[Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
With Evolution 3.12.10 (as well as all previous versions I'm aware of), when email is moved to another folder, be it by filter rule or manually a duplicate message appears in Trash. I believe this is only the case with IMAP mail accounts. Trying to confirm this, I copied several messages to folders "On this computer" and moved them about without the messages appearing in Trash. This inconsistent behavior suggests that the messages going to Trash are an artifact of interaction with the remote server via IMAP more so than an intentional feature. Negative effects of this cloning into trash include: 1) The end user, when auditing the contents of Trash prior to expunging may be compelled to confirm that some important and/or unread emails also reside in another location in the message store. 2) This increases the footprint and processing overhead of the message store, while adding no discernible value. 3) It is inconsistent with the operation of POP3 mail accounts and somewhat disconcerting. If it is technically impractical to alter Evolution so this does not occur, would it not be possible to flag or process these messages differently so that the end user or a mail filter can quickly and easily scan Trash and identify which mails reside there as a result of moving them to another folder? -- Best Regards, Dennis Reichel (dennis * reichel d.t net) ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
I am mostly guessing what is going on for you here, but this may be what's happening: Not all IMAP servers support the MOVE operation (RFC 6851). In that case, when moving a message evolution has no alternative than COPYing the message to the new folder and deleting the old one. It's possible that your IMAP server implements a Trash folder containing all messages marked for deletion but not expunged yet. That would explain why moving a message makes a copy appear on Trash. IMHO the best solution would be to update the IMAP server to support MOVE, so that COPY+DELETE isn't needed. Do you happen to know which IMAP server is it? ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
On Sun, 2015-02-22 at 10:22 -0500, Dennis Reichel wrote: > With Evolution 3.12.10 (as well as all previous versions I'm aware of), > when email is moved to another folder, be it by filter rule or manually > a duplicate message appears in Trash. The short memories of the internet ... IMAP, until very recently, didn't have the concept of a "MOVE". A move operation is implemented as a "COPY" + "DELETE". Hence the fact that a message appears in the Trash. In fact "Trash" is also something that IMAP didn't (doesn't?) know about - a message is marked as "DELETED" only, and stays in the folder. The best way of seeing this is to turn off the "hide deleted messages" (or turn on the "show deleted messages" depending on your version). You will then be able to see what is happening. The Trash folder on Evolution is a virtual folder showing the messages that are marked as deleted in all the folders of the account. (Unless you've changed the defaults for the account) This has been gone over many times on this mailing list over the last 12 years I've been on it! > > I believe this is only the case with IMAP mail accounts. Trying to > confirm this, I copied several messages to folders "On this computer" > and moved them about without the messages appearing in Trash. It used to be that even internally to Evo a move was implemented as copy +delete. But that appears to have changed recently (I don't use local folders). Even for IMAP, Evo will now use the MOVE command if the server supports it (which confused me immensely the first time it happened - I *liked* the copy+delete. > > This inconsistent behavior suggests that the messages going to Trash are > an artifact of interaction with the remote server via IMAP more so than > an intentional feature. > > Negative effects of this cloning into trash include: It is NOT cloned into trash. The message is marked as deleted in the original folder and what you are seeing is a virtual folder containing references to the deleted messages. No messages are "moved" to the trash in the process. > > 1) The end user, when auditing the contents of Trash prior to expunging > may be compelled to confirm that some important and/or unread emails > also reside in another location in the message store. Make deleted messages visible, it makes things a lot clearer! > > 2) This increases the footprint and processing overhead of the message > store, while adding no discernible value. Nope, doesn't change any "processing overhead". > > 3) It is inconsistent with the operation of POP3 mail accounts and > somewhat disconcerting. IMAP and POP3 are totally different things - I would say that POP3 processing is inconsistent with IMAP operation ... Besides, the handling of internal Evolution mail stores (which is effectively what POP3 is) used to use the IMAP model, but users, apparently, didn't like it and didn't see any need for them to be mutually consistent ... > > If it is technically impractical to alter Evolution so this does not > occur, would it not be possible to flag or process these messages > differently so that the end user or a mail filter can quickly and > easily scan Trash and identify which mails reside there as a result > of moving them to another folder? Make deleted messages visible and expunge (Ctrl-E) individual folders. In the virtual trash folder add a "source" column - that will tell you where each of the deleted messages actually resides. Other than that the virtual Trash folder just displays messages marked as "DELETED" - there is no distinction between messages deleted and those deleted as a result of a copy+delete. P. ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
One of my IMAP accounts shows the mentioned behavior (when moving messages *manually* from one folder to another the messages appear also in trash), one doesn't, so probably you are right. On Sun, 2015-02-22 at 18:41 +0100, Ángel González wrote: > I am mostly guessing what is going on for you here, but this may be > what's happening: > > Not all IMAP servers support the MOVE operation (RFC 6851). > In that case, when moving a message evolution has no alternative than > COPYing the message to the new folder and deleting the old one. > It's possible that your IMAP server implements a Trash folder containing > all messages marked for deletion but not expunged yet. > > That would explain why moving a message makes a copy appear on Trash. > > IMHO the best solution would be to update the IMAP server to support > MOVE, so that COPY+DELETE isn't needed. Do you happen to know which IMAP > server is it? > ___ > evolution-list mailing list > evolution-list@gnome.org > To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
On Sun, 2015-02-22 at 18:39 +, Pete Biggs wrote: > This has been gone over many times on this mailing list over the last > 12 years I've been on it! Many, many, many times, by me and a lot of other people including you :-) poc ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
On Sun, 2015-02-22 at 10:22 -0500, Dennis Reichel wrote: > With Evolution 3.12.10 (as well as all previous versions I'm aware of), > when email is moved to another folder, be it by filter rule or manually > a duplicate message appears in Trash. https://help.gnome.org/users/evolution/stable/mail-moving-emails.html andre -- Andre Klapper | ak...@gmx.net http://blogs.gnome.org/aklapper/ ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Re: [Evolution] Mails moved to another folder by filter also end up in trash folder
Thanks Angel, Pete, Lorenz, Patrick and Andre! I'll look into the capabilities of the IMAP server to see if it can be updated to support MOVE. I was just getting a little concerned about my practices when I found myself reading mails out of the deleted items folder and neglecting to mark them read in their assigned by filter rule folders. That's a bit like eating food out of the trash, to be avoided if there are more civilized options :) Dennis On Sun, 2015-02-22 at 10:22 -0500, Dennis Reichel wrote: > With Evolution 3.12.10 (as well as all previous versions I'm aware of), > when email is moved to another folder, be it by filter rule or manually > a duplicate message appears in Trash. > > I believe this is only the case with IMAP mail accounts. Trying to > confirm this, I copied several messages to folders "On this computer" > and moved them about without the messages appearing in Trash. > > This inconsistent behavior suggests that the messages going to Trash are > an artifact of interaction with the remote server via IMAP more so than > an intentional feature. > > Negative effects of this cloning into trash include: > > 1) The end user, when auditing the contents of Trash prior to expunging > may be compelled to confirm that some important and/or unread emails > also reside in another location in the message store. > > 2) This increases the footprint and processing overhead of the message > store, while adding no discernible value. > > 3) It is inconsistent with the operation of POP3 mail accounts and > somewhat disconcerting. > > If it is technically impractical to alter Evolution so this does not > occur, would it not be possible to flag or process these messages > differently so that the end user or a mail filter can quickly and > easily scan Trash and identify which mails reside there as a result > of moving them to another folder? -- Best Regards, Dennis Reichel (dennis * reichel d.t net) ___ evolution-list mailing list evolution-list@gnome.org To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ... https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
