Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
On 8/9/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Do these SVN's provide the functionality that everyone is talking about in the regular SVN? What are my GUI options for this service? As Charlie also pointed out, the "One Click Installer" is for the Subversion Server. The Subversion Server was initially built for Linux, so the installation process for Windows use to be kinda difficult. This one click GUI helps you instal on Win without doing the hokey pokey. As for your questions about the difference between the SVN Server and Client. It may be best to think of the SVN server as a database that you put your code into. The client is essentially a way to get that data out and put it back in. So you'd "checkout" your code fromt he Server using the Client, which will manage putting that code onto your filesystem wherever you want. When you are done editing your code, you use the client to pick up your most recent version of the code and submit it back into the SVN Server (database). There are several SVN Clients, each with it's own advantages. -Cameron -- Cameron Childress Sumo Consulting Inc http://www.sumoc.com --- cell: 678.637.5072 aim: cameroncf email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
RE: getting started with SVN RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
No, I'm afraid not. :-( To start, and to be clear, the client app for SVN has nothing to do with a web app or browser. All the ones I know of (Tortoise and such) tend to be either java or windows client applications. They are used by the developer interested in managing the version control of their local code base using some server installation of Subversion as the repository. Further, when you say Tortoise is an app "initiated at any client", there again it seems you're mixing terms. What "client" do you mean? This wording makes it sound like you're referring to client as a person. You don't want to think of it that way. In fact, if you might construe "client" to mean one of your site's users, then no--definitely no--they have nothing to do with SVN, whether client or server or browser app. They never see or should care about it. It's just a tool for the developer interested in using some tool to manager version control. If you didn't mean to imply anything otherwise, I hope you'll forgive my clarification. I will just say, in conclusion, that I do hope you'll take the time to read any one of the resources I pointed out. They all try to solve the very problem of getting you from 0 to 60. I really think they'll help a lot and that it would be in everyone's interest if you just took even 20 minutes to read any one of them before discussing SVN further. :-) I really mean that in the most polite way I can put it. No offense intended at all. I'm just responding to what I'm reading. /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert ReilSent: Wednesday, August 09, 2006 2:20 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: RE: getting started with SVN RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Thanks Charlie. I guess I have some reading to do. (GREAT! MORE READING!! YECH!! LOL..) Thanks all for this info. I think I hear you saying that the client server issue is one of symantics from my perspective as I am assuming that the client goes to a web app that has hooks onto SVN. Kind of like PHPMyAdmin in MySQL. So therefore SVN is a server load, and Tortoise is a browser app that is initiated at any client provided certain securities are met. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink -
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
GUI SVN! Im a GUI guy (not gooey Preesh). Do these SVN’s provide the functionality that everyone is talking about in the regular SVN? What are my GUI options for this service? I have to have a Windows based utility, I also prefer one that is IIS friendly. But I’m ok with going to Apache as long as it is windows based in order to take advantage of some functionality. So now we have Cameron: http://svn1clicksetup.tigris.org/ AXUnderwood: http://tortoisesvn.tigris.org/ and its older sibling http://tortoisecvs.org/. These are sweet clients for using these services. I've been really liking Eclipses support lately myself. Trying to read into this it seems that Camerons link is a link to a quick install of Tortoise, but then looking at the tortoise links it seems that they may be different. This is god stuff guys! Keep up the banter!! Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 09, 2006 8:49 AM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Tortise SVN is an awesome windows integration tool - you don't have to use command line... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Robert Reil Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:55 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Tortoise Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:37 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version numb
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Once more note on this lengthy thread... If you are going to try to install SVN on Windows, you should definitely when out this GUI installed for Win. Works great! http://svn1clicksetup.tigris.org/ -Cameron On 8/9/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Tortise SVN is an awesome windows integration tool - you don't have to use command line... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Robert Reil Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:55 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Tortoise Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:37 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as the
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Tortise SVN is an awesome windows integration tool - you don't have to use command line... -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Robert ReilSent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:55 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Tortoise Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:37 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going:easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed.Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating!I made a couple in line comments below.I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this:Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal wit
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
http://tortoisesvn.tigris.org/ and its older sibling http://tortoisecvs.org/ These are sweet clients for using these services. I've been really liking Eclipses support lately myself. DKOn 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Tortoise Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:37 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, espe
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
hmm, no idea on that one... I'd imagine you would have to route that through apache or something.On 8/8/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:is SVN easy to hook into a LDAP store for authentication? Curious. DKOn 8/8/06, Steven Ross < [EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote:Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up a
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Robert...forgot to mention this earlier. There are services out there offering hosted SVN or CVS use. I've been using freepository.com lately for some CVS. There is http://www.cvsdude.com/ offering both SVN and CVS as well as Trac use. I'm sure there are others around.DKOn 8/8/06, Steven Ross < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:hmm, no idea on that one... I'd imagine you would have to route that through apache or something. On 8/8/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:is SVN easy to hook into a LDAP store for authentication? Curious. DKOn 8/8/06, Steven Ross < [EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote:Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, espec
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Tortoise Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 4:37 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
is SVN easy to hook into a LDAP store for authentication? Curious.DKOn 8/8/06, Steven Ross <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote:Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVN On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Not sure, it is command line on linux... that much i know.. course the only command you need to know is create and the rest is managed through something like TortoiseSVNOn 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" w
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
U was going to put this on the Win Dev Server. What work arounds will I encounter? I can see already that I will probably have to load Apache to use this. Is this a command line only tool? No GUI? Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Steven Ross [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 2:32 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going: easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
I posted a blog entry about setting up a fedora box and getting SVN going:easy stuff... course now I'm liking ubuntu, but the basic commands stay the same (except you use apt instead of yum) and some config files are in different places. http://www.zerium.com/zerium/index.cfm?mode=entry&entry=63467E64-E1E5-119E-19FA55A04B20E4F3 On 8/8/06, Robert Reil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw , Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? Jeremy On 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences and benefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Doug: You did not hijack my thread. I opened it up for debate and I just stood back and absorbed. It seems that the debate provided a general consensus of SVN. I appreciate the candid banter and absorbed a lot from it. Objective fulfilled! Thanks again. Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? Jeremy On 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences and benefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which I have obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting about borrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're in no hurry, right? :-) /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Cameron Childress
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
This would be a good subject for a Wednesday meeting! I know I could use a primer! Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Douglas Knudsen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:42 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed. Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below. I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DK On 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? Jeremy On 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences and benefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which I have obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting about borrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're in no hurry, right? :-) /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Cameron Childress Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 4:00 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
thank you Jeremy! As Charlie pointed out, it would be a good blog post to get consumed.Robert, we kind of hijakced your thread, but this is some good fudge for your version control sundae you will be eating! I made a couple in line comments below.I'll add one thing I really hate about CVS, you can't export a module from teh repository to a existing directory where you exported the module previously. CVS will not overwrite files. This forced us to checkout working copies on our prod server. No biggie, we are a intranet only team, but a pain. DKOn 8/7/06, Jeremy Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THe points for SVN go like this:Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. We use tags in CVS for this. Works fine, but certainly doesn't tie in with the version of a file. This is a interesting concept. This means a file that was created as teh first file in your tree and never edited for 5 years still has the version listed at the max of all file versions, eh? SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. yes, this is a major PITA for sure in CVS. Most clients hide this issue by 'pruning' empty dirs. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. branching and merging is a major PITA, luckily we rarely do it. The team of 10 here usually works on seperate projects. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? JeremyOn 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences andbenefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which Ihave obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting aboutborrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're inno hurry, right? :-)/charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of CameronChildress Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 4:00 PMTo: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into> these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical> to go through changing, eh? All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools your teamis most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't any compelling reasonsfor you to change, then don't.It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here] argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get you there just fine,and the development teams know one better than the other. If it ain'tbroke, don't fix it.I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Jeremy, do you have a blog? That would make a great blog post. Of course, you could point folks to do a google search where they'd find still others who've taken the time to write. But at least for CF folks, they may appreciate hearing of your experience/opinion. /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeremy AllenSent: Monday, August 07, 2006 3:48 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. THe points for SVN go like this:Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? Jeremy On 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences andbenefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which Ihave obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting aboutborrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're inno hurry, right? :-)/charliehttp://www.carehart.org/blog/-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of CameronChildress Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 4:00 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into> these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical> to go through changing, eh? All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools your teamis most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't any compelling reasonsfor you to change, then don't.It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here] argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get you there just fine,and the development teams know one better than the other. If it ain'tbroke, don't fix it.I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences and advantages of one over the other before dismissing it. Once that due diligence is over, makethe educated decision.-Cameron-To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserformFor more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mail
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Well thanks all. Sounds like SVN is the way to go then for me. More stuff to learn I guess but you gotta start somewhere... Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com From: Jeremy Allen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 3:48 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. THe points for SVN go like this: Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? Jeremy On 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences and benefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which I have obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting about borrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're in no hurry, right? :-) /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Cameron Childress Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 4:00 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into > these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical > to go through changing, eh? All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools your team is most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't any compelling reasons for you to change, then don't. It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here] argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get you there just fine, and the development teams know one better than the other. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences and advantages of one over the other before dismissing it. Once that due diligence is over, make the educated decision. -Cameron - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglis
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
THe points for SVN go like this:Versioning is much more sane and manageable. When I first started using SVN it was much more bearable to me. Your entire codebase can be encapsulated in one SVN version number instead of each file having its own version. When I say version 543 of the codebase with SVN there is no ambiguity about the state of the system when I say that. CVS has no easy concept of referring to the contents of the repository as a whole with a version number. That to me is what makes SVN so much better. SVN is easier to manage. This is a personal opinion but my experiences bear this one out. The command line for SVN is much more intuitive. SVN allows for you to delete and rearrange branches. This is HUGE. Deleting folders in CVS is plain not possible. CVSs delete functionality is just lacking in every way. Directories have revision numbers too. Everything in the system behaves consistently and there are no surprises or differences to deal with with different types of entities in the system as there is with CVS. SVN has no special functionality for branching, merging, or tagging. It is all implemented using the same functionality so how you arrange your repository is up to you. The cost of these operations in SVN is constant O(1) which is great compared to CVS and its slowness with many of these operations, especially on larger codebases. That is all I can remember off the top of my head. I know there are a couple of other good points somewhere in there that favor SVN. Sure a lot of these are small things but add them up and it makes SVN much better to work with. So if you are starting from scratch why bother with CVS? Unless you have very specific interoperability requirements or you are already really experienced with CVS from a management perspective I recommend using SVN. Its not just about solving "issues" with CVS. The system is also a bit more cohesive overall. And I promise you that with a team of 10 developers that consistently write code every week you WILL have to deal with these "issues" in CVS. They are common and frequently annoying problems not just edge case things that come up once in a while. That said if you already have a lot of experience with CVS or have some specific requirements SVN may not work out. If this is starting from scratch and you have not managed CVS or SVN before SVN wins quite easily in my mind. Why use an inferior system if you have no requirements holding you to it? JeremyOn 8/6/06, Charlie Arehart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences andbenefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which Ihave obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting aboutborrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're inno hurry, right? :-)/charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of CameronChildress Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 4:00 PMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into> these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical> to go through changing, eh? All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools your teamis most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't any compelling reasonsfor you to change, then don't.It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here] argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get you there just fine,and the development teams know one better than the other. If it ain'tbroke, don't fix it.I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences and advantages of one over the other before dismissing it. Once that due diligence is over, makethe educated decision.-Cameron-To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserformFor more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com- -To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglistsArchive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com- - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
And a good book of exploration (which also discusses the differences and benefits over CVS) is "Pragmatic Version Control with Subversion", which I have obtained from the publisher and am one chapter from finishing and then will write up a review. Someone else had asked me at the meeting about borrowing it, but after him, you could take it, Doug. Sounds like you're in no hurry, right? :-) /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Cameron Childress Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 4:00 PM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into > these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical > to go through changing, eh? All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools your team is most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't any compelling reasons for you to change, then don't. It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here] argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get you there just fine, and the development teams know one better than the other. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences and advantages of one over the other before dismissing it. Once that due diligence is over, make the educated decision. -Cameron - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
my sentiments exactly c^2.DKOn 8/6/06, Cameron Childress <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into these> 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical to go > through changing, eh?All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools yourteam is most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't anycompelling reasons for you to change, then don't. It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here]argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get youthere just fine, and the development teams know one better than theother. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences and advantages ofone over the other before dismissing it. Once that due diligence isover, make the educated decision.-Cameron- To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserformFor more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglistsArchive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com--- Douglas Knudsenhttp://www.cubicleman.com this is my signature, like it? - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical to go through changing, eh? All things held equal, I'm always a proponent of using the tools your team is most familiar and proficient at. If there aren't any compelling reasons for you to change, then don't. It's just like the age old CF vs [insert other language here] argument. No reason to change horses midstream if both horses get you there just fine, and the development teams know one better than the other. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I would, however, thoroughly explore the differences and advantages of one over the other before dismissing it. Once that due diligence is over, make the educated decision. -Cameron - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
righto. So, in a team of 10 developers that don't seem to run into these 'issues' in CVS that SVN solves, it doesn't seem very economical to go through changing, eh?DKOn 8/6/06, Cameron Childress <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: SVN was an attempt to build "a better CVS", so in the developers'eyes, it solves all the shortcoming of CVS. In reality, most of thedifferences have to do with how it handles versions, which alsoimpacts branching and merging. There's an appendix to the SVN book that explains the differences for CVS users:Subversion for CVS Users:http://svnbook.red-bean.com/en/1.0/apa.html-CameronOn 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> from my vantage as a CVS user, this begs the pregunta so to speak. Just> what did SVN give you that CVS didn't have? -To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglistsArchive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com--- Douglas Knudsen http://www.cubicleman.comthis is my signature, like it? - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
SVN was an attempt to build "a better CVS", so in the developers' eyes, it solves all the shortcoming of CVS. In reality, most of the differences have to do with how it handles versions, which also impacts branching and merging. There's an appendix to the SVN book that explains the differences for CVS users: Subversion for CVS Users: http://svnbook.red-bean.com/en/1.0/apa.html -Cameron On 8/6/06, Douglas Knudsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: from my vantage as a CVS user, this begs the pregunta so to speak. Just what did SVN give you that CVS didn't have? - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
from my vantage as a CVS user, this begs the pregunta so to speak. Just what did SVN give you that CVS didn't have?DKOn 8/6/06, Jeremy Allen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:WinMerge is sufficient for plain text format diffs. Excellent tool for comparing entire code bases and merging changes amongst them.SubVersion for change control. No question that it is far better thanCVS. After working with a CVS repository and migrating to SVN therewas simply no looking back. I never once thought "I wish SubVersion did X like CVS". For centralized repository management SVN is it.JeremyOn 8/3/06, Tom Chambers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> Subversion is a great tool for source code mgmt and baselining. > However, its roots are from the Linux side. Do some Googling and read> up on it.>> Now, you mention comparing. There a several free 'diff' tools out> there. You can find them Googling also. >> good luck>> Robert Reil wrote:>> >While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that we> >have to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able > >continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds.> >> >This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and they> >go theirs.> >> >What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on > >changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it.> >With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study group> >with Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good > >for me.> >> >I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I can> >see the changes.> >Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates are > >done. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code.> >Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible.> >> >So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWARE > >product for us to manage these ongoing changes.> >> >Note:> >These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for> >the most part that I can see. > >It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be saved> >with a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly)> >We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1> >> >Let the debate begin!> >> >Thanks!> >> >Robert P. Reil> >Managing Director,> >Motorcyclecarbs.com , Inc.> >4292 Country Garden Walk NW> >Kennesaw, Ga. 30152> >Office 770-974-8851> >Fax 770-974-8852> >www.motorcyclecarbs.com > >> >> >-> >To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @> > http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform> >> >For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists> >Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/> >List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com> >- > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -> To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ > http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform>> For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists > Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/> List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com > --To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserformFor more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglistsArchive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com- -- Douglas Knudsenhttp://www.cubicleman.comthis is my signature, like it? - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
WinMerge is sufficient for plain text format diffs. Excellent tool for comparing entire code bases and merging changes amongst them. SubVersion for change control. No question that it is far better than CVS. After working with a CVS repository and migrating to SVN there was simply no looking back. I never once thought "I wish SubVersion did X like CVS". For centralized repository management SVN is it. Jeremy On 8/3/06, Tom Chambers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Subversion is a great tool for source code mgmt and baselining. However, its roots are from the Linux side. Do some Googling and read up on it. Now, you mention comparing. There a several free 'diff' tools out there. You can find them Googling also. good luck Robert Reil wrote: >While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that we >have to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able >continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds. > >This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and they >go theirs. > >What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on >changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it. >With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study group >with Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good >for me. > >I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I can >see the changes. >Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates are >done. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code. >Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible. > >So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWARE >product for us to manage these ongoing changes. > >Note: >These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for >the most part that I can see. >It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be saved >with a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly) >We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1 > >Let the debate begin! > >Thanks! > >Robert P. Reil >Managing Director, >Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. >4292 Country Garden Walk NW >Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 >Office 770-974-8851 >Fax 770-974-8852 >www.motorcyclecarbs.com > > >- >To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ >http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform > >For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists >Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ >List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com >- > > > > > > > > - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Subversion is a great tool for source code mgmt and baselining. However, its roots are from the Linux side. Do some Googling and read up on it. Now, you mention comparing. There a several free 'diff' tools out there. You can find them Googling also. good luck Robert Reil wrote: While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that we have to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds. This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and they go theirs. What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it. With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study group with Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good for me. I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I can see the changes. Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates are done. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code. Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible. So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWARE product for us to manage these ongoing changes. Note: These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for the most part that I can see. It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be saved with a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly) We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1 Let the debate begin! Thanks! Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
Robert, further to all the recommendations to consider subversion, let me point you to a recent blog entry I did pointing out resources that introduce it from the perspective of a CFML developer: http://carehart.org/blog/client/index.cfm/2006/7/12/subversion_resources /charlie http://www.carehart.org/blog/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 8:13 AM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. A good source control could help out tremendously. You can branch off separate builds...great freeware versions are CVS and Subversion (a spinoff of CVS). I think you will find plenty of information on these with a google. If you put the time into learning how to really incorporate a source control you could do exactly what you're talking about below and at the same time have good rollback points if you ever need to I will say this, I've worked with Subversion and was very impressed - they have tools that integrate into windows and they are pretty slick. Hope that helps a little, Allen -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Robert Reil Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 8:00 AM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that we have to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds. This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and they go theirs. What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it. With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study group with Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good for me. I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I can see the changes. Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates are done. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code. Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible. So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWARE product for us to manage these ongoing changes. Note: These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for the most part that I can see. It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be saved with a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly) We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1 Let the debate begin! Thanks! Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=gin.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
I have to agree here, a source versioning system would be the best way to go. Subversion is an open source solution that can be setup on an Windows environment while Linux (any flavor) normally comes with CVS built into the system by default. Visual Source Safe would be another choice for you if you have the license for it. Hope this helps Jason From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steven Ross Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 08:26 To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. I second that SVN is the way to go. I've never set it up for windows but running it under linux is quite easy. On 8/2/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: A good source control could help out tremendously. You can branch off separate builds...great freeware versions are CVS and Subversion (a spinoff of CVS). I think you will find plenty of information on these with a google. If you put the time into learning how to really incorporate a source control you could do exactly what you're talking about below and at the same time have good rollback points if you ever need to I will say this, I've worked with Subversion and was very impressed - they have tools that integrate into windows and they are pretty slick. Hope that helps a little, Allen -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Robert Reil Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 8:00 AM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that we have to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds. This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and they go theirs. What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it. With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study group with Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good for me. I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I can see the changes. Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates are done. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code. Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible. So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWARE product for us to manage these ongoing changes. Note: These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for the most part that I can see. It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be saved with a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly) We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1 Let the debate begin! Thanks! Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?falogin.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - -- Steven Ross web application & interface developer http://www.zerium.com [phone] 404-488-4364 - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink -
Re: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
I second that SVN is the way to go. I've never set it up for windows but running it under linux is quite easy.On 8/2/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: A good source control could help out tremendously. You can branch off separate builds...great freeware versions are CVS and Subversion (a spinoff of CVS). I think you will find plenty of information on these with a google. If you put the time into learning how to really incorporate a source control you could do exactly what you're talking about below and at the same time have good rollback points if you ever need to I will say this, I've worked with Subversion and was very impressed - they have tools that integrate into windows and they are pretty slick.Hope that helps a little,Allen-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Robert ReilSent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 8:00 AMTo: discussion@acfug.orgSubject: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that wehave to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds.This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and theygo theirs.What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it.With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study groupwith Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good for me.I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I cansee the changes.Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates aredone. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code. Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible.So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWAREproduct for us to manage these ongoing changes.Note:These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for the most part that I can see.It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be savedwith a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly)We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1Let the debate begin!Thanks!Robert P. ReilManaging Director,Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc.4292 Country Garden Walk NWKennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851Fax 770-974-8852www.motorcyclecarbs.com-To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserformFor more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglistsArchive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com- -To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @http://www.acfug.org?falogin.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglistsArchive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com--- Steven Ross web application & interface developer http://www.zerium.com[phone] 404-488-4364 - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by FusionLink -
RE: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate.
A good source control could help out tremendously. You can branch off separate builds...great freeware versions are CVS and Subversion (a spinoff of CVS). I think you will find plenty of information on these with a google. If you put the time into learning how to really incorporate a source control you could do exactly what you're talking about below and at the same time have good rollback points if you ever need to I will say this, I've worked with Subversion and was very impressed - they have tools that integrate into windows and they are pretty slick. Hope that helps a little, Allen -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Robert Reil Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 8:00 AM To: discussion@acfug.org Subject: [ACFUG Discuss] Change Management Options Debate. While I am new to development I have reached a point where I realize that we have to modify AbleCommerce (our CF based shopping cart) but that Able continues to revise their product, and create new updated builds. This is going to become a mess as we go our way with their product and they go theirs. What I need to do is manage changes. We have been keeping a log file on changes but they are only as good as the technician that documents it. With this being the case I had a discussion last night at the study group with Teddy, and John that there are many many other options that may be good for me. I will need to compare Older AbleCommerce builds with newer ones so I can see the changes. Also to save as a base line a certain config as a build once updates are done. Then examining the AbleCommerce changes integrate them into our code. Or Vice versa. And this needs to be as simple as possible. So I respectfully open the floor for debate on what is the best FREEWARE product for us to manage these ongoing changes. Note: These changes would be CFM, CSS, & WZC (AbleCommerce Wizard) files only for the most part that I can see. It would also be nice however if certain tables in the DB could be saved with a build as well if that would be possible. (for cart settings mostly) We are using CF6 at the moment on a Windows 2K server in MySQL4.1 Let the debate begin! Thanks! Robert P. Reil Managing Director, Motorcyclecarbs.com, Inc. 4292 Country Garden Walk NW Kennesaw, Ga. 30152 Office 770-974-8851 Fax 770-974-8852 www.motorcyclecarbs.com - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com - - To unsubscribe from this list, manage your profile @ http://www.acfug.org?fa=login.edituserform For more info, see http://www.acfug.org/mailinglists Archive @ http://www.mail-archive.com/discussion%40acfug.org/ List hosted by http://www.fusionlink.com -
