Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
В Mon, 23 Feb 2015 13:19:04 + KatolaZ kato...@freaknet.org пишет: On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Ста Деюс sthu.d...@openmailbox.org wrote: But, at the first, what is planned to perform to protect «Devuan» from the guys, that got hold of the fantastic project «Debian»? In other words, if the guys come to «Devuan» and by their cruelty will start to «help» some of developers to corrupt the project, do abnormal, unnatural for the project things -- similar like constitution of «Debian» appeared, finnaly the «systemd» was forcibly set up: how we will protect our project? Very good question. Well the answer is simple: if such an unlikely invasion would happen, we will always have the opportunity to fork Devuan, for the good of its users :) Hmm. You see how not easy and not short is the process of creation of a new distro. To capture distro is very easy as Debian sad experience shows... and is grievous for its long time users. Why i stress the point is that our community would ponder on this wise, and may be, a decision will be thought out for such cases - when distro is not protected by army (its developers): and be used for other free distro.s, not only Devuan. The decision can be encapsulated into the development process so that easy transfer to another (new) distro will be easy and short, or its capture will be in vain and therefore may abandoned in the future. Otherwise we will be going circles - long, hard - just to get what we had already - and even that is not in long perspective. Having said that, I personally think that there is no reason to protect Devuan from the [bad] guys. If we would like to do something good for Devuan we should now focus on helping Devuan developers making it happen, not defending them from being zombified by unspecified members of The Dark Power(TM) Well. I have said my opinion. Sthu. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
В Wed, 25 Feb 2015 09:15:24 +0100 Anthony Scemama scem...@gmx.com пишет: I found this image on the web: http://tux.crystalxp.net/png/kros753-kiss-the-demon-2286.png It's a good mix between KISS and Linux! If you like it, I can ask the guys from CrystalXP.net if it can be used for Devuan. I guess it is not what Linus ment, choosing for logo penguin: something cute. :o) To me it is not beautiful, nor comely. Sthu. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On 02/24/2015 09:54 PM, Vernon Geiszler wrote: I think this question goes together with the badge or logo question. It must go beyond sans-systemd; it is more about principles. Let's list some: - freedom of choice, - interchangealility of solutions to a given need, - reduce inter-dependencies to the strict minimum Don't know if KISS goes into details, but maybe it could inspire the logo. KISS Linux? Unless the band has an objection to the use of its trademark. Unlikely, since we're in a different business entirely. Unless, of course, we choose to use the band's logo as well. My first vision was of the lips from Rocky Horror Show kissing Tux the penguin. Vernon I found this image on the web: http://tux.crystalxp.net/png/kros753-kiss-the-demon-2286.png It's a good mix between KISS and Linux! If you like it, I can ask the guys from CrystalXP.net if it can be used for Devuan. Cheers, Anthony ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
I think this question goes together with the badge or logo question. It must go beyond sans-systemd; it is more about principles. Let's list some: - freedom of choice, - interchangealility of solutions to a given need, - reduce inter-dependencies to the strict minimum Don't know if KISS goes into details, but maybe it could inspire the logo. KISS Linux? Unless the band has an objection to the use of its trademark. Unlikely, since we're in a different business entirely. Unless, of course, we choose to use the band's logo as well. My first vision was of the lips from Rocky Horror Show kissing Tux the penguin. Vernon ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
Доброго времени суток, Martijn. Спасибо за ответ, Tue, 3 Feb 2015 16:34:59 +0200, вы писали: I (my company) looks after a lot of servers, and we are *always* looking for ways to make things go better, faster, and stronger :) automation is a *huge* part of what we do, as is security. Systemd does not really offer us much that we don't already have, and the price we need to pay to take on systemd is not one we are comfortable with. Untested, unproven, and at the end of the day an overall framework architecture that we think sucks. Systemd offers a lot of interesting things for desktop users, which we are not. We are server monkeys, and don't really care about desktop bootimes. I *like* initscripts, but also like OpenRC and upstart (we are an Ubuntu shop). Plus many of desktop users do not turn off their machines, but simply put it to sleep. С уважением, Ста. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Ста Деюс sthu.d...@openmailbox.org wrote: But, at the first, what is planned to perform to protect «Devuan» from the guys, that got hold of the fantastic project «Debian»? In other words, if the guys come to «Devuan» and by their cruelty will start to «help» some of developers to corrupt the project, do abnormal, unnatural for the project things -- similar like constitution of «Debian» appeared, finnaly the «systemd» was forcibly set up: how we will protect our project? Very good question. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 01:04:05PM +, Nuno Magalhães wrote: On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Ста Деюс sthu.d...@openmailbox.org wrote: But, at the first, what is planned to perform to protect «Devuan» from the guys, that got hold of the fantastic project «Debian»? In other words, if the guys come to «Devuan» and by their cruelty will start to «help» some of developers to corrupt the project, do abnormal, unnatural for the project things -- similar like constitution of «Debian» appeared, finnaly the «systemd» was forcibly set up: how we will protect our project? Very good question. Well the answer is simple: if such an unlikely invasion would happen, we will always have the opportunity to fork Devuan, for the good of its users :) Having said that, I personally think that there is no reason to protect Devuan from the [bad] guys. If we would like to do something good for Devuan we should now focus on helping Devuan developers making it happen, not defending them from being zombified by unspecified members of The Dark Power(TM) :P -- [ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ --- GLUG Catania -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ me [at] katolaz.homeunix.net -- http://katolaz.homeunix.net -- ] [ GNU/Linux User:#325780/ICQ UIN: #258332181/GPG key ID 0B5F062F ] [ Fingerprint: 8E59 D6AA 445E FDB4 A153 3D5A 5F20 B3AE 0B5F 062F ] ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
Didier Kryn wrote: Le 23/02/2015 14:04, Nuno Magalhães a écrit : On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Ста Деюс sthu.d...@openmailbox.org wrote: But, at the first, what is planned to perform to protect «Devuan» from the guys, that got hold of the fantastic project «Debian»? In other words, if the guys come to «Devuan» and by their cruelty will start to «help» some of developers to corrupt the project, do abnormal, unnatural for the project things -- similar like constitution of «Debian» appeared, finnaly the «systemd» was forcibly set up: how we will protect our project? Very good question. ___ I think this question goes together with the badge or logo question. It must go beyond sans-systemd; it is more about principles. Let's list some: - freedom of choice, - interchangealility of solutions to a given need, - reduce inter-dependencies to the strict minimum Don't know if KISS goes into details, but maybe it could inspire the logo. KISS Linux? -- Joel Roth ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
Доброго времени суток, Didier. Спасибо за ответ, Tue, 03 Feb 2015 12:31:33 +0100, вы писали: I think it is fine that T.J.Duchene gives his opinion, although I disagree with him. I'm very optimistic about Systemd-free Linux, so optimistic that I think Devuan is simply preparing the future of Debian. Sure! The reason why RedHat develops and enforces systemd is clear to me: they have customers paying for a ready-made system that RedHat would maintain. They want to increase their productivity by introducing tools which automate things as much as possible, plus security-related features -- a valid sales argument. It makes full sense; that's their busyness model. Which security you are talking about? systems - has a lot of poorely tested code at one hand, that uses root-priveleges at another hand! But what are Debian maintainers/developpers working for? OK they try to provide an OS that's usable out of the box, but for who? Sure For those who has power over the developers|maintainers, that like security issues of software, who need to control every person on the planet, or occupy the planet! - And who is it?! - As usually, the well-known planet accupants, the original capitalists, the US/UK ! it works for Everybody, they claim, but this includes primarily people like themselves, geeks and hackers. And they likely will see geeks and hackers run away. Debian has taken a very wrong decision but they're going to have chances to change it. No! They continue as it is the goal of the 4 voters and their masters: to bind the great project to themselves. In systemd i see pure attack on linux and the free software. С уважением, Ста. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 07:47:32AM -1000, Joel Roth wrote: Didier Kryn wrote: Le 23/02/2015 14:04, Nuno Magalhães a écrit : On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Ста Деюс sthu.d...@openmailbox.org wrote: But, at the first, what is planned to perform to protect «Devuan» from the guys, that got hold of the fantastic project «Debian»? In other words, if the guys come to «Devuan» and by their cruelty will start to «help» some of developers to corrupt the project, do abnormal, unnatural for the project things -- similar like constitution of «Debian» appeared, finnaly the «systemd» was forcibly set up: how we will protect our project? Very good question. ___ I think this question goes together with the badge or logo question. It must go beyond sans-systemd; it is more about principles. Let's list some: - freedom of choice, - interchangealility of solutions to a given need, - reduce inter-dependencies to the strict minimum Don't know if KISS goes into details, but maybe it could inspire the logo. KISS Linux? Unless the band has an objection to the use of its trademark. Unlikely, since we're in a different business entirely. Unless, of course, we choose to use the band's logo as well... -- hendrik ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On Mon, 23 Feb 2015 07:47:32 -1000 Joel Roth jo...@pobox.com wrote: Didier Kryn wrote: I think this question goes together with the badge or logo question. It must go beyond sans-systemd; it is more about principles. Let's list some: - freedom of choice, - interchangealility of solutions to a given need, - reduce inter-dependencies to the strict minimum Don't know if KISS goes into details, but maybe it could inspire the logo. KISS Linux? It has rhythm. I think I can dance to it! SteveT Steve Litt* http://www.troubleshooters.com/ Troubleshooting Training * Human Performance ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 8:54 PM, Hendrik Boom hend...@topoi.pooq.com wrote: Unless, of course, we choose to use the band's logo as well... Paul Stanley's tongue... Tux sticking its tongue out... dunno. Anyway will Devuan have release names? I'd go with Calimero for 1.0. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On Tuesday, 24 de February de 2015 00:35:59 Gravis escribió: ha! jude it's perfect. if there was ever a Master Control Program, it would be systemd. ;) Partitioning memory, controlling permissions, access to hardware, managing networks, shredding programs from memory... I always thought MCP was Linux, before Linux was conceived :D er Envite -- A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? OpenPGP key: 1586 50C8 7DBF B050 DE62 EA12 70B4 00F3 EEC7 C372 Spiral galaxies always have at least TWO arms. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11
On February 23, 2015 at 7:35 PM Gravis rin...@adaptivetime.com wrote: ha! jude it's perfect. if there was ever a Master Control Program, it would be systemd. ;) --Gravis I have this image of the scene late in Tron where the MCP is turning red in the uplink after the data disk has been hurled into it. Superimpose a circle bar left over it to prohibit it. Peter Olson ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
