Re: Revisiting MSSQL and Azure SQL Support in Django

[Warren Chu]

2YxNzUxNGEyNzMxNmMyMGRkZGU1=SGN4MTJxQTFCUFNoR29lZUduQk43bGl0TTFDK0NtZTlVUGkvV3RiWUcrZz0==35eb6939d2dd4d978b08a6a8ae2ffcf7>
>
> and the other one is Github Stars. None of them show any sign that MS 
> package is even semi-popular among Django users. 
>
> We have many popular packages that are residing outside of Django core and 
> living happily their lives.
>
> Probably MS wants to use this merge as a marketing point for their MSSQL, 
> a proprietary software.
>
> At the end I, as a total outsider with no direct connection of any kind 
> with Django project, have nothing against merging MS package into core the 
> same way that we have Oracle backend. But before that, there are some 
> questions that need to addressed:
>
> 1. How can MS package create more value for Django users by getting merged 
> into main branch?
>
> 2. According to your internal spying tools, how popular is your package?
>
> 3. How can you guarantee the long-term sustainability of your package?
>
> 4. What are the previous involvements of MS Package contributors in Django?
>
> 5. How does MS support Django Project for its long-term fundraising goals?
>
> 6. Is MS Team ready to follow Django Project deadlines? Especially release 
> dates and critical bugs. 
>
> 7. How does MS support Django Fellows in helping them triaging the 
> tickets, related to MS package. 
>
> Cheers, Salman
>
>
>
>
>
> Am 31. März 2022 18:30:06 MESZ schrieb Warren Chu :
>
> Hi All,
>
> There is increasing interest within Microsoft to have stronger ties 
> between Microsoft SQL Server and Django. As you may be aware, Microsoft and 
> their connectivity teams have been managing the 3rd party backend for 
> "mssql-django" for over a year now at: 
> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django 
> <https://us-east-2.protection.sophos.com?d=github.com=aHR0cHM6Ly9naXRodWIuY29tL21pY3Jvc29mdC9tc3NxbC1kamFuZ28==NWVjN2YxNzUxNGEyNzMxNmMyMGRkZGU1=bTAzbkRpZU8zRVAxZU1sc2plWWY4UnFFQlZqbFRweTR0cjcwRFg1UEh3Zz0==35eb6939d2dd4d978b08a6a8ae2ffcf7>
>
> Inclusion of SQL Server as a 1st party backend is viewed as a potential 
> big milestone in that regard.
>
> @adamjohnson mentioned a year ago that ideally the community would like to 
> see multiple years of ongoing Microsoft support before considering merging 
> as a 1st party backend.
>
> We'd love to hear thoughts and feedback around the possibility of moving 
> forward with a DEP enhancement proposal, with a commitment from Microsoft 
> to providing continued dedicated support for the 1st party backend through 
> the Django project itself (rather than the 3rd party repo).
>
> Cheers,
> Team Microsoft
>
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>  
> <https://us-east-2.protection.sophos.com?d=google.com=aHR0cHM6Ly9ncm91cHMuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS9kL21zZ2lkL2RqYW5nby1kZXZlbG9wZXJzLzZiYWVkM2Y5LTZjZjUtNDU5YS05OTM3LWYwYzM4ZDY0ZjMzMm4lNDBnb29nbGVncm91cHMuY29tP3V0bV9tZWRpdW09ZW1haWwmdXRtX3NvdXJjZT1mb290ZXI==NWVjN2YxNzUxNGEyNzMxNmMyMGRkZGU1=N0hoT3N6Q0FzNUVnNnRNcGhLWmFVMmRzTit5UzRWVnBIbHFiOStQSnRNND0==35eb6939d2dd4d978b08a6a8ae2ffcf7>
> .
>

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Re: Revisiting MSSQL and Azure SQL Support in Django

[Warren Chu]

Thanks for the feedback Adam. Your suggestions are actionable and potential 
sponsorship has been raised for discussion as recently as this week (no 
promises or strings attached).

We'll reach out to you directly if we have any direct follow-up on filling 
in the feature gaps.

 -Warren

On Thursday, 31 March 2022 at 10:07:09 UTC-7 Adam Johnson wrote:

> Hi again Warren,
>
> Good work on maintaining the backend.
>
> Merging the backend could be a good end goal, but I'd be concerned about 
> merging it in the current state. The README lists many features that don't 
> work: https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django#limitations . This list 
> includes some key features like timezones, constraints, and renaming models 
> with foreign keys. The text also has very limited detail on the problems, 
> for example: "Timezones, timedeltas not fully supported" - what doesn't 
> work?
>
> For comparison, the Cockroach DB backend lists its differences and 
> deficiencies in much more detail: 
> https://github.com/cockroachdb/django-cockroachdb#known-issues-and-limitations-in-cockroachdb-212x-and-earlier
>  
> . Although the list there is physically longer, the issues are much more 
> niche. This gives me the impression that the Cockroach DB backend has much 
> better feature coverage.
>
> Merging any code into core Django significantly limits the ability to 
> iterate on it, given the strict release cycle. Users would have to wait for 
> a new Django version to get improvements. I think that whilst the MS SQL 
> backend is missing coverage for key features, effort would be better spent 
> improving it than on any merge proposal.
>
> Adam
>
> P.S. I still don't see Microsoft on the sponsorship page: 
> https://www.djangoproject.com/fundraising/ 
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 31, 2022 at 5:30 PM Warren Chu  wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> There is increasing interest within Microsoft to have stronger ties 
>> between Microsoft SQL Server and Django. As you may be aware, Microsoft and 
>> their connectivity teams have been managing the 3rd party backend for 
>> "mssql-django" for over a year now at: 
>> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django
>>
>> Inclusion of SQL Server as a 1st party backend is viewed as a potential 
>> big milestone in that regard.
>>
>> @adamjohnson mentioned a year ago that ideally the community would like 
>> to see multiple years of ongoing Microsoft support before considering 
>> merging as a 1st party backend.
>>
>> We'd love to hear thoughts and feedback around the possibility of moving 
>> forward with a DEP enhancement proposal, with a commitment from Microsoft 
>> to providing continued dedicated support for the 1st party backend through 
>> the Django project itself (rather than the 3rd party repo).
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Team Microsoft
>>
>> -- 
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>> "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to django-develop...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/0c6ca059-d50e-4c84-bef6-ab0742fc4fa9n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/0c6ca059-d50e-4c84-bef6-ab0742fc4fa9n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

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Revisiting MSSQL and Azure SQL Support in Django

[Warren Chu]

Hi All,

There is increasing interest within Microsoft to have stronger ties between 
Microsoft SQL Server and Django. As you may be aware, Microsoft and their 
connectivity teams have been managing the 3rd party backend for 
"mssql-django" for over a year now at: 
https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django

Inclusion of SQL Server as a 1st party backend is viewed as a potential big 
milestone in that regard.

@adamjohnson mentioned a year ago that ideally the community would like to 
see multiple years of ongoing Microsoft support before considering merging 
as a 1st party backend.

We'd love to hear thoughts and feedback around the possibility of moving 
forward with a DEP enhancement proposal, with a commitment from Microsoft 
to providing continued dedicated support for the 1st party backend through 
the Django project itself (rather than the 3rd party repo).

Cheers,
Team Microsoft

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Re: mssql-django - Need help to contribute / run tests locally

[Warren Chu]

Hi All,

As a project admin for mssql-django, I agree with the above sentiment. The 
support.md policy of the project has now removed the mention of this Google 
group, and we will look to better direct users to the Github issues of 
mssql-django as the primary support channel.

Thanks,
Warren

On Tuesday, 15 February 2022 at 12:19:45 UTC-8 jean.f...@optelgroup.com 
wrote:

> I agree with you.
>
> On Tuesday, February 15, 2022 at 2:34:14 PM UTC-5 Adam Johnson wrote:
>
>> I don't think Microsoft have the right to claim this as their discussion 
>> forum - they've been welcome to post about development in the past, but 
>> there are 11k people subscribed to this list interested in Django, very few 
>> in MS SQL.
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 7:26 PM Jean Frenette  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I see what you mean, but according to this page (
>>> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django/blob/dev/SUPPORT.md), I 
>>> thought I would find an answer here.
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, February 15, 2022 at 2:01:41 PM UTC-5 Adam Johnson wrote:
>>>
 Hi

 This is a bit off topic for this list - mssql-django is not an official 
 Django project. I suggest you contact the maintainers of that project at 
 Microsoft, perhaps through GitHub discussions/issues or email.

 Thanks,

 Adam

 On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 1:26 PM Jean Frenette  
 wrote:

> Hello,
> I recently started contributing to the mssql-django project (
> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django), and I'm not able to run 
> specific tests included in that project, locally.  My goal is to be able 
> to 
> debug some of broken tests, while I try to make some modifications to the 
> code.
>
> I can run specific tests that are included in the Django project tests 
> (in the django folder created by following the contributing file 
> instructions 
> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django/blob/dev/CONTRIBUTING.md).  
> I can NOT run tests individually (or debug) that are specific to the 
> mssql-django project.
>
> Any help would be appreciated.
>
> Thank you very much
>
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>  
> 
> .
>
 -- 
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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Re: Update - MSSQL support for Django

[Warren Chu]

Hi All,

We've released version 1.0 of the Microsoft SQL Server 3rd Party Backend 
for Django! We're excited to bring ongoing first class support to Django 
users on SQL Server and Azure SQL DB.

@Will Vincent - we've reached out to your personal email in the hopes that 
you can post about this release in Django News :)

If anyone has any questions, feel free to post here in the Django 
Developers forum, or via Github issues at: 
https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django

Happy Coding,
Team Microsoft

On Friday, 2 July 2021 at 10:00:40 UTC-7 Warren Chu wrote:

> Hi All, 
>
> We've released version 1.0rc1 of the Microsoft SQL Server 3rd Party 
> Backend for Django, with support for Django 3.2 and JSONField.
>
> We've re-added optional regex support so that the regex DLL file is 
> included in the pypi package as opposed to the source code. This follows 
> our organizational security best practices.
>
> We've also cleared up the licensing issue and reverted to the prior BSD-3 
> license.
>
> We expect to release GA version 1.0 end of this month - where we'll 
> prepare blog post content in advance and engage the community.
>
> If you have any questions, feel free to post here in the Django Developer 
> forum, or via Github issues at: https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django
>
> Thanks,
> Warren
>
> On Friday, 26 March 2021 at 07:39:20 UTC-7 f.apo...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Maybe wait with featuring till the licensing issues are cleared up. 
>> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django/issues/15 does not leave a 
>> good impression on a first glance.
>>
>> On Friday, March 26, 2021 at 1:48:50 PM UTC+1 wi...@wsvincent.com wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, what Adam said! We'll certainly feature the project next week in 
>>> Django News and would happily also include a blog post etc on the project :)
>>>
>>> On Friday, March 26, 2021 at 7:56:11 AM UTC-4 Adam Johnson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Great work Warren and co! I see you already have a number of stars on 
>>>> GitHub.
>>>>
>>>> A promotional blog post could help get the word out as well. If you do 
>>>> write one, submit your blog's Django-specific feed to "Community blog 
>>>> posts" on https://www.djangoproject.com/community/ and it will get 
>>>> picked up by many readers. You can also send it to Jeff Triplett and Will 
>>>> Vincent who run Django News ( https://django-news.com/ ).
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, 19 Mar 2021 at 23:56, Warren Chu  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi All, 
>>>>>
>>>>> We've released the preview version 1.0b1 of the Microsoft SQL Server 
>>>>> 3rd Party Backend for Django. This version supports Django 2.2, 3.0 and 
>>>>> 3.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> What's coming up next between now and GA release? We are re-adding 
>>>>> optional regex support, so that the regex DLL file is downloadable from a 
>>>>> trusted Microsoft downloads page. This file can then be installed in SQL 
>>>>> Server via our project script. This follows our organizational security 
>>>>> best practices.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you have any questions, feel free to post here in the Django 
>>>>> Developer forum, or via Github issues at: 
>>>>> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Warren
>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>>>> Groups "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group.
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>>>> an email to django-develop...@googlegroups.com.
>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/93188f91-c638-4e4d-89ee-e4b63585ab38n%40googlegroups.com
>>>>>  
>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/93188f91-c638-4e4d-89ee-e4b63585ab38n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Adam
>>>>
>>>

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Re: Update - MSSQL support for Django

[Warren Chu]

Hi All, 

We've released version 1.0rc1 of the Microsoft SQL Server 3rd Party Backend 
for Django, with support for Django 3.2 and JSONField.

We've re-added optional regex support so that the regex DLL file is 
included in the pypi package as opposed to the source code. This follows 
our organizational security best practices.

We've also cleared up the licensing issue and reverted to the prior BSD-3 
license.

We expect to release GA version 1.0 end of this month - where we'll prepare 
blog post content in advance and engage the community.

If you have any questions, feel free to post here in the Django Developer 
forum, or via Github issues at: https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django

Thanks,
Warren

On Friday, 26 March 2021 at 07:39:20 UTC-7 f.apo...@gmail.com wrote:

> Maybe wait with featuring till the licensing issues are cleared up. 
> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django/issues/15 does not leave a good 
> impression on a first glance.
>
> On Friday, March 26, 2021 at 1:48:50 PM UTC+1 wi...@wsvincent.com wrote:
>
>> Yes, what Adam said! We'll certainly feature the project next week in 
>> Django News and would happily also include a blog post etc on the project :)
>>
>> On Friday, March 26, 2021 at 7:56:11 AM UTC-4 Adam Johnson wrote:
>>
>>> Great work Warren and co! I see you already have a number of stars on 
>>> GitHub.
>>>
>>> A promotional blog post could help get the word out as well. If you do 
>>> write one, submit your blog's Django-specific feed to "Community blog 
>>> posts" on https://www.djangoproject.com/community/ and it will get 
>>> picked up by many readers. You can also send it to Jeff Triplett and Will 
>>> Vincent who run Django News ( https://django-news.com/ ).
>>>
>>> On Fri, 19 Mar 2021 at 23:56, Warren Chu  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi All, 
>>>>
>>>> We've released the preview version 1.0b1 of the Microsoft SQL Server 
>>>> 3rd Party Backend for Django. This version supports Django 2.2, 3.0 and 
>>>> 3.1.
>>>>
>>>> What's coming up next between now and GA release? We are re-adding 
>>>> optional regex support, so that the regex DLL file is downloadable from a 
>>>> trusted Microsoft downloads page. This file can then be installed in SQL 
>>>> Server via our project script. This follows our organizational security 
>>>> best practices.
>>>>
>>>> If you have any questions, feel free to post here in the Django 
>>>> Developer forum, or via Github issues at: 
>>>> https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Warren
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>>> Groups "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>>> an email to django-develop...@googlegroups.com.
>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/93188f91-c638-4e4d-89ee-e4b63585ab38n%40googlegroups.com
>>>>  
>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/93188f91-c638-4e4d-89ee-e4b63585ab38n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Adam
>>>
>>

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Update - MSSQL support for Django

[Warren Chu]

Hi All, 

We've released the preview version 1.0b1 of the Microsoft SQL Server 3rd 
Party Backend for Django. This version supports Django 2.2, 3.0 and 3.1.

What's coming up next between now and GA release? We are re-adding optional 
regex support, so that the regex DLL file is downloadable from a trusted 
Microsoft downloads page. This file can then be installed in SQL Server via 
our project script. This follows our organizational security best practices.

If you have any questions, feel free to post here in the Django Developer 
forum, or via Github issues at: https://github.com/microsoft/mssql-django

Thanks,
Warren

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Re: Improving MSSQL and Azure SQL support on Django

[Warren Chu]

@Florian, @Adam - Thanks for the feedback. Focusing on MSSQL as a 3rd party 
backend sounds good, indeed even as the long-term goal. We have no 
directive at this point that inclusion into Django core is mandatory, so I 
think we're aligned in terms of practical goals. I'm sure we'll have new 
perspectives and opinions in 1 year's time, and we can re-evaluate or 
confirm this current sentiment at that time. Thanks again.

Cheers,
Warren

On Friday, 4 December 2020 at 00:27:29 UTC-8 Adam Johnson wrote:

> Please keep in mind that Phase 2 is something that might never happen. We 
>> have a tendency to not bloat Django and there is no reason why a database 
>> backend cannot live outside of core.
>>
>  
> I agree here with Florian. It's not *impossible* to consider merging the 
> backend, but I think we'd want to see several years of ongoing support from 
> MS before even considering it.
>
> Keeping it outside of core can probably work in your favour, with the 
> ability to update support for new features or versions of SQL Server 
> outside of Django's release cadence.
>
> On Fri, 4 Dec 2020 at 07:39, Florian Apolloner  wrote:
>
>> Hi Warren,
>>
>> > A) django-mssql is viewed as the Phase 1 focus and current preferred 
>> option with a longer term Phase 2 goal of including MSSQL as a supported 
>> backend for Django core
>>
>> Please keep in mind that Phase 2 is something that might never happen. We 
>> have a tendency to not bloat Django and there is no reason why a database 
>> backend cannot live outside of core. Tim Graham is currently working on a 
>> cockroach backend and is running against the builtin Django testsuite (+ 
>> submitting patches to Django where we need to alter tests due to reliance 
>> on PKs etc…). This approach works imo very well (I did the same when 
>> writing a backend for Informix). We are very supportive of 3rd party db 
>> backends in the sense that we usually quickly address issues in our 
>> testsuite etc to make testing those external backends against Django 
>> easier. In that sense there is no strong reason to include the MSSQL 
>> backend in core. Package management in Python works well enough to allow 
>> the backend to stay external. 
>>
>> Personally I think having the django-mssql backend with MS support behind 
>> it (be that test infra for the existing django-mssql fork etc) is already 
>> the icing on the cake.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Florian
>>
>>
>> On Friday, December 4, 2020 at 2:59:43 AM UTC+1 vwa...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for the responses.
>>>
>>> @Florian - I've now reached out to the maintainers of ESSolutions as 
>>> well as the relevant previous Microsoft engagement owners, thanks for the 
>>> suggestion
>>>
>>> @Chris - This is excellent news indeed, we are excited to make progress 
>>> beginning with some small steps
>>>
>>> @r...@whidbey.com - 
>>> A) django-mssql is viewed as the Phase 1 focus and current preferred 
>>> option with a longer term Phase 2 goal of including MSSQL as a supported 
>>> backend for Django core
>>> B) I've now logged both your pain points as issues in our private repo 
>>> (which will be made public after internal compliance reviews)
>>> C) Happy to hear about your scaled production app using Django and 
>>> MSSQL. Could I ask you to send a "Hello" email to myself at 
>>> v-wa...@microsoft.com, so that we can follow up with eventual testing?
>>>
>>> @dans...@gmail.com - Your security concerns are important and noted, 
>>> I've flagged this for investigation as a priority
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Warren
>>> On Friday, 27 November 2020 at 10:57:09 UTC-8 dans...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 I'd suggest someone talk with professional DBAs for MSSQL.  In my work, 
 which is Federal government, the DBA told me that disconnecting from PSQL 
 as "appuser" and attempting to connect to database "postgres" in order to 
 create the test database violated FISMA.  I had to subclass my own 
 postgresql backend to create the test user while connected to my actual 
 database.  I would imagine that the original reasons for doing it this way 
 harkens back to a time when people used the same database server for 
 production, staging, qa, and integration, and some of these environments 
 may not have existed. While in some organizations we have only production, 
 staging/qa, and development/integration, I would guess there are few cases 
 where the same database server is used for production and the other 
 environments.

 On Fri, Nov 27, 2020 at 1:18 PM r...@whidbey.com  
 wrote:

> Good news.  I've been using Django on MSSQL for about 8 years.  Couple 
> of things:
> - I've been using pyodbc, not django-mssql.  I note your messages from 
> 2015 include it as a library to check for compatibility; what was the 
> outcome of that?  Is it proposed that django-mssql become the 
> "best-practices" interface for SQL Server?
> - Couple of persistent pain points:
>  

Re: Improving MSSQL and Azure SQL support on Django

[Warren Chu]

Thanks for the responses.

@Florian - I've now reached out to the maintainers of ESSolutions as well 
as the relevant previous Microsoft engagement owners, thanks for the 
suggestion

@Chris - This is excellent news indeed, we are excited to make progress 
beginning with some small steps

@r...@whidbey.com - 
A) django-mssql is viewed as the Phase 1 focus and current preferred option 
with a longer term Phase 2 goal of including MSSQL as a supported backend 
for Django core
B) I've now logged both your pain points as issues in our private repo 
(which will be made public after internal compliance reviews)
C) Happy to hear about your scaled production app using Django and MSSQL. 
Could I ask you to send a "Hello" email to myself at 
v-war...@microsoft.com, so that we can follow up with eventual testing?

@dans...@gmail.com - Your security concerns are important and noted, I've 
flagged this for investigation as a priority

Cheers,
Warren
On Friday, 27 November 2020 at 10:57:09 UTC-8 dans...@gmail.com wrote:

> I'd suggest someone talk with professional DBAs for MSSQL.  In my work, 
> which is Federal government, the DBA told me that disconnecting from PSQL 
> as "appuser" and attempting to connect to database "postgres" in order to 
> create the test database violated FISMA.  I had to subclass my own 
> postgresql backend to create the test user while connected to my actual 
> database.  I would imagine that the original reasons for doing it this way 
> harkens back to a time when people used the same database server for 
> production, staging, qa, and integration, and some of these environments 
> may not have existed. While in some organizations we have only production, 
> staging/qa, and development/integration, I would guess there are few cases 
> where the same database server is used for production and the other 
> environments.
>
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2020 at 1:18 PM r...@whidbey.com  wrote:
>
>> Good news.  I've been using Django on MSSQL for about 8 years.  Couple of 
>> things:
>> - I've been using pyodbc, not django-mssql.  I note your messages from 
>> 2015 include it as a library to check for compatibility; what was the 
>> outcome of that?  Is it proposed that django-mssql become the 
>> "best-practices" interface for SQL Server?
>> - Couple of persistent pain points:
>>   1. Testing.  The Django code that sets up test databases fails with 
>> MSSQL, while it succeeds with PostGRE, MySQL and SQLite.  The issues seem 
>> to revolve around setting constraints as the tables are generated, rather 
>> than holding off and enabling the constraints at the end of the process.
>>   2. Stored Procedures.  These need to be loaded as an additional step in 
>> the creation of a database, and don't really have any representation in 
>> Django per se so migrations, etc don't generally have an idea that they 
>> exist.
>>
>> I'd be happy to test out what you come up with against our system.  It's 
>> currently serving a custom REST interface with 2-million-plus rows of 
>> transactions,with clients world-wide, along with a customer-facing web app, 
>> a staff site and a suite of Tableau reports.
>>
>> On Thursday, November 26, 2020 at 5:40:18 PM UTC-8 vwa...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> Microsoft has now committed ongoing resources towards improving MSSQL 
>>> and Azure SQL support for Django. We're currently focused on internal 
>>> compliance and forking the ESSolutions django-mssql-backend 
>>> , adding testing 
>>> pipelines, refactoring the Django DB engine naming convention, and 
>>> addressing current test suite errors.
>>>
>>> We'd love to hear from current mssql-backend maintainers as well as 
>>> mssql-backend users about the existing issues and feature requests that we 
>>> should be prioritizing.
>>>
>>> We looking forward to engaging the community and working towards MSSQL 
>>> as a first-class supported backend for Django.
>>>
>>> -Warren
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, 4 December 2019 at 07:05:25 UTC-8 Tim Allen wrote:
>>>
 Hi Sean, just an update from what I know.

 We are still waiting for a reply from Microsoft. They're a large 
 company, so understandably, it takes a little while.


 For now, if people need to get onto Django 2.2 for long term support 
 (which will last until April, 2022), you can use this package:

 https://github.com/ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend I've been running 
 it in production for months without incident. Of course, YMMV.


 If Microsoft and/or the DSF end up wanting to bring support under the 
 Django umbrella, the django-mssql-backend repository is a possible 
 starting point, IMHO.

 The django-mssql-backend is currently being developed and support for 
 Django 3.0 is being worked on: ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend#18 
 


 Regards,


 Tim

Re: Increasing support for Microsoft SQL Server

[Warren Chu]

Thanks for link references - they've been helpful.

We're in the process of forking the existing django-mssql-backend 
<https://github.com/ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend> and setting up 
related pipelines. We're also reviewing previously logged Github issues, 
and preparing an internal Django app as a tool and onboarding opportunity. 
Are there any other hot topics related to Django and MSSQL? We're happy to 
discuss offline in a video call as well.

Cheers,
Warren 

On Tuesday, 10 November 2020 at 03:05:44 UTC-8 uri...@gmail.com wrote:

>
> This thread in particular, I think.
> https://groups.google.com/g/django-developers/c/FbBcUCzrSZo/m/EoFNbR2BDgAJ
> On Monday, November 9, 2020 at 11:56:01 PM UTC-10 Adam Johnson wrote:
>
>> Hi Warren,
>>
>> Thanks for looking at working on this. SQL Server is (I believe) the most 
>> popular not-in-core DB backend. Carlton's suggestions are solid.
>>
>> I'd also point you to reading the old mailing list posts: 
>> https://groups.google.com/g/django-developers/search?q=microsoft%20sql . 
>> I recall there was a few years ago a previous Microsoft effort to support 
>> Django + SQL Server, and some people including the author of django-mssql, 
>> Michael Manfre, were flown out to Redmond(?) for some discussions. But I 
>> don't know what came of that.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Adam
>>
>> On Sun, 8 Nov 2020 at 11:32, Carlton Gibson  wrote:
>>
>>> HI Warren. 
>>>
>>> Thanks for your mail. 
>>>
>>> 1 - How can we best collaborate?
>>>
>>>
>>> I’d guess the best thing would be to communicate with the existing 
>>> contributors and ask where resource would be best spent. 
>>>
>>> I’m not mssql-server user myself, but first question I’d be asking is 
>>> where is the backend not feature-equivalent to the backends in core? (I 
>>> can’t tell you that I’m afraid.) A good test would be whether it passes the 
>>> django test suite?
>>>
>>> Kind Regards,
>>>
>>> Carlton
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 3 Nov 2020, at 21:50, Warren Chu  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> Microsoft has commissioned internal resources, of which I'm a member, to 
>>> drive development and support of an open source Microsoft SQL Server 
>>> backend solution for Django. This project would exist under the 
>>> github.com/microsoft organization.
>>>
>>> We recognize there is an existing and active project [
>>> https://github.com/ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend], and we'd like to 
>>> solicit ideas and feedback from the Django community on the best way to 
>>> proceed.
>>>
>>> Some initial questions we have are:
>>>
>>> 1 - How can we best collaborate?
>>> 2 - What issues or challenges are most pressing to make MSSQL-Django 
>>> work better for you?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Warren
>>>
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/25102379-5df3-4c55-a786-ac9acda20b13n%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/25102379-5df3-4c55-a786-ac9acda20b13n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>>
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>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/52921BEA-3ACE-4C49-995A-FD8F3597352C%40gmail.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/52921BEA-3ACE-4C49-995A-FD8F3597352C%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Adam
>>
>

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Re: Improving MSSQL and Azure SQL support on Django

[Warren Chu]

Hi All,

Microsoft has now committed ongoing resources towards improving MSSQL and 
Azure SQL support for Django. We're currently focused on internal 
compliance and forking the ESSolutions django-mssql-backend 
, adding testing 
pipelines, refactoring the Django DB engine naming convention, and 
addressing current test suite errors.

We'd love to hear from current mssql-backend maintainers as well as 
mssql-backend users about the existing issues and feature requests that we 
should be prioritizing.

We looking forward to engaging the community and working towards MSSQL as a 
first-class supported backend for Django.

-Warren

On Wednesday, 4 December 2019 at 07:05:25 UTC-8 Tim Allen wrote:

> Hi Sean, just an update from what I know.
>
> We are still waiting for a reply from Microsoft. They're a large company, 
> so understandably, it takes a little while.
>
>
> For now, if people need to get onto Django 2.2 for long term support 
> (which will last until April, 2022), you can use this package:
>
> https://github.com/ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend I've been running it 
> in production for months without incident. Of course, YMMV.
>
>
> If Microsoft and/or the DSF end up wanting to bring support under the 
> Django umbrella, the django-mssql-backend repository is a possible 
> starting point, IMHO.
>
> The django-mssql-backend is currently being developed and support for 
> Django 3.0 is being worked on: ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend#18 
> 
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
> Tim
>
> On Monday, December 2, 2019 at 11:03:56 AM UTC-5, Sean Martz wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> It seems like this issue has lost momentum. Is this still something 
>> that's on anyones radar? It looks like django-pyodbc-azure is not actively 
>> maintained anymore (it looks like Michaya has taken a hiatus from GitHub). 
>> It also looks like there's a small community potentially popping up that's 
>> interested in first class MSSQL Server support for Django. (
>> https://github.com/FlipperPA/django-mssql-backend). Is Microsoft still 
>> interested in committing resources to this goal? In my situation, it would 
>> be a lot easier to sell stakeholders and decision makers on Django if it 
>> had first class support for MSSQL Server.
>>
>> For what it's worth, Django-pyodbc-azure is still working well.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Sean
>>
>>

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Increasing support for Microsoft SQL Server

[Warren Chu]

Hi All,

Microsoft has commissioned internal resources, of which I'm a member, to 
drive development and support of an open source Microsoft SQL Server 
backend solution for Django. This project would exist under the 
github.com/microsoft organization.

We recognize there is an existing and active project 
[https://github.com/ESSolutions/django-mssql-backend], and we'd like to 
solicit ideas and feedback from the Django community on the best way to 
proceed.

Some initial questions we have are:

1 - How can we best collaborate?
2 - What issues or challenges are most pressing to make MSSQL-Django work 
better for you?

Thanks,
Warren

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