[Elecraft] K-Pod: feature request

2016-10-25 Thread Keith Onishi 
I tried the new K-Pod commands with the latest beta firmwares, both K3 and 
K-Pod. I guessed that controlling K-Pod LEDs meant controlling rocker-switch 
function as well, but it did not. So I would like to make a feature request;

A new K-Pod macro controlling rocker-switch function so that the macro switch 
the main know function.

With this, a series of macro commands to switch K3 to split operation can 
switch main knob to control VFO B without pressing the rocker-switch.

73 de JH3SIF, Keith

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Re: [Elecraft] Logging with K3/0 remotely

2016-10-25 Thread Mitch Wolfson , DJØQN / K7DX 

I have the following checklist available for K3 CAT:

CAT Checklist for K3 Twin
--
Note first that in a "Twin" configuration, COM2 is used to "tie" the two 
ends together and carries the CAT data. In order to access CAT, you need 
to get to COM2 without touching it. The easiest method is to duplicate 
COM2 over COM1 using a function in the RRC as follows:


- Change both RRC's COM1 to mode-7. Note that the baud rate does not 
have to be identical with COM2 to fit a lower bandwidth or software 
requirement.


- If using a "real" serial cable:
 - connect between the control RRC's COM1 and the PC, but note that 
the pinout is not the standard straight-through serial port. Use the 
pinout description in the RemoteRig manual, or just try a null-modem 
cable which usually works (may need a gender changer).
 - The  serial setting for COM1 "Use USB Com Port as COM1" must be 
set to NO


- If using USB:
 - make sure that first Microbit Setup Manager is installed first 
on the control PC to get the drivers.
 - Then change the serial settings for COM1 to change "Use USB Com 
Port as COM1" to YES
 - connect the USB cable between the RRC and computer and wait for 
the drivers to finish installing
 - go to the Windows Device Manager and look at which virtual 
serial port was assigned to COM1 and use that for your software, taking 
the correct baud rate into account.


Note also that you can pull CAT data in parallel off of the radio RRC to 
use a PC on that end, or to sync with a remote device (amplifier, 
SteppIR, etc.)


73,
Mitch

Mitch Wolfson DJØQN / K7DX
10285 Boca Cir, Naples, FL 34109
Skype: mitchwo
USA: Home:+1-239-221-9600 - Mobile:+1-424-288-9171
Germany: Home:+49 89 32152700 - Mobile:+49 172 8374436

On 25.10.2016 19:01, Fred Jensen wrote:

I'll repeat back what I think I understand about your current setup:

You have a serial-USB adapter plugged into the female DE-9 labeled 
"COM1" on the front of the RRC-1258, the other [USB-A] end is plugged 
into a USB slot on your computer, and device mangler tells you it is 
"COM3".


If that's exactly what you meant, I have never been able to make that 
work with N1MM+.  I don't have DX4WIN or WriteLog.  What does work 
fine for me:


1.  Remove the DE-9 COM1 connection from both the RRC and computer 
USB-A port.


2.  Plug a standard USB-A cable end into the computer and the other 
end [USB-B] into the USB-B jack under the RRC power LED.


3.  Go into device mgr and you will see four new ports:
RRC1258 COM0(COMw)
RRC1258 COM1(COMx)
RRC1258 COM2(COMy)
RRC1258 COMExtra(COMz)

5.  Note the "x" for RRC1258 COM1.  Use that COM port# in your logger 
for the CAT control.


5.  It is possible that Windoze may have assigned a COMx that is 
already in use.  Do not try to change the RRC1258 assignment!  Go into 
the other [duplicate] port and change it to something unused.  
Whatever is using that port will likely have to be adjusted as well.


#5 above is brought to you by Windoze 7, 8, and 10.  You can thank 
Microsoft for that feature.


73,

Fred K6DGW
- Sparks NV DM09dn

- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the Cal QSO Party 7-8 Oct 2017
- www.cqp.org

On 10/25/2016 3:29 PM, Mike Murray wrote:

Got the RemoteRig setup working great except for one small wrinkle -
logging.  I have a serial to USB cable connected from COM1 on the 
1258 and

settings at both control and remote set to Mode 7 - CAT to COM2.  The
computer recognizes the connection as COM3, but when I try to direct a
logging program (tried DX4WIN and WriteLog so far) to COM3 it doesn't 
find

the radio.

The RemoteRig manual indicates that this setup will work with K3 
twins, but

I'm not sure that is the case with a K3/0.  Anyone have this working or
ideas on how to proceed?

73,
Mike - W0AG


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[Elecraft] RESOLVED: KAT Won't Tune, KPA presents HIGH SWR

2016-10-25 Thread Byron Peebles 
Many thanks to Mike Flowers, K6MKF, NCDXC ("It's about DX!"), who calmed 
me down to do the step by step troubleshooting for this issue.  And 
thanks to several others who offered even the smallest suggestion.


To describe the circumstances: K3S->KPA->KAT->ANT

When opening the station Monday evening, the KPA was producing no 
output.  I had attempted to work an easy QSO for me, but called for 
several minutes before I noticed the power was at zero. Nothing out of 
the KPA.


As I went through my usual "what happened now", which means "what 
happened last year that looked like this" I tried the K3S TUNE to see if 
I was in a band segment that hadn't been recently updated. But, the K3S 
showed it was outputting 25 WATTS with an SWR of 11-15:1 - unlikely.  
And the KAT was making no attempt to tune. And the KPA still had zero 
output.


Long story, in hours, short after determining the K3S was fine, then the 
K3S->KAT were fine and then the KPA was not, I retested the reconnected 
KPA after resetting the CONFIG using EDIT+ON at power-up and things are 
back to operation.


Thank you Mike, thank you everyone else, and thank you Elecraft for the 
EDIT+ON option.


See you in CQWW!  73, Byron


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[Elecraft] K3 for sale

2016-10-25 Thread Frederick Atchley 
S/n 2241, factory calibrated and aligned. Certified by Elecraft, as of 17
October 2016 that it meets or exceeds all factory specifications. Updated to
include gold pins. Options: KPA3 100W amp and KAT3 internal 100W tuner. Has
the standard 2.7 KHz. Filter.

If you are looking for a superb starter rig, capable of accepting all of
Elecraft' s stable of options, this is it!

$2000. Fred Atchley, AE6IC

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Re: [Elecraft] KAT or KPA Issue, Likely KPA

2016-10-25 Thread Nr4c 
KPA500??  Darn phone can't spell worth a $&@n. 

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill


> On Oct 25, 2016, at 7:01 PM, Nr4c  wrote:
> 
> Is the LOA500 connected to the correct antenna port!?  Very important. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> ...nr4c. bill
> 
> 
>> On Oct 25, 2016, at 6:22 PM, Byron Peebles  wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks to all who have sent suggestions on how I might resolve my "KAT Not 
>> Tuning" issue.
>> 
>> Here's what I think I know so far:
>> 
>> 1. The KAT seems fine.
>> 2. The P3 Output Monitor thinks it sees 0.6W on the antenna line after the 
>> KAT.
>> 3. This implies to me that the K3S thinks it is tuning with 25W, but it 
>> isn't.
>> 4. This implies that the KAT isn't tuning due to low drive (and maybe it's 
>> already tuned).
>> 
>> 5. Last night when I ran one of the Utilities, probably the KPA one, I 
>> though I saw an Fxx code streaming into the text box on the MACRO tab of the 
>> utility.  I thought it might be F00F00F00, but I'm not sure.  That could be 
>> some communications error between the KPA and the K3S, but it isn't 
>> happening now.
>> 
>> 6. The HIGH SWR display at the K3S is 11:1 plus/minus in TUNE (25W) when the 
>> KPA is STANDBY and 9:1 plus/minus when in OPERATE and 15:1 when the KPA is 
>> OFF.  In all three situations the K3S thinks it is outputting 25 watts, but 
>> it doesn't seem to be.
>> 
>> 7. If I key the radio in KPA OPERATE it looks like the KPA is outputting 30 
>> or 40 watts if you trust the display.  Varying the K3S output doesn't have a 
>> corresponding change in KPA display, it just moves from 30 to 40 to 30 out. 
>> That happened once but I cannot repeat that test result.
>> 
>> 8. I have powered-off the KPA with the rear switch and discconected "the 
>> mains".  This should have reset any hard faults.
>> 
>> 9. The FAULT LOG shows the last error as "60V Supply Over limit" if the 
>> latest is at the top, or "Excessive Reflect4ed Power (High SWR)" if the 
>> latest is at the bottom.  There is no timestamp so I cannot be sure when 
>> these occurred, but an occasional HIGH SWR happens as I tune and fiddle with 
>> antennas.  (Sometimes I forget to retune a segment.)
>> 
>> Should I suspect control cable issues or something internal to the KPA?
>> 
>> Thanks, and 73, Byron
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] KAT or KPA Issue, Likely KPA

2016-10-25 Thread Nr4c 
Is the LOA500 connected to the correct antenna port!?  Very important. 

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill


> On Oct 25, 2016, at 6:22 PM, Byron Peebles  wrote:
> 
> Thanks to all who have sent suggestions on how I might resolve my "KAT Not 
> Tuning" issue.
> 
> Here's what I think I know so far:
> 
> 1. The KAT seems fine.
> 2. The P3 Output Monitor thinks it sees 0.6W on the antenna line after the 
> KAT.
> 3. This implies to me that the K3S thinks it is tuning with 25W, but it isn't.
> 4. This implies that the KAT isn't tuning due to low drive (and maybe it's 
> already tuned).
> 
> 5. Last night when I ran one of the Utilities, probably the KPA one, I though 
> I saw an Fxx code streaming into the text box on the MACRO tab of the 
> utility.  I thought it might be F00F00F00, but I'm not sure.  That could be 
> some communications error between the KPA and the K3S, but it isn't happening 
> now.
> 
> 6. The HIGH SWR display at the K3S is 11:1 plus/minus in TUNE (25W) when the 
> KPA is STANDBY and 9:1 plus/minus when in OPERATE and 15:1 when the KPA is 
> OFF.  In all three situations the K3S thinks it is outputting 25 watts, but 
> it doesn't seem to be.
> 
> 7. If I key the radio in KPA OPERATE it looks like the KPA is outputting 30 
> or 40 watts if you trust the display.  Varying the K3S output doesn't have a 
> corresponding change in KPA display, it just moves from 30 to 40 to 30 out. 
> That happened once but I cannot repeat that test result.
> 
> 8. I have powered-off the KPA with the rear switch and discconected "the 
> mains".  This should have reset any hard faults.
> 
> 9. The FAULT LOG shows the last error as "60V Supply Over limit" if the 
> latest is at the top, or "Excessive Reflect4ed Power (High SWR)" if the 
> latest is at the bottom.  There is no timestamp so I cannot be sure when 
> these occurred, but an occasional HIGH SWR happens as I tune and fiddle with 
> antennas.  (Sometimes I forget to retune a segment.)
> 
> Should I suspect control cable issues or something internal to the KPA?
> 
> Thanks, and 73, Byron
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] Logging with K3/0 remotely

2016-10-25 Thread Fred Jensen 

I'll repeat back what I think I understand about your current setup:

You have a serial-USB adapter plugged into the female DE-9 labeled 
"COM1" on the front of the RRC-1258, the other [USB-A] end is plugged 
into a USB slot on your computer, and device mangler tells you it is "COM3".


If that's exactly what you meant, I have never been able to make that 
work with N1MM+.  I don't have DX4WIN or WriteLog.  What does work fine 
for me:


1.  Remove the DE-9 COM1 connection from both the RRC and computer USB-A 
port.


2.  Plug a standard USB-A cable end into the computer and the other end 
[USB-B] into the USB-B jack under the RRC power LED.


3.  Go into device mgr and you will see four new ports:
RRC1258 COM0(COMw)
RRC1258 COM1(COMx)
RRC1258 COM2(COMy)
RRC1258 COMExtra(COMz)

5.  Note the "x" for RRC1258 COM1.  Use that COM port# in your logger 
for the CAT control.


5.  It is possible that Windoze may have assigned a COMx that is already 
in use.  Do not try to change the RRC1258 assignment!  Go into the other 
[duplicate] port and change it to something unused.  Whatever is using 
that port will likely have to be adjusted as well.


#5 above is brought to you by Windoze 7, 8, and 10.  You can thank 
Microsoft for that feature.


73,

Fred K6DGW
- Sparks NV DM09dn

- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the Cal QSO Party 7-8 Oct 2017
- www.cqp.org

On 10/25/2016 3:29 PM, Mike Murray wrote:

Got the RemoteRig setup working great except for one small wrinkle -
logging.  I have a serial to USB cable connected from COM1 on the 1258 and
settings at both control and remote set to Mode 7 - CAT to COM2.  The
computer recognizes the connection as COM3, but when I try to direct a
logging program (tried DX4WIN and WriteLog so far) to COM3 it doesn't find
the radio.

The RemoteRig manual indicates that this setup will work with K3 twins, but
I'm not sure that is the case with a K3/0.  Anyone have this working or
ideas on how to proceed?

73,
Mike - W0AG


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[Elecraft] Logging with K3/0 remotely

2016-10-25 Thread Mike Murray 
Got the RemoteRig setup working great except for one small wrinkle -
logging.  I have a serial to USB cable connected from COM1 on the 1258 and
settings at both control and remote set to Mode 7 - CAT to COM2.  The
computer recognizes the connection as COM3, but when I try to direct a
logging program (tried DX4WIN and WriteLog so far) to COM3 it doesn't find
the radio.

The RemoteRig manual indicates that this setup will work with K3 twins, but
I'm not sure that is the case with a K3/0.  Anyone have this working or
ideas on how to proceed?

73,
Mike - W0AG
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[Elecraft] KAT or KPA Issue, Likely KPA

2016-10-25 Thread Byron Peebles 
Thanks to all who have sent suggestions on how I might resolve my "KAT 
Not Tuning" issue.


Here's what I think I know so far:

1. The KAT seems fine.
2. The P3 Output Monitor thinks it sees 0.6W on the antenna line after 
the KAT.
3. This implies to me that the K3S thinks it is tuning with 25W, but it 
isn't.
4. This implies that the KAT isn't tuning due to low drive (and maybe 
it's already tuned).


5. Last night when I ran one of the Utilities, probably the KPA one, I 
though I saw an Fxx code streaming into the text box on the MACRO tab of 
the utility.  I thought it might be F00F00F00, but I'm not sure.  That 
could be some communications error between the KPA and the K3S, but it 
isn't happening now.


6. The HIGH SWR display at the K3S is 11:1 plus/minus in TUNE (25W) when 
the KPA is STANDBY and 9:1 plus/minus when in OPERATE and 15:1 when the 
KPA is OFF.  In all three situations the K3S thinks it is outputting 25 
watts, but it doesn't seem to be.


7. If I key the radio in KPA OPERATE it looks like the KPA is outputting 
30 or 40 watts if you trust the display.  Varying the K3S output doesn't 
have a corresponding change in KPA display, it just moves from 30 to 40 
to 30 out. That happened once but I cannot repeat that test result.


8. I have powered-off the KPA with the rear switch and discconected "the 
mains".  This should have reset any hard faults.


9. The FAULT LOG shows the last error as "60V Supply Over limit" if the 
latest is at the top, or "Excessive Reflect4ed Power (High SWR)" if the 
latest is at the bottom.  There is no timestamp so I cannot be sure when 
these occurred, but an occasional HIGH SWR happens as I tune and fiddle 
with antennas.  (Sometimes I forget to retune a segment.)


Should I suspect control cable issues or something internal to the KPA?

Thanks, and 73, Byron

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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Walter Underwood 
Oops, that is Willson Peak (yes, double-L) and it is 2-3 miles to the nearest 
house.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Oct 25, 2016, at 2:43 PM, Walter Underwood  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Oct 25, 2016, at 2:31 PM, Edward R Cole  wrote:
>> 
>> I wonder where in the world one sees a 20m noise floor that low when antenna 
>> is connected?  Only when I lived off the grid running on battery power did I 
>> see S0 noise on my radio (3.9-KHz with TS180S from a dipole). 
> 
> Good point. Looking at the photo of my KX3 on top of Mount Willson in Henry 
> Coe, I see two bars on the S-meter on 20 meters. That is miles from Silicon 
> Valley. It was quiet and lovely, I could hear everybody. The filters were 
> wide open, preamp on, and NR off. Zoom in and you can see for yourself.
> 
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/walter_underwood/17417496311/in/album-72157652448882921/
>  
> 
> 
> wunder
> K6WRU
> Walter Underwood
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Walter Underwood 

> On Oct 25, 2016, at 2:31 PM, Edward R Cole  wrote:
> 
> I wonder where in the world one sees a 20m noise floor that low when antenna 
> is connected?  Only when I lived off the grid running on battery power did I 
> see S0 noise on my radio (3.9-KHz with TS180S from a dipole). 

Good point. Looking at the photo of my KX3 on top of Mount Willson in Henry 
Coe, I see two bars on the S-meter on 20 meters. That is miles from Silicon 
Valley. It was quiet and lovely, I could hear everybody. The filters were wide 
open, preamp on, and NR off. Zoom in and you can see for yourself.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/walter_underwood/17417496311/in/album-72157652448882921/
 


wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Edward R Cole 
Most of this very interesting post is not-relevant to my ham radio 
operating (eme on VHF+).

Comments preceded by asterisk *  inserted below:

-
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 05:21:20 + (UTC)
From: Al Lorona 
To: Elecraft Reflector 
Subject: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers  (long)

Receivers are always ranked by the "2 kHz third order dynamic range", 
such as at: 
http://www.remeeus.eu/hamradio/pa1hr/productreview.pdf  but do we 
really grasp the meaning of these specs? For instance, the Elecraft 
K3's (after synthesizer upgrade) number is 103 dB, good enough to be 
in the top ten. In fact, this number is so strong that very few hams 
will ever be affected by it. To the best of my knowledge, I have 
*never* been close to running out of dynamic range. To understand 
why, let's put "103 dB" into English.

===snip
I have assumed a noise floor or MDS of -130 dBm because it's a nice 
round number. If your 20 meter noise floor is higher than this, then 
the two signals would have to be *even stronger* to hear the intermod 
come out of the noise.


*I wonder where in the world one sees a 20m noise floor that low when 
antenna is connected?  Only when I lived off the grid running on 
battery power did I see S0 noise on my radio (3.9-KHz with TS180S 
from a dipole).  I doubt that radio had a noise floor that low, but 
maybe.  I see S3/5 noise on my K3 connected to triband yagi, preamp 
off.  That is probably about -110 to -100 dBm noise floor.  My SDR-IQ 
is very good at 28-MHz and displays -132 dBm without an antenna 
connected (190-KHz bandwidth).  But connecting an antenna raises that 
instantly.

===snip
Perhaps it's time to rank receivers by a different measurement, 
something that affects more of us. Looking through the table at the 
link above we see another measurement called "2 kHz blocking gain 
compression" and for the same K3 it is 143 dB. This is a measurement 
not of two interfering signals, but a single interferer just 2 kHz away.


*I can only think of two instances seeing such a strong adjacent signal:
1)  At 310-KHz a GPS-reference station is locate less than a mile 
away and I measure it at -30 dBm on my inverted-L (tuned to 490-KHz) 
with SDR-IQ.
2)  I once measured a high power pager running 158.100 100-foot away 
from my company's 161.325 repeater showing 1/4w on the Bird power 
meter installed on the repeater antenna whenever the pager 
transmitted (repeater was turned off).  That would be +23 
dBm.  Amazingly the repeater Rx survived this (due to duplexer and 
helicoil prefilter).  IMD mixing of the 158.1+161.325 produced a 
horrendous signal on 156.450 (which interfered marine ch.9).

Both examples extremely unlikely to occur for HF hams.
===snip
Finally, we notice a measurement called "2 kHz reciprocal mixing 
dynamic range" -- probably the limiting spec nowadays for top tier 
receivers. In our example of the single strong signal, way before 
reducing the gain of the receiver, that signal will have another 
effect: it will mix with the phase noise of the K3's own local 
oscillator and deposit that phase noise right onto your desired 
frequency of 14.050 MHz.


*this has application for me.  The occurrence of a high power signal 
off frequency mixing with the phase noise of my eme Rx.  This is one 
of the reasons driving a goal for extremely low LO phase noise in eme 
systems.  This is one of the major selling points for me to purchase 
my K3 and upgrade synthesizers.


===snipped the rest (though very interesting proposal)

73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
"Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
dubus...@gmail.com

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Re: [Elecraft] P3 utility and no sub receiver

2016-10-25 Thread Don Wilhelm 

Ron,

You have to use the P3 Utility to access the P3 - you cannot use the K3 
Utility and the P3 Utility at the same time, they both have to use the 
same COM Port.


For the NO SUB response, I suspect that you have not yet turned the KRX3 
menu entry to Installed.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/25/2016 2:35 PM, Ron Wilcox wrote:

First time poster. I just finished putting together my K3S, subreceiver,
100 watt amplifier  and panadapter. Having a medical background this was
quite a unique experience. I have a couple of questions and could not find
the answer in the archives so hope this is not a frequently asked question.
I have read the sections in the books multiple times but it is still not
clear to me. My computer setup is via USB.

1- I was able to update the K3S and access the utility  with no problems. I
cannot update the P3 or access the P3 utility  when the K3S is on, and am
running the P3 from the K3S. Is the P3 automatically updated when I do the
K3S? Do I need the P3 utility when the K3S utility is linked to my K3S?

2- When I push the "sub" button I get "no sub", what is my next step, or
what did I miss?


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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Bill Frantz 

I assume that Don means a 30Hz wide peak below.

While I have found APF to be good for digging out weak CW 
signals near the noise level, I have found a 50-100Hz bandwidth 
works better when there are nearby strong signals. (I have the 
250Hz crystal filter.) The K3 won't let me narrow the DSP filter 
that much with APF on, probably for good reason. Am I missing a 
way to use APF in these tight spaced conditions?


73 Bill AE6JV

On 10/25/16 at 8:31 AM, donw...@embarqmail.com (Don Wilhelm) wrote:

Just how much improvement is gained for each receiver is open 
to some question, and depends on what tools are available and 
used.  Certainly the K3(S) APF function would be of help with 
its 30Hz peak, but if testing is to be conducted using very 
closely spaced multiple signals, then it would be necessary to 
specify which of the interference abatement tools were used on 
each receiver...


-
Bill Frantz| When it comes to the world | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506  | around us, is there any choice | 16345 
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | but to explore? - Lisa Randall | Los Gatos, 
CA 95032


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Re: [Elecraft] P3 utility and no sub receiver

2016-10-25 Thread Cady, Fred 
Hi Ron,

You do need the P3 utility to update the P3 and the K3 Utility should not be 
running as they use the same serial port.

If you are seeing No Sub you probably don't have the Config menu KRX3 set to 
ATU or BNC.  Which of those you chose depends on how you have the sub receiver 
installed.  Choose ATU if the sub receiver antenna is connected to the ATU or 
BNC if it is connected to the AUX BNC connector.

73,

Fred KE7X


For all KE7X Elecraft books, see www.ke7x.com





From: Elecraft  on behalf of Ron Wilcox 

Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2016 12:35 PM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] P3 utility and no sub receiver

First time poster. I just finished putting together my K3S, subreceiver,
100 watt amplifier  and panadapter. Having a medical background this was
quite a unique experience. I have a couple of questions and could not find
the answer in the archives so hope this is not a frequently asked question.
I have read the sections in the books multiple times but it is still not
clear to me. My computer setup is via USB.

1- I was able to update the K3S and access the utility  with no problems. I
cannot update the P3 or access the P3 utility  when the K3S is on, and am
running the P3 from the K3S. Is the P3 automatically updated when I do the
K3S? Do I need the P3 utility when the K3S utility is linked to my K3S?

2- When I push the "sub" button I get "no sub", what is my next step, or
what did I miss?

Thanks in advance.


Ron Wilcox  KF7ZN
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[Elecraft] P3 utility and no sub receiver

2016-10-25 Thread Ron Wilcox 
First time poster. I just finished putting together my K3S, subreceiver,
100 watt amplifier  and panadapter. Having a medical background this was
quite a unique experience. I have a couple of questions and could not find
the answer in the archives so hope this is not a frequently asked question.
I have read the sections in the books multiple times but it is still not
clear to me. My computer setup is via USB.

1- I was able to update the K3S and access the utility  with no problems. I
cannot update the P3 or access the P3 utility  when the K3S is on, and am
running the P3 from the K3S. Is the P3 automatically updated when I do the
K3S? Do I need the P3 utility when the K3S utility is linked to my K3S?

2- When I push the "sub" button I get "no sub", what is my next step, or
what did I miss?

Thanks in advance.


Ron Wilcox  KF7ZN
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[Elecraft] FS - XV50 transverter

2016-10-25 Thread Steve Lund 
Elecraft XV50 transverter in excellent condition.

Set for 10w output to drive 100w amplifier. Built with N connector for
output, but will install SO-239, if desired.

$250 shipped via Priority Mail to US.

Steve, K6UM
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Don Wilhelm 

All,

While the suggestions of simulating contest conditions for testing may 
have merit, I believe the existing tests demonstrate that the low phase 
noise of the K3(S) allows you to 'saddle up' closer to an offending 
station in a contest or DX Pileup.  The 2kHz test results does indicate 
that to me.


Just how much improvement is gained for each receiver is open to some 
question, and depends on what tools are available and used.  Certainly 
the K3(S) APF function would be of help with its 30Hz peak, but if 
testing is to be conducted using very closely spaced multiple signals, 
then it would be necessary to specify which of the interference 
abatement tools were used on each receiver.  I doubt if Rob Sherwood 
would want to buy into that form of testing, there are simply too many 
variables in that all receivers do not have the same interference 
fighting tools.


A long time ago, I built a receiver based generally on the HBR-16 
design, except that it used a double-coupled 85kHz IF instead of the 
100kHz IF.  I added a Q-multiplier stage at 85kHz, and it was fantastic 
at pulling a signal out from the 'mud'.  I have no idea about the 
dynamic range or the 2kHz test for it, but it was quite capable.  The 
K3(S) APF provides similar capability to the Q-multiplier of old.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/25/2016 10:32 AM, Bill Frantz wrote:


I like Brian's idea of simulating contest conditions to test receivers.
Such a simulation would need to be reproducible and good enough that it
can't be gamed. For testing CW reception, perhaps a fixed set of signals
modulated through a very linear SSB modulator would work. That could
give at least 2KHz of signals for the receiver to handle.


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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread brian 

There is another frontier.  That is noise/RFI reduction.
The Pandora's box of RFI has been opened and can't be shut at this point.

We need to address the issue of noise reduction and noise blanketing in 
some quantitative way to compare various RX's.  Right now the 
"comparisons" are all innuendo, e.g. "my old xyz rig did a much better 
job at noise blanketing power line noise than my new widget."  The 
recent QST article on the K3S singing the praises (without giving any 
data) of its NR and NB capability is another example.


This would be tough since the world of RFI sources is huge.  It would 
take some real effort to quantify the world of noise sources and their 
signatures and then find some algorithms to deal with them.  Impossible? 
The world of big data isn't so big any more. Such an catalog might be 
doable.  Algorithms are another issue.  My hope is that NR/NB could be 
made adaptive to recognize the signature(s) and generate appropriate 
algorithms on the fly.


There are a lot of smart people out there who could perhaps address 
these issues.  Unfortunately commercial interests have to see some 
payoff.  They haven't as of yet.  The fact that AM broadcasters are 
being burned by RFI and becoming proactive is a plus.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 10/25/2016 14:32 PM, Bill Frantz wrote:

Before I bought my K3, I discussed the radio with someone in the booth
at Radiofest, a small hamfest held near Monterey, CA. After I had
learned a very little bit about the radio, I had my wife (KI6SLX), a
retired QA engineer for Apple, discuss UI issues. When she said it
seemed OK, I wrote a check.

I like Brian's idea of simulating contest conditions to test receivers.
Such a simulation would need to be reproducible and good enough that it
can't be gamed. For testing CW reception, perhaps a fixed set of signals
modulated through a very linear SSB modulator would work. That could
give at least 2KHz of signals for the receiver to handle.

The West Valley Amateur Radio Association field day operation sometimes
has 3 signals active on one band (CW, digital, and SSB). We manage to
get by running QRP with K3(S)s, KX3s, K2s and carefully placed antennas.
For CQP, we managed to run two stations on a band at 100 watts with
similar equipment and techniques.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 10/25/16 at 5:45 AM, als...@comcast.net (brian) wrote:


I want to know how well a receiver is able to separate a weak signal
from strong signals 50-100 Hz away. It would be interesting to
speculate how such a measurement would be done. Let the RX use
whatever analog or digital tricks it can to achieve the above.

Your idea of simulating a contest with a hundreds of signal injected
at various random frequencies to gauge RX performance has merit.

Have you overlooked the MM, FD and DXpedition RX uses which in fact
push the dynamic range and mixing limits today?  There are MM stations
which operate two transmitters on the same band.


---
Bill Frantz| Re: Computer reliability, performance, and security:
408-356-8506   | The guy who *is* wearing a parachute is *not* the
www.pwpconsult.com | first to reach the ground.  - Terence Kelly

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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Bill Frantz 
Before I bought my K3, I discussed the radio with someone in the 
booth at Radiofest, a small hamfest held near Monterey, CA. 
After I had learned a very little bit about the radio, I had my 
wife (KI6SLX), a retired QA engineer for Apple, discuss UI 
issues. When she said it seemed OK, I wrote a check.


I like Brian's idea of simulating contest conditions to test 
receivers. Such a simulation would need to be reproducible and 
good enough that it can't be gamed. For testing CW reception, 
perhaps a fixed set of signals modulated through a very linear 
SSB modulator would work. That could give at least 2KHz of 
signals for the receiver to handle.


The West Valley Amateur Radio Association field day operation 
sometimes has 3 signals active on one band (CW, digital, and 
SSB). We manage to get by running QRP with K3(S)s, KX3s, K2s and 
carefully placed antennas. For CQP, we managed to run two 
stations on a band at 100 watts with similar equipment and techniques.


73 Bill AE6JV

On 10/25/16 at 5:45 AM, als...@comcast.net (brian) wrote:

I want to know how well a receiver is able to separate a weak 
signal from strong signals 50-100 Hz away. It would be 
interesting to speculate how such a measurement would be done. 
Let the RX use whatever analog or digital tricks it can to 
achieve the above.


Your idea of simulating a contest with a hundreds of signal 
injected at various random frequencies to gauge RX performance 
has merit.


Have you overlooked the MM, FD and DXpedition RX uses which in 
fact push the dynamic range and mixing limits today?  There are 
MM stations which operate two transmitters on the same band.


---
Bill Frantz| Re: Computer reliability, performance, and security:
408-356-8506   | The guy who *is* wearing a parachute is 
*not* the

www.pwpconsult.com | first to reach the ground.  - Terence Kelly

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[Elecraft] FS-KPA500

2016-10-25 Thread Jack Satterfield 
Elecraft KPA500 Amplifier Serial 2015 in Excellent/Like New condition. 

Includes Kpa500-K3 cable and Y-Cable, manual and dust cover $1850 shipped.

Jack

W4GRJ

 

 

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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Morgan Bailey 
EXCELLENT excellent excellent post...Great summary. The listen ability and
ease of ergonomic operability are the reason I love radios with knobs. This
is what the maestro is trying to do for for the Flex 6XXX radios. There is
just not a better box for both on the market other than the K3, K3s, KX3,
KX2. Seemingly Elecraft has nailed it. Your post only confirms what I
believe all Elecraft owners already know and experience when we hit the
power on switch.

Again you summary is excellent and great reading. Well written and well
thought out and equally well presented.

Strong work.

Vy 73,

Morgan Bailey NJ8M

On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 12:21 AM, Al Lorona  wrote:

> Receivers are always ranked by the "2 kHz third order dynamic range", such
> as at: http://www.remeeus.eu/hamradio/pa1hr/productreview.pdf  but do we
> really grasp the meaning of these specs? For instance, the Elecraft K3's
> (after synthesizer upgrade) number is 103 dB, good enough to be in the top
> ten. In fact, this number is so strong that very few hams will ever be
> affected by it. To the best of my knowledge, I have *never* been close to
> running out of dynamic range. To understand why, let's put "103 dB" into
> English.
>
> Let's say you're on 20 meter CW, operating at 14.050 MHz. You're listening
> through your fine Elecraft 500 Hz crystal filter when suddenly, and by
> incredible coincidence, two equally strong 49 dB over S9 signals begin
> transmitting at the exact same time, one on 14.052 and the other at 14.054
> MHz, exactly 2 kHz and 4 kHz up from where you're listening. With the
> preamp off (which is totally believeable on 20 meters with a decent
> antenna) you will just barely hear a "ghost signal" right at the noise
> level... if you notice it at all. That "ghost" signal is the two-tone, 3rd
> order intermod product generated in the K3 receiver by those two hugely
> strong and perfectly placed signals.
>
> Not a very likely scenario, but that's what 103 dB of dynamic range buys
> you.
>
> I have assumed a noise floor or MDS of -130 dBm because it's a nice round
> number. If your 20 meter noise floor is higher than this, then the two
> signals would have to be *even stronger* to hear the intermod come out of
> the noise.
>
> Even if each of those interferers was *60* dB over S9 -- pegging the
> S-meter-- the intermod product on 14.050 would still be only S5. Amazing.
> This kind of performance begs the question, "How much more dynamic range is
> really needed?" and some (like Rob Sherwood) have said that once you're
> above 90 dB, you already have enough, at HF at least.
>
> Perhaps it's time to rank receivers by a different measurement, something
> that affects more of us. Looking through the table at the link above we see
> another measurement called "2 kHz blocking gain compression" and for the
> same K3 it is 143 dB. This is a measurement not of two interfering signals,
> but a single interferer just 2 kHz away. Since there's only one signal, it
> won't generate a "ghost", but it will reduce the gain of the receiver. ARRL
> defines this as the signal level that reduces the gain by 1 dB. One dB is
> really small, something like changing your RF Gain knob from the 3:00
> o'clock position to maybe the 2:45 o'clock position. Barely noticeable.
> Nonetheless, for our K3 the signal required to do this is about +13 dBm, or
> 20 milliwatts, which is probably near the damage level of the receiver!
> (I'm quite sure that Wayne has made intercontinental QSOs at 20 mW.) It's a
> theoretical value that very, very few hams would ever encounter... only the
> ones living next door to
>   a guy running a kilowatt. So this measurement is even less relevant to
> us.
>
> Finally, we notice a measurement called "2 kHz reciprocal mixing dynamic
> range" -- probably the limiting spec nowadays for top tier receivers. In
> our example of the single strong signal, way before reducing the gain of
> the receiver, that signal will have another effect: it will mix with the
> phase noise of the K3's own local oscillator and deposit that phase noise
> right onto your desired frequency of 14.050 MHz. As you're listening there,
> you suddenly notice that the noise floor seems to be rising for no apparent
> reason. You listen some more, and notice that the noise is following some
> kind of CW keying. You glance at your panadapter and notice an enormous
> signal just 2 kHz away on 14.052. So there are two culprits: that strong
> signal, and the K3 oscillator phase noise. The K3 with upgraded synths has
> a spec of "-115 dBc", again near the top of the list, which means that a
> signal 2 kHz away and 115 dB above the noise floor will cause the noise
> floor to rise by 3 dB. For a K3 n
>  oise floor of -130 dBm this is -15 dBm, or about 60 dB over S9. The
> reason I say this is the limiting factor is because the chance of just one
> 60 dB over S9 signal nearby is greater than *two* of them at the right
> spacing as in our discussion of 3rd order DR.
>
> For thes

Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread brian 

Al,

As a CW op, I consider the 2 KHz away figures interesting not really 
relevant.


I want to know how well a receiver is able to separate a weak signal 
from strong signals 50-100 Hz away. It would be interesting to speculate 
how such a measurement would be done. Let the RX use whatever analog or 
digital tricks it can to achieve the above.


Your idea of simulating a contest with a hundreds of signal injected at 
various random frequencies to gauge RX performance has merit.


Have you overlooked the MM, FD and DXpedition RX uses which in fact push 
the dynamic range and mixing limits today?  There are MM stations which 
operate two transmitters on the same band.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 10/25/2016 5:21 AM, Al Lorona wrote:

Receivers are always ranked by the "2 kHz third order dynamic range", such as at: 
http://www.remeeus.eu/hamradio/pa1hr/productreview.pdf  but do we really grasp the meaning of these 
specs? For instance, the Elecraft K3's (after synthesizer upgrade) number is 103 dB, good enough to 
be in the top ten. In fact, this number is so strong that very few hams will ever be affected by 
it. To the best of my knowledge, I have *never* been close to running out of dynamic range. To 
understand why, let's put "103 dB" into English.

Let's say you're on 20 meter CW, operating at 14.050 MHz. You're listening through your fine 
Elecraft 500 Hz crystal filter when suddenly, and by incredible coincidence, two equally strong 49 
dB over S9 signals begin transmitting at the exact same time, one on 14.052 and the other at 14.054 
MHz, exactly 2 kHz and 4 kHz up from where you're listening. With the preamp off (which is totally 
believeable on 20 meters with a decent antenna) you will just barely hear a "ghost 
signal" right at the noise level... if you notice it at all. That "ghost" signal is 
the two-tone, 3rd order intermod product generated in the K3 receiver by those two hugely strong 
and perfectly placed signals.

Not a very likely scenario, but that's what 103 dB of dynamic range buys you.

I have assumed a noise floor or MDS of -130 dBm because it's a nice round 
number. If your 20 meter noise floor is higher than this, then the two signals 
would have to be *even stronger* to hear the intermod come out of the noise.

Even if each of those interferers was *60* dB over S9 -- pegging the S-meter-- the 
intermod product on 14.050 would still be only S5. Amazing. This kind of performance begs 
the question, "How much more dynamic range is really needed?" and some (like 
Rob Sherwood) have said that once you're above 90 dB, you already have enough, at HF at 
least.

Perhaps it's time to rank receivers by a different measurement, something that affects more of us. Looking through the table at the link above we see another measurement called "2 kHz blocking gain compression" and for the same K3 it is 143 dB. This is a measurement not of two interfering signals, but a single interferer just 2 kHz away. Since there's only one signal, it won't generate a "ghost", but it will reduce the gain of the receiver. ARRL defines this as the signal level that reduces the gain by 1 dB. One dB is really small, something like changing your RF Gain knob from the 3:00 o'clock position to maybe the 2:45 o'clock position. Barely noticeable. Nonetheless, for our K3 the signal required to do this is about +13 dBm, or 20 milliwatts, which is probably near the damage level of the receiver! (I'm quite sure that Wayne has made intercontinental QSOs at 20 mW.) It's a theoretical value that very, very few hams would ever encounter... only the ones living next door 

to

   a guy running a kilowatt. So this measurement is even less relevant to us.

Finally, we notice a measurement called "2 kHz reciprocal mixing dynamic range" -- 
probably the limiting spec nowadays for top tier receivers. In our example of the single strong 
signal, way before reducing the gain of the receiver, that signal will have another effect: it will 
mix with the phase noise of the K3's own local oscillator and deposit that phase noise right onto 
your desired frequency of 14.050 MHz. As you're listening there, you suddenly notice that the noise 
floor seems to be rising for no apparent reason. You listen some more, and notice that the noise is 
following some kind of CW keying. You glance at your panadapter and notice an enormous signal just 
2 kHz away on 14.052. So there are two culprits: that strong signal, and the K3 oscillator phase 
noise. The K3 with upgraded synths has a spec of "-115 dBc", again near the top of the 
list, which means that a signal 2 kHz away and 115 dB above the noise floor will cause the noise 
floor to rise by 3 dB. For a K3

 n

  oise floor of -130 dBm this is -15 dBm, or about 60 dB over S9. The reason I 
say this is the limiting factor is because the chance of just one 60 dB over S9 
signal nearby is greater than *two* of them at the right spacing as in our 
discussion of 3rd order DR.

For these reasons, we could start

Re: [Elecraft] [K3] The Way We Rank Receivers (long)

2016-10-25 Thread Art Hejduk 
Nice explanation Al.  It's nice to know that the K3 ranks high on the
charts, but I agree that 'usability' and 'listenability' are underrated.
Before I purchased my K3, I went to AES in Wickliffe and listened to
several receivers.  I liked the sound of the Kenwoods, but I liked the
'modularity' of the Elecraft K3.  I was also influenced by my conversations
with Eric and Wayne at Dayton.

73,
Art  WB8ENE

On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 1:21 AM, Al Lorona  wrote:

> Receivers are always ranked by the "2 kHz third order dynamic range", such
> as at: http://www.remeeus.eu/hamradio/pa1hr/productreview.pdf  but do we
> really grasp the meaning of these specs? For instance, the Elecraft K3's
> (after synthesizer upgrade) number is 103 dB, good enough to be in the top
> ten. In fact, this number is so strong that very few hams will ever be
> affected by it. To the best of my knowledge, I have *never* been close to
> running out of dynamic range. To understand why, let's put "103 dB" into
> English.
>
> Let's say you're on 20 meter CW, operating at 14.050 MHz. You're listening
> through your fine Elecraft 500 Hz crystal filter when suddenly, and by
> incredible coincidence, two equally strong 49 dB over S9 signals begin
> transmitting at the exact same time, one on 14.052 and the other at 14.054
> MHz, exactly 2 kHz and 4 kHz up from where you're listening. With the
> preamp off (which is totally believeable on 20 meters with a decent
> antenna) you will just barely hear a "ghost signal" right at the noise
> level... if you notice it at all. That "ghost" signal is the two-tone, 3rd
> order intermod product generated in the K3 receiver by those two hugely
> strong and perfectly placed signals.
>
> Not a very likely scenario, but that's what 103 dB of dynamic range buys
> you.
>
> I have assumed a noise floor or MDS of -130 dBm because it's a nice round
> number. If your 20 meter noise floor is higher than this, then the two
> signals would have to be *even stronger* to hear the intermod come out of
> the noise.
>
> Even if each of those interferers was *60* dB over S9 -- pegging the
> S-meter-- the intermod product on 14.050 would still be only S5. Amazing.
> This kind of performance begs the question, "How much more dynamic range is
> really needed?" and some (like Rob Sherwood) have said that once you're
> above 90 dB, you already have enough, at HF at least.
>
> Perhaps it's time to rank receivers by a different measurement, something
> that affects more of us. Looking through the table at the link above we see
> another measurement called "2 kHz blocking gain compression" and for the
> same K3 it is 143 dB. This is a measurement not of two interfering signals,
> but a single interferer just 2 kHz away. Since there's only one signal, it
> won't generate a "ghost", but it will reduce the gain of the receiver. ARRL
> defines this as the signal level that reduces the gain by 1 dB. One dB is
> really small, something like changing your RF Gain knob from the 3:00
> o'clock position to maybe the 2:45 o'clock position. Barely noticeable.
> Nonetheless, for our K3 the signal required to do this is about +13 dBm, or
> 20 milliwatts, which is probably near the damage level of the receiver!
> (I'm quite sure that Wayne has made intercontinental QSOs at 20 mW.) It's a
> theoretical value that very, very few hams would ever encounter... only the
> ones living next door to
>   a guy running a kilowatt. So this measurement is even less relevant to
> us.
>
> Finally, we notice a measurement called "2 kHz reciprocal mixing dynamic
> range" -- probably the limiting spec nowadays for top tier receivers. In
> our example of the single strong signal, way before reducing the gain of
> the receiver, that signal will have another effect: it will mix with the
> phase noise of the K3's own local oscillator and deposit that phase noise
> right onto your desired frequency of 14.050 MHz. As you're listening there,
> you suddenly notice that the noise floor seems to be rising for no apparent
> reason. You listen some more, and notice that the noise is following some
> kind of CW keying. You glance at your panadapter and notice an enormous
> signal just 2 kHz away on 14.052. So there are two culprits: that strong
> signal, and the K3 oscillator phase noise. The K3 with upgraded synths has
> a spec of "-115 dBc", again near the top of the list, which means that a
> signal 2 kHz away and 115 dB above the noise floor will cause the noise
> floor to rise by 3 dB. For a K3 n
>  oise floor of -130 dBm this is -15 dBm, or about 60 dB over S9. The
> reason I say this is the limiting factor is because the chance of just one
> 60 dB over S9 signal nearby is greater than *two* of them at the right
> spacing as in our discussion of 3rd order DR.
>
> For these reasons, we could start ranking receivers by 2 kHz reciprocal
> mixing dynamic range because reciprocal mixing is far more likely to happen
> to a larger number of hams. It's not a catastrophic effect, but