Re: [FairfieldLife] Bullying
This was a very interesting thread to read and included very interesting takes and perspectives by both Judy and Curtis - leaving the personal out of it, but acknowledging how the personal spurred some of the perspectives, I thought it was a good debate. I am reminded, however, that each of our realities differs, and from my own experience, I have seldom succeeded in changing anyone's viewpoint on themselves or their position. Usually, in my family at least, the "other" person descends into defensiveness and then a victim mentality...accusing me of "taking their inventory." I usually counter with..."not true, I am not sitting in judgment, simply trying to explain how your behavior is affecting me and the children and asking you to consider what I am saying." Whereby, the fallback of the "other" is to attack by rewriting reality and the details of any said exchange and accusing me of being abusive and also crazy. I appreciate the debates here, more easily held, in part, I think, because they aren't influenced by physical presence. From: Xenophaneros Anartaxius To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 6:09 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Bullying --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" wrote: > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" wrote: >>>>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" >>>>> wrote: >>> >> I checked many definitions of the term when I designed my course >> including over a dozen books on the subject. I am familiar with >> the term in detail and you are misusing it as a way to make Sal >> look bad. It also neuters an important term following your absurd >> assertion that a power differential is not key. > > This is just bluster, Curtis. In fact, you're attempting > to bully *me*. I think Curtis is just elucidating points > >>> The Merriam Webster Collegiate* Dictionary, 11th edition, >>> has this definition: >>> >>> "a blustering browbeating person; especially: one >>> habitually cruel to others who are weaker." >>> >>> "Especially" does not mean "limited to." >> >> The definition of browbeating includes "intimidation" because >> it also rests on an inequality of power to be >> meaningful. > > Are you really trying to claim one person can't intimidate > another person unless there's an inequality of power to > start with? That's just bizarre. Intimidation can *create* > an inequality of power between two people who were peers > to start with. And so, of course, can bullying. > >> "Especially" means in particular, to help distinguish this >> word's meanings from others. In other words they are >> defining the term in terms of its reliance on the other >> person being weaker. > > Nope, you're wrong, sorry. "Especially" defines a special > sense distinguished from the more general sense of the > definition that precedes it. "Especially" does not *limit* > how the word may be used to that special sense. At least > not per Merriam-Webster. It's called a "sense divider." es·pe·cial·ly adverb Used to single out one person, thing, or situation over all others - he despised them all, especially Sylvester - a new song, written especially for Jonathan To a great extent; very much - he didn't especially like dancing - sleep is especially important for growing children I think Judy got you there Curtis. I got this definition of 'bullying' from a New Zealand website: "Bullying is when someone keeps doing or saying things to have power over another person. Some of the ways they bully other people are by: calling them names, saying or writing nasty things about them, leaving them out of activities, not talking to them, threatening them, making them feel uncomfortable or scared, taking or damaging their things, hitting or kicking them, or making them do things they don't want to do." Maybe there is a difference in the way girls and women intimidate, and the way boys and men intimidate. Whether there is a perceived power differential or not, the bully thinks they have the power, that the power differential exists and the advantage is on their side. In a person to person situation, this may already be established early in childhood. Certain people are known to be weaker than others, less agressive than others, and some take advantage of that knowledge. A bully i
[FairfieldLife] Bullying
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" wrote: > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" wrote: > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: >>> >> I checked many definitions of the term when I designed my course >> including over a dozen books on the subject. I am familiar with >> the term in detail and you are misusing it as a way to make Sal >> look bad. It also neuters an important term following your absurd >> assertion that a power differential is not key. > > This is just bluster, Curtis. In fact, you're attempting > to bully *me*. I think Curtis is just elucidating points > >>> The Merriam Webster Collegiate* Dictionary, 11th edition, >>> has this definition: >>> >>> "a blustering browbeating person; especially: one >>> habitually cruel to others who are weaker." >>> >>> "Especially" does not mean "limited to." >> >> The definition of browbeating includes "intimidation" because >> it also rests on an inequality of power to be >> meaningful. > > Are you really trying to claim one person can't intimidate > another person unless there's an inequality of power to > start with? That's just bizarre. Intimidation can *create* > an inequality of power between two people who were peers > to start with. And so, of course, can bullying. > >> "Especially" means in particular, to help distinguish this >> word's meanings from others. In other words they are >> defining the term in terms of its reliance on the other >> person being weaker. > > Nope, you're wrong, sorry. "Especially" defines a special > sense distinguished from the more general sense of the > definition that precedes it. "Especially" does not *limit* > how the word may be used to that special sense. At least > not per Merriam-Webster. It's called a "sense divider." es·pe·cial·ly adverb Used to single out one person, thing, or situation over all others - he despised them all, especially Sylvester - a new song, written especially for Jonathan To a great extent; very much - he didn't especially like dancing - sleep is especially important for growing children I think Judy got you there Curtis. I got this definition of 'bullying' from a New Zealand website: "Bullying is when someone keeps doing or saying things to have power over another person. Some of the ways they bully other people are by: calling them names, saying or writing nasty things about them, leaving them out of activities, not talking to them, threatening them, making them feel uncomfortable or scared, taking or damaging their things, hitting or kicking them, or making them do things they don't want to do." Maybe there is a difference in the way girls and women intimidate, and the way boys and men intimidate. Whether there is a perceived power differential or not, the bully thinks they have the power, that the power differential exists and the advantage is on their side. In a person to person situation, this may already be established early in childhood. Certain people are known to be weaker than others, less agressive than others, and some take advantage of that knowledge. A bully is only surprised if their perception of power is in error. For example, in male oriented action movies, the protagonist is theatened by the antagonist or his henchmen. The protagonist and/or the henchment make their move and get creamed, they get their butts kicked by the protagonist. But in a school yard etc., this is much less likely, kids kind of know where they are in the heirarchy of doom. Online it is a bit more complicated because the visual, intuitive physical clues about power are much less in evidence. A number of online incidents of bullying seem to have relied on an actual physical familiarity of the people. Now here on FFL, it is less clear, though there are pictures of some of the people here. I do not think Curtis talks like a bully normally, and Judy, I think you tend to use language in a way that seems kind of like bullying, in the sense of the New Zealand definition, I think you use it to attempt to get power over others. Your are probably better at this than Curtis could be because you know meanings and syntax better. Curtis mispells words from time to time. >> But all this is bluff and bluster parsing on your part. You >> know that you were using the term to make Sal look worse than >> if she was just being sarcastic, you were implying that she >> was doing something that we all sense is unfair, bullying. > > That would make no sense at all, Curtis, since we all know > there are no power differentials on FFL. > >> Or would you be comfortable with a claim that Robin's long >> criticisms of me were an act of bullying on his part? > > Sure. Not anywhere near as nasty as Sal's bullying, though. > Or as malicious as
