Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[James Pawson (U3C)]

Hello Steve,

 

Following up on Kevin’s message about IEC 62368-1, there are some requirements 
in Annex L (Disconnect Devices)

 

L.8 Multiple power sources

Where a unit receives power from more than one source (for example, different 
voltages/frequencies or as redundant power), there shall be a prominent 
instructional safeguard in accordance with Clause F.5 at each disconnect device 
giving adequate instructions for the removal of all power from the unit.

 

The elements of the instructional safeguard shall be as follows:

– element 1a: IEC 60417-6042 (2010-11); and IEC 60417-6172 (2012-09)

– element 2: “Caution” or equivalent word or text, and “Shock hazard” or 
equivalent text

– element 3: optional

– element 4: “Disconnect all power sources” or equivalent text

 

If more than one such disconnect device is provided on a unit, all these 
devices shall be grouped together. It is not necessary that the devices be 
mechanically linked.

 

 

All the best

James

 

James Pawson

Managing Director & EMC Problem Solver

 

Office hours:

My mornings are reserved for full attention on consultancy, testing, and 
troubleshooting activities for our customers’ projects. I am otherwise 
contactable between 1300h to 1730h from Monday to Friday.

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<mailto:he...@unit3compliance.co.uk> he...@unit3compliance.co.uk or call 01274 
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Unit 3 Compliance Ltd

EMC : Environmental & Vibration : Electrical Safety : CE & UKCA : Consultancy

 

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Registered in England and Wales # 10574298

 

From: Douglas Powell  
Sent: Friday, April 7, 2023 6:14 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

 

Although related to the installation of products and not necessarily the 
product desgins themselves, you might review NFPA 70, National Electric Code.  
They do have requirements when using multiple sources.

 

-Doug

 

 

Douglas E Powell

Laporte, Colorado USA

 <mailto:doug...@gmail.com> doug...@gmail.com

 <https://www.linkedin.com/in/coloradocomplianceguy/> LinkedIn

 

(UTC -06:00, US-MDT)

 

 

 

 

On Thu, Apr 6, 2023 at 2:41 PM Steve Brody mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net> > wrote:

A new question. 

 

A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, but 
I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance. 

 

The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A or B 
are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the other 
section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says there 
are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit protection 
and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both. 

 

What am I missing? 

 

Thanks, 

 

 

Steve Brody 

 <mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net> sgbr...@comcast.net 

C - 603 617 9116 

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Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[Douglas Powell]

Although related to the installation of products and not necessarily the
product desgins themselves, you might review NFPA 70, National Electric
Code.  They do have requirements when using multiple sources.

-Doug


Douglas E Powell
Laporte, Colorado USA
doug...@gmail.com
LinkedIn 

(UTC -06:00, US-MDT)




On Thu, Apr 6, 2023 at 2:41 PM Steve Brody  wrote:

> A new question.
>
> A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product,
> but I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on
> compliance.
>
> The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A
> or B are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the
> other section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that
> says there are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own
> circuit protection and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used
> for both.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Steve Brody
> sgbr...@comcast.net
> C - 603 617 9116
> -
> 
>
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
> emc-p...@ieee.org
>
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
>
> Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
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> unsubscribe) 
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>
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>
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> David Heald dhe...@gmail.com
> --
>
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Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[Dan Roman]

And in the telecom world we frequently used multiple AC cords, each one going 
to an outlet served by a different circuit breaker to make sure the switch or 
multiplexer did not go down.  They fed individual power supplies that fed a 
common power bus.  Covered by IEC 950 and later standards.  Needed a warning 
that there were multiple power cords.  Seems odd that IEC 950 and derivatives 
would cover this situation but not 61010!

 

Dan

 

 

From: Richard Nute [mailto:ri...@ieee.org] 
Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2023 8:15 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

 

 

 

Hi Steve:

 

The TV broadcast industry electronic products have used two (redundant) AC 
sources for their products for many years.  You may have some help there.

 

Rich

 

 

From: Steve Brody mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net> > 
Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2023 1:42 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> 
Subject: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

 

A new question. 

 

A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, but 
I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance. 

 

The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A or B 
are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the other 
section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says there 
are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit protection 
and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both. 

 

What am I missing? 

 

Thanks, 

 

 

Steve Brody 

sgbr...@comcast.net <mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>  

C - 603 617 9116 

 

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Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[Boštjan Glavič]

Hi Steve,

Below is link to official ISO symbol for multiple power source.

https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iec:grs:60417:6172

Best regards,
Boštjan

From: Richard Nute 
Sent: Friday, April 7, 2023 2:15 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

CAUTION: This email originated from outside of our organisation. Do not click 
links or open attachments unless you recognise the sender and know the content 
is safe.



Hi Steve:

The TV broadcast industry electronic products have used two (redundant) AC 
sources for their products for many years.  You may have some help there.

Rich


From: Steve Brody mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>>
Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2023 1:42 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG<mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
Subject: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

A new question.

A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, but 
I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance.

The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A or B 
are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the other 
section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says there 
are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit protection 
and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both.

What am I missing?

Thanks,


Steve Brody
sgbr...@comcast.net<mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>
C - 603 617 9116


-


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Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[sgbrody]

Thanks for your responses. Sent from my T-Mobile 5G Device
 Original message From: Steve Brody  Date: 
4/6/23  4:41 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: PSES List Server  
Subject: Multiple electrical power sources 
  
   A new question.
  
  
   
  
  
   A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, 
but I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance.
  
  
   
  
  
   The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A 
or B are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the 
other section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says 
there are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit 
protection and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both.
  
  
   
  
  
   What am I missing?
  
  
   
  
  
   Thanks,
  
  
   
  
  
   
  
  
   
Steve Brody
   
   
sgbr...@comcast.net
   
   
C - 603 617 9116
   
  
 


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Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[Kevin Robinson]

You might want to take a look at UL/IEC/EN 60950-1 which I know definitely has 
requirements for multiple power sources.  62368 may have guidance as well

Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>

From: Richard Nute 
Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2023 8:15:02 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG 
Subject: Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources






Hi Steve:



The TV broadcast industry electronic products have used two (redundant) AC 
sources for their products for many years.  You may have some help there.



Rich





From: Steve Brody 
Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2023 1:42 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources



A new question.



A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, but 
I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance.



The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A or B 
are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the other 
section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says there 
are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit protection 
and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both.



What am I missing?



Thanks,





Steve Brody

sgbr...@comcast.net<mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>

C - 603 617 9116



-


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Re: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[Richard Nute]

 

 

Hi Steve:

 

The TV broadcast industry electronic products have used two (redundant) AC 
sources for their products for many years.  You may have some help there.

 

Rich

 

 

From: Steve Brody  
Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2023 1:42 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

 

A new question. 

 

A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, but 
I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance. 

 

The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A or B 
are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the other 
section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says there 
are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit protection 
and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both. 

 

What am I missing? 

 

Thanks, 

 

 

Steve Brody 

sgbr...@comcast.net <mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net>  

C - 603 617 9116 

 


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[PSES] Multiple electrical power sources

[Steve Brody]

A new question.

A client's product is using two independent AC power sources on a product, but 
I can't find anything in 61010-1 60204-1 that provide any guidance on 
compliance.

The obvious is that the sections of the product that are fed from source A or B 
are not interrelated in any way that would create a hazard for for the other 
section, that there be a warning label adjacent to each input that says there 
are multiple AC sources, and that each section has it's own circuit protection 
and disconnect, even if a facility disconnect is used for both.

What am I missing?

Thanks,


Steve Brody
sgbr...@comcast.net mailto:sgbr...@comcast.net
C - 603 617 9116

-

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