[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation
"One of the things that I think has helped me most in my recapitulation of my life on the spiritual path, and in my ongoing reassessment of the value of that life, is dropping the notion of 'liberation.' " Yep, if you see the Buddha on the road, kill him. Same thing. Liberation is no more a notion or belief than the Milky Way is just a group of stars. Any notion of liberation is a trap, some fanciful dream that the ego has cooked up in order to contain the concept of liberation. Liberation doesn't have to be thought about, or seemingly resolved. It just IS.:-) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb wrote: > > One of the things that I think has helped me most in my recapitulation > of my life on the spiritual path, and in my ongoing reassessment of the > value of that life, is dropping the notion of "liberation." > > NOT in the sense of liberation from the binding effects of one's thought > and actions. I still believe that can and possibly should be achieved; > the less attached we are to the play of the inner and outer worlds on > our self, the better able we probably are to appreciate the wonder of > both worlds. > > The sense in which I have abandoned "liberation" is the way that many > spiritual trips (including Maharishi's) see things -- that once one > realizes enlightened one is liberated from the need to ever again > self-assess or self-monitor. In enlightenment, such dogma teaches, one > is completely "in tune" with God's will or the Laws Of Nature, and thus > every thought and action is "right" and wrong thought and wrong action > are no longer possible. Off the hook. Home free. No need to ever even be > concerned with the "rightness" of our thoughts and actions ever again. > > I no longer believe this. My own fleeting experiences with enlightened > states of consciousness has convinced me that they are 1) completely > subjective, and 2) without any appreciable impact on the comings and > goings of the relative world. I found it *just* as possible to fuck up > when in the throes of some passing state of mind that matched > word-for-word MMY's description of one of the "higher" states of > consciousness as I did in any lesser or "lower" state of consciousness. > My feeling is that this is a clue I should pay attention to. :-) > > Many spiritual seekers seem to view the realization of enlightenment as > synonymous with no longer having to work at life. The Big E will be for > them -- at least in their expectations -- a big Get Out Of Jail Free > card. They will incur no further negative karma because it will be > impossible for them to do so. Every thought and action they have will be > essentially perfect, because now that they're all enlightened and all, > that's just the nature of life. And they know this because someone told > them it was true, and since they assume that the person who told them > this is enlightened, it must be true. They're enlightened, after all; > *everything* they say is true. :-) > > In my imagining of How It All Works, the realization of enlightened > states of mind doesn't really change ANYTHING outside of the mind that > has realized it. It's an additive process, not one based on fundamental > changes to How It All Works. "It" continues to work exactly the same way > it always did, with the component of 24/7 subjective awareness of our > eternal nature added in to the mix. Thoughts still arise, emotions still > arise, and karma in the form of outside actions we must react to -- or > resist reacting to -- in the relative world still arise. Nothing > changes. Before enlightenment, sport wood and carry condoms; after > enlightenment, ditto. > > In my model of How It All Works, the realization of enlightenment would > not impact my need to self-assess and self-monitor in any way. I would > still have to monitor my thoughts, and assess my fleeting emotions via > mindfulness, with the constant realization in mind that I can *always* > fuck up. My hope is that if this enlightenment thang ever happens > permanently for me, this model will help to keep me from becoming as > much of an asshole behind it as some others have been. > > Holiness doth not prohibit assholiness IMO. And I base this belief on > examples we have seen of people who declared their enlightenment. Many > of these folks assumed that they now had a cosmic Get Out Of Jail Free > card in their wallets, and as a result *stopped* self-monitoring and > just assumed that everything they thought and did was perfect. My > assessment of their actions was simpler; they were fucking up. The > Supposedly Enlightened have done some WAY stupid shit along the Way, > stuff that their followers make excuses for and say that they cannot > evaluate the same way they would evaluate similar stupid shit in > themselves or in normal people because...well...they're enlightened. > > I don't buy this -- for others, or for myself. Liberation to me implies > an even greater need to self-assess and self-monit
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation
turquoiseb: > Liberation to me implies an even greater need to > self-assess and self-monitor, not a relaxation or > cessation of those efforts... > So, in your dualist POV, what exactly, would people be liberated from? The term 'liberation' implies being bound by something. If we are bound, by what means can we free ourselves? If we are free, then there would be no need for a technique of liberation. If we are free, then we are not bound to a belief in 'karma', since karma means the result of past and future actions. Are you saying that we are free, but bound to our actions? You're not making much sense, Turq. Free or bound?
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation
2BR02B ... Either way it's a moral dilemma. Don't worry though. We're bound to be free. . --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "richardwillytexwilliams" wrote: > Are you saying that we are free, but bound to our > actions? You're not making much sense, Turq. > > Free or bound? >
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "emptybill" wrote: > > > 2BR02B ... Either way it's a moral dilemma. > > Don't worry though. We're bound to be free. > > . > For the heart never lies..(! [:D] ) > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "richardwillytexwilliams" > willytex@ wrote: > > > > Are you saying that we are free, but bound to our > > actions? You're not making much sense, Turq. > > > > Free or bound? > > >
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Liberation Part II I just finished a family vacation out west. The fact that I had a cell phone allowed me to keep in incidental touch with my company and some of my customers. Without the cell phone there would have been missed opportuntites, or it might have taken the folks minding the store much longer to sort things out. Of course, my preference would be to be on vacation without interruptions of this sort, but this is not an option. So, for me having the cell phone is somewhat liberating for me. Being without a cell phone is very much the opposite. At least at this stage of things in my life. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > The word "liberation" came to mind in the last several days when I dropped my new cell phone (forced upgrade to a touch screen) and the display broke.  Because of this I can't see the time (of course I don't carry a watch), don't have the alarm that wakes me each day, and can't see the dial pad or any of the buttons that manage the menu, etc.  I was dropping my oldest off to college, when it flipped out of my hand onto the new tile flooring of the hall the parent orientation was at.  So, I was officially unplugged...and headed to the Oregon Coast, where it was sunny and and windy, with white sand beaches and horses galloping in the surf down the beach.  Right out of a movie. So much flooding and devastation and evacuation on the east coast and so much good weather at the beach on the west.  Of course, I had to stop and buy a watch with a large face so I could actually see the time.  Two full days, unplugged, without the family. >  LIBERATIONliberation is all relaxation and cessation from self-monitoring and the demands of time...I don't care what anyone says. > > --- On Sun, 8/28/11, richardwillytexwilliams willytex@... wrote: > > From: richardwillytexwilliams willytex@... > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Date: Sunday, August 28, 2011, 12:55 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > turquoiseb: > > > Liberation to me implies an even greater need to > > > self-assess and self-monitor, not a relaxation or > > > cessation of those efforts... > > > > > So, in your dualist POV, what exactly, would people > > be liberated from? The term 'liberation' implies > > being bound by something. If we are bound, by what > > means can we free ourselves? > > > > If we are free, then there would be no need for a > > technique of liberation. If we are free, then we are > > not bound to a belief in 'karma', since karma means > > the result of past and future actions. > > > > Are you saying that we are free, but bound to our > > actions? You're not making much sense, Turq. > > > > Free or bound? >
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > You have that wrong. Don't know what to say. Unplug during your vacations. Feel the freedom. LIBERATION! They will be there when you get back. It's a feeling close to bliss. Seriously. Yea, I guess you come from a corporate background, (as you've mentioned before), where that may be a little easier to do. When you are a small operation other factors may come into play. Sure I could take that approach, and let those back at work address all the issues, and yes, I'm sure things would work out in the end. But our business is such that even when one person is out, it affects the smooth operation. There are benefits to owning a business, but also drawbacks. I guess you could put this in the drawbacks category. > From: seventhray1 steve.sundur@... > Liberation Part II > I just finished a family vacation out west. The fact that I had a cell phone allowed me to keep in incidental touch with my company and some of my customers. Without the cell phone there would have been missed opportuntites, or it might have taken the folks minding the store much longer to sort things out. Of course, my preference would be to be on vacation without interruptions of this sort, but this is not an option.  So, for me having the cell phone is somewhat liberating for me. Being without a cell phone is very much the opposite. At least at this stage of things in my life.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Denise Evans: > The word "liberation" came to mind in the last > several days when I dropped my new cell phone... > Nice, but I don't think Turq was talking about the kind of 'liberation' you get from taking a vacation with no cell phone. A Buddhist like Turq would be talking about liberation from suffering and avoiding the endless round of rebirth and samsara. > If we are free, then there would be no need for a > technique of liberation. If we are free, then we are > not bound to a belief in 'karma', since karma means > the result of past and future actions. >
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Thank you for making me smile. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > Ah yes...I remember my projects were like my babies, at one point.  I nurtured them along and was always available.  I didn't go on vacation without work for about 10 years.  I was passionate about my work, and now, I can't find the drive.  It's gone.  I have to start doing more than "waiting for it to return" as I have a feeling it's not coming back in the same context. I am not passionate about my work. Yes, I have a drive to come through for my customers, but that may be a different trait altogether that expresses itself in business in that way. Or it may be a symptom of OC. In a small business of less than 10 people the owner is likely the CEO, the CFO, and COO. CEO doesn't mean much in regards to vacation. CFO can make arrangments to cover contingincies before going on vacation. It is the function of the COO that comes into play during a vacation. What makes me smile is to hear you describe aspects that I associate with corporate life - your projects, your babies. I feel none of that. I am just trying to keep my operation going. I am in a business where small doesn't usually survive. In fact my biggest competitor has fallen on hard times and recently had to sell their business. And to be totally honest, my daughter just started the ninth grade. When she graduates in four years, I hope to have different options available. I need to try to hold out until then. And that brings up a different kind of quandry. One I don't think a lot about, but of which I'm aware. And that is the notion of living in the present. These are fun and special times with the family, and I don't want to miss or hurry anything, but I can't help but have an eye out for a time when I may have a little more freedom, (and a little less pressure). > I see your point, however, about your business...at least you control a larger aspect of your livelihood and your life and your time -  that is good. > The feeling of freedom from being solo for two days and unreachable too was so great and rejuvenating - a kind of irresponsible high.  But it's not something that can be sustained for long :( Here's my fantasy: (I don't know if it is legitimate or just escapism). When possible I just want to disconnect for a week, or maybe two weeks. A wilderness sort of thing. I figure that it will produce a real shift in my awareness (new age speak I guess). I don't see it happening for many years. I could go on and on in this vein, but I'll leave it here.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Thanks for the reply. By coincidence my oldest just started his first year of college a couple weeks ago. I think he, like your daughter, is not inclined to partake in some of the more alcohol laden type college activities. But I excited for him and think he will get a lot out of the whole experience. ( and also come away with something that he would like to pursure career wise) And I have a middle son in the 10th grade. Others probably know, as mentioned it before, that my wife was 40 when we had our first, and 45 when we had the third. But yes, it is so difficult to have to handle business matters while on vacation. I try to keep it as brief as possible, and e-mail does help in that regard. But I definitely try to keep it as minimal as possible. know he will enjoy the experience--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > Ah yes...hanging on.  I did this for my older daughter who is now gratefully in college, where she was invited to a party on Day 1 where the frat boys gave the incoming freshman shots of alcohol.  She declined, walked home, and will not join a sorority.  Yeah! > I have a younger daughter who is also starting 9th grade...except that I am unemployed and am coming to the sad conclusion that I have to hang on now for another 4 years and maybe longer with her as she has serious learning disabilities and other issues and is likely not leaving the nest in the traditional way. But, we had kids, right?  Hence the responsibility.  I want to feel passion about what I do next...I want it to feel like it means something.  But, that is fantasy as well, and although I am visualizing what I want, I will take what comes my way and pray that I don't lose everything in the process of retooling.  I could deal with it, but it would be rough on the kid. > I think my point is that disconnecting helps to reinvigorate our souls..particularly if it involves a wilderness adventure that provides ample opportunity to reconnect with the planet and ourselves. I think it's required for me that I build this in, somehow.  > --- On Tue, 8/30/11, seventhray1 steve.sundur@... wrote: > > From: seventhray1 steve.sundur@... > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 7:37 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for making me smile. > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans dmevans365@ wrote: > > > > Ah yes...I remember my projects were like my babies, at one point. àI nurtured them along and was always available. àI didn't go on vacation without work for about 10 years. àI was passionate about my work, and now, I can't find the drive. àIt's gone. àI have to start doing more than "waiting for it to return" as I have a feeling it's not coming back in the same context. > I am not passionate about my work. Yes, I have a drive to come through for my customers, but that may be a different trait altogether that expresses itself in business in that way. Or it may be a symptom of OC. In a small business of less than 10 people the owner is likely the CEO, the CFO, and COO. CEO doesn't mean much in regards to vacation. CFO can make arrangments to cover contingincies before going on vacation. It is the function of the COO that comes into play during a vacation. > What makes me smile is to hear you describe aspects that I associate with corporate life - your projects, your babies. I feel none of that. I am just trying to keep my operation going. I am in a business where small doesn't usually survive. In fact my biggest competitor has fallen on hard times and recently had to sell their business. > And to be totally honest, my daughter just started the ninth grade.  When she graduates in four years, I hope to have different options available. I need to try to hold out until then. And that brings up a different kind of quandry. One I don't think a lot about, but of which I'm aware. And that is the notion of living in the present. These are fun and special times with the family, and I don't want to miss or hurry anything, but I can't help but have an eye out for a time when I may have a little more freedom, (and a little less pressure). > > I see your point, however, about your business...at least you control a larger aspect of your livelihood and your life and your time - àthat is good.à> > The feeling of freedom from being solo for two days and unreachable too was so great and rejuvenating - a kind of irresponsible high. àBut it's not something that can be sustained for long :( > Here's my fantasy: (I don't know if it is legitimate or jus
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
The word "liberation" came to mind in the last several days when I dropped my new cell phone (forced upgrade to a touch screen) and the display broke. Because of this I can't see the time (of course I don't carry a watch), don't have the alarm that wakes me each day, and can't see the dial pad or any of the buttons that manage the menu, etc. I was dropping my oldest off to college, when it flipped out of my hand onto the new tile flooring of the hall the parent orientation was at. So, I was officially unplugged...and headed to the Oregon Coast, where it was sunny and and windy, with white sand beaches and horses galloping in the surf down the beach. Right out of a movie. So much flooding and devastation and evacuation on the east coast and so much good weather at the beach on the west. Of course, I had to stop and buy a watch with a large face so I could actually see the time. Two full days, unplugged, without the family. LIBERATIONliberation is all relaxation and cessation from self-monitoring and the demands of time...I don't care what anyone says. --- On Sun, 8/28/11, richardwillytexwilliams wrote: From: richardwillytexwilliams Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, August 28, 2011, 12:55 PM turquoiseb: > Liberation to me implies an even greater need to > self-assess and self-monitor, not a relaxation or > cessation of those efforts... > So, in your dualist POV, what exactly, would people be liberated from? The term 'liberation' implies being bound by something. If we are bound, by what means can we free ourselves? If we are free, then there would be no need for a technique of liberation. If we are free, then we are not bound to a belief in 'karma', since karma means the result of past and future actions. Are you saying that we are free, but bound to our actions? You're not making much sense, Turq. Free or bound?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
You have that wrong. Don't know what to say. Unplug during your vacations. Feel the freedom. LIBERATION! They will be there when you get back. It's a feeling close to bliss. Seriously. --- On Sun, 8/28/11, seventhray1 wrote: From: seventhray1 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, August 28, 2011, 7:16 PM Liberation Part II I just finished a family vacation out west. The fact that I had a cell phone allowed me to keep in incidental touch with my company and some of my customers. Without the cell phone there would have been missed opportuntites, or it might have taken the folks minding the store much longer to sort things out. Of course, my preference would be to be on vacation without interruptions of this sort, but this is not an option. So, for me having the cell phone is somewhat liberating for me. Being without a cell phone is very much the opposite. At least at this stage of things in my life. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > The word "liberation" came to mind in the last several days when I dropped my > new cell phone (forced upgrade to a touch screen) and the display broke. >  Because of this I can't see the time (of course I don't carry a watch), > don't have the alarm that wakes me each day, and can't see the dial pad or > any of the buttons that manage the menu, etc.  I was dropping my oldest off > to college, when it flipped out of my hand onto the new tile flooring of the > hall the parent orientation was at.  So, I was officially unplugged...and > headed to the Oregon Coast, where it was sunny and and windy, with white sand > beaches and horses galloping in the surf down the beach.  Right out of a > movie. So much flooding and devastation and evacuation on the east coast and > so much good weather at the beach on the west.  Of course, I had to stop and > buy a watch with a large face so I could actually see the time.  Two full > days, unplugged, without the family. >  LIBERATIONliberation is all relaxation and cessation from > self-monitoring and the demands of time...I don't care what anyone says. > > --- On Sun, 8/28/11, richardwillytexwilliams willytex@... wrote: > > From: richardwillytexwilliams willytex@... > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of > liberation > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Date: Sunday, August 28, 2011, 12:55 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > turquoiseb: > > > Liberation to me implies an even greater need to > > > self-assess and self-monitor, not a relaxation or > > > cessation of those efforts... > > > > > So, in your dualist POV, what exactly, would people > > be liberated from? The term 'liberation' implies > > being bound by something. If we are bound, by what > > means can we free ourselves? > > > > If we are free, then there would be no need for a > > technique of liberation. If we are free, then we are > > not bound to a belief in 'karma', since karma means > > the result of past and future actions. > > > > Are you saying that we are free, but bound to our > > actions? You're not making much sense, Turq. > > > > Free or bound? >
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Ah yes...I remember my projects were like my babies, at one point. I nurtured them along and was always available. I didn't go on vacation without work for about 10 years. I was passionate about my work, and now, I can't find the drive. It's gone. I have to start doing more than "waiting for it to return" as I have a feeling it's not coming back in the same context. I see your point, however, about your business...at least you control a larger aspect of your livelihood and your life and your time - that is good. The feeling of freedom from being solo for two days and unreachable too was so great and rejuvenating - a kind of irresponsible high. But it's not something that can be sustained for long :( --- On Mon, 8/29/11, seventhray1 wrote: From: seventhray1 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, August 29, 2011, 5:06 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > You have that wrong. Don't know what to say. Unplug during your > vacations. Feel the freedom. LIBERATION! They will be there when you get > back. It's a feeling close to bliss. Seriously. Yea, I guess you come from a corporate background, (as you've mentioned before), where that may be a little easier to do. When you are a small operation other factors may come into play. Sure I could take that approach, and let those back at work address all the issues, and yes, I'm sure things would work out in the end. But our business is such that even when one person is out, it affects the smooth operation. There are benefits to owning a business, but also drawbacks. I guess you could put this in the drawbacks category. > From: seventhray1 steve.sundur@... > Liberation Part II > I just finished a family vacation out west. The fact that I had a cell > phone allowed me to keep in incidental touch with my company and some of my > customers. Without the cell phone there would have been missed > opportuntites, or it might have taken the folks minding the store much longer > to sort things out. Of course, my preference would be to be on vacation > without interruptions of this sort, but this is not an option.  So, for me > having the cell phone is somewhat liberating for me. Being without a cell > phone is very much the opposite. At least at this stage of things in my > life.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
I actually realized that I was off-topicI was just playing on the word because I was feeling so liberated...temporary...but I felt almost euphoric from the freedom of being off-line from family and friends and having 2 days alone. I have thought long and hard about the concept of karma..I have accessed the Akashic records (to help explain what could not be explained). I think it's kind of a cosmic karmic joke that we must live out our "lives" in a physical body, yet, when we die and are reborn, we can take none of the lessons with us consciously into our new "life" to assist us. What is the point? Ultimately, I have decided that I simply cannot worry about my progress as a soul through what has been and may be thousands more lifetimes in various forms. I think it is more important that I figure out how to live in this one liberated from (insert word of choice). It can all be boiled down into one thing probably"faith"...and the kind of action that disseminates from that. --- On Tue, 8/30/11, richardwillytexwilliams wrote: From: richardwillytexwilliams Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 2:10 PM Denise Evans: > The word "liberation" came to mind in the last > several days when I dropped my new cell phone... > Nice, but I don't think Turq was talking about the kind of 'liberation' you get from taking a vacation with no cell phone. A Buddhist like Turq would be talking about liberation from suffering and avoiding the endless round of rebirth and samsara. > If we are free, then there would be no need for a > technique of liberation. If we are free, then we are > not bound to a belief in 'karma', since karma means > the result of past and future actions. >
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Ah yes...hanging on. I did this for my older daughter who is now gratefully in college, where she was invited to a party on Day 1 where the frat boys gave the incoming freshman shots of alcohol. She declined, walked home, and will not join a sorority. Yeah! I have a younger daughter who is also starting 9th grade...except that I am unemployed and am coming to the sad conclusion that I have to hang on now for another 4 years and maybe longer with her as she has serious learning disabilities and other issues and is likely not leaving the nest in the traditional way. But, we had kids, right? Hence the responsibility. I want to feel passion about what I do next...I want it to feel like it means something. But, that is fantasy as well, and although I am visualizing what I want, I will take what comes my way and pray that I don't lose everything in the process of retooling. I could deal with it, but it would be rough on the kid. I think my point is that disconnecting helps to reinvigorate our souls..particularly if it involves a wilderness adventure that provides ample opportunity to reconnect with the planet and ourselves. I think it's required for me that I build this in, somehow. --- On Tue, 8/30/11, seventhray1 wrote: From: seventhray1 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 7:37 PM Thank you for making me smile. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > Ah yes...I remember my projects were like my babies, at one point.  I > nurtured them along and was always available.  I didn't go on vacation > without work for about 10 years.  I was passionate about my work, and now, I > can't find the drive.  It's gone.  I have to start doing more than "waiting > for it to return" as I have a feeling it's not coming back in the same > context. I am not passionate about my work. Yes, I have a drive to come through for my customers, but that may be a different trait altogether that expresses itself in business in that way. Or it may be a symptom of OC. In a small business of less than 10 people the owner is likely the CEO, the CFO, and COO. CEO doesn't mean much in regards to vacation. CFO can make arrangments to cover contingincies before going on vacation. It is the function of the COO that comes into play during a vacation. What makes me smile is to hear you describe aspects that I associate with corporate life - your projects, your babies. I feel none of that. I am just trying to keep my operation going. I am in a business where small doesn't usually survive. In fact my biggest competitor has fallen on hard times and recently had to sell their business. And to be totally honest, my daughter just started the ninth grade. When she graduates in four years, I hope to have different options available. I need to try to hold out until then. And that brings up a different kind of quandry. One I don't think a lot about, but of which I'm aware. And that is the notion of living in the present. These are fun and special times with the family, and I don't want to miss or hurry anything, but I can't help but have an eye out for a time when I may have a little more freedom, (and a little less pressure). > I see your point, however, about your business...at least you control a > larger aspect of your livelihood and your life and your time -  that is > good. > The feeling of freedom from being solo for two days and unreachable too was > so great and rejuvenating - a kind of irresponsible high.  But it's not > something that can be sustained for long :( Here's my fantasy: (I don't know if it is legitimate or just escapism). When possible I just want to disconnect for a week, or maybe two weeks. A wilderness sort of thing. I figure that it will produce a real shift in my awareness (new age speak I guess). I don't see it happening for many years. I could go on and on in this vein, but I'll leave it here.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world
Nice to know I am not the only one out there. I got so lucky with my first..she is nothing like me. I would have taken the shot and asked for a second. Of course, I pity myself because while I had my first at 30, I am single and financially the one. I can honestly say that I knew no one, absolutely no one that did what I did in my position in corporate america solo. I'm sure they are out there, I just didn't know them. It was my choice to have kids...which is why I believe in a woman's choice. We are, in the end (in most cases), the responsible party. I would often say to my acquaintances or friends that were married and complaining...at least you have someone to take your children to dance or make or start dinner or help in any way whatsoever with the kids, even if it isn't up to your standard. I pay through the nose for all of this..all of it. Which reminds me, it is 8:20 and I haven't started dinner. Toodle ooo. --- On Tue, 8/30/11, seventhray1 wrote: From: seventhray1 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of liberation - Not in my world To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 8:14 PM Thanks for the reply. By coincidence my oldest just started his first year of college a couple weeks ago. I think he, like your daughter, is not inclined to partake in some of the more alcohol laden type college activities. But I excited for him and think he will get a lot out of the whole experience. ( and also come away with something that he would like to pursure career wise) And I have a middle son in the 10th grade. Others probably know, as mentioned it before, that my wife was 40 when we had our first, and 45 when we had the third. But yes, it is so difficult to have to handle business matters while on vacation. I try to keep it as brief as possible, and e-mail does help in that regard. But I definitely try to keep it as minimal as possible. know he will enjoy the experience--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans wrote: > > Ah yes...hanging on.  I did this for my older daughter who is now gratefully > in college, where she was invited to a party on Day 1 where the frat boys > gave the incoming freshman shots of alcohol.  She declined, walked home, and > will not join a sorority.  Yeah! > I have a younger daughter who is also starting 9th grade...except that I am > unemployed and am coming to the sad conclusion that I have to hang on now for > another 4 years and maybe longer with her as she has serious learning > disabilities and other issues and is likely not leaving the nest in the > traditional way. But, we had kids, right?  Hence the responsibility.  I > want to feel passion about what I do next...I want it to feel like it means > something.  But, that is fantasy as well, and although I am visualizing what > I want, I will take what comes my way and pray that I don't lose everything > in the process of retooling.  I could deal with it, but it would be rough on > the kid. > I think my point is that disconnecting helps to reinvigorate our > souls..particularly if it involves a wilderness adventure that provides ample > opportunity to reconnect with the planet and ourselves. I think it's required > for me that I build this in, somehow.  > --- On Tue, 8/30/11, seventhray1 steve.sundur@... wrote: > > From: seventhray1 steve.sundur@... > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The liberation of dropping the concept of > liberation - Not in my world > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 7:37 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for making me smile. > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans dmevans365@ wrote: > > > > Ah yes...I remember my projects were like my babies, at one point.  I > > nurtured them along and was always available.  I didn't go on vacation > > without work for about 10 years.  I was passionate about my work, and > > now, I can't find the drive.  It's gone.  I have to start doing more > > than "waiting for it to return" as I have a feeling it's not coming back in > > the same context. > I am not passionate about my work. Yes, I have a drive to come through for > my customers, but that may be a different trait altogether that expresses > itself in business in that way. Or it may be a symptom of OC. In a small > business of less than 10 people the owner is likely the CEO, the CFO, and > COO. CEO doesn't mean much in regards to vacation. CFO can make > arrangments to cover contingincies before
