Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Vote: Elect Jean Weber as Documentation team lead

2011-11-10 Thread Jean Weber
Thank you to everyone for your support of David's proposal for me to
be team leader. I am honoured.

However, after much thought, I am declining the invitation. I will
continue to do some things, but only intermittently, and I do not want
to accept responsibility for the things I think need to be done. What
I want to do requires enough others contributing reliably and
productively to get at least some jobs done. And we don't have enough
productive people. I've been recruiting for and promoting OOo/LO docs
for many years, and the results have not been encouraging. I don't
know what the secret is for successful volunteer recruitment and
retention, but obviously I haven't stumbled on it. I'm tired of
trying.

Some time ago I did a fairly thorough brain dump into the chapters
of the Contributors Guide. Even though they need updating and (in some
cases) expansion, they should be a good starting place for the group's
members, both new and veteran. I sincerely hope some people will
emerge to take over doing the necessary work, and doing it well.

--Jean

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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Vote: Elect Jean Weber as Documentation team lead

2011-11-10 Thread Jean Weber
Also, after all these years I'm bored with the whole thing. --Jean

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 21:10, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thank you to everyone for your support of David's proposal for me to
 be team leader. I am honoured.

 However, after much thought, I am declining the invitation. I will
 continue to do some things, but only intermittently, and I do not want
 to accept responsibility for the things I think need to be done. What
 I want to do requires enough others contributing reliably and
 productively to get at least some jobs done. And we don't have enough
 productive people. I've been recruiting for and promoting OOo/LO docs
 for many years, and the results have not been encouraging. I don't
 know what the secret is for successful volunteer recruitment and
 retention, but obviously I haven't stumbled on it. I'm tired of
 trying.

 Some time ago I did a fairly thorough brain dump into the chapters
 of the Contributors Guide. Even though they need updating and (in some
 cases) expansion, they should be a good starting place for the group's
 members, both new and veteran. I sincerely hope some people will
 emerge to take over doing the necessary work, and doing it well.

 --Jean


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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Vote: Elect Jean Weber as Documentation team lead

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
Ouch.  It is fair enough.  I think one problem was Sun's mastery but it's good 
to hear that the problems we are having are not new.  In England it is a 
particularly difficult time to recruit volunteers as a lot of charities are 
having their funding pulled away so they are all clamouring for volunteers 
too.  Of course the top-down structure doesn't bode well for them either so 
like Sun they might have troubles too.  None of which really helps
Apols and regards from
Tom :)

--- On Thu, 10/11/11, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:

From: Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Vote: Elect Jean Weber as 
Documentation team lead
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Thursday, 10 November, 2011, 11:38

Also, after all these years I'm bored with the whole thing. --Jean

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 21:10, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thank you to everyone for your support of David's proposal for me to
 be team leader. I am honoured.

 However, after much thought, I am declining the invitation. I will
 continue to do some things, but only intermittently, and I do not want
 to accept responsibility for the things I think need to be done. What
 I want to do requires enough others contributing reliably and
 productively to get at least some jobs done. And we don't have enough
 productive people. I've been recruiting for and promoting OOo/LO docs
 for many years, and the results have not been encouraging. I don't
 know what the secret is for successful volunteer recruitment and
 retention, but obviously I haven't stumbled on it. I'm tired of
 trying.

 Some time ago I did a fairly thorough brain dump into the chapters
 of the Contributors Guide. Even though they need updating and (in some
 cases) expansion, they should be a good starting place for the group's
 members, both new and veteran. I sincerely hope some people will
 emerge to take over doing the necessary work, and doing it well.

 --Jean


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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] My work on the Getting Started Guide; I have questions

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
+1
Particularly the point about the Calc Guide

 Inserting new sheets
working with sheets and then
Deleting Sheets
Seems a good logical flow for the chapters.
Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Wed, 9/11/11, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:

From: Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-documentation] My work on the Getting Started Guide;  
I have questions
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Wednesday, 9 November, 2011, 4:04

Comments interleaved below. See also end of note for other things that
need to be done.

On Tue, Nov 8, 2011 at 23:55, David Michel dsmic...@yahoo.com wrote:
 I worked on Chapter 5 (Calc) of the Getting Started Guide.  This is my first 
 attempt at a contribution to this
 project, so I need help!

 The file is in the Repository under the name:
 0105GS34-GettingStartedWithCalc DavidMichelFirstDraft.odt

 Go to:  EnglishDocumentationGetting Started GuideDrafts

 It is the third on the list.

 The original text from the Wiki is in italics, and my comments are directly 
 below.

 Redesign Move/Copy Sheet dialog (Edit-Sheet-Move/Copy) - put in section on 
 working with sheets.
 I created a screen shot of the dialog.  But, where exactly should I put it?  
 Should more text be written?

I think the logical place would be just before Deleting Sheets on
page 17; that is, after the section titled Inserting new sheets. And
yes, you'll need to write some text to go with it (unless the Calc
Guide includes something you can reuse).

 Add a few words on sheet tab colors (get words from Calc Guide).
 Done on page 8

OK.

 Add a few words on total and subtotals?
 How much should be written?  These are subjects which take more than a few 
 words.

Just a few words, and see below about combining with other info into a
section on data analysis.

 Mention Pivot Tables (formerly DataPilot) and refer reader to Calc Guide.
 Where, exactly?  I put this on page 35.

That's good. You might say a little bit more than you've got in the
draft. Maybe you can get some ideas or words from the first paragraph
of Calc Guide Chapter 8? Also, mention that in LO 3.3 this feature is
called DataPilot.

After further reflection, I think perhaps a short section on data
analysis, mentioning some of the methods Calc provides (with pivot
tables as an important method), would be more useful in this chapter
than just an item on PTs. The introductory section of Calc Guide
Chapter 9 has some good ideas, and you can also mention consolidating
data, subtotals, scenarios, other what if tools, goal seek, and
solver. Just a few words on each.

Let's tie together the basic data entry info earlier in this Getting
Started chapter and offer to readers the idea that they can go
further. Hmmm, I see the CG has subtotals in Chapter 9.

BTW, references to other books are to chapters only (sometimes section
headings), but never page numbers.

Section titles should start with an -ing word, for consistency with
the rest of the chapter and book. So, for example, Using pivot
tables (capitalization not necessary).

 Add a few words on functions and formulas, refer reader to Calc Guide.
 Again, where?  Do these go together in one section?  I put these on page 35.

Together in one section, yes. Page 35 is good. A bit more discussion,
please. First two paragraphs of Calc Guide Ch7, slightly modified,
could be useful.

 Based on these changes, I updated the TOC.


Other things to do (as listed near the top of this section,
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Documentation/Development#Getting_Started_Guide
)

1) Use the Template Changer extension to apply the v3.4 chapter
template (LO_3_4_chapter_template.ott, available from the
Documentation  Resources folder in Alfresco). [You may need to
download and install the extension, then download and import the
template into LO. Get it from
http://extensions.libreoffice.org/extension-center/template-changer
and put it anywhere on your computer, then follow instructions in
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Documentation/HowTo/install_extension
] You may also wish to review the relevant part of the GS chapter on
styles and templates for how to use this extension.

2) Change arrows in menu paths to  (to match most other books).

3) Ensure that feedback address on Copyright page shows
documentation@global.libreoffice.org (global is missing in some
chapters).

4) Check screenshots for changes. Some are definitely out of date, but
I don't know which ones. Use silver/gray theme for any replacements
needed. In many cases (Chapter 4,5,6,7) the component guide will
contain a newer image that can be used in this book without necessity
of recapturing/redoing.

--Jean

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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Writer Guide chapter 1: Introducing Writer

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
I have been having troubles at work so i have been kinda off-line until today.  
A lot of catching-up to do.  Hazel i think your emails are getting through, 
certainly some of them are.  Jean has a good point tho lol.  How about checking 
the Nabble forum to see if your posts are there?
http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Documentation-f1645240.html
Regards from
Tom :)


--- On Tue, 8/11/11, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:

From: Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Writer Guide chapter 1: Introducing 
Writer
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Tuesday, 8 November, 2011, 20:07

On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 03:04, Hazel Russman hazeldeb...@googlemail.com wrote:
 OK, locked and downloaded.

 Recently I've had the impression my posts to this list aren't coming through. 
 Any problems?


I've seen several notes from you about checking out files and checking
them in again, but I haven't replied to all of them. Of course, if you
sent something that didn't come through, I wouldn't know I'd missed
it. :-)

--Jean

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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] how to type %

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
If you can't find it on the keyboard then try the menus

Insert - Special character

Then depending on which font is selected the % might be about 6th across the 
top?
Regards from
Tom :)


--- On Tue, 8/11/11, lsq lsq...@gmail.com wrote:

From: lsq lsq...@gmail.com
Subject: [libreoffice-documentation] how to type %
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Tuesday, 8 November, 2011, 14:44

in mathe, i find all guide ,but i can't find how to type % in writer.


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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] My work on the Getting Started Guide; I have questions

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
Brief is good!  Most topics can be expanded endlessly but the Getting Started 
Guide is just a brief taster to encourage people to either check the other 
guides, find out on-line, ask around or explore for themselves.

Good stuff!  It's great to get your feet wet again after so long dealing with 
infra-structure i bet!  I have tons of filing to catch-up on at work now that 
Black History Month is over. Fun, fun, fun.  Luckily i am off to the boat for 
a week soon.  Cold, wet, muddy and almost no access but a good refreshing break 
:)
Regards from
Tom :)


--- On Tue, 8/11/11, David Michel dsmic...@yahoo.com wrote:

From: David Michel dsmic...@yahoo.com
Subject: [libreoffice-documentation] My work on the Getting Started Guide;  I 
have questions
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org 
documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Tuesday, 8 November, 2011, 13:55

I worked on Chapter 5 (Calc) of the Getting Started Guide.  This is my first 
attempt at a contribution to this 
project, so I need help!  

The file is in the Repository under the name:
0105GS34-GettingStartedWithCalc DavidMichelFirstDraft.odt

Go to:  EnglishDocumentationGetting Started GuideDrafts

It is the third on the list.

The original text from the Wiki is in italics, and my comments are directly 
below.
 
Redesign Move/Copy Sheet dialog (Edit-Sheet-Move/Copy) - put in section on 
working with sheets. 
I created a screen shot of the dialog.  But, where exactly should I put it?  
Should more text be written?

Add a few words on sheet tab colors (get words from Calc Guide). 
Done on page 8 

Add a few words on total and subtotals? 
How much should be written?  These are subjects which take more than a few 
words.

Mention Pivot Tables (formerly DataPilot) and refer reader to Calc Guide. 
Where, exactly?  I put this on page 35.

Add a few words on functions and formulas, refer reader to Calc Guide. 
Again, where?  Do these go together in one section?  I put these on page 35.

Based on these changes, I updated the TOC.  

Thanks for your patience,

David
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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] how to type %

2011-11-10 Thread Jay Lozier
On 11/10/2011 08:38 AM, Tom Davies wrote:
 Hi :)
 If you can't find it on the keyboard then try the menus

 Insert - Special character

 Then depending on which font is selected the % might be about 6th across the 
 top?
 Regards from
 Tom :)


 --- On Tue, 8/11/11, lsq lsq...@gmail.com wrote:

 From: lsq lsq...@gmail.com
 Subject: [libreoffice-documentation] how to type %
 To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
 Date: Tuesday, 8 November, 2011, 14:44

 in mathe, i find all guide ,but i can't find how to type % in writer.

 What is your default keyboard, US standard the % sign is shift 5 and the Euro 
 sign is not available on the keybouard but is in the character set. It is 
 accessed as Tom noted. Also, check your character encoding and make sure the 
 % is defined; all of the fonts I checked had the % mapped to the same code. 
 In the US, the typical character sets include many extra characters that are 
 not directly accessible from the keyboard.


-- 
Jay Lozier jsloz...@gmail.com

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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] LibO Documentation

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
Lol, i thought we were going to have to fight them (the devs) to try to wrest 
control away from them, once people had time to start working on the Help files!
Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 7/11/11, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:

From: Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-documentation] LibO Documentation
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org 
documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Monday, 7 November, 2011, 19:51

On 08/11/2011, at 4:04, David Nelson li...@traduction.biz wrote:

 On Mon, Nov 7, 2011 at 12:24 PM, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:
 And I'm not sure who is in charge of the Help, but I don't think it's us.
 
 Erm, actually, the devs do seem to think it is us, which I find fairly
 logical. That's why they keep CC'ing me all bugs involving the
 built-in help.
 
 I guess we could currently consider me to be first custodian of
 built-in help issues, although *anyone* is welcome to work on them.
 I'll be happy to foster anyone wanting to tool up for the job.


Ah, OK. That brings us back to the original question: where are the Help source 
files? And related questions about how/where/when to write/edit the Help. Is 
this work all tracked through the issue/bug system? Devs say here is a new or 
changed function or dialog box which needs Help written/revised? 

I'd like to add something, even if (at this point) brief and general, to the 
Documentation Contributors Guide. I know little or nothing about it, but I do 
recall discussion at several times over the past year. And i know that, because 
the Help is shipped as part of the product, it's handled differently from the 
user guides and other docs we deal with here.

--Jean
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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] LibO Documentation

2011-11-10 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
Translating is not a trivial word-for-word replacement.  Some of the ideas and 
concepts might not make much sense and so there might be better ways of saying 
things so that they do make sense more easily.  Some words have implications 
and nuances in some languages that they don't have in others.  That is why 
Machine Translators (such as Google Translate) make such humorous gaffes 
sometimes.
Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 7/11/11, Nguyen Vu Hung (kiei) vuh...@ki-ei.com wrote:

From: Nguyen Vu Hung (kiei) vuh...@ki-ei.com
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-documentation] LibO Documentation
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Monday, 7 November, 2011, 18:47

Ngày 11/11/08 1:14, David Nelson vie^'t:
 In case you decide you want to use Afresco as platfor for developing
 Vietnamese documenation,
Yes, of course I do :)

 I can create a Vietnamese work space and
 group.
Please create one and point the them.

 Please just let me know if you want that.

 Right now, I've added you to the English group.

By the way, now I know what i18n teams are not parts of Documentation team.

You (Documentation team) creates docs, we (i18n teams) translate.

After receiving Alfresco credentials, I will go back to where I should 
be - i18n :)

Cheers,

Nguyen Vu Hung

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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Vote: Elect Jean Weber as Documentation team lead

2011-11-10 Thread Dan Lewis
On Thu, 2011-11-10 at 21:10 +1000, Jean Weber wrote:
 Thank you to everyone for your support of David's proposal for me to
 be team leader. I am honoured.
 
 However, after much thought, I am declining the invitation. I will
 continue to do some things, but only intermittently, and I do not want
 to accept responsibility for the things I think need to be done. What
 I want to do requires enough others contributing reliably and
 productively to get at least some jobs done. And we don't have enough
 productive people. I've been recruiting for and promoting OOo/LO docs
 for many years, and the results have not been encouraging. I don't
 know what the secret is for successful volunteer recruitment and
 retention, but obviously I haven't stumbled on it. I'm tired of
 trying.
 
 Some time ago I did a fairly thorough brain dump into the chapters
 of the Contributors Guide. Even though they need updating and (in some
 cases) expansion, they should be a good starting place for the group's
 members, both new and veteran. I sincerely hope some people will
 emerge to take over doing the necessary work, and doing it well.
 
 --Jean
 

 The explanation is in the parable of the sower (Matthew 13:3-9).
Pardon me for being religious, but this parable does point out human
frailties. It divides people into four groups: those who don't
understand a situation at all; those who like the idea until something
happens that they don't like; those who begin work on something but let
other things get in their way to prevent completion; and those who
actually accomplish something some more than others and some less. Such
is the case with volunteers.
People want someone to lead (read that do things for them) but
seldom step up to doing things themselves as much as they should. Here
is another religious reference. When Israel first neared their
destination, they refused to go any further because of what 10 men had
said. Talking about not following someone, the entire army (603550 men)
with the exception of 2 men prepared to return to Egypt.
I'm still amazed that a wiki page has been created in which we were
suppose to discuss job descriptions for the team and only two have
entered anything there. I posted my thoughts, and another person added
my name at the beginning of my post. That has been it. Again, I have
seen several +1 with no -1 in posts. But where are their thoughts on
this wiki page? Who has said that they will take responsibility for a
specific area of documentation?
 We are a group of individuals with talents. What is it that each
one can do well? What are our areas of expertise? Who can we rely upon
for help when we need it? One wiki page has a list of names, but nothing
about these people as far what they can provide the the team. What is
our commitment to the team?
 The main goal for what the team should be accomplishing has already
been stated. But how well has the main goal been broken down into
smaller goals that apply to the documents for each of the components of
LO?
 Another wiki page diagrams the path a new document should take
before it is published. So, who is going to take on the responsibility
of revise a chapter or creating a new one? Who is going to review the
chapters for clarity or correctness? Who is going to proofread them for
grammar etc.? Who will make the final decision as to whether it should
be published or not?
 I have a few more thoughts as well that I will post at a later time
concerning what we should tell someone who wants do some technical
writing. So of it are some things that I think I remember Jean writing a
few years ago (around the time of or perhaps before the appearance of
OOo 2.0).


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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] how to type %

2011-11-10 Thread Gary Schnabl

I refrained until now with my solution.

This method (Insert - Special character) should be the best. One could 
go a bit further by making a list of whatever missing keyboard 
characters are desired and then get their numerical Unicode equivalents 
(there are a number of Unicode sources), which can easily be checked in 
the Special characters dialog box for a particular font in order to 
ascertain if that character is available for that font.


Gary

On 11/10/2011 8:38 AM, Tom Davies wrote:

Hi :)
If you can't find it on the keyboard then try the menus

Insert - Special character

Then depending on which font is selected the % might be about 6th across the 
top?
Regards from
Tom :)


--- On Tue, 8/11/11, lsqlsq...@gmail.com  wrote:

From: lsqlsq...@gmail.com
Subject: [libreoffice-documentation] how to type %
To: documentation@global.libreoffice.org
Date: Tuesday, 8 November, 2011, 14:44

in mathe, i find all guide ,but i can't find how to type % in writer.





--

Gary Schnabl
Southwest Detroit, two miles NORTH! of Canada--Windsor, that is...

Technical Editor forum http://TechnicalEditor.LivernoisYard.com/phpBB3/


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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Contribute to the Docs Team's blog

2011-11-10 Thread Andrew Douglas Pitonyak

Please send the invitation. I do not have an account.

Also, my computer is squirrely at the moment. I updated to Fedora 16, 
and there is a bug in the video driver. It causes certain things (like 
editing wikis) to bring my computer to an almost total halt. Will add 
some content after they update the driver (which is already in test, so 
I will not bother to patch my system with a known work around).



On 11/10/2011 12:08 AM, Jean Weber wrote:

Andrew,
No, you're not on the list yet. Do you have a wordpress.com login? If
so, what is your username there? I don't need your password, just your
username so I can grant you access to the libodocs blog.

If you don't have a wp.com username, I can send you an invitation to
join wp.com and the blog.

--Jean

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 14:53, Andrew Douglas Pitonyak
and...@pitonyak.org  wrote:


On 11/09/2011 11:49 PM, Andrew Douglas Pitonyak wrote:

Drop me a message when I have access Or post here that it is so.


And perhaps I have access and am merely a dolt, because I don't see any way
to authenticate to the blog so that it could know if I had access or not.




--
Andrew Pitonyak
My Macro Document: http://www.pitonyak.org/AndrewMacro.odt
Info:  http://www.pitonyak.org/oo.php


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[libreoffice-documentation] Rewrite of Chapter 1 (Introducing Base) of the Base Guide

2011-11-10 Thread Dan Lewis
 I have rewritten much of Chapter 1 and uploaded it to the draft
folder of the Base Guide. (I did the upload right for a change.) 
 It was written for OOo, so someone needs to search for OOo or
OpenOffice.org so that these can be changed to LibreOffice. I have
changed the template to LO_3_4_chapter_template.ott and replaced the
Title page graphic with the graphic from this template.
 If someone could also go through the chapter looking for other
corrections, I would appreciate it.

--Dan 
 


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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Corrections to the Getting Started with Base chapter

2011-11-10 Thread Jean Weber
On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 11:20, Jean Weber jeanwe...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 09:06, Dan Lewis elderdanle...@gmail.com wrote:

 OK, 100 tries later, the file finally uploaded to the draft folder.


 Dan, thanks for persevering. I've got the file now. --Jean


Dan, I made some further corrections in the file you provided; I found
some more missing quotation marks and added them. (Same as for the OOo
docs.)

I have now replaced the ODTs on Alfresco (in Published v3.3 and in
Drafts for v3.4) and replaced the ODT and PDF on the wiki.

--Jean

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