[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
I won't make any comments on legality or morality but I check out a ton of CD's from the library. Sometimes, weeks later I find FLAC's of the CD's on my computers hard drive. Weird how that happens. ;-) -- dae3dae3 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Amazon.com offers free mp3s of hundreds of artists - some quite popular, some trying to get a break: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/browse/-/468646/ref=m_mh_mn_dd/103-5188174-5077459 Or, if this link doesn't work, go to Music and look for "Free Downloads" in the linkbar. Robert ob_kook wrote: One way to get around the copywright question is to go with music that has the blessing of the owners. There is a good site for this called "Live Music Archive" (http://www.archive.org/audio/etreelisting-browse.php), which has live shows posted by those who taped them either from the audience or sometimes patching into the soundboard. Of course, you are limited to the bands that allow this which means you don't get many mainstream bands, but on the other hand, it is a fantastic way to explore new music and expand your own musical horizon. The majority of the shows are lossless (SHN) format and are pretty big, but there are also a lot of VBR-MP3 shows too. Now, to end with an off-topic remark, I highly recommend checking out The Mermen. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
I disagree with several of the logical/common sense and "moral" reasoning points raised, but I don't particularly care to get into that here (feel free to PM me if you want). However I am also interested in hearing more answers to the originally raised question. FWIW eMusic has served me well for a variety of music genres, but I hope to hear of other good resources similar to them. -- cmturner2 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
On Oct 3, 2005, at 6:42 PM, Mike Anderson wrote: It is NOT a criminal action to purchase iTunes songs and strip the DRM encryption, as long as you don't redistribute the music yourself. IANAL, but are you sure about that? The DMCA has a lot of verbiage about breaking the DRMs, etc. iTunes will happily strip the DRM for you when you burn to disk. You can't compress back using a lossy compression scheme without some quality degradation, of course, but you do have the song with no DRM. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
pfarrell Wrote: > On Mon, 2005-10-03 at 17:43 -0700, Mike Anderson wrote: > > It is NOT a criminal action to purchase iTunes songs and strip the > DRM > > encryption, as long as you don't redistribute the music yourself. > > There's no copyright violation there; DRM is Apple's way of not > having > > to depend on the copyright laws. > > IANAL, but are you sure about that? The DMCA has a lot of verbiage > about breaking the DRMs, etc. > > To me, the DRM is a way to keep honest people honest and miffed. > > You could be right; I'll back off my statement. I'm not an expert on DMCA at all. -- Mike Anderson ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
On Mon, 2005-10-03 at 17:43 -0700, Mike Anderson wrote: > It is NOT a criminal action to purchase iTunes songs and strip the DRM > encryption, as long as you don't redistribute the music yourself. > There's no copyright violation there; DRM is Apple's way of not having > to depend on the copyright laws. IANAL, but are you sure about that? The DMCA has a lot of verbiage about breaking the DRMs, etc. To me, the DRM is a way to keep honest people honest and miffed. -- Pat Farrell http://www.pfarrell.com ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Oh yeah, my own website offers lots of free music too: http://freeradicalradio.com -- Mike Anderson ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
It is NOT a criminal action to purchase iTunes songs and strip the DRM encryption, as long as you don't redistribute the music yourself. There's no copyright violation there; DRM is Apple's way of not having to depend on the copyright laws. You are probably going against your contract with Apple (I'd bet there's a clause dealing with this), but that's not a crime. Note that this still doesn't amount to breach of contract (something for which they could sue you in civil court) because there are no damages (i.e. you aren't costing them any money as long as you don't redistribute the music). Oh, and yes, I AM a lawyer! -- Mike Anderson ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Believe it or not, lots of artists and even record companies are GIVING AWAY mp3s. (Telarc even offers some tracks at 320k). I would check artist websites and small, high quality record labels. What we should do is create a list of good sites that offer free downloads. Here are a few I know of: www.telarc.com www.davidsylvian.com Another way is to use opensource software called iRate - it lets you sample free downloads from artists' websites, rate them, and easily find the stuff you like. There are something like 46,000 songs in the iRate database. http://irate.sourceforge.net/index.html Similar to iRate is "Indy", a windows program that does the same thing. http://indy.tv/ I just installed Indy, and it's pretty cool. It actually saves each song in a folder according to how you rated it. So you can always go to your 4-star and 5-star folders and add the stuff you liked to your collection. There is also Screamer Radio. This is an internet radio player that allows you to save a copy of a song if you like it. Many of the station presets are the same ones that slimserver lists. You can let Screamer save everything it plays, or just save individual songs as you hear them. http://www.screamer-radio.com/ -- Pale Blue Ego ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
ob_kook wrote: One way to get around the copywright question is to go with music that has the blessing of the owners. There is a good site for this called "Live Music Archive" (http://www.archive.org/audio/etreelisting-browse.php), which has live shows posted by those who taped them either from the audience or sometimes patching into the soundboard. Of course, you are limited to the bands that allow this which means you don't get many mainstream bands, but on the other hand, it is a fantastic way to explore new music and expand your own musical horizon. Related: The latest episode of NerdTV features an hour long interview with the archive founder Brewster Kahle. Mucho worth listening to. Best one so far, with Macintosh guru Herzfeld a close second. http://www.pbs.org/cringely/nerdtv/ (No, after four episodes, I am still no fan of the way Cringley uses the video media to portray the same speaking head with no editing no nothing. Adds zero to the interview experience. Just download the audio and listen away.) /peter ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
One way to get around the copywright question is to go with music that has the blessing of the owners. There is a good site for this called "Live Music Archive" (http://www.archive.org/audio/etreelisting-browse.php), which has live shows posted by those who taped them either from the audience or sometimes patching into the soundboard. Of course, you are limited to the bands that allow this which means you don't get many mainstream bands, but on the other hand, it is a fantastic way to explore new music and expand your own musical horizon. The majority of the shows are lossless (SHN) format and are pretty big, but there are also a lot of VBR-MP3 shows too. Now, to end with an off-topic remark, I highly recommend checking out The Mermen. -- ob_kook ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
cliveb Wrote: > I agree with your interpretation of the law. When you sell your > legally-bought CD to someone else, your right to retain copies on other > media ends. > > The only artists who ever receive fair return for their work are (i) > superstars, and (ii) those very few who are savvy enough to refuse the > initial advance. (iii) Canadians. I believe the law is different in this area in Canada. At least, musician friends tell me they don't get much in the way of royalties for US sales, but do better in Canada. Also air plays. But I'm not conversant with the details. Not being a musician myself. Back to the original question ... there were some subscription sites about a year ago last I checked. About a buck a download. But when I checked, their catalogue was mediocre. May have changed in the mean time, for better or worse, don't know. -- Michaelwagner ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
You misunderstood me. Buying the cd was a good thing, getting tracks I've never heard of is a good thing. I was just disappointed to find out that I couldn't get just one track via this whole new internet thing. ;-) Max JJZolx Wrote: > Don't you like discovering new music? You've never heard of any other > Lynyrd Skynyrd songs? Freebird? > > Like many thirty year old hits songs, it's probably on many, many > albums. Go to http://www.allmusic.com, do a song search, and then find > another album that it's on (by Skynyrd, not a cover). I'd guess it's on > no less than 20 albums, including some sound tracks (Forrest Gump) or > other compilations that you might like if you really don't want to > discover Lynyrd Skynyrd. Many of them will be available for under $7. > Why buy a crummy mp3 for $1? > > http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=10:r78e4j270way > > http://www.alldirect.com/music/mItem.asp?mitemNo=081227063528 -- max.spicer The wild things roared their terrible roars and gnashed their terrible teeth and rolled their terrible eyes and showed their terrible claws but Max stepped into his private boat and waved good-bye ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Michaelwagner Wrote: > If the law were to be construed as you say, artists would get no > royalties and the business of recorded music would collapse I agree with your interpretation of the law. When you sell your legally-bought CD to someone else, your right to retain copies on other media ends. But your "common-sense" rationalisation of why the law is that way is not realistic. The simple fact is that the overwhelming majority of recording artists receive little or no royalites - the recording industry (fourth most corrupt institution in the world after organised crime, government and religion) sees to that via it's "standard operating practices". The only artists who ever receive fair return for their work are (i) superstars, and (ii) those very few who are savvy enough to refuse the initial advance and fund their own recordings, thus retaining ownership of their own work. This is not meant as encouragement to obtain music illegally. I am merely pointing out that by breaking the law you're not hurting the artists; rather you're hurting the recording industry. -- cliveb ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
abdomen Wrote: > Very well said. I agree. I wish this thread could go back to where it started. Not trying to command the discussion's direction; just interested in replies to the original request [slightly edited]: max.spicer Wrote: > Are there sites where you can just buy tracks that can then be played on > my SB2? [...] Ideally, I'd like some plain old mp3s, but would settle > for DRM stuff, provided I can actually listen to it. [...] One thing to > note is that I can't really go with one of the monthly subscription > service as I wouldn't use it enough to justify the cost. I hear a lot of great stuff on internet radio which I'll bet is not mainstream and might be available on some site for non-DRM download. I've seen replies in this thread for dance music. How about acoustic, folk, jazz? -- Dave D ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Michaelwagner Wrote: > > > So it's a wonderful rationalization, (perhaps) narrowly within the law, > but when all is said and done, both morally wrong and > non-self-sustaining as a business model. > > Michael Very well said. -- abdomen ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
cmturner2 Wrote: > Indeed, that is what the RIAA would like you to believe. The point is, the document you quoted is moot on this point. You are chosing to interpret it in a way that is favourable to you. But the quoted document doesn't say what you're claiming it says. In the case of software, a similar enough situation, it says the courts have disagreed and so there is no clear cut "law of the land" at this point. It also says a supreme court ruling will likely be necessary to resolve the disagreement amongst the lower court decisions. Rather than relying on narrowly construed legal decisions, why don't you use common sense? If the law were truly to be construed in the way you describe, each artist might have only one sale, to you, say, who would copy it to their hard disk and sell it to their neighbour, who would do the same and sell it to their neighbour, etc. In this way, the artist would be paid only one royalty. Clearly this would not be enough to live on, the artist would have to move on to another line of work, and no music would ever be recorded again. If the law were to be construed as you say, artists would get no royalties and the business of recorded music would collapse (live performances might still sustain some artists). At which point the law wouldn't matter because there'd be no recorded music to copy. So it's a wonderful rationalization, (perhaps) narrowly within the law, but when all is said and done, both morally wrong and non-self-sustaining as a business model. Michael -- Michaelwagner ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Indeed, that is what the RIAA would like you to believe. -- cmturner2 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
cmturner2 Wrote: > *the distribution rights of a copyright holder end on that particular > copy once the copy is sold.* The distribution rights end on the first sale. Your rights to have a copy of the song on a different medium end on the second sale (when you sell it). -- Michaelwagner ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
cmturner2 Wrote: > The first sale doctrine makes the reselling of audio CD's (after you've > done anything you want with them) perfectly legal. Actually, that's not what it says. It says the original copyright holder cannot prevent the resale of second-hand CDs and force you to buy a new copy at retail from them directly. However, I believe your rights to make and enjoy "fair use" copies of music (to your hard disk, your favorite old 8-track media, etc) exist by virtue of your ownership of the physical media and end when you no longer have title to the media (an issue that isn't covered in the article you quoted, because it's not part of the first-sale doctrine). Michael Disclaimer: I'm no lawyer, I anyways don't live in the USofA, the laws here are different, etc. -- Michaelwagner ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
The first sale doctrine makes the reselling of audio CD's (after you've done anything you want with them) perfectly legal. This includes, buying, legally ripping to your collection, then reselling the physical media without destroying anything in your electronic collection. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine The first-sale doctrine is an exception to copyright codified in the US Copyright Act, section 109. The doctrine of first sale allows the purchaser to transfer (i.e. sell or give away) a particular, legally acquired copy of protected work without permission once it has been obtained. *That means the distribution rights of a copyright holder end on that particular copy once the copy is sold.* -- cmturner2 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
max.spicer Wrote: > I have to say that given the choice of buying a track from some outfit > that in no way benefits the original artists or just getting it via > p2p, I'd go for the latter. Admittedly, there are probably many > recording deals out there that mean that artists no longer benefit from > sales of there work, but at least they got money originally and > assumedly agreed to the detail in the first place (albeit possibly by > failing to check the small print). However, I've just bought myself a > copy of Lynyrd Skynyrd - The Collection, which has Sweet Home Alabama > as the first track, and gets me another 16 tracks that I've never heard > of. It's disappointing to find out that I don't seem to be able to just > buy a track somewhere, but then I like buying albums anyway, I guess! Don't you like discovering new music? You've never heard of any other Lynyrd Skynyrd songs? Freebird? Like many thirty year old hits songs, it's probably on many, many albums. Go to http://www.allmusic.com, do a song search, and then find another album that it's on (by Skynyrd, not a cover). I'd guess it's on no less than 20 albums, including some sound tracks (Forrest Gump) or other compilations that you might like if you really don't want to discover Lynyrd Skynyrd. Many of them will be available for under $7. Why buy a crummy mp3 for $1? http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=10:r78e4j270way http://www.alldirect.com/music/mItem.asp?mitemNo=081227063528 -- JJZolx Jim ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
For dance music check out www.stompy.com WAV and mp3 downloads, however downloading WAV files takes forever... -- mikerob ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
stinkingpig Wrote: > > check out your neighborhood used record store, you can get the CD cheap > > and sell it back to them if you don't like it. Here in Ontario there's a place called the beat goes on beatgoeson.com works great. You can pick through their inventory of currently available used CDs online and show up at the store to claim them. They also do online charge and they do delivery, but my local store is about 1 mile away, so that's what I always do. -- Michaelwagner ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
I have to say that given the choice of buying a track from some outfit that in no way benefits the original artists or just getting it via p2p, I'd go for the latter. Admittedly, there are probably many recording deals out there that mean that artists no longer benefit from sales of there work, but at least they got money originally and assumedly agreed to the detail in the first place (albeit possibly by failing to check the small print). However, I've just bought myself a copy of Lynyrd Skynyrd - The Collection, which has Sweet Home Alabama as the first track, and gets me another 16 tracks that I've never heard of. It's disappointing to find out that I don't seem to be able to just buy a track somewhere, but then I like buying albums anyway, I guess! Max Jim Wrote: > allofmp3.com is quite a good site, and even if rumours of it being just > one big criminal enterprise were true I for one would rather be sending > money to the Russian mafia than to the RIAA. > > However you obtained your music there is not much chance of being > caught if you are not sharing it with others - note that by downloading > in a P2P program you are actually forced to upload, and thus sharing > with others. > > If the record company cannot provide you with a easy, reasonably priced > method of getting just 1 track in lossless FLAC quality then you will > either have to purchase lossy DRM crap or break copyright law. > > But breaking the law isn't necessarily going to make you go to hell, as > for instance you could be a Chinese citizen breaking the law by running > a free-speech website and would everyone on here frown at that? > > You can make yourself feel better by sending the artist the money > directly or donating to the artist's favourite charity. Either way, it > would be worth writing to the record company and artist explaining > (anonymously of course) why you felt there was no reasonable option > other than to do this. -- max.spicer The wild things roared their terrible roars and gnashed their terrible teeth and rolled their terrible eyes and showed their terrible claws but Max stepped into his private boat and waved good-bye ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
If they did that, why are only some of their songs available in FLAC format? On 9/10/05, bjackson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Has anyone checked their flacs for bit-perfect? I've always wondered ifthey really store them as 384 mp3's like everything else and just transcode back.--bjackson___Discuss mailing listDiscuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Has anyone checked their flacs for bit-perfect? I've always wondered if they really store them as 384 mp3's like everything else and just transcode back. -- bjackson ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Jim Wrote: > allofmp3.com is quite a good site, and even if rumours of it being just > one big criminal enterprise were true I for one would rather be sending > money to the Russian mafia than to the RIAA. Really? Personally I'm not into supporting drug dealing, murder, extortion, forced prostitution, etc. I mean the RIAA aren't great, but they're not that bad. > > If the record company cannot provide you with a easy, reasonably priced > method of getting just 1 track in lossless FLAC quality then you will > either have to purchase lossy DRM crap or break copyright law. > Or you could just not buy the music. I mean, does the fact that my local supermarket only sells eggs in 6 packs mean I have the right to steal as many eggs as I like? The label own the music - it's entirely up to them how they choose to sell it to you. It's entirely up to you to accept their terms or not. It is not your right to make up your own terms. I agree that they're being stupid and missing out on a great business opportunity, but it's their right to make that mistake. > > But breaking the law isn't necessarily going to make you go to hell, as > for instance you could be a Chinese citizen breaking the law by running > a free-speech website and would everyone on here frown at that? > Some laws are bad. Some are good. This isn't about the law (as has been pointed out, the likleyhood of getting caught is tiny) it's about doing the right thing. Your view of what that is is personal. I am involved in the creation of copyrighted works - it's what puts food on my table. Therefore, personally, I support the artists and their right to be paid for their work. The fact that they have decided that they want to be paid via CD sales from a major label is their business. I would prefer it if the artists I liked made all their music available for paid, non-DRM download (as many do) but it's their choice in the end. My choice is whether I buy the product or not. > > You can make yourself feel better by sending the artist the money > directly or donating to the artist's favourite charity. Either way, it > would be worth writing to the record company and artist explaining > (anonymously of course) why you felt there was no reasonable option > other than to do this. Now that's a good idea. Of course lots of people suggest this but I seriously doubt anyone's ever done it. -- radish ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
allofmp3.com is quite a good site, and even if rumours of it being just one big criminal enterprise were true I for one would rather be sending money to the Russian mafia than to the RIAA. However you obtained your music there is not much chance of being caught if you are not sharing it with others - note that by downloading in a P2P program you are actually forced to upload, and thus sharing with others. If the record company cannot provide you with a easy, reasonably priced method of getting just 1 track in lossless FLAC quality then you will either have to purchase lossy DRM crap or break copyright law. But breaking the law isn't necessarily going to make you go to hell, as for instance you could be a Chinese citizen breaking the law by running a free-speech website and would everyone on here frown at that? You can make yourself feel better by sending the artist the money directly or donating to the artist's favourite charity. Either way, it would be worth writing to the record company and artist explaining (anonymously of course) why you felt there was no reasonable option other than to do this. -- Jim ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
On 10/9/05 at 09:14 -0700, Dave D wrote Someone told me about a method which may or may not be legal. It is probably similar to what Daniel mentioned. You can buy the protected files, then re-record them on Windows using something like Audacity. I have no idea what the resulting quality would be. I have not tried this yet; just no time or patience for it. Not really similar to what I suggested, and the legality may differ. Your suggestion provides a *permanent* un-DRM version of the song, whereas mine always uses the DRM version, in a way not all that different from just connecting to sound output of the computer to an input on the stereo system. -- Daniel Cohen ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
RE: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
>check out your neighborhood used record store, you can get the CD cheap and sell it back to them if you don't like it. ...having then deleted Sweet Home Alabama from your mp3 library in order to stay legal... -Original Message- From: Jack Coates [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 10 September 2005 16:42 To: Slim Devices Discussion Subject: Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally cliveb wrote: >essbee1964 Wrote: > > >>Try www.allofmp3.com a Russian site, totally legal. >> >> >That is a questionable statement. It is legal in Russia because that >country has such lax copyright laws. But it doesn't alter the fact that >the artists whose work they are selling do not get a royalty. > >(Incidentally, to Max, re. Sweet Home Alabama: perhaps you should just >go out and buy The Essential Lynyrd Skynrd - a compilation double CD >stuffed full of great songs). > > check out your neighborhood used record store, you can get the CD cheap and sell it back to them if you don't like it. -- Jack at Monkeynoodle dot Org : It's a Scientific Venture! "I spent all me tin with the ladies drinking gin, so across the Western ocean I must wander." -- All for Me Grog, traditional ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
If you want to take that chance, great...if you get caught, and if they wish to prosecute, you will have no leg to stand on, and unless you have deep pockets, you will be unable to fund a defense. I've got a family to support. I don't need any legal hassles. What you do is up to you. Ah, the legal thugs of the RIAA just had a warm fuzzy moment. Kevin -- Kevin O. Lepard [EMAIL PROTECTED] Happiness is being 100% Microsoft free. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
On Sep 10, 2005, at 12:32 PM, Dave D wrote: Dave Dewey Wrote: Read this. http://www.hymn-project.org/ I did. I got far enough in the FAQ to see that JHymn needs to log into an Apple server, pretending to be a legitimate computer running iTunes, in order to get a key to unlock the tunes. If you want to take that chance, great. I am not a lawyer, but my (pretty extensive) research on this issue comes up with results that are not as clear cut as yours. JHymn logs into an Apple server to get *your* FairPlay keys, not some random hacker keys, or whatnot. Thus, you're modifying music that you've paid for, using keys that you've been given a right to use to access that music. So at worst, you've violated Apple's Terms of Use (the discussion about whether click-thru licenses are even legal to start with is a separate one altogether), but I have a hard time seeing this violating the DCMA. Plus, we all knowing, modifying DRM'ed music is double plus ungood, right? :) Or let me rephrase the argument this way: JHymn has been around for a long time now. If there was any hint of DCMA violation, I think Apple would have nuked them from orbit with their army of lawyers, which as we know they're not shy about using. Just my $.02 on this. Victor ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Dave Dewey Wrote: > Read this. > http://www.hymn-project.org/ I did. I got far enough in the FAQ to see that JHymn needs to log into an Apple server, pretending to be a legitimate computer running iTunes, in order to get a key to unlock the tunes. If you want to take that chance, great. I don't disagree with your sentiment about the DCMA law (it's unclear, unfair, largely unenforcable, and can be interpreted as being all-encompassing.) I don't disagree with the logic that you paid for the song and should be able to listen to it whereever you want. And I don't disagree with your logic that your willingness to spend money at iTunes is partly driven by your ability to circumvent DRM. All I'm saying is, if you get caught, and if they wish to prosecute, you will have no leg to stand on, and unless you have deep pockets, you will be unable to fund a defense. I've got a family to support. I don't need any legal hassles. What you do is up to you. Thanks for the link, though. It's very interesting; I've often wondered if anyone had cracked DRM. This is one way around it. -- Dave D ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
You just might want to take a look in your local public library. At least here in the Metro Denver area, the library catalog is on-line. You can browse for certain artists and request a CD without leaving your house. -- Wayne1 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
stinkingpig Wrote: > check out your neighborhood used record store, you can get the CD cheap > > and sell it back to them if you don't like it. Of course, if you rip the CD, then it would be a copyright violation to keep the extracted audio in your collection once you no longer own the CD. (FWIW: I am not a lawyer and don't pretend to be telling anyone what they should do, nor do I care.) -- JJZolx Jim ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Quoting Dave D ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): > > Dave Dewey Wrote: > > I also use the iTunes store to download music, and then remove the DRM. > > It's an easy process that doesn't take anywhere near the 15-30 minutes > > quoted elsewhere in this thread. It's a simple, drag-and-drop > > non-techie process. > > This is interesting info, but I'll bet if you use this and get caught, > you'll spend a bit more than 15-30 minutes in jail. Highly unlikely. I don't redistribute the stripped files, I PAID for them in the first place, and I only go to these measures so that I can use the media I've paid for on the device of my choice. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure Apple isn't going to prosecute me for buying music from them. If JHymn didn't exist, I would never purchase music from the Apple Store. Since it does, I spend probably $15 a month there. Bring on the handcuffs! Read this. http://www.hymn-project.org/ ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Dave Dewey Wrote: > I also use the iTunes store to download music, and then remove the DRM. > It's an easy process that doesn't take anywhere near the 15-30 minutes > quoted elsewhere in this thread. It's a simple, drag-and-drop > non-techie process. This is interesting info, but I'll bet if you use this and get caught, you'll spend a bit more than 15-30 minutes in jail. -- Dave D ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
water wrote: http://emusic.com is a really great site with tons of indy music :) :water I dig emusic, it's introduced me to some really great bands. They also have a great catalog of folk, blues, classic country (basically all the Smithsonian library). There's a lot of classical too, but I'm not a complete classical nut and can't say if it's terribly good or bad :) Another way to find new music (tangential to the OP's issue though) is Audioscrobbler and http://last.fm. It's been useful to see that people who like the stuff I like also like things that I haven't heard of, then I go look on emusic and download it :) -- Jack at Monkeynoodle dot Org : It's a Scientific Venture! "I spent all me tin with the ladies drinking gin, so across the Western ocean I must wander." -- All for Me Grog, traditional ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
http://emusic.com is a really great site with tons of indy music :) :water -- water http://wa.terhou.se - 'http://werock.org' (http://www.werock.org) - 'http://nunmusic.com' (http://www.nunmusic.com) ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
max.spicer Wrote: > there sites where you can just buy tracks that can then be played on my > SB2? I'm dimly aware of itunes and the like, and the horrible DRM > monster that's associated with them. Ideally, I'd like some plain old > mp3s, but would settle for DRM stuff, provided I can actually listen to > it (I realise that's somewhat against the whole point of DRM!). One > thing to note is that I can't really go with one of the monthly > subscription service as I wouldn't use it enough to justify the cost. I am right there with you on this. I've looked for sites which sell single-track mp3s which can be played on SB2. Any I've found that sell unprotected files generally only have tracks I've never heard of. I don't want to get a service; wouldn't use it that much. I'd pay 2-3 bucks for a track if I could play it anywhere and get it in a non-lossy format (if I buy the music, I want to buy _all_ the music.) Someone told me about a method which may or may not be legal. It is probably similar to what Daniel mentioned. You can buy the protected files, then re-record them on Windows using something like Audacity. I have no idea what the resulting quality would be. I have not tried this yet; just no time or patience for it. The same person who told me about Audacity does not actually use it. He had an interesting point: those who have more time than money (e.g. high school & college students) can easily circumvent the protection using the method above or others. They don't care if it takes them 15-30 minutes each time they re-record a track. Those of us with more money than time really don't want to go through the hassle of circumventing the laws, but there are few, if any, options for us to be able to play our purchased music where we want to. I'll be honest: I don't own an iPod or other mp3 player (just SB2) and have a very small collection of CDs. I listen mostly to internet music. But I've been writing down names of songs I've heard which I would like to own. I'd like to be able to buy them somewhere and be able to add them to my ripped music collection. Silly laws. Hey, would it be a good idea for a sticky forum thread which would be a list of sites where you can purchase unprotected tracks? -- Dave D ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
I'd second the love for beatport, but it's library is obviously very specific. There are a ton of great (legal) mp3 download sites for dance music, which makes me happy to be a DJ :) If you like beatport, try also audiojelly.com, playittonight.com, id-t.com etc. Great stuff. As for non-dance music, well, it's tougher. I'll ignore allofmp3, because it is of dubious legality and, more importantly, doesn't give any money to the people who own or created the music. The reason I use legal downloads rather than Kazaa or whatever is not to be legal - the chances of getting caught if you know what you're doing are basically zero - but to be morally right by rewarding the artists. Several of my friends are musicians and I really don't want to rip them off. So that basically leaves DRM sites for the majority of established (i.e. non-indy) artists. Of those, I have to say iTunes is probably the easiest to work with. They have a decent catalogue, and the DRM allows you to burn to a CD and then you can rerip from there. It's a pain, but it's legal, and the artists get their cut. I'd mention here that of course the sound quality is far from great, especially if you recompress after ripping, so I'd second the advice of picking up the CD used. Amazon have a great system - I picked up a ton of great CDs used for under $1 each (plus shipping) a few weeks ago. -- radish ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Yes, and you can also order some very cheap used CDs from places like Amazon. I've purchased discs for $.01, basically, just the cost of shipping. -- MrC ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
cliveb wrote: essbee1964 Wrote: Try www.allofmp3.com a Russian site, totally legal. That is a questionable statement. It is legal in Russia because that country has such lax copyright laws. But it doesn't alter the fact that the artists whose work they are selling do not get a royalty. (Incidentally, to Max, re. Sweet Home Alabama: perhaps you should just go out and buy The Essential Lynyrd Skynrd - a compilation double CD stuffed full of great songs). check out your neighborhood used record store, you can get the CD cheap and sell it back to them if you don't like it. -- Jack at Monkeynoodle dot Org : It's a Scientific Venture! "I spent all me tin with the ladies drinking gin, so across the Western ocean I must wander." -- All for Me Grog, traditional ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
essbee1964 Wrote: > Try www.allofmp3.com a Russian site, totally legal. That is a questionable statement. It is legal in Russia because that country has such lax copyright laws. But it doesn't alter the fact that the artists whose work they are selling do not get a royalty. (Incidentally, to Max, re. Sweet Home Alabama: perhaps you should just go out and buy The Essential Lynyrd Skynrd - a compilation double CD stuffed full of great songs). -- cliveb ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Try www.allofmp3.com a Russian site, totally legal. The songs are cheap and can be encoded at the bitrate you choose. shaun -- essbee1964 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
I think it's safe to say that I listen to pretty much all sorts of music. One of the tracks I'm after atm is Sweet Home Alabama, but don't take that is representative of my tastes in music! Max DrNic Wrote: > Hi > I think it really depends on the type of music you like to listen to. I > use a great site for "Dance" music called Beatport (www.beatport.com) > that allows instant download of 320kbps MP3's or shipment of the WAV > files to you on CD. > There are loads of others to check out, I'm not sure about plain old > Middle-of-the-Road music downloads or other genres but these sites do > exist. > > Nic -- max.spicer The wild things roared their terrible roars and gnashed their terrible teeth and rolled their terrible eyes and showed their terrible claws but Max stepped into his private boat and waved good-bye ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Re: Obtaining mp3s/flac/whatever legally
Hi I think it really depends on the type of music you like to listen to. I use a great site for "Dance" music called Beatport (www.beatport.com) that allows instant download of 320kbps MP3's or shipment of the WAV files to you on CD. There are loads of others to check out, I'm not sure about plain old Middle-of-the-Road music downloads or other genres but these sites do exist. Nic -- DrNic ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
