Re: [Elecraft] FW: HEAVY KNOBS??
I tried both kinds of knobs for an extended period. I used the standard knob with very light drag from the felt pad so that I could spin it easily. It was easy to spin and stop precisely. The heavy knob spins for much longer, but at first I found it was harder to stop it where I wanted it. I have kept the heavy knob because I like the feel of it when turning more slowly. Both it and the standard knob are well-balanced so you can use them with very little drag. On 5/30/2012 9:24 AM, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote: > What I get out of a weighted knob is related to a car accelerator or > throttle body that sticks with first pressure on the accelerator -- you > always get a jerky start. The knob weight makes the "smooth" part possible > -- with enough inertia in the knob, it is possible to tune slowly with the > results of a "light touch" even though my fingers no longer reliably impart > a light touch. This is getting more obvious as I get older. > > 73, Guy. > > On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:54 AM, W4ATK wrote: > >> Phillip and others, >> >> The original K3 knob is adequate in my opinion. As a matter of fact >> I have an extra. I acquired a K2 where someone had put a K3 knob on it >> (Which I did replace with the newer K2 weighted knob from Elecraft). I am >> sitting here with the spare K3 knob in my hands and cannot for the life of >> me see any advantage to an even heavier knob. Proper adjustment against the >> felt washer works for me….But to each his own….. >> >> 73s Jim, W4ATK >> On May 30, 2012, at 8:44 AM, Phil LaMarche wrote: >> >>> I questioned the problems possible caused by heavy knobs. N8BX's >>> response >>> >>> Philip LaMarche >>> >>> >>> >>> K3 # 1605 >>> KPA500 # 029 >>> P3 #1480 >>> >>> W9DVM >>> >>> >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: Fred Freeman [mailto:n...@redbird.net] >>> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 8:41 PM >>> To: Phil LaMarche >>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? >>> >>> >>> Hi Phil, with regard to premature wear caused to the K3 encoders by >> weighted >>> knobs, I do not feel there is anything to be concerned about. Elecraft >> uses >>> the best encoders I have experienced in over 20 years in ham radio. They >>> are on par with encoders I have seen in industrial applications where >> they >>> receive much more use and abuse than anything likely to be seen in an >>> amateur radio application. I have had a weighted knob on my K3 for 3 >> years >>> and it gets used frequently. It is also my demo radio at shows and it >> gets >>> a lot of use there. To date, I can not tell it from a brand new radio. >> The >>> reason it stays nice is partly due to the quality of the encoder and >> partly >>> because of the nature in which bearing material works. Obviously a ball >>> bearing is preferred but it is an expensive luxury for hams. We a lucky >> to >>> have a USA manufacture (Elecraft) that chooses to use premium components. >>> Many Japanese made radios now use a quality made encoder with a full >> metal >>> shell and a bronze bushing for the bearing. Icom uses the same exact >>> encoders the Icom 746 thru the 7800 radios, and Yaesu does the same on >> the >>> FT-950 thru FTdx9000, etc. There were radios made in the 80's and 90's >> that >>> had plastic encoder housings and less robust bearing materials, yet these >>> encoders continue to hold up over time. Once in a while you will find an >>> old Icom 735, Kenwood 440, or a Yaesu 757GX with a worn, loose and sloppy >>> feeling encoder. Often these radios have equal wear on the face, buttons >>> and the rest of the enclosure. They literally got the heck ran out of >> them >>> for 20 years and all without any maintenance (lubrication, etc). There >> are >>> a great many radios on the used market from the 80's-90's that have nice >>> smooth and wear free encoders and the best feeling are often from radios >>> with heavier knobs (Icom 781, 765, 751A, Kenwood 930, 940, 950, Yaesu >>> FT-990, FT-1000D, FT-1000MP, etc). As an experienced tool maker, I will >> not >>> design a product that I feel will compromise the life of a customers >> radio. >>> >>> One measure that I do recommend is removing the weighted knob from your >>> radio if ever you ship it. Shipping companies today are known for >> dropping >>> boxes from great heights. When I bought my Icom 7700 and 7800 radios, >> they >>> both came with the Icom weighted knob not installed on the radio. You >> have >>> to put the knob on after you remove it from the box. So it is a >> worthwhile >>> consideration to remove the knob if shipping your radio via UPS, Fed-Ex >> or >>> US Mail. >>> >>> If you have any other questions or concerns, feel free to email me. >>> Thanks& 73, N8BX >>> Fred >>> >>> --Original Message-- From: Phil LaMarche To: n...@73cnc.com Subject: FW: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? Sent: May 27, 2012 2:58 PM Thoughts? Philip LaMarche 727-944-3226 727-510-
Re: [Elecraft] FW: HEAVY KNOBS??
What I get out of a weighted knob is related to a car accelerator or throttle body that sticks with first pressure on the accelerator -- you always get a jerky start. The knob weight makes the "smooth" part possible -- with enough inertia in the knob, it is possible to tune slowly with the results of a "light touch" even though my fingers no longer reliably impart a light touch. This is getting more obvious as I get older. 73, Guy. On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:54 AM, W4ATK wrote: > Phillip and others, > >The original K3 knob is adequate in my opinion. As a matter of fact > I have an extra. I acquired a K2 where someone had put a K3 knob on it > (Which I did replace with the newer K2 weighted knob from Elecraft). I am > sitting here with the spare K3 knob in my hands and cannot for the life of > me see any advantage to an even heavier knob. Proper adjustment against the > felt washer works for me….But to each his own….. > > 73s Jim, W4ATK > On May 30, 2012, at 8:44 AM, Phil LaMarche wrote: > > > I questioned the problems possible caused by heavy knobs. N8BX's > > response > > > > Philip LaMarche > > > > > > > > K3 # 1605 > > KPA500 # 029 > > P3 #1480 > > > > W9DVM > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: Fred Freeman [mailto:n...@redbird.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 8:41 PM > > To: Phil LaMarche > > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? > > > > > > Hi Phil, with regard to premature wear caused to the K3 encoders by > weighted > > knobs, I do not feel there is anything to be concerned about. Elecraft > uses > > the best encoders I have experienced in over 20 years in ham radio. They > > are on par with encoders I have seen in industrial applications where > they > > receive much more use and abuse than anything likely to be seen in an > > amateur radio application. I have had a weighted knob on my K3 for 3 > years > > and it gets used frequently. It is also my demo radio at shows and it > gets > > a lot of use there. To date, I can not tell it from a brand new radio. > The > > reason it stays nice is partly due to the quality of the encoder and > partly > > because of the nature in which bearing material works. Obviously a ball > > bearing is preferred but it is an expensive luxury for hams. We a lucky > to > > have a USA manufacture (Elecraft) that chooses to use premium components. > > Many Japanese made radios now use a quality made encoder with a full > metal > > shell and a bronze bushing for the bearing. Icom uses the same exact > > encoders the Icom 746 thru the 7800 radios, and Yaesu does the same on > the > > FT-950 thru FTdx9000, etc. There were radios made in the 80's and 90's > that > > had plastic encoder housings and less robust bearing materials, yet these > > encoders continue to hold up over time. Once in a while you will find an > > old Icom 735, Kenwood 440, or a Yaesu 757GX with a worn, loose and sloppy > > feeling encoder. Often these radios have equal wear on the face, buttons > > and the rest of the enclosure. They literally got the heck ran out of > them > > for 20 years and all without any maintenance (lubrication, etc). There > are > > a great many radios on the used market from the 80's-90's that have nice > > smooth and wear free encoders and the best feeling are often from radios > > with heavier knobs (Icom 781, 765, 751A, Kenwood 930, 940, 950, Yaesu > > FT-990, FT-1000D, FT-1000MP, etc). As an experienced tool maker, I will > not > > design a product that I feel will compromise the life of a customers > radio. > > > > One measure that I do recommend is removing the weighted knob from your > > radio if ever you ship it. Shipping companies today are known for > dropping > > boxes from great heights. When I bought my Icom 7700 and 7800 radios, > they > > both came with the Icom weighted knob not installed on the radio. You > have > > to put the knob on after you remove it from the box. So it is a > worthwhile > > consideration to remove the knob if shipping your radio via UPS, Fed-Ex > or > > US Mail. > > > > If you have any other questions or concerns, feel free to email me. > > Thanks & 73, N8BX > > Fred > > > > > >> > >> --Original Message-- > >> From: Phil LaMarche > >> To: n...@73cnc.com > >> Subject: FW: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? > >> Sent: May 27, 2012 2:58 PM > >> > >> Thoughts? > >> > >> Philip LaMarche > >> > >> > >> 727-944-3226 > >> 727-510-5038 Cell > >> www.w9dvm.com > >> WWW.FLAMGROUP.COM > >> > >> K3 # 1605 > >> KPA500 # 029 > >> P3 #1480 > >> > >> CCA 98-00827 > >> CRA 1701 > >> W9DVM > >> > >> > >> > >> -Original Message- > >> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net > >> [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ron D'Eau > >> Claire > >> Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 2:56 PM > >> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > >> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? > >> > >> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder > >> bushings and shafts that must support those knobs?
Re: [Elecraft] FW: HEAVY KNOBS??
Phillip and others, The original K3 knob is adequate in my opinion. As a matter of fact I have an extra. I acquired a K2 where someone had put a K3 knob on it (Which I did replace with the newer K2 weighted knob from Elecraft). I am sitting here with the spare K3 knob in my hands and cannot for the life of me see any advantage to an even heavier knob. Proper adjustment against the felt washer works for me….But to each his own….. 73s Jim, W4ATK On May 30, 2012, at 8:44 AM, Phil LaMarche wrote: > I questioned the problems possible caused by heavy knobs. N8BX's > response > > Philip LaMarche > > > > K3 # 1605 > KPA500 # 029 > P3 #1480 > > W9DVM > > > > -Original Message- > From: Fred Freeman [mailto:n...@redbird.net] > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 8:41 PM > To: Phil LaMarche > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? > > > Hi Phil, with regard to premature wear caused to the K3 encoders by weighted > knobs, I do not feel there is anything to be concerned about. Elecraft uses > the best encoders I have experienced in over 20 years in ham radio. They > are on par with encoders I have seen in industrial applications where they > receive much more use and abuse than anything likely to be seen in an > amateur radio application. I have had a weighted knob on my K3 for 3 years > and it gets used frequently. It is also my demo radio at shows and it gets > a lot of use there. To date, I can not tell it from a brand new radio. The > reason it stays nice is partly due to the quality of the encoder and partly > because of the nature in which bearing material works. Obviously a ball > bearing is preferred but it is an expensive luxury for hams. We a lucky to > have a USA manufacture (Elecraft) that chooses to use premium components. > Many Japanese made radios now use a quality made encoder with a full metal > shell and a bronze bushing for the bearing. Icom uses the same exact > encoders the Icom 746 thru the 7800 radios, and Yaesu does the same on the > FT-950 thru FTdx9000, etc. There were radios made in the 80's and 90's that > had plastic encoder housings and less robust bearing materials, yet these > encoders continue to hold up over time. Once in a while you will find an > old Icom 735, Kenwood 440, or a Yaesu 757GX with a worn, loose and sloppy > feeling encoder. Often these radios have equal wear on the face, buttons > and the rest of the enclosure. They literally got the heck ran out of them > for 20 years and all without any maintenance (lubrication, etc). There are > a great many radios on the used market from the 80's-90's that have nice > smooth and wear free encoders and the best feeling are often from radios > with heavier knobs (Icom 781, 765, 751A, Kenwood 930, 940, 950, Yaesu > FT-990, FT-1000D, FT-1000MP, etc). As an experienced tool maker, I will not > design a product that I feel will compromise the life of a customers radio. > > One measure that I do recommend is removing the weighted knob from your > radio if ever you ship it. Shipping companies today are known for dropping > boxes from great heights. When I bought my Icom 7700 and 7800 radios, they > both came with the Icom weighted knob not installed on the radio. You have > to put the knob on after you remove it from the box. So it is a worthwhile > consideration to remove the knob if shipping your radio via UPS, Fed-Ex or > US Mail. > > If you have any other questions or concerns, feel free to email me. > Thanks & 73, N8BX > Fred > > >> >> --Original Message-- >> From: Phil LaMarche >> To: n...@73cnc.com >> Subject: FW: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? >> Sent: May 27, 2012 2:58 PM >> >> Thoughts? >> >> Philip LaMarche >> >> >> 727-944-3226 >> 727-510-5038 Cell >> www.w9dvm.com >> WWW.FLAMGROUP.COM >> >> K3 # 1605 >> KPA500 # 029 >> P3 #1480 >> >> CCA 98-00827 >> CRA 1701 >> W9DVM >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net >> [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ron D'Eau >> Claire >> Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 2:56 PM >> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? >> >> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder >> bushings and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a >> simple bushing >> - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the lower >> side of the bushing. >> >> Ron AC7AC >> >> __ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email >> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> >> >> >> Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry® > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/li
Re: [Elecraft] FW: HEAVY KNOBS??
As Eric reported, my assumption was wrong; the Elecraft encoders have ball bearings in spite of their small size. IMX quality ball bearings make a big difference in their ability to handle weight without excessive wear in designs with significant side-loading (such as a heavy knob rotating a nominally horizontal encoder shaft). Fred makes an excellent point about removing the heavy knob if the rig is shipped. Inertia is an amazing weight-multiplier. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Phil LaMarche Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 6:45 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] FW: HEAVY KNOBS?? I questioned the problems possible caused by heavy knobs. N8BX's response Philip LaMarche K3 # 1605 KPA500 # 029 P3 #1480 W9DVM -Original Message- From: Fred Freeman [mailto:n...@redbird.net] Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 8:41 PM To: Phil LaMarche Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? Hi Phil, with regard to premature wear caused to the K3 encoders by weighted knobs, I do not feel there is anything to be concerned about. Elecraft uses the best encoders I have experienced in over 20 years in ham radio. They are on par with encoders I have seen in industrial applications where they receive much more use and abuse than anything likely to be seen in an amateur radio application. I have had a weighted knob on my K3 for 3 years and it gets used frequently. It is also my demo radio at shows and it gets a lot of use there. To date, I can not tell it from a brand new radio. The reason it stays nice is partly due to the quality of the encoder and partly because of the nature in which bearing material works. Obviously a ball bearing is preferred but it is an expensive luxury for hams. We a lucky to have a USA manufacture (Elecraft) that chooses to use premium components. Many Japanese made radios now use a quality made encoder with a full metal shell and a bronze bushing for the bearing. Icom uses the same exact encoders the Icom 746 thru the 7800 radios, and Yaesu does the same on the FT-950 thru FTdx9000, etc. There were radios made in the 80's and 90's that had plastic encoder housings and less robust bearing materials, yet these encoders continue to hold up over time. Once in a while you will find an old Icom 735, Kenwood 440, or a Yaesu 757GX with a worn, loose and sloppy feeling encoder. Often these radios have equal wear on the face, buttons and the rest of the enclosure. They literally got the heck ran out of them for 20 years and all without any maintenance (lubrication, etc). There are a great many radios on the used market from the 80's-90's that have nice smooth and wear free encoders and the best feeling are often from radios with heavier knobs (Icom 781, 765, 751A, Kenwood 930, 940, 950, Yaesu FT-990, FT-1000D, FT-1000MP, etc). As an experienced tool maker, I will not design a product that I feel will compromise the life of a customers radio. One measure that I do recommend is removing the weighted knob from your radio if ever you ship it. Shipping companies today are known for dropping boxes from great heights. When I bought my Icom 7700 and 7800 radios, they both came with the Icom weighted knob not installed on the radio. You have to put the knob on after you remove it from the box. So it is a worthwhile consideration to remove the knob if shipping your radio via UPS, Fed-Ex or US Mail. If you have any other questions or concerns, feel free to email me. Thanks & 73, N8BX Fred __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] FW: HEAVY KNOBS??
I questioned the problems possible caused by heavy knobs. N8BX's response Philip LaMarche K3 # 1605 KPA500 # 029 P3 #1480 W9DVM -Original Message- From: Fred Freeman [mailto:n...@redbird.net] Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 8:41 PM To: Phil LaMarche Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? Hi Phil, with regard to premature wear caused to the K3 encoders by weighted knobs, I do not feel there is anything to be concerned about. Elecraft uses the best encoders I have experienced in over 20 years in ham radio. They are on par with encoders I have seen in industrial applications where they receive much more use and abuse than anything likely to be seen in an amateur radio application. I have had a weighted knob on my K3 for 3 years and it gets used frequently. It is also my demo radio at shows and it gets a lot of use there. To date, I can not tell it from a brand new radio. The reason it stays nice is partly due to the quality of the encoder and partly because of the nature in which bearing material works. Obviously a ball bearing is preferred but it is an expensive luxury for hams. We a lucky to have a USA manufacture (Elecraft) that chooses to use premium components. Many Japanese made radios now use a quality made encoder with a full metal shell and a bronze bushing for the bearing. Icom uses the same exact encoders the Icom 746 thru the 7800 radios, and Yaesu does the same on the FT-950 thru FTdx9000, etc. There were radios made in the 80's and 90's that had plastic encoder housings and less robust bearing materials, yet these encoders continue to hold up over time. Once in a while you will find an old Icom 735, Kenwood 440, or a Yaesu 757GX with a worn, loose and sloppy feeling encoder. Often these radios have equal wear on the face, buttons and the rest of the enclosure. They literally got the heck ran out of them for 20 years and all without any maintenance (lubrication, etc). There are a great many radios on the used market from the 80's-90's that have nice smooth and wear free encoders and the best feeling are often from radios with heavier knobs (Icom 781, 765, 751A, Kenwood 930, 940, 950, Yaesu FT-990, FT-1000D, FT-1000MP, etc). As an experienced tool maker, I will not design a product that I feel will compromise the life of a customers radio. One measure that I do recommend is removing the weighted knob from your radio if ever you ship it. Shipping companies today are known for dropping boxes from great heights. When I bought my Icom 7700 and 7800 radios, they both came with the Icom weighted knob not installed on the radio. You have to put the knob on after you remove it from the box. So it is a worthwhile consideration to remove the knob if shipping your radio via UPS, Fed-Ex or US Mail. If you have any other questions or concerns, feel free to email me. Thanks & 73, N8BX Fred > > --Original Message-- > From: Phil LaMarche > To: n...@73cnc.com > Subject: FW: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? > Sent: May 27, 2012 2:58 PM > > Thoughts? > > Philip LaMarche > > > 727-944-3226 > 727-510-5038 Cell > www.w9dvm.com > WWW.FLAMGROUP.COM > > K3 # 1605 > KPA500 # 029 > P3 #1480 > > CCA 98-00827 > CRA 1701 > W9DVM > > > > -Original Message- > From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net > [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ron D'Eau > Claire > Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 2:56 PM > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS?? > > I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder > bushings and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a > simple bushing > - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the lower > side of the bushing. > > Ron AC7AC > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > > Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry® __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
