Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal Loop question
n7tb wrote > ... the loop is connected at its end points to 450 ohm ladder that has one > leg attached to the tuner's antenna connector and the other leg to the > ground lug. Coax comes from the tuner to my rig ... Terry, I'm using similar setup. To avoid radiation from ladder line and keep the antena-line system as close to balanced as possible I've put balun on the tuner end of ladder line. Balun is wound (bifilar) on the toroid. Regards, Piotr SP2BPD -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Horizontal-Loop-question-tp7610926p7610976.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal Loop question
I use a 80 meter vertical loop with about 124' of 450 ladder line to a 1 to 1 current balun right outside the window. A 3 foot piece of coax goes to the tuner (this coax should be as short as possible). You will find that the Elecraft tuners will cover a broad range. Mine covers all bands excluding 160. Actually it will tune 160 but with an amplifier, I expect extremely high voltages at the balun. On 160 you could tune it against ground if so inclined... The antenna is a delta loop with the top at 120' in a pine tree. The bottom wire is at about 50' and it is fed about 1/3rd up a vertical side. It is an excellent performer and depending on where the lobes are on the higher bands, it sometimes beat my 3 element tribander. On 40 it really shines. There is much written on the net on current baluns vs voltage baluns and 1 to 1 vs. 1 to 4. Also, much is written on common mode current. Richard K7SD On 11/29/2015 10:17 PM, n7tb wrote: I currently have a horizontal loop at my QTH being matched by an Icom AH-4 Tuner. It is interfaced with my Icom 756. I will be running a new-to-me K2 with the auto tuner installed. Right now, the loop is connected at its end points to 450 ohm ladder that has one leg attached to the tuner's antenna connector and the other leg to the ground lug. Coax comes from the tuner to my rig and works great on my Icom 756. Now for the several questions. 1. the AH-4 interfaces with the 756 via a four conductor molex connector. Is there some way to take those 4 wires and interface them to my K2 and let the AH-4 tune the loop instead of the internal K2 tuner? 2. I presume it possible to take the coax feed from the A-4 off my 756, or have an antenna switch do that, and attach the loop coax feed to my K2, then turn on the 756 to the same frequency that I want to transmit on the K2, and press the tune button on the 756 to tune the loop? 3. I could manually take 450 ohm loop antenna connection off the Ah4, attach it to a balun attached to another length of coax that attaches to the K2, but this is very cumbersome. Perhaps an antenna switch is available that has two balanced feedpoints and a coax feedpoint that would allow me to switch remotely? Does anyone know of such a thing? 4. If I decide to feed the 450 ohm twin lead to coax to my rig, what type of balun do I need? 4:1 or 1:1? __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to vetteresto...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal Loop question
First, let me say "thank you" to all of you who wrote me very thoughtful and helpful responses to my question. I received many directly to my email address. I came away many great ideas. One is to get ELNEC and use it! I am sorry I did not elaborate about the size of my loop. It is 60 feet on a side, fed on a lower corner (the other three are in trees) with 450 ohm ladder to my AH-4. I was given the following information for finding an interface for the AH-4 that will interface with any radio. I thought others who may be feeding antennas with this tuner and wanting to interface a non-Icom rig to it might find the link helpful. http://www.ebay.com/itm/ArtCraft-Electronics-AEAH-4-Icom-AH-4-Antenna-Tuner-Interface-/291613533877?hash=item43e58566b5. ArtCraft Electronics sells them directly on their website. I think they build to order mostly. Using the interface is the simplest solution for me, so I ordered one. Very 73's, Terry de N7TB -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Horizontal-Loop-question-tp7610926p7610955.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal Loop question
Correction, get the EZNEC software. -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Horizontal-Loop-question-tp7610926p7610959.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal Loop question
Terry, I do not really intend to answer your questions about the switching the feedline, that is up to you In the old days, we did that with a knife switch, or more 'rich and sophisticated' hams used a DPDT relay. For the balun, the impedance at the shack end will determine whether a 4:1 or a 1:1 will be a better choice. Measure the impedance on all bands of interest with an antenna analyzer and use the results to figure out which will be the better compromise. The antenna feedpoint impedance will change from band to band, and the length of the feedline will transform that impedance to something else. If you have trouble matching it on any one band, try adding or subtracting 1/8 wavelength of feedline for that particular band and measure again. 73, Don W3FPR On 11/29/2015 10:17 PM, n7tb wrote: I currently have a horizontal loop at my QTH being matched by an Icom AH-4 Tuner. It is interfaced with my Icom 756. I will be running a new-to-me K2 with the auto tuner installed. Right now, the loop is connected at its end points to 450 ohm ladder that has one leg attached to the tuner's antenna connector and the other leg to the ground lug. Coax comes from the tuner to my rig and works great on my Icom 756. Now for the several questions. 1. the AH-4 interfaces with the 756 via a four conductor molex connector. Is there some way to take those 4 wires and interface them to my K2 and let the AH-4 tune the loop instead of the internal K2 tuner? 2. I presume it possible to take the coax feed from the A-4 off my 756, or have an antenna switch do that, and attach the loop coax feed to my K2, then turn on the 756 to the same frequency that I want to transmit on the K2, and press the tune button on the 756 to tune the loop? 3. I could manually take 450 ohm loop antenna connection off the Ah4, attach it to a balun attached to another length of coax that attaches to the K2, but this is very cumbersome. Perhaps an antenna switch is available that has two balanced feedpoints and a coax feedpoint that would allow me to switch remotely? Does anyone know of such a thing? 4. If I decide to feed the 450 ohm twin lead to coax to my rig, what type of balun do I need? 4:1 or 1:1? __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] Horizontal Loop question
I currently have a horizontal loop at my QTH being matched by an Icom AH-4 Tuner. It is interfaced with my Icom 756. I will be running a new-to-me K2 with the auto tuner installed. Right now, the loop is connected at its end points to 450 ohm ladder that has one leg attached to the tuner's antenna connector and the other leg to the ground lug. Coax comes from the tuner to my rig and works great on my Icom 756. Now for the several questions. 1. the AH-4 interfaces with the 756 via a four conductor molex connector. Is there some way to take those 4 wires and interface them to my K2 and let the AH-4 tune the loop instead of the internal K2 tuner? 2. I presume it possible to take the coax feed from the A-4 off my 756, or have an antenna switch do that, and attach the loop coax feed to my K2, then turn on the 756 to the same frequency that I want to transmit on the K2, and press the tune button on the 756 to tune the loop? 3. I could manually take 450 ohm loop antenna connection off the Ah4, attach it to a balun attached to another length of coax that attaches to the K2, but this is very cumbersome. Perhaps an antenna switch is available that has two balanced feedpoints and a coax feedpoint that would allow me to switch remotely? Does anyone know of such a thing? 4. If I decide to feed the 450 ohm twin lead to coax to my rig, what type of balun do I need? 4:1 or 1:1? Thanks so much for all you help. Very 73's Terry Brown, N7TB -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Horizontal-Loop-question-tp7610926.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal loop question
I have been quite pleased with this delta loop since I put it up about six weeks ago. The pattern does seem to be omni-directional and I notice that the noise level appears to be at least fairly low. I've worked several stations (North Cook Islands, Bonnaire Ireland) that were just above the noise level that many other stations didn't seem to hear. I originally put up a 88' doublet but, upon presenting my new creation to the XYL, she commented, Is there any way to move that ugly black thing? referring to the center insulator which was directly in our view of the foothills behind our house. The aggravating thing about the comment was that she was entirely right. I sat up half the night trying to think of a way to re-orient the doublet before it finally crossed my mind to take the surplus wire I had sitting around and attach it to both ends of the doublet. This created the delta loop and allowed me to get the feed-point out of our line-of-sight. That was a serendipitous turn of events for me because I had never considered a loop before. On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 6:21 PM, AB5N 7000...@gmail.com wrote: I've always been a fan of the horizontal loop. The Delta config works well. Constructive and destructive effects on the radiation of the antenna occur depending on the frequency, size of the loop and height above ground. A 140 ft loop at 45 feet works well on 40 meters and up. You get virtually omni-directional reception and a decently low angle of radiation. It's an over-all winner design. Only thing I like better out of wire is a Carolina Windom. -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Horizontal-loop-question-tp7156283p7156881.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Rick McClelland, AA5S Fort Collins, CO __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] Horizontal loop question
Your posts about the horizontal delta loop prompted me to ask this question. I know someone who has a 2WL horizontal loop erected about 45 feet high on the average. It is over a field of six foot high vegetation. Will that absorb some of the signal? Dick, n0ce __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Horizontal loop question
I've always been a fan of the horizontal loop. The Delta config works well. Constructive and destructive effects on the radiation of the antenna occur depending on the frequency, size of the loop and height above ground. A 140 ft loop at 45 feet works well on 40 meters and up. You get virtually omni-directional reception and a decently low angle of radiation. It's an over-all winner design. Only thing I like better out of wire is a Carolina Windom. -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Horizontal-loop-question-tp7156283p7156881.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
