Re: Re[2]: Demos and Eval Units Now Require CE Mark???
Again I will direct your attention to the "Guide to the implementation of Community harmonization directives based on the new approach and the global approach" published by the the European Communities, ISBN 92-826-8584-5. Under section II, 1. Placing on the market, page 20, "The following are not considered placing on the market: Display of the product at fairs and exhibitions." So, a demonstration unit at shows or exhibitions is exempt, but private showings at other than fairs and exhibitions may not qualify as exempt from compliance. Best Regards, Hans Mellberg __ Reply Separator _ Subject: Re[2]: Demos and Eval Units Now Require CE Mark??? Author: Non-HP-owner-emc-pstc (owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org) at hp-boise,uugw2 List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org Date:3/13/97 4:12 AM Article 3 of the EMC Directive states, "...apparatus referred to in Article 2 may be placed on the market or taken into service only if it complies with the requirements laid down by this Directive when it is installed and maintained and when it used for the purposes for which it is intended." That "placed into service" statement has been interpreted to include any apparatus that is being used as intended. This would seem to include demos and may even be stretched into use at shows. As for "placed on the market", might this include demonstration at a show and/or taking orders. I don not find any exclusions for demos or shows listed in the EMC directive. This analysis is my own of course. Tom Whissel Senior Compliance Engineer Cabletron Systems, Inc. -Reply Separator I don't have a copy of the EC EMC directive infront of me, but I'm fairly certain that an Article in that tome gives equipment destined for exhibitions a free run, and that may describe your Demo equipment. France is a proud and individualistic nation with a long history of unique scientific achievements and the world owes them much gratitude for such things as the Metric System and a singularly large statue situated at the entrance to New York's waterways. This individuality shows at the extremes of the national behavioural map as a particularly introspective view of the world which may seem to the Cosmopolitanly Challenged amongst us as slightly 'difficult' or 'protectionist', but I am sure that this is a distorted view. Europe has spent many years and expended much effort in finally getting all the European States to agree a common date for the time change used for Daylight Saving. Just as that was agreed, the French (for very good reasons which are extensively discussed in the French technical press) have had to pull out of the arrangement so painfully arrived at after so many years, and make entirely different plans. I'm sure they had no other choice, being uniquely placed so near the edge of the European land mass. Many years ago, I recall it was reported that in order to import Video Recorders into France, all had to be subject to the paperwork being arranged in one particular small office in the middle of France, rather than at the port of entry. This was a magnanimous gesture to speed things up, as the office in question was very small, and underworked, and so could concentrate on the task rather than making the applicants wait in a queue at a noisy and smelly port. It also provided this office with valuable work and alleviated the task placed hitherto on the port workers. This arrangement was to everybody's advantage, though the more cynical amongst the bitter baling hounds of the uninformed press suggested that this was a slowing tactic to give local products an advantage. Pish, let their pens turn to Grissini. Have a good day, Chris Dupres. Surrey, UK
RE: CE Mark product standards for purchased equipment
In my experience, the integrator is the party responsible for final system compliance, as configured (IOW - I agree with Bob). If something fails in the test in the final configuration, it's just good business sense for all parties involved to work trogether to solve the problem. Example: My company has a few deals with a few computer companies which integrate some of our cards into their systems. Our cards are CE-marked Class B, having been tested in a few "representative" systems from a few manufacturers (I suppose that's the "due dilligence" on our part). Computer company A has had no problems certifying with our cards. Computer company B has had a good track record with us, but finds with their new zippy SuperSpecial model that they have a problem which is related to our card (or a peripheral attached to our card). It makes sense for Computer company B, my company, and whomever is the peripheral supplier to look into this problem together and offer final solutions (this scenario has happened a few times in the past, and the problems were rectified to the satisfaction of all parties in a rather short time period). Steve Chin StreamLogic Corp. Bob Martin wrote: >Most definitely The system integrator is ALWAYS responsible for the >final outcome (whether it is internal cards or external printers as in >the original case). Tony Fredriksson wrote: >This is very intriguing. Let me throw out a scenario for comment. >Let's say that I have a PC with CE marking and I integrate a video >card and 15" monitor, also with CE Marking, and all declared to Class B >levels. > >Now suppose I import the system to Germany and don't test to >verify the combination since these "new guidelines" say that it is OK to >do so based on the fact that all of the items bear the CE Marking. >The authorities obtain a sample, test it, and find that video >emissions are over the Class B limits at multiple frequencies (this >happens all the time by the way).
Re: Rohde and Schwarz rep
--- On Thu, 13 Mar 1997 08:45:31 GB-EIRE Alan Hudson wrote: > wrote: >> I am trying to find a Rohde and Schwarz representative in the southern >> California area. If anyone knows of any representatives or dealers in the >> S. California area, please drop me a note. >> > >According to their website at http://www.rsd.de they don't >seem to have anybody in California. > >But you could try emailing them to verify - try >customersupport@notes.compuserve.com > >Regards, > >-- - >Alan Hudson >Marconi Simulation (Scotland, UK) >mailto:alan.hud...@gecm.com > > -End of Original Message- Guys: R & S is partnered with Tektronix in the USA. Find a Tek salesman, and you got the R & S man also. -- Name: Ed Price E-mail: ed.pr...@cubic.com List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org Date: 3/13/97 Time: 8:34:31 AM --
Re: TAA and Year 2000 Requir
Reply to: RE>TAA and Year 2000 Requirements? Mike, First of all, could you tell me what type of product that your company is marketing? If you let me know. I could narrow the product categories to figure out what TAA stands for. Year 2000 is coming. All product softwares must be compliant with International Standard ISO 8601 "Data Elements and Interchange Formats-Information Interchange Representation of Dates and Times", which provides specifications for the numeric representation of Gregorian calendar dates and time of day. The requirement prevents the misrepresentation of the significance of the numerals when these representations are interchanged. Example: year 2000 is represented as "00" which could be misrepresented as "year 1900". Year 2000 is a Millennium year! Regards, Bao Tran Nortel (Northern Telecom Inc.) -- List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org Date: 3/11/97 7:52 PM To: Bao Tran From: Mike Campi - E X T E R N A L L Y O R I G I N A T E D M E S S A G E - Help! I have been asked by our sales people if our products comply with the following requirements; 1. TAA 2. Year 2000 I know they are not safety or EMI standards. Does anyone have any clues what our sales person is talking about? They say it is a requirement to sell to the Army recruiters. Thanks Mike -- RFC822 Header Follows -- Received: by nrchq1.rich1.nt.com with SMTP;11 Mar 1997 19:51:10 -0500 Received: from ruebert.ieee.org by ntigate.rich.nt.com with SMTP (PP); Wed, 12 Mar 1997 01:47:53 + Received: (from daemon@localhost) by ruebert.ieee.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA26534 for emc-pstc-list; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 19:38:15 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199703120037.qaa23...@fujitsui.fujitsu.com> List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org Date: Mar 11, 1997 16:38 -0800 From: Mike Campi To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: TAA and Year 2000 Requirements? Sender: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Mike Campi X-Resent-To: Multiple Recipients X-Listname: emc-pstc X-List-Description: Product Safety Tech. Committee, EMC Society X-Info: Help requests to emc-pstc-requ...@majordomo.ieee.org X-Info: [Un]Subscribe requests to majord...@majordomo.ieee.org X-Moderator-Address: emc-pstc-appro...@majordomo.ieee.org
Thoriated-tungsten wire
We have a potential use for thoriated-tungsten filament wire which, because of the thorium, is slightly radioactive - somewhat like a luminous watch dial. A search of US regulations shows that such wire is specifically exempted from NRC licensing requirements if it has less than 4% thorium. Does anyone know if similar exemptions exist in other countries, specifically Europe and Japan. Is there a Directive in the European Community related to radioactive materials and do individual countries have more stringent regulations? Jack M. Burns 512.248.2851
Re: Re[2]: Demos and Eval Units Now Require CE Mark???
Some comments [ ] based on Tom's note: Article 3 of the EMC Directive states, "...apparatus referred to in Article 2 may be placed on the market or taken into service only if it complies with the requirements laid down by this Directive when it is installed and maintained and when it used for the purposes for which it is intended." [This much is "fact", i.e. literal text of Directive. However, "opinion" begins at the point of "interpretation" below. Ben Franklin once said "Opinions are like watches, none run just alike, but each believes his own".] That "placed into service" statement has been interpreted to include any apparatus that is being used as intended. This would seem to include demos and may even be stretched into use at shows. As for "placed on the market", might this include demonstration at a show and/ or taking orders. [The Directive says when it is installed AND maintained AND used for the purposes for which it is intended. In my "opinion" a demo unit is not "installed","maintained", or used for the "purposes for which it is intended". A demo is for the purpose of showing what a product could do if it were purchased, installed, maintained, and used for the purpose for which it was intended. From a practical standpoint, a demo unit should be safe and free from obtrusive EMC emissions, although it might not meet the "letter" of applicable standards. The FCC used to require demo units to be marked as NOT complying with the FCC regulations for Class A/B if FCC certification had not been granted, e.g. pending. A trade show did not represent a serious threat to the FCC's objective of non-intereference with residential or business equipment.] [Well, these are just my opinions, and like my own watch, I believe them to be the most accurate. ??] I do not find any exclusions for demos or shows listed in the EMC directive. This analysis is my own of course. Tom Whissel Senior Compliance Engineer Cabletron Systems, Inc.
Re: Rohde and Schwarz rep
To the best of my knowledge, R&S no longer has it's own reps in the U.S. since signing up with Tektronix in a joint marketing agreement. The local Tektronix office should be able to help. Tek phones: San Diego: (310)643-6977 Irvine: (714)660-8080 L.A.: (818)340-9840 Good luck, -- Brent DeWitt U.S. EMC Technical Coordinator TUV Product Service Boulder, CO (303)449-4165 http://www.tuvps.com
FW: (fwd) NEW COMMISSION GUIDELINES
Draft - New EMC European Guidelines is available at: .. > > A copy of the new "Commission Guidlines" for EMC can be found at:- > > http://www.emc-journal.co.uk/newguide.html > > Webmaster > Nutwood UK Ltd > Mirko
Re[2]: Demos and Eval Units Now Require CE Mark???
Article 3 of the EMC Directive states, "...apparatus referred to in Article 2 may be placed on the market or taken into service only if it complies with the requirements laid down by this Directive when it is installed and maintained and when it used for the purposes for which it is intended." That "placed into service" statement has been interpreted to include any apparatus that is being used as intended. This would seem to include demos and may even be stretched into use at shows. As for "placed on the market", might this include demonstration at a show and/or taking orders. I don not find any exclusions for demos or shows listed in the EMC directive. This analysis is my own of course. Tom Whissel Senior Compliance Engineer Cabletron Systems, Inc. -Reply Separator I don't have a copy of the EC EMC directive infront of me, but I'm fairly certain that an Article in that tome gives equipment destined for exhibitions a free run, and that may describe your Demo equipment. France is a proud and individualistic nation with a long history of unique scientific achievements and the world owes them much gratitude for such things as the Metric System and a singularly large statue situated at the entrance to New York's waterways. This individuality shows at the extremes of the national behavioural map as a particularly introspective view of the world which may seem to the Cosmopolitanly Challenged amongst us as slightly 'difficult' or 'protectionist', but I am sure that this is a distorted view. Europe has spent many years and expended much effort in finally getting all the European States to agree a common date for the time change used for Daylight Saving. Just as that was agreed, the French (for very good reasons which are extensively discussed in the French technical press) have had to pull out of the arrangement so painfully arrived at after so many years, and make entirely different plans. I'm sure they had no other choice, being uniquely placed so near the edge of the European land mass. Many years ago, I recall it was reported that in order to import Video Recorders into France, all had to be subject to the paperwork being arranged in one particular small office in the middle of France, rather than at the port of entry. This was a magnanimous gesture to speed things up, as the office in question was very small, and underworked, and so could concentrate on the task rather than making the applicants wait in a queue at a noisy and smelly port. It also provided this office with valuable work and alleviated the task placed hitherto on the port workers. This arrangement was to everybody's advantage, though the more cynical amongst the bitter baling hounds of the uninformed press suggested that this was a slowing tactic to give local products an advantage. Pish, let their pens turn to Grissini. Have a good day, Chris Dupres. Surrey, UK
Re: Specs for VDE878
Resending following message:
FROM: Georg M. Dancau, 100536,2175
TO: emc-pstc group, INTERNET:emc-p...@ieee.org
DATE: 11.03.1997 05:35
Re: Copy of: Re: Specs for VDE878
Patrick Lawler wrote:
>I've come across a product requirement spec'ing VDE878
>(Interference-telcom systems).
>Does anyone have a brief description of the requirements?
>- Is it radiated or conducted?
>- If it's a conducted EMI spec, is it voltage-referenced using LISN's, or
>current-referenced using a current probe?
>- Frequency range?
>Thanks,
Hi Patrick
Following Standards of the VDE 0878 are valid:
VDE0878 Part 2 (July 1988)
Radio interference suppression of telecommunication equipment;
Equipment in telecommunication operating rooms
The standard contains no limits but points to Part 1 of VDE0878,
which is no longer valid. I think you still have to choose your
measurement methods and measurement points according to this standard.
VDE0878 Part 22 (May 1995)
Limits and methods of measurement of radio disturbance characteristics
of information technology equipment
German version of EN55022 (1994) and CISPR 22 (1993)
Replaces:
VDE 0878 Part 1 (1986-12)
VDE 0878 Part 3 (1989-11)
VDE 0878 Part 22/A1: Dec. 1995
Limits and methods of measurement of radio disturbance characteristics
of information technology equipment
German version of EN55022:1994 /A1:1995 and CISPR 22:1993/A1:1995
VDE 0878 Part 200 (Dec. 1992)
Electromagnetic compatibility of information technology equipment and
telecommunication equipment;
Immunity of analogue subscriber equipment
Covered Phenomena:
narrow band conducted disturbances (10kHz-150MHz)
pulsed conducted disturbances
burst (fast transients)
surges 1.2us/50us AND 10us/700us
electromagnetic fields - under consideration !!!
electrostatic discharge (interesting setup for indirect discharge)b
VDE0878 Part 240 ("vornorm"=pre-standard)(July 1993)
Electromagnetic compatibility of information technology b
and telecommunication equipment;
Immunity of information technology equipment
This standard tries to harmonize the immunity limits with EN50082-1
ESD - Table A1, Row A.1.4
EM fields Table A1, Row A.1.2
Conducted RFTable A.2 Row A2.2
Table A.4 Row A.4.5
Transients Table A.3 Row A.3.3
Table A.4 Row A.4.4
Table 2 Row 2.1
Table 3 Row 3.1
Table 4 Row 4.1
"This standard shall be valid as log as EN55024-1 to EN55024-4 have
not
yet been published" (Very very free translation).
I hope this helps.
Regards
George
* Dr. Georg M. Dancau* HAUNI MASCHINENBAU AG *
* g.m.dan...@ieee.org* EMC Lab *
* TEL: +49 40 7250 2102 * Kampchaussee 8..32 *
* FAX: +49 40 7250 3801 * 21033 Hamburg, Germany *
* home: Tel: +49 40 738 51 07* Lohbruegger Landstr. 82 *
* Fax: +49 40 730 11 99* 21031 Hamburg, Germany *
Re: Rohde and Schwarz rep
wrote: > I am trying to find a Rohde and Schwarz representative in the southern > California area. If anyone knows of any representatives or dealers in the > S. California area, please drop me a note. > According to their website at http://www.rsd.de they don't seem to have anybody in California. But you could try emailing them to verify - try customersupport@notes.compuserve.com Regards, -- - Alan Hudson Marconi Simulation (Scotland, UK) mailto:alan.hud...@gecm.com
RE: antenna calibration
I am not sure if anyone has already posted an answer to this question, but we use NPL. The contact details are: Mr M Alexander Antenna Calibration Dept. National Physical Laboratory Queens Road Teddington Middlesex TW11 0LW Tel: 0181 943 7175 Fax: 0181 943 6458 I hope this is of use. Regards - Stephen Kirk Radio Frequency Investigation Ltd. Basingstoke, England Tel: +44 (0)1256 855412 (Direct Tel) E-mail: stephen_k...@rfi.co.uk Web Site: http://www.rfi.co.uk - -Original Message- From: Martin Garwood [SMTP:aust...@mpx.com.au] Sent: 28 February 1997 16:47 To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject:antenna calibration Can anyone advise contact details of UK or other accredited Antenna calibration labs (30MHz - 1GHz or better). (must be traceable to National/int'l standards). Thanks & Best Regards.
FW: EMC standards
Hi All I have received the following information from CENELEC on the Generic Immunity standard, the ITE immunity standard, and the Harmonic stuff. Enjoy!! >-- > >Dear Charles, > >I'm going to try to answer all the questions you've sent me >lately at once. I haven't been able to reply before now >because it's been so unbelievably hectic here we don't know >whether we're coming or going! > >Your email of today: > >prEN 50082-1:1996 - the results of the third vote on this >draft are being discussed at our Technical Board meeting >this week. > >prEN 55024:1996 - a parallel vote (by IEC and CENELEC) was >launched December 20. It is the same as CISPR 24:199X >(CISPR/G/113/FDIS). The results of this vote will be >discussed at the next Technical Board in July. > >Your fax of February 15 on EN 61000-3-2: > >Q1: A12 was published by CENELEC in January 1996, but the >European Commission hasn't published its reference as a >Harmonized Standard under the EMC directive. >This standard is one of a series of EMC standards that have >'certification clauses'. The idea of certifiation clauses in >Harmonized Standards is under question and this is why >several EMC standards aren't harmonized yet. I may know more >about this next week. > >Q2&Q3: A vote was launched on EN 61000-3-2:1995/prA13:1996 - >an amendment to clause C7. I think this week's technical >board is also discussing these results and I should be able >to let you know more about this next week too. > >Q4: This standard's in the hands of TC 210. The Chairman is: >Mr Robert De Vre >Laborelec Tel: 32/2 382-0371 >Rodestraat, 125Fax: 32/2 382-0241 >B - 1630 Linkebeek >Belgium > > >Best regards, >Gail Ann Fage >Head of the Info Data Service >CENELEC CS >
