FESco meeting summary for 20090605
We are trying out a meeting irc bot plugin to handle meetings in a more consisent and timely manner. You can find a copy of the meeting output at: http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-05-17.00.html We would appreciate feedback on this format for meeting logs. If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings use it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search ability. If not, we will come up with something better. kevin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 11:51:42AM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > We are trying out a meeting irc bot plugin to handle meetings in a more > consisent and timely manner. > > You can find a copy of the meeting output at: > > http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-05-17.00.html > > We would appreciate feedback on this format for meeting logs. > > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings use > it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. Holy moley Kevin, this is great! -- Paul W. Frieldshttp://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
Here also is the full txt file of the meeting: 17:00:15 #startmeeting 17:00:28 #meetingtopic FESCo Meeting - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/report/9 17:00:38 nirik: you drive this meeting, I'm not sure how to operate this new-fangled thing :D 17:00:57 happy to. I was going to make that the first topic. ;) 17:01:10 * nirik thought jds2001 wasn't going to be around today. Moving done? 17:01:36 that was yesterday. 17:01:41 wait, what thing? 17:01:46 I still have boxes all around :( 17:01:51 jwb: fedbot 17:01:57 so we're not doing gobby? 17:02:00 * dgilmore is here 17:02:17 we could try each I guess. 17:02:21 well, lets go ahead and discuss which we want to do... 17:02:25 #topic ticket 158: Create new meeting summary procedure 17:02:28 fedbot 17:02:33 because i don't have gobby setup :) 17:02:49 so, this is a plugin to supybot, created by the fine debian folks. 17:03:10 it runs the meeting and produces a log and summary and such. 17:03:29 examples of the summaries? 17:03:30 nirik: i like the idea its something everyone can use and we can post all meetings logs to a common location 17:03:43 * nirik is digging up a example. 17:03:58 http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-04-16.33.html 17:04:06 this was the IRC Support sig meeting yesterday. 17:04:13 dgilmore: yeah, I would like that too. 17:04:27 we could still use both 17:04:29 currently it's running on my machine here, but we could easily add it to zodbot and get it on a fedora location. 17:04:43 so, it's all keyword based? 17:04:44 nirik, could have febot log to gobby 17:04:54 notting: yeah. 17:04:57 #commands 17:05:10 we need a #gobby 17:05:11 :) 17:05:18 nirik: is it packaged? 17:05:23 hm. it might be simpler, i'm not sure if it will end up more legible on the list/wiki 17:05:29 this does more than log, it does summary and such. 17:05:41 jds2001: not yet. I can do so. 17:05:49 notting, at this point i think we should just focus on getting something there consistently 17:05:54 notting, cleanup can happen later 17:06:04 jwb: right, but that can be done by just assigning someone :) 17:06:13 I would like all meetings to use the same format and go the same place and be searchable. ;) 17:06:13 notting: i could setup something like http://fp.o/meetings/ 17:06:22 to point to the right spot on noc1. 17:06:32 nirik: yep 17:06:42 notting, true. but robots are soo much cooler 17:06:48 we have a bunch in the wiki as well. 17:06:49 so that we dont have to put it on the wiki. 17:06:52 Meeting: space 17:07:10 jds2001: well, we'd still want them all (both before and after we change) in the same place 17:07:12 but the wiki search is... suboptimal 17:07:51 nirik: i google site:fedoraproject.org :( 17:08:13 so, I guess I think this is usable, but if we just want to assign a minutes taker, or try gobby, or whatever I am open to it if people feel its better. 17:08:43 * abadger1999 notes that we should make sure the logs get backed up. 17:08:46 perhaps ask for feedback from people who read logs after this meeting? 17:08:59 nirik: works for me 17:09:12 abadger1999: noc1 gets backed up, right? 17:09:14 * nirik nods. I backup the machine they are on here. ;) But yes, if they go to noc1 they should get backed up 17:09:20 if we add this plugin to zodbot? 17:09:43 jds2001: I don't know, thus: make sure ;-) 17:09:52 nirik: maybe take the log from this and post it on the wiki, get comments, and we can move everything together later? 17:10:29 well, not sure it would post right to the wiki. It expects to be it's own html/txt file. 17:10:37 but yes, I can ask for feedback from it. 17:10:51 it does allow logs to be posted right when the meeting is done, which is nice. 17:11:06 also links to the items in the logs, etc. 17:11:50 * nirik waits for any other votes/opinions. 17:12:05 i'm good with either 17:12:32 the bot looks good 17:12:38 i like the bot. 17:12:49 * j-rod happy w/the bot, knows nothing of gobby at all though 17:13:19 #action nirik will post the summary/logs from the meeting plugin for comment/feedback on fedora-devel. 17:13:24 ok, shall we move on? 17:14:07 #topic ticket 159: FPC report - 2009-06-02 17:14:11 .fesco 159 17:14:14 nirik: #159 (FPC report - 2009-06-02) - FESCo - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/159 17:14:30 +1 17:14:45 +1 17:14:58 +1 17:14:59 +1 17:14:59 seems reasonable to reduce the number of duplicate things in spec files... +1 here. 17:15:24 n+1 17:16:11 #agreed Approval for ticket 159 (phase out BuildRoot tag) from FPC. 17:16:32 #topic ticket 134: Approval needed - zsync needs to ship internal zlib for rsync compatibility 17:16:36 .fesco 134 17:16:42 nirik: #134 (Approval needed - zsync needs to ship internal zlib for rsync compatibility) - FESCo - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/134 17:17:01 -1, if at all technically possible 17:17:17 -1 17:17:23 -1 17:17:27 yeah, I don't want to allow an
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On 06/05/2009 10:51 AM, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > We are trying out a meeting irc bot plugin to handle meetings in a more > consisent and timely manner. > > You can find a copy of the meeting output at: > > http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-05-17.00.html > > We would appreciate feedback on this format for meeting logs. > > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings use > it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. > > kevin > Notting's #agreed note wasn't picked up by meetbot: 17:30:11 #agreed rsync should be fixed in the same manner -Toshio signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
Toshio Kuratomi (a.bad...@gmail.com) said: > Notting's #agreed note wasn't picked up by meetbot: > 17:30:11 #agreed rsync should be fixed in the same manner The bot only listens to the defined meeting chair for certain items; we'll get this fixed up for later meetings. Bill -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, 05 Jun 2009 11:30:02 -0700 Toshio Kuratomi wrote: > On 06/05/2009 10:51 AM, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > > We are trying out a meeting irc bot plugin to handle meetings in a > > more consisent and timely manner. > > > > You can find a copy of the meeting output at: > > > > http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-05-17.00.html > > > > We would appreciate feedback on this format for meeting logs. > > > > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings > > use it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. > > > > kevin > > > Notting's #agreed note wasn't picked up by meetbot: > 17:30:11 #agreed rsync should be fixed in the same manner Yes, this command is only available to the chair of the meeting. ;( We will likely just add all the voting fesco folks to the chair list for it to work. Alternately, we can make sure the chair always does those if there is an agreement. > > -Toshio > kevin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 11:51:42AM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings use > it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. We should probably try to have these transferred to the wiki, under the Meeting: namespace, with an appropriate category assigned. Perhaps the bot could be given an account that would allow that access? -- Paul W. Frieldshttp://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, 5 Jun 2009 14:56:34 -0400 "Paul W. Frields" wrote: > On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 11:51:42AM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings > > use it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. > > We should probably try to have these transferred to the wiki, under > the Meeting: namespace, with an appropriate category assigned. > Perhaps the bot could be given an account that would allow that > access? That would be great, but it currently has no ability to talk to a wiki. The upstream page at http://wiki.debian.org/MeatBot has: Wishlist: Publish to a wiki page? (I'll do it if someone gives me wiki-posting code) So, perhaps someone could contribute that. :) Currently it just writes logs/summary to a local filesystem. kevin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 01:05:06PM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > On Fri, 5 Jun 2009 14:56:34 -0400 > "Paul W. Frields" wrote: > > > On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 11:51:42AM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > > > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings > > > use it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > > > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. > > > > We should probably try to have these transferred to the wiki, under > > the Meeting: namespace, with an appropriate category assigned. > > Perhaps the bot could be given an account that would allow that > > access? > > That would be great, but it currently has no ability to talk to a wiki. > > The upstream page at http://wiki.debian.org/MeatBot has: > > Wishlist: > Publish to a wiki page? (I'll do it if someone gives me wiki-posting > code) > > So, perhaps someone could contribute that. :) > Currently it just writes logs/summary to a local filesystem. I'd like to try this (and fail badly, and then have it rewritten by someone who knows better). The main problem I see is that the thing's written in Tcl which I don't know. Maybe I could try porting it to a zodbot plugin, and then use python-mediawiki to do the auth + posting. -- Paul W. Frieldshttp://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, 5 Jun 2009 15:30:36 -0400 "Paul W. Frields" wrote: > > So, perhaps someone could contribute that. :) > > Currently it just writes logs/summary to a local filesystem. > > I'd like to try this (and fail badly, and then have it rewritten by > someone who knows better). The main problem I see is that the thing's > written in Tcl which I don't know. Maybe I could try porting it to a > zodbot plugin, and then use python-mediawiki to do the auth + posting. Oh, the link on the summary is pointing to the wrong page. The tcl thing was the old generation of plugin. The http://wiki.debian.org/MeatBot one which we are using is in python. ;) kevin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Fri, Jun 05, 2009 at 01:56:59PM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > On Fri, 5 Jun 2009 15:30:36 -0400 > "Paul W. Frields" wrote: > > > > So, perhaps someone could contribute that. :) > > > Currently it just writes logs/summary to a local filesystem. > > > > I'd like to try this (and fail badly, and then have it rewritten by > > someone who knows better). The main problem I see is that the thing's > > written in Tcl which I don't know. Maybe I could try porting it to a > > zodbot plugin, and then use python-mediawiki to do the auth + posting. > > Oh, the link on the summary is pointing to the wrong page. > The tcl thing was the old generation of plugin. > > The http://wiki.debian.org/MeatBot one which we are using is in > python. ;) Yay! -- Paul W. Frieldshttp://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
Kevin Fenzi said the following on 06/05/2009 10:51 AM Pacific Time: We are trying out a meeting irc bot plugin to handle meetings in a more consisent and timely manner. You can find a copy of the meeting output at: http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-05-17.00.html We would appreciate feedback on this format for meeting logs. If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings use it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search ability. If not, we will come up with something better. kevin A small nit, but something I find really helpful reading the logs, is giving each person a different color. John -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 05:55:43 -0700 John Poelstra wrote: > Kevin Fenzi said the following on 06/05/2009 10:51 AM Pacific Time: > > We are trying out a meeting irc bot plugin to handle meetings in a > > more consisent and timely manner. > > > > You can find a copy of the meeting output at: > > > > http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-05-17.00.html > > > > We would appreciate feedback on this format for meeting logs. > > > > If this format is acceptable, I would like to see all irc meetings > > use it, and have them all transfer to a common location with search > > ability. If not, we will come up with something better. > > > > kevin > > > > A small nit, but something I find really helpful reading the logs, is > giving each person a different color. yeah, thats a good idea. This plugin uses 'pygments' to highlight/process the output. It looks like there is already an upstream bug about the irc highlight being too generic, see: http://dev.pocoo.org/projects/pygments/ticket/341 I'll see if there can be some progress made on it, or perhaps we can get the fedora maintainer to add the patch. > > John > kevin signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
Am Freitag, 05 Juni 2009 12:21:01 schrieb Kevin Fenzi: KF> 17:28:03 so, we already have -5 to the exception for zsync KF> 17:28:28 #agreed No exception for zsync. Of course shipping internals is very very evil and I really understand the problems behind them. I'm a pessimist and I ask myself: "What is the consequence, if rsync-upstream is unwilling to drop shipping of forked zlib as internal dependency?" a) drop rsync from fedora? b) build rsync against system and lose compatibility to rsync original? c) call the dependency rsync-zlib or whatever? The zsync difficulty is that zsync tries to be compatible to rsync and needs a forked zlib, like rsync. It's on the dice, that the zlib-internal is bound with the zlib of rsync. I beg, again, for the exception of zsync, because the problem wouldn't be worsened. It's just a new child of sorrow, sitting in the front of the closed door and knows his brother with the same misfeature is in. If rsync-upstream is unwilling to drop internal zlib, I believe nothing will happened, because rsync is a centerpiece of every distribution and fedora can't afford drop this package or can't afford to be incompatible to other distributions and rsync itself. And renaming the zlib for this project will bring a flood of *-zlib and that can not be the meaning of it all. I think this is an important question. I don't want to bring trouble upon fedora project or rsync or anybody else. Additionally, I believe that there are a few applications in fedora which are using shipped internals, too. As I said it before, I don't want to start trouble, but it should be very helpful to find them and collect them in a seperate tracker. I created one with the bugnumber #504497 to get an overview, about packages/applications with duplicated libs. Please help to find them. Perhaps we can be succeed in conversion of upstream, to help all for a better cooperation and better software. Thank you! -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus dem schönen Hainzell Simon Wesp The G in GNU stands for GNU http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SimonWesp signature.asc Description: PGP signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: FESco meeting summary for 20090605
On 06/08/2009 01:06 PM, Simon Wesp wrote: > Am Freitag, 05 Juni 2009 12:21:01 schrieb Kevin Fenzi: > KF> 17:28:03 so, we already have -5 to the exception for zsync > KF> 17:28:28 #agreed No exception for zsync. > > Of course shipping internals is very very evil and I really understand the > problems behind them. > > I'm a pessimist and I ask myself: > "What is the consequence, if rsync-upstream is unwilling to drop shipping of > forked zlib as internal dependency?" > a) drop rsync from fedora? > b) build rsync against system and lose compatibility to rsync original? > c) call the dependency rsync-zlib or whatever? > > The zsync difficulty is that zsync tries to be compatible to rsync and needs > a forked zlib, like rsync. It's on the dice, that the zlib-internal is bound > with the zlib of rsync. I beg, again, for the exception of zsync, because the > problem wouldn't be worsened. This is the wrong solution to the problem. > It's just a new child of sorrow, sitting in the front of the closed door and > knows his brother with the same misfeature is in. > If rsync-upstream is unwilling to drop internal zlib, I believe nothing will > happened, because rsync is a centerpiece of every distribution and fedora > can't afford drop this package or can't afford to be incompatible to other > distributions and rsync itself. And renaming the zlib for this project will > bring a flood of *-zlib and that can not be the meaning of it all. > simo told notting that it was possible to fix this. So we need him to give some input on how he's thinking this can be done. However, we are going to fix this somehow. If don't have a clean method, we'll have to fork zlib. Robert, I still haven't heard, what happened when you asked rsync upstream about their releasing their forked zlib separately? Having a flood of zlib-* is unlikely to happen at the distribution level because the effort to maintain all the libraries is painful. It's more likely that we'll make more of an effort to work with upstreams to port their code to vanilla zlib and work with the patches to zlib that they carry to get them merged upstream and if those patches can't be merged, to get them merged into a single fork rather than multiple forks. > I think this is an important question. I don't want to bring trouble upon > fedora project or rsync or anybody else. Additionally, I believe that there > are a few applications in fedora which are using shipped internals, too. > As I said it before, I don't want to start trouble, but it should be very > helpful to find them and collect them in a seperate tracker. I created one > with the bugnumber #504497 to get an overview, about packages/applications > with duplicated libs. Please help to find them. Perhaps we can be succeed in > conversion of upstream, to help all for a better cooperation and better > software. Thank you! > Yes, please, if you know of a package that's shipping an internal version of a library, open a bug and block the tracker so we can fix it (or possibly get FESCo to issue an exception). These things should be getting caught during package review but sometimes they slip through the cracks. -Toshio signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
