Re: [Emc-users] Probing
Hi, I proposed the problem of manual tool change and offset determination some time ago, I have a small mill (always an MF70) without tool holders, so I'm very interested. I'm happy to see there is a first solution for the problem now. Maybe I will be able to test it in a couple of days. thanks chris, Manfredi My website: www.m24-pro.com www.emc2cnc.altervista.org >From: Chris Radek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" > >To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" >Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Probing >Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2007 21:18:42 -0500 > >On Sun, Apr 29, 2007 at 06:52:13PM +0200, Sven Mueller wrote: > > Chris Radek schrieb: > > > On Sun, Apr 29, 2007 at 10:03:29AM -0500, Chris Radek wrote: > > > > > > G49 > > > insert any tool, touch off, set work coordinate system > > > start program > > > program probes first tool, THIS is the reference tool for this run > > > program saves reference Z coordinate in a variable > > > cut... > > > program goes up to tool change height, prompts for next tool > > > program probes this tool, this - reference => G43 > > > cut... > > > ... > > > > Looks exactly like I would want it to work. It would be nice if this > > could be automated in M06 handling if no tool changer is defined, but > > any working recipe would work for me I guess. > > >Hi Sven, I've added this scheme to the emc2 cvs trunk. I can't test >it right now but maybe I can set up something one of these days. > >G43 with an H index -1 is now a "transient" tool whose offsets are >specified on the G43 line. The length offset is specified with the K >word (and X offset with I word for lathes). > >So G43 H-1 K0.5 would do the same thing as G43 H3 if tool 3 has a >length of 0.5 in the tool table. > >Like I described above I think this will let you use probing to >measure and set up length compensation for a newly inserted tool in a >fairly straightforward way. > >(Since H-1 was previously disallowed, this will not break any >existing programs.) > >Chris > >- >This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express >Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take >control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. >http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ >___ >Emc-users mailing list >Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users _ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.com/ - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] probing
Gentlemen, A lights out machine using probing will have XY registers for each tool's probing position. This will allow any tool to be probed. They will usually probe the tool after every tool change to detect broken tools. This will also verify the correct tool is in the spindle. An operator can change a tool in the magazine and put the wrong tool in the magazine pot. This check is not certain but not many times will the tool length and XY check position match to the precision necessary to allow the machine to continue with that tool. thanks Stuart - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] G38.2
Greetings Guys; Dean, I have that probe built, many thanks for the idea, and now waiting on digikey for the optical stuff, I bought 5 of them so I can make some limit switches too. Here I'm working from memory, the printout is out in the shop, so I could have the numbers wrong. One concern I have with using the G38.2 function is noted in my copy of the rs-274d manual, and it doesn't say much about storing the results except to note something about the 5199-5x00 range, which I'd assume one could access via the Z#5199 etc syntax. What strikes me as a rather severe limitation to this concept is the apparent lack of just using a logfile for the results, which could then be made into a surface mesh for visual checking in a wireframe program, and finally manipulated back into a gcode file, the idea being to take a pattern to carve, where you only have the x/y params, and by comparing the x/y params to those in the probed mesh file, find the closest matching x/y position in the surface mesh, interpolate and add the appropriate z values to the otherwise 2 dimensional file. The end result probably to be carved with a diamond tipped burr moving at, in my machine, about .01" a minute so as not to bend or wear the burr before the job was done. The spindle max is 2000 rpm for this machine. I'd like to be able to write a gcode program to probe say a floor plate from my hunting rifle, on about a 0.010" grid, so the result mesh is going to be around 1.5" by nearly 6". That's a boatload of points, and if not made acessable in a file format for further use, seems rather pointless in the end. Is there a solution for this apparent problem, possibly even conceptual because I'm not visualizing the problem correctly? -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) I have seen these EGG EXTENDERS in my Supermarket ... I have read the INSTRUCTIONS ... - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] G38.2
On Mon, Apr 30, 2007 at 10:12:33AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: > What strikes me as a rather severe limitation to this concept is the apparent > lack of just using a logfile for the results See page 140 of the user manual - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Axis Active G-code display?
> S#101 > (debug,Set knob to #101) > M0 Not with 2.14, which is what I normally use, but it's fine in CVS Head. I'd puzzled out the debug "comment" from your examples while fiddling with those stepper glitches, but found it didn't work with 2.14 and (sigh) forgot it. Minor quibble: It Would Be Nice If the msg and debug pop-up boxes had a title other than "AXIS error". Maybe a neutral "Message" would be easy to do? It also seems that (with Head) the "Reload Current Program" button becomes grayed out and does not track the enabled state of the File->Reload menu item. Thanks! -- Ed - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] G38.2
On Monday 30 April 2007, Chris Radek wrote: >On Mon, Apr 30, 2007 at 10:12:33AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: >> What strikes me as a rather severe limitation to this concept is the >> apparent lack of just using a logfile for the results > >See page 140 of the user manual Duh, that will teach me to read the whole thing, thanks Chris. And I have to assume the size limit for this file is whatever the filesystem can handle.. And that reads differently on the wiki copy than my about a year old printout, the error conditions in particular really don't make a lot of sense in my dead tree copy. Maybe that's why I didn't see the logfile comment, its all different now? Q: Not having done this yet so I can inspect the file, how complete is the machine state logged as? All 6 positions? -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) A soft drink turneth away company. - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] Halscope & PID Tuning
Hello, I started tuning my new system using halscope and plotting ferror, commanded position, and feedback position. Things are going well, however I can not decipher the units of the vertical scale. It shows ferror in m/div this can not be meters. Thanks Richard - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.- This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Halscope & PID Tuning
richard harris wrote: > Hello, > > I started tuning my new system using halscope and plotting ferror, > commanded position, and feedback position. Things are going well, > however I can not decipher the units of the vertical scale. It shows > ferror in m/div this can not be meters. it is milli * user units, so if you are set to metric, it should be micro-meters, I think, since the user units are already mm. Jon - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Probing
Chris Radek schrieb:
> Hi Sven, I've added this scheme to the emc2 cvs trunk. I can't test
> it right now but maybe I can set up something one of these days.
Cool thanks.
It will probably take another week or two until I have a controller for
my machine that EMC2 could work with. And probably another week or two
until I figured out how I need to set up EMC2 to control my machine.
> G43 with an H index -1 is now a "transient" tool whose offsets are
> specified on the G43 line. The length offset is specified with the K
> word (and X offset with I word for lathes).
>
> So G43 H-1 K0.5 would do the same thing as G43 H3 if tool 3 has a
> length of 0.5 in the tool table.
>
> Like I described above I think this will let you use probing to
> measure and set up length compensation for a newly inserted tool in a
> fairly straightforward way.
>
> (Since H-1 was previously disallowed, this will not break any
> existing programs.)
Hmm, looks useful, especially if I can call a subroutine upon each tool
change. Speaking of subroutines:
What I would find highly useful would be if emc2 provided
1) Access (read&write) to the tool lenghts in the tool table
2) Access to the currently selected tool identifier
(read-only, use T-word to change it)
2) Access (read&write-once) to the currently set reference tool index.
3) (optional, though ideally available): A way to define that
subroutine X (a G-Code program) be called on every tool change.
With that, I could define a subroutine which does the following (sorry,
don't know the G-Codes right now, not even wether the conditionals are
available, so I'm using C-like pseudo-code):
idx=cur_ref_tool_idx;
if ( idx==0 ) {
cur_ref_tool_idx=cur_tool;
}
if ( tool_length[cur_tool] == 0 || always_reprobe ) {
execute("G00 Z0");
execute("G00 X probe_pos[X] Y probe_pos[y]");
tmp_length = result_of(probe_length);
if ( check_tool_lengths
&& ( tmp_length!=tool_length[cur_tool] ) )
{
abort("Tool length inconsistent for tool $curtool");
}
tool_length[cur_tool]
}
execute("G43 H-1 K tool_length[cur_tool]-tool_length[cur_ref_tool]");
return;
Or in other words: A routing which checks wether a reference tool is
already set. If not, use the current tool index to set it. If the
current tool length is 0 (no previously set), set it to the value
returned from probing at position probe_pos (note: We have a rather
large (regarding our tool sizes), completely even area where the tool
can hit for the probing. Therefor the actual size and shape of the tool
are of minor interest to me regarding this probing.) Finally: set
effective tool length offset to the difference of recorded "lengths" of
the reference tool and the current tool (which might be the same and the
"formula" might need a different prefix - i.e. tool_length[cur_ref_tool]
- tool_length[cur_tool]).
Stuart Stevenson wrote about a machine that verifies tool lengths to
mitigate the posibility of broken tools or wrong tools. This would be
achieved with the above subroutine if always_reprobe and
check_tool_lengths are both true. Machines with no tool changers would
set always_reprobe to true and check_tool_length to false. Machines with
tool changers could set both to false and still automatically populate
the tool table with determined tool lengths.
Geeze, would be great if this could be implemented.
Of course, it would be even greater if it was directly available inside
EMC2 with no special requirements in the g-code except for the usual
"M06 Tx" to select tool x.
BTW: Can I tell EMC2 to automatically go to a specified position on M06
execution so that I could change the tool manually, waiting for
confirmation from me? I might have overlooked it, but I couldn't find
this information in the docs (yet).
regards,
Sven
-
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Re: [Emc-users] Probing
On Mon, Apr 30, 2007 at 07:15:33PM +0200, Sven Mueller wrote: > BTW: Can I tell EMC2 to automatically go to a specified position on M06 > execution so that I could change the tool manually, waiting for > confirmation from me? I might have overlooked it, but I couldn't find > this information in the docs (yet). Yes. Hidden in the documentation for the AXIS gui is documentation for the program "hal_manualtoolchange". The hal script configs/sim/axis_manualtoolchanges shows how to use it. The tool change position is still programmed as described in the Basic Configuration section, [EMCIO]TOOL_CHANGE_POSITION. Jeff - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Halscope & PID Tuning
Jon Elson wrote: > richard harris wrote: >> Hello, >> >> I started tuning my new system using halscope and plotting ferror, >> commanded position, and feedback position. Things are going well, >> however I can not decipher the units of the vertical scale. It shows >> ferror in m/div this can not be meters. > it is milli * user units, so if you are set to metric, it > should be micro-meters, I think, since the user units are > already mm. That is right... the units display in halscope only shows the "prefix", like 'm' for milli, K for kilo, etc. Halscope doesn't know what the actual physical units are. If you are using inches, then 'm' means milli-inches (0.001"), 'u' means microinches, etc. If your machine units are millimeters, then 'm' is microns. Unlike a real oscilliscope, halscope is looking at floating point variables, which have a huge range. A regular scope can be adjusted from perhaps 1mV per div to 100V per div. Halscope can go from pico-units per div to giga-units per div Regards, John Kasunich - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Unexpected realtime delay
On Sun, 2007-04-29 at 21:05 +0800, 杜少华 wrote: > Every time I start the emc2,it reports that unexpected time delay. I has this problem as well & fixed it by replacing the video card. The system was a 400MHz P2 on an Intel Seattle2 motherboard with an AGP bus S3 VGA card. I replaced the S3 card with a PNY brand Nvidia MX200 card & the problem disappeared. I realized what the problem was when I switched from a CRT monitor to a LCD. I observed green streaky artifacts on the display every time I moved the mouse. I came to suspect that the card was tying up the bus for unusually long periods if mouse interrupts were causing problems with screen redraws. I might just bring this card to fest... Matt - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] G38.2
Gene, I think what you want to do now is generate a g-code file that moves to all the points on the grid of the region that you want to scan. The fragment below shows raster in y direction at .1 unit intervals, from a rapid height of .5 in z (PROBEOPEN probefile.txt) G00 X 1.0 Y 1.0 Z 0.5 G38.2 X 1.0 Y 1.0 Z 0.0 G00 X 1.0 Y 1.1 Z 0.5 G38.2 X 1.0 Y 1.1 Z 0.0 G00 X 1.0 Y 1.2 Z 0.5 G38.2 X 1.0 Y 1.2 Z 0.0 . . . (PROBECLOSE) Maybe you can use a spreadsheet to assist in creating the above. I suspect the probe file just stores the coordinates for X Y Z A B C at each probe point. You will have hand edit the probe file in order to get usable g-code that you can feed back into EMC. - Original Message - From: "Gene Heskett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] G38.2 > On Monday 30 April 2007, Chris Radek wrote: >>On Mon, Apr 30, 2007 at 10:12:33AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote: >>> What strikes me as a rather severe limitation to this concept is the >>> apparent lack of just using a logfile for the results >> >>See page 140 of the user manual > > Duh, that will teach me to read the whole thing, thanks Chris. And I have > to > assume the size limit for this file is whatever the filesystem can > handle.. > > And that reads differently on the wiki copy than my about a year old > printout, > the error conditions in particular really don't make a lot of sense in my > dead tree copy. Maybe that's why I didn't see the logfile comment, its > all > different now? > > Q: Not having done this yet so I can inspect the file, how complete is > the > machine state logged as? All 6 positions? > - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] G38.2
On Monday 30 April 2007, Dean Hedin wrote: >Gene, I think what you want to do now is generate a g-code file >that moves to all the points on the grid of the region that you want to >scan. > >The fragment below shows raster in y direction at .1 unit intervals, from a >rapid height of .5 in z > >(PROBEOPEN probefile.txt) >G00 X 1.0 Y 1.0 Z 0.5 >G38.2 X 1.0 Y 1.0 Z 0.0 >G00 X 1.0 Y 1.1 Z 0.5 >G38.2 X 1.0 Y 1.1 Z 0.0 >G00 X 1.0 Y 1.2 Z 0.5 >G38.2 X 1.0 Y 1.2 Z 0.0 >. >. >. >(PROBECLOSE) > A great place to practice coding a subroutine I believe. :-) >Maybe you can use a spreadsheet to assist in creating the above. > That is of course assuming that what I want to carve is laid out on the same grid, which of course it will not be since bezier etc curves can go anyplace in between. So I'll need to find the 4 points that surround the instant position of the bit as it follows the curves, then do a straight line interpretation between the two diagonals, proportional to the step size, and massage the z data to place the bit at that depth when it has reached the commanded position. >I suspect the probe file just stores the coordinates for X Y Z A B C >at each probe point. > >You will have hand edit the probe file in order to get usable g-code that >you can feed back into EMC. Even that would be a large undertaking due to the sheer size of the probe file. And something that would be better done, and with fewer mistakes, with a filter program of some sort. If I have to write it, well, my C is a little rusty but I think I could come up with something that works eventually. -- Cheers, Gene "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Go on, EMOTE! I was RAISED on thought balloons!! - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] G38.2
> And something that would be better done, and with fewer mistakes, with > a filter program of some sort. If I have to write it, well, my C is a > little > rusty but I think I could come up with something that works eventually. This is basically what my emcprobe program did in EMC1: You told it a region specified as a range in XY, a safe Z, and resolution in an .ini file You then put a probe tip on to match what ever profile you wanted to machine with. The utility then ran by directly talking to EMC through NML and scanned the surface. It's output was a gcode file that you could then play back into EMC to machine the surface. The utility could handle multiple region definitions. For example you could scan one area at a fine resolution, and another area at a course resolution. Another tip. I would use modeling clay to build up smooth approaches to the edge of the model. I would then probe a square XY region slightly larger than the model. I wouldn't bother trying to scan along curves in the XY plane, since ultimately I would be machining with a ball mill and would end up with a scalloped surface. You kind of want the scallops at a regular interval. Makes it easy to final finish with a file. This is pretty much how the professional CAM programs do it. FYI, It took several hours to probe a 4"x5" surface even at .1 grid resolution. Because of this it is important to make sure the probe does'nt bind and the wires to the probe are carefuly mounted out of the way, etc.. I'd like to get this utility working with EMC2. However I can't afford the risk of upgrading my machine to EMC2 right now (too many active projects in the pipeline). - This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
