Setting up Tigervnc [FAILED] ?!?
Hi; I think I have yummed every thing I need. What is the following warning telling me? ]# service vncserver start Starting VNC server: no displays configured [FAILED] And how do I fix it? I have checked the /etc/sysconfig/vncservers file. I don't see anything about a display. I assume something is looking for an X display:0 -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Setting up Tigervnc [FAILED] ?!?
On Sat, 2010-01-09 at 06:00 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: William Case wrote: Hi; I think I have yummed every thing I need. What is the following warning telling me? ]# service vncserver start Starting VNC server: no displays configured [FAILED] And how do I fix it? I have checked the /etc/sysconfig/vncservers file. I don't see anything about a display. I assume something is looking for an X display:0 It would be useful for you to tell people what you have in your vncservers file. Sorry Ed. I have tried and removed so many different combinations that I am now double thinking a simple instruction. My latest attempt: /etc/sysconfig/vncservers VNCSERVERS=1:bill VNCSERVERARGS[1]=-geometry 800x600 -nolisten tcp -localhost ]# service vncserver restart Shutting down VNC server: [ OK ] Starting VNC server: 1:bill[FAILED] ( I have tried 0 and 2, 0 gives me ]# service vncserver start Starting VNC server: 0:root A VNC server is already running as :0 [FAILED] ]# vncviewer (I get a screen asking for VNC server but no answer satisfies. Tried name/address (192.168.1.7) of other machine and get -- main:unable connect to socket: No route to host (113)) -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Setting up Tigervnc [FAILED] ?!?
Thanks Ed; On Sat, 2010-01-09 at 08:34 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: William Case wrote: On Sat, 2010-01-09 at 06:00 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: First of all Why not try something simple by dumping the VNCSERVERARGS line since it may confuse things since nolisten tcp prevents X connections to your VNC server via TCP and -localhost will prevent remote VNC clients connecting except when doing so through a secure tunnel. I have commented out VNCSERVERARGS line. It may make things simpler, but just about every site I consulted today plus the man pages suggested I needed it. That's my defence, and I'm sticking to it -- your right about making things simpler at the start but no one tells one that it isn't absolutely needed. [FAILED] ]# vncviewer (I get a screen asking for VNC server but no answer satisfies. Tried name/address (192.168.1.7) of other machine and get -- main:unable connect to socket: No route to host (113)) Don't forget that the format of vncviewer is vncviewer [options] [host][:display#] ]# vncviewer localhost:0 -- gave me a screen on display 0 -- once, then no more. From there I tried various combinations of localhost, address, and bill, and :0 :1. hostname is CASE so I tried that too. bill is user name and host alias, nada. Not surprising. Because my vncserver wasn't running. So, if you started vncserver using VNCSERVERS=1:bill and you start vncviewer on the same machine with no parameters you'd use localhost:1 ]$ service vncserver status Xvnc is stopped root]# service vncserver start Starting VNC server: 1:bill[FAILED] user]$ service vncserver start Starting VNC server: 1:bill runuser: cannot set groups: Operation not permitted [FAILED] I even restarted just to clear out the cobwebs. Remember that if you are connecting from a remote host you'll need to change your firewall settings assuming you are running a firewall. Firewall has been changed. I can have another go at it, but the error seems to be at my vncserver level first. Probably SELinux. My frustration level is getting too high for now. A good drink and a sleep and I'll try again in the morning. -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Setting up Tigervnc [FAILED] ?!? -- [SOLVED]
Thanks Ed; On Sat, 2010-01-09 at 13:04 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: William Case wrote: My frustration level is getting too high for now. A good drink and a sleep and I'll try again in the morning. But I now know what is most likely causing your problem Your user bill probably doesn't have a ~/.vnc directory with the requisite files, passwd and xstartup. So, before you can start up a service for this user you'll need to start the server as the user and complete the prompts for password So 1. Login as bill 2. Enter vncserver 3. Follow the prompts 4. Stop the server with vncserver -kill :X where X= the number presented to you in the line similar to this... New 'f12.greshko.com:1 (gnomer)' desktop is f12.greshko.com:1 (My X would be 1) 5. Now you can go ahead and configure the vncserver service. Followed your instructions and it worked like a charm. I can handle the rest. Thanks. I was just suffering from the biggest irony of computer use. Too much information and none dealing with the very first simplest steps that 'everyone' should know. I was trying to get the vnc service started first when all along the vncservice command would have started it for me. I'll spend the weekend figuring out why it worked i.e. what the various scripts and files in vncservice were doing. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: TV over the internet
Hi Tim; On Wed, 2010-01-06 at 15:26 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote: I've read lots of online postings about people who are apparently watching TV on their computers, but I haven't seen a concrete description of what to do. I'd love to see a posting from someone who has abandoned the traditional TV set in favour of the (Fedora) computer. I have a TV tuner card with my computer connected to my cable. It's great. I prefer it to having my computer connected to my TV. But... I assume you are talking about NOT cable TV, but internet TV instead. Fedora has an application called Miro in repo for just that. To read what it is all about go to http://www.getmiro.com/ . They have the best explanation of how internet TV all works. I wouldn't download it from their site. To try it out, look for Miro in the Fedora repository using yum etc. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Boot Log annoyance/nitpick re: nvidia
Hi; I keep getting this warning in my boot log. Enabling the nvidia driver: /etc/rc.d/init.d/functions: line 520: 941 Segmentation fault $@ [FAILED] It doesn't seem to affect anything; and it has been suggested that I just ignore it; but it has been there for two Fedora versions now and is getting annoying. Whose bug is it? Fedora's or rpmfusion's? -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Setting Application startup priority
Hi; How do I set/change Application's startup priority? I have three applications in my Preferences = 'Startup Applications' that are loading before Compiz et al. That means Compiz can't place those windows in the correct viewport/workspace and position when I login. Compiz does place them correctly, if I shut the three down then restart them after Compiz is loaded. Tweaking the 'Place Windows Plugin' is not likely the answer. I am used to working with Xwindows info etc. and have confirmed online that my settings are correct. In case it makes a difference, or there is some other reason why they should be started early, the three programs I want to position at startup are Firefox; Evolution and Xchat-GNOME. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: ]$ Compiz working but I am a little confused ?!?
Hi; To be honest, my family complains that I am a lot confused. On Tue, 2009-12-29 at 11:00 -0500, William Case wrote: I can add the ModulePath /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/nvidia manually. But as the advice is dated April 2009, is it out of date (i.e. for versions earlier than F12)? I added the ModulePath manually -- now GLX and Compiz work. Shouldn't this type of configuration be added by some program or package automatically? I have the nVidia Display Settings gui. Shouldn't there be a way to set this configuration through that? But my main question remains, shouldn't the GLX and extensions info be somehow added automatically? I understood that developers where trying to get rid of the use of xorg.conf and have Xwindows just read the info directly , so why would something as basic as GLX and extensions require xorg.conf? If this is a bug or a request for enhancement, who should I file it with; Fedora; rpmfusion; Xwindows? I am running a GeForce 9500 GT on a PCIe Bus and a rpmfusion nvidia driver as part of a Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU system. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Name of fedora lists - you're kidding right?
Hi; On Wed, 2009-12-30 at 22:51 +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Wed, 2009-12-30 at 13:20 -0500, Todd Zullinger wrote: IMO, the current description should be changed, but I'd prefer to not see a lengthy debate on the list about it. My 2c: The Fedora users list Geez Patrick, would I still be able to get community assistance, encouragement and advice for using Fedora? I would particularly miss the encouragement. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Name of fedora lists - you're kidding right?
Hi; On Wed, 2009-12-30 at 21:54 -0500, Tony Nelson wrote: On 09-12-30 18:27:53, Mail Lists wrote: On 12/30/2009 12:25 PM, Chris Tyler wrote: Suggestions for new text values are welcome -- but you will have to sell your proposal. I'd suggest something like: Fedora Users Too terse to guide new signups away from the developers' list. The currentname is wordy and wraps too often. Community assistance for using Fedora. Then change the name of the developers' list. Only for developers working on Fedora -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
]$ glxinfo: “Error: glXCreateContext failed”
Hi; Just to clarify things. I have the above error when I checked glxinfo after I tried Susyem = Preferences = Desktop Effects and got this warning Accelerated 3D graphics is not available Desktop effects require hardware 3D support. I googled and got the fallowing advice: The following needs to be present in the xorg.conf file: Section Files ModulePath /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/nvidia ModulePath /usr/lib64/xorg/modules EndSection My xorg.conf contains: # nvidia-xconfig: X configuration file generated by nvidia-xconfig # nvidia-xconfig: version 1.0 (mockbuild@) Sun Nov 22 21:04:19 EST 2009 # Xorg configuration created by livna-config-display Section Files ModulePath /usr/lib64/xorg/modules EndSection I can add the ModulePath /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/nvidia manually. But as the advice is dated April 2009, is it out of date (i.e. for versions earlier than F12)? Shouldn't this type of configuration be added by some program or package automatically? I have the nVidia Display Settings gui. Shouldn't there be a way to set this configuration through that? I am running a GeForce 9500 GT on a PCIe Bus and a rpmfusion nvidia driver as part of a Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU system. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Compiz -- Discussion
Hi; I just want to get some user thoughts and points on using Compiz. I tried it a couple of Fedora versions ago. It was kind of cute using the spinning cube for workspaces and wobbly windows for a short while but I soon returned to using Metacity. Now that Compiz is more mature and more people are using it, is there any advantages to trying it again. Any preferred modes etc. I do include a 'fun' desktop amongst the possible advantages. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Missing posts again ??
Thanks Patrick; On Wed, 2009-12-23 at 08:55 +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Tue, 2009-12-22 at 22:02 -0500, William Case wrote: On Tue, 2009-12-22 at 21:50 -0500, William Case wrote: Hi; ** Just now, as I was typing this at 9:41 pm EST, I received 61 fedora-list posts. Six or seven of the posts are current. The rest are marked yesterday or two days ago and include all the posts I was looking for. It doesn't make sense. It really doesn't make sense, this last post turned around and was sent back to me in 15 minutes. As well, when I checked closer, I am still missing a couple (a few) posts from Sunday and maybe Saturday. Bill, it may seem counterintuitive but it's perfectly legitimate for mail to arrive out of order. There are no guarantees, even for the ordering of messages sent between the same two addresses. I do understand how email works and how it is forwarded from site to site sometimes taking a circuitous route. I am not expecting that it should follow in exact order. However, I belong to 11 mailing lists. Granted, none of the others has as much traffic as the fedora-list but none of them ever get blocked for two or three days like the fedora-list. And the instances of blockage/delay with fedora-list seems random. I can go several months with no problem. The blockage seems to be at the fedora-list or why else would I receive a block of 61 posts, some of the posts current and some two or three days old. It seems that this weekend fedora-list had about 200 messages. I received about 100 in the normal fashion throughout the weekend (i.e. in batches of 1-7 messages), then a block of 61 and then later an additional block of 35 late yesterday. The problem with these delays is not that I have email that is so important. It is that once I develop a feeling that I cannot trust the orderly exchange of mail, I find myself continually having to check the archive to see if my post arrived or if there has been a response. Also, I don't live in a remote area where I might expect physical interruptions or primitive service conditions. Gawd knows, I pay enough monthly to my local IP to expect good service. That said, it's certainly not *usual*, so something seems to be going on, but knowing exactly what means tracing the mail's path via its headers. Take a look at the detailed header info of some delayed messages (especially the timestamps) and you'll probably be able to identify where the blockage is occurring. I tried that earlier and then the problem self-corrected. I will try again to trace the delay. Now that I have confirmation this may also be happening to other people, the effort might be worthwhile. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Missing posts again ??
Hi; I am once again not receiving some posts from the fedora-list. About half of the posts listed in the mail-list archives for this weekend have not yet (??) appeared in my Evolution's Fedora search folder. This happened several months ago for some unfathomable reason, then straightened itself out. Everything has been fine until now. What I really want to know, is there anyway to make 'fedora-list' re-send a block of emails or selected emails that are in the archives but have not yet arrived here? -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Missing posts again ??
Hi; On Tue, 2009-12-22 at 20:24 -0600, Aaron Konstam wrote: On Tue, 2009-12-22 at 11:00 -0500, William Case wrote: Hi; I am once again not receiving some posts from the fedora-list. Is it possible that you configured the list for awhile not to seed your posts back to you. No. I haven't been into my fedora-list profile for a while and it has always worked before. Besides, not only am I losing some of my own posts coming back, but I am losing responses to my posts and even one or two responses to other people's threads. However, today I have been receiving today's postings today like I normally do. ** Just now, as I was typing this at 9:41 pm EST, I received 61 fedora-list posts. Six or seven of the posts are current. The rest are marked yesterday or two days ago and include all the posts I was looking for. It doesn't make sense. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Missing posts again ??
On Tue, 2009-12-22 at 21:50 -0500, William Case wrote: Hi; ** Just now, as I was typing this at 9:41 pm EST, I received 61 fedora-list posts. Six or seven of the posts are current. The rest are marked yesterday or two days ago and include all the posts I was looking for. It doesn't make sense. It really doesn't make sense, this last post turned around and was sent back to me in 15 minutes. As well, when I checked closer, I am still missing a couple (a few) posts from Sunday and maybe Saturday. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Annoyance Re: Gnotes ?!? -- [Solved]
Hi Aaron; Thanks for the reply. My Fedora users maillist is running about a day late again so I haven't received your response yet, but read it by going directly to the archives. On Sun, 2009-12-20 at 09:40 -0500, William Case wrote: Hi; I have replaced TomBoy (which I used throughout the day) with Gnote. I want to set Gnote in my startup file so that it starts with the icon in the notification bar but the search window NOT open. I can get what I want when I start gnote from Panel Menu = Applications = Accessories but not from Startup Applications. gnote --help nor the Configuration Editor give me any options for starting without the search window automatically opening at startup. I also end up with two instances of gnote running. Locate doesn't seem to show me a *rc file or a configuration file in /home or /etc. Any suggestions ? Here is the series of events that caused the loss of the gnote applet. I am responding so that if this happens to others, they have something to try. The short answer was, I found the applet by re-booting. 1. I used Tomboy in F11. 2. I upgraded from F11 = F12. 3. Tomboy, of course, was not upgraded automatically. 4. Gnote was not included to replace it as default because F12 was not a new install. 5. I yum removed Tomboy and yum installed Gnote. 6. The Gnote icon showed up in Panel Menu under Accessories, but did not show under the applets drop down menu for Add to Panel. 7. I screwed around trying to get the Gnote launcher onto my panel. 8. I then wrote the above quoted post. 9. Between then and reading Aaron's reply I re-booted for entirely unrelated reasons. 10. After Aaron's suggestion, I looked again at Add to Panel and there the icon was. 11. I added it to my panel and everything is working fine. I hope this saves someone a bit of grief. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Annoyance Re: Gnotes ?!?
Hi; I have replaced TomBoy (which I used throughout the day) with Gnote. I want to set Gnote in my startup file so that it starts with the icon in the notification bar but the search window NOT open. I can get what I want when I start gnote from Panel Menu = Applications = Accessories but not from Startup Applications. gnote --help nor the Configuration Editor give me any options for starting without the search window automatically opening at startup. I also end up with two instances of gnote running. Locate doesn't seem to show me a *rc file or a configuration file in /home or /etc. Any suggestions ? -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Clean your CD/DVD disks -- Just a PSA reminder !!!
Hi; An old lesson re-learned for the umpteenth time. Public Service Announcement --- Last week I upgraded the MY machine to F12 with preupgrade etc. No problem. This weekend I set out to install from the Fedora 12 LiveCD on to two other older machines I have here. On the first machine everything worked the way it should. On the second machine nothing would work right. I won't embarrass myself further by listing all of normal and dumb things I tried over eight hours to get the LiveCD working and installing. I took a break and had a nice dinner then came back to machine #2. Just on the off-chance I cleaned the LiveCD disk -- and bingo everything worked. It turns out CD drive on machine #1 was not sensitive to gunk or smudges on the CD. Machine #2's CD drive was. No need for a reply. I just thought I might pass on a useful reminder about checking your disks first when in the throws of frustration while using disks that should work but won't. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Help: No internet connection
Hi Simon; On Mon, 2009-12-14 at 23:27 +0100, Simon Schneebeli wrote: On 12/14/2009 11:02 PM, R. G. Newbury wrote: Simon wrote: I have come to this thread late and only given it a cursory read. My knowledge of NetworkMangager is limited. However, in a response to my post Re: Fedora 12 -- A great new version !, Dec 13, Linuxguy123 makes the passing remark I didn't have video or a network connection at first boot. Somehow DHCP was disabled for eth0. I fixed that, ran yum update and pretty much everything is golden. He doesn't say much further about what he did exactly to fix it. But could your problem be the same as his Somehow DHCP was disabled for eth0. Of course, feel free to ignore. As I said -- late and little. -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Fedora 12 -- A great new version !
Hi; Just thought I would say I really really like Fedora 12. It feels like a Christmas gift. I upgraded from F11 this morning with no difficulties -- worked like a charm. Everything looks and feels a little cleaner and a little tighter. The upgrading process (which I couldn't get to work for me in F11) found the upgrades for all my applications except one small minor accessory. I had hoped the cx23885 driver for v4l2 had been fixed to handle analog cable TV, but I guess not. However, that's an ongoing problem not related to the upgrade per se. I for one am very pleased. If any of the maintainers are reading this list, congratulations! -- Regards Bill Fedora 12, Gnome 2.28 Evo.2.28, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
LBA formatting question ?!?
Hi; Not a crisis -- I am just futzing about looking at the hardware on my machine using command line commands. Is there a way to confirm my hard disks have been formatted with an LBA (logical block accessing) scheme rather than CHS? Actually I am pretty sure they have been. I was just wondering how I could get a look-see for future reference. root]# lshw shows they have extended partitions -- but I was wondering if there was some other command that definitively specified LBA, CHS, or whatever else? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Compiz plugins + OT keyboard layouts ?!?
Hi; Although the subject of keyboard layouts is moving off topic and should be a new thread ... On Sun, 2009-12-06 at 17:20 +, Marko Vojinovic wrote: On Sunday 06 December 2009 09:45:53 Suvayu Ali wrote: On Sunday 06 December 2009 01:39 AM, Eric Tanguy wrote: How to know what key is super ? Although its usually the Windows key, you can check by running xev from the terminal. This will give you a keycode for the key, but I don't know how you can make sure that is the correct keycode. I've always found this super and meta terminology quite confusing. What keys do you press when you read press alt+meta3+F9 in some instruction manual? It's a confusion you won't get rid of -- it is far too steeped in history and nostalgia. Given that some keyboards might or might not have one or more Windows and similar keys present, there must be some table in X configuration files that maps available keyboard layout to names such as super, meta1-4, alt, ctrl and shift. The problem is where this information actually is and how to make it easily available for a newbie. In Gnome, System = Preferences = Keyboard = Layouts = Layout Options; tries to show the different keyboard options that you have. Along the way, it kind of points to what is Super key and what is a Win key etc. It is not really satisfying as a guide, but it was the simplest demonstration I could find. After so many years of using Linux, I myself am still not sure what are super and meta keys on my keyboard. I never bothered to do a serious investigation of this, but certainly, one should not be supposed to use google and read configuration files in order to find out which key is where on the keyboard... Or am I missing something completely obvious here? A couple of years ago I spent more than two weeks chasing down the real meaning of the various key designations, key codes, keyboard layouts etc., etc. The whole subject is quite arcane, convoluted and prehistoric, loaded with repressed emotional content. It seems to boil down to a quite common rule employed by the scientific and technological community. Those few who truly understand it won't explain it, and those of us who only understand some of it can't explain it. End of rant. If anyone wants to respond, be fair to the OP and start a new thread. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Where are gnome menu configuration files ?
Hi; I have posted this query to the gnome users list 4 or 5 days ago and received no response. Sorry for the double posting. I am about to replace Fedora 11 with Fedora 12. I have re-configured my gnome panel menu (Applications Places System) so that various applications' launchers appear under sub-menus different from the default. The last couple of times that I have done a Fedora new version install I have lost my menu reconfiguration. And yes, I am fully backed up. But I can never seem to find all of the files necessary to show my own menu re-configuration. Instead I always get the new default menu installed and have to once again manually reconfigure. What files should I be sure to backup and/or what files do I have to restore to get MY menu configuration back? Just a URL for a site/page that explains would be helpful. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Just a quick double-check question re installation of LiveCD
Hi; Is the LiveCD updated as bugs are discovered and fixed, or do I get all fixes subsequent to installation from the update repo? In other words, if I download and burn the LiveCD now, it will remain the same when it comes to installing F12 on other machines later? I think the answer is 'yes' but I just want to double check? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Just asking -- re: cx23885 driver for v4l2
Hi; I couldn't get my TVtime working under F11 because the analog sound from my TV Cable supplier was not being being piped to a buffer/socket/whatever -- at least that is what I understood the problem to be. I am using tuner card: Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1800 video driver: v4l2; driver: cx23885. I filed some bug reports and picked up from googling some crosstalk between developers (???) about fixes that may be in the latest (???) kernel and hence in F12. I haven't yet installed or upgraded to F12 just yet. Does anybody know if this problem has been fixed and does the fix appear in the kernel used in F12? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: unexpected logout
Hi Craig; On Tue, 2009-11-10 at 17:02 -0700, Craig White wrote: On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 06:55 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote: In addition, I had a power supply go wonky that ended up being the culprit. Is that a technical term (wonky)? Wonky is an open ended technical term. It describes a piece of hardware or software that does not act the way it used to, was expected to or hoped for. Its use implies that the user has not yet looked into why this may be happening, usually in the hope that someone else has already done the research and found a solution. Wonkyness is usually announced by the phrase Oh sh*t!. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is it me or is the list going NUTS? (Old messages are appearing new)
Hi Antonio; On Fri, 2009-11-06 at 18:28 -0800, Antonio Olivares wrote: Dear fellow fedora users, Is it me or is the list going NUTS?, ie., the thread Should I go 64 bit Fedora just came in from the Original poster, wheras I have seen many replies already to this thread. Is something wrong with the dates, I have November 6, 2009 and this thread message was sent November 2. May I ask what is happenning here? I post a message and it appears much much later :(, What in cronos is going on? If it is me? Scratching my head, then I'll take a pill and go to sleep and forget that all of this is happening :) I had the same problem a couple of weeks ago. I started a discussion here and after several posts back and forth the problem went away without figuring out the cause. It happened again on one post a few days ago. If you check the archives for posts not yet received and the message headers, the non-delivery of mail will seem random. If you can figure out what is causing the problem, let us know. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: For Computer/Electronic Engineer types -- Intel Data Sheet interpretation ?!?
Thanks David; Somewhat off topic for this list .. Yes I agree somewhat, but a couple of years ago I asked if this kind of question was acceptable on the Fedora users list. From time to time, I have had questions that touch on the physical layer of my computer. I have no interest in becoming an Engineer. If I ask on more technical sites (I have tried) I either get answers that are so technical, they are no answers at all -- for my purposes, or, people get aggravated at such basic questions and feel that I am wasting their time. On the other hand, on the Fedora list there are some people who like to take a shot (like you just did) but can keep the answers at my level. Some people have indicated the same interest or a passing curiosity, that I have on how these things work. I try to indicate in the Heading the type of question I am asking so that those who want to skip the question can. I have no expertise in this but out of curiousity I had a look at the datasheet. My conclusions are below. No doubt there will be others here with greater expertise who are welcome to correct any errors. Reference: http://download.intel.com/design/processor/datashts/318732.pdf The intent of the datasheet is to describes its interfaces, not its internal operation. 1) Table 2: the processor outputs a byte that controls the regulator to provide it a supply voltage VCC in the range 0.5 to 1.6 V. 2) Table 4 Note 7: VTT is the databus (frontside bus FSB) fixed reference voltage. It does not vary. 3) Table 3: VTT absmax = 1.45V 4) Table 4: VTT typical = 1.2V 5) Section 2.7: The databus uses GTL+. The 0 or 1 reference threshold for input voltages is GTLREF which is derived from VTT by a simple resistive divider. 6) Table 15: With resistors 57.6 and 100 ohm: GTLREF=VTT*100/(57.6+100)=0.76V 7) So for the databus: Table 11: (approx) 0 VIL GTLREF (VIL = voltage detected as 0 = below 0.76V) Table 11: (approx) GTLREF VIH VTT (VIH = voltage detected as 1 = above 0.76V) Table 11: (approx) VOH = VTT (VOH = voltage output for 1 = 1.2V) I could not see any VOL (voltage output for 0) for the FSB in this datasheet. 8) Table 12 and Table 13 specify open-drain and cmos interfaces which use different voltages. Background docs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunning_Transceiver_Logic http://focus.ti.com/lit/an/scea003a/scea003a.pdf (mentions VOL 0.4V for GTL+) Hope this is useful. Yes, it was very useful. It gave me the Gunning_Transceiver_Logic as the appropriate search criteria for what I wanted to know. This site seems to cover it: http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Gunning+Transceiver+Logic Gunning Transceiver Logic - (GTL) A standard for electrical signals in CMOS circuits used to provide higher data transfer speeds with smaller voltage swings The GTL signal swings between 0.4 volts and 1.2 volts with a reference voltage of about 0.8 volts. Only a small deviation of 0.4 volts (or thereabouts) from the reference voltage is required to switch between on and off states. Therefore, a GTL signal is said to be a low voltage swing logic signal. Gunning Transceiver Logic has several advantages. The resistive termination of a GTL signal provides a clean signalling environment Moreover, the low terminating voltage of 1.2 volts results in reduced voltage drops across the resistive elements. GTL has low power dissipation and can operate at high frequency and causes less electromagnetic interference (EMI). I am going to make the assumption that the voltages used on the FSB would be the same as are used by transistors inside the CPU and DRAM. Thanks again !! -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
For Computer/Electronic Engineer types -- Intel Data Sheet interpretation ?!?
Hi;
I have the 102 page Intel Data Sheet in front of me. I am trying to
determine the High and Low voltage numbers for transistors on my
system.
I am not trying to do anything mysterious or build a CPU in my garage.
I am just doing a small write up for myself that has an introductory
paragraph for a section on how DRAM memory works that says something
like My machine's CPU and Memory transistors typically use XXX volts
when thrust High and XXX volts when driven Low. I understand that
things can get more complex, but I am only trying to establish a sense
or feel of what is happening inside, not write a technical manual for
engineers.
All the various Vtt, Vcc, Vss, VID etc. are getting confusing. I will
either have to spend a couple of days googling trying to interpret the
Data Sheet or take a short cut by asking here.
What designation or parameters should I be looking at for high and low
voltage (logical/binary 1 and logical/binary 0)?
I am using the Intel 318732.pdf {Core 2 Duo Processor Data Sheet}.
lshw says I have a:
product: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU E7400 @ 2.80GHz
vendor: Intel Corp.
bus info: c...@0
version: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU
slot: Socket 775
size: 1600MHz
capacity: 4GHz
width: 64 bits
clock: 266MHz
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
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Re: Is my Harddrive failing?
Hi;
On Sat, 2009-10-31 at 12:24 -0400, Matthew Saltzman wrote:
On Sat, 2009-10-31 at 11:39 +, Alan Cox wrote:
Oct 31 08:05:04 merk kernel: res
41/40:00:af:3a:d7/30:00:1e:00:00/00 Emask 0x409 (media error) F
Oct 31 08:05:04 merk kernel: ata1.00: status: { DRDY ERR }
Oct 31 08:05:04 merk kernel: ata1.00: error: { UNC }
That is the drive reporting a bad block yes. Whether it is a one off
failure or the start of a pattern of fails ending in doom is
unfortunately rather harder to tell.
It used to be fairly common for new disks to have a few bad blocks--back
in the dark days of early PCs when disk drive capacities were measured
in tens or low hundreds of megabytes. Then things seemed to improve as
manufacturing techniques improved. When disk capacities were measured
in tens or low hundreds of gigabytes, I don't recall ever encountering a
new drive with bad blocks. Now that capacities have reached the
terabyte range, it seems that a few bad blocks on new drives are once
again less rare.
It would be nice if the monitor software could record the state of a
drive and issue reports when the number of bad blocks increases from the
starting state, rather than insisting that every bad block is a sign of
imminent failure. The persistent false alarm provokes the user to
ignore the monitor or turn it off entirely, thus risking missing a
warning of an imminent real failure.
I have had the same complaint ever since Fedora started using the
gdu-notification-daemon at startup. I have filed the following bug
against it:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=526742
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
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Re: udev messed up again
Hi Aaron; I posted yesterday that mine was fixed. On Wed, 2009-10-28 at 08:17 -0500, Aaron Konstam wrote: Well I see someone messed up udev again. I can no longer play Audio CDs automagically in F11. No icon shows up when the CD is inserted and no program is launched. I know . File a Bugzilla. Well the last time a Bugzilla was filed on this nothing was done about it but to break the solution that was found by someone who was not developer , I think. Aram Agajanian, correct me if I am wrong. When is this problem going to be dealt with, or has it been dealt with and I missed it? I was told that it was in an update DeviceKit-disks-004-5.fc11 Which I eventually found in the Announce list. Perhaps your previous fix is now messing up this new fix. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Curiosity re: Rhythmbox and CD places fix ?!?
I just did a yum update; somewhere in there was the fix for Rhythmbox finding my CD/DVD drive as well as the icon for the CD/DVD drive showing in 'Places' on my menu. They Work. Which downloaded update had the fixes? Just curious. I have been watching the 'Announce List' and didn't see any announced updates that included these fixes. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Looking for an Accounting package recommendation ?!?
Hi; I have a friend who is looking to switch to Linux in the next few days. I have agreed to help him get up and running on Fedora. He has one major concern -- an appropriate accounting package. I have recommended gnucash to him. I know and have used gnucash, also I have reviewed grisbi. I do not know anything about the Tinyerp application offered in the Fedora repo. Perhaps someone on the list has working knowledge of the strengths and weakness of various linux accounting packages. He is retired but owns 6 or 7 pieces of rental property he wants to keep track of including rents, maintenance, mortgages, banking etc. He has been using M$ Money but is completely dissatisfied. I know he can set up a bookkeeping system with gnucash but does anyone know of a better linux accounting package, or an accounting package which is particularly strong in setting up real estate type of accounts? I have googled and read several pieces of bumf but I was hoping for some advice from someone with hands on experience. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Looking for an Accounting package recommendation ?!?
Thanks Bruno; On Sun, 2009-10-25 at 14:56 -0500, Bruno Wolff III wrote: On Sun, Oct 25, 2009 at 15:13:01 -0400, William Case billli...@rogers.com wrote: He has one major concern -- an appropriate accounting package. I have recommended gnucash to him. I know and have used gnucash, also I have reviewed grisbi. I do not know anything about the Tinyerp application offered in the Fedora repo. Perhaps someone on the list has working knowledge of the strengths and weakness of various linux accounting packages. Linux Weekly News has reviewed accounting packages in the past and may be a good place to start. (Be sure to read the comments as well as the base articles.) Will check Linux Weekly News. Note that if your friend has an accountant they work with, that accountant may put limitations on the software. That is an area where there is not much compatibility and you don't always have much of a choice in software if you are working with a particular accountant. A good question that I forgot to ask. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Bulk] Re: bournal reviews please !?!
Thank you Tim; On Sat, 2009-10-17 at 01:05 +1030, Tim wrote: On Thu, 2009-10-15 at 20:11 -0400, William Case wrote: I want a encrypted, password protected, container/file into which I can store things like some personal data, site passwords, and bank account numbers and passwords. If you want something that's going to be around, you can use gpg for that. There's even thingumees around that let you right click a file in Nautilus, and gpg encrypt it. I was trying to avoid climbing the gpg learning curve until I had the time to really dive in so I was looking for something that would do most of the work for me. Nautilus right click does exactly what I want. In four years of using gnome/nautilus, I have never tried the encrypt command although I have experimented with just about everything else. Who knew?!? Thanks again! -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
bournal reviews please !?!
Hi; I just noticed the Bournal application that is new to me appear in the announcement list. Summary : Write personal, password-protected journal entries Description : Bournal is a bash script that allows you to keep a personal, minimalistic, password-protected journal, log, or diary. It includes encryption, regexp searches, and a date-sorted list for editing old entries. Since Bournal is pure bash, it should be easily editable for the CLI-savvy. This sounds like something I have been looking for. Is anybody using it? I have checked their site and googled for additional information, but the main questions I have are not answered. I want a encrypted, password protected, container/file into which I can store things like some personal data, site passwords, and bank account numbers and passwords. I am not highly secrecy oriented or paranoid so I don't want or need something will completely lock down my computer or create a new partition. Instead I want something that will let me have a modicum of protection from prying eyes, yet will give me easy access to my data when I forget something. It doesn't have to be large, 1 Mb at the very most. I want an application that will be around for a while so that I am not caught without access if the world changes. That is why the idea of it being a bash script is appealing. Has anybody used or worked with Bournal? Do you think it meets my outlined light weight type needs? Is it easy to work with? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Gnome or KDE - why not ask?
Hi; Patrick, I am with you! On Sat, 2009-10-10 at 09:52 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Sat, 2009-10-10 at 14:34 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote: Joshua C. wrote: The installation process guides you through some basic points (like grub, partitioning, basic packages). While I am at it, I think the partitioning options are badly put, too. The first option should be to use the current partitions, in my view. The second should be to set up partitions as one wants. I kind of agree. I must have installed every Fedora system since FC1 and every single time I get to this question (or the equivalent in earlier versions) I have doubts about how to proceed. I almost always want to keep my existing partition scheme and just install (not update) the new Fedora version on /, preserving /home untouched, but the dialogue doesn't make it easy to understand how to do this. It would reduce installation anxiety considerably if Anaconda told me the exact consequences of each option before asking me to confirm, but for some reason every time I get to this point I find myself wondering what does this *really* mean?. Maybe I'm just paranoid. Even for experienced users, some of the Anaconda choices are full of FUD. Keeping in mind, that most people don't re-partition very often, or install grub very often or burn DVD's very often or rename their machines very often, or input the addresses of their repos very often etc. etc., asking them to choose a process when their machines have been taken over by the installation process and it is too late to double check, is confusing at the best of times and infuriating when things are going wrong. I really feel sorry for someone installing for the first time who is brand new to Linux or Fedora. There should be explanation Buttons through out Ananconda, not written for the experienced, but for the newbie particularly somebody coming over from M$ Windows. Much of that text already exists in documentation of Installation Notes and Release Notes. The problem is that those documents are unavailable when a user needs them the most. I suspect that most people who have installed Fedora before know that it is best to avoid the crazy system suggested by Anaconda. In the past, I have inadvertently got into one of the non-custom options and had to back out and re-start the installation. (Actually I didn't have to re-start, but I didn't know that at the time.) Strictly speaking it *is* impossible to install Fedora without at least part of Gnome. Installing both and choosing one or the other is not difficult. Installing from a KDE-focussed download isn't hard either and is usually what I do. There's nothing vestigial about it. Fedora is upfront about being a Gnome distro which also supports KDE. For example the upcoming DeviceKit stuff mentions Gnome components in the same breath as the kernel. This is common in Fedora docs. I gripe about it from time to time but I doubt anything can be done about it at present. The current state of free desktop architectures doesn't seem to allow neutrality. I keep a TomBoy note ongoing in which I add a list of all of the dickey little things I have to do before and while installing the latest Fedora version. I print it out as hard copy just before each time I install. (Just in case.) Unfortunately, that list is getting longer and longer. To me Anaconda should or could be Fedora's main sales page. When I think of the time and frustration of installing a M$ Windows OS, Fedora's installation should be reduced to a couple of Button pushes as a comparison. On first start after installation, gpk-application should be thrust front and centre in order to pick your applications. I have a bash script that runs yum with a list of about 20 applications I want with each Fedora version. It took me a couple of weeks on Fedora 11 to discover that Ad/remove Software i.e.gpk-application, could quickly get me everything I wanted. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Bulk] Installing Windows afterFedora
Hi; On Fri, 2009-10-02 at 19:19 -0400, Bill Davidsen wrote: I have managed to go for just under a decade without a Windows machine, but now I need to have such, and I'd like to add it to an existing machine with a large enough partition which was used as work area for a project since shipped. The problem is that while I've put Fedora (and Linux back to SLS and Slackware on 2.2 kernels) on Windows machines, I haven't done it with anything else after, Linux has always been the last OS you'll ever need for dual boot. I'm not worried about the grub.conf, but the boot sector could be an issue, I have seen reports that XP with patches and Win7 check the boot sector now (XP at patch level 3). other than having to rewrite the boot sector, is that going to be an issue? Any other things I should know? I have had the same problem. What I did was make sure of the grub instructions I wanted to use and wrote them down or printed them out -- just in case all else failed and I needed written notes. I made sure that I knew how to re-install using grub-install or grub or firstaid on my Fedora LiveCD or the DVD disk. Once I had protected myself, I just installed WindowsXP and then re-installed grub. It was fast and easy (well not installing Windows -- but you know what I mean). This you should double check, but if I remember correctly, you only need to install Windows on the first partition if you are going to depend on the Windows boot loader. Otherwise, you can chainload Windows from any partition as long has you correctly tell grub.conf where the windows partition is. e.g. title Windows XP SP3 rootnoverify (hd0,5) chainloader +1 if windows has been installed on the first disk, 6th partition. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: A couple of DRAM memory stick questions ??
Thank you Markku; The cell arrangement of DRAM has been frustrating me for a long time now. Probably more because I set out to find an answer than because it was something I needed to know. The additional questions below simply sprung to mind as I was reading your response and are only secondary. On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 12:07 +0300, Markku Kolkka wrote: William Case kirjoitti viestissään (lähetysaika keskiviikko, 30. syyskuuta 2009): The second diagram shows a set of 4 X 4 arrays -- with a major disclaimer about its accuracy at the bottom. I have also seen other sites plus a couple of text books I own that show the cell arrangement as a linear setup. But only for 32 bit machines. I found nothing for 64 bit DRAM. The bit width of the CPU has no effect on the DRAM chip layout. I know. I only mentioned the CPU registers to avoid someone taking a lot of time explaining the difference between SRAM and DRAM. Perhaps mentioning latches only confused the issue. You simply connect enough chips in parallel to achieve the desired data bus width. A typical 64-bit DIMM stick has eight 8-bit wide chips. I'll take that information to the bank. To state it another way just to make sure I've got it. A typical physical address goes to, or points to, 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 cells arranged side-by-side in a line on an individual DIMM/DRAM stick. I suspect that by thinking of address as divided into bytes rather than a single 64 bit word (dword, qword, -- pick your author) there is a natural division for instructions, numbers and characters within the 'word'. Or, is there some physical reason why it is thought of as 8 + 8 ... When you say chips above I assume you mean cell, i.e. chip = cell = 1 capacitor and 1 transistor for storage of 1 bit. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: A couple of DRAM memory stick questions ??
Thanks poc; Then it gets confusing again! On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 10:53 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 10:55 -0400, William Case wrote: It's the data that's stored in units of 8 bits. When addresses are stored then of course the same applies. When they're on the address lines of the memory bus, they may be in groups of 16 or 32 or 64 (depends on the bus design). None of this matters to you as a programmer. Understood -- I think. Put another way, on a 64 bit machine if the memory bus is 32 lines wide the data, or whatever, would flow with the first 32 bits immediately followed by the second 32 bits -- right? (I am trying to avoid discussing whether data flows on the rising edge or falling edge of a clock tick etc.) Note that the pedantic name for a group of 8 bits is octet. A byte is the number of bits required to represent a character in some encoding. When you say chips above I assume you mean cell, i.e. chip = cell = 1 capacitor and 1 transistor for storage of 1 bit. A chip has a whole bunch of cells (in the millions these days). They aren't the same. Then what was Markku referring to when he said A typical 64-bit DIMM stick has eight 8-bit wide chips. The chip is one of the minute black chips I can just barely see on a RAM stick --? That is what I originally thought. Markku's statement then implies that a 64 bit qword is stored in an 8 x 8 array of cells. True? By the Way: The definition of a 'word' seems to be all over the place. With Intel, the definition I have read says a 'word' is 16 bits, a 'double word (dword)' is 32 bits, and a 'quadruple word (qword)' is 64 bits. The specs for the 64 bit AMD CPU I used to have defined a 'word' as whatever the machine said it was. In my case at the time, a 'word' would have been 64 bits. I raised the question of 'words' with my local Linux Users Group and simply got caught in a long debate amongst them with huge digressions that resolved nothing to my satisfaction. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: A couple of DRAM memory stick questions ??
Hi poc, Markku. I think I have what I wanted. Thanks for taking the time. On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 12:02 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 12:03 -0400, William Case wrote: Thanks poc; Then what was Markku referring to when he said A typical 64-bit DIMM stick has eight 8-bit wide chips. The chip is one of the minute black chips I can just barely see on a RAM stick --? That is what I originally thought. Yes. Markku's statement then implies that a 64 bit qword is stored in an 8 x 8 array of cells. True? No. If a 64-bit wide DIMM has 8 chips on it you can be highly confident in saying the chips are 8 bits wide, but their depth is another matter. And the fact that the chip presents an 8-bit wide interface doesn't mean that the internal organization is in 8x8 bit arrays, though it might be. Furthermore, the 64 bits in a word will pretty much *never* be stored in a single 8x8 array. They'll be stored in a number of parallel arrays for speed of access, usually across 8 separate chips. Ah, back to 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 cells arranged side-by-side in a line on an individual DIMM/DRAM stick. OK, that's good enough for the personal visualization I wanted. I understand that this can vary, but once one has a basic configuration in mind, it only requires mild mental gymnastics to move the parts and pieces around in one's head as long as the parts and pieces are still all there, Again: this level of detail (the array size) is essentially invisible to the programmer. I know. My objective is not primarily for programming but for understanding how a machine (basically an appliance) plugged into a wall socket can do so much. By the Way: The definition of a 'word' seems to be all over the place. With Intel, the definition I have read says a 'word' is 16 bits, a 'double word (dword)' is 32 bits, and a 'quadruple word (qword)' is 64 bits. That's true of Intel. It's not necessarily true across all computer architectures (in fact it isn't, as I mentioned in my previous reply). The specs for the 64 bit AMD CPU I used to have defined a 'word' as whatever the machine said it was. In my case at the time, a 'word' would have been 64 bits. A word is normally considered to be the unit of the bus cycle of the machine (but see the above discussion of dual-cycle implementations) and coincides with the maximum addressable range of virtual memory (physical memory can be less, or even more in some cases). It usually also coincides with the size of the most common machine instructions, those these can also vary depending on the architecture. Good introductions to this stuff are Hennessy and Patterson, or Tanenbaum's Computer Organization book. I have both books and read them a couple of years ago, cover to cover. You would be surprised how much I was able to understand and retain. I made copious notes at the time. I am presently re-reading and putting those notes into a meaningful form for myself. But learning is an iterative process. Any questions I ask now are fill-in questions or questions I didn't think to ask at the time. Now that I know better where and how to look, I can do MOST of the research myself, but an occasional hand is greatly appreciated. The advantage of being able to mentally visualize a process is that I find it easier to see logic gaps; to ask myself questions like hey wait a minute; how did that get from here to there?. I raised the question of 'words' with my local Linux Users Group and simply got caught in a long debate amongst them with huge digressions that resolved nothing to my satisfaction. That's because only hardware nuts and operating system geeks really care :-) Thanks again for your time. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: A couple of DRAM memory stick questions ??
Hi David; On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 08:17 +1000, David Timms wrote: On 09/28/2009 01:07 AM, William Case wrote: I have been re-reading some notes I have made on how DRAM works. As a result I have a couple of unanswered questions? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_random_access_memory has some pretty pictures, surely you found/searched that already ? Yes. Found that a while ago. It is a good example of why I am asking. The second diagram shows a set of 4 X 4 arrays -- with a major disclaimer about its accuracy at the bottom. I have also seen other sites plus a couple of text books I own that show the cell arrangement as a linear setup. But only for 32 bit machines. I found nothing for 64 bit DRAM. I do have the schematics for my CPU which has 64 bit SRAM (latch) registers. As I tried to explain, both probably exist, although I don't know that for sure. The actual operation of the DRAM isn't altered under either arrangement. The word line (row) and the bit line (column) are just organized slightly differently. The real problem is that the caption on any diagram I view is never clear on whether I am being shown just a concept or an actual arrangement. I tend to visualize, in order to understand things better, such operations as reading from and writing to memory . It would help if I could have in my mind's eye the actual arrangement of cells for the most commonly used, current, DRAM for a 64 bit machine. I have searched, on and off, over the last six months for something definitive. I have tried DRAM manufacturers sites for specifications that would be helpful. It seems that internal arrangements of memory cells must be proprietary. So I turned to the mail list to see if there where any engineers who knew what the typical DRAM cell arrangement usually is. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!? [SOLVED - kinda]
On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 10:06 +0400, Hiisi wrote: 2009/9/28 William Case billli...@rogers.com: Hi Hiisi On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 00:37 +0400, Hiisi wrote: 2009/9/28 William Case billli...@rogers.com: Does it matter if you have a replay to your post (like now)? Can you see your message now? Can you see your message now? I sent a message over a half an hour ago replying 'Yes' to your query; but that 'yes' response hasn't shown up here yet although it is in the archive. The usual turnaround time is about 1 to 2 minutes. The first two messages that I sent on this thread made it through instantly. The 'yes' response which was sent about a half hour - 45 minutes before the second response arrived here about an hour after the second message i.e. about 2 hours after sending. OK. We have here two messages from you, the second arrived about a half of an hour after the first one. The second message, a reply to does it matter arrived first about 1-2 minutes after sending. I also noticed that even for a thread that wasn't mine, I received a users response about 1/2 an hour before I received the original post. Recently I had similar problem with my messages. But in my case I new exactly where problem laid. I used rambler.ru here in Moscow, Russia. And they have the same reputation of 'screwing around with their system on weekends without telling anybody' ;-) My solution was to sign up in gmail, then set up my old address as 'reply-to' in gmail and forward all messages to the new mailbox from the old one. You could then unsubscribe the old address from list-messages and subscribe for it on the new one. Hope that helps. In my opinion gmail is the best mail-provider I've ever used. But I use web-mail, not programs like evolution or kmail... For the time being I am going to drop the issue, as things seem to be straightening out. Just for future reference, and to add to my own personal knowledge, I wish I had a better idea of what was going on. I have wasted 2 or 3 hours try to figure out what I did wrong when I probably haven't done anything I shouldn't have. It would be nice to be able to recognize the source of this kind of problem. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!? [SOLVED - kinda]
Hi Todd; On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 10:11 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote: William Case wrote: Just for future reference, and to add to my own personal knowledge, I wish I had a better idea of what was going on. I have wasted 2 or 3 hours try to figure out what I did wrong when I probably haven't done anything I shouldn't have. It would be nice to be able to recognize the source of this kind of problem. Have you checked the Received headers of the messages in question? It's quite possible that one of the hops along the way was the source of the delay. Greylisting or other anti-spam tactics might be the cause. No reply necessary, but just to point out the irony. The quote from a post of mine you refer to above is from a message I sent to this list over 6 hours ago, which you have obviously received, but I have not. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!? [SOLVED - kinda]
Hi; On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 10:11 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote: Have you checked the Received headers of the messages in question? No I hadn't. I am not sure what I would be looking for. It's quite possible that one of the hops along the way was the source of the delay. Greylisting or other anti-spam tactics might be the cause. Nonetheless, on your suggestion I looked at the headers of a) a message that had an instant turn around and b) one that took a whole day, but I couldn't see anything significant other the warning in both about domainkeys=fail (bad syntax); a) instant re-send from fedora list. X-Apparently-To: billli...@rogers.com via 216.39.53.226; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 13:59:53 -0700 X-YMailISG: ezCtjOkWLDsRdjTjVknEO_zOJjKbn4xz13hWacO.WxYrKv.6JNNt.rY.tNU5yuBdOlRpY8jpCe0VwyslCB.g1UGA2SUWXj_I.0TssHSHI8YjPJElpdf2yKKIhuKh4R_9MtXwgc1dciWm1hIGF3_147EZVAiGylRVRRilDQpXGz4XVEzVeuR51xUn4b3Bm_IV68ApXC8TpTuAQz8edG2ZgRTWzG9xD96vpevMDVX9YbtCkBHmkcSeojuCkMgOz63Kp5lC.AhZBXYLbXx1Pg5JLGep1CY_PlgBGxHLTfH9bL0K0ejE3kQ03lbBX_8tmE2eGyuNXo7ENoYj7q9fVrCzIoPQvU7OHbnfSscJAxc4QU.4cISXOoDN2tTPNHwCrpNmJzpz7.9hnQOEMQzGvQ-- X-Originating-IP: [209.132.177.33] Authentication-Results: mta108.rog.mail.sp1.yahoo.com from=redhat.com; domainkeys=fail (bad syntax); from=redhat.com; dkim=neutral (no sig) Received: from 209.132.177.33 (EHLO hormel.redhat.com) (209.132.177.33) by mta108.rog.mail.sp1.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 13:59:52 -0700 Received: from listman.util.phx.redhat.com (listman.util.phx.redhat.com [10.8.4.110]) by hormel.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82CAA618E65; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 16:35:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from int-mx01.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com (nat-pool.util.phx.redhat.com [10.8.5.200]) by listman.util.phx.redhat.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id n8RKZCNU006740 for fedora-l...@listman.util.phx.redhat.com; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 16:35:12 -0400 Received: from mx1.redhat.com (ext-mx04.extmail.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.110.8]) by int-mx01.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n8RKZB8f011863 for fedora-list@redhat.com; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 16:35:12 -0400 Received: from smtp119.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp119.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [68.142.224.74]) by mx1.redhat.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with SMTP id n8RKYxXu024407 for fedora-list@redhat.com; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 16:35:00 -0400 Received: (qmail 82241 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2009 20:34:59 - DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Subject:From:To:Content-Type:Date:Message-Id:Mime-Version:X-Mailer:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=zjqQXXw1eWiZCClwcdAg3eMCwiOhwAry/eaKnr6TSUXIGesK5Ibd3zpqAmygZeX98DAexQyPk5+nSrs1AL+BbBBxyppZojo1u/f8NzZGqX42+p2CbdkbD/0LCV91tHjdKPRjyqYS88rVrdrQTgoS4+cGXWihg1M7z/FApYHcsJk= ; Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.1.3?) (billli...@99.245.242.191 with plain) by smtp119.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2009 20:34:59 - X-YMail-OSG: KAqppJIVM1lR_01CEixbanPuHkLNvwtaCGtpVi4LmO4FKqqEYlnzsejNhPDSXUb7sQ-- From: William Case billli...@rogers.com To: Fedora List fedora-list@redhat.com Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:32:29 + Message-Id: 1254083549.4957.58.ca...@case b) 20+ hour delay re-send from fedora list. X-Apparently-To: billli...@rogers.com via 216.39.53.230; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 19:16:33 -0700 X-YMailISG: OnUe9J8WLDv9VRey9GV_nmAE_fanaGY0HbDMWDkXKeYA75cxVet83iUfQ4eI46aKbktGqQJN5zgVwmhu8CK4eAI.YH8pMAKOMFVlmeSEToLyxFfsq8h4ZUpVfdzzyeJMLW2_JP381_peupAqlY_CFkfVdcsKJH4rBoglxCuVVsJrAcYbgkasrCk7u4SSdHiGFsTBMW0xxziK5OBrq58FdD6lQTgl.j0LK0zDPv7XPkqEFHSbYt6Hr8YB1cnEnokSm669aFzLQdv3E4.KHqteb27MIe6AG2.vSLplWNvc9_RMqfFEXJF_WEsjaSMlwedNckCHfJ0S3ni9Le_cBYKERQjvGzFSgOqv_iwjLFYqh7asOxsr0qqsc3OoVdjA25.qCHq2ZpR5iuV5UGkP4w-- X-Originating-IP: [209.132.177.33] Authentication-Results: mta108.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com from=redhat.com; domainkeys=fail (bad syntax); from=redhat.com; dkim=neutral (no sig) Received: from 209.132.177.33 (EHLO hormel.redhat.com) (209.132.177.33) by mta108.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 19:16:33 -0700 Received: from listman.util.phx.redhat.com (listman.util.phx.redhat.com [10.8.4.110]) by hormel.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89821619323; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:14:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from int-mx03.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com (nat-pool.util.phx.redhat.com [10.8.5.200]) by listman.util.phx.redhat.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id n8S1EsKx007371 for fedora-l...@listman.util.phx.redhat.com; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:14:54 -0400 Received: from mx1.redhat.com (ext-mx03.extmail.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.110.7]) by int-mx03.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n8S1Esu5031734 for fedora-list@redhat.com; Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:14:54 -0400 Received: from smtp105.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp105.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [206.190.36.83]) by mx1.redhat.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with SMTP id n8S1EgDh031989 for fedora-list@redhat.com; Sun
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!? [SOLVED - kinda]
Thanks poc; On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 11:29 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 10:37 -0400, William Case wrote: Just for future reference, and to add to my own personal knowledge, I wish I had a better idea of what was going on. I have wasted 2 or 3 hours try to figure out what I did wrong when I probably haven't done anything I shouldn't have. It would be nice to be able to recognize the source of this kind of problem. Bill, in my days as the guy where the buck stops for a University user community, one of the things I constantly had to explain was that email doesn't obey strict rules of time-ordering as seen by the user, and the fact that a message hasn't arrived *yet* wasn't necessarily my fault. It's quite illuminating to study how email actually works, end-to-end. I have had the opportunity to read a great deal about email messaging, internet packets and protocols. So, I am not starting at stage zero. However, this is the first time I have had a real question rather than just a theoretical one. For that reason alone, to me, the question of delayed reception of emails is worth pursuing. It's enormously more complex than most people realize, in fact it's something of a miracle that it works at all :-) I understand that it is a complex question and that emails are not guaranteed to arrive in a set order but can bounce around all over the place. However, in this case, something that has not been 'normal' in the past is now happening. It makes the question of what is causing the delay worthwhile for me to investigate, if only to learn a practical side of this 'email thing'. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
A couple of DRAM memory stick questions ??
Hi; For anyone, but particularly Les H. I have been re-reading some notes I have made on how DRAM works. As a result I have a couple of unanswered questions? 1) This question is for personal visualization purposes. I fully realize it makes no real difference on how DRAM works. What is the most common arrangement of memory cells (??) within a memory stick. It seems to be proprietary information? I have seen schematics of two possibilities; a) with each stored bit side-by-side for the length of a 'word' or in my case a 'double word' (i.e. 64 bits), or, b) in a 4 X 4 arrangement. Is there some place in the DRAM manufacturer's specification I could be looking to determine this? As I said, this question is for no technical reason. When I am thinking about DRAM memory, I use a visualizations in my mind about what is happening in memory. I would like my mental vision of the process to be as close to physical reality as possible. 2) When referring to DRAM memory, what is a 'cell'; is it physically one bit (capacitor, transistor, lines and all) or is a cell a group of them? If it is a group, from what I have read it is a bit ambiguous whether 'cell' refers to one 4 X 4 ( or one 16 bit linear) arrangement, one 'word' or one 'double word'? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!?
Hi; I have sent 2 or three posts to the mailing list but have not received a return copy of those posts. I have double checked the archive list and the posts are there. My user profile is checked 'yes' to receive a copy of my own posts. It has always worked up to a couple of days ago. Is there a problem anyone knows about? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!?
Hi; On Sun, 2009-09-27 at 20:32 +, William Case wrote: Hi; I have sent 2 or three posts to the mailing list but have not received a return copy of those posts. I have double checked the archive list and the posts are there. My user profile is checked 'yes' to receive a copy of my own posts. It has always worked up to a couple of days ago. Is there a problem anyone knows about? Of course, just to be really annoying, fedora-list or my IP or Evolution decided to immediately return/show a copy of THIS post?!!? Sorry for the noise, unless it happens again. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!?
On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 00:37 +0400, Hiisi wrote: 2009/9/28 William Case billli...@rogers.com: Hi; I have sent 2 or three posts to the mailing list but have not received a return copy of those posts. I have double checked the archive list and the posts are there. My user profile is checked 'yes' to receive a copy of my own posts. It has always worked up to a couple of days ago. Is there a problem anyone knows about? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 Does it matter if you have a replay to your post (like now)? Can you see your message now? Yes I can see your reply. However, there are 2 previous posts that have never shown up here but are in the archives, and one other that took over a day to appear and only after I re-sent it when I originally thought *I* had done something to make it disappear. I thought it might have been my Evolution filters, but I have double checked them and they are correct. I also checked that the posts never made it back into my inbox. The likely culprit is my IP. I use rogers.com here in Ottawa, Canada. Rogers has a bit of a reputation of screwing around with their system on weekends without telling anybody. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: I think something is 'stuck' on the fedoara-list ?!?
Hi Hiisi On Mon, 2009-09-28 at 00:37 +0400, Hiisi wrote: 2009/9/28 William Case billli...@rogers.com: Does it matter if you have a replay to your post (like now)? Can you see your message now? Can you see your message now? I sent a message over a half an hour ago replying 'Yes' to your query; but that 'yes' response hasn't shown up here yet although it is in the archive. The usual turnaround time is about 1 to 2 minutes. The first two messages that I sent on this thread made it through instantly. Does it matter if you have a replay to your post (like now)? To me, yes for five reasons: 1) I want to keep my threads together and not have to check back and forth between the 'Sent' folder and my 'Fedora List' folder. 2) I have a filter set up so that anything from a mailing list that was sent to the mailing list by is labeled in Green (Personal) -- that allows me to easily find the threads I am following or am engaged in. That filter is still working properly for other mailing lists. 3) I hadn't changed, fiddled or tweaked anything intentionally. There is no logical reason why something should change. 4) Emails, Evolution and mail filters is something I thought I had mastered. If I am not getting a re-send that is my fault, I want to figure out what I did wrong. 5) Because I don't know what I don't know, I may be losing other people's posts to this list without being aware of it. Now, lets see if this post comes back. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Solved] Re: Why update Swahili? [RE-SENT]
On Fri, 2009-09-25 at 15:28 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Fri, 2009-09-25 at 11:28 -0400, William Case wrote: [Message didn't seem to get through last night. Could be a screwed up Evo filter here!] It did get through, as you could have verified by checking the archives. Yes poc. Immediately after sending the offending post, I thought of checking the archives. Both were there. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Solved] Re: Why update Swahili? [RE-SENT]
[Message didn't seem to get through last night. Could be a screwed up Evo
filter here!]
Hi gilpel;
On Thu, 2009-09-24 at 20:13 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
On Thu, 2009-09-24 at 06:14 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
Well, in my book, rm is a bash command. It might not be exclusive to
the bash shell, but it definitely is a bash command. Otherwise, maybe
you could tell us what a bash command is to you?
You are wrong. 'rm' (meaning /bin/rm) is an executable program. Shell
commands are builtin procedures such as 'cd', 'eval', etc. Unix Shells
have worked this way since the beginning.
In Bash, if you want to know if a command is builtin, use 'type':
$ type rm
rm is /bin/rm
$ type cd
cd is a shell builtin
Interesting. Now that I have a shell builtin, I won't have to scroll
through all the bash man page to find the list. They're under... SHELL
BUILTIN COMMANDS.
A couple of tips from someone who was a newbie only a few years ago.
1) don't worry about the extra downloads. You may need Bluetooth
someday and it doesn't take up much room. Turn it off in startup
applications and it won't bother you again until, and if, you need it.
There are not many updates. As for the language updates, it is a
loosing battle; too many programs look for the dictionaries or have
their own, like Firefox.
Similarly, they really don't take up much room. They are stored on your
harddisk until they are called for. Then they are put into memory. If
you never use them, they will never be called. If it takes a bit of
time on your internet connection, download them over night or have
another coffee. It is not worth the battle; as far as I know every
operating system is multilingual and acts as if, if the dictionaries are
missing, part of its brain is missing.
2) This is a tip I learned the hard way, but once I learnt it, it has
stood me in good stead. To operate a bit more efficiently and
effectively, take 4 hours, 2 hours for each program, and learn how to
use vim(vi) and emacs.
Vim and Emacs are text editors, and great debates rage about which one
is the better. Try them both and you decide. However, here is the real
reason why you should spend the time. The commands for these two text
editors form the basis of most Linux/Unix applications. You can
eliminate a great deal of frustration by recognizing:
'info' commands are similar to emacs commands
'man' commands are similar to vim commands
'less' 'more' commands are similar to vim commands
'readline' commands are similar to emacs commands
etc., etc.
Pay particular attention to: help, search, modes, command lines, index,
quitting and moving around a page in both. Don't spend anymore time
than just learning those basic commands.
These text editors are not really for writing text as you and I mean the
term. They are large programs used primarily for programming. Some
programmers live in vim or emacs all day and have added more and more
capablities; don't get bogged down in those parts of the applications --
just get to recognize the basics.
Some of the shell programs listed above will have a few differing
commands from vim or emacs but a quick check of help in each shell
application will point out the difference. You will quickly learn to
recognize which applications are based on vim and which ones on emacs.
Soon you will be able to find things and bounce around in different
files like a pro. It is well worth the few hours practise to get the
basics of vim and emacs.
The purists and the pros might be tempted to throw in a whole bunch or
corrections and caveats to this post. For this one time only, I'll say
ignore them; most of them forget what it was like being a beginner.
For what it is worth, one extra tip about finding how or why things
work. Once you have mastered getting around inside Linux, you can
easily use man or info, or --help or ]$ help {bash command}, and yelp
(if you use Gnome). For someone new, the hardest part is often just
getting the correct terminology in order to ask the right Google or
Wikipedia question. Man etc. will sometimes appear incomprehensible but
they will provide the terms, jargon or acronyms that you can use to do a
more extensive and meaningful search online.
Don't get frustrated with the people on the list, they are really trying
to help. They have helped me a lot!
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
--
fedora-list mailing list
fedora-list@redhat.com
To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Ebooks -- How?
Hi; I came across some ebooks online I would like to read. Is there anyway to do it in Fedora 11 on a desktop? Checked Fedora repo etc. I couldn't see anything useful other than ebook-tools. I wasn't sure whether that was what I wanted or not. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Solved] Re: Why update Swahili?
Hi gilpel;
On Thu, 2009-09-24 at 20:13 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
On Thu, 2009-09-24 at 06:14 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
Well, in my book, rm is a bash command. It might not be exclusive to
the bash shell, but it definitely is a bash command. Otherwise, maybe
you could tell us what a bash command is to you?
You are wrong. 'rm' (meaning /bin/rm) is an executable program. Shell
commands are builtin procedures such as 'cd', 'eval', etc. Unix Shells
have worked this way since the beginning.
In Bash, if you want to know if a command is builtin, use 'type':
$ type rm
rm is /bin/rm
$ type cd
cd is a shell builtin
Interesting. Now that I have a shell builtin, I won't have to scroll
through all the bash man page to find the list. They're under... SHELL
BUILTIN COMMANDS.
A couple of tips from someone who was a newbie only a few years ago.
1) don't worry about the extra downloads. You may need Bluetooth
someday and it doesn't take up much room. Turn it off in startup
applications and it won't bother you again until, and if, you need it.
There are not many updates. As for the language updates, it is a
loosing battle; too many programs look for the dictionaries or have
their own, like Firefox.
Similarly, they really don't take up much room. They are stored on your
harddisk until they are called for. Then they are put into memory. If
you never use them, they will never be called. If it takes a bit of
time on your internet connection, download them over night or have
another coffee. It is not worth the battle; as far as I know every
operating system is multilingual and acts as if, if the dictionaries are
missing, part of its brain is missing.
2) This is a tip I learned the hard way, but once I learnt it, it has
stood me in good stead. To operate a bit more efficiently and
effectively, take 4 hours, 2 hours for each program, and learn how to
use vim(vi) and emacs.
Vim and Emacs are text editors, and great debates rage about which one
is the better. Try them both and you decide. However, here is the real
reason why you should spend the time. The commands for these two text
editors form the basis of most Linux/Unix applications. You can
eliminate a great deal of frustration by recognizing:
'info' commands are similar to emacs commands
'man' commands are similar to vim commands
'less' 'more' commands are similar to vim commands
'readline' commands are similar to emacs commands
etc., etc.
Pay particular attention to: help, search, modes, command lines, index,
quitting and moving around a page in both. Don't spend anymore time
than just learning those basic commands.
These text editors are not really for writing text as you and I mean the
term. They are large programs used primarily for programming. Some
programmers live in vim or emacs all day and have added more and more
capablities; don't get bogged down in those parts of the applications --
just get to recognize the basics.
Some of the shell programs listed above will have a few differing
commands from vim or emacs but a quick check of help in each shell
application will point out the difference. You will quickly learn to
recognize which applications are based on vim and which ones on emacs.
Soon you will be able to find things and bounce around in different
files like a pro. It is well worth the few hours practise to get the
basics of vim and emacs.
The purists and the pros might be tempted to throw in a whole bunch or
corrections and caveats to this post. For this one time only, I'll say
ignore them; most of them forget what it was like being a beginner.
For what it is worth, one extra tip about finding how or why things
work. Once you have mastered getting around inside Linux, you can
easily use man or info, or --help or ]$ help {bash command}, and yelp
(if you use Gnome). For someone new, the hardest part is often just
getting the correct terminology in order to ask the right Google or
Wikipedia question. Man etc. will sometimes appear incomprehensible but
they will provide the terms, jargon or acronyms that you can use to do a
more extensive and meaningful search online.
Don't get frustrated with the people on the list, they are really trying
to help. They have helped me a lot!
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
--
fedora-list mailing list
fedora-list@redhat.com
To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Music Appreciation teaching program ??
Hi Tim; The thread has turned a bit OT. That's OK by me. It lets me get a few things about music off my chest. On Mon, 2009-09-21 at 04:38 +0930, Tim wrote: Tim: That was the title to a program on our (Australian) ABC, Classic FM station: http://www.abc.net.au/classic/keys/ Found the above radio program. For some reason the volume is coming extremely faintly through RhythmBox. I don't need help yet. I am not done fiddling. Though classical music isn't always to the taste of everybody, but the principles behind it are the underpinning of all other music types, as well. And it's amusing, at times, to find out how some hard core rock artist has some very formal classical training in their past. At my age I find I like oldies but goodies of the late 50's and early 60's. That probably has more to do with nostalgia for my youth and dating years, than a real appreciation of the music. I can't remember the name of a song or an artist until the announcer reminds me. But, after a couple of bars the name of the girl(s) I was dating at the time comes instantly to mind. As I have grown older, I have noticed that some particularly poignant points in my life have been marked by some very strange (for me) classical music. The name of those classical pieces I can quite clearly keep in mind, but again I have to hear a couple of bars (a second or two) to actually recognize the music. Quite often, though I can recognize name and music, I have a hard time joining the two. In this day and age of world-wide internet radio, there must be others, and one's covering the styles of music that interests you. Yes. I have a classical radio station on now playing softly in the background. To explain what I am after, as I sit here, only a few adjectives or adverbs spring to mind that I use to describe noise/sound/music and they are: loud, soft, higher, lower, tolerable, Gawd awful and -ish. I do hear gentle intimations that a lot more is going on in music and sound than that limited vocabulary can cover. I, too, like to know a bit more about what I'm listening to, particularly the unfamiliar stuff. Some of the interview shows are good for that, where a composer, conductor, musician, etc., talks about their art, rather than themselves. but you end with what seems like a question related to playing music, yourself. You might want to clarify your wants The very thought of me trying to learn to play music would frighten my friends and neighbours and send the dog running from the house in sheer panic. You couldn't possibly be any worse than what passes for so-called popular music, these days... Yes I could. Bill's skill at singing, dancing or whatever has always been a great source of mirth for family and friends. In fact, the inability to hold a tune has had benefits. I have managed to avoid Sunday morning Church Services for most of my life by threatening to sing the hymns. No, what I was looking for was something in the way of music appreciation. I was trying to indicate I wanted something that would let me hear what different musical terms meant as well as offer an introduction to different kinds of music. To me, the term music appreciation always conjures up an image of long-haired amateur music critiques, professing to be fans, but behaving otherwise... ;-) Haughtily condemning the performance of something over some trivial point, using jargon they've heard, but don't understand, and couldn't possibly do themselves. ;-) Though, at its most basic level, the term just means music lover. I have spent a life time dedicated to pricking the balloons of those kind of pompous elites -- mentally I just call them A** H*les. Here I meant 'appreciation' in the ordinary sense of 'understanding the value of something'. In this I agree completely with Les. Often jargon and formal training has the side benefit to Professionals of making their knowledge special and inaccessible to others. Let me tell you, there is a large market for people who translate the language of specialized worlds into plain language understandable by everyone. Which brings me around to what I was hoping to find. It seems to me that music can be thought as, much like computers, having abstraction layers. 1) The physics and physiology of noise or sound or music; 2) The basic components of listening; rhythm, timbre, pitch and tones; 3) The language of composition; chords, scales, harmonics and/or whatever; 4) The application of all of the above to types (classical, rock'n roll, jazz etc.), varieties of music within the types (classical can be a string quartet, a concerto, an opera etc.), the parts of the types or varieties, overture, libretto, etc. I probably have misplaced much of the above -- but you get the idea. That misplacement is one of the things I am trying to correct. I was hoping there was a learning program that would help me travel up and down the music abstraction
Music Appreciation teaching program ??
Hi; Can anyone recommend a program to download from Fedora repo / any Linux repo / or the world that teaches Music Appreciation? I have something in mind like 'Rosette Stone' but for music. Something that really starts with the basics and works up. I am think that maybe after 65 years, I can finally learn to recognize different beats, find out what a harmonic sounds like and discover a chord. And then, move on to find out what they are useful for. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Music Appreciation teaching program ??
Hi Aaron; On Sun, 2009-09-20 at 09:04 -0500, Aaron Konstam wrote: On Sun, 2009-09-20 at 09:01 -0400, William Case wrote: If you want a way out solution install Sugar Development Environment using yum group install. It is not that 'way out'. I have been an interested bystander watching the OLPC project for a few years. What you have recommended gives me a very good excuse to get my hands dirty, as it were. Ever since I first tried Linux I have been looking for at least one development branch that is trying a radically new user interface. Starting with what innocent children find intuitive, seems radical enough for me. I checked 'sugar' through yumex and http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar_development I have read the documentation there. I have a couple of naive questions before I download. 1) I was thinking of creating a new user on my Fedora 11 and downloading 'sugar' from there. Would this make any difference? It would avoid the Gnome/KDE conflict with 'sugar' wouldn't it? 2) Is this enough of a separation between my Fedora system and the Sugar system or will I need the XO on a separate partition? I would think a new partition and an addition to grub would not be necessary. But better to ask and be safe rather than sorry. 3) 'Sugar' runs on top of Linux rather than replacing it -- doesn't it? The use the TamTam applications after you switch from Gnome (or KDE, etc) to the Sugar window manager. Ah! Just read your post more closely. Sugar is not part of an OS but a window manager -- right? How are window managers switched? Is it the same as or similar to the Medacity/Compiz switch in Gnome? I.e If I create a new user and open it in Gnome for the first time, how do I get 'sugar' running? http://wiki.laptop.org/go/TamTam You will have to Google TamTam and Sugar to find out how the system works or if you decide to try it e-mail me and I will help yur find the appropriate helpful document. This works only for F10 and F11. How do I download and install TamTam? Does one have to be registered to view the downloads? I don't mind registering really, I just wanted to get a look at what I might be getting into. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Music Appreciation teaching program ??
Hi Tim; On Sun, 2009-09-20 at 23:29 +0930, Tim wrote: On Sun, 2009-09-20 at 09:01 -0400, William Case wrote: Can anyone recommend a program to download from Fedora repo / any Linux repo / or the world that teaches Music Appreciation? I have something in mind like 'Rosette Stone' but for music. Something that really starts with the basics and works up. I am think that maybe after 65 years, I can finally learn to recognize different beats, find out what a harmonic sounds like and discover a chord. And then, move on to find out what they are useful for. You started off with a question that sounded like it was to do with listening to music (to which my best suggestion would be an old fashioned radio station with a Keys to music style of program), I have never heard of a keys to music style of program. Where would I find one? but you end with what seems like a question related to playing music, yourself. You might want to clarify your wants, to get a better answer. The very thought of me trying to learn to play music would frighten my friends and neighbours and send the dog running from the house in sheer panic. No, what I was looking for was something in the way of music appreciation. I was trying to indicate I wanted something that would let me hear what different musical terms meant as well as offer an introduction to different kinds of music. Aaron Konstam's suggestion of starting at child's level seemed to touch on what I meant. However when it comes to the best means to learn about music/sound/noise, I am necessarily in the hands of others. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Boot.log question/fix ?
Hi; I was looking at my boot.log this morning and found confusing symbols that distract from its clarity. E.g. ... emounting root filesystem in read-write mode: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Mounting local filesystems: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Enabling local filesystem quotas: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Enabling /etc/fstab swaps: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Entering non-interactive startup Applying Intel CPU microcode update: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] ... I gather, [60G[[0;32m has something to do with Tab [ and [0;39m] represents ]\n. The problem probably has something to do with locale and/or basic fonts installed. Does anybody know how I should configure whatever to get the boot.log to print properly ? None of my other logs have this problem. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Boot.log question/fix ?
Hi; On Fri, 2009-09-18 at 08:22 -0600, Phil Meyer wrote: On 09/18/2009 08:00 AM, William Case wrote: Hi; I was looking at my boot.log this morning and found confusing symbols that distract from its clarity. E.g. ... emounting root filesystem in read-write mode: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Mounting local filesystems: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Enabling local filesystem quotas: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Enabling /etc/fstab swaps: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] Entering non-interactive startup Applying Intel CPU microcode update: [60G[[0;32m OK [0;39m] ... I believe those are the ascii codes to change the colors. more or cat the file instead of editing it. :) Right you are! Interesting. 'cat' and 'more' /var/log/boot.log prints a proper colourized file to stdout. However 'less' and 'gnome-system-log' only show me the ASCII colour codes without actually colourizing. Of course it's not a big problem, but I would like to fix it. Any suggestions? Add while I am at it, the boot.log gives me this message: ... Enabling the nvidia driver: /etc/rc.d/init.d/functions: line 513: 1326 Segmentation fault $@ [FAILED] ... Yet nothing seems wrong with my graphics once I am logged in. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Bulk] Re: Viewing virtual memory locations from the command line ??
Hi Bryn; On Tue, 2009-09-15 at 10:34 +0100, Bryn M. Reeves wrote: On Mon, 2009-09-14 at 14:32 -0400, William Case wrote: Hi; Thanks. That was a very thorough answer. Luckily, I have 'Understanding the Linux Kernel' by Bovet and Cesati. In fact, it was in preparation to reading/studying their text that I wanted to draw an outline of memory use! -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Rhythmbox --command-line ?? [SOLVED]
Thanks to Sam and Peter; On Mon, 2009-09-14 at 07:03 +0100, Sharpe, Sam J wrote: 2009/9/14 William Case billli...@rogers.com: Hi; Peter, I simply followed your advice using the my radio stations URI and it worked. [...@samlap ~]$ cat /usr/share/applications/rhythmbox.desktop | grep Exec Exec=rhythmbox %U Thanks Sam. I have been going through all kinds of contortions to find the exact exec command for applications for years. It usually involved open the properties of existing icons or launchers and copying and/or amending pre-configured commands. Your example of using cat /usr/share/... and grep Exec is something I am certainly going to remember. %U is a URI - so could you not give it the URI of your favourite radio station? (or am I missing the point) I wish the developers would stop making everything so easy. I full expected a start command + string of options + a URL. In other gnome applications %U = user name. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Viewing virtual memory locations from the command line ??
Hi; I can use gnome-system-monitor with the Ctrl-M key to view memory addresses for various processes. It will show me a pop-up window with | VM Start | VM End | VM Size | Flags | VM Offset | etc. What would be the command line equivalent ? I am assuming that such a command line equivalent would have more refinements than gnome-system-monitor. I have tried ps, vmstat, cat /proc/*/stat, but have not been able to get what I want to see -- the actual address and offset. Besides user process addresses, I would like to see kernel processes addresses on stdout. My understanding is that Virtual Memory for the kernel map to the same addresses as their physical addresses, so either view would do. Also, my understanding is that Virtual Memory creates a buffer in physical memory where it keeps the VM structure; similarly for a DMA buffer. I would like to view them as well -- at least once. I have three reasons for doing this; 1) I am currently looking closer at how RAM memory is used. And, like the guy from Missouri said seeing is believing. 2) I want to draw a representation of what is in memory at any given time, just to fix memory operations better in my mind 3) My frustration level is almost boiling over after having spent the morning trying to find a command line command that will show me addresses. Now I just want to know how, or if, it can be done from the command line. To avoid anyone spending a lot of time on long explanations, I just need someone to point me in the right direction re: commands. If I have stated some mis-assumptions here, don't worry about it. I have several kernel and architecture texts and I am just starting my closer look. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Automatic page numbering in OpenOffice
Hi; On Mon, 2009-09-14 at 07:26 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Tim wrote: I was referring to the following message from William Case. that I had completely misunderstood: You can set it up as a page style in Styles and Formats; (...) ; or, add the page style as part of template options; or, just change the template directly; or create a macro. There are several ways to number pages. Pick whichever is most convenient to you. https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-list/2009-September/msg00833.html === From this I had wrongly gathered that there was a possibilility to set page numbering permanently in Format = Styles as or, add the page style as part of template options only seemed like an option. Mr Case was certainly much clearer in his previous message in the same thread. gpelil, I was trying to tell you that there really are several ways to set up page numbering. I wasn't saying RTFM in this case. The option that you might want to use depends on personal choice and work habits and the nature of the writing project. By reading the manuals you can get a much clearer view of just what is possible. Option one: In Format = Styles (F11) you can create and name a page style that has page numbering fields where and how you want them -- at the top of the page, in a header or in a footer. When you first open a new document simply Insert = Fields = Page Number and Insert = Fields = Page Count and any text. The disadvantage is that without making a template you have to manually insert your start page number and any text. If you use a header or footer, however, you only have to do it once. The Advantage is you can create several styles depending on the type of document you use. For me, I have at least 4 styles a) FirstPage witn no page numbering; b) A Preface style which numbers pages in small roman numerals c) body style with normal page numbering, and d) a chapter style for long documents. You can add more page styles as you need them. Having made all these styles saves me from having to create several document templates and from having to decide before I type a word what kind of document I am going to write. I can easily change my mind to expand the document. Option two: Having created various page styles, you can save your current document with or without content as a template - E.g. 'Publish_Doc.ott'. When you open the default template none of your custom page styles will show, but if you open the 'Publish_Doc' template your page styles will be available. Option three: Set up your first page exactly as you want it, content and all, and save that as a template. That will give you exactly the page numbering as you outlined in your original post. However, you will have limited flexibility and if you want to change anything you are back at square one -- as if you had opened the default template. Option four: Four is a whole new exercise in learning. Write a macro to insert the page numbering where and how you design it. Besides the online help check out http://documentation.openoffice.org/manuals/userguide3/index.html and there has been lots of discussion regarding page numbering in the OOo users archive. http://www.openoffice.org/servlets/SummarizeList?listName=users It doesn't take long to master styles or templates in OOo. They are an invaluable tool. I have to use M$ Word from time to time as well. In comparison, page numbering in Word is a real PIA. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Rhythmbox --command-line ??
Hi; Does anyone know how to get RhythmBox started from a command line in a launcher? I would like to put a Gnome launcher on my desktop or panel that launches RhythmBox gui but with the Radio source and my favourite Radio Station selected i.e already included in the launch command line. I have searched yelp and the Internet; I can't seem to find a way to do this yet it seems such an obvious request. Anything that does exist is about hacks for the rhythmbox-client. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Automatic page numbering in OpenOffice
On Sat, 2009-09-12 at 03:47 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Sometimes OpenOffice reminds me of the bad old days of WordPerfect. Everything is so complicated, even though the document formatting I need is just elementary. For now, all I want to do is set automatic page numbering in the x/y format, e.g.: 1/5, 2/5, 3/5, etc., for every new document I create. How do I do this? Try Help = Index = Page numbers Or try any of the many extra help pages, manuals or tutorials there are online for OO Writer. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Automatic page numbering in OpenOffice
Hi; On Fri, 2009-09-11 at 21:26 -0600, Frank Cox wrote: On Fri, 11 Sep 2009 19:30:15 -0400 Christopher K. Johnson wrote: I'm not sure whether there is any way to set this up automatically other than creating a document or document template which you open for each new document you start. If you set it up as the default template it will load every time you create a new document of that type. You can set it up as a page style in Styles and Formats; or, create a first page in styles + a next page style that has the page number in footer or header; or, add the page style as part of template options; or, just change the template directly; or create a macro. There are several ways to number pages. Pick whichever is most convenient to you. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
Thanks Stan; On Thu, 2009-09-10 at 08:23 -0700, stan wrote: Checking some backlog, saw I hadn't responded to this. You have other responses and seem to have moved on, but I'll just put in my 2 cents. :-) On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 22:15:21 -0400 William Case billli...@rogers.com wrote: Hi Stan and others; http://ftp.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/tiwai/docs/HD-Audio.html Bill, if I could answer questions like that I would be developing alsa drivers. :-) Snd-hda-intel is the driver for the architecture. Because it is a standard architecture, no matter who provides the chips that build it, the same driver should *theoretically* work for any device that conforms to the standard. Yeah, right! Like that will happen. So yes, all hda-intel devices use the snd-hda-intel driver. I have been directed to the appropriate Intel spec manuals. I should probably have gone there first, but I never guessed that 'not-working' sound could be so complex. The parts of the document I thought were particularly relevant for people with hda-intel devices that weren't working were the slots information at the start, and how to overcome broken bioses that mis-reported the device (proprietary drivers can ignore the bios reports because they *know* the setup of the hardware), and the hda-verb section that allowed the user to change pin configuration on the device until it was working. But your suggestion directed me to up dating my BIOS which was probably needed anyway. i.e. I wasn't viewing it as a theoretical overview, though it is partly that, but as a practical way of getting an hda-intel device to work on your hardware. Well I have largely ignored sound and sound devices most of my life, so delving into this stuff both technically and theoretically have been an adventure. One that I intend to pursue. Luckily I don't have to cram it all in. I have the time to learn something; put it aside; think about it; then go back for more. Someday, when I upgrade my hardware, I'll probably have the opportunity to test that view myself seeing as all new hardware seems to be moving to hda-intel as the on board device. Or, maybe I'll buy an add-on device that doesn't use hda-intel and avoid the whole potential problem. ;-) External devices avoid the whole electronically noisy environment inside a pc, so they have other benefits as well. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: OT Enlightenment 16 = 17 opinions ??
Hi Mamrou; On Mon, 2009-09-07 at 15:49 +0900, Mamoru Tasaka wrote: $ rpm -qi enlightenment Regards, Mamoru For some unknown reason, I had forgotten about rpm -qi *. I had gotten in the habit of always using rpm -qa. Bad habits I guess. Thanks for reminding me! -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Kernel update to 2.6.30.5-43.fc11.x86_64 issues
Hi; On Mon, 2009-09-07 at 11:04 -0700, Jason Turning wrote: I did the update to kernel 2.6.30.5-43.fc11.x86_64 today, noticed there were updates to pulse audio, and when I rebooted wireless didn't work and I heard these loud sound pops, one at boot, one at login, so I just reverted back to the previous kernel. Anyone having similar issues? Just for the record, I also did the update to kernel 2.6.30.5-43.fc11.x86_64 today. I noticed that my weird sounds on booting have now gone away!?!. ALSA sound and RhythmBox are still not working. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
OT Enlightenment 16 = 17 opinions ??
Hi; I have opened a new user account to try out Enlightenment desktop. I have been playing with E16 all afternoon and kind of like it. Before I really dive in though, I was wondering if it is worth downloading E17. It is not an rpm so I would have to install it from source. That's OK -- but, is there enough improvement over the E16 in the Fedora 11 repo to make the building of E17 worthwhile? I don't as yet want to replace gnome or anything, but I would like to have some fun playing around with new eye candy and new ways of doing things in my new guest user account. I have checked reviews on line -- they are mixed, out of date, and not really applicable. Has anybody tried E17? What did you think of it? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: For hardware engineer types re: sound controlers and/or codec chips ??
Thanks Les; On Sun, 2009-09-06 at 17:02 -0700, Les wrote: On Sat, 2009-09-05 at 13:36 -0400, William Case wrote: Hi; Is my assumption about temporary, perhaps 1-2 ticks, storage accurate? Where is this data stored? Does the sound card itself have some small capacity for memory? -- SRAM or DRAM? Hi, Bill, Sound, like most everything else electronic is becoming more and more integrated. The chip processes today are quite a bit different today than they were even 20 months ago. Anything I might say is probably different from the actual truth anyway. But here is an attempt at a high level overview... As I have said before, it is not essential I get the latest hardware construction or software configuration. I am not building a computer from scratch in my garage. But it is nice to know various nodes or resting points of a system so that I can follow the the problems that are being solved or the improvements being made. Sound is digitized by an A/D. that is it comes in, is buffered to isolate the source from the actions of the A/D, is selected or mixed with other sources (either before the A/D or afterwards mathematically) and then encoded. The encoding is dependent upon the standard(s) chosen. In the past the data was simply passed to the cpu and the encoding or decoding took place on the main processor. Today many of the sound chips and advanced sound systems (USB or plug in board or chipset) have encoder/decoder capable processors built in, and many of them support programming to meet new standards, so that as MPEG2 becomes MPG3 or 4, the software can be updated to manage that change. This relieves the main processor of that task, so it can concentrate on other things. At the same time, the video boards are also becoming more powerful with array processing built in to do all kinds of 3d graphing, and there are more powerful utilities being developed all the time (facial recognition, tracking, movement detection, environment measurements etc.) And again the on board processing relieves the main processor of much of the processing burden. However the data is handled, it is eventually sent to the main processor for storage or transmission, and that part may be handled by DMA, although using DMA for an Audio process is somewhat overkill, since DMA is in essence a high speed process. It depends upon the demands put on the hardware whether slow speed processes like audio are handled by DMA or polled buffering, but in any event, the mixing of multiple channels, the processing for Dolby, or other encoding like THX, or even simulated projected sound as used by some forms of speakers with phasing capabilities, means that the processing overhead is increasing, and the demand for integrated processing increases with that. Also board real estate is more expensive than IC real estate, so economies of scale dictate that the chips become more and more powerful. In an earlier post John Wendel suggested. http://www.intel.com/design/chipsets/hdaudio.htm It has most of what I want, it seems. I have perused the documents and found stuff that seems to answer my posted questions but I have not yet really dug into them. I will. I am referring to: Intel® I/O Controller Hub 7 (ICH7)/Intel® High Definition Audio/AC’97/Programmer’s Reference Manual (PRM), or the Intel® I/O Controller Hub 7 (ICH7) Family Datasheet and one other. In there is mention of several registers. I assume those registers are in the hub and that is where the sound data is temporarily stored whether it goes through DMA or not. If I am wrong just let me know. A long explanation is not needed at this point until I actually dig into the manuals and try to understand them myself. The enemy of good sound is noise, and PC's with their switching power supplies, digital I/O and something called ground bounce (where the return path gets periodically overloaded with current, minimizing the difference between the power rail and ground), all contribute noise. So lots of systems now use USB or some other means to isolate the audio system from the processing ground. And then a new problem crops up. If the audio system does the processing, how can it handle the processing noise it makes itself? There are lots of methods, but one is to make the processing synchronous with the sampling. This means that the noise occurs at the same time as the ADC or DAC is switching to the next sample, so the noise is not captured. Other techniques involved here all have to do with making the noise common mode so that the audio system is balanced against ground, and differential. When the ground noise goes into such an amplifier, it is canceled by its own image of the wrong polarity. (this is a simplified explanation). I am always fascinated by the ingenious solutions engineers develop. It just demonstrates that in spite of the innovation, how
Re: OT Enlightenment 16 = 17 opinions ??
On Sun, 2009-09-06 at 18:59 -0400, William Case wrote: Hi; I have opened a new user account to try out Enlightenment desktop. I have been playing with E16 all afternoon and kind of like it. Before I really dive in though, I was wondering if it is worth downloading E17. It turns out enlightenment-0.16.999.050-3.fc11.x86_64 is the one I installed from the Fedora repo. The version numbers are so close I wonder if this means it is virtually the same as version 17. It is not an rpm so I would have to install it from source. That's OK -- but, is there enough improvement over the E16 in the Fedora 11 repo to make the building of E17 worthwhile? I don't as yet want to replace gnome or anything, but I would like to have some fun playing around with new eye candy and new ways of doing things in my new guest user account. I have checked reviews on line -- they are mixed, out of date, and not really applicable. Has anybody tried E17? What did you think of it? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
For hardware engineer types re: sound controlers and/or codec chips ??
Hi; I am chasing down the creation or production of sound on my computer. Everything is fitting into place after being at it, on and off, for a couple of years. However, there is one hardware answer I don't seem able to chase down. Where is the sound data kept immediately on arrival at the sound card? Whether analog or digital; whatever the source; sound arrives at the sound card or at on-board chip(s). Whether the sound is in 'chunks', 'segments' or 'packets', the sound data has to be stored somewhere on the sound card, before being coded or decoded, or before being moved to the DMA. I expect that the memory requirements are small, perhaps only a few bytes, but none-the-less, the sound card has to (I would think) store the data somewhere before processing it and putting it in a DMA buffer. Is my assumption about temporary, perhaps 1-2 ticks, storage accurate? Where is this data stored? Does the sound card itself have some small capacity for memory? -- SRAM or DRAM? If so, is this storage a property or function of the sound controller or the codec chip? Is there a way to tell the size or nature of this memory from the specifications, or, the hardware definitions in lshw, or, cat /proc/asound/card*/pcm*/info? Is, for some reason, this information propitiatory to manufacturers ? If it is propitiatory, can you give me a best guess? In the end, this is not a terribly important issue, other than without an explanation, the understanding of the logic chain for hardware and software used by sound is broken. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: For hardware engineer types re: sound controlers and/or codec chips ??
Thanks; On Sat, 2009-09-05 at 13:51 -0700, john wendel wrote: On 09/05/2009 10:36 AM, William Case wrote: Hi; Take a look here... http://www.intel.com/design/chipsets/hdaudio.htm Regards, John It all seems to be there. I will work my way through it -- slowly. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
Hi; Tried ]$ aplay ~/Music/babycry.wav I got the following error message: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 which is not PCM or FLOAT encoded. What does it mean? How can I fix it? Tried a couple of Ubuntu solutions from a year ago I found on the internet. They didn't help. I do get sound with mplayer. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
On Fri, 2009-09-04 at 16:24 +0200, Michael Schwendt wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 14:16:05 +, William wrote: Hi; Tried ]$ aplay ~/Music/babycry.wav I got the following error message: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 which is not PCM or FLOAT encoded. What does it mean? How can I fix it? I do get sound with mplayer. What do you get for file ~/Music/babycry.wav? I get totem attempting to play the sound. Sliders move; default video shows but no noise. I am fully updated as of this morning. /usr/bin/play from sox is superior as it supports several special encodings used within the RIFF/WAV container format. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
On Fri, 2009-09-04 at 16:24 +0200, Michael Schwendt wrote: file ~/Music/babycry.wav $ file ~/Music/babycry.wav /home/bill/Music/babycry.wav: RIFF (little-endian) data, WAVE audio, MPEG Layer 3, mono 11025 Hz -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
Hi; On Fri, 2009-09-04 at 09:07 -0700, stan wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 08:12:29 -0700 jack craig ja...@linuxlighthouse.com wrote: hi stan, may i ask how you made this determination? i have long wanted to know how to decipher audio formats at the byte level. or did you use the file cmd? tia, jackc... $ file ~/Music/babycry.wav /home/bill/Music/babycry.wav: RIFF (little-endian) data, WAVE audio, MPEG Layer 3, mono 11025 Hz I used the last line of the file output, MPEG Layer 3 is mp3. Here is the output from file on a true wav file (a sample from freesound). uberhuberman_Louisiana_Rain_1.wav: RIFF (little-endian) data, WAVE audio, Microsoft PCM, 16 bit, stereo 44100 Hz I also tried the following: ]$ aplay ~/Music/train.wav Playing WAVE '/home/bill/Music/train.wav' : Signed 16 bit Little Endian, Rate 11025 Hz, Mono --- got a train whistle; on play and mplayer as well; silence on totem. ]$ aplay ~/Music/Noise.wav Playing WAVE '/home/bill/Music/Noise.wav' : Signed 16 bit Little Endian, Rate 48000 Hz, Mono --- got (static) noise; on play and mplayer as well; silence on totem. Tried ]$ play ~/Music/babycry.wav play formats: can't open input file `/home/bill/Music/babycry.wav': Unhandled WAV file encoding (MP3). Try overriding the encoding: e.g. for an MP3 WAV, `-t mp3' ]$ play -t mp3 ~/Music/babycry.wav play formats: no handler for given file type `mp3' -- no sound. That is OK, I'll chase your advice down a little. e.g. questions like Why is a .wav not a .wav? Thank you for introducing me to sox. I had never heard of it before. I have been having trouble with sound ever since I bought a new box in November? Audio Chip/Device product: 82801G (ICH7 Family) High Definition Audio Controller [8086:27D8] vendor: Intel Corporation [8086] bus info: p...@:00:1b.0 version: 01 width: 64 bits clock: 33MHz capabilities: Power Management, Message Signalled Interrupts, PCI Express, bus mastering, PCI capabilities listing configuration: driver: HDA Intel latency: 0 There is no further point that I can see trying to fix anything until the HDA driver or whatever else needs to be fixed is fixed. I have made no headway on this list (although I have received losts of helpful suggestions), the ALSA users list or Fedora bugzilla. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
On Fri, 2009-09-04 at 15:32 -0700, stan wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 19:35:43 + William Case billli...@rogers.com wrote: Oops Sorry. Found snd_hda_codec 65408 2 snd_hda_codec_realtek,snd_hda_intel But still no actual hardware codec chip. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: aplay: test_wavefile:807: can't play WAVE-file format 0x0055 !??
Hi Stan and others; On Fri, 2009-09-04 at 15:32 -0700, stan wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2009 19:35:43 + William Case billli...@rogers.com wrote: If you really want to understand the hda-intel architecture and its relationship to alsa, and how to configure it in alsa, read the document at this link. If you pursue it diligently, you will get your card working or know the reason why it doesn't work. http://ftp.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/tiwai/docs/HD-Audio.html Stan, I have taken your advice and I am pursuing it diligently. My fist quick questionis; /docs/HD-Audio.pdf says: The HD-audio component consists of two parts: 1) the controller chip, and, 2) the codec chips on the HD-audio bus. Checking with lshw: On my machine they are: 1) [82801G (ICH7 Family) High Definition Audio Controller] 2) And nothing obvious to me for the codec chip. Would this be the hardware I am looking for: *-pci:2 description: PCI bridge product: 82801G (ICH7 Family) PCI Express Port 2 vendor: Intel Corporation physical id: 1c.1 bus info: p...@:00:1c.1 version: 01 width: 32 bits clock: 33MHz capabilities: pci normal_decode bus_master cap_list configuration: driver=pcieport-driver resources: irq:26 ioport:d000(size=4096) memory:e400-e4ff ioport:e520(size=1048576) and, would the pcieport-driver be a digital-to-analog / analog-to-digital driver. /docs/HD-Audio.pdf says there should be a specific driver. If not, what should I be looking for? Is the codec chip just considered part of the 82801G (ICH7 Family) and snd-hda-intel the sole driver? Actually most of that document is not too hard to follow, but this codec chip question doesn't seem to be answered, and, googling doesn't give me anything useful about my particular machine/motherboard that I can see. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: start location for windows
Hi; On Tue, 2009-09-01 at 10:57 -0500, Steven Stern wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 When I start a new program in Gnome, it positions the new window at the top left of the screen. Is there a way to tell it to use some other location (e.g., center)? In gnome, screen positioning is the responsibility of the individual application. There are three different ways that I know of to pre-set the screen placement of windows. They all use the Xwindows geometry +x +y flag in one way or another. 1) Many applications, but not all, have a setting in Configuration Editor for position x and y. 2) In a terminal run AppName --help, A list of commands to add to the launch command will appear on stdout. Many, but not all, will show flag like --geometry (or -g) +x+y that can be included with the command line , or launcher, or menu command that will position the first window of an application. 3) Install a program called Devil's Pie (devilspie). It will give you fine grained control over several aspects of window attributes including window position. Devil's Pie has a bit of a learning curve with only rudimentary manuals and tutorials. If you are like me and like to keep your desktop just so, it is worth the learning time. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Sunday morning Question re: Desk Top ??
Hi; I have been following the thread Can we have different desktop backgrounds for different workspaces? with interest. I have started a new thread because I have a question or topic that is related but a bit different. I am using Gnome for my desktop. For the last 2 or 3 years I have been looking for a way to setup my desktop so that I could have different backgrounds/wallpaper and launchers in different work spaces. Particularly I would like one set of wallpaper and launchers on what I might designate as my play' area and a different setup for a work workspace. For example: A play workspace would consist of something like a background with favourite photograph(s) and launchers for tv, radio, volume, other media and a 'home' icon that had a path to my personal files. I expect the 'play' area somewhat filled with a messy variety of launchers. A work workspace would be sparse, clean, with a solid colour background for easy reading. When I work I want a choice of just a few launchers which I use regularly placed exactly where I know how to find them with either the mouse or keyboard. And, a Home icon that I could setup with a path that leads to my directory(s) where I keep various work projects. I would like to be able to move back and forth between play and work workspaces using the workspace switcher. Other people might have other choices. They might want a 'home' workspace as well as a 'photography' workspace, or, a 'business' workspace, or a 'writer's' workspace, or a 'programming' workspace. I have tried opening a second 'work' user, but then common functions like email, internet browsing and jotters are not available to both users. I would like to maintain the easy, single user, inter-workspace communication. It is really just the launchers and background that I want to change. It would be no different than running programs as a single user. Sleeping and running processes would remain the same. I would keep the panels (particularly 'Window List' app). For those of you who are familiar with Gnome; How difficult would it be to build an addon or plugin for the workspace app so that when I changed workspaces a different desktop i.e. ~/Desktop2, and ~/Wallpaper2, would open and replace Desktop1 and Wallpaper1? I have looked over the Gnome Developers site. I am not looking for any instructions at this point, but any major gotcha's or considerations to think about before I even begin a project of that size would be helpful. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Where is pulseaudio started?
Hi; On Thu, 2009-08-27 at 14:49 -0400, Steve Blackwell wrote: On Fri, 28 Aug 2009 00:12:39 +0930 Tim ignored_mail...@yahoo.com.au wrote: The pulseaudio.desktop file contains this: [Desktop Entry] Version=1.0 Encoding=UTF-8 Name=PulseAudio Sound System Comment=Start the PulseAudio Sound System Exec=start-pulseaudio-x11 Terminal=false Type=Application Categories= GenericName= Name[en_US]=PulseAudio Sound System Comment[en_US]=Start the PulseAudio Sound System X-GNOME-Autostart-enabled=false /usr/bin/start-pulseaudio-x11 is a script: comments snipped set -e # Exit without running pulseaudio daemon if this is a remote desktop session [ -n $PULSE_SERVER ] exit 0 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --start $@ if [ x$DISPLAY != x ] ; then /usr/bin/pactl load-module module-x11-publish display=$DISPLAY /dev/null if [ x$SESSION_MANAGER != x ] ; then /usr/bin/pactl load-module module-x11-xsmp display=$DISPLAY session_manager=$SESSION_MANAGER /dev/null fi fi So my remaining questions are what reads the pulseaudio.desktop file and how does pulseaudio get started if it does not exist. Steve I have been following this thread with a great deal of interest. When you finally get it figured out would you please be sure to let us all know. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [Solved, kinda]Nvidia driver problem
Hi gilpel On Thu, 2009-08-27 at 00:07 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Having already removed akmod-nvidia, I booted with kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64, which was the only one still working and just did: yum remove kmod-nvidia* yum install kmod-nvidia which took care of dependencies. So, not only was: kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.31-1.fc11 removed, but also: xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64185.18.31-1.fc11 xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs.x86_64 185.18.31-1.fc11 How those packages ever got to my system, I have no idea. I never enabled rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing. (Maybe somebody at rpmfusion is keeping a low profile for supplying these as dependencies with akmod?) See the description below akmod is just a script(s). It does not supply any dependencies. akmod-nvidia-185-18.14 supplies or directs akmod to the files that are needed for akmod to build an rpm that can be used by kmod for various kernels as modules for the nvidia driver. If you have akmod and akmod-185.18.14 installed I am sure that 2.6.29.6-217.2.7 and 2.6.29.6-217.2.3 will work. The correct nvidia modules will be automatically built when you first boot into those kernels. Whatever you think you may have done with akmod previously, it is very unlikely that your problems will re-occur. http://rpmfusion.org/Packaging/KernelModules/Akmods Quick Overview RPM Fusion/Livna distributes kernel-modules as kmod packages that contain modules precompiled for the latest kernels released by Fedora. That works fine for most people, but it doesn't work on systems with use different kernel -- like a self-compiled kernel, an older Fedora kernel or the quickly changing kernels from updates-testing/rawhide. [This includes new stable kernels for which RPMFusion has not yet built and distributed a kmod-nvidia-kernel_number-driver_version.] The kmods-srpms can easily be rebuilt for those kernels using rpmbuild with a kmod-specific parameter that defines what kernel to build the kmod for. But that requires some knowledge of how to build rpms; this is what the script akmods tries to make easier for the end user, as it does all the steps required to build a kmod.rpm for the running kernel from a kmod-srpm. But the user still needs to do something manually when he needs a kmod for a newly installed kernel. This is what the akmodsd daemon is trying to fix: it's a script normally started from init on bootup that checks if all kmods are present. If a kmod is not found then akmods tries to rebuild kmod.srpms found in a certain place in the filesystem; if that works it will install the rebuilt kmod into the running kernel automatically. What is akmod-nvidia? akmod-nvidia provides the files required by the akmod system to build a new kmod-nvidia package when the kernel module is found to be missing. Akmods are completely compatible with regular kmods, and you can mix the two if you'd like. Now, kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.8 works, kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.7 which never worked and I considered destroyed by my experiments with akmod, still doesn't work, and kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.3, which always worked flawlessly, now doesn't work. Maybe, I should have booted to kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.8 and worked from a terminal for the remove/install operations, but I still find it strange that the .3 kernel, which always worked fine with the 185.18.14-3.fc11 Nvidia modules, doesn't work anymore with the same modules. Modules for each kernel have to be built. Though the Nvidia drivers now seem to work very well with the .8 kernel, I have those error messages: Use 'locate' to ensure that all 185.18.31 files are gone. They have all been removed on my system, then install akmod and akmod-nvidia-185.18.14. and reboot for each kernel. boot message: Enabling the nvidia driver: /etc/rc.d/init.d/functions: line 513 :1298 Segmentation fault $@ dmesg | grep nvidia nvidia: module license 'NVIDIA' taints kernel. nvidia :01:00.0: PCI INT A - GSI 18 (level, low) - IRQ 18 nvidia :01:00.0: setting latency timer to 64 nvidia-config-d[1300]: segfault at 7f5ac400 ip 003e7dc799a4 sp 7b6f0448 error 4 in libc-2.10.1.so[3e7dc0+164000] Note that I got the boot message, that otherwise only flashes by, with the icon at the bottom of the login screen. It would have been impossible to read this message if the boot process had not terminated at the login screen. The I for interactive set-up has absolutely no effect and Shift pg-up doesn't get you to the previous boot messages screen. Those are not always present in dmesg or /var/log/messages and might prove helpful for troubleshooting. I have the same problem. I would hope someone on the list can give us a fix or an alternate way to step through the boot process. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
Hi gilpel; I am up early in the morning and adding just a bit more. I really think you should be using yumex. Its a graphical front end for yum and keeps everything visual, simple and informative. yum install yumex. However ... On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 00:55 -0400, William Case wrote: On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 10:00 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Hi gilpel; 185.18.31 is not a package, but a package version. All that I can see is that you have some mis-matched files, or, a 185.18.14 and a 185.18.31 file and akmod-nvidia is picking the wrong one. yum list installed xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* yum list installed kmod-nvidia* yum list installed akmod-nvidia yum deplist kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 might tell you something I would clean everything out and start over yum remove kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia yum install kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia Or just try yum reinstall kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia Using globs will let yum show you every version of a file that you have installed. Here is what you should get. ]# yum list installed akmod-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages akmod-nvidia.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates ]# yum list installed kmod-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.3 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.5 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.6 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates ]# yum list installed xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64185.18.14-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs.x86_64 185.18.14-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates You will notice all packages are version 186.18.14-something. If packages with another version number (e.g. 185.18.31) shows up, remove them. It would be better to remove everything like I have suggested and re-install. Make sure those previous header files, akmod, kernel-devel have been removed. And akmod and kernel-devel have been re-installed. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 05:09 -0400, William Case wrote: Hi gilpel; I am up early in the morning and adding just a bit more. I really think you should be using yumex. Its a graphical front end for yum and keeps everything visual, simple and informative. yum install yumex. However ... On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 00:55 -0400, William Case wrote: On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 10:00 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Hi gilpel; 185.18.31 is not a package, but a package version. All that I can see is that you have some mis-matched files, or, a 185.18.14 and a 185.18.31 file and akmod-nvidia is picking the wrong one. yum list installed xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* yum list installed kmod-nvidia* yum list installed akmod-nvidia yum deplist kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 might tell you something I would clean everything out and start over yum remove kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia yum install kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia Or just try yum reinstall kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia Using globs will let yum show you every version of a file that you have installed. Here is what you should get. ]# yum list installed akmod-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages akmod-nvidia.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates ]# yum list installed kmod-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.3 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.5 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.6 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates ]# yum list installed xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64185.18.14-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs.x86_64 185.18.14-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates You will notice all packages are version 186.18.14-something. If packages with another version number (e.g. 185.18.31) shows up, remove them. It would be better to remove everything like I have suggested and re-install. Make sure those previous header files, akmod, kernel-devel have been removed. And akmod and kernel-devel have been re-installed. When I say remove them, I mean yum remove NOT rm. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 22:06 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 10:00 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: I would clean everything out and start over $ yum list installed xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* (...) Installed Packages xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64185.18.31-1.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs.x86_64 185.18.31-1.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates $ yum list installed kmod-nvidia* Installed Packages kmod-nvidia.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.6 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.31-1.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.5 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11.6 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates $ yum list installed akmod-nvidia* Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Error: No matching Packages to list So, from this, it is quite clear that I must remove/install xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* and kmod-nvidia* Make sure that xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64185.18.14-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs.x86_64 185.18.14-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-nonfree-updates are also installed. You can't run without them. I am not sure what they are dependency of kmod-nvidia or akmod-nvidia. Or, they can be installed independently. I see no reason to install akmod-nvidia, akmods or whatever. akmod-nvidia.x86_64 185.18.14-1.fc11- is something you should want. It automatically rebuilds the kernel module for nvidia from 185.18.14 packages every time there is a kernel upgrade. Then you don't have to wait for a new kmod-nvidia release. It has always worked for me and if you peruse this users list you will see that nvidia driver users swear by it. When (if) nvidia updates to a new driver version that works with newer kernels (say, 185.18.31) akmod-nvidia will be upgraded to that new version and all your nvidia driver modules will be rebuilt for the new kernel. Check to see if akmods is installed; it should be. ]# yum list installed akmods Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Installed Packages akmods.noarch0.3.6-3.fc11 @rpmfusion-free-updates -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Announcing Fedora 12 Alpha
Hi; What is the mail list where Fedora Project new release announcements are made; also for GNOME KDE releases for Fedora ? I am presently subscribed only to the main Fedora list (i.e. this one: fedora-list@redhat.com), and woefully out of date on new release info. Thanks, Jay For just a quick look at new release status I check http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/12/Schedule It shows the expected release dates for things like GNOME KDE releases for Fedora 12. After the final release of Fedora 12 a new release tracking page is usually started for the next version. Fedora 13? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
Hi gilpel; On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 02:04 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: On Mon, 2009-08-24 at 09:36 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Again, any messages in dmesg or /var/log/messages or /var/log/Xorg.0.log? Yes this one, in dmesg: NVRM: API mismatch: the client has version 185.18.31 but this kernel module has version 185.18.14 If I boot with kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64 and I uninstall/install kmod-nvidia, I still get version 185.18.14. and for kernel.x86_64 2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11 s kernel.x86_64 2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11 kmod-nvidia version 185.18.14 is what you are supposed to get. If I boot with kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.9.fc11.x86_64 and I uninstall/install kmod-nvidia, will I get version 185.18.31 ? Where did you get kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.9.fc11.x86_64? kmod-nvidia-185.18.31 comes from rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing repo. Add that and then you have got my previous problem. Why not stick with kernel-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11 ? -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
Hi gilpel; I repeat my warning. I am new at playing around with video drivers, sockets and libraries. But I am willing to help if I can. On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 06:17 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Hi gilpel; On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 02:04 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: On Mon, 2009-08-24 at 09:36 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: If I boot with kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64 and I uninstall/install kmod-nvidia, I still get version 185.18.14. and for kernel.x86_64 2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11 s kernel.x86_64 2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11 kmod-nvidia version 185.18.14 is what you are supposed to get. Then, why do I have: I don't think you should have them. locate 185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libGL.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libGLcore.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libXvMCNVIDIA.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libcuda.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-cfg.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-tls.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_nvidia.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_trace.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/nvidia/tls/libnvidia-tls.so.185.18.31 /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/nvidia/libglx.so.185.18.31 I never enabled rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing , but somebody suggested that I install kernel-headers and *kernel-devel* for akmod. Is this possibly the reason? I did a 'locate' on each one of the files you show above first for locate /usr/lib64/nvidia/x.185.18.31 then for locate /usr/lib64/nvidia/x.185.18.14. No 185.18.31 were returned to me, while exactly the same named files were returned as x.185.18.14. rpm -qa kernel-devel returns kernel-devel-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64 and rpm -qa akmod returns nothing. In any case, what I think you wanted was akmod-nvidia. As I understand it, akmod is a meta header file used to check if a Linux module has to be built for the kernel for Fedora repo modules. akmod-nividia does the same thing but for rpmfusion nvidia modules (drivers) that are outside of the Fedora release -- which the nvidia driver is. I am sending you a copy of the 185.18.14 files that are on my machine: ]$ locate /usr/lib64/nvidia/*.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libGL.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libGLcore.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libXvMCNVIDIA.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libcuda.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-cfg.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-tls.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_nvidia.so.185.18.14 /usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_trace.so.185.18.14 I would make a hard copy of this post so that you have a list of your and 185.14.31 files and my 185.18.14 files. Just in case. If something goes wrong it can fixed from a text terminal or from the rescue disk. Probably more caution than needed -- but ... Next I would yum (yumex) remove kernel-headers and *kernel-devel* and akmod. Then immediately re-install kernel-devel and akmod. Next I would remove each one of the 185.18.31 items, checklisting that nothing not on the list is removed as a dependency. Next I would remove akmod-nvidia and any kmod-nvidia+kernelnumber +version (185-18.14) and any other kernel+version you wanted. akmod-nvidia kmod-nvidia-for-other kernels, xorg-x11-drv-nvidia+version and xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs+version should be included in the removal dependencies list. You have to give yum enough time (3-4 sec) for yum to update itself. Next I would search for and install kmod-nvidia... 18.14 and kmod-nvidia...2.3...18.14. akmod-nvidia, kmod-nvidia-for-other kernels, xorg-x11-drv-nvidia+version and xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs+version should be included in the dependencies list. Double check that all the version numbers are the same i.e. 185-18.14. Then process and restart. I am not sure, but some of the 185.18.31 files above look like they may not be video files but used by something else like gstreamer-bad or ugly so make sure they are all replaced by 185.18.14. Nowhere, it's a typo. I did a uname -r and replaced the 3 by a 9 instead of an 8. Why not stick with kernel-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11 ? It certainly is my intention. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
On Mon, 2009-08-24 at 22:35 -0400, William Case wrote:
Hi gilpel;
I repeat my warning. I am new at playing around with video drivers,
sockets and libraries. But I am willing to help if I can.
On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 06:17 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
Hi gilpel;
On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 02:04 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
On Mon, 2009-08-24 at 09:36 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote:
If I boot with kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.3.fc11.x86_64 and I
uninstall/install
kmod-nvidia, I still get version 185.18.14.
and for
kernel.x86_64 2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11 s
kernel.x86_64 2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11
kmod-nvidia version 185.18.14 is what you are supposed to get.
Then, why do I have:
I don't think you should have them.
locate 185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libGL.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libGLcore.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libXvMCNVIDIA.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libcuda.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-cfg.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-tls.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_nvidia.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_trace.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/nvidia/tls/libnvidia-tls.so.185.18.31
/usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/nvidia/libglx.so.185.18.31
I never enabled rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing , but somebody suggested
that I install kernel-headers and *kernel-devel* for akmod. Is this
possibly the reason?
I did a 'locate' on each one of the files you show above first for
locate /usr/lib64/nvidia/x.185.18.31 then for locate
/usr/lib64/nvidia/x.185.18.14. No 185.18.31 were returned to
me, while exactly the same named files were returned as
x.185.18.14.
rpm -qa kernel-devel returns
kernel-devel-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64
and
rpm -qa akmod returns nothing.
In any case, what I think you wanted was akmod-nvidia. As I understand
it, akmod is a meta header file used to check if a Linux module has to
be built for the kernel for Fedora repo modules. akmod-nividia does the
same thing but for rpmfusion nvidia modules (drivers) that are outside
of the Fedora release -- which the nvidia driver is.
I am sending you a copy of the 185.18.14 files that are on my machine:
]$ locate /usr/lib64/nvidia/*.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libGL.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libGLcore.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libXvMCNVIDIA.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libcuda.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-cfg.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libnvidia-tls.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_nvidia.so.185.18.14
/usr/lib64/nvidia/libvdpau_trace.so.185.18.14
I would make a hard copy of this post so that you have a list of your
and 185.14.31 files and my 185.18.14 files. Just in case. If something
goes wrong it can fixed from a text terminal or from the rescue disk.
Probably more caution than needed -- but ...
Next I would yum (yumex) remove kernel-headers and *kernel-devel* and
akmod. Then immediately re-install kernel-devel and akmod.
Next I would remove akmod-nvidia and any kmod-nvidia+kernelnumber
+version (185-18.14) and any other kernel+version you wanted.
akmod-nvidia kmod-nvidia-for-other kernels, xorg-x11-drv-nvidia+version
and xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs+version should be included in the
removal dependencies list. You have to give yum enough time (3-4 sec)
for yum to update itself.
Next I would check ('locate') and remove each one of the remaining
185.18.31 items, checklisting that nothing not on the list is removed as
a dependency.
I am not sure, but some of the 185.18.31 files above look like they may
not be video files but used by something else like gstreamer-bad or ugly
so make sure they are all removed and replaced by 185.18.14.
Next I would search for and install kmod-nvidia... 18.14 and
kmod-nvidia...2.3...18.14. akmod-nvidia, kmod-nvidia-for-other kernels,
xorg-x11-drv-nvidia+version and xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs+version should
be included in the dependencies list. Double check that all the version
numbers are the same i.e. 185-18.14. Then process and restart.
I am not sure, but some of the 185.18.31 files above look like they may
not be video files but used by something else like gstreamer-bad or ugly
so make sure they are all replaced by 185.18.14.
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
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Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
On Tue, 2009-08-25 at 10:00 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: Hi gilpel; I repeat my warning. I am new at playing around with video drivers, sockets and libraries. But I am willing to help if I can. Other weird things: yum search 185.18.31 Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit === Matched: 185.18.31 === xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64 : NVIDIA's proprietary display driver for NVIDIA : graphic cards yum install xorg-x11-drv-nvidia.x86_64 Loaded plugins: refresh-packagekit Setting up Install Process Package matching xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-185.18.14-3.fc11.x86_64 already installed. Checking for update. Nothing to do Before anybody understands what exactly is going on, I'm afraid trying this and that will only cause more trouble. 185.18.31 is not a package, but a package version. All that I can see is that you have some mis-matched files, or, a 185.18.14 and a 185.18.31 file and akmod-nvidia is picking the wrong one. yum list installed xorg-x11-drv-nvidia* yum list installed kmod-nvidia* yum list installed akmod-nvidia yum deplist kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64.x86_64 might tell you something I would clean everything out and start over yum remove kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia yum install kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia Or just try yum reinstall kmod-nvidia* akmod-nvidia Thanks! -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: list files but not directory
On Sun, 2009-08-23 at 11:18 -0400, Steven W. Orr wrote:
On 08/22/09 16:46, quoth Mikkel L. Ellertson:
Just remember: Do one simple thing and do i well. ;-)
And to carry this one step farther, you can create aliases or
function to do things you require often. For example, you could use
something like this:
function lsp() { ls $@ less }
so that you could run lsd instead of running ls | less.
Two things!
1. Bash syntax:
This will not work:
function lsp() { ls $@ less }
If you do it in one line then it would have to be
function lsp() { ls $@ less; }
If you say ls less then you will only run the less command if the ls
command succeeds with a 0 exit status. I know this was a typo but I just
didn't want others to get confused.
*NEVER* use $@ without using double quotes. It is very bad luck and failure to
follow this advise will cause you to send 200 copies of stupid jokes to all
the people you know with aol addresses. And worse, you will end up knowing
more aol people.
What's the difference between an alias and a function? Simple: If you need to
pass arguments then use a function. I mention this because it's another of
those basic sources of confusion.
After allowing that there can be basic sources of confusion you become
indignant that 'ls' might be a basic sources of confusion and are
offended -- from your engineering pedestal -- that someone should want
to discuss it.
2. READ THIS BOOK!
http://catb.org/~esr/writings/taoup/
Looked at it and saved the URL as a valuable reference.
This discussion has flowed from complaining about how deficient ls is, to how
people have to learn new paradigms when moving to a new operating system.
No one complained about how deficient 'ls'. 'ls' has been around for
years and used by millions. However, the original poster was having
problems getting a 'clean' list of their 'regular files', a fairly
common beginner complaint. My suggestion boiled down to, if people
expect to find such an option in 'ls' why not give it to them.
Nothing flowed anywhere. The original poster asked how she could view
her files (i.e. regular files, text files) from the command line. A few
suggestions followed including my suggestion that the process could be
made easier.
One
of the worst things that can happen to a knowledgeable Unix engineer is to
have him subjected to a windoze weenie telling how to do it right.
No one was telling anyone how to do anything right. In fact, as I
re-read the thread, the posts show a tolerant and polite exchange about
why things like 'ls' are, or, are not done a certain way. If that kind
of exchange annoys you -- ignore it and stay out of it.
To quote myself from a previous post: Or, maybe, there is just the
natural old pro desire to force an unnecessarily onerous initiation
period on beginners.
There's a
reason that things work and work well in Unix.
That is like Dad saying Because I said so.
Do one simple thing and do it
well is really just the tip of the iceberg. In fact, Eric did a great job of
articulating enough stuff to fill an entire book of stuff that all of us
already know but may not have actually ever articulated. For example, lots of
people like C++. Lots of people like using threads. One of the cool spotlights
in the book is why you should be wary of a project that uses both.
Buy it in a book store, print out your own copy, or read it on line. No matter
how much you know, reading this is like running lsd for the first time. ;-)
Thank you for the URL.
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
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Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
Hi; To whom it may concern: If you got that from RPMfusion, it's from the rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing repo. Yes it was. I am not sure whether it came from the rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing repo or not. In frustration, at one point I might have downloaded it from the testing repo. As a warning to others and a good lesson(s) relearned: 1) in an attempt to solve another unrelated problem I enabled rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing repo. I forgot to disable it afterwards. 2) later when I went looking for a kmod-nvidia driver, the driver from testing showed up. Without reading carefully, and thinking it was the latest stable driver, I installed it. From there on everything went wonky. I.E. Pay attention to what you are doing! I haven't tried that yet, but the akmod-nvidia-185.18.14-1.fc11.x86_64 one is the one that worked for me. If you didn't get it from RPMfusion, you might want to remove all traces of it from wherever it came from and start from scratch with akmod-nvidia. Agreed. I will remove all RPMfusion kmod related stuff and start over. I did. It worked. For the record: Removed kmod-nvidia... 18.31 kmod-nvidia...2.3...18.31 and the following dependencies: akmod-nvidia...18.14 kmod-nvidia...2.7...18,14 kmod-nvidia...2.8...18.14 xorg-x11-drv-nvidia...18.31 xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs...18.31 Installed: kmod-nvidia... 18.14 kmod-nvidia...2.3...18.14 dependencies: akmod-nvidia...18.14 kmod-nvidia...2.7...18,14 kmod-nvidia...2.8...18.14 xorg-x11-drv-nvidia...18.14 xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs...18.14 Voilá -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: list files but not directory
Hi Ann;
On Sun, 2009-08-23 at 12:07 -0700, ann kok wrote:
]$ find . -maxdepth 1 -type f ! -name '.*'
or,
]$ find . -maxdepth 1 -type f ! -regex '^.*/\..*'
or,
]$ ls -hl | grep ^-
This works fine
but there is ./file as result
How can remove ./ in the command also?
The './' is the name of the current directory where the files are
located. If you prefer not to see it, use:
]$ find . -maxdepth 1 -type f ! -name '.*' -exec basename {} \;
]$ find . -maxdepth 1 -type f ! -regex '^.*/\..*' -exec basename {} \;
exactly as written here.
--
Regards Bill
Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
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Re: Is RPMfusion on strike? [SOLVED -- at least for me]
Hi gilpel; I am no hardware expert; but maybe I can suggest some things to double check and to remove and reinstall. On Mon, 2009-08-24 at 09:36 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: I'm trying :) But I never enabled rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing, and I installed the new update for kernel 2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64. First some very basic stuff. I am going to assume that by now you are getting flustered, frustrated and flumexed. You have probably already done the stuff listed below; but take a deep breath and start again. 1) Can you boot under one of the kernels? 2) Do you have yumex installed? I use yumex when the operations are simple, when I want to keep them simple and when I want to think visually. Therefore, it is handy, to me, for double checking stuff. 3) Check on the gnome menu Applications = System Tools = nVidia Display Settings. Under X server Information; System Information write down the NVIDIA Driver Version: so you have it handy if things go south. 4) Using Nautilus (or whatever your file browser is) go to /etc/X11/xorg.conf and check and note down the Driver in the Section Device. Also check the driver in xorg.conf.backup and xorg.conf.livna-config-backup. This so you can go to a different xorg.config file if you have to rescue latter. Keep these backups. 5) Optionally, as root cd to /etc/X11/ and remove any extra xorg.conf bakups just to keep things clean. I have the nouveau' driver installed, just in case. I have a xorg.config.BU.vesa and a xorg.config.BU.nouveau for quick fixes from a text screen. First time I rebooted, boot stopped, just where it used to with -217.2.7: r8169: eth0: link up . I checked if there was any akmod left to mess things up and all I found was /var/cache/akmods. I supposed this was unrelated, but I deleted it just the same. Now, the boot process stops at atd. 6) Optionally, test that the hardware is working by typing vesa or nouveau as the Device driver in xorg-conf and reboot. 7) Using yumex (you can use the yum command line of course) list the installed packages and search for kmod-nvidia. Click to un-check akmod-nvidia and any kmod-nvidia+kernel+version (185-18.14.x and any other version), then remove by Processing Queue. Any additional dependencies that need to be removed will be included. There should be about five or six. If there is more or some of the dependencies suggested look weird or dangerous don't continue but cancel and get back to this list. 8) When processing is done click on Available. Search for kmod-nvidia and select kmod-nvidia... 18.14 and kmod-nvidia...2.3...18.14. Again Process Queue. akmod, kmod-nvidia-for-other kernels, xorg-x11-drv-nvidia +version and xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs+version should be included in the dependencies list. Double check that all the version numbers are the same i.e. 185-18.14-x. If something different happens cancel and get back to the list. NB. Double check that akmods is installed; rpm -qa akmods. This is a different program from akmods-nvidia. To get it functioning again you have to restart; maybe a complete shutdown and a cold boot just to be sure. Maybe you don't have to double check if its installed or cold boot. I just don't know; but better safe than sorry. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: Is RPMfusion on strike?
Hi; On Sat, 2009-08-22 at 02:53 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: My last kernel was installed on: Aug 17 23:07:07 Installed: kernel-2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64 The last updates for kmod-nvidia were: # 16-Aug-2009: kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11.x86_64-185.18.14-1.fc11.5.x86_64 # 16-Aug-2009: kmod-nvidia-185.18.14-1.fc11.5.x86_64 http://download1.rpmfusion.org/nonfree/fedora/updates/11/x86_64/repoview/index.html Until now, kmod-nvidia updates were provided within 24 hours. Did the Nouveau developers complain that updates were coming too soon? Is RPMfusion experiencing problems with akmod-nvidia? :) Or are they plainly on strike? I can't find information anywhere. If it is any consolation to you, I am having exactly the same problem with the 2.6.29.6-217.2.8.fc11.x86_64 kernel. akmod-nividia-185.18.14-1.fc11.x86_64 doesn't work and kmod-nvidia-2.6.29.6-217.2.7.fc11.x86_64-185.18.14-1.fc11.5.x86_64q is the last nvidia module I have received. I am using the nouveau driver in the meantime. -- Regards Bill Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3 Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1 -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
