Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023 (extended deadline)
Letters of intent are due March 21. https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2023_Bid_Process Merry mapping, Eli On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 2:43 PM Vasile Craciunescu wrote: > Dear OSGeo/FOSS4G Community, > > The deadline for proposals to host our beloved global conference was > extended. Please take a look at the information package and, *please*, dare > to bid! It's very very important for our community. > > > May the FOSS4G be with everyone, > > Vasile & Msilikale, on behalf of OSGeo's Conference Committee > > > > [1] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2023_Bid_Process > > [2] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Conference_Committee > > ___ > Conference_dev mailing list > conference_...@lists.osgeo.org > https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev > ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023
On Wed, 12 Jan 2022 at 16:45, Michael Smith via Discuss wrote: > > I would say that its probably best to think about Hybrid, as this is what is > happening for 2022. Essentially you are both right, there are pluses and > minuses to each. And we want to support both going forward as there isn’t > going to be an approach that works for everyone. Future FOSS4Gs will probably > all part virtual and in-person. > Yes, I also (and not only because as FIrenze LOC are following these way) think in the future virtual and in-person FOSS4G should be the way to go. To save the environment a better idea is to connect similar events in the same place at closed times. I really look forward to being able to join FOSS4G, SotM, HOT summit, OGRS, geopython, gvsig, etc conferences all together. Since the spirit and the values are really similar I think it could be possible to get a bigger year conference about Open Geography tools and data. About the effort of Local committee to start again it is true, for that I would like to see in the future an OSGeo Working group managing the organisation of the conference with the help of Local committee (this already happen for SotM and HOT Summit) > > Mike > -- ciao Luca www.lucadelu.org ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023
Dear (OS)Geo friends, > > we really hope that FOSS4G2023 can be safely > organized in > > physical format. >> Why? >>> Because we humans are social animals; and people like me, who are almost completely burnt out by not having been outside of their houses for nearly >>> two years, could really use an in-person event to see their friends and their personal heroes. Exactly, I can only say yes, yes and yes to this. For me the social interaction is the main reason (at least for me) to attend such and event (even an online one). I can go even a step further: while the technical/subject content is nice, often even great that is not the main driver to attend such and event - I can watch such in video and recordings all over the web online any time, but the human interaction, networking and all that is priceless. It is absolutely a main driver for such events. This is not going to be covered with any online event (even a great one like FOSS4G Argentina last year), yup it still does not come even close, too much is lost in 'translation'. >>> I'm not gonna attack Jonathan's points (or even reply to them, risking an episode of sealioning to erode my patience), Neither will I do, some of the points are definitely valid >>> but I want to make one of my own: >>> It's good for our collective mental health. We *want* an in person event, we >>> *hope* for it; which for me is a sign our brains have some demand for it, even if it's intangible. While there are many pros and cons (online vs. in person) that could lead to "years of discussions' and a hundred people have 300 opinions - for me it really boils down to the need for the social interactions (and all the myriad of benefits that stem from that) mentioned above. I did not even start listing all my personal benefits (as a 'placeholder' example) I had after I attended my fist FOSS4G Vancouver in 2007 (and other conferences over the years) because I don't want to go into the "nitty gritty" here. Long live FOSS4G "in person" events ! Cheers Karsten Principal TerraGIS LTD www.terragis.net ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023
I would say that its probably best to think about Hybrid, as this is what is happening for 2022. Essentially you are both right, there are pluses and minuses to each. And we want to support both going forward as there isn’t going to be an approach that works for everyone. Future FOSS4Gs will probably all part virtual and in-person. Note this is my personal opinion. Mike -- Michael Smith US Army Corps / Remote Sensing GIS Center On 1/12/22, 10:28 AM, "Discuss on behalf of Iván Sánchez Ortega via Discuss" wrote: El miércoles, 12 de enero de 2022 15:26:05 (CET) Jonathan Moules via Discuss escribió: > > we really hope that FOSS4G2023 can be safely > > organized in physical format. > > Why? Because we humans are social animals; and people like me, who are almost completely burnt out by not having been outside of their houses for nearly two years, could really use an in-person event to see their friends and their personal heroes. I'm not gonna attack Jonathan's points (or even reply to them, risking an episode of sealioning to erode my patience), but I want to make one of my own: It's good for our collective mental health. We *want* an in person event, we *hope* for it; which for me is a sign our brains have some demand for it, even if it's intangible. -- Iván Sánchez Ortega https://ivan.sanchezortega.es ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023
Hi, This is my personal opinion as co-chair of FOSS4G 2021 and not any official OSGeo statement. Take it with a grain of salt. I am still recovering from the burnout of organizing it, so I may be very biased :) On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 3:42 PM Jonathan Moules via Discuss wrote: > Why? If it can be held in a virtual format then surely that's better > than an in-person event? Better is a subjective term. It is better in some aspects, it is worse in some others. When we changed FOSS4G 2021 to the online version, we researched as much as we could about how to do it properly. And though I still need to write a second part post-event of this post[1] it summarized concerns that are really not fully solved in an online event. Most of the points stated there still stand. I would advocate to have both, online and face to face, maybe on alternate years, maybe adding as a "fourth" option on the rotation. Online is good, but in my opinion, it can't replace all in person events. And that hurts to say. > Online is more accessible, Depends on how you measure accessible. Not everybody has the network bandwidth or hardware to attend an online event, to name the most obvious one. But they may take a train or bus and go to the venue. And don't let me start with streaming services that ban certain countries. Because for example if you are streaming from USA, there are several countries that can't watch it. Period. By law. Safest place to stream from is Europe, which usually adds up to the bill. Or you stream from several locations, which adds complexity. What about communicating in a foreign language with all the body language missing? Not everyone is fluent in English. But when you are physically there, you can read clues on body language and you can use other methods to complement the English you are not fully understanding. That's missing on online events. May be minor to native speakers, but it makes the event less accessible to some people. Timezones are a nightmare too. Many people can travel and adapt to the timezone of the venue, but if you don't travel, some people find it hard to adapt to the timezone. Imagine you live with kids. Are you going to stay awake and sleep during the day without that affecting either you or them? It can be done, but saying "more accessible" as a blank statement is subjective. It has its difficulties. I agree that depending on the venue (is it accessible to wheelchairs? does the catering have allergy options? can you reach it walking or on public transport?) or the country chosen (can you get a VISA or are you in danger for being LGBTQ+?), it may be better to do it online, sure thing. But you have to go case by case. No generalizations here. > cheaper, This really depends on how good you want your event to be. You can have a free event (on Twitch or YouTube and expect ads in between talks) or you can pay for a good platform that offers services useful to make the conference better. How many of these services do you want? Did you like the social map from 2021? Was it too much? Do you want to have private video chats? What else can you add? Maybe some virtual reality room for the gala dinner? We ended up having a good price for all of this, but at a cost of a lot of volunteering work. Exhausting volunteering work that wouldn't have been required on a face to face version. > and the > massive environmental impact of several hundred people flying to an > arbitrary point on the globe With this I agree 100%. > Now is a good opportunity to re-evaluate the need for it to be in-person > given the evident success of 2021's online event. > > > It strikes me that online has numerous advantages: > > * Cheaper to attend Usually true (and true in our case), but I wouldn't count on that as another generalization without looking at close numbers. > * Cheaper to organise This depends a lot on where you organize it face to face and how you organize it online. > * Easier to organise (? a supposition) Well, I have found the online version much much much harder to organize than similar conferences in person. Just because on the online version there is absolutely no room to improvise, you have to have everything completely tied before the event. And have a backup plan. And a backup plan for the backup plan. And then maybe a third backup plan. And then during the event you will run out of backup plans and your only choice will be to shrug very hard. The moderator is missing because whatever personal issues. F2F: Anyone else in the room can act as moderator Online: Who has privileges to be a moderator in this room? Anyone? Someone? Are all the backup moderators busy somewhere else? How many rooms are on fire right now? Who can we speed up and teach how the controls work in less than five minutes? I want to thank again the amazing work of the horde of volunteers that moderated this 2021. And even when they were a huge amazing group and did their best, and we had a huge pool of backups, there
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023
El miércoles, 12 de enero de 2022 15:26:05 (CET) Jonathan Moules via Discuss escribió: > > we really hope that FOSS4G2023 can be safely > > organized in physical format. > > Why? Because we humans are social animals; and people like me, who are almost completely burnt out by not having been outside of their houses for nearly two years, could really use an in-person event to see their friends and their personal heroes. I'm not gonna attack Jonathan's points (or even reply to them, risking an episode of sealioning to erode my patience), but I want to make one of my own: It's good for our collective mental health. We *want* an in person event, we *hope* for it; which for me is a sign our brains have some demand for it, even if it's intangible. -- Iván Sánchez Ortega https://ivan.sanchezortega.es ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023
Hi Vasile, > 2021 was the proof that a successful FOSS4G can be organized in virtual form as well. Which is great to hear! But in that case, the following statements raises a question > we really hope that FOSS4G2023 can be safely organized in physical format. Why? If it can be held in a virtual format then surely that's better than an in-person event? Online is more accessible, cheaper, and the massive environmental impact of several hundred people flying to an arbitrary point on the globe to watch/participate in something that can be done online doesn't seem warranted if, as you say, it works well in a virtual form. I appreciate that someone is going to say "in-person is better for networking opportunities", but has anyone ever actually quantified these nebulous benefits? For any conference, doesn't even have to just be FOSS4G? Or is it merely a rationalisation? A quick literature search (not my area) suggests there's very little work been done in this area, and even less to objectively quantify the outcomes. Now is a good opportunity to re-evaluate the need for it to be in-person given the evident success of 2021's online event. It strikes me that online has numerous advantages: * Cheaper to attend * Cheaper to organise * Easier to organise (? a supposition) * Open to many more delegates (several billion) * Open to many more disadvantaged delegates * Much lower environmental impact Whereas the benefits for the in-person are: * More money for OSGeo * More networking opportunities * (Personal level) A work paid for junket It is true that some of the online benefits can be transferred to an in-person event by filming/streaming as FOSS4G does, but that doesn't obviate the very real environmental costs. Seems like something worth discussing, Cheers, Jonathan On 2022-01-12 12:57, Vasile Craciunescu wrote: Dear OSGeo/FOSS4G Community, Although the fight against COVID-19 is not over yet, we need to think and act to keep the FOSS4G spirit alive and to have our beloved global conference hosted in 2023. That's why OSGeo's Conference Committee is happy to announce that the call for location for the "Free and Open Source Software for Geospatial Conference 2023" is open. This year we accept bids from any region of the globe. 2021 was the proof that a successful FOSS4G can be organized in virtual form as well. With the mankind understanding more and more about the coronavirus, we really hope that FOSS4G2023 can be safely organized in physical format. And OSGeo is committed to stand by the hard working LOCs to provide all the needed support. Please find all details on our wiki page [1]. In case that you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask the Conference Committee [2]! May the FOSS4G be with everyone, Vasile & Msilikale, on behalf of OSGeo's Conference Committee [1] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2023_Bid_Process [2] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Conference_Committee ___ Conference_dev mailing list conference_...@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev ___ Conference_dev mailing list conference_...@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
