Re: [PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison
Hello folks, Thank you to everyone who replied with the information and further reading; it was most helpful. I'm still on the EN version of the 2nd edition which is why I hadn't spotted the update. All the best James From: James Pawson (U3C) Sent: 07 January 2019 15:55 To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: [PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison Hello all, Happy new year folks, I hope 2019 brings health and happiness to you all. I'm trying to gain a better understanding of cable flammability standards. Safety standard EN 62368-1 states that, for PS2 and PS3 circuits, wire insulation flammability should meet the requirements of [ IEC 60332-1-2 and IEC 60332-1-3 ] or IEC/TS 60695-11-21. I don't have a copy of 60695-11-21 but have read that it uses a 500W flame. Does anyone have a feeling or understanding for the equivalence between 60695-11-21 and the UL 1581 test for VW-1 rating of cables? I ask because I don't see many cables with a 60332-1 or 60695-11-21 rating but lots with a VW-1 rating, for instance on PC ATX power supplies, the outputs of which are definitely PS2 and PS3 circuits. If someone could point me towards some further reading material on the subject that would be appreciated. All the best James - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org> > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) <http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org> > Mike Cantwell mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org> > For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org> > David Heald mailto:dhe...@gmail.com> > - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas Mike Cantwell For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: David Heald:
Re: [PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison
Hi James, The note that Rich referenced is found in the 3rd edition of IEC 62368-1. It was not present in 2nd edition but has been added to address the problem you described (as well as the text "or the equivalent" to the body of 6.5.1). More information here <https://62368-ul-solutions.com/engineers/clause-6-of-iec-62368-1-flammability-requirements/> . There is no EN equivalent of IEC 62368-1 3rd edition <https://www.cenelec.eu/dyn/www/f?p=104:110:885545800959701FSP_ORG_ID,FSP_PROJECT,FSP_LANG_ID:1257189,67625,25> yet. On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 11:20 AM Richard Nute wrote: > > > > > Hello James: > > > > I can’t point you to reading material, but I can point you to IEC 62368-1, > sub-clause 6.5.1: > > > > NOTE Wire complying with UL 2556 VW-1 is considered to comply with these > requirements. > > > > Also, IEC 62368-2, sub-clause 6.5.1: > > > > Rationale: > > > > Wiring flammability proposals have now been included for all wiring > (external and internal). > > > > Compliance with IEC 60332-1-2 for large wires and IEC 60332-2-2 for small > wires has historically proven adequate for *mains *wiring. These > documents include their own material flammability requirements. > > > > The requirements of IEC/TS 60695-11-21 are also considered adequate given > that the flame spread requirements for vertical testing are more onerous > than the IEC 60332 series of documents. > > > > The compliance criteria are based on application of the above test > methods. These are consistent with international wiring standards. National > standards may have more onerous requirements. > > > > > > Best wishes for the New Year! > > Rich > > > > > > *From:* James Pawson (U3C) > *Sent:* Monday, January 7, 2019 7:55 AM > *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG > *Subject:* [PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison > > > > Hello all, > > > > Happy new year folks, I hope 2019 brings health and happiness to you all. > > > > I’m trying to gain a better understanding of cable flammability standards. > > > > Safety standard EN 62368-1 states that, for PS2 and PS3 circuits, wire > insulation flammability should meet the requirements of [ IEC 60332-1-2 and > IEC 60332-1-3 ] or IEC/TS 60695-11-21. > > > > I don’t have a copy of 60695-11-21 but have read that it uses a 500W > flame. Does anyone have a feeling or understanding for the equivalence > between 60695-11-21 and the UL 1581 test for VW-1 rating of cables? > > > > I ask because I don’t see many cables with a 60332-1 or 60695-11-21 rating > but lots with a VW-1 rating, for instance on PC ATX power supplies, the > outputs of which are definitely PS2 and PS3 circuits. > > > > If someone could point me towards some further reading material on the > subject that would be appreciated. > > All the best > > James > > > > > > > - > > > This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc > discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to < > emc-p...@ieee.org> > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html > > Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at > http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in > well-used formats), large files, etc. > > Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ > Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to > unsubscribe) <http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html> > List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html > > For help, send mail to the list administrators: > Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org> > Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org> > > For policy questions, send mail to: > Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org> > David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com> > -- Scott Aldous | Regulatory Compliance Program Manager | scottald...@google.com | 650-253-1994 - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas Mike Cantwell For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: David Heald:
Re: [PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison
Hello James: I can't point you to reading material, but I can point you to IEC 62368-1, sub-clause 6.5.1: NOTE Wire complying with UL 2556 VW-1 is considered to comply with these requirements. Also, IEC 62368-2, sub-clause 6.5.1: Rationale: Wiring flammability proposals have now been included for all wiring (external and internal). Compliance with IEC 60332-1-2 for large wires and IEC 60332-2-2 for small wires has historically proven adequate for mains wiring. These documents include their own material flammability requirements. The requirements of IEC/TS 60695-11-21 are also considered adequate given that the flame spread requirements for vertical testing are more onerous than the IEC 60332 series of documents. The compliance criteria are based on application of the above test methods. These are consistent with international wiring standards. National standards may have more onerous requirements. Best wishes for the New Year! Rich From: James Pawson (U3C) Sent: Monday, January 7, 2019 7:55 AM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: [PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison Hello all, Happy new year folks, I hope 2019 brings health and happiness to you all. I'm trying to gain a better understanding of cable flammability standards. Safety standard EN 62368-1 states that, for PS2 and PS3 circuits, wire insulation flammability should meet the requirements of [ IEC 60332-1-2 and IEC 60332-1-3 ] or IEC/TS 60695-11-21. I don't have a copy of 60695-11-21 but have read that it uses a 500W flame. Does anyone have a feeling or understanding for the equivalence between 60695-11-21 and the UL 1581 test for VW-1 rating of cables? I ask because I don't see many cables with a 60332-1 or 60695-11-21 rating but lots with a VW-1 rating, for instance on PC ATX power supplies, the outputs of which are definitely PS2 and PS3 circuits. If someone could point me towards some further reading material on the subject that would be appreciated. All the best James - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas Mike Cantwell For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: David Heald:
[PSES] Cable Flammability Standard Comparison
Hello all, Happy new year folks, I hope 2019 brings health and happiness to you all. I'm trying to gain a better understanding of cable flammability standards. Safety standard EN 62368-1 states that, for PS2 and PS3 circuits, wire insulation flammability should meet the requirements of [ IEC 60332-1-2 and IEC 60332-1-3 ] or IEC/TS 60695-11-21. I don't have a copy of 60695-11-21 but have read that it uses a 500W flame. Does anyone have a feeling or understanding for the equivalence between 60695-11-21 and the UL 1581 test for VW-1 rating of cables? I ask because I don't see many cables with a 60332-1 or 60695-11-21 rating but lots with a VW-1 rating, for instance on PC ATX power supplies, the outputs of which are definitely PS2 and PS3 circuits. If someone could point me towards some further reading material on the subject that would be appreciated. All the best James - This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas Mike Cantwell For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: David Heald:
