are using. And this is a concern for 
>>> mac users, as there software is usually proprietary software and not 
>>> software with ODF formats in it. The only program on the mac that can 
>>> only open odt documents is text editor.
>>> 
>>> There is no default requirement for a user to explore an ODF formats 
>>> program on the mac. They usually are swamped with proprietary 
>>> software as being the only solution, and forget that ODF formats 
>>> exist. As the odt format can be mistaken as a basic text document 
>>> format and not a fully fledged document suite file type format on the
> mac.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> LJ
>>> 
>>> On 07/02/2013, at 12:21 AM, "M. Fioretti"  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Feb 06, 2013 20:17:49 PM +1100, Laurence Jeloudev wrote:
>>>>> The concept is a great idea. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> But what if you encounter a person with a mac computer.
>>>> 
>>>> that's the whole point. Both of ODF in general, and, I assume, of 
>>>> Boudi. His signature is only about formats, it never mentions 
>>>> specific software programs.
>>>> 
>>>> THE reason for formats like ODF is to arrive as soon as possible to 
>>>>

Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness

[Laurence Jeloudev]

 ODF formats are still not implemented to a point where consumers can forget 
about what software they are using. And this is a concern for mac users, as 
there software is usually proprietary software and not software with ODF 
formats in it. The only program on the mac that can only open odt documents is 
text editor. 

There is no default requirement for a user to explore an ODF formats program on 
the mac. They usually are swamped with proprietary software as being the only 
solution, and forget that ODF formats exist. As the odt format can be mistaken 
as a basic text document format and not a fully fledged document suite file 
type format on the mac. 


LJ

On 07/02/2013, at 12:21 AM, "M. Fioretti"  wrote:

> On Wed, Feb 06, 2013 20:17:49 PM +1100, Laurence Jeloudev wrote:
>> The concept is a great idea. 
>> 
>> But what if you encounter a person with a mac computer.
> 
> that's the whole point. Both of ODF in general, and, I assume, of
> Boudi. His signature is only about formats, it never mentions specific
> software programs.
> 
> THE reason for formats like ODF is to arrive as soon as possible to a
> point where you can ignore what software the others are using.
> 
> More on this topic:
> 
> http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/articles/focus_format_history
> 
> Marco
> 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Help vendor-lock-in awareness

[Laurence Jeloudev]

The concept is a great idea. 

But what if you encounter a person with a mac computer. What would be the 
easiest solution for them?



On 06/02/2013, at 7:15 PM, Boudi van Vlijmen  wrote:

> Friends,
> 
> Every email I send has the footer as in this one.
> 
> The purpose is to achieve;
> 
>   1. Vendor-lock-in awarness
>   2. Hook in on the society learning curve status.
> 
> The message is:
> ODT in place of DOC/DOCX,
> ODS in place of XLS/XLSX,
> ODP in place of PPT/PPTX.
> 
> ODF is one bridge to far. People think in DOC, XLS and PPT. To get them
> away from that we should start from there. Not with a high level ODF
> concept!
> 
> Met vriendelijke groet,
> Kind regards,
> Boudi van Vlijmen 
> 
>  *Werk documenten*
> ODT, gDoc, DOC, DOCX
> ODS, gSheet, XLS, XLSX
> en ODP, gSlides, PPT, PPTX
> *Distributie en Archivering*
> PDF/A 
> 
> 
>  [image: Inline image 1]
> [image: Inline image 1]
>  *Open standards or Open Wallets that is the question! Waak over uw
> onafhankelijkheid!
> *
> http://forumstandaardisatie.nl/
> Beleidsquote "Rijksdiensten moeten vanaf april 2008 ODF ondersteunen.
> Mede-overheden en overige instellingen volgen uiterlijk december 2008.
> ODF = .odt voor tekst, .ods voor spreadsheets, .odp voor presentaties"
> Vendor-lock
> safe formats 
> http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenDocument
> **
> 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: LibreOffice and Java Security: OpenJDK Vulnerability

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Thank you, for the info world article and the brief explanation about java 
running on desktop software.
I have shared the infoworld article. 
I have a better understanding through this discussion and reading other 
articles of how java works on libreoffice.  
I'm glad this issue has raised discussion and that there are some concerns from 
the media and the community about java and the way that oracle resolves 
security exploits. 
ljelly.


On 17/01/2013, at 5:46 AM, NoOp  wrote:

> On 01/16/2013 10:36 AM, NoOp wrote:
> ...
>> Security releases for OpenJDK and Icedtea were released yesterday (Tues
>> Jan 17). Of course I reckon that it will take awhile for the builds to
>> get pushed to the distro's.
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> Sorry, looks like I have URL stutter... here is the correct second URL:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice for Academic Work -- College/University

[Laurence Jeloudev]

On 15/05/2012 5:52 PM, Pieter E. Zanstra wrote:

Like it or not, only one thing matters:
Seemless file exchange with Microsoft Word, Excel, and Powerpoint. Period!
Pieter
  

-Original Message-
From: Marc Paré [mailto:m...@marcpare.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2012 9:33 AM
To: discuss@documentfoundation.org
Subject: [tdf-discuss] LibreOffice for Academic Work --
College/University

I need to work out a short note about use of LibreOffice in an
academic environment. What would some of you, who are using
LibreOffice, consider necessary to use LibreOffice in an
academic setting.

I am not looking for a "wish-list", but a list of any
extensions/add-ons to LibreOffice that are available right
now. Is LibreOffice sufficient as is, or do any of you have
any suggestions of add-ons that are really needed for such a
setting as a college/university/academic environment?

Thanks for any input.

Marc


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cannot be deleted




I agree that is the worse thing that I do not like about LibreOffice, is 
that there is no sufficient compatibility with Microsoft Office.
An Example are pptx files, that have formatting errors where the text 
does not fit on the same slide, and runs off the page. so everything has 
to be re-sized again. all the text boxes.
I hope Microsoft Office support Libreoffice file formats the odf formats 
in there next office release, as then it would help more compatibility 
issues and problems with files and formatting hopefully being fixed.
Microsoft are not the only company that have this problem, working with 
Apple iwork files also has formatting problems with Calc in Libreoffice 
when apple convert them to an xls format. i don't understand how that works
LibreOffice and Google Docs (Drive) still don't work together sometimes 
especially with fonts and formatting errors. Although again, its a 
google issue not an issue with libreoffice.
In An Academic environment, I believe the software suite could work, 
although I am restricted currently at the moment only allowed to use 
Microsoft Office. I am a student at a school, the thing that annoys me, 
is when microsoft office lags, and it hangs, on school computers. It 
then wastes  a lot of my time when typing a document (somtimes crashing 
and the document doesn't want to retrieve!). Then when I am at home, 
libreoffice always works flawlessly.



ljelly.



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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Support for Versions, Full-Screen, and Resume in OS X Lion

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Do you think these features could be tested in a development build ???

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 05/08/2011, at 20:54, Tor Lillqvist  wrote:

>> Wouldnt that require us to migrate from the current 10.4 sdk which
>> everything is built against to the latest 10.7 in regards to API's?
>
> Not necessarily. This is not a technical list, so this will probably make the
> eyes glaze over for most readers, but still:
>
> As long as only calling new instance methods of existing classes, and adding 
> new
> instance methods to existing subclass implementations (hopefully I got the
> Objective-C terminology right) is involved, it can be done quite nicely to be
> optional at run-time and compiling fine against the 10.4 SDK.
>
> Example, from my experimental patch to vcl/aqua/source/window/salframe.cxx:
>
> // On 10.7 and later, If the window has a title bar and is
> // resizable, we make it full-screenable. The ideal would be to do
> // it only for document windows, but how to figure out that?
> if (GetSalData()->mnSystemVersion >= 0x1070) {
>  if ((mnStyleMask & NSTitledWindowMask)
>  && (mnStyleMask & NSResizableWindowMask)) {
>// If compiled against a SDK version earlier than 10.7
>// NSWindowCollectionBehaviorFullScreenPrimary won't be
>// defined so define it ourselves. Note that we can't use
>// MAC_OS_X_VERSION_10_7 in this #if as such a macro is
>// not defined in earlier SDKs...
>
> #if MAC_OS_X_VERSION_MAX_ALLOWED < 1070
>enum {
>  NSWindowCollectionBehaviorFullScreenPrimary = (1 << 7)
>};
> #endif
>
>int behavior = (int) objc_msgSend(mpWindow, @selector(collectionBehavior));
>behavior |= NSWindowCollectionBehaviorFullScreenPrimary;
>
>objc_msgSend(mpWindow, @selector(setCollectionBehavior:), behavior);
>  }
> }
>
> Note the use of objc_msgSend and @selector there. Using normal Objective-C
> syntactic sugar and calling [mpWindow collectionBehavior] and [mpWindow
> setCollectionBehavior: behavior] would not compile against the 10.4 SDK as
> collectionBehavior is present only in the 10.5 SDK and later.
>
> Compiles fine against the 10.4 SDK, works as intended on 10.7. Should work 
> fine
> on earlier OSes, too, but I haven't verified that.
>
> --tml
>
>
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Support for Versions, Full-Screen, and Resume in OS X Lion

[Laurence Jeloudev]

It would make sense.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 05/08/2011, at 16:57, Jonathan Aquilina  wrote:

> On 04/08/2011 18:32, Tor Lillqvist wrote:
>> Larry Gusaas  gmail.com>  writes:
>>
>>> When will LibreOffice add support for using the Versions,
>>> Full-Screen mode, and Resume features in Mac OS X version 10.7 Lion ?
>> When somebody writes the code. (And offers it for inclusion under the
>> license(s) we use.)
>>
>>> NeoOffice already supports these features in NeoOffice 3.2.1 Beta.
>> Which probably means that many volunteer developers who might have the
>> required skills and hardware have little interest in working on these
>> features as it would be duplication of work because of licensing
>> differences. Duplicating work just because of licensing is not fun.
>> At least that is how I feel...
>>
>> (NeoOffice is GPL, LibreOffice is LGPL, and new LibreOffice code is also 
>> MPL.)
>>
>> I did some inital experimentation with full-screen mode, and indeed,
>> supporting that to some extent is trivial. But exactly how Lion
>> full-screen mode should interact with/supplement/replace the
>> traditional OOo/LO full-screen mode, if at all, would be something
>> for the user experience experts to work on.
>>
>> Versioning, Auto-Save, Resume etc would require quite a lot of work,
>> I think. The OOo/LO code does not use the NSDocument class at all,
>> for instance. (In general, the OOo/LO MacOSX code is rather old-fashioned
>> in its use of MacOSX APIs.)
>
> Wouldnt that require us to migrate from the current 10.4 sdk which everything 
> is built against to the latest 10.7 in regards to API's?
>
>>
>> --tml
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Support for Versions, Full-Screen, and Resume in OS X Lion

[Laurence Jeloudev]

It would be a little ironic if these features were implemented before
Microsoft office for Mac 2011 had them.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 04/08/2011, at 7:33, Larry Gusaas  wrote:

> When will LibreOffice add support for using the Versions, Full-Screen mode, 
> and Resume features in Mac OS X version 10.7 Lion ?  NeoOffice already 
> supports these features in NeoOffice 3.2.1 Beta.
>
> Larry
> --
> _
> Larry I. Gusaas
> Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
> Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
> "An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs." 
> - Edgard Varese
>
>
>
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Fwd: [tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Mac Osx Lion

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Sorry never really replied to a mailing list before just checking this went
through.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

Begin forwarded message:

*From:* Laurence Jeloudev 
*Date:* 17 July 2011 20:34:01 AEST
*To:* Laurence Jeloudev 
*Subject:* *Re: [tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Mac Osx Lion*

By the way, I am using the auto save options in libreoffice. They do
work 99% of when I don't loose a document is the one percent where
saving a document and knowing you don't need to save it because you
know it will be their when you open the office suite again and then
you can save it to a folder or somewhere else, and you will always
know that it is saved every single character of it 100%.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 17/07/2011, at 20:29, Laurence Jeloudev  wrote:

The only problem is that this feature is I think integrated into the

os x lion operating system so it is constantly backing up the file

with the os x lion API which is integrated with the a feature called

versions which saves different versions of the document on to the hard

drive which I think also integrates with Mac os x lion's time machine.

I am not sure because mac os x lion is not out yet.


Laurence Jeloudev

ljelou...@gmail.com


On 17/07/2011, at 20:23, Laurence Jeloudev  wrote:


I think the ability is not saving.  The problem is with office suites

is that you always have to save your document so you don't loose your

work.  As Mac os x auto save feature is implemented so that you do not

save a document it is done automatically by any changes that you do in

a document. So it doesn't bug you to save the document before you

close it you just open it up how it was before. And you don't have to

worry about not saving your work.


www.apple.com/macosx/whats-new/auto-save.html


Laurence Jeloudev

ljelou...@gmail.com


On 17/07/2011, at 20:09, MiguelAngel  wrote:


Have you see in Menu/Tools/Options/Load-Save/General - Save

Autorecovery information every and Always create backup copy?El 17/07/11
9:57, Laurence Jeloudev escribi:Hi,



I was wondering if Libreoffice would implement an auto save feature in

os x lion and full screen app support, or maybe an auto save feature

that is similar but it can also be Implemented in other operating

systems like ubuntu or windows where the user does not have to worry

about saving a document at all?

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Mac Osx Lion

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I think the ability is not saving.  The problem is with office suites
is that you always have to save your document so you don't loose your
work.  As Mac os x auto save feature is implemented so that you do not
save a document it is done automatically by any changes that you do in
a document. So it doesn't bug you to save the document before you
close it you just open it up how it was before. And you don't have to
worry about not saving your work.

www.apple.com/macosx/whats-new/auto-save.html

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 17/07/2011, at 20:09, MiguelAngel  wrote:

> Have you see in Menu/Tools/Options/Load-Save/General - Save
>Autorecovery information every and Always create backup copy?El 17/07/11 
> 9:57, Laurence Jeloudev escribi:Hi,
>
>
> I was wondering if Libreoffice would implement an auto save feature in
> os x lion and full screen app support, or maybe an auto save feature
> that is similar but it can also be Implemented in other operating
> systems like ubuntu or windows where the user does not have to worry
> about saving a document at all?
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[tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Mac Osx Lion

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Hi,

I was wondering if Libreoffice would implement an auto save feature in
os x lion and full screen app support, or maybe an auto save feature
that is similar but it can also be Implemented in other operating
systems like ubuntu or windows where the user does not have to worry
about saving a document at all?

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: [Libreoffice] Proposal to join Apache OpenOffice

[Laurence Jeloudev]

So oracle won't make new licensing agreements with any one else except
apache which could see no contribution to the project unless your part
of ASF.


Laurence


On 05/06/2011, at 10:11, Jim Jagielski  wrote:

>
> On Jun 4, 2011, at 7:35 PM, Christian Lohmaier wrote:
>
>> Man, how I love fullquotes :-/
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 5, 2011 at 1:20 AM, Laurence Jeloudev  
>> wrote:
>>> Make a new license agreement for openoffice? With other contributing 
>>> companies.
>>
>> Sorry, but what is your point?
>> my point was that it is in my opionon a stupid idea for LO people to
>> sign up as contributors to the incubator proposal just "to have a say"
>> or "now there are no restrictions yet".
>>
>> Once in Apache, there is no discussion about licences anymore. Apache
>> only has its own license and has made it pretty clear numerous times
>> that they won't allow other licenses.
>>
>> Only Oracle could add another license to the mix, but if everyone
>> subscribes to the apache-proposal, and thus shows their support for
>> the apache license, why should Oracle even consider to re-license?
>>
>> So I absolutely don't udnerstand what you're trying to say, especially
>> when you write it as a f'up to my posting.
>>
>
> If the reason to not "join" Apache is because you are holding
> out hope that Oracle may still one day re-license, then I think
> you are holding out for a lost, lost hope.
>
> Whether OOo lives or dies in Apache, Oracle has made it abundantly
> clear that this is it... This is one promise I fully expect Oracle
> will keep :/
>
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: [Libreoffice] Proposal to join Apache OpenOffice

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Make a new license agreement for openoffice? With other contributing companies.

Laurence

On 05/06/2011, at 8:41, Christian Lohmaier
 wrote:

> Hi Allen, *,
>
> On Sat, Jun 4, 2011 at 3:08 PM, Allen Pulsifer  
> wrote:
>> [...]
>> I don't know what vision IBM has for the project.  I don't know what code
>> contribution they are going to make--I'm certain they will make some, but I
>> don't know what they will be.  I don't know what contributions members of
>> the LibreOffice community will or will not want to make.
>
> Given that they had 35 people working on it according to their press
> releases, that was ended up in OOo was  basically nonexistent. As
> you've been with the OOo project for a couple of years you can
> probably understand that people that were part of OOo project before
> switching over to TDF/LibreOffice don't have much trust in IBM's lip
> service.
>
> The few times they did contribute, it was code-dumping, far from
> contributing in a collaborative manner. The accessibility stuff that
> Rob just mentioned on the apache list has been promised since 2007 and
> he correctly stated that is is still (considerable) amount of /work/
> needed to get it integrated. They dumped it instead of contributing
> it. To me that's still a difference. The code is against an obsolete
> branch (OOo 1.1.5 codeline (!))
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Accessibility/IAccessible2_support
>
>> I do know this however.  There is currently an open invitation for us to get
>> involved.  If we get involved, we can have a say in with direction of the
>> project.
>
> Not really, as you first have to "surrender" to the Apache's licence
> terms. And that alone is reason for me not to join the effort.
>
>>  We can ensure that direction of the project provides the maximum
>> benefit for LibreOffice, which includes any contributions from IBM.
>> Basically, we can get IBM working for us.
>
> I really doubt it. What would change for them now, with the permissive
> licence, that did prevent them in the last 5 years from contributing?
> They (according to their press release) had massive manpower working
> on it (35 people), but what ended up in OOo is two code dumps to
> ancient codeline, one of which being lotuswordprofilter, the other the
> abovementioned accessibility dump.
>
> But before you say: It's not only IBM in the foundation. Then let me
> ask: Who else is? Oracle is gone for good. The few  individual
> contributers that have enlisted themselves as initial contributers on
> the apache wiki are to a big extent non-coder. (Not to say that the
> non-code contributors are not important, that's far from being my
> point)
> I currently find 5 people in that list of whom I'd say the have /some/
> idea of the code. And two of those already have a focus on a
> side-project/fork of OOo.
>
> So if you ask me who is on the Apache project who is not engaged in
> TDF/LO, then the only answer is: IBM.
> (But I'm also well aware that the proposal is new, and there might be
> more to come, and I'm also aware that to the apache-voting the big
> picture doesn't matter, they don't care whether it is considered a
> good idea or not. If there are enough people to run the podling and if
> IBM can convince them that it is possible to get rid of all the
> thirdparty stuff that doesn't comply with the strict licencing terms,
> they will approve it as an incubator project)
>
> And I don't really see a point in shifting this perception "now that
> nobody cares who enlists".
> IMHO you only should enlist yourself if you're really convinced that
> the Apache Foundation along with its restrictions/limitations and
> rules, esp. regarding licencing are a good idea, when you actually
> support the move.
>
> If you do, then go ahead and add yourself, I won't question your decision.
>
> The only "reason" on why the TDF should contribute is to why neooffice
> did "join" go-oo at the time: To make grabbing their code easier. But
> that is a very, very weak reason in my opinion.
>
>> So what I would like to see is an many LibreOffice people at the table as
>> possible.  If possible, I would like to see LibreOffice people dominating
>> the Apache OpenOffice community to get as much out of the project as we can.
>
> What is the point? If it is run by LO people, what is the benefit of
> creating another entity instead of letting OOo be what it is (or
> better was), and instead focusing only on LibreOffice?
>
> ciao
> Christian
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Mirrors : Australia.

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Sorry I didn't see it!!!
Thanks for replying though that's really good support.

There was a person that needed one for iinet maybe you can help him
with his mirror problem.

Thanks for your help.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 21/05/2011, at 2:52, Ben McGinnes  wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA512
>
> On 20/05/11 1:05 PM, Laurence Jeloudev wrote:
>> I'll see if I have the time to contact telstra about it. And see if
>> they can agree or aarnet.
>
> Addendum: you don't need to request anything, it's already there:
>
> http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/libreoffice/
>
>
> Regards,
> Ben
>
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/
>
> iEYEAREKAAYFAk3WnD4ACgkQNxrFv6BK4xMw+ACgynVUQEU8NElhcTt/FuY4eOxx
> yFQAn0uWQ3NLvyfzDLp4/PLUA3RzwtnM
> =0Sj4
> -END PGP SIGNATURE-
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Mirrors : Australia.

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I'll see if I have the time to contact telstra about it. And see if
they can agree or aarnet.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 20/05/2011, at 9:52, Jean Hollis Weber  wrote:

> On Thu, 2011-05-19 at 20:24 +1000, Laurence Jeloudev wrote:
>> Speaking about mirrors Libreoffice should be able to have a mirror on
>> mirror.aarnet.edu.au as it is unmetered for Telstra customers in
>> Australia and open-office has one as well. Another benefit is that it
>> is very fast for customers in Australia or New Zealand to get
>> libreoffice.
>
>
> One on iinet (my ISP) would be good too, for the same reason: unmetered.
> (I get Ubuntu and various other programs and updates through iinet's
> "Freezone", which also has a lot of other linux distros among other
> things.)
>
> I wonder what needs to be done to get iinet to agree to a mirror? I'll
> try to find out, but I may not find the time very soon to pursue this.
>
> --Jean
>
>
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[tdf-discuss] Mirrors : Australia.

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Speaking about mirrors Libreoffice should be able to have a mirror on
mirror.aarnet.edu.au as it is unmetered for Telstra customers in
Australia and open-office has one as well. Another benefit is that it
is very fast for customers in Australia or New Zealand to get
libreoffice.


Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

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Re: [tdf-discuss] Observations of LibreOffice and our users..

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I like the idea how google have separated chromium and google chrome.

For mirrors people should be able to have a choice. Or autodetect
closet mirror to them.


Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 19/05/2011, at 20:05, Gianluca Turconi  wrote:

> Laurence Jeloudev wrote:
>> I'd exactly agree with these statements libreoffice needs to have a
>> end user understanding not a developer understanding.
>
> I disagree.
>
> LibreOffice need to have *both*.
>
> Simply we have to channel end users better towards "LibreOffice, the product" 
> and the developers/contributors towards "LibreOffice, the project".
>
> I've several ideas about this but few time to write them down, since I'm 
> already working on another proposal for the project.
>
> Nevertheless, here how I'd like a LibO website reworking:
>
> --
> home page:
>
> [short description of what LibO, the software, is]
> 3 huge buttons: [Download] [Find Support] [Contribute]
> [short description of what TDF, the foundation, is]
>
> Then, under [Find Support]:
>
> [*all* support mailing list *with* @libreoffice.org suffix]
>
> [any other external and independent support system]
>
> Finally, under [Contribute], other 3 huge buttons:
>
> [Contribute money] -> Fund raising
>
> [Contribute your skills and time] -> a central employment system that I'm 
> just now proposing in the projects@@libreoffice.org mailing list.
>
> [Join projects' discussion] -> *all* projects' mailing lists *with* 
> @libreoffice.org + other external and independent resources.
> --
>
> Of course, the idea lacks a lot of details that must be included 
> (documentation, mirrors, source code...) and above all I've no data about 
> LibO statistics of what pages are more accessed by web users.
>
> It's just an idea, for the time being.
>
> Regards,
>
> Gianluca
> --
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> fantasy, horror, noir, narrativa fantastica e tradizionale:
> http://www.letturefantastiche.com/
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Observations of LibreOffice and our users..

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I'd exactly agree with these statements libreoffice needs to have a
end user understanding not a developer understanding.

Laurence Jeloudev
ljelou...@gmail.com

On 19/05/2011, at 14:47, Xing Li  wrote:

> Hi, I'm the administrator for FanFiction.Net and FictionPress.com and
> we have always pushed openoffice and now
> libreoffice to our users. However, we would like to give you guys some
> feedbacks from our users regarding the
> perception of libreoffice.
>
> 1) Our members are mostly non-techy and heavy users of word processing 
> features.
> 2A) Some members falsely believe we are profiting off somehow from
> this LibreOffice download.
> 2B) Some members have false perception of LibreOffice somehow paying
> us to put a link to your site.
> 3) (2) shows that LibreOffice is a new name with not a widely accepted
> recognition in the non-tech world.
> 4) Overall, it's leading to lower adoption that I would like and a
> general false perception that I did not see with OpenOffice.
>
> Recommendations:
>
> Please retool the Libreoffice site just a little with more emphasis on
> the following:
>
> 1) "Abouse US" should not be last item in the menu. LibreOffice has a
> branding problem and it should be first or second in
> terms of prioity on the menu.
> 2) Make the site and especially the download page, which most of us
> link to, more consumer and not project centric.
> Right now, the whole site looks very business/corporate like.
> 3) Emphasis "Non-Profit" much more. So that new users can
> differentiate "free" vs "non-profit". There are
> lots of free software out there that have commerical tie-ins and
> LibreOffice needs to give more thoughts to this.
>
> For example the first sentence of About US page is:
>
> "LibreOffice is community-driven and developed software which is a
> project of the not-for-profit organization, The Document Foundation."
>
> Why is "not-for-profit" the last thought of the sentence? Also no
> mention of free either. This sentence is written for developers and
> not end-users
> which is a oversight. Target the end-users first. Developers are smart
> enough to know who you guys are already.
>
> Maybe I'm being too detailed here but overall, I would like
> LibreOffice to do a better job of presenting itself via the website as
> a free end-user, consumer friendly software from an non-profit entity.
>
> It's more about presentations of LibreOffice to the end-user to give
> them a comfortable feeling when they visit the site for the first
> time. The download page is needlessly too complicated for end-users.
> Don't list sdk or source code builds. End-users have no idea what they
> are. Perhaps have a "end-user/consumer"-centric main site and a
> separate dev.libreoffice.org site.
>
> I would recommend a similar approach as taken by sites such as
> www.getfirefox.com or www.google.com/chrome.  Just give them one
> download link, one logo, one line intro to what it is and that is
> free, plus a friendly graphics and then a link to find out more if
> they want to.
>
> Just some suggestions. I love the software and would like to help it
> spread like summer weed. =)
>
> Regards,
>
> Xing
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] LO & OO are not the only competitors of MSOffice... LO could also make a simple office suite that runs in Android & iOS

[Laurence Jeloudev]

If LO didn't have any bugs and it worked very well compared to the
free version of a bugged OO that had many problems then people would
choose to buy LO because obviously they see the benefits of using a
free version on there desktop of LO that doesn't have many bugs that
are as bad as OO so they would buy the mobile version assuming it
would be the same.

It's as long as the product works and is easy to use.
Sent from my iPhone

On 09/04/2011, at 4:01 PM, Jonathan Aquilina  wrote:

> Agreed but the problem is if lets say OOo have the rather buggy writer 
> available and its free. which do you think people would prefer to go with?
>
> On 09/04/2011 00:35, Laurence Jeloudev wrote:
>> Even if you had to pay for the apps it would help gain revenue for LO
>> in the mobile market especially for iOS.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 09/04/2011, at 5:17 AM, Ian Lynch  wrote:
>>
>>> On 8 April 2011 19:06, Jaime R. Garza  wrote:
>>>
>>>> For Android and iPhone it doesn't make sense to have the whole LO, only
>>>> Clac, Writer&  Impress are needed urgently!
>>>>
>>> Probably only Writer and Calc and an Impress viewer in the first instance.
>>> Snag is Uno. Replacing Uno with a web common platform would be one way to do
>>> it but it would mean you had to have web access to use the apps.
>>>
>>> If LO manages to place those three apps for Android, ODF will gain momentum.
>>>> Cheers!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 21:01, todd rme  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 2:12 AM, Jonathan Aquilina
>>>>>   wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 7:36 AM, toki  wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/04/2011 14:43, Jonathan Aquilina wrote:
>>>>>>>> How much of LO would need to be ported since android is linux based
>>>> as
>>>>>>> is?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Basically, it needs to be rewritten in a language that can be compiled
>>>>>>> into Dalvik Bytecode.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The usual language is Java, but at least one C++ compiler that
>>>>>>> accomplishes the same effect exists.
>>>>>> If one c++ compiler already exists then wouldnt it be easy as just
>>>>> telling
>>>>>> the compiler to compile?
>>>>> Almost certainly not, it most likely needs to be able to support the
>>>>> proper Android APIs to work properly.  And that is only to get it
>>>>> working as-is, without any reworking of the UI to be better on a
>>>>> touch-based device.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Todd
>>>>>
>>>>> --
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>>>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] LO & OO are not the only competitors of MSOffice... LO could also make a simple office suite that runs in Android & iOS

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Even if you had to pay for the apps it would help gain revenue for LO
in the mobile market especially for iOS.

Sent from my iPhone

On 09/04/2011, at 5:17 AM, Ian Lynch  wrote:

> On 8 April 2011 19:06, Jaime R. Garza  wrote:
>
>> For Android and iPhone it doesn't make sense to have the whole LO, only
>> Clac, Writer & Impress are needed urgently!
>>
>
> Probably only Writer and Calc and an Impress viewer in the first instance.
> Snag is Uno. Replacing Uno with a web common platform would be one way to do
> it but it would mean you had to have web access to use the apps.
>
> If LO manages to place those three apps for Android, ODF will gain momentum.
>>
>> Cheers!
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 21:01, todd rme  wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 2:12 AM, Jonathan Aquilina
>>>  wrote:
 On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 7:36 AM, toki  wrote:
>
> On 06/04/2011 14:43, Jonathan Aquilina wrote:
>> How much of LO would need to be ported since android is linux based
>> as
> is?
>
> Basically, it needs to be rewritten in a language that can be compiled
> into Dalvik Bytecode.
>
> The usual language is Java, but at least one C++ compiler that
> accomplishes the same effect exists.

 If one c++ compiler already exists then wouldnt it be easy as just
>>> telling
 the compiler to compile?
>>>
>>> Almost certainly not, it most likely needs to be able to support the
>>> proper Android APIs to work properly.  And that is only to get it
>>> working as-is, without any reworking of the UI to be better on a
>>> touch-based device.
>>>
>>> -Todd
>>>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Capitalizing Letters:

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Thanks or the shortcuts for ubuntu and Linux

Sent from my iPhone

On 07/04/2011, at 10:05 PM, M Henri Day  wrote:

> 2011/4/7 Steve Edmonds 
>
>>
>>
>> On 2011-04-07 10:54, Steve Edmonds wrote:
>>>
>>> On 2011-04-07 10:02, Christoph Noack wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Laurence!
>>>>
>>>> Am Donnerstag, den 07.04.2011, 07:32 +1000 schrieb Laurence Jeloudev:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> can't there be a shortcut like in microsoft office for capitalisation?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> You can define a shortcut to execute the capitalization feature. Please
>>>> go to Tools -- Customize... and the tab "Keyboard". Then select an entry
>>>> in "Shortcut keys" according to your wish (Strg+F3 is already used for
>>>> AutoText, but you may change that). Then, chose the desired feature - in
>>>> your case it might be "Category"="Format", and "Function"="Capitalize
>>>> Every Word" (or: "Rotate case").
>>>>
>>>> Does this help?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Christoph
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Thanks, helped me - I just had a cause to lowercase 2 letters in the
>>> middle of a list of uppercase words. Made it much easier with a shortcut.
>>>
>>>
>> In fact it is even better to asign my own shortcut. For best efficiency
>> I like to keep one hand on the mouse and one on the keyboard
>> (highlight-shortcut) and hence I want one handed shortcuts. SHIFT+F is
>> no good, CTRL+SHIFT+L or CTRL+SHIFT+U works for me.
>>
>
> When assigning, keyboard shortcuts, Ubuntu and other Linux users might want
> to note that «Ctrl + Shift + u» provides access to Unicode hexadecimals
>
> Henri
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Capitalizing Letters:

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Cool I'll give it ago!

Ljelly

Sent from my iPhone

On 07/04/2011, at 8:02 AM, Christoph Noack
 wrote:

> Hi Laurence!
>
> Am Donnerstag, den 07.04.2011, 07:32 +1000 schrieb Laurence Jeloudev:
>> can't there be a shortcut like in microsoft office for capitalisation?
>
> You can define a shortcut to execute the capitalization feature. Please
> go to Tools -- Customize... and the tab "Keyboard". Then select an entry
> in "Shortcut keys" according to your wish (Strg+F3 is already used for
> AutoText, but you may change that). Then, chose the desired feature - in
> your case it might be "Category"="Format", and "Function"="Capitalize
> Every Word" (or: "Rotate case").
>
> Does this help?
>
> Cheers,
> Christoph
>
>
>> ljelly.
>>
>> On 07/04/2011, at 6:53 AM, Christoph Noack wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Jonathan!
>>>
>>> Am Mittwoch, den 06.04.2011, 12:40 + schrieb toki:
>>>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>
>>>> On 06/04/2011 07:59, lj wrote:
>>>>> Capitalizing Letters in LibreOffice.
>>>>
>>>> ">Format >Change Case"
>>>> Options are:
>>>> * Sentence Case;
>>>> * Lower Case;
>>>> * Upper Case;
>>>> * Capitalize Every Word.  (This should be renamed to "Title Case");
>>>
>>> There is a difference between "capitalize every word" and "title case".
>>> Liz once nicely described the Title Case in the OpenOffice.org User
>>> Interface Text Guidelines:
>>> http://specs.openoffice.org/collaterals/guides/text-style-guide.html#7.
>>>
>>> So the current menu item naming seems correct, but ... see below,
>>> please.
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>> The "Change Case" menu really changes the characters (and thus: it's not
>>> formatting only - if one looks closer). There is another option that
>>> only applies a real formatting and, thus, doesn't change the entered
>>> characters. It is located in the Format - Character menu (tab: Font
>>> Effects, drop-down: Effects). You can set it to "Title" as well
>>> (strange, the behavior differs from the description above).
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Christoph
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> deleted
>>
>>
>
>
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Feature Request: Capitalizing Letters:

[Laurence Jeloudev]

can't there be a shortcut like in microsoft office for capitalisation?

ljelly. 

On 07/04/2011, at 6:53 AM, Christoph Noack wrote:

> Hi Jonathan!
> 
> Am Mittwoch, den 06.04.2011, 12:40 + schrieb toki:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>> 
>> On 06/04/2011 07:59, lj wrote:
>>> Capitalizing Letters in LibreOffice.
>> 
>> ">Format >Change Case"
>> Options are:
>> * Sentence Case;
>> * Lower Case;
>> * Upper Case;
>> * Capitalize Every Word.  (This should be renamed to "Title Case");
> 
> There is a difference between "capitalize every word" and "title case".
> Liz once nicely described the Title Case in the OpenOffice.org User
> Interface Text Guidelines:
> http://specs.openoffice.org/collaterals/guides/text-style-guide.html#7.
> 
> So the current menu item naming seems correct, but ... see below,
> please.
> 
> [...]
> 
> The "Change Case" menu really changes the characters (and thus: it's not
> formatting only - if one looks closer). There is another option that
> only applies a real formatting and, thus, doesn't change the entered
> characters. It is located in the Format - Character menu (tab: Font
> Effects, drop-down: Effects). You can set it to "Title" as well
> (strange, the behavior differs from the description above).
> 
> Cheers,
> Christoph
> 
> 
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Re: [tdf-discuss] European Commitee enter talks with MS licences, Please make your action today against it.

[Laurence Jeloudev]

MO? What about iWork? How
Come our document formats don't work with them.

Sent from my iPhone

On 06/04/2011, at 9:23 PM, toki  wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 05/04/2011 14:56, Mike Hall wrote:
>> long documents, I personally came across only 2 instances of genuine MSO 
>> bugs.
>
> I guess it is a feature that when I used MSO 2010 with Win7, the mean
> time till seeing the BSOD was under 100 seconds. I guess it is a feature
> that with MSO97 on Win2K mean time to BSOD was just on 60 minutes.
>
>> at least it didn't to me, nor did I hear complaints of that kind from
>
> How much of that was because they were so used to MSO trashing their
> documents, that they did not know that software could be bug free.
> And that it is not normal to have to spend hours fixing documents
> because the program that created the document is incompatible with the
> program that created the document?
>
>> that OOo/LibO has a product offering of adequate quality to be
>> cost-effective in a high-cost labour economy.
>
> If only due to the mean time to BSOD, MSO is equally, if not more
> inadequate that LibO or OOo is.
>
>> The support costs are just far too high.
>
>> to MSO, by which I primarily mean an absence of bugs.
>
> Riddle me this. Why is the same bug that was in Word 1.0, found in MSO
> 2010?  That shows a clear commitment to ignoring bug reports.
>
> Even more bizarre, is that Word allegedly had at least one major
> rewrite, as well as being ported from being an 8 bit program to bing a
> 64 bit program.
>
> jonathon
> - --
> If Bing copied Google, there wouldn't be anything new worth requesting.
>
> If Bing did not copy Google, there wouldn't be anything relevant worth
> requesting.
>
>  DaveJakeman 20110207 Groklaw.
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/
>
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> =1+vJ
> -END PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: [tdf-discuss] How difficult is it to port Libreoffice to theAndroid Tablets? Is there any plan yet?

[Laurence Jeloudev]

That sounds easy since apple doesn't support flash

Sent from my iPhone

On 08/03/2011, at 7:44 AM, "Jaime R. Garza"  wrote:

> As I have mentioned before, I think, the best solution would be to make a
> HTML5 based LO!
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 7, 2011 at 21:27, Alexandro Colorado  wrote:
>
>> Linux on Arm is not the same as LibreOffice on ARM. My N900 runs Debian
>> Linux on Arm, but it has X connected to it. Without it, LibO won't run.
>> Thats the issue we had earlier with OOo on OSX.
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 7, 2011 at 7:58 AM, Chao Sun  wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Alexandro,
>>>
>>>

 However, I would rather see some code, and not just ideas. My question
>> is
 when will u launch a proof of concept, or at least try?

>>>
>>> We are typing some code now. However, firstly we need to do the "cross
>>> compile" part. And some issues need to address. I've heard the "linux on
>>> ARM" has already been done. And if anybody have access to those assembly
>>> code.  Or have clue where we should headed, please ring the bell.
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> Chao
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>


>
> Cheers!
>
> Jaime
>
> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 11:56, Mirek M.  wrote:
>
>> 2011/3/4 Jaime R. Garza 
>>
>>> In my humble opinion it will be great to have the UI separated from
>>> all
>> the
>>> rest. Think of WebKit in the Browser! That would allow to have a QT
>>> UI,
> a
>>> GTK UI, a Multitouch UI, etc.
>>>
>>
>> There are two projects already underway with this goal in mind:
>> WebODFand
>> ODFKit  (WebODF seems to be an
>> evolution
>>> of
>> ODFKit, and although it uses web technologies, it's still suitable
>> for
>> desktop and mobile applications).
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 02:52, Chaosun  wrote:
>>>
 Well, I had a quite long chat with tml_ regarding the porting to
>> Android
 issue. The truth is that we are planning to have a try. However the
>>> workload
 is tremendous due to the loss of UI. Also to fit the platform, we
> need
>> a
 complete redesign on UE.

 The possible works would be:

 1. Get rid of all the UI related modules such as vcl, sfx2,
>> framework
>> and
 corresponding services etc.
 2. A engine like LibreOffice, no UI, only provides APIs for further
 development.
 3. Create a UI for multitouch devices
 Just name a few. no one is a easy work. Also, I'd like to hear from
>> you.
 Please do advice!

 Regards
 Chao
 --
 Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to
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 *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***


>>>
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 --
 *Alexandro Colorado*
 *OpenOffice.org* Español
 http://es.openoffice.org

 --
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Re: [tdf-discuss] How difficult is it to port Libreoffice to theAndroid Tablets? Is there any plan yet?

[Laurence Jeloudev]

It's not all about android what about all the people that use iOS?

Laurence.

On 08/03/2011, at 1:00 AM, Jonathan Aquilina  wrote:

> On 3/7/11 2:58 PM, Chao Sun wrote:
>> Hello Alexandro,
>>
>>
>>> However, I would rather see some code, and not just ideas. My question is
>>> when will u launch a proof of concept, or at least try?
>>>
>> We are typing some code now. However, firstly we need to do the "cross 
>> compile" part. And some issues need to address. I've heard the "linux on 
>> ARM" has already been done. And if anybody have access to those assembly 
>> code.  Or have clue where we should headed, please ring the bell.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Chao
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
 Cheers!

 Jaime

 On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 11:56, Mirek M.  wrote:

> 2011/3/4 Jaime R. Garza
>
>> In my humble opinion it will be great to have the UI separated from all
> the
>> rest. Think of WebKit in the Browser! That would allow to have a QT UI,
 a
>> GTK UI, a Multitouch UI, etc.
>>
> There are two projects already underway with this goal in mind:
> WebODFand
> ODFKit  (WebODF seems to be an evolution of
> ODFKit, and although it uses web technologies, it's still suitable for
> desktop and mobile applications).
>
> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 02:52, Chaosun  wrote:
>>> Well, I had a quite long chat with tml_ regarding the porting to
> Android
>>> issue. The truth is that we are planning to have a try. However the
>> workload
>>> is tremendous due to the loss of UI. Also to fit the platform, we
 need
> a
>>> complete redesign on UE.
>>>
>>> The possible works would be:
>>>
>>> 1. Get rid of all the UI related modules such as vcl, sfx2, framework
> and
>>> corresponding services etc.
>>> 2. A engine like LibreOffice, no UI, only provides APIs for further
>>> development.
>>> 3. Create a UI for multitouch devices
>>> Just name a few. no one is a easy work. Also, I'd like to hear from
> you.
>>> Please do advice!
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Chao
>>> --
>>> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to
> discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org
>>> Archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/
>>> *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
>>>
>>>
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 discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org
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>>>
>>> --
>>> *Alexandro Colorado*
>>> *OpenOffice.org* Español
>>> http://es.openoffice.org
>>>
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>>
>>
> Wouldnt cmake come in handy in this case as its a cross platform make?
>
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Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Libreoffice for Mac

[Laurence Jeloudev]

I'd just like to ask the people who are libreoffice contributors for Mac.
Mac Osx lion apparently has full screen apps integration can we see
something similar in libreoffice on mac Osx lion in the future  or
before the release of lion?

Laurence.

On 06/03/2011, at 6:50 PM, Alexander Thurgood  wrote:

> Le 05/03/11 15:20, adept techlists - kazar a écrit :
>
> Hi,
>
>>
>> so far the actual question has not been answered i'm also curious to
>> know if there is a strong Mac porting team among those who are now
>> working on LibreOffice, and whether they will be ensuring Lion
>> compatibility
>>
>
> You might be better off asking on the developer list, rather than here,
> but Christian, who provide you with an answer, is one of the people who
> builds LibO on Mac, and as far as I know, there are others. As to
> whether LibO will be adapted specifically to take account of Mac OSX
> Lion's latest and greatest developments / functions, that would seem
> unlikely if the build baseline remains Tiger, since many functions have
> been introduced by Apple post-Tiger that do not work with that release
> of the OS.
>
>
> Alex
>
>
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[tdf-discuss] Libreoffice for Mac

[Laurence Jeloudev]

Will libreoffice be supported for future os s on the Mac?

Etc Mac Osx lion?

Sent from my iPhone

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