Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Jason Burton]

Sorry to revive this with an unrelated question, but all messages I send
direct to the list seem to be quarantined.

What do I need to do differently?

Sincerely,
Jason Burton
 On Aug 17, 2012 4:14 AM, "andy pugh"  wrote:

> On 16 August 2012 20:00, Jason Burton  wrote:
> > Looking for a good bang for the buck rig with either digital capture that
> > can be downloaded for analysis, or even old school one-shot hold memory
> > (and i'll take a photo of the screen).
>
> I have a middle-aged Tek scope with both digital storage and analog.
> It also has direct output to an X-Y plotter. (GPIB too)
> It is rather small, though not in the pocket class. (A little smaller
> than A4 paper footprint). It doesn't look like they were ever very
> common, and I paid £100 for it, which is probably a very small
> fraction of what all that cutting-edge tech cost in 1985.
>
> It's a Sony / Tektronix 336 and searching the internets seems to
> indicate that I paid less than the going rate.
> http://www.komu.jp/336.html shows decent pictures of one.
>
> --
> atp
> If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
> http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[andy pugh]

On 16 August 2012 20:00, Jason Burton  wrote:
> Looking for a good bang for the buck rig with either digital capture that
> can be downloaded for analysis, or even old school one-shot hold memory
> (and i'll take a photo of the screen).

I have a middle-aged Tek scope with both digital storage and analog.
It also has direct output to an X-Y plotter. (GPIB too)
It is rather small, though not in the pocket class. (A little smaller
than A4 paper footprint). It doesn't look like they were ever very
common, and I paid £100 for it, which is probably a very small
fraction of what all that cutting-edge tech cost in 1985.

It's a Sony / Tektronix 336 and searching the internets seems to
indicate that I paid less than the going rate.
http://www.komu.jp/336.html shows decent pictures of one.

-- 
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 16 August 2012 19:45:08 Jason Burton did opine:

> On Aug 14, 2012 10:16 PM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
> > On Tuesday 14 August 2012 23:09:35 Jason Burton did opine:
> > > On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
> > > > > Ebay auction #160861790127
> > > > > 
> > > > > Mark
> > > > 
> > > > A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's. 
> > > > For
> > > 
> > > what
> > > 
> > > > I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable
> > > > and its fully isolated.
> > > > 
> > > > Cheers, Gene
> > > > --
> > > > "There are four boxes...
> > > 
> > > How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
> > 
> > About the only thing I haven't mastered is getting the sweep trigger
> > set
> 
> so
> 
> > I can see the actual trigger.  Other than that, and a miss-match
> > between the probe and its frequency comp that distorts a square wave
> > somewhat, it Just Works(TM).
> > 
> > I didn't expect it to match my Hitachi V-1065, but at 5% of the cost
> > ...
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> > --
> 
> I have a 100 mhz HP scope for the bench, but it takes a bit to warm up
> (if you follow the manual's guideline). That and no one-shot event
> capture have me looking for another scope.
> 
> Doing some very short transient pulse measurements. Good news is they
> are audio frequency range so no great strain on most worth-anything
> scopes.
> 
> Looking for a good bang for the buck rig with either digital capture
> that can be downloaded for analysis, or even old school one-shot hold
> memory (and i'll take a photo of the screen).
> 
> I left off looking at the Tek 2200 series with memory added when the
> Nanos came around.
> 
> Think it might be a good fit?
> 
No clue Jason.  The only tek 22xx I ever had any experience with was new in 
'84, a pure analog 100 mhz dual trace 2235, had a shite crt that tek would 
not replace in warranty, so I eventually ordered the crt ($550 at the time) 
and put it in myself.  Generally it worked well but as usual with a tek, 
the input attenuators go way out of calibration and developed severe 
frequency response errors, really bad by '93 or so, and by then tek had 
done that same thing they always do 5 years after the last one rolls off 
the line, all the spares went to the landfill.  I sent it to the 
transmitter site. AFAIK, it still works, but if I saw a square wave being 
displayed as a square wave, I'd go get my glasses fixed.  My own Hitachi 
V-1065 works well yet today and it is pushing 30 years old.  The timebase 
is out of calibration about 3 or 4%, but voltages are still dead on, as are 
the displays of a square wave.  Best $1200 I ever spent for any piece of 
test equipment, ever.  If something should destroy it, I'd buy another one 
just like it tomorrow.

The only Hitachi scope I wouldn't touch is the V-1085, the trigger circuit 
doesn't.

> Jason
> 
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Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 2:00 PM, Jason Burton  wrote:
>>
>
> I have a 100 mhz HP scope for the bench, but it takes a bit to warm up (if
> you follow the manual's guideline). That and no one-shot event capture have
> me looking for another scope.
>
> Doing some very short transient pulse measurements. Good news is they are
> audio frequency range so no great strain on most worth-anything scopes.
>
> Looking for a good bang for the buck rig with either digital capture that
> can be downloaded for analysis, or even old school one-shot hold memory
> (and i'll take a photo of the screen).
>
> I left off looking at the Tek 2200 series with memory added when the Nanos
> came around.
>
> Think it might be a good fit?
>
> Jason

If you don't mind another bench size scope, you might consider one of
the Tek 7000 mainframe series.  I've got a 7623 mainframe, 100 MHz,
that's a storage scope.  I don't use the storage function often, but
when I need it, it comes in really handy.  And with certain Time Base
plugins, like the 7B92A, you can squeak out almost 500 Mhz from it.

If you want something a little smaller, you might consider the Tek
TM500 series mainframe, with a SC503 storage scope.  It's only 10 MHz,
but that's plenty good enough for the audio frequency range.

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Kenneth Lerman]

On 8/16/2012 2:00 PM, Jason Burton wrote:
> On Aug 14, 2012 10:16 PM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
>> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 23:09:35 Jason Burton did opine:
>>
>>> On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
 On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
> Ebay auction #160861790127
>
> Mark
 A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For
>>> what
>>>
 I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and
 its fully isolated.

 Cheers, Gene
 --
 "There are four boxes...
>>> How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
>>>
>> About the only thing I haven't mastered is getting the sweep trigger set
> so
>> I can see the actual trigger.  Other than that, and a miss-match between
>> the probe and its frequency comp that distorts a square wave somewhat, it
>> Just Works(TM).
>>
>> I didn't expect it to match my Hitachi V-1065, but at 5% of the cost ...
>>
>> Cheers, Gene
>> --
>>
> I have a 100 mhz HP scope for the bench, but it takes a bit to warm up (if
> you follow the manual's guideline). That and no one-shot event capture have
> me looking for another scope.
>
> Doing some very short transient pulse measurements. Good news is they are
> audio frequency range so no great strain on most worth-anything scopes.
>
> Looking for a good bang for the buck rig with either digital capture that
> can be downloaded for analysis, or even old school one-shot hold memory
> (and i'll take a photo of the screen).
>
> I left off looking at the Tek 2200 series with memory added when the Nanos
> came around.
>
> Think it might be a good fit?
>
> Jason
> --
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See: http://www.saelig.com/PSBE100/PSPC017.htm for what appears to be a 
pretty good deal. $399 includes shipping.

Ken


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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Jason Burton]

On Aug 14, 2012 10:16 PM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
>
> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 23:09:35 Jason Burton did opine:
>
> > On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
> > > On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
> > > > Ebay auction #160861790127
> > > >
> > > > Mark
> > >
> > > A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For
> >
> > what
> >
> > > I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and
> > > its fully isolated.
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene
> > > --
> > > "There are four boxes...
> >
> > How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
> >
> About the only thing I haven't mastered is getting the sweep trigger set
so
> I can see the actual trigger.  Other than that, and a miss-match between
> the probe and its frequency comp that distorts a square wave somewhat, it
> Just Works(TM).
>
> I didn't expect it to match my Hitachi V-1065, but at 5% of the cost ...
>
> Cheers, Gene
> --
>

I have a 100 mhz HP scope for the bench, but it takes a bit to warm up (if
you follow the manual's guideline). That and no one-shot event capture have
me looking for another scope.

Doing some very short transient pulse measurements. Good news is they are
audio frequency range so no great strain on most worth-anything scopes.

Looking for a good bang for the buck rig with either digital capture that
can be downloaded for analysis, or even old school one-shot hold memory
(and i'll take a photo of the screen).

I left off looking at the Tek 2200 series with memory added when the Nanos
came around.

Think it might be a good fit?

Jason
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Ray Mitchell]

GPIB also had a ridiculously short cable length (and expensive to boot).


--J. Ray Mitchell Jr.
jrmitche...@gmail.com
(818)324-7573


A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of truth.
 - Einstein





On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:49 AM, Mark Wendt  wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 7:42 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> >>
> >> The TM500 series do get warm, but I haven't noticed my TM504 get
> >> uncomfortably hot to the touch fully loaded.  The TM5000 series did
> >> add a fan to the case, though the 5000 series plugins are a lot more
> >> complex.  They come with a GPIB plug on each plugin and a GPIB plug on
> >> the back of the mainframe.
> >>
> >> Mark
> >>
> > GPIB might have come in handy, but did you ever read the specs? That is a
> > very power hungry interface.  Adding that to every module in the frame
> > could easily add 200+ watts of heat to get rid of.  There is a reason
> GPIB
> > didn't take over the factory floor bus, same one that eventually killed
> the
> > use of terminating resistor banks on scsi buses in favor of active terms.
> > Power budgets.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene
>
> I've never used the GPIB interface myself, but I could see a number of
> uses for it.  You can get relatively inexpensive USB-GPIB and
> Ethernet-GPIB converters online.
>
> There are also open source utilities for Unix/Linux that support GPIB:
>
> http://gpib-utils.sourceforge.net/
>
> The heat factor is probably why they added the fan to the TM5000
> series.  Since the TM500 series didn't support the GPIB interface, it
> probably was deemed not necessary.
>
> Mark
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 7:42 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>>
>> The TM500 series do get warm, but I haven't noticed my TM504 get
>> uncomfortably hot to the touch fully loaded.  The TM5000 series did
>> add a fan to the case, though the 5000 series plugins are a lot more
>> complex.  They come with a GPIB plug on each plugin and a GPIB plug on
>> the back of the mainframe.
>>
>> Mark
>>
> GPIB might have come in handy, but did you ever read the specs? That is a
> very power hungry interface.  Adding that to every module in the frame
> could easily add 200+ watts of heat to get rid of.  There is a reason GPIB
> didn't take over the factory floor bus, same one that eventually killed the
> use of terminating resistor banks on scsi buses in favor of active terms.
> Power budgets.
>
> Cheers, Gene

I've never used the GPIB interface myself, but I could see a number of
uses for it.  You can get relatively inexpensive USB-GPIB and
Ethernet-GPIB converters online.

There are also open source utilities for Unix/Linux that support GPIB:

http://gpib-utils.sourceforge.net/

The heat factor is probably why they added the fan to the TM5000
series.  Since the TM500 series didn't support the GPIB interface, it
probably was deemed not necessary.

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 16 August 2012 07:30:40 Mark Wendt did opine:

> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 6:48 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > On Thursday 16 August 2012 06:44:58 Mark Wendt did opine:
> >> Find yourself a Tektronix TM502 and pop an SC504 scope into it.
> >> 
> >> Mark
> > 
> > I saw one of those at the NAB show a decade or so back.  Tek left one
> > thing out, a howling big cooling fan, it ran very uncomfortably hot
> > to the touch.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> The TM500 series do get warm, but I haven't noticed my TM504 get
> uncomfortably hot to the touch fully loaded.  The TM5000 series did
> add a fan to the case, though the 5000 series plugins are a lot more
> complex.  They come with a GPIB plug on each plugin and a GPIB plug on
> the back of the mainframe.
> 
> Mark
> 
GPIB might have come in handy, but did you ever read the specs? That is a 
very power hungry interface.  Adding that to every module in the frame 
could easily add 200+ watts of heat to get rid of.  There is a reason GPIB 
didn't take over the factory floor bus, same one that eventually killed the 
use of terminating resistor banks on scsi buses in favor of active terms.  
Power budgets. 

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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My web page:  is up!
For those who like this sort of thing, this is the sort of thing they like.
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 6:48 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> On Thursday 16 August 2012 06:44:58 Mark Wendt did opine:
>
>> Find yourself a Tektronix TM502 and pop an SC504 scope into it.
>>
>> Mark
>>
> I saw one of those at the NAB show a decade or so back.  Tek left one thing
> out, a howling big cooling fan, it ran very uncomfortably hot to the touch.
>
> Cheers, Gene

The TM500 series do get warm, but I haven't noticed my TM504 get
uncomfortably hot to the touch fully loaded.  The TM5000 series did
add a fan to the case, though the 5000 series plugins are a lot more
complex.  They come with a GPIB plug on each plugin and a GPIB plug on
the back of the mainframe.

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 16 August 2012 06:44:58 Mark Wendt did opine:

> Find yourself a Tektronix TM502 and pop an SC504 scope into it.
> 
> Mark
>
I saw one of those at the NAB show a decade or so back.  Tek left one thing 
out, a howling big cooling fan, it ran very uncomfortably hot to the touch.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular.
-- Adlai Stevenson

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

Find yourself a Tektronix TM502 and pop an SC504 scope into it.

Mark

On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 5:09 PM, Peter Loron  wrote:
> The Nano is a decent little scope. Very handy and can be easily dropped in 
> your gear bag or used on your bench as an extra scope to supplement your 
> bench unit.
>
> Far better than no scope, although I would recommend having something bigger 
> if possible. I've also got one of the DS1052E scopes and it is pretty good 
> for the money. It's also quite portable, compared to my old boatanchor scopes.
>
> -Pete

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Fox Mulder]

I also got the DS1052E and for the very low price (~280€ without vat) it
has quite much features. The software hack to 100 MHz is also very nice. :)

Ciao,
 Rainer

Am 15.08.2012 23:09, schrieb Peter Loron:
> The Nano is a decent little scope. Very handy and can be easily dropped in 
> your gear bag or used on your bench as an extra scope to supplement your 
> bench unit. 
> 
> Far better than no scope, although I would recommend having something bigger 
> if possible. I've also got one of the DS1052E scopes and it is pretty good 
> for the money. It's also quite portable, compared to my old boatanchor scopes.
> 
> -Pete
>  
> On Aug 14, 2012, at 8:12 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> 
>> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 23:09:35 Jason Burton did opine:
>>
>>> On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
 On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
> Ebay auction #160861790127
>
> Mark

 A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For
>>>
>>> what
>>>
 I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and
 its fully isolated.

 Cheers, Gene
 --
 "There are four boxes...
>>>
>>> How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
>>>
>> About the only thing I haven't mastered is getting the sweep trigger set so 
>> I can see the actual trigger.  Other than that, and a miss-match between 
>> the probe and its frequency comp that distorts a square wave somewhat, it 
>> Just Works(TM).
>>
>> I didn't expect it to match my Hitachi V-1065, but at 5% of the cost ...
>>
>> Cheers, Gene
>> -- 
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>> My web page:  is up!
>> The less a statesman amounts to, the more he loves the flag.
>>  -- Kin Hubbard
>>
>> --
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Peter Loron]

The Nano is a decent little scope. Very handy and can be easily dropped in your 
gear bag or used on your bench as an extra scope to supplement your bench unit. 

Far better than no scope, although I would recommend having something bigger if 
possible. I've also got one of the DS1052E scopes and it is pretty good for the 
money. It's also quite portable, compared to my old boatanchor scopes.

-Pete
 
On Aug 14, 2012, at 8:12 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 23:09:35 Jason Burton did opine:
> 
>> On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
>>> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
 Ebay auction #160861790127
 
 Mark
>>> 
>>> A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For
>> 
>> what
>> 
>>> I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and
>>> its fully isolated.
>>> 
>>> Cheers, Gene
>>> --
>>> "There are four boxes...
>> 
>> How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
>> 
> About the only thing I haven't mastered is getting the sweep trigger set so 
> I can see the actual trigger.  Other than that, and a miss-match between 
> the probe and its frequency comp that distorts a square wave somewhat, it 
> Just Works(TM).
> 
> I didn't expect it to match my Hitachi V-1065, but at 5% of the cost ...
> 
> Cheers, Gene
> -- 
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> My web page:  is up!
> The less a statesman amounts to, the more he loves the flag.
>   -- Kin Hubbard
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 5:27 PM, Jason Burton  wrote:
>
> How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
>
> Jason

I went the other way from Gene.  I have a Tek 7623 with a bunch of
plugins, and a TM504 with calibration plugins, power supply plugins,
two SC504 scope plugins, an SC503 scope plugin and an SC502 scope
plugin.

One can never have too many scopes...

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Gene Heskett]

On Tuesday 14 August 2012 23:09:35 Jason Burton did opine:

> On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
> > On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
> > > Ebay auction #160861790127
> > > 
> > > Mark
> > 
> > A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For
> 
> what
> 
> > I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and
> > its fully isolated.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> > --
> > "There are four boxes...
> 
> How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.
> 
About the only thing I haven't mastered is getting the sweep trigger set so 
I can see the actual trigger.  Other than that, and a miss-match between 
the probe and its frequency comp that distorts a square wave somewhat, it 
Just Works(TM).

I didn't expect it to match my Hitachi V-1065, but at 5% of the cost ...

Cheers, Gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page:  is up!
The less a statesman amounts to, the more he loves the flag.
-- Kin Hubbard

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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Jason Burton]

On Aug 14, 2012 9:08 AM, "Gene Heskett"  wrote:
>
> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
>
> > Ebay auction #160861790127
> >
> > Mark
>
> A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For
what
> I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and its
> fully isolated.
>
> Cheers, Gene
> --
> "There are four boxes...

How do you like the DSO Nano? I've been eyeing them for a while.

Jason
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

Yeah, but it is a Fluke.  It's $2900 retail new.  ;-)

Mark

On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 10:03 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:
>
>> Ebay auction #160861790127
>>
>> Mark
>
> A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For what
> I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and its
> fully isolated.
>
> Cheers, Gene
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> My web page:  is up!
> Have the courage to take your own thoughts seriously, for they will shape
> you.
> -- Albert Einstein
>
> --
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
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Re: [Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Gene Heskett]

On Tuesday 14 August 2012 10:00:30 Mark Wendt did opine:

> Ebay auction #160861790127
> 
> Mark
 
A bit rich ($330) for my budget.  I bought one of the DSO NANO's.  For what 
I want to use it for its adequate.  Unplug the usb charging cable and its 
fully isolated.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page:  is up!
Have the courage to take your own thoughts seriously, for they will shape 
you.
-- Albert Einstein

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[Emc-users] Hey Gene! Hand held O'scope for ya.

[Mark Wendt]

Ebay auction #160861790127

Mark

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