Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Paolo Cavallini wrote: Il giorno mar, 08/03/2011 alle 08.28 +0100, Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas ha scritto: I wouldn't suggest google code as a repository unless you don't care about people living in USA embargoed countries. Google apply USA export restrictions and developers can't access those repositories (a Cuban OSGeo-es member suffers this stuff all the time). BTW: is this stil a problem with the OSGEO repo? All the best. Paolo, not a problem and was never a direct OSGeo issue either. GeoNetwork operate their code repositories at SoureForge who had some policy changes a few months back imposing strict export restriction rules to arbitrarily all projects, whether justified or not. Developers from some nations had trouble for some time continuing to contribute and use code. Project owners could eventually (after some protesting directed at SF) revert these changes if they do not export restricted code. Then again, this whole issues is but a laugh and certainly not worth spending so many words on because it is so very easy to circumnavigate by using proxies. It is again based on the general misunderstanding that one could apply the same restriction to software as to matter. Which simply does not work. Try to copy a brick, or make a backup or send it via email. The other way round (partially restrict the distribution of digital data) does not work either. Never. It is nothing but a nuissance and it demonstrates how unrelated politics, policies and laws are to the real world. Best regards, Arnulf - -- Exploring Space, Time and Mind http://arnulf.us -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAk12D0oACgkQXmFKW+BJ1b3B9gCePNf/6pxeapzEx1P1V0Q9j6Qq KCgAn12NYun2wMgsU4hJbME1DUl3+uUb =Dhbi -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 El 08/03/11 12:13, Seven (aka Arnulf) escribió: Paolo Cavallini wrote: Il giorno mar, 08/03/2011 alle 08.28 +0100, Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas ha scritto: I wouldn't suggest google code as a repository unless you don't care about people living in USA embargoed countries. Google apply USA export restrictions and developers can't access those repositories (a Cuban OSGeo-es member suffers this stuff all the time). BTW: is this stil a problem with the OSGEO repo? All the best. Paolo, not a problem and was never a direct OSGeo issue either. GeoNetwork operate their code repositories at SoureForge who had some policy changes a few months back imposing strict export restriction rules to arbitrarily all projects, whether justified or not. Developers from some nations had trouble for some time continuing to contribute and use code. Project owners could eventually (after some protesting directed at SF) revert these changes if they do not export restricted code. Then again, this whole issues is but a laugh and certainly not worth spending so many words on because it is so very easy to circumnavigate by using proxies. It is again based on the general misunderstanding that one could apply the same restriction to software as to matter. Which simply does not work. Try to copy a brick, or make a backup or send it via email. The other way round (partially restrict the distribution of digital data) does not work either. Never. It is nothing but a nuissance and it demonstrates how unrelated politics, policies and laws are to the real world. I agree this is a nonsense, but as I said, many people are suffering those restrictions so as they are applied to many services and sites (not only for developers, also for something as normal as getting a java virtual machine, for example) I would encourage to avoid using them. SEXTANTE for example moved from Google Code to OSOR.eu forge because of this. Best - -- Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas http://es.osgeo.org http://jorgesanz.net -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJNdiZGAAoJEAOYD75lvHdBlvUIALRv9gjg2g2vpSnGfTghrErO iv+7OtcCpz4j+wBZGLdKrioQzhRWwKsR5RIg+hQOyndrnO0AgxEhPclL1G5NlQft xcqepZtTSD7WxWRBe4X+Z2JEodP3Y6zOWKx6JfUPKb1vmfJrAug4lYPUKfzq4sRv /s64WN3BwLAm3G2wuGMUQmV9w5ntTtTiyl//hQvj2FhBB/yHTS3Rut2AZB3hTugR fsxxiy65u7F3Y9k08JSILTFHbikVE+voqB2+cCy6cXrAa54UlEjtnsKwHhdNjGjg XuIpSnFPsNuHPWwTmU+hrd86qD32wNQsJsXXAMIINXe+gqXJv091HL1ryvbQa5w= =CNmy -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
On Tue, Mar 08, 2011 at 03:08:44PM +0100, Paolo Cavallini wrote: Il giorno mar, 08/03/2011 alle 13.51 +0100, Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas ha scritto: I agree this is a nonsense, but as I said, many people are suffering those restrictions so as they are applied to many services and sites (not only for developers, also for something as normal as getting a java virtual machine, for example) I would encourage to avoid using them. SEXTANTE for example moved from Google Code to OSOR.eu forge because of this. Just to make it clear: can people from, say, Cuba, download packages from OSGEO servers? A few years back we had reports they could not. All the best. There are no restrictions on any OSGeo services that intentionally prevent access from any location. At one point, some OSGeo projects were hosted on SourceForge, which enforced these restrictions, but they were never in place on servers maintained by OSGeo. Best Regards, -- Christopher Schmidt Web Developer ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
Daniel, First, thanks for the book link, looks like an excellent resource. I see your point about a directory structure 'starter kit' and the actual procedures for managing a project as open-source. At best, a pre-populated structure may save some busy-work while launching the project, and give some hints to the day-to-day operation (what tools are installed there, the directory permissions etc.). I wonder if it is less 'starter kit' and more 'cookbook' Let's take the utility and telecom personnel attending GITA as an example. I believe they'll find their problem spaces (e.g., asset network design / maintenance) largely unpopulated at the moment with targeted open-source apps. Let's assume that no combination of existing open-source tools solves their problem without significant additional coding. Rather than passively waiting for someone else out there to develop the application, or building a solution in-house, I'd like these utility folks to feel empowered to combine forces and develop their solution as open-source. Most certainly (we hope) they'll enlist the open-source developer community. But I'd like for as few structural hurdles as possible to stand in the way, or the industry people will simply dismiss the entire idea as too complex and never even get started. What do you suppose are the most effective things we as a community can build or do to pave the way for this model of industry participation? Robert I think it would be challenging to come up with an Open-Source Project Starter Kit that really works. I mean, launching and running an open source project is not only about making the source available under the right project infrastructure and tools, it is also in large part a different way to build and manage software and its community of users and developers, and this knowledge does not come in a box. The book Producing Open Source Software could be a good starting point: http://producingoss.com/ My personal advice to anyone willing to launch and run a successful open source project would be to join and contribute to existing successful open source project for a little while, then try to immerse yourself in the way they do things, and apply those tricks to your project. Daniel -- Daniel Morissette http://www.mapgears.com/ Provider of Professional MapServer Support since 2000 ___ ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
On 11-03-03 11:54 AM, Robert Hollingsworth wrote: It has occurred to me that it would be useful to create an Open-Source Project Starter Kit, a file structure consisting of the means to create and maintain a project, with none of the actual content. It's skeleton website definition would simply point at the unpopulated management components. [...] Any ideas out there on the feasibility of something like this, how to construct, etc.? I know a starter kit such as this would be most attractive to the GITA audience I'll be speaking to if it as close as possible to being a one-button operation. Hi Robert, I think it would be challenging to come up with an Open-Source Project Starter Kit that really works. I mean, launching and running an open source project is not only about making the source available under the right project infrastructure and tools, it is also in large part a different way to build and manage software and its community of users and developers, and this knowledge does not come in a box. The book Producing Open Source Software could be a good starting point: http://producingoss.com/ My personal advice to anyone willing to launch and run a successful open source project would be to join and contribute to existing successful open source project for a little while, then try to immerse yourself in the way they do things, and apply those tricks to your project. Daniel -- Daniel Morissette http://www.mapgears.com/ Provider of Professional MapServer Support since 2000 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
On 08/03/11 07:09, Daniel Morissette wrote: On 11-03-03 11:54 AM, Robert Hollingsworth wrote: It has occurred to me that it would be useful to create an Open-Source Project Starter Kit, a file structure consisting of the means to create and maintain a project, with none of the actual content. It's skeleton website definition would simply point at the unpopulated management components. [...] Any ideas out there on the feasibility of something like this, how to construct, etc.? I know a starter kit such as this would be most attractive to the GITA audience I'll be speaking to if it as close as possible to being a one-button operation. Hi Robert, I think it would be challenging to come up with an Open-Source Project Starter Kit that really works. I mean, launching and running an open source project is not only about making the source available under the right project infrastructure and tools, it is also in large part a different way to build and manage software and its community of users and developers, and this knowledge does not come in a box. The book Producing Open Source Software could be a good starting point: http://producingoss.com/ My personal advice to anyone willing to launch and run a successful open source project would be to join and contribute to existing successful open source project for a little while, then try to immerse yourself in the way they do things, and apply those tricks to your project. Daniel And I'd extend Daniel's comment to suggest that in 95% of cases, someone's contributions are significantly more valuable if they extend an existing project rather than start another project and compete for users and developers. -- Cameron Shorter Geospatial Director Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050 Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254 Think Globally, Fix Locally Geospatial Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open Source http://www.lisasoft.com ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
Besides SourceForge, Google Code is a great hosting environment for open source projects, and also github is becoming very popular. Cheers Paul On 2011-03-03, at 11:54 AM, Robert Hollingsworth wrote: Hello, I'm giving a presentation at the GITA conference in Grapevine TX in April, as part of the OSGEO track there. (Audience: electric/gas/water utilities, telecommunications, etc.) Subject of the talk: highlights of management of a project as open-source, especially where that differs from software development in the single-company, closed-source model. Although the audience is likely to be mostly consisting of non-software developers, I'll be calling on these very people to team up with each other and with in-house and/or consulting software engineers -- across company lines -- to launch, build, and maintain open-source apps that address needs in their respective subject areas. I've got a fair amount of research to do to compile this information -- what apps and file structures comprise a viable project server, presenting all that through the project web site, etc. It has occurred to me that it would be useful to create an Open-Source Project Starter Kit, a file structure consisting of the means to create and maintain a project, with none of the actual content. It's skeleton website definition would simply point at the unpopulated management components. A quick google suggests there are tools out there addressing some of this. And there's Sourceforge, of course. But if OSGEO were to create such a kit, it could be constructed so that the resulting projects match many of the criteria for qualifying as OSGEO member projects later. Any ideas out there on the feasibility of something like this, how to construct, etc.? I know a starter kit such as this would be most attractive to the GITA audience I'll be speaking to if it as close as possible to being a one-button operation. Thanks, Robert H. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss __ Paul Spencer Chief Technology Officer DM Solutions Group Inc http://research.dmsolutions.ca/ ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
On 7 March 2011 22:38, Paul Spencer pspen...@dmsolutions.ca wrote: Besides SourceForge, Google Code is a great hosting environment for open source projects, and also github is becoming very popular. Cheers Paul I wouldn't suggest google code as a repository unless you don't care about people living in USA embargoed countries. Google apply USA export restrictions and developers can't access those repositories (a Cuban OSGeo-es member suffers this stuff all the time). Of course this is not a blame against Google, as they just apply these stupid USA laws. Maybe gitorious.org? -- Jorge Sanz http://es.osgeo.org ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] open-source project site construction
Hello Robert, I'm not sure if this will help, but I've been using OSGeo live dvd to start a production server. I'm doing it under Linux (Ubuntu), mainly for it multiuser, multitasking features (a server:)) Itś not a large project, but after configuring it, I've managed shared resources, users and groups, permissions, and even remote applications and desktops. It lets you use any kind of computer (even old ones as graphic terminals), and OS (Windows, MacOS, probably Android). You can throw every aplication available, and use it in a multiuser environment! All this is standard Linux practice, but applied to GIS. The options are huge. Hope it helps. Alex Borrell, Guadalajara, MX On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:54 AM, Robert Hollingsworth r...@prodigy.netwrote: Hello, I'm giving a presentation at the GITA conference in Grapevine TX in April, as part of the OSGEO track there. (Audience: electric/gas/water utilities, telecommunications, etc.) Subject of the talk: highlights of management of a project as open-source, especially where that differs from software development in the single-company, closed-source model. Although the audience is likely to be mostly consisting of non-software developers, I'll be calling on these very people to team up with each other and with in-house and/or consulting software engineers -- across company lines -- to launch, build, and maintain open-source apps that address needs in their respective subject areas. I've got a fair amount of research to do to compile this information -- what apps and file structures comprise a viable project server, presenting all that through the project web site, etc. It has occurred to me that it would be useful to create an Open-Source Project Starter Kit, a file structure consisting of the means to create and maintain a project, with none of the actual content. It's skeleton website definition would simply point at the unpopulated management components. A quick google suggests there are tools out there addressing some of this. And there's Sourceforge, of course. But if OSGEO were to create such a kit, it could be constructed so that the resulting projects match many of the criteria for qualifying as OSGEO member projects later. Any ideas out there on the feasibility of something like this, how to construct, etc.? I know a starter kit such as this would be most attractive to the GITA audience I'll be speaking to if it as close as possible to being a one-button operation. Thanks, Robert H. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
