[PSES] List of Harmonised Standards for RED; and EMCD 2014/30/EU

[itl-emc user group]

Hello

Does anyone have any information as to when lists of harmonized standards will 
be published for both the RED and EMCD 2014/30/EU?

Does anyone have any information as to when CISPR 35 will be published?

Thanks in advanced for any information

Regards,
David Shidlowsky | Technical Reviewer
Address 1 Bat-Sheva St., LOD  Israel
Tel 972-8-9186113 Fax 972-8-9153101
Mail dav...@itl.co.il/e...@itl.co.il  Web 
www.itl.co.il

Fill out Customer Satisfaction 
Survey
Global Certifications You Can Trust
This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information.
If you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate, 
distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you 
received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the message 
and its attachments to the sender.








-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

[Brian O'Connell]

The current *style* is the Risk Assessment. The RA is an assumed probability. 
Dunno, as much of the supposed 'probability' for failure does not map well with 
resultant MTBF numbers. The sample space is not the probability space, but 
probability space does contain a sample space. American engineers are taught 
statistics without adequate measure theory; that is, this side of the pond uses 
stuff based on combinatorics - not always conducive to the existing finite 
sample space.

The measure of the result of safeguards, while codified by many medical 
equipment standards, does not necessarily provide a repeatable model for 
revealing the effectiveness of safeguards. Data from observations (Type Tests?) 
has problems (other than the obvious mundane calculations for measurement 
uncertainty) because the 'experiments' (aka, the tests), are not designed to be 
randomized experiments. From a simplistic working engineer's POV, there should 
never be a pathological integral in this stuff.

By my feeble understanding, we have a mathematical process that strives for a 
countable infinite, in order to explain why a coin may never or continually 
comes up heads. A non-countable infinite makes for unclean and intractable 
theoretical basis. While there are textbooks that provide measure theory for 
use in probability theory, the usage is scoped for graduate-level math geeks, 
and it seems to be all sigma algebra.

There are some engineering processes (HALT,HASS,SR332) that are using bayesian 
analysis, but the initial calculation of both posteriors and a priori to remove 
uncertainty for electrical equipment failures is difficult for mortals. But 
once you build your database with good RMA (failure data) and ATP (production 
data), the dynamic updates yields very tangible and useable results. But how do 
we get to a legit RA for our new box about to go to production? Not trivial for 
power conversion equipment, at least.

So how safe is it to sit at your computer and read this? Probably about 0.1, or 
more, or less...

Brian
 

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 3:10 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

OTOH, apart from instructions and symbols, how else can manufacturers begin to 
address the issue of “risk reduction” other than  making the products 
“absolutely safe”?

Most products are absolutely safe for all practical purposes.  As you read 
this, you are safe.  And, you are acting like you are absolutely safe; that is, 
you are taking no precautions against an injury.  

Most safety requires two independent safeguards.  Safeguards are considered 
reliable for the lifetime of the product.  So, for an injury to occur, you have 
the probability of failure of two safeguards, both of which are supposed to be 
reliable for the product lifetime.  Multiplication of the two probabilities 
yields an extremely small number which means the product is absolutely safe for 
two lifetimes.  

Driving across town involves much higher probabilities of safeguard (driver 
behavior) failure than typical product safeguard failures.  Most of us 
recognize that our safety and that of others depends on our behavior (adherence 
to driving rules).  I would not use the term “absolute safety” to describe the 
activity of driving across town.

Best regards,
Rich

Ps:  This should trigger much discussion!

-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

[Richard Nute]

 

 

OTOH, apart from instructions and symbols, how else can manufacturers begin to 
address the issue of “risk reduction” other than  making the products 
“absolutely safe”?

 

Most products are absolutely safe for all practical purposes.  As you read 
this, you are safe.  And, you are acting like you are absolutely safe; that is, 
you are taking no precautions against an injury.  

 

Most safety requires two independent safeguards.  Safeguards are considered 
reliable for the lifetime of the product.  So, for an injury to occur, you have 
the probability of failure of two safeguards, both of which are supposed to be 
reliable for the product lifetime.  Multiplication of the two probabilities 
yields an extremely small number which means the product is absolutely safe for 
two lifetimes.  

 

Driving across town involves much higher probabilities of safeguard (driver 
behavior) failure than typical product safeguard failures.  Most of us 
recognize that our safety and that of others depends on our behavior (adherence 
to driving rules).  I would not use the term “absolute safety” to describe the 
activity of driving across town.

 

 

Best regards,

Rich

 

Ps:  This should trigger much discussion!

 

 


-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

[John Allen]

I do have to agree – do even WE read the instruction and/or look at the symbols?

 

OTOH, apart from instructions and symbols, how else can manufacturers begin to 
address the issue of “risk reduction” other than  making the products 
“absolutely safe”? And then, how can you do that and still release it to the 
market? 

 

Personally, I don’t think that is realistically possible, and therefore – as we 
have discussed before – the only likely solution is the risk assessment/ risk 
reduction approach.

 

Over to you all J!

 

John Allen

W.London, UK

 

From: Nyffenegger, Dave [mailto:dave.nyffeneg...@bhemail.com] 
Sent: 05 April 2016 18:24
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

 

The symbols are only for the inspectors.  Everyone knows the users don’t read 
instructions much less symbolsJ

 

-Dave

 

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 1:14 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

 

 

 

There is a gap between standalone transformer standard requiring warning "For 
indoors use only" and combined product requiring no warning.

 

There is no uniformity (standardization?) among safety standards for the use of 
the “indoor use” symbol.  Virtually all electrical products are “indoor use”; 
few are outdoor use.  I suppose all battery-powered products are candidates for 
outdoor use, but the safety standards don’t recognize this fact.  

 

Do users recognize that the symbol means “indoor use”?

 

 

Rich

 

 

 

 

-


This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) 
 
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html 

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell  

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher 
David Heald  

-


This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) 
 
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html 

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell  

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher 
David Heald  


-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] Plenum Rated Speakers in the EU and Canada

[Chuck McDowell]

Hi Scott,
Try
UL 1480Speakers for Fire Alarm and Signaling Systems, Including 
Accessories
EU   EN 54-24.
Canadian CSA-C22.2 No. 205, "Signal Equipment."

UL1480A   Standard for Speakers for Commercial and Professional Use.
EU try EN 60065 or EN 62368-1
Canadian   CAN/CSA-E60065 or CAN/CSA-C22.2 No. 60065 or CAN/CSA-C22.2 No. 
62368-1

Blurb on Air-handling Found at “Guide Information for Electrical Equipment for 
Use in Ordinary Locations Certified for Canada” UL page.

Products such as LAN transceivers and baluns investigated for use in 
air-handling spaces are marked "Suitable for use in environmental air spaces 
(plenums) in accordance with Rules 16-220 and 60-402 of the Canadian Electrical 
Code," or equivalent. These products have been additionally investigated to 
ANSI/UL 2043,"Fire Test for Heat and Visible Smoke Release for Discrete 
Products and Their Accessories Installed in Air-Handling Spaces." Products that 
bear this marking are suitable for installation in accordance with Rules 16-220 
and 60-402 of the CEC.

Cheers,

Chuck McDowell
Compliance Specialist
Meyer Sound Laboratories Inc.

From: Scott Douglas [mailto:sdouglas...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 10:51 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] Plenum Rated Speakers in the EU and Canada

Fellow List Persons,

Given audio speakers Listed to the following standards to be used in plenum, 
air handling, commercial spaces:

UL 2043Standard for Fire Test for Heat and Visible Smoke Release for 
Discrete Products and Their Accessories Installed in Air-Handling Spaces
UL 1480Speakers for Fire Alarm and Signaling Systems, Including 
Accessories
UL1480A   Standard for Speakers for Commercial and Professional Use.

Is there a Canadian equivalent rating/listing/standard for same?

Is there an EU equivalent rating/listing/standard for same?

Thank you in advance for your help.

Scott

-


This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>>

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to 
unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>>
Mike Cantwell mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>>

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>>
David Heald mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>>

NOTICE: This email may contain confidential information.  Please see 
http://www.meyersound.com/confidential/ for our complete policy.


-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

[PSES] Plenum Rated Speakers in the EU and Canada

[Scott Douglas]

Fellow List Persons,

Given audio speakers Listed to the following standards to be used in
plenum, air handling, commercial spaces:



UL 2043Standard for Fire Test for Heat and Visible Smoke Release
for Discrete Products and Their Accessories Installed in Air-Handling Spaces

UL 1480Speakers for Fire Alarm and Signaling Systems, Including
Accessories

UL1480A   Standard for Speakers for Commercial and Professional Use.


Is there a Canadian equivalent rating/listing/standard for same?


Is there an EU equivalent rating/listing/standard for same?


Thank you in advance for your help.


Scott

-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

[Nyffenegger, Dave]

The symbols are only for the inspectors.  Everyone knows the users don’t read 
instructions much less symbols☺

-Dave

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 1:14 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply



There is a gap between standalone transformer standard requiring warning "For 
indoors use only" and combined product requiring no warning.

There is no uniformity (standardization?) among safety standards for the use of 
the “indoor use” symbol.  Virtually all electrical products are “indoor use”; 
few are outdoor use.  I suppose all battery-powered products are candidates for 
outdoor use, but the safety standards don’t recognize this fact.

Do users recognize that the symbol means “indoor use”?


Rich




-


This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>>

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to 
unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>>
Mike Cantwell mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>>

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>>
David Heald mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>>

-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] "For indoor use only" on External Power Supply

[Richard Nute]

 

 

There is a gap between standalone transformer standard requiring warning "For 
indoors use only" and combined product requiring no warning.

 

There is no uniformity (standardization?) among safety standards for the use of 
the “indoor use” symbol.  Virtually all electrical products are “indoor use”; 
few are outdoor use.  I suppose all battery-powered products are candidates for 
outdoor use, but the safety standards don’t recognize this fact.  

 

Do users recognize that the symbol means “indoor use”?

 

 

Rich

 

 

 

 


-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: 

Re: [PSES] "Job opening for a Regulatory Compliance Engineer in Kanata, Ontario

[Rodney Davis]

Mitel Networks is looking for a Senior Regulatory Compliance Engineer. Details 
can be found on-line at www.Mitel.com

Make Communicating Seamless | Mitel - United States
www.mitel.com
Companies across the globe rely on Mitel to power 2 billion connections every 
day so they can connect, collaborate and take care of their customers




http://domino1.mitel.com/hr_kan/recruitment.nsf/51daf913859d493a85257f6a00039241/e6831ae4cfd7f64085257f6b0056a9b5?OpenDocument


NOTE: This e-mail (including any attachments) is for the sole use of the 
intended recipient(s) and may contain information that is confidential and/or 
protected by legal privilege. Any unauthorized review, use, copy, disclosure or 
distribution of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended 
recipient, please notify Mitel immediately and destroy all copies of this 
e-mail. Mitel does not accept any liability for breach of security, error or 
virus that may result from the transmission of this message.

-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html

Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)
List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

For help, send mail to the list administrators:
Scott Douglas 
Mike Cantwell 

For policy questions, send mail to:
Jim Bacher:  
David Heald: