Re: [Elecraft] Another CW question (was: CW Mistakes)
This is a great thread. Beats the hell out of 100 E-Mails over 3 days because someone is not happy with an Elecraft rig and gives it a 4.0 at E-Ham. Best, DW Holtman WB7SSN - Original Message - From: "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'elecraft Reflector'" Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2008 9:10 AM Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Another CW question (was: CW Mistakes) Brian wrote: I am finding this discussion on CW mistakes to be WAY off-topic for this list but WAY useful too. - With respect, I don't think it's "off-topic": The list moderator, Eric, as repeatedly said that anything to do with getting on the air and operating on the Ham bands is *on topic* for this list. Especially if it's something one might do with an Elecraft product, it has always been welcome. That has certainly been the case over the eight years I've followed the discussions here. Some topics take on a life of their own and start going "around in circles", and in those cases Eric will, eventually, call a halt to it. And he's quick to step on posts that seem impolite or which criticize others, which I greatly appreciate. I agree with you, Brian; such discussions can be "WAY useful too" which I why I read them, sometimes participate in them, and always appreciate that they are welcome here. Ron AC7AC ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] Another CW question (was: CW Mistakes)
Brian wrote: I am finding this discussion on CW mistakes to be WAY off-topic for this list but WAY useful too. - With respect, I don't think it's "off-topic": The list moderator, Eric, as repeatedly said that anything to do with getting on the air and operating on the Ham bands is *on topic* for this list. Especially if it's something one might do with an Elecraft product, it has always been welcome. That has certainly been the case over the eight years I've followed the discussions here. Some topics take on a life of their own and start going "around in circles", and in those cases Eric will, eventually, call a halt to it. And he's quick to step on posts that seem impolite or which criticize others, which I greatly appreciate. I agree with you, Brian; such discussions can be "WAY useful too" which I why I read them, sometimes participate in them, and always appreciate that they are welcome here. Ron AC7AC ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Another CW question (was: CW Mistakes)
Comments inline... On Saturday 26 April 2008 10:39:33 am Brian Lloyd wrote: > I do have the ARRL operating manual and I am using that to start to > guide the kids through proper procedures. On voice they have cue cards > with pieces of the QSO they can use; i.e. how to call CQ, how to > answer a call, how to give a signal report, how to "brag" the station, > how to clear, etc.; and that has helped them a lot. I bet that cue > cards for a CW QSO would be really helpful to noobs as well. Put the > most-used abbreviations and Q-sigs on there for reference. Yes, a good idea. I used that many times with new ops. Another thing that helps them get over the on-air jitters is having an experienced op sitting somewhere else in the room reading the mail. Then they can relax and ask the occasional, what did he say? question to the other op in the room, it lets them relax and enjoy the QSO. It isn't long and they won't need the crutch. > My question concerns the use of Farnsworth sending on-the-air, i.e. > sending the letters at a much faster speed than the overall rate and > then inserting greater spacing between letters and words. Is that an > OK-practice for working new CW ops or should I have the kids slow down > the keyer so that all intra-element, intra-word, and inter-word > spacing is proper? Yes. Character spacing needs to be right for proper sent CW. So set the keyer spacing and timing for the speed in question. Still, think about a hand key. I have used the Farnsworth method in teaching CW before, and it is faster as far as getting to the speed you used to need to get a ticket and get the CW testing done with. But if you really understand CW, the plateaus that all of us who learned the old fashioned way had to go through were just learning the language of CW at the different speeds. If you learned it right it was about the sound of the character, the rhythm of it, and not anything else. That changes as the speed changes. So anyone learning via Farnsworth spacing, can't necessarily slow down and operate anywhere in between with out going through the learning experience eventually. It's easier I think after you know CW faster. But you really don't know 20 wpm CW if you space it down to 8 wpm via Farnsworth. As for me, it's choppy and disconnected. I don't like to listen to it. I'll QSO an op like that, but I won't enjoy it as much as properly spaced CW. Even slow, properly spaced CW just flows along. > As soon as they can send/copy 5WPM I plan to push them to actually get > on-the-air to have some CW QSOs. I want to be sure I am giving them > good advice. Yes, that's the best. For me and those I've taught, I don't recommend using a keyer until the speed is over about 15 wpm, with real spacing. Part of the whole experience is knowing how to send by hand, and at slower speeds that just works best and is less nerve wracking with a hand key. There are a lot less mistakes in sending that way too. And it helps avoid sending too fast, faster than you can receive. Having to learn a keyer and making tons of sending mistakes is just something else a new CW op doesn't need to worry about. Get them on the air and start having nice slow QSOs with properly spaced CW and the speed will go up on it's own. You give me a CQ from a slow sender using a hand key, and he'll get an answer from me every time. No matter how long it takes to complete the QSO. Rick Kunath, k9ao ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Another CW question (was: CW Mistakes)
To be very honest, I have not used CW much. I used it a bit when I got my first tech ticket in 1976 but not much since then. Now I find myself teaching it to my students. I am finding this discussion on CW mistakes to be WAY off-topic for this list but WAY useful too. I do have the ARRL operating manual and I am using that to start to guide the kids through proper procedures. On voice they have cue cards with pieces of the QSO they can use; i.e. how to call CQ, how to answer a call, how to give a signal report, how to "brag" the station, how to clear, etc.; and that has helped them a lot. I bet that cue cards for a CW QSO would be really helpful to noobs as well. Put the most-used abbreviations and Q-sigs on there for reference. My question concerns the use of Farnsworth sending on-the-air, i.e. sending the letters at a much faster speed than the overall rate and then inserting greater spacing between letters and words. Is that an OK-practice for working new CW ops or should I have the kids slow down the keyer so that all intra-element, intra-word, and inter-word spacing is proper? As soon as they can send/copy 5WPM I plan to push them to actually get on-the-air to have some CW QSOs. I want to be sure I am giving them good advice. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com